Radiohead vs Lana Del Rey | Did They Write The Same Song?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 6 вер 2024
- Radiohead vs Lana Del Rey or "Creep" vs "Get Free"
The REAL Story!
THE BEATO EAR TRAINING PROGRAM: beatoeartraini...
BUY THE BEATO BOOK HERE → bit.ly/2uTQFlo
*Advanced Harmonic Concepts for Composition and Improvisation Video Course* → bit.ly/2nl5Qky
GET THE BEATO UA-cam TRANSCRIPTIONS VOL.1 HERE →
bit.ly/2jfkyaB
SUBSCRIBE HERE → bit.ly/2eEs9gX
--------------------------------------
My Links to Follow:
UA-cam - / rickbeato
Artist Facebook - / rickbeatopro. .
Personal Facebook - / rick.beato.1
Instagram - / rickbeato1
Follow On Twitter - @rickbeato
www.nuryl.com
As a songwriter, I have accidentally written creep 3 different times
Shawn Connolly THIS IS GOLD MY G
Hilarious! Its like soft rock monkeys and typewriters. Eventually Creepy Shakespeare
lol
@@fennecbesixdouze1794 fuck, settle down. Dude didn't say that he deserves royalties from these 3 songs because he figured out the chords.
Omg same
In a stunning turn of events, all three are sueing Beato for stealing their music in his new song "The Creepy Air that I get for Free"
Owen Polley omfgrofl
What?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Haha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Awesome, thanks for the laugh
Owen Polley hahhahaa nailed it bro :P
That was good
"I wish I found some chords in an order that is new" - Twenty One Pilots
^ inversions and sus chords
jaco5187. Hey, I wrote that......see you in court. Lol
Imight Realperson wrong
There’s four chords ? - green day.
@@callofcaymen3007 microtonalities, changing the rythm, just one chord or even not using chords, just fifths...
For anyone coming to this new, a lawsuit never materialised, and Del Ray still has writing credit on her song.
nice! thanks!
Ah ,thank you ! By the way, is there anything new by Aphex Twin?
APHEX TWIN FAN HERE
Thank you. That's exactly why I was looking at the comments.
@@planpitz4190 I wish
1957 - Elvis Presley - That's When Your Heartaches Begin.
1965 - Aline - Christophe
1969 - Carry the Weight - the beattles
1972 - Albert Hammond - The Air That I Breathe
1974 - The Hollies - The Air That I Breathe
1992 - Radiohead - Creep
2003 - Vuelve - Latin Dreams
2008 - Los Ronaldos - No puedo vivir sin ti
2015 - Mon Lafarte - Tu forma de querer
2016 - Cruel Youth - Mr. Watson
2017 - Get Free - Lana Del Rey
You missed : world of love - sharon jones
Ares This is hilarious.
2020 - Diodato - Fai Rumore
I don't mean to ruin your point with my question, but do all those songs share the same chord progression?
I guess it's alright to steal from the French, Christophe is the same as The Air That I Breathe.
In another 10-15 years lana should sue the next person down the latter
LADDER
Halsey
LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER LATTER
Hahaha.
Lunar Legend clavius and Robert Milak its either down the line or down the road or along the chain. another phrase for this situation would be passing the buck. As in their just gonna keep passing the buck so none of them get stuck with it.
And down the latter makes absolutely no sense.
So, if Radiohead wins, would the Hollies get a chunk of Lana Del Rey's song equivalent to their share of "Creep"?
Fennec Besixdouze lol is that true fr fr?
Yes the songwriters of the Air that I breath, (Hollies didn't write it, Just did a cover on it) since they already own a part of Creep. And they, or the estate. Actually probably their label are the ones that are sueing. Not Radiohead. -Btw if that is the case, the songwriters of the Air that I Breath are sueing Del Rey. That is quit ridiculous, Since the chorus is from Creep is what sounds like Del Rey's song. That melody is nowhere to be found in the Air that I Breath. That melody is completely original from Radiohead.
Albert Hammond “it never rains in so California” fame wrote the song
@@Atlas65 The melody is not "completely original" from Radiohead that is one of the most ignorant things I've ever heard.
@@red5llaw You're thinking way too deep into this lol Albert Hammond literally wrote and made the song, "Air that I breathe". The Hollies got the rights to the song from Albert Hammond. And if you're accusing Albert Hammond of theft, you should do some research on him because he's actually very creative and talented. He also wrote the song, "It never rains in Southern California". And he's also very much so still alive. ;)
To be fair Lana del Ray follows the same vocal pitch and volume changes and vocal structure as creep. It's not simply chord progression.
Exactly and the vocal line from Creep is diff from The air that i breath.
It's extremely close, too close to be coincidental
he changed the key to creep. so there is a difference
@@pvthfindxr changing key is not a real solution, if the melody line is 90% similar, Lana will have to pay (even though I think that such lawsuits are stupid)
cdd1craig I agree. It’s a dead ringer
It's not about the money, it's about sending a message - Joker
"That was no message... This, is a message." - Makarov
@@quickscopeoneeighty9158" The American thought he could deceive us".
"I am spartacus"
-Bob Ross
"You wouldn't get it" - another Joker
@@j_freed hahah awesome catch !
All Radiohead have achieved with this is to make more people aware that Creep ripped off the Hollies
Is this another case of the Streisand effect? It seems like it.
Streisand effect on action,,
@@dervaumann1 just noticed your comment..yup
radiohead released in rainbows fully free, it’s not like them to pursue cash
@@brigittefalderbaum5682 then it's about ego
Today I Learned The Hollies invented the I, III, IV, iv progression.
I guess a lot of people owe them money.
The progression it's I - V/VI - IV - IVm. And was not invented by them. "The air that I breath" it's a cover of a song by Albert Hammond.
G-B-C-Cm is literally I - III - IV - iv
No they did not. You can find a similar chord progression in hymn tune harmonisations for instance. One example that springs to mind is A Closer Walk With Thee (also works for happy birthday). There's good reason why chord progressions are not subject to copyright....
No, my friend. The third grade of a diatonic scale its a minor chord, but in this progression that third grade it's major (B major), cause' it's a secondary dominant chord. Thats one of the reasons of why this progression sounds so special and unique, and also easily recognizable.
i don't think its just the chord progression…maybe you should watch that video again lol
I'm sure thousands of songs have been independently created with identical chord structures at identical BPMs throughout history. Some Venetian was probably playing these chords hundreds of years ago on a lute.
A A Er what?
Chord progressions are one thing but ripping off a melody is blatant stealing
I love the Venetian lute...
@A A Ah yes, you gotta find some way to fit that in everything, even if it has nothing to do with the original comment.
And he even came up with the lyrics "For thou is a churl, thou is cox-comb"
"You are trying to steal what I have rightfully stolen"
-the Sicilian
Put Creep and The Air That I breathe side by side and they are two completely different songs
Let me put it this way have you heard of Led Zeppelin, Elvis, Rolling Stones?
Yes.
Thieves.
Reeally?
It’s a chain reaction. Lana “steals” from Radiohead, Radiohead steals from the Hollies, the hollies steal from Elvis Presley, Elvis steals from Vasily Kalinnikov.
How does elvis copy from nietzsche..
@@Manu-pj3ie He was a creep,he was a weirdo,what the hell was he doing here?
Elvis was not a songwriter
@@arpitdas4263 hahaha...oh the fucking irony!
Our programmers only have so much code.
I’ve accidentally wrote so many songs that already exist. It sucks so much. Especially when you didn’t realize it until a friend points it out and u search up the song and it’s the exact same thing
Bro that doesnt just happen lol your brain clearly stored the lyrics
@@allaroundentertainment7230You clearly have never written any music before.
@@ordinaryshiba i got plenty music. Wheres urs?
I think Vicini in The Princess Bride said it best:
“You’re trying to kidnap what I’ve rightfully stolen.”
Just my opinion as a non-musician music lover: I love the Hollies and "The air that I breathe." is a great song. I also love Radiohead's "Creep" and it is a great song. That said when I listen to either of them I don't hear the other, I didn't even realized there was a connection. When I first heard Lana Del Rey's "Get Free" (which was before I saw this video) I instantly thought this IS "Creep." I like Lana's song, and think of it as an extension of "Creep", but I do not think of "Creep" as an extension of "The air that I breath."
I remember the first time I heard "Creep.," it sounded real familiar. Then I realized it sounded like "The Air that I Breathe." I love them both but they are different songs with different vibes to them.
@@curtisrodriguez938 It's funny because when I heard the song of Lana Del Rey for the first time, I didn't think of Creep, even though I have listened to Creep various times. And it was just an hour ago that I heard The Air that I Breathe for the first time (I wasn't born when it came out/ it's not my generation), I had to think of Creep at some parts, not knowing that Creep was written later.
I feel the same way as you. I grew up listening to the Hollies, and never associated Creep to their song, Air that I Breath . Even with similar chord progressions, they sound almost nothing alike. The lyrics and stylings of the song, Creep, differentiate it significantly from any of the other two songs.
The first time I heard "Creep," I recognized and loved this section:
She's running out the door (run)
She's running out
She run, run, run, run,
Run...
as an homage to "The Air That I Breathe." And I thought it was super cool.
I agree. I am actually a somewhat impartial judge as I don't know Creep or Get Free. Hearing the juxtaposition of Creep and Get Free, you get an immediate impression they are the same. The Hollies song has a different vibe and melodic feel, even though it is the same chords.
I've had musicology reports done several times over the years. Whilst I'm not a musicologist, the comparison, (from my experience) would be in both the chords and the melody (pitches and rhythm thereof).
They have the same chord pattern, which wouldn't be enough. But there's parts in Lana Del Ray's melody that are identical to "Creep". As there are parts of the "Creep" melody that are identical to "The Air that I breathe".
When you've got the same chords AND melody outlining the same notes with the same rhythm, that's where it starts getting dangerous, for sure. A musicologist would be able to answer this one and is probably involved already.
Add it the rythmic vibe to the melody & chords and you have the full combo. The vibe is identical.
Verónica Darrell It's particularly things like the melody, rhythm and harmony happening at "manifesto-o-o" in Lana Del Ray Vs "weirdo-o-o" in Radiohead.
It's all there.
I think one of my teachers said you can have the same chord progression all you want. However the melody is the real copyrightable content.
Second Class Heroes It's the combination. Also depends on the chord progression. Some chord patterns are so common that it would be a joke to claim it was original. But if a chord pattern was complex and rare, then maybe that could be enough.
Unique chord progressions like this one usually only have a few melody lines that go well with it because of the particular voice leading you need to do to connect non-diatonic chords, so it's harder to write good melodies over them.
Completely agree Rick... Stop. These so called copyright infringement cases are ridiculous.
Even though I heard both songs I never caught myself thinking that someone stole from someone. As somebody mentioned - you can just subconsciously write existing chord progression and put a similar vocal melody without thinking too much of it, because it just sounds good
This is true. But her mangers, producers and record company could’ve pointed out the similarities, right? 😂 I mean, it’s not like Radiohead are some obscure indy band that only the scene knows…
Hmm so can Johann Pachelbel's descendants sue the whole music industry?
Boboski Copyrights expire
+/- 100 years after the composers death, sometimes....
@@LesterBrunt It was a rethorical question but thanks
@@LesterBrunt depends on country. As of about 5-10 years ago for the UK music licensing companies, it was 50 years after death.
Canon in D certainly was massively influential
Don’t Look Back in Anger- such a blatant rip off. Poor Johann...
It just so happened I read somewhere a couple of days ago about how the late, great Prince became so worried if the last part of Purple Rain sounded a little too similar to Journey's Faithfully that he requested Jonathan Cain to listen to it before release. Upon listening the Journey songwriter said something like no worries, the song is gonna be huge, and all the best. The rest is history. Such class, the both of them.
Steven universe's opening has the same chord progression
The kids watching the show may not even realize to begin with. Just a side note...
It’s not just the chord progression. The melodies are the same too. Rip off. Confirmed.
The embarrassing thing about the Del Rey song is that her pacing and inflections are a *perfect* copy of Radiohead. It's not just about chord progressions.
Creep used the same chord progression as the Hollies, but their songs are utterly different. If you heard these three songs over the speakers in a restaurant or cafe you would not mistake the Radiohead song for the Hollies songs. But you would pay attention to the Del Rey and ask, "Who is this covering Creep?"
There's nothing embarrassing. She made a song and it sounds similar to Radiohead. They need to grow up and understand music isn't science and things can sound similar without trying.
You're embarrassing yourself by trying to make this a thing.
Nereosis Yeah it’s obviously no coincidence that she copied the melody and vocal inflection so much. She’s clearly familiar with Creep. It’s probably Radiohead’s most well known song in the USA if not one of them:
Nereosis i would normally agree but you’re wrong
@@PoopyFrikoli are you omniscient or something?
@@VanielDeeform She probably heard Creep in the past and then made a song that subconsciously sounds like it. That's the problem with trying to hold music to IP and copyright standards. It's an art form, not a science.
Update: Radiohead settled with a writing credit on Lana del Ray's song.
**rey
Thanks
Really neat video on this comparison! It's interesting how accusations of plagiarism happen in the music industry.
Nahre Sol it's because the people that complain about plagiarized songs are the non Musicians they think just one part that is similar was stolen.
What about sampling?
Uza Name what about it?
Never mind.
Uza Name no I'm curious what you mean by it
You're right, but:
"To set the record straight, no lawsuit has been issued and Radiohead have not said they 'will only accept 100% of the publishing of Get Free."
And also even if they did, creep is from Radiohead's earlier days, they may not have been savvy enough to retain the full rights, which means the lawsuit may be out of their hands and in the hands of the likes of UMG! We know how much they like to sue!!!
Yeah. I think Lana Del Rey has sadly put it in her favor by making radiohead sound like the assholes. The same argument about Get Free vs Creep is the same you could make about Creep vs the Air that I breathe. Creep isn't wholly a plagarism of The Air That I Breathe, but the "she's running out" was proven to have been taken from the hollies. It's not the chord progression, unlike what some people claim. It's the chord plus the melody. In this case, I think that the verse sections of Get Free are very similar to creep. But, as some Lana fans have pointed out, it's not an entire knock off of creep. It's all very hysterical so I'd rather wait and see what happens if a lawsuit does actually transpire. However, it sounds like this is Radiohead's management, not them themselves, that have been negotiating
Gad somebody mentioned it. He's going in on this band without knowing all the facts and looks a bit ignorant on the subject as a whole.
...And a bit bias with the dig on the song itself.
Sounds like they started to deny it after so many people brought up the Hollies. I guess they thought not many people would know about that.
All we have is one tweet from Lana Del Rey and the statement from Radiohead's publishers. Let's not turn this into some Taylor Swift/Katy Perry style feud.
Let's remember who we are talking about. Radiohead have been critics of the music industry for a long time, they offered their album In Rainbows for free, Thom Yorke distributed his last album via BitTorrent. Across the years they've been very engaged in politics and charitable work. I find the presumption that they were a bunch of money-grabbing fools really silly.
Maybe Radiohead doesn't need the money, but the lawyers surely do. Who really benefits from this lawsuit.
Lawyers win every lawsuit, people lose most
@@TonyHavenMusic the suit makers probably make the most money, as the suits that the lawyers usually use isn't exactly cheap
@@tolfred hahaha that's so true, the economic pecking order goes deeper than first thought
@@TonyHavenMusic yes, it goes deeper and deeper still. Maybe we all benefit from this lawsuit in some strange way?
Well it's not necessarily about money.. copyrights are only effective if you actively enforce them. This is why Disney will shut down an Etsy store selling Mickey mouse headbands. It's not that they are losing any money to them, it's that if they dont enforce the copyright on a regular basis, it opens them up to risk of losing control of the copyright. As the copyright holder, you are responsible for enforcing it, and if you don't, it becomes easier for the opposing litigant to get away with it.
Same with Nirvana's song "Come as you Are"
They stole the riff from Killing Joke's "Eighties". And KJ stole it from the band Damned and their song "Life goes on"
I have to give you a big kudos for these comparisons. Before I had a hard time hearing the similarities sometimes. With what you do, you strip away all the instruments, singing and processing and just give us the basics so we can hear exactly what is at the heart of the lawsuit. As someone who can read music but for singing only (high school choir) the times you put up is also helpful. I really appreciate these videos so so much!!!
The Hollies should sue them both. Lol
The hollies did sue radiohead
HanDrumsolo and I believe Radiohead gave them partial writing credit after that.
The melody of Get Free is a lot more like Creep than it is The Air That I Breathe, so such a scenario wouldn't make much sense (despite being funny).
No I was just kidding because it's so ridiculous. Let them all sue each other.
The Hollies should've never won the case against Radiohead.
You are correct about "Air That I Breath" the chorus is quite beautiful especially the last time he says breath and it takes that chord change then the airy guitar solo comes in. That is simply brilliant! Also their other song about the long cool woman in the red dress which has an amazing guitar intro. One of the best rock song intros ever!
The Creep part that really sounds like the Hollies, melody wise, is not the verse but this part:
"She's running out again,
She's running out
She's run run run run"
Lets just have 1 super-song "The Air That Creep Breathes Gets Free" and call it a day.
I dunno, honestly I rather get free even though I heard the other one wayy before, not that there's anything wrong with creep, get free is just a little less awkward and kinda more applicable. And then of course the air that I breathe is just the best ofc
Pretty sure this is why Trent Reznor of NIN, wrote the song “I am just a copy of a copy...”.🤔.
@EC Tron And ChucK Palahniuk has said that Fight Club was written with The Downward Spiral by NIN on repeat...
Just an echo of an echo of an echo
The Hollies song is different than Creep, but Lana Del Rio's verses are with the rhythm of Radiohead's Creep.
You can't copyright rhythm dude
@@davecarsley8773 It's how the things are. Whether you can copyright it or not it's a different issue.
@@d-rzarkocubrinoski Fair point. Your comment didn't say you could or couldn't copyright anything... Also, I agree with you
Žarko Čubrinoski Radiohead had to credit the Hollies for Creep
agreed.
Maybe. But Creep is definitely a “rewriting” of the Hollies “The Air That I Breathe”; so much so that they had to give the songwriter half credit on their song.
yeah. The Stones took the royalties for Bitter Sweet Symphony because their manager decided that they got more out of the strings section, something that they had gotten permission to use from Decca, than they should have and happened to have better lawyers. So being awarded songwriter credits by a court doesn't really mean anything.
The Hollies tune is close, but Lana's tune is a flat out COPY. Tempo, chord position changes, feel etc.
The only thing missing is the crunchy guitar strums before the chorus. I do like how Lana's song completely changes during her chorus but theres no doubt she or whoever's wrote the song ripped the majority straight from creep
I believe at the time (or shortly thereafter) Metallica stated that they weren't doing it for the money - they were doing it because they could afford to. ie: the bands who were in fact being impacted financially couldn't afford to (do anything.)
I rather quickly went from "you greedy bastards" to "wow - that's actually kind of a noble thing to do."
i still find it rather unfortunate that people still trash Metallica for how they handled Napster. clearly it was the right thing to do as even now streaming services are ripping off musicians
Rick, you didn't compared right parts of the songs, in the case of "Creep" and "The Air That I Breathe" . Crescendo part in Radiohead's song: 'She's running out again...' and vocal line/melody in that part is so obviously inspired by The Hollies song (verse, not chorus); it is probably 'unconscious theft' (if that term exists in English:)). Progression it self wasn't problem. Btw, 'Creep' is much better song, although simpler. :)
"it is probably 'unconscious theft' (if that term exists in English:))."
It might've even been a deliberate reference, but they didn't bother to give the proper credit.
I know this comment is a bit old, but I believe the word you're looking for is "cryptomnesia".
Parallel thinking?
Zozovaca, you are correct, Rick isn't comparing the correct parts and most of the public are doing the same. Even if the chords ,key and phrasing of the chords were identical in each song , there is still no case to sue. It's all about the vocal melody. Radiohead's falsetto at the end is identical to 'Air's' verse melody and Creep's verse melody is identical to Get Free's verse melody.
If that is copyright infringement then so is every 12 bar Blues tune ever written. Give me a break.
Bob Boitt and Jazz 2-5-1
Bob Boitt the melody is identical
the West African tribes still sing that form, even though they don't even have chords. oh and they were the real source of all this syncopation and rhythms you see today in western music. 0 dollars were given to the African people for their contribution to music.
The blues gets away with it because it's a traditional pattern beyond the age of a copyright and therefore public domain.
You can't copyright a chord progression
So what if I copied the entire song but changes the key from E to Ab and the tempo from 4/4 to 2/2 and added a fifth interval at the end of every melody line.
Would it then magically be “original”?
There are only so many chords, and only so many ways to put them together that sound right that it has to happen. I am not musical but I hum to myself and I was humming what Ithought was a made up tune only for someone to say I didn't know you liked Bach ! Er no..Alice Cooper yes.
People always compare the verses of “Creep” and “The Air That I Breathe” but the melodies are very different. Where Radiohead actually knicked the melody was in the bridge after the second chorus when Thom sings in falsetto. He’s an octave higher, but it’s the exact melody from “The Air That I Breathe.”
The Hollies lawsuit actually pertained to the bridge of Creep (when Thom Yorke goes into falsetto)
Just to clear some things up -- Albert Hammond and Mike Hazelwood, who wrote "The Air that I Breathe," were not members of the Hollies. They wrote the song for Albert Hammond's album in 1972. The Hollies covered, and had a huge hit with it, in 1974. The Hollies did not sue Radiohead. It was Hammond and Hazelwood's lawyers. And Al Hammond has stated that he had no idea that his lawyers were doing that.
It is very likely that Radiohead's members have little to do with the lawsuit against Del Rey. They will not be called on to testify is it goes to trial. Radiohead will not really be impacted by this, with the exception that their names will probably end up on future releases of the song. They will not receive a ton of royalties, and they may not even have the authority to object to the lawsuit.
That's life!
Thanks for setting the facts straight. Often times, it is not the band doing anything but publishers or copyright holders.
If I’m not mistaken, it’s also sort of the duty and diligence for copyright holders to enforce their IP. If they’re not diligent, then it could be seen that they don’t care or something. I’m not an expert, though, and just going off of a faulty memory. And now that I think of it, I might be thinking of trademarks? I dunno,
9th circuit just ruled chord progressions to be unconstitutional.
Did Radiohead get Creep chords from Pixies Where is My Mind? Not main verse but the chords over 'Way out in the Water see it swimming'. E > G# > A > Am
I believe that the I - III - IV - iv interpretation is not describing accurately the harmonic function of the chords. In my opinion C solves the tension created by B. So the B - C progression sounds to me like an imperfect cadence V - VI in the relative E minor key. And then we go back to G with a plagal cadence iv - I.
Madness tweeted back to Boy George asking to be left out of this!
“Latitude 88 north” by E.L.O has the same exact progression in the verse.
Lana should sue Radiohead for slander and bring in the hollies as a character witness
One of Rick's best posts.
Every song has already been written.
The issue I have with cases like these is several fold.
Firstly there is the intent. If you hear two songs with the same chord progressions and similar melodies, it can be very easy to point the finger at the newer track and cry "plagiarism", however it often isn't that simple. I have sat down many times at my piano and accidentally composed songs that already exist. One that I can very specifically remember is that I accidentally composed Harry's Wondrous World from Harry Potter 1, by John Williams. Sometimes your brain hears something familiar in whatever you're playing, and works to fill in the gaps before you even notice that you've already heard the song. You're sitting there thinking you've crafted an original masterpiece and then someone goes "Nice Harry Potter music, when did you learn that?", and you suddenly realise. Given that a lot of songwriters compose based on flashes of inspiration or melodic fragments that appear in their head fully formed, it's definitely not out of the realms of possibility that Lana and her co-writers simply subconsciously rewrote the verses from Creep, and didn't realise until it was far too late. The feeling of "That sounds really great" and "That sounds familiar" aren't necessarily that different.
Secondly, only the verses resemble Creep. The chorus is completely different. The lyrical content is also very different, and the song as a whole has a much more hopeful feel than Creep. The issue is that the chords used in the verse are very distinctive, immediately recognisable, and rare enough that you can pinpoint them to specific songs, which leads to you recognising even more similarities between the songs, than you otherwise would. Most pop songs use the same/similar chord sequences, and often have similar melodies, but due to the much greater number of similar songs, you don't tend to pinpoint those traits to a specific song. For example, Better in Time by Leona Lewis and Price Tag by Jessie J share many of the same similarities that Radiohead is suing Lana Del Rey for, but most people wouldn't notice them unless you played them side by side, because the songs aren't as iconic, and the chord sequence more commonplace. As people have said in other comments, there is a slightly limited number of rhythmic and melodic combinations that sound both attractive to the ear, and "poppy"; and in an unusual, non-diatonic chord sequence, it is much harder to write a distinctive melodic line that fits with the unusual chords, because there are far less options to choose from.
Finally, and most importantly, cases like these set an annoying precedent for copyright law in music. This case isn't anywhere near as stupid or influential as the Blurred Lines - Marvin Gaye case, but it still will have an effect. I didn't like Blurred Lines particularly, but the fact that Robin Thicke and Pharrell Williams got successfully sued for it "feeling" like it could have been a Marvin Gaye song is a disgusting travesty. I personally love it when a pop artist makes a callback to a previous era of music in the now very much homogenised world of chart music these days. There are more distinctive artists making great music than ever these days, however very few of them are in the charts, as due to the increasing pool of available music, only the music that is disliked by the least amount of people, or that by well established artists tends to make it to the top. This is why I enjoy it when a well established artist makes something inspired by a different era, because it is likely to make it high in the charts, and is guaranteed to be different to all the other indistinguishable fluff in them. However, when those artists start getting sued for the melody, chord sequence, or even the "feel", of their new song, they're likely to start shying away from doing anything like that, and will go back to just making the same risk-free music as everyone else. Lana Del Rey has a distinctive enough style that this likely won't affect what she puts out in the slightest, but other artists will take note. Now some people would argue that this will lead to greater creativity, with people actively seeking to make something new, to avoid infringing on someone else. I would argue that it is virtually impossible to create a pop song that someone couldn't claim to be plagiaristic in some aspect, simply due to the essentially codified nature of a pop song, the ability of the human mind to find patterns and similarities where there are none, and the ability of people to game the system for their own gain. As well as this, it's far easier to simply follow the majority, as if everyone is making the same music, no one can be sued for it. If music copyright law progresses much further you'll see a lot more Blurred Lines type cases, where artist who try to buck the trends of the day are immediately sued by someone else, because the distinctiveness of the song draws attention to itself, and immediately draws up comparisons with other distinctive songs.
Great comment. You summed it up perfectly regarding the feeling of writing a new song is annoyingly similar to stumbling on how an existing song is played. For myself when I write and think it sounds great I will immediately assume it is a song I'm just remembering! I've had too many false alarms when band mates tell what it sounds like! We have been exposed to so much music in this point in history almost saturated
legally its irrelevant if only a verse is similar....check the story of Bittersweet Symphony and The Last Time....its just 4 or 5 notes used...personally I think the lawsuits and that are silly
That's what you get when your guitarist(s) play nothing but campfire chords.
Johnny greenwood is a badass though.
I heard Hubert Van Calenbergh had uttered heresy. I came as fast as I could.
I think he was talking about the song, itself
The chords may be simple but the arpeggios on Creep make it sound awesome
Hubert Van Calenbergh go listen to some "praise and worship" if you wanna hear some campfire chords. All two chords.
Didn’t John Fogerty get sued for sounding to much like CCR?
Yes, even though John Fogerty made CCR
Saul Zaentz head of Fantasy records sued him that Old Man Down the Road sounded like Green Rucer I think.
John won the suit.
I remember that suit. I remember the judge said something like this is just John Fogerty writing like John Fogerty. Hilarious. Sad that JF got sued for essentially being himself.
@@violinmke Run through the jungle
This & summertime by sublime which she actually calls summertime .. I still LOVE her tho 🥰🥰🥰
Important to remember vis a vis copyright or trademark law: Part of maintaining one requires vigorous defense against infringement (i.e. use it or lose it). These lawsuits usually aren't brought due to greed (although the lawyers make sure it makes them some money), they're brought to fulfill that obligation. Makes no sense to copyright your work otherwise.
Tbh, i think that they (lana) offered Radiohead 40% of the profit is actually more than generous. It has little elements and the same Key but Lana turned the idea into something great different.
You have to defend a copywrite or you lose it.
Radiohead has some huge balls to sue someone for stealing that song
The 3 songs may have similar chord patterns, but quite different songs as a whole. Like a blues song ;-)
This is a part of music. Musicians are always reforming old tunes. Sometimes it's adding new lyrics. Sometimes a minor change,and update of a classic song.
All the old country artists did things like this. A.P. Carter,and Ralph Peer music did a copyright on everything A.P. could find. Which was mostly old ballads that had been reworked over many years.Centuries old music in some cases. But none had a copyright so they were free to use them, change them. Whatever they liked.
Take the old English or Irish tune 'The Rose Tree'. It became 'Turkey in the Straw' in the US. Then it was used in a well known Minstrel song.
It then got used for a joke song that soldiers would sing on march called 'Do your Balls Hang Low?'. That got cleaned up to a tune called 'Do your Ears Hang Low?'
Now use the same chords = lawsuit.
I know they're trying to protect their income, but they could negotiate it.
Radiohead didn't sue her. They asked to be credited as writers. The lawsuit language was thrown around by Del Rey to garner sympathy and misdirect for the fact that she directly copied the rhythm and tried to pass it off as original instead of some form of sampling.
I think you're wrong here, Rick. Radiohead's publisher, Warner Music, released a statement saying that there's no lawsuit just negotiations, they didn't ask for 100% and that their goal is to get proper credit for all the writers, Radiohead and Hammond and Hazlewood included.
The verse of Get Free blatantly rips off Creep's chorus (the chorus being written solely by Radiohead while the bridge of Creep was from Air That I Breathe) and Lana has outright refused to admit any similarity or inspiration and seemingly refuses to give any credit meanwhile making untrue claims about the situation. I think it's worthy of a lawsuit; proper credit seems more important than any money in this specific case.
Radiohead should care and WB would never do for just the credit. They are a business. If Radiohead signed a pub deal with WB it would have been a 50/50 deal like all publishing deals back then meaning that WB couldn’t do this without Radiohead’s consent. I know all about publishing deals because I’ve had major pub deals for over 25 years.
Rick Beato thanks for the reply but I'm confused on where you stand on this issue. In the video you make it seem like you're against this lawsuit and think it's frivolous and undignified but in some of your comments you say that it's justified and they should care about it. Which is it?
Dom Guy Rick has no clue either. Of course, Radiohead wants writing credits. So do Hammond and Hazlewood. This is NOT about money for Radiohead. It's about art and copyright laws that protect artists and their creativity. Thom Yorke didn't fight Hammond and Hazlewood. He never denied the chord similarities to The Air I Breathe. However, Lana Del Rey continues to insult our intelligence claiming it was mere coincidence. BS. Her lawyers even offered the same 40% to Radiohead previous publishing company that they gave to Hammond and Hazlewood. This is either a publicity stunt or blatant theft. The lawyers are fighting over money. Radiohead is fighting for art. This is a band who gave their fans the option to pay as they wish for downloading an album / song. Money is not their priority. Everything from the tone, chords, chord progression, mood, melody, etc. in Get Free was exactly same Creep. Everyone acknowledges many songs will be influenced / have similarities to the songs of the past. However, it doesn't take a genius to figure out Lana Del Rey's song was a blatant rip off.
If Lana Del Rey is bullshitting us with the 100% of publishing rights thing, then shame on her. But other than that, wouldn't it just be smarter for her to admit the "inspiration"? That only gives her more publicity. I've never even heard of Lana Del Rey before this goddamn controversy started at all.
Rick Beato By the way, with your knowledge of how these deals work: if this legal move is really coming from Warner, could Radiohead just tell them to drop the case and stop it on its tracks, or does it have to be a mutual agreement? I mean, it would be a smart move for Radiohead to drop the case altogether, make it look insignificant. But is that legally possible?
When I heard Get Free, Creep instantly came to mind and I can't get around hearing it every time I hear that song. That said I'm not familiar with the Hollies song, otherwise I'd hear that.
wingracer 16 Oh duh... I obviously have heard this song. I'm in the opinion Get Free is way more similar to Creep than to The Air that I Breathe as far as the overall song is concerned.
wingracer 16 But! I actually like all three songs in their own right.
The Air that I Breathe, one of the main issues is the bridges are almost identical.
At the end of the day, everyone rips off Sabbath.
What I learned from this: be very careful if you try to write something with that chord progression.
*and same melody, and same rhythm
You can use those chords all you want - it's the melody you have to be careful about, cos that's the bit that's copyrightable*. Chord progressions get reused and reused (check Rick's video on the 4 chords that ruined pop for instance.) The del Rey melody is very close... That said, it is a fear of all composers that they will plagirise something without realising it. If they lift it on purpose at least they can change it enough to be legal
*at least until the Blurred Lines case a couple of years back
I've played many so songs with the same chord progression. But different strumming and timing. This sounds the same. Lol peoplw getting lazy they know that these songs will touch a chord in people's minds and said wow i love that song. When really its just their memory of creep being activated. See how that works? Sneaky sneaky Lana del sexy. Still a fan and I would tap.
I guess you didn't learn jack, I've gotta agree with the replies prior to mine.
This is such a sad state of affairs that somebody should write a song about it.
And get sued for it too.
Except they didnt actually sue her though
They haven't sued because they want to negotiate out of court.
Lana Del Ray will soon die of lung cancer, why sue her at all..
Blaž Bohinc
Lung cancer? It seems that some people want only bad for those who don't give something for them.
Jamie Bales Probably.. and she will as well. From smoking 3 packs a day.
To each their own. It's a shame we were born into this world smart enough to realise we'll die some day. And nothing really matters. So fuck your body up before you even have the chance to get old. That's the logic right?
There's hundreds of things that can end your life at any time. Life is too short to worry about eliminating just one scenario. I don't smoke myself, but I don't see the need to point out when others do and to tell them what they already know. People also poison their livers every weekend without a second thought.
I think one important thing is that even though the melody in the Lana song is similar, it uses synth instead of guitars and the song is very minimalist in comparison to Radiohead or the Hollies.
Best frivolous lawsuit ever:
John Fogerty, the author of "Old Man Down the Road" by was sued for copyright infringement of "Run Though the jungle" ...also by John Fogerty.
🤔
So basically, the author was sued for sounding like himself.
🤣
"...there is nothing new under the sun." -Ecclesiastes
It looks like it's a bit more complex than people seem to think... according to the website oaf Albert Hammond, he said of the case against Radiohead....and i quote:
"Albert Hammond (writer): I don't publish The air that I breathe, I only own the writer's end, so the publisher of the song, Rondor Music, when the song Creep came out, he felt it was a steal from The air that I breathe, and he sued Radiohead, and they agreed. Radiohead agreed that they had actually taken it from The air that I breathe. Because they were honest they weren't sued to the point of saying "we want the whole thing". So we ended up just getting a little piece of it. (Albert on the telephone with Reto, Copyright ?2002 by Reto)"
Also, the Hollies (as far as i can see) have no involvement here at all. t wasn't the Hollies who were involved with the Radiohead suit, but the publishing company for the original Songwriters, Albert Hammond and Mike Hazlewood. The Hollies COVERED the song in 1974, two years after the original Albert Hammond release. And as a result Hammond is credited as co-writer of Creep.
Further to all this, Radiohead's management claim they are NOT suing Lana Del Rey for 100%, and that a lawsuit hasn't actually been issued. Yet?
The melody to Creep i written by Albert Hammond and Mike Hazlewood in 1972.
you never miss a beat, man. your videos are so good to watch. Thank you!
I agree. They need to realize the important thing. They created music we all love and listen to. Why is it 100% money with these people?
I was reading the comments during the Lana switch and I was like “waaaait a minute”
I can almost guarantee you that Thom and Jonny and the rest of the guys in Radiohead don’t care at all, they all hate Creep, they’ve stated that many times, they want nothing to do with the song and that’s pretty good confirmation that this whole thing has to do with their publishing team and their label because they want money out of it. And secondly, Creep is better than The Air That I Breathe by a wide margin.
Agree on the first part, totally disagree with your final sentence.
they don't hate creep. Thom hated creepy in the 90s but now they play it on occasion and not 'ironically' like they used to.
well
how to put this
basically everything you wrote is wrong?
They still don't like Creep and after doing it as an encore for the last couple of tours they're retiring it again.
K M As Thom himself would call it “Fridge Buzz”.
Yea I'm a serial Lana listener and I absolutely felt like I've heard the song before, but it's just so common now that you point it out
The melody in the 'bridge' of Creep (where Thom sings in a higher register)has the same melody as the verse of the ai r that I breathun e.
Exactly! I think Thom did that as a clue to where he got the chords from. It's a definite nod to the Hollies tune.
Naughty naughty, very naughty!
I nicked that last bit from the Shamen 😁👍
So Lana del Ray should have gone to the Hollies and offered them co-writer credits, bypassing Radiohead completely from the equation.
That would be super ridiculous since the melody that is used in Del Rey's song is lifted straight from Creep. That Melody is nowhere to be found in the Air that I Breath. The Melody that Radiohead got sued over in Creep from the Songwriters of the Air that I Breath (written by Albert Hammond and Mike Hazlewood, Not the Hollies) is the Middle 8 in Creep that Del Rey does not use. The Melody that Del Rey uses is the chorus from Creep. Which is completely original from Radiohead.
If you would have known that then you would have realised how stupid your suggestion sounded like.
The hollies didn’t write the song. Albert Hammond did
@@Atlas65 nice explanation but no need to be a dick
@@friendlyplayer92 Thank you
... But, sorry. I guess I was just fed up with these uninformed Del Rey fan's at the time, that commented again and again that Radiohead didn't have any rights to sue Del Rey, because they stole it from the Hollies, which wasn't really accurate, like I pointed out in my former comment.
Albert Hammond, the composer of The Air That I Breathe should sue The Hollies, Radiohead and Lana
Marcelo B I should sue bc I thought all of the songs yesterday
I feel that these are now considered to be the "Cursed chords of the industry" for those who strum these forbidden chords shall lose both time and money to the rock ghosts of the past. It is a vicious cycle doomed to repeat itself forever...it is the Inception of guitar chords.
Finally a video that has a subject and goes right on into it! Thank you so much!
Right on, Rick. Love your channel more each day.
This all sounds strangely like Space Oddity by Bovie...
"The Air That I Breath is a MUCH better song than Creep!"
*Every Radiohead fan liked that*
Wait what
@@madden7732 every radiohead fan hates creep, or at least every radiohead fan that listens to their stuff after the bends
@@SERVICERMUSIC ohhh now I get what you saying. Yeah, its kinda typical for a fan to start hating a little the hits of the band. I personally even when im a fan of a specifically band, still love their hits, for me they cant be denied.
@@madden7732 I usually feel the same, but honestly there are so many radiohead songs that are better in my opinion, and even in the same vein (?) like "Lewis (Mistreated)" and "You" (or mostly anything off of pablo honey).
@@dylan2588 yeah thats right :)
so we cant use a chord progression that someone else has already used? Might as well stop making music because its all been done.
Yes, but it's the same melody as well
It will never be all done
Mega Rockstar We have been doing this for almost a thousand years now all over the world, it has all been done.
@@LesterBrunt people said this for decades and new and original music still pops out from time to time. You always feel like it has all been done, because it's hard to imagine something that you've never heard. Do you find Nirvana for exemple not original? Kurt said that when he was in school people kept saying that everything has been written. There are too many options to just finish. If someone is creative enough, he will always find something new to play
Mega Rockstar Well I am pretty sure somewhere somebody thought of similar melodies on a similar chord progression. I am sure somewhere in all the symphonies, beethoven sonatas, Bach fugues, late 19th century music, let alone the lost music of all ages across all countries, there exist a passage that uses the same melody on the same chords of any modern song. It is just that that all music pre 1900 is public domain and thus you are free to copy from it as much as you want, as it should be with all music. I am not saying that there is no point to originality, just that by the standard we hold today, melody + chords = yours, everything has already been done.
Hi Rick and Friends,
Ive been thinking about this for weeks after this video, and i think all three songs are actually using DIFFERENT chords... or at least the three iv chords are functionally different. Hear me out and tell me what you think.
In The Air that I breathe, the melody notes are in melodic minor (F G Ab Bb C D E) this makes the chord a vi/bIII. You can play an Fm6#7 over it and it sounds fine... sort of.
In Creep, the melody and the guitar are clearly hitting that Bb making the chord a Cm7 and giving it a dorian fuction, so its a ii/bIII kind of thing.
Get Free is a true iv chord, as it comes from the harmonic major. If you listen to her melody notes (Eb F Gb A Bb C D) they are in Bb harmonic major.
At least thats how i hear it. I think it can easily be argued these are three distinct songs... even though they all treat the V/vi the same.
Bit like calling the cops on the thief that stole your TV from your house that you bought off the back of a lorry.
I see a stronger case here than with other infringement suits, but still it's not really the same melody or lyrics which I feel should be the criteria.
Rick, I would love to hear your take on the Blurred Lines/Got To Give It Up case. That one seemed particularly outrageous to me. The two songs have almost nothing in common other than "vibe" or MAYBE groove yet it was deemed infringement in court.
Nope. There are marked differences, even in the passages that are the most similar. Does she hit some of the same accent notes? Of course, but it can't be honestly argued that the melody is the exact same. If you transcribed them, they would look very dissimilar.
No. The melodies are not identical. It's right fucking there. How can people not hear this? The melodies are different.
i agree, the blurred lines/got to give up case was just ridiculous
When the melody and lyrics are generic and stupid, how can you use them as the basis for a plagiarism suit? The thing that's getting ripped off is the shape and feel of the earlier recording.
David Paul. It is the same melody
So basically the music industry is a scary and irrational place haha
This is great! 😁 They should just let each other pass the torch; Who’s next??
It goes even deeper, The Hollies' version of The Air That I Breath is a cover. The original was released in 1972 by Albert Hammond, two years before The Hollies!
I prefer the Hank Williams jr cover version of the air that I breathe
This makes me want to use the same progression and write a fourth song. I wanna be sued too just to be part of the circus show.