@@shorelockhomes943 My theory is that she is or was at one time doing the dance with no pants with Q. However instead of him returning the ship to earth she did it for more torpedoes because she wanted the acclaim that would come from her guiding the crew home.
I'm pretty sure that they have the specifications on how to build these things in the database and it's more than likely that they resupplied the Torpedoes every time they stopped to resupply the ship. And they did stop quite often in the show to resupply.
By the way, if they ever actually ran out of torpedoes, it's ok. They could just launch shuttle craft at the enemy. There's a nearly infinite supply of those as well.
Almost as the near infinite supply of red shirts in all of Star Trek. There's so many when on dies another takes their place, though expendable they are infinite, it is truly horrifying. (Joke)
@@ZeroGForce I mean yes but also no :P I can't really argue with that tho, but that's like telling someone not to ram someone with their car so they do it 3 times.
"I would not recommend it. We're already firing torpedoes that not only do not exist but that we now owe the universe. It's conceivable the space-time continuum could actually shatter." "Meh, that happens every week anyway."
Tuvok: I must warn you. IF we keep delving deep into our pockets and withdrawing more and more torpedos from 'null space' it could have disastrous consequences. Janeway: Do you really think anyone is keeping count? 20 torpedos were launched that day.
Let’s take a moment to appreciate the fact that this guy went into every episode of the series again. He then video edited every single scene of torpedoes firing or mentioning. And then made this video. Do u even imagine the time and effort needed?
The only warship to return from extended deep space endurance combat with a full compliment of torpedoes in its holds. Reads the museum plaque: "This torpedo from Voyager appears to be a regular starfleet torpedo, but analysis indicates it was not manufactured but in fact emerged from the quantum vacuum by random chance.... along with the rest of Voyager's arsenal."
@@MedalionDS9 it's not from the alternate timeline. it's from the actual timeline. the reason they called it the warship voyager was because the people who ran the museum didn't know any better and let their bias guide their interperetation of voyager. the episode is also set 700 years in the future. alot of information was lost in that time, except for a copy of the doctor.
Vaadwaur : If we armed our ship with your photon torpedoes.... Janeway : I can't authorize that. Vaadwaur : Why not? Janeway : Because we've already use more torpedoes than we have.
Janeway: Q. Can you take our ship back to the Alpha quadrant. Q: Yes I can but no that would not be fun. But I can give your ship a set of self replicating photon torpedoes that never runs out.
the standart compliment of a galaxy class is 200 with more later on, but even the constitution class refit in star trek 6 had definetly more torpedoes than 32
Either Voyager left to take on Chakotay's Maquis with only limited stocks ( they thought it was gonna be a easy job) or somebody got REALLY, REALLY trigger happy during that Maquis mission. "Open hailing frequencies" "HERE'S A GREETING FOR YA! BOOM!!!" "Time for dinner." "DID SOMEONE SAY FULL SPREAD!!!" "KA-POW!!!"
That is precisely what the writers wanted though. They wanted a low number, a number that would convey urgency and despair. A number that would put the crew to its limits. They also wanted to convey that clearly to the audience so they said "here is a small number you can keep track of". Then they decided that they didn't want to do that anymore! Oops!
its almost as if the show runners were aware of potential continuity issues and then got distracted by finally being allowed to play with the borg as a major opponent
@@rockstermaniac It's certainly possible that between the temporary alliance with the Borg and Seven of Nine's expertise they were able to make more torpedoes. Also I always thought they managed to get some from the USS Equinox at the end of season 5 before the ship was destroyed in the season 6 opener.
@@jcohasset23 lol so you think a short range science vessel not only had quantum torpedoes, but enough , that they’d have some left over after the exact same amount of time in the delta quadrant as voyager?
Actually, they wanted to use only 38 toroedoes over all 7 seasons. But at the end of Season 4 or so they realised 38 is shit low and anyways in the technical guide it says they can build torpedoes with raw materials from planets (Technical Guide V1.0 p. 22 "Torpedo Limitations", 1994).
But they outright said they had no way to manufacture more. Now, if they did find a way, they would have to outright say it. An equal reaction. The former is confirmed, the latter is conjecture. And conjecture isn't canon unless it's confirmed.
@@Cyke101 Yes, they said that at the _beginning_ of the show. And I hoped they would have at least had one line where they said they figured it out or something. But they didn't. Like the endless shuttlecraft, it's a plot hole. So we can either just assume they figured it out...or not. Either way, that they've still got us thinking and talking about a show over two decades later...I think they did all right.
The thing is, since it's a plot hole, the burden of proof is on the show, and not the viewer, to create the explanation of making the show. We could all assume or hypothesize how they replaced their torpedoes all the live long day, but if they don't actually explain it, then they violate one of the basic rules they set up for themselves -- a constant state of scarcity. I realize that framing the torpedo supply like that seems overblown, but every TV show has a set of rules that they adhere to, spoken or not. Some rules are explicit in the show bible. Others are implied but are part of the premise (i.e. Full House cannot violate an explicit rule of having a sparsely-occupied house, nor can it violate an implied rule of, like, magical time travel. It's just not that kind of show). But by violating the rules it sets upon itself, it then means that its own cohesion and tightness can give way, when a TV show really requires a strict focus in its premise (or else the premise is pointless). For example, Voyager's premise was that it would take them 70 years to get home. Obviously it took far less time than that, but that distance had to be acknowledged -- every time they took a shortcut, they would outright state that it cut the journey by years or even decades. That's an acknowledgement of the premise. The torpedoes didn't get that acknowledgement. Them shaving off 63 years off the journey doesn't feel like a cheat or plot hole because its central premise was kept in mind. The viewer didn't need to explain or rationalize any of those jumps. The viewer's labor wasn't needed there. Their needing double the torpedoes *is* a cheat because they never touched upon that scarcity again.
@@Cyke101 I agree with you that it's a plot hole. I agree with you that the show didn't explain this point as it should have. What do you want me to do about it? We're talking about a TV show that hasn't been on the air for going on two decades.
@@AlandrisFerguson I came here to say the same. I just saw that episode. In all actuality, despite what is said about not being able to replace them, I believe they could easily replicate them. I think when that's said, they're referring to the fact that they can't restock via normal means. A starship wouldn't have much need to replicate torpedoes in the Alpha Quadrant.
I like to think Jane way is just deluded, but the crew are too nice to call her out, so whenever she says “fire torpedos” they just press the button and make “pew pew” sounds
I'm afraid the frightening truth is that the number of extra torpedoes Voyager fired is roughly equal to the number of their dead crewmates. Thus reviving a very old Starfleet trick of using humans as torpedo warheads.
Kim: Captian here is your toast with a competent of condiments. Janeway: Nutella? Kim: We only have ¼ of a tub left. Janeway: I don't care, Nutella Full spread! Chakotay: Same here Ensin, Nutella on Toast, Full spread. Kim: Question, Will you ever promote me? Janeway and Chakotay: NO!
Janeway to Tuvok, "fire torpedoes full spread" Tuvok to Janeway "i would not recommend it" Janeway to tuvok " why is that Tuvok" Tuvok to Janeway "we ran out of torpedoes in season 1" Janeway to Tuvok "What have we been firing for the last 2 seasons?" Tuvok to Janeway "Neelix leftovers that even make b'lanna puke out the airlock" Janeway to Tuvok "fire everything!"
Borg : we are the borg lower your shield .... SPLAT .... Neelix type torpedoes ..... un-adaptable .... Captain Janeway : 0_0 Neelix do more slop thats an order Neelix : ay ay captain but what will we eat ? Captain Janeway : everything but that
This is what a continuity director is for. Someone who keeps track of things mentioned in throwaway lines, or various actions so the plot stays centered. Otherwise you end up with subwarp shuttles from season 1, that can suddenly reach warp speed in season 3, but are then unable to do so in season 4. It's a luxury position that most studios don't want to pay for. But don't worry, the internet is here to remind them.
Robert Lozyniak “Lol DoN’t YoU kNoW rEtArDs JuSt Go DuRrRr In A cOrNeR????” Basically the attitude against the spectrum of mental disorders back then. It wasn’t until a minimum of 2008 that there was even a bare minimum of understanding. They sure missed on a lot lol not that I’m complaining since people were horrible back then.
The best thing about Voyager was still when Harry Kim was sucked out into space and died... they got a instant replacement from that alternate Voyager so nobody gave a damn about it. No funeral no nothing and next episode forgotten it ever happened. His body is probably still floating out there somewhere.
You're making assumptions that aren't warranted. During the events of that episode, they were too busy defending their ship to spend time grieving for their lost crewman. It is reasonable to assume they dealt with those consequences off-screen between that episode and the next. Just because they don't dedicate screen time to it didn't mean it didn't happen.
When they return home, they need to carry 85 torpedos on board to have none. Or, every time they fire an antimatter photon torpedo, it increases the regular matter torpedo inventory by +1. You never run out of torpedos, if you alternate between firing matter and antimatter torpedos. They cancel each other out on the inventory list.
@@Tar-Numendil And I mean, the original mission was one of military significance. Tracking down a hostile ship in hostile territory. They really ought to have had that much to begin with.
+Schwarzer Ritter I think a great way to go about that would be to count them all, then show Janeway ramming the timeship with the unscathed Voyager passing by after with the counter reset. Would've been a fun troll moment.
The most impressive thing isn't the fact you went through and grabbed every single clip from the series, but the fact you weaved in the dialog of Janeway explaining to a random alien that there's no WAY they can transfer a torpedo to them because of Starfleet's strict rules about photon torpedoes. Absolutely epic.
To be fair, at least Voyager showed the crew building new shuttles, mainly the Delta Flyer. I don't think they ever mentioned making more photon torpedoes.
It's a shame Voyager never seriously explored the consequences of its interesting premise. Not just the fact that they couldn't restock at the nearest starbase, but the fact that a significant part of the crew were Maki - but almost immediately started acting just like Star Fleet officers.
well they neither explore it or explore how they are able to replenish their torpedo compliment and yes they had to replenish torpedo's in order to not run out during the series in the delta quadrant
"Almost immediately"? Oh, no. That took lots of time and work . Remember, human management and group psychology are also sciences that would have advanced in the future.
I mean, with the length of time they were out there, they'd have had to figure out how to replace the weapons eventually. Every part of the ship would have needed maintenance or reconstruction, anyway.
They have replicators that's how they make items and repair. They may have built a large one in a storage room and found the right things to print torpedos.
Well I'm sure there are security measures in place to keep people from replicating a matter/antimatter warhead that is the torpedo. The other parts may be replicated for like caskets, probes, etc. But, I'm sure the anti-matter had to me siphoned from voyager's own reserve. So, Janeway may have jumped the gun when she said there was no way to replace them when expending the munitions.
Janeway: Tuvok full torpedo spread! Tuvok: Captain we don´t have any left. Janeway: To be or not to be, thats not the question here, FIRE THOSE TORPEDOES! Tuvok: But we don´t have- Janeway: THERE IS COFFEE IN THAT NEBULA, *FIRE TORPEDOES*!!!!!!!!!!!
To be fair, when Janeway first said they had "no way to replenish them once their gone", she was speaking during an energy supply crisis. A few Borg upgrades, and upgrades from other species and well... +85 torpedoes :P Also, you forgot to include the "Transphasic Torpedoes" from the series finale :)
+Michael Anderson It's also probebly fair to asume that they were able to trade for various materials they could use directly or indirectly for the torpedoes. Not including stray asteroids, ship remains and possably may have been able to harvest certain elements from solar flares from some stars.
Yep. Even if they couldn't make more once they had resources, the total count only requires them to have sound a planet with sufficient tech to help them manufacture needed components twice - pretty sure they ran into civilizations with superior tech several times.
All the writers needed to do was insert one sentence: "Captain, using 7's nano-probes, we've managed to modify a high powered replicator to produce Photon Torpedoes". And that would not have even contradicted Janeway's first statement that they had no way to replenish them - Borg technology gave them a way. But instead they just seemed to ignore it all together...that, along with the seemingly unlimited supply of Shuttle Crafts...
The funny thing is, the ridiculous waste of photon torpedoes started after 7 appeared. They could have easily shown that she helped them modify the replicators or build some extra manufacturing infrastructure or something.
I heard that there was a Right Way, a Wrong Way, and the Janeway...... I now happen to know what the Janeway is. To fire all the torpedoes...... and then some!
Like in the episode Pathfinder. They were around 35.000 light years away from Earth, Barclay somehow managed to contact with them, though the Starfleet's only knowledge about the Voyager's whereabout was they are somewhere at 60.000 ly away...
I would have liked it if they had started every single episode with a brief recap of how far Voyager has traveled since the start of their journey, coupled with how far away from earth they are at that point in time. Maybe set against a map of the galaxy. This standard beginning to each episode wouldn't have to be lengthy or cumbersome - it would only have to last ten or fifteen seconds. This would have given the show an entirely different and better feeling of continuity.
@@thomasn3882 I think they didn't know in advance in what order the stories would run; Star Trek didn't really have explicit continuity between episodes until... Enterprise? Maaaaybe DSN. They could still work around that, but in general, the ST writing format was "a bunch of episodes written by different people with little to no communication between them". This worked fine for TOS, but started really breaking by the time of Voyager.
Haha, great video :D and there is even 1 scene missing. Voyager follows the "U.S.S. Dauntless" in the slipstream and fires 4 torpedos on the ship, "full spread" of course :D lol
the fire sequence "full spread" is like if you change the setting of a machine gun from single bullet, to automatic. You don`t fire one torpedo (bullet) you fire full spread or full volley 3:39 4:01 4:52 5:31 5:50
If I recall Correctly a Full Spread for the Enterprise D would be 5 shot from a single tube (though I don't recall if they can shoot 5 out of the back launcher as well that might have a lower rate of fire). So think of a Revolver you can "fan it" and fire all 6 chambers in under 2 seconds or fire sequentially - the same here they can fire 3 Torpedo in quick succession from a chamber loaded with 3 Torpedoes on each side. It seems Voyager has a number of temporary staging points where a single or small number of torpedos can be released from too. these include one in the dorsal one next to the tractor beam emitter and a small cluster of them on the side. those areas don't seem suited for rapid fire and may not even be a full staging area and are little more than a weapon release airlock. They might even be the place the umbilicals attach to when docking the ship. The main Torpedo Bay (3 of them) are adjacent to the storage areas and so can fire and reload more quickly - I don't know the facts but judging by the footage it seems they can stage 3 and fire them almost simultaneously from each main launcher. (so 6 forwards and 3 rear wards) but they usually stagger them a bit no only to target them independently but also for safety reasons. Where are the Enterprise D fired all 5 at once they then separate from the cluster (kinda dangerous). The main launcher can also fire Probes too. If a larger probe was needed it would likely have to be specially constructed and either beamed into space or released from the shuttle bay. Curiously like the NX-01 Voyager has a lot of auxiliary hatches and ports that were never given a specific function - for example near the rear torpedo launcher there are two hatches - which I think are wear work bees are stored.
90 Lancaster when we start about functional design....what the hell is that borg-ish part at the front of the Intrepid saucer? NO other federation ship has it
In one of the specialist sensor Pallets that Science Vessels have - there is also a secondary Deflector on the Primary hull underneath that part. If you compare Rhode Island to The normal Nova Class Equinox you can see Equinox has them too Rhode Island doesn't. It's quite common on 24th Century ships (Look at Norway Class, Prometheus class and so on) - on other ships the sensors are contained in domes or parts stuck on the hull (like the Centaur Class or the Constellation class) where as the additional sensors on other ships can also be place in a out-board pod as on some variations of Nova Class. If I had to guess i'd say some of the sensors are mapping sensors and general science tools for doing stuff science ship do more easily. and some of the sensors are more tactical and rely on tracking ships, looking for cloaked vessels and acting a battlefield management tools. (I think that distinction is the most obvious in the Nova Class variants). I'm kinda curious what the thick armour plates on the side of the Prometheus are for though myself.
Never understood why they didn't weaponise they transporter more than they did. Like, mid battle transport a huge chunk of metal into the flight path of another ship Or as soon as they take shields out, like teleport their computer system away, or their engines. Do something other than fire torpedoes all day 😂
@@MrTimmy132 Actually, it is sort of addressed in canon. Transporters have a hard time getting a lock on anything moving at too high a relative velocity, and space combat speeds are usually a decent fraction of c. The times they aren't are often when there's some sort of restriction that also precludes using transporters anyway
it should be noted the only time they say they can't replace the torpedo's is the first or second seasons which means that they probably found a way to replenish their supply afterwards later on in the series because they get more trigger happy with torpedo's in later seasons maybe because they didn't have to worry about running out anymore
@@raven4k998 Visual mediums like TV and movies are about show, not tell... or tell if you absolutely have to...but don't leave things up to fans to imagine scenarios for overlooked plot points
Dopest Flyest O.G. Pimp Hustla Gangsta Playa ikr. Still find this absolutely hilarious. Damn writers need to start taking notes on each others work, or at least explain how they got more torpedoes...
+Missionary of the Adepta Sororitas The re-armed at one of the many planets that they've come across with similar technology, then reconfigured them to work with Federation equipment. Now, was that so difficult? Not surprised a Stooge of Imperium lacks the imagination to fill in the blanks on their own. The Imperium is stagnation! For Chaos! ;)
+Missionary of the Adepta Sororitas Star Trek never addressed that Voyager could just make more torpedoes.It takes time and energy so they can only carry so many at a time. But that solves the whole thing. They had to say as much.... and they did not.
i really think it's a shame they didn't make this more of a plot point. it would have been really cool to see them being really careful about whether they use them or not.
When 7 of 9 joined the crew they had around 9 original torpedos left. She obviously upgraded their replicators to produce an endless supply of torpedoes as well as shuttle craft parts. She helped them build the Delta Flyer from scratch.
@@owlsayssouth you expect them to give dialog for every single event in their 7 year journey? the series would take 7 years of nonstop footage to explain all that.
@@lojosol Ya I expect them to have dialogue on one of the most important resources of the ship. In fact that could and should have been an entire episode and WOULD HAVE BEEN if Ronald D Moore was given control of the series.
I AM THE PHOTON OF MY TORPEDOES DESTRUCTION IS MY PURPOSE AND LIGHT IS MY SOUL I HAVE BEEN FIRED OVER A THOUSAND TIMES UNKNOWN TO AMMUNITION COUNT NOR KNOWN TO SPECIALIZED TYPES HAVE WITHSTOOD ADVERSITY TO AID THE USS VOYAGER YET THESE TORPEDOES WILL NEVER RUN OUT SO AS I PRAY UNLIMITED PHOTON TORPEDOES
I think some of them were from the episode where a backup of the Doctor is activated hundreds of years in the future and the historians think Voyager was all warlike and crazy.
And I would imagine some also happened in the Year of Hell that got completely erased. Also, that one episode where Voyager was doubled and Harry had to switch ships with baby Naomi.
Chakotay: (Sees Borg Cube) Chakotay to Tuvok, "What about a photon torpedo?" Tuvok to Chakotay, "i would not recommend it" Chakotay: (Fires 3 photon torpedos anyway) Borg Cube: (Shields neutralize the photon torpedos) Chakotay: "All weapons online!" Also Chakotay: (Fires 3 more Photon Torpedos for good measure) Janeway: "aNoThEr SuCcEsSfUl MiSsIoN!"
This is exactly why Voyager is my least liked Star Trek. It was like nothing mattered. Nothing had consequence. They set it up to be this survival show with a crew that supposedly shouldn't have gotten along, and then just completely forgot the premise.
These people built a submersible, Warp-10-capable shuttlecraft using the tools they had onboard. Can we maybe give them the benefit of the doubt that they figured out how to build a few more torpedoes as they went along?
***** Having limited resources is supposed to be the main conflict of the show. Solving it offscreen is like a beat up Defiant docking on the station and Sisko declaring they just defeated the Dominion.
I'll them the benefit of the doubt, however you do realize that they didn't just build a few more torpedoes, they nearly tripled their supply. To add to that, the first episode that they did use a torpedo, Janeway specifically said "and no way to replace them after their gone, makes you wonder doesn't it?
Kade Gillman In that episode, they repeatedly imply they are extremely low on energy reserves which means they didn't have the resources to build torpedoes, which means no way to replace them. *Captain's Log, supplemental. We set out to augment our energy reserves and wound up depleting them by over twenty percent. As a result, we've set a new course for a planet fourteen light years away that Neelix says might have compatible energy sources to offer us. It is out of our way, but circumstances offer few alternatives.* Neelix even had the Captain sacrifice replicating her coffee so we know she didn't have the energy to start making parts for a torpedo! lol
2:40 - Janeway: "Hit them with more than we've got." 4:11 - Janeway: "One more torpedo oughtta do it." Tuvok: "Captain. We've already used way more torpedoes than we have. One more could dangerously overload the core suspension of disbelief." Janeway: "Fire!" ... "Tuvok, where's your vulcan sense of logic? Once we get back home, we can get as many torpedoes as we want, so we can easily get the number back into the positive. It's simple math, really." 5:08 - Chakotay: "What about a photon torpedo?" Tuvok: "I would not recommend it." Chakotay: "Yeah yeah, I know, we have less than none left. Just put it on the tab." Tuvok (to himself): "Damn torpedo addicts. They're gonna crash this whole thing."
Little-known fact: if you only have one torpedo left, and temporarily glitch out your ship's counter with cosmic radiation from Delta Quadrant Space Anomaly #4,982,716, then fire two torpedoes, the counter goes negative, wraps around, and you wind up with 255 torpedoes.
I hate to be that guy, but some of those torpedoes shouldn't count because they were fired during timelines that got changed, like Year of Hell. Also, I think some of those torpedoes were fired between the two Goo Crew episodes and so may have been fired by the Goo Crew and not by the real Voyager.
I think you'll find there are no alternate timelines included. As for Goo Crew... The part at 3:22 where they shoot down Tom's weapon is from the episode where he gets demoted to Ensign, which takes place in between the two goo crew episodes, and he doesn't get promoted until the end of the next season. But in the second goo crew episode, Goo Tom is a lieutenant. So we know that at least this episode and any that follow it where Tom was still an ensign was the real crew. At 3:08 where Seven reconfigures more torpedoes, her suit has had an upgrade that continues through the season. Except when we see Goo Seven, she's still wearing the gray suit from earlier. So we know this is the real crew too. That just leaves 2:32 to 3:07, which believe it or not is all one episode, the most torpedoes ever used in a single episode. But this is also where Tom creates Captain Proton, which would later be established as Real Tom's, so this has to be Real Tom too.
damn, before i read the replies i was going to say that even if as much as 15 of the torpedoes (quite generous) were miscounted that is still nearly twice as many nonexistent torpedoes (torpedoes that shouldn't exist) as real torpedoes. but turns out he did actually did his homework and all of those torpedoes were an accurate count, so great job TazG2000.
Don't forget that Voyager has industrial replicators: that is, replicators used to replicate spare components for the ship itself. It is easy to theorise that they could manufactur photon torpedo casing. The antimatter, lore wise (if Enterprise is to be believed, anyway) comes from the ships actual antimatter housing. However, I am aware that this is just excusing sloppy writing. It wouldn't have taken much time for them, in an episode, to be like "captain, we need to replicate more torpedos. We are down to 3"
TazG2000 I think you did a good job in trying to decipher the Demon/Goo crew out that was one of the thoughts I had during the video but I'm sorry to say your tally is not accurate you have only listed the ones, used by the crew but we know they lost some too season 4 episode 23 Living Witness the episode right before the demon/goo crew was created there is a Voyager torpedo in the Kyrian Voyager Museum this adds to the total "used" by the show but it also makes me wonder if more are missing
Yup. They could have even incorporated it into a bit of storywriting. "Captain's log: we have entered a nebula that makes it easy for enemy ships to sneak up on us because we need to find some (unobtanium) to replenish our supply of photon torpedoes."
"If we armed my ships with your photon torpedoes…" "I can't authorize that." "Why not?" "Because we've already used more than we have." (Copied from an old comment that doesn't seem to be here anymore. It deserves to live on.)
well its questionable how much they spent due to not knowing what exactly in the series was doing of the original voyager and what of the clone voyager
For what it's worth, Voyager did have a bunch of visible hull patches visible from all the times a deck blew up with no casualties. So clearly their ability to fix evverything wasn't unrealistically magical.
I don't care what the canon says - it doesn't make sense to assume Voyager couldn't replenish their supply of torpedoes through SOME means. The idea of having a limited inventory made sense in the pilot and most of season 1, but c'mon. even if they had to build a special replicator or something, they would have needed to improvise. Maybe the later torpedoes were improvised explosives and not true photon torpedoes. In the end though, firing torpedoes was done to make scripts more exciting and really for no other reason. Trek has far bigger continuity errors than this kind of thing.
At the start of the series they were in an area of space where tech was limited compared to Starfleet. It was realistic to say that in the foreseeable future they would have no way of replacing their torpedoes. Resources really were limited and they were relying heavily on trade. If they can eventually get to the point where they can build the Delta Flyer then it is a reasonable assumption that they had also been able to manufacture torpedoes. The resources required to keep an adequate supply constantly regularly may be sparse, but they could gradually replenish them. But it does point out one of the real flaws of Voyager. The series started out acknowledging their lack of resources but rarely referenced it again and mostly discarded it. Voyager would have been a better series as a whole if they focussed more on that as an ongoing plot point. The fact we can make a video about this issue with torpedoes illustrates this wonderfully because we were never shown how they solved this problem.
The writers were lazy and didn't care. They hated to do "arc" episodes, so everything got reset at the beginning of the next episode, including relationships. It would have been easy to drop in a line about how "we need to find more antimatter to replenish our torpedo supply" but NOPE. That's just too much continuity for them.
I cracked up at 'Fire everything!'. This was still better than Generations. "Prepare to fire a full spread of photon torpedoes when their shields drop. And by full spread, I mean ONE torpedo.'
I suspect that the initial comment of "No way to replace them" was based on being isolated and too low on energy to replicate new ones - a situation they solved before the count passed 0.
I believe the Borg had a more efficient and mobile way to make more, so Seven modified Voyager so that it could manufacture them and never run out. The infinite torpedo shenannigans started when Seven joined the crew, so it makes sense.
It's best to simply say Chakotay had inaccurate data to begin with. And then they figured out that they actually had 100+ because they where overstocked because of an error at DS9 before going into the Badlands.
or that during their trip through the Delta Quadrant they manage to acquire the components needed to manufacturing facilities and to build more torpedos. We saw in one episode where Voyager was arranging a deal to acquire better weapons.
David Knowles I would have liked a clip from an episode where we see B'Elanna's quarters converted into a photon torpedo production area. I suspect that was what happened anyway. That's why she was so violent.
They come across dozens of other alien races, many of which have the same technologies as the Federation. SURELY some of them had photon torpedoes or something similar enough to be considered photon torpedoes. There are plenty of episodes where they get supplies from other races, including weapons.
@@Masasume1 The writers of Voyager could easily had fitted in a line somewhere where Janeway just casually mentions how lucky they were that they got parts which were easy to modify for spare torpedoes.
@@Nonsensei436 Maybe a slightly smarter than average Ferengi would have been of some use? Apparently there's one that developed a rather successful self replicating mine. Volatile exploding bits included.
Marchant2 He did daydream about becoming the ECH (Emergency Command Hologram) in an earlier episode, but later it was actually implemented. They activated the ECH program once because they had to abandon the ship, and the "watch and learn" part happens after they return and he's been in command by himself for some time.
+Marchant2 That's from the episode "Workforce Pt. 2" when he's trying to get the crew back. The Dr refers to a battle where a Romulan captain disables two ships by creating a photonic shockwave between two ships. "How'd he do that?" Kim asks. "Watch and learn," The Dr replies.
To me it was rather obvious when Janeway said "no way to replenish them", she was thinking in the short term where normally a starship would restock at a starbase. In long term they no doubt gathered the materials needed to replicate the torpedo housings and technology. Not to mention the several upgrades they did to the replicators and other systems from species they encountered. The is evident in episodes like Scorpion Part 1 when 7 of 9 knows the torpedo compliment "We are borg" when asked how she knew.
blivvy Not at all. First of all from the character's perspective, they were thinking they would need to survive on their own for up to 70 years. Meanwhile this was released at the height of Star Trek's popularity - TNG just ended, DS9 was picking up steam, a new movie series was launching - the writers fully expected to get a full 7 seasons like TNG (which they did) and intended the supply rationing to be a real long-term need. In fact the 38 torpedoes almost did last an entire 4 seasons. It was only in the last few years the writers pretty much abandoned the idea (but without giving an explanation for the change), apparently because ratings were slipping and they thought they needed a more "action" oriented show.
Despite the way this video is presenting it, this really is less a continuity problem and more the writer's flip-flopping on the intended tone. They easily could have made torpedoes offscreen, and we can assume they did, but the point of the original line is to show that their resources are limited. But as the series go on rarely do things just stop working or run out as a routine thing rather than as a central plot point. It's kinda a shame.
TheEliteGir No, it's the theme of this particular episode where they don't have the resources, especially to replace the torpedoes. But they are not ALWAYS so low on resources. It's the nature of their journey: They have to stockpile fuel, weapons, supplies, food, energy, etc, as well as do repairs and regular maintenance. Depending on circumstances, some things may get used up or damaged more or less than expected. When something critical starts running low, or it's time for maintenance, they come out of warp, and gather up supplies and all that, and start another stretch. Since they were new to the area, and their situation, they'd likely run low a few times before they know or anticipate what they need to stockpile more of, and what they can safely recycle and/or convert. Unneeded supplies can be recycled back into the energy reserves & base materials, like the replicators do when you put unused portions, plates and stuff back. However, they need energy reserves to use replicators to make parts for constructing weapons, so... It's a juggling act with resources that they had to learn to manage so they didn't run low on anything critical, and the goal is to be able to stay at high warp without running out of anything before the need to do regular maintenance.
Gramps Ford No, but it only occasionally seems like they have to worry about their resources. All I'm saying is that that would have made the show a ton more interesting if it wasn't just business as usual on Starship Voyager just without being able to Skype command on demand.
That's because the ships are capable of massive amounts of recycling so if something did completely shut down, they are likely almost entirely out of energy. Which happened on many episodes.
It wasn't. They were on food rations the entire series. The whole point of Neelix cooking food was because they couldn't afford to put all their energy supply into food replication. They instead relied on people farming in cargo bays and trading for more food.
That bit about having 30-something torpedoes and no way to replace them had always stuck with me. It made me self-conscious each time they used them, and wondering how many they had left. They sold it with that single exchange of dialogue, and if they wanted to drop the limit and opt for "torpedoes go brrr", they could've done so just as easily. Personally, it would've been really satisfying if they said that a room was repurposed for torpedo production. 😌 Perhaps early Season 4, when they upped the budget and frequency of space battles, and it could've been a 7 of 9 thing like the new atrometrics lab.
So they did find a way of manufacturing photon torpedoes at an average rate of about one per month, but “I need 20 more by tomorrow” remains an impossible request. Doesn’t sound very implausible to me. It’s just a missed opportunity to make a good episode or two about the struggle of torpedo manufacturing.
They build Shuttles and later the deltaflyer. twice. building a couple of Torpedos is no biggy. the antimatter might be tricky,they never explained where a spaceship gets it from. probably trading of some kind.
@@aikrichter5403 IIRC they can collect it slowly (how fast depends on the nature of the area of space they are in I think?) but they also need it to power their ship so they could only build new ones when they had a power surplus.
No way to replace them cuz there stranded in the delta quadrant. Of course givin the right material they could make new ones. Its be silly if they couldnt, thou a few line about it would have shut all the haters up
I can't believe the person who uploaded this might actually call themselves a Star Trek fan and not know that ships can with the right resources and time make all manner of replacement parts and munitions, don't forget that over the course of Voyager they built several shuttles while over in the D-quad.
"I don't intend to run out of firepower mid battle."
AT -33 PHOTON TORPEDOES
Whooooooooo is supplying her torpedoes after she ran out?
@@shorelockhomes943 My theory is that she is or was at one time doing the dance with no pants with Q.
However instead of him returning the ship to earth she did it for more torpedoes because she wanted the acclaim that would come from her guiding the crew home.
I'm pretty sure that they have the specifications on how to build these things in the database and it's more than likely that they resupplied the Torpedoes every time they stopped to resupply the ship. And they did stop quite often in the show to resupply.
I like to think that, after Seven said: "That is not possible," Janeway said "Bet."
She is very good at holding to her intentions, even made up new fake torpedos out of sheer willpower.
By the way, if they ever actually ran out of torpedoes, it's ok. They could just launch shuttle craft at the enemy. There's a nearly infinite supply of those as well.
Almost as the near infinite supply of red shirts in all of Star Trek. There's so many when on dies another takes their place, though expendable they are infinite, it is truly horrifying. (Joke)
If they could build the delta flyer i'm pretty sure a torpedo isn't really gonna be a challenge.
Yeah and paris could ride it
@@vivaelbetis2086 Which one. The admiral or lieutenant?
That one got me chuckling
"What about a photon torpedo"
"I wouldn't recommend it"
FIRES 3
America!!!!
In their defense... three photon torpedoes isn't *_a_* photon torpedo.
@@ZeroGForce I mean yes but also no :P I can't really argue with that tho, but that's like telling someone not to ram someone with their car so they do it 3 times.
this scene made me laugh in retrospect to the video
"I would not recommend it. We're already firing torpedoes that not only do not exist but that we now owe the universe. It's conceivable the space-time continuum could actually shatter."
"Meh, that happens every week anyway."
" Tuvok, how many torpedoes do we have left?"
"-25 captain"
"FIRE!"
Tuvok: I must warn you. IF we keep delving deep into our pockets and withdrawing more and more torpedos from 'null space' it could have disastrous consequences.
Janeway: Do you really think anyone is keeping count?
20 torpedos were launched that day.
" Tuvok, how many torpedoes do we have left?"
"-25 captain"
"FULL SPREAD!"
*Rolls eyes, fires torpedos full spread*
That is illogical
Full Spread
Let’s take a moment to appreciate the fact that this guy went into every episode of the series again. He then video edited every single scene of torpedoes firing or mentioning. And then made this video. Do u even imagine the time and effort needed?
He did a better job than the people who made the series!
@@jaysay3177 Seriously? I mean, yeah, it's not accurate having a negative torpedo balance, but the series is still fun to watch.
I think he missed a couple. Two were fired in "Counterpoint".
@VHTesla Then the one for plot convenient shield strength must be 1B2B3.
"Get a life!" comes to mind...
-1 additional that ended up in a museum about “warship Voyager”
The only warship to return from extended deep space endurance combat with a full compliment of torpedoes in its holds.
Reads the museum plaque: "This torpedo from Voyager appears to be a regular starfleet torpedo, but analysis indicates it was not manufactured but in fact emerged from the quantum vacuum by random chance.... along with the rest of Voyager's arsenal."
@@hoodaticus so wait the 24th Century SCP foundation went public?
alternate reality timeline doesn't count
@@MedalionDS9 it's not from the alternate timeline. it's from the actual timeline. the reason they called it the warship voyager was because the people who ran the museum didn't know any better and let their bias guide their interperetation of voyager.
the episode is also set 700 years in the future. alot of information was lost in that time, except for a copy of the doctor.
@@eliasfrimannsson6216 It splintered off into an alternate timeline because this ep took place in the Future, but obviously Voyager got back home.
Vaadwaur : If we armed our ship with your photon torpedoes....
Janeway : I can't authorize that.
Vaadwaur : Why not?
Janeway : Because we've already use more torpedoes than we have.
+Dr Galactose "Captain, in the old tongue on Talax, "Vaadwaut" meant 'plot hole.'"
:P
+Dr Galactose LOL 4:35 his alien face. "Why not?" Obviously...
Why did I read what you wrote in her voice?
Or they just made more and Janeway meant they can't simply pick them up.
Dr Galactose vadwar distent decendents of Cardassia
"I never met a problem that a photon torpedo couldn't solve."
-Abraham Lincoln 1861
Everything you read on the Internet is true. ibid.
hm, must have told that to kirk...
How the hell do you count to negative Abraham Lincoln? Let alone negative Abraham Lincoln and 1,861 more?
@Koowluh Akshally... he preferred Transphasic torpedoes... cuz he had to fight so many Borg back in the day
I don't know what happened to this section, but I love it.
8 years after published, this randomly shows up in my suggested feed.
I call it the nostalgia algorithm.
@@AM-xi1lh Yeah isn't video on demand awesome you don't have to watch it when it comes out
Just me one year later I guess.
im glad it did the same for me lmao
Yep just arrived
"We're not going to run out"
"Why's that?"
"We've already run out."
Day bow bow
LOL
Captain Carol Janeway.
"I don't want to hear that kind of negativity"😆
😂😂😂
Janeway: Q. Can you take our ship back to the Alpha quadrant.
Q: Yes I can but no that would not be fun. But I can give your ship a set of self replicating photon torpedoes that never runs out.
that makes way too much sense
Must've reconstituted that puppy without saying anything.
We might need some shuttlecraft too.
Infinite ammo is the perfect complement to our ablative plot armor.
Ahhh, so that's what happened 🐱
32 is WAY too low and specific a number to get away with. If they said like 200 or something, nobody would keep track of this.
Considering the size of these torpedoes, you can probably double that amount
the standart compliment of a galaxy class is 200 with more later on, but even the constitution class refit in star trek 6 had definetly more torpedoes than 32
Either Voyager left to take on Chakotay's Maquis with only limited stocks ( they thought it was gonna be a easy job) or somebody got REALLY, REALLY trigger happy during that Maquis mission.
"Open hailing frequencies" "HERE'S A GREETING FOR YA! BOOM!!!" "Time for dinner." "DID SOMEONE SAY FULL SPREAD!!!" "KA-POW!!!"
That is precisely what the writers wanted though. They wanted a low number, a number that would convey urgency and despair. A number that would put the crew to its limits. They also wanted to convey that clearly to the audience so they said "here is a small number you can keep track of". Then they decided that they didn't want to do that anymore! Oops!
@@ViccVegaa023 did we miss the fire until you hit something part I think we know who was trigger happy
I didn't think this video would be THAT funny!
I completely lost it at "Keep firing until you hit something!"
hehe yeah the music made it really good
^
Janeway: Full spread
Chakotey:We're out of torpedoes
Janeway:clone harry and fire his clones FULL SPREAD.
Scheiblerfunk Poor Harry. 😂
Well, he is nearly always off the ship, so...
Replace "harry" with "Neelix". You're welcome! :D
@Terix Septim
Don't you worry about it.... they'll all be shot into the vacuum of space to suffocate and explode. :)
"we accidentally fired the real harry along with all of his cloens, excluding one."
"are we sure?"
"Not really."
Please let there be a shuttle version of this.
YESSS!!!
EdricLysharae omg yes
@Chris Spencer "Report"
"We lost all 3 shuttles."
"How many are left."
"Only 4 Ma'am."
or a crew member version, for that matter
YES PLEASE
Tbh, I was actually surprised the count stayed positive for as long as the beginning of season 4.
its almost as if the show runners were aware of potential continuity issues and then got distracted by finally being allowed to play with the borg as a major opponent
@@rockstermaniac It's certainly possible that between the temporary alliance with the Borg and Seven of Nine's expertise they were able to make more torpedoes. Also I always thought they managed to get some from the USS Equinox at the end of season 5 before the ship was destroyed in the season 6 opener.
@@jcohasset23 lol so you think a short range science vessel not only had quantum torpedoes, but enough , that they’d have some left over after the exact same amount of time in the delta quadrant as voyager?
Actually, they wanted to use only 38 toroedoes over all 7 seasons. But at the end of Season 4 or so they realised 38 is shit low and anyways in the technical guide it says they can build torpedoes with raw materials from planets (Technical Guide V1.0 p. 22 "Torpedo Limitations", 1994).
@@turbogamerxd329 38 would have been low for something like a sovereign, galaxy, or a defiant, but for an Intrepid class it seems accurate.
I always just assumed they figured out a way to manufacture them along the way somehow. Just like the endless shuttlecraft.
But they outright said they had no way to manufacture more.
Now, if they did find a way, they would have to outright say it. An equal reaction. The former is confirmed, the latter is conjecture. And conjecture isn't canon unless it's confirmed.
@@Cyke101 Yes, they said that at the _beginning_ of the show. And I hoped they would have at least had one line where they said they figured it out or something. But they didn't. Like the endless shuttlecraft, it's a plot hole. So we can either just assume they figured it out...or not. Either way, that they've still got us thinking and talking about a show over two decades later...I think they did all right.
The thing is, since it's a plot hole, the burden of proof is on the show, and not the viewer, to create the explanation of making the show. We could all assume or hypothesize how they replaced their torpedoes all the live long day, but if they don't actually explain it, then they violate one of the basic rules they set up for themselves -- a constant state of scarcity.
I realize that framing the torpedo supply like that seems overblown, but every TV show has a set of rules that they adhere to, spoken or not. Some rules are explicit in the show bible. Others are implied but are part of the premise (i.e. Full House cannot violate an explicit rule of having a sparsely-occupied house, nor can it violate an implied rule of, like, magical time travel. It's just not that kind of show).
But by violating the rules it sets upon itself, it then means that its own cohesion and tightness can give way, when a TV show really requires a strict focus in its premise (or else the premise is pointless).
For example, Voyager's premise was that it would take them 70 years to get home. Obviously it took far less time than that, but that distance had to be acknowledged -- every time they took a shortcut, they would outright state that it cut the journey by years or even decades. That's an acknowledgement of the premise. The torpedoes didn't get that acknowledgement. Them shaving off 63 years off the journey doesn't feel like a cheat or plot hole because its central premise was kept in mind. The viewer didn't need to explain or rationalize any of those jumps. The viewer's labor wasn't needed there. Their needing double the torpedoes *is* a cheat because they never touched upon that scarcity again.
@@Cyke101 we have no way to manufacture photon torpedoes now either. But that does not change the fact that we may someday develop the method.
@@Cyke101 I agree with you that it's a plot hole. I agree with you that the show didn't explain this point as it should have. What do you want me to do about it? We're talking about a TV show that hasn't been on the air for going on two decades.
Janeway: "They may have torpedoes to waste, we dont." 0:54
Also Janeway: "Keep firing until you hit something" 4:25
Also also Janeway: Lol let's use it to start off this dumb race.
In all fairness, 4:25 was in reference to the phasers. The targeting scanners were offline. That's why she said keep firing until you hit something.
Haha
@@AlandrisFerguson I came here to say the same. I just saw that episode.
In all actuality, despite what is said about not being able to replace them, I believe they could easily replicate them. I think when that's said, they're referring to the fact that they can't restock via normal means. A starship wouldn't have much need to replicate torpedoes in the Alpha Quadrant.
Best line in this whole video.
I like to think Jane way is just deluded, but the crew are too nice to call her out, so whenever she says “fire torpedos” they just press the button and make “pew pew” sounds
"Wow, lucky for us, everything we needed to hit with torpedos had a spontaneous warp core breach right after we faked a firing sequence!"
@@swishfish8858 you made me spot out my tea.
someone in camo running accros the bottom of the screen with a stick and pic of torpedo attach making pew pew sounds
I'm afraid the frightening truth is that the number of extra torpedoes Voyager fired is roughly equal to the number of their dead crewmates. Thus reviving a very old Starfleet trick of using humans as torpedo warheads.
LoL
Tuvok: We can't just keep firing torpedoes.
Janeway: haha torpedoe printer go brrrrr
Janeway obviously was lying about not having a way to replace those torpedo's
That; or they found a way to modify the CFE Replicator to produce weapons... yet hadn't got to that point whilst still in Kazon space.
LOL oh fuck my sides!
@@jimtaylor294 Don't you dare bring logical solutions into this!
@@jblyon2 *XD*
Tuvok: Captain, we are down to nine torpedoes.
Janeway: Harry, activate the Cheat Engine again and replenish our stock.
They should just simulate torpedoes on the holodeck 24-7 and wait for the inevitable computer malfunction to turn them real.
I read this in Janeway's voice
By Cheat Engine you mean, of course, Q.
impulse 101
Power overwhelming
Kim: Captian here is your toast with a competent of condiments.
Janeway: Nutella?
Kim: We only have ¼ of a tub left.
Janeway: I don't care, Nutella Full spread!
Chakotay: Same here Ensin, Nutella on Toast, Full spread.
Kim: Question, Will you ever promote me?
Janeway and Chakotay: NO!
i want the nutella on my toast in dispersal pattern sierra.
I only take high-yield nutella.
:DDD bio-molecular, high-yield nutella tubs
haha😂
Lewis Co. And remember to keep some for Admiral [insert random name here] back on earth, I want to give him a full spread of Nutella for his pancakes!
Janeway to Tuvok, "fire torpedoes full spread"
Tuvok to Janeway "i would not recommend it"
Janeway to tuvok " why is that Tuvok"
Tuvok to Janeway "we ran out of torpedoes in season 1"
Janeway to Tuvok "What have we been firing for the last 2 seasons?"
Tuvok to Janeway "Neelix leftovers that even make b'lanna puke out the airlock"
Janeway to Tuvok "fire everything!"
And have Neelix make more slop!
Not even the Borg could adapt to that kind of weapon!
Borg : we are the borg lower your shield .... SPLAT .... Neelix type torpedoes ..... un-adaptable ....
Captain Janeway : 0_0 Neelix do more slop thats an order
Neelix : ay ay captain but what will we eat ?
Captain Janeway : everything but that
Take the cheese to sickbay!....i mean, to the Armory!
The New Puketon Torpedo, Because we ran out photons thats why
So is Janeway’s favorite word “coffee” or “fire”?
*YES*
They found a way to make torpedoes out of coffee grinds
@@MedalionDS9 Infinite torpedo supply.
@@MedalionDS9 Which explains the episode where they punch a hole into a lifeform to get coffee
Or maybe "Full Spread"
Fire everything, and then some more... for good measure.
Says the Y-wing bomber.
shoot until you hit something - best scene ever....
majstealth 🤪
Y-Wings carry 8 Proton Torpedoes, 20 Proton Bombs, At least 12 Ion Torpedoes, And undoubtedly more ordinance....
K-Wings are the way to go if they were only canon.
This is what a continuity director is for. Someone who keeps track of things mentioned in throwaway lines, or various actions so the plot stays centered.
Otherwise you end up with subwarp shuttles from season 1, that can suddenly reach warp speed in season 3, but are then unable to do so in season 4.
It's a luxury position that most studios don't want to pay for. But don't worry, the internet is here to remind them.
Also the whole warp 10 situation.
Like they can't afford even one autistic person to keep track?
Robert Lozyniak “Lol DoN’t YoU kNoW rEtArDs JuSt Go DuRrRr In A cOrNeR????” Basically the attitude against the spectrum of mental disorders back then. It wasn’t until a minimum of 2008 that there was even a bare minimum of understanding. They sure missed on a lot lol not that I’m complaining since people were horrible back then.
@@Norinia *Were* horrible?
damn, how do i get that job
The best thing about Voyager was still when Harry Kim was sucked out into space and died... they got a instant replacement from that alternate Voyager so nobody gave a damn about it. No funeral no nothing and next episode forgotten it ever happened. His body is probably still floating out there somewhere.
The same happened to O'Brien.
You're making assumptions that aren't warranted. During the events of that episode, they were too busy defending their ship to spend time grieving for their lost crewman. It is reasonable to assume they dealt with those consequences off-screen between that episode and the next. Just because they don't dedicate screen time to it didn't mean it didn't happen.
Steve Terry 'Just because they don't dedicate screen time to it didn't mean it didn't happen.' But that does make it lazy storytelling.
***** Visionary (DS9 season 3)
Star Trek Online has remedied this :P.
When they return home, they need to carry 85 torpedos on board to have none.
Or, every time they fire an antimatter photon torpedo, it increases the regular matter torpedo inventory by +1. You never run out of torpedos, if you alternate between firing matter and antimatter torpedos. They cancel each other out on the inventory list.
They used the initial 38 first before going into the negative. So it would actually have to be 123 to have 0 left when they returned home.
@@Tar-Numendil And I mean, the original mission was one of military significance. Tracking down a hostile ship in hostile territory. They really ought to have had that much to begin with.
The worst was -71, because they used it as fireworks.
I like that you left those fired in Year of Hell out, because they got them back.
+Schwarzer Ritter I think a great way to go about that would be to count them all, then show Janeway ramming the timeship with the unscathed Voyager passing by after with the counter reset. Would've been a fun troll moment.
Chakotay: Neelix, I want to put on a big lunch for our guests...
Neelix: But commander... Our supplies...
Chakotay: Give them a full spread!
Lol
Haha.
ah fuck, thats clever!
Dammit, I just sprayed Leeola root stew across my desk, thanks...
Janeway used cheat code.
Yup - "Pi 1 1 0" ;)
Computer! Up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, ...
A B A B select start.
Justin bailey -------- --------!!!!!!!!!
+Jacob Stratton lmfao
The most impressive thing isn't the fact you went through and grabbed every single clip from the series, but the fact you weaved in the dialog of Janeway explaining to a random alien that there's no WAY they can transfer a torpedo to them because of Starfleet's strict rules about photon torpedoes.
Absolutely epic.
Also Janeway: "I will be happy to transfer some torpedos. FIRE!"
Janeway: I don't intend to run out of firepower mid battle.
Seven: That is not possible.
Me: You don't say...
"No torpedo is ever really gone."
Hahahaha, priceless
Oh...how embarrassing
Is it possible to learn that power?
@@red_cosplay Not from a Voyager
LMAO. So True!
So where is a shuttle count?
it went out the window, along with the script section about counting the torpedoes used throughout the series.
To be fair, at least Voyager showed the crew building new shuttles, mainly the Delta Flyer. I don't think they ever mentioned making more photon torpedoes.
Mike T Antimatter would have to be slavaged from any sources they came across, but that's plausible.
There was coffee in that nebula. Maybe it also held a few torpedoes and shuttles.
this needs to be done.
It's a shame Voyager never seriously explored the consequences of its interesting premise. Not just the fact that they couldn't restock at the nearest starbase, but the fact that a significant part of the crew were Maki - but almost immediately started acting just like Star Fleet officers.
well they neither explore it or explore how they are able to replenish their torpedo compliment and yes they had to replenish torpedo's in order to not run out during the series in the delta quadrant
*Maquis :D
@@cjtombraider Oops, yeah, I should have remembered that French spelling. They’re named for the French resistance in WW2, I think.
"Almost immediately"?
Oh, no. That took lots of time and work .
Remember, human management and group psychology are also sciences that would have advanced in the future.
@@TheNoiseySpectator well you would hope that they had advanced in the future but who knows man🤣
there is an episode where janeway mentions the "torpedo building team" Ensign wildmand is a member of it.
I mean, with the length of time they were out there, they'd have had to figure out how to replace the weapons eventually. Every part of the ship would have needed maintenance or reconstruction, anyway.
They have replicators that's how they make items and repair. They may have built a large one in a storage room and found the right things to print torpedos.
@David Daivdson We do that with airplanes all the time in the real world: and the answer, perhaps surprisingly, is Yes.
Well I'm sure there are security measures in place to keep people from replicating a matter/antimatter warhead that is the torpedo. The other parts may be replicated for like caskets, probes, etc. But, I'm sure the anti-matter had to me siphoned from voyager's own reserve. So, Janeway may have jumped the gun when she said there was no way to replace them when expending the munitions.
@David Daivdson your body's cells die and are replaced are you you? am I me? are we us?
Janeway: Tuvok full torpedo spread!
Tuvok: Captain we don´t have any left.
Janeway: To be or not to be, thats not the question here, FIRE THOSE TORPEDOES!
Tuvok: But we don´t have-
Janeway: THERE IS COFFEE IN THAT NEBULA, *FIRE TORPEDOES*!!!!!!!!!!!
Captain, Im not Scotty
To be fair, when Janeway first said they had "no way to replenish them once their gone", she was speaking during an energy supply crisis. A few Borg upgrades, and upgrades from other species and well... +85 torpedoes :P
Also, you forgot to include the "Transphasic Torpedoes" from the series finale :)
+Michael Anderson It's also probebly fair to asume that they were able to trade for various materials they could use directly or indirectly for the torpedoes. Not including stray asteroids, ship remains and possably may have been able to harvest certain elements from solar flares from some stars.
+Michael Anderson They were able to build a next-gen shuttle. A torpedo should be considerably less difficult.
they all so bought guns at least from one species they encountered
Yep. Even if they couldn't make more once they had resources, the total count only requires them to have sound a planet with sufficient tech to help them manufacture needed components twice - pretty sure they ran into civilizations with superior tech several times.
Also....................
All the writers needed to do was insert one sentence: "Captain, using 7's nano-probes, we've managed to modify a high powered replicator to produce Photon Torpedoes". And that would not have even contradicted Janeway's first statement that they had no way to replenish them - Borg technology gave them a way.
But instead they just seemed to ignore it all together...that, along with the seemingly unlimited supply of Shuttle Crafts...
I can just imagine a ship battling Voyager and then Voyager justs starts expelling hundreds of shuttlecraft
@@tareqn.gaming1622 Who needs an aircraft carrier when you have an endless supply of shuttlecraft LMAO
The funny thing is, the ridiculous waste of photon torpedoes started after 7 appeared. They could have easily shown that she helped them modify the replicators or build some extra manufacturing infrastructure or something.
Or better yet, have a scene where it shows us where they're able to construct torpedoes using spare parts or tech they gather.
@@LuaanTi They did that a LOT with 7 and several plot points surrounding her character.
4:41 starfleet protocols are very strict about transfered weapons.
Here have some torpedos
Conclusion: Chakotay slept in all of his maths lessons.
Conclusion: full spread
Conclusion: Dispersal pattern sierra
Conclusion: Guns, lots of guns.
conclusion, i am tired
I heard that there was a Right Way, a Wrong Way, and the Janeway...... I now happen to know what the Janeway is. To fire all the torpedoes...... and then some!
The Janeway is similar to the Max Power way :D
Full spread of course
I feel like it’d be really cool if the writers actually kept track of everything in Voyager
But then it'd be Battlestar Galactica
Like in the episode Pathfinder. They were around 35.000 light years away from Earth, Barclay somehow managed to contact with them, though the Starfleet's only knowledge about the Voyager's whereabout was they are somewhere at 60.000 ly away...
they kept track of crew members at least
I would have liked it if they had started every single episode with a brief recap of how far Voyager has traveled since the start of their journey, coupled with how far away from earth they are at that point in time. Maybe set against a map of the galaxy. This standard beginning to each episode wouldn't have to be lengthy or cumbersome - it would only have to last ten or fifteen seconds. This would have given the show an entirely different and better feeling of continuity.
@@thomasn3882 I think they didn't know in advance in what order the stories would run; Star Trek didn't really have explicit continuity between episodes until... Enterprise? Maaaaybe DSN. They could still work around that, but in general, the ST writing format was "a bunch of episodes written by different people with little to no communication between them". This worked fine for TOS, but started really breaking by the time of Voyager.
Haha, great video :D and there is even 1 scene missing. Voyager follows the "U.S.S. Dauntless" in the slipstream and fires 4 torpedos on the ship, "full spread" of course :D lol
*hits bong* What does full spread even mean?
the fire sequence "full spread" is like if you change the setting of a machine gun from single bullet, to automatic. You don`t fire one torpedo (bullet) you fire full spread or full volley 3:39 4:01 4:52 5:31 5:50
If I recall Correctly a Full Spread for the Enterprise D would be 5 shot from a single tube (though I don't recall if they can shoot 5 out of the back launcher as well that might have a lower rate of fire).
So think of a Revolver you can "fan it" and fire all 6 chambers in under 2 seconds or fire sequentially - the same here they can fire 3 Torpedo in quick succession from a chamber loaded with 3 Torpedoes on each side.
It seems Voyager has a number of temporary staging points where a single or small number of torpedos can be released from too. these include one in the dorsal one next to the tractor beam emitter and a small cluster of them on the side. those areas don't seem suited for rapid fire and may not even be a full staging area and are little more than a weapon release airlock. They might even be the place the umbilicals attach to when docking the ship.
The main Torpedo Bay (3 of them) are adjacent to the storage areas and so can fire and reload more quickly - I don't know the facts but judging by the footage it seems they can stage 3 and fire them almost simultaneously from each main launcher. (so 6 forwards and 3 rear wards) but they usually stagger them a bit no only to target them independently but also for safety reasons.
Where are the Enterprise D fired all 5 at once they then separate from the cluster (kinda dangerous).
The main launcher can also fire Probes too. If a larger probe was needed it would likely have to be specially constructed and either beamed into space or released from the shuttle bay.
Curiously like the NX-01 Voyager has a lot of auxiliary hatches and ports that were never given a specific function - for example near the rear torpedo launcher there are two hatches - which I think are wear work bees are stored.
90 Lancaster when we start about functional design....what the hell is that borg-ish part at the front of the Intrepid saucer?
NO other federation ship has it
In one of the specialist sensor Pallets that Science Vessels have - there is also a secondary Deflector on the Primary hull underneath that part.
If you compare Rhode Island to The normal Nova Class Equinox you can see Equinox has them too Rhode Island doesn't.
It's quite common on 24th Century ships (Look at Norway Class, Prometheus class and so on) - on other ships the sensors are contained in domes or parts stuck on the hull (like the Centaur Class or the Constellation class) where as the additional sensors on other ships can also be place in a out-board pod as on some variations of Nova Class.
If I had to guess i'd say some of the sensors are mapping sensors and general science tools for doing stuff science ship do more easily. and some of the sensors are more tactical and rely on tracking ships, looking for cloaked vessels and acting a battlefield management tools. (I think that distinction is the most obvious in the Nova Class variants).
I'm kinda curious what the thick armour plates on the side of the Prometheus are for though myself.
I was sent by a mechanic..
With The Intellect of a Cow when it comes to cars
His mind was as empty as his name.
3:35
Beaming a bomb over to the enemy is how 100% of these battles should go.
but how does beaming a photon torpedo work when they cannot replicate antimatter? Beaming is essentially breaking everything down to molecular basis..
Never understood why they didn't weaponise they transporter more than they did.
Like, mid battle transport a huge chunk of metal into the flight path of another ship
Or as soon as they take shields out, like teleport their computer system away, or their engines.
Do something other than fire torpedoes all day 😂
@@MrTimmy132 Actually, it is sort of addressed in canon. Transporters have a hard time getting a lock on anything moving at too high a relative velocity, and space combat speeds are usually a decent fraction of c. The times they aren't are often when there's some sort of restriction that also precludes using transporters anyway
@@MrTimmy132 they can't Pierce shields and you have to be pretty much still or have some kind of device to lock into to be targeted.
There is the wrong way, the right way, and the Janeway.
it should be noted the only time they say they can't replace the torpedo's is the first or second seasons which means that they probably found a way to replenish their supply afterwards later on in the series because they get more trigger happy with torpedo's in later seasons maybe because they didn't have to worry about running out anymore
@@raven4k998 Visual mediums like TV and movies are about show, not tell... or tell if you absolutely have to...but don't leave things up to fans to imagine scenarios for overlooked plot points
"Mr. Tuvok, enter the sequence: 'Janeway-IDKFA'."
You'd need a mechanic to explain this.
Continuity errors?! In Star Trek?! Say it ain't so!!
Dopest Flyest O.G. Pimp Hustla Gangsta Playa
ikr. Still find this absolutely hilarious. Damn writers need to start taking notes on each others work, or at least explain how they got more torpedoes...
+Missionary of the Adepta Sororitas The re-armed at one of the many planets that they've come across with similar technology, then reconfigured them to work with Federation equipment. Now, was that so difficult?
Not surprised a Stooge of Imperium lacks the imagination to fill in the blanks on their own. The Imperium is stagnation! For Chaos! ;)
+Keihryon Thank you for that information, now please remit the name of your planet of origin so that I can call an extermin... er, send you a gift.
+Keihryon What he said...kind of.
+Missionary of the Adepta Sororitas
Star Trek never addressed that Voyager could just make more torpedoes.It takes time and energy so they can only carry so many at a time. But that solves the whole thing. They had to say as much.... and they did not.
That's hilarious! 😂I still love the show despite a little bit of inconsistency ❤️
a "little bit"? what were you even watching?
Well there is an episode where Janeway briefly says something like “Ensign (?) is away with the torpedo building team”
I did not expect to see your channel here! Now you are even more awesome for loving Star Trek.
0:47 - a torpedo fires rearward from the ventral side of the engineering hull. There's no tube there though!
There is a phaser bank. In another episode, that with the old Klingon ship, Voyager fires Phasers out of aft torpedo tubes.
"FIRE EVERYTHING!!!!"
Until you hit something
i really think it's a shame they didn't make this more of a plot point. it would have been really cool to see them being really careful about whether they use them or not.
When 7 of 9 joined the crew they had around 9 original torpedos left. She obviously upgraded their replicators to produce an endless supply of torpedoes as well as shuttle craft parts. She helped them build the Delta Flyer from scratch.
It would have taken one or two sentences to establish that in canon. That they had a way around the problem of limited torpedoes. But they didn't.
@Righteous Pursuit It makes one wonder if the crew made more torpedoes of lesser yield using the old torpedoes.
@@owlsayssouth you expect them to give dialog for every single event in their 7 year journey? the series would take 7 years of nonstop footage to explain all that.
@@lojosol Ya I expect them to have dialogue on one of the most important resources of the ship. In fact that could and should have been an entire episode and WOULD HAVE BEEN if Ronald D Moore was given control of the series.
@@kanaric
Maybe they did and it was a scene that was cut.
I AM THE PHOTON OF MY TORPEDOES
DESTRUCTION IS MY PURPOSE AND LIGHT IS MY SOUL
I HAVE BEEN FIRED OVER A THOUSAND TIMES
UNKNOWN TO AMMUNITION COUNT NOR KNOWN TO SPECIALIZED TYPES
HAVE WITHSTOOD ADVERSITY TO AID THE USS VOYAGER
YET THESE TORPEDOES WILL NEVER RUN OUT
SO AS I PRAY
UNLIMITED PHOTON TORPEDOES
Full spread brother
I think some of them were from the episode where a backup of the Doctor is activated hundreds of years in the future and the historians think Voyager was all warlike and crazy.
I mean, wasn't it??
Living Witness, my opinion the best VOY episode
@@rustyshackleford6060 the *official* version
And I would imagine some also happened in the Year of Hell that got completely erased. Also, that one episode where Voyager was doubled and Harry had to switch ships with baby Naomi.
@@chironOwlglass Someone explain this, I don’t even understand was it a limited series or something?
Chakotay: (Sees Borg Cube)
Chakotay to Tuvok, "What about a photon torpedo?"
Tuvok to Chakotay, "i would not recommend it"
Chakotay: (Fires 3 photon torpedos anyway)
Borg Cube: (Shields neutralize the photon torpedos)
Chakotay: "All weapons online!"
Also Chakotay: (Fires 3 more Photon Torpedos for good measure)
Janeway: "aNoThEr SuCcEsSfUl
MiSsIoN!"
This is exactly why Voyager is my least liked Star Trek. It was like nothing mattered. Nothing had consequence. They set it up to be this survival show with a crew that supposedly shouldn't have gotten along, and then just completely forgot the premise.
It' raining in Britain, let's build a car!
These people built a submersible, Warp-10-capable shuttlecraft using the tools they had onboard. Can we maybe give them the benefit of the doubt that they figured out how to build a few more torpedoes as they went along?
***** Having limited resources is supposed to be the main conflict of the show. Solving it offscreen is like a beat up Defiant docking on the station and Sisko declaring they just defeated the Dominion.
Actually, that is not correct. It is more like the Dominion stopped getting mentioned and just have to assume they got defeated.
I'll them the benefit of the doubt, however you do realize that they didn't just build a few more torpedoes, they nearly tripled their supply. To add to that, the first episode that they did use a torpedo, Janeway specifically said "and no way to replace them after their gone, makes you wonder doesn't it?
Kade Gillman In that episode, they repeatedly imply they are extremely low on energy reserves which means they didn't have the resources to build torpedoes, which means no way to replace them.
*Captain's Log, supplemental. We set out to augment our energy reserves and wound up depleting them by over twenty percent. As a result, we've set a new course for a planet fourteen light years away that Neelix says might have compatible energy sources to offer us. It is out of our way, but circumstances offer few alternatives.* Neelix even had the Captain sacrifice replicating her coffee so we know she didn't have the energy to start making parts for a torpedo! lol
+Shawn Elliott The Delta Flyer...
2:40 - Janeway: "Hit them with more than we've got."
4:11 - Janeway: "One more torpedo oughtta do it."
Tuvok: "Captain. We've already used way more torpedoes than we have. One more could dangerously overload the core suspension of disbelief."
Janeway: "Fire!" ... "Tuvok, where's your vulcan sense of logic? Once we get back home, we can get as many torpedoes as we want, so we can easily get the number back into the positive. It's simple math, really."
5:08 - Chakotay: "What about a photon torpedo?"
Tuvok: "I would not recommend it."
Chakotay: "Yeah yeah, I know, we have less than none left. Just put it on the tab."
Tuvok (to himself): "Damn torpedo addicts. They're gonna crash this whole thing."
Little-known fact: if you only have one torpedo left, and temporarily glitch out your ship's counter with cosmic radiation from Delta Quadrant Space Anomaly #4,982,716, then fire two torpedoes, the counter goes negative, wraps around, and you wind up with 255 torpedoes.
Glad you cleared that up.
Empty
I hate to be that guy, but some of those torpedoes shouldn't count because they were fired during timelines that got changed, like Year of Hell. Also, I think some of those torpedoes were fired between the two Goo Crew episodes and so may have been fired by the Goo Crew and not by the real Voyager.
I think you'll find there are no alternate timelines included.
As for Goo Crew...
The part at 3:22 where they shoot down Tom's weapon is from the episode where he gets demoted to Ensign, which takes place in between the two goo crew episodes, and he doesn't get promoted until the end of the next season. But in the second goo crew episode, Goo Tom is a lieutenant. So we know that at least this episode and any that follow it where Tom was still an ensign was the real crew.
At 3:08 where Seven reconfigures more torpedoes, her suit has had an upgrade that continues through the season. Except when we see Goo Seven, she's still wearing the gray suit from earlier. So we know this is the real crew too.
That just leaves 2:32 to 3:07, which believe it or not is all one episode, the most torpedoes ever used in a single episode. But this is also where Tom creates Captain Proton, which would later be established as Real Tom's, so this has to be Real Tom too.
TazG2000 is the occurrence of Long-Haired Kes from the one episode where Kes Prime has long hair?
damn, before i read the replies i was going to say that even if as much as 15 of the torpedoes (quite generous) were miscounted that is still nearly twice as many nonexistent torpedoes (torpedoes that shouldn't exist) as real torpedoes. but turns out he did actually did his homework and all of those torpedoes were an accurate count, so great job TazG2000.
Don't forget that Voyager has industrial replicators: that is, replicators used to replicate spare components for the ship itself. It is easy to theorise that they could manufactur photon torpedo casing. The antimatter, lore wise (if Enterprise is to be believed, anyway) comes from the ships actual antimatter housing.
However, I am aware that this is just excusing sloppy writing. It wouldn't have taken much time for them, in an episode, to be like "captain, we need to replicate more torpedos. We are down to 3"
TazG2000 I think you did a good job in trying to decipher the Demon/Goo crew out that was one of the thoughts I had during the video but I'm sorry to say your tally is not accurate you have only listed the ones, used by the crew but we know they lost some too season 4 episode 23 Living Witness the episode right before the demon/goo crew was created there is a Voyager torpedo in the Kyrian Voyager Museum this adds to the total "used" by the show but it also makes me wonder if more are missing
One line could’ve fixed that .... “good thing tuvok was an instructor at the academy and taught a class on how to built torpedos ....”
Just change Chakotay's original line to "no easy way to replace them".
@@stoontechguy Or just remove his line entirely.
Yup. They could have even incorporated it into a bit of storywriting. "Captain's log: we have entered a nebula that makes it easy for enemy ships to sneak up on us because we need to find some (unobtanium) to replenish our supply of photon torpedoes."
@@KneelB4Bacon or they buy some new ones, some weird fucking shit. Maybe salvage them from a borg ship.
"Ensign Samantha Wildman is on the torpedo building team"
Voyager was my favorite Star Trek franchise. That being said, this is still hysterical! I love it when someone points out foibles like these.
"If we armed my ships with your photon torpedoes…"
"I can't authorize that."
"Why not?"
"Because we've already used more than we have."
(Copied from an old comment that doesn't seem to be here anymore. It deserves to live on.)
Indeed, it does deserve to live on
well its questionable how much they spent due to not knowing what exactly in the series was doing of the original voyager and what of the clone voyager
because we technically have negative torpedoes.
*pets a wuffie*
Myke Prior they do have antimatter warhead, so sort of negative 🤣
I just realized that FIRE EVERYTHING voice clip is from Nero from the 2009 movie, which makes it ten times funnier somehow.
FULL SPREAD!
"Fire everything!" Lmfao that's where yah got me.
They replenished them each episode, of course. Using Voyager's prototype Giant Reset Button 4000.
Virini I thought manufacturing was invented loong befor startrek.
You forgot the trademark and copyright.
You mongaloid.
For what it's worth, Voyager did have a bunch of visible hull patches visible from all the times a deck blew up with no casualties. So clearly their ability to fix evverything wasn't unrealistically magical.
I don't care what the canon says - it doesn't make sense to assume Voyager couldn't replenish their supply of torpedoes through SOME means. The idea of having a limited inventory made sense in the pilot and most of season 1, but c'mon. even if they had to build a special replicator or something, they would have needed to improvise. Maybe the later torpedoes were improvised explosives and not true photon torpedoes.
In the end though, firing torpedoes was done to make scripts more exciting and really for no other reason. Trek has far bigger continuity errors than this kind of thing.
Maybe Chakotay just mispoke & he meant a A HUNDRED and thirty eight lol
2:54 nero out of nowhere: FIRE EVERYTHING!!
At the start of the series they were in an area of space where tech was limited compared to Starfleet. It was realistic to say that in the foreseeable future they would have no way of replacing their torpedoes. Resources really were limited and they were relying heavily on trade. If they can eventually get to the point where they can build the Delta Flyer then it is a reasonable assumption that they had also been able to manufacture torpedoes. The resources required to keep an adequate supply constantly regularly may be sparse, but they could gradually replenish them.
But it does point out one of the real flaws of Voyager. The series started out acknowledging their lack of resources but rarely referenced it again and mostly discarded it. Voyager would have been a better series as a whole if they focussed more on that as an ongoing plot point. The fact we can make a video about this issue with torpedoes illustrates this wonderfully because we were never shown how they solved this problem.
I think next time they should just repair the torpedoes instead of buying them from torpedo parts. way cheaper
haha
Simple explanation. They divided their torpedo complement by zero.
The writers were lazy and didn't care. They hated to do "arc" episodes, so everything got reset at the beginning of the next episode, including relationships. It would have been easy to drop in a line about how "we need to find more antimatter to replenish our torpedo supply" but NOPE. That's just too much continuity for them.
Phantom Torpedos, full spread!
Phantom Torpedoes are made of people, didn't you see the Khan reboot? It's Voyager's dead crew. The numbers are consistent.
Should do a montage named, "Janeway says 'crew'."
ack I had to stop at 1:49 because I'm current watching voyager..
It's like a high tech version of John Wayne's gun
He always managed to get 12 shots out of a six shooter
Glad to see Voyager stuck with the classics
I cracked up at 'Fire everything!'.
This was still better than Generations.
"Prepare to fire a full spread of photon torpedoes when their shields drop. And by full spread, I mean ONE torpedo.'
I suspect that the initial comment of "No way to replace them" was based on being isolated and too low on energy to replicate new ones - a situation they solved before the count passed 0.
a situation they solved off-screen, of course
I'm not going to be a nitpicker - I know this video was a joke and it was a good one. 👍
I believe the Borg had a more efficient and mobile way to make more, so Seven modified Voyager so that it could manufacture them and never run out.
The infinite torpedo shenannigans started when Seven joined the crew, so it makes sense.
Could have had a throw away line at the end of Basics that the Kazon had left more torpedoes behind, modified by Seska for use in their launchers.
So in summation... "Fire photon torpedoes!"
+Davish Krail "Full Spread!"
Screw that...FIRE EVERYTHING
Dispersal pattern Sierra!
FULL SPREAD!!
so, in summary, Janeway was trigger happy.
It's best to simply say Chakotay had inaccurate data to begin with. And then they figured out that they actually had 100+ because they where overstocked because of an error at DS9 before going into the Badlands.
or that during their trip through the Delta Quadrant they manage to acquire the components needed to manufacturing facilities and to build more torpedos. We saw in one episode where Voyager was arranging a deal to acquire better weapons.
David Knowles
I would have liked a clip from an episode where we see B'Elanna's quarters converted into a photon torpedo production area. I suspect that was what happened anyway. That's why she was so violent.
It's almost like in the Star Trek universe they have some strange machine that's able to replicate matter out of energy.
isrealjason volatile photon torpedo components are not on the list of things that can be replicated
Yea but...
They come across dozens of other alien races, many of which have the same technologies as the Federation. SURELY some of them had photon torpedoes or something similar enough to be considered photon torpedoes. There are plenty of episodes where they get supplies from other races, including weapons.
@@Masasume1 The writers of Voyager could easily had fitted in a line somewhere where Janeway just casually mentions how lucky they were that they got parts which were easy to modify for spare torpedoes.
@@Nonsensei436 Maybe a slightly smarter than average Ferengi would have been of some use? Apparently there's one that developed a rather successful self replicating mine. Volatile exploding bits included.
9 years later in the middle of a pandemic and this shows up in my feed, weird!
It's because 2020 is the "Year of Hell". Just needs more Red Foreman.
@@freshdoug : He stuck a foot in time's ass.
I read it as "9 years into the pandemic". 2020 has been a hell of a decade
I could be wrong, but I think the torpedo fired when the doctor said, "Watch and learn" was from one of his daydreams.
Marchant2 He did daydream about becoming the ECH (Emergency Command Hologram) in an earlier episode, but later it was actually implemented. They activated the ECH program once because they had to abandon the ship, and the "watch and learn" part happens after they return and he's been in command by himself for some time.
+Marchant2 That's from the episode "Workforce Pt. 2" when he's trying to get the crew back. The Dr refers to a battle where a Romulan captain disables two ships by creating a photonic shockwave between two ships. "How'd he do that?" Kim asks. "Watch and learn," The Dr replies.
+lray801 I'm glad I didn't have to be the one to explain this. It makes me feel like far too much of a knowitall. ;)
By they u mean kim. Kim and the doc fighting for command of a two crew ship. Classy.
Even if it were then it still wouldnt' explain the other 80 odd extra they pulled lol
To me it was rather obvious when Janeway said "no way to replenish them", she was thinking in the short term where normally a starship would restock at a starbase. In long term they no doubt gathered the materials needed to replicate the torpedo housings and technology. Not to mention the several upgrades they did to the replicators and other systems from species they encountered. The is evident in episodes like Scorpion Part 1 when 7 of 9 knows the torpedo compliment "We are borg" when asked how she knew.
Exactly!
it's more fun to think of some torpedo debt collector breaking some legs in an episode which was never made though.
I think it's more like she was thinking in the short term where nobody knew if the series would last a whole season without getting canceled...
blivvy Not at all. First of all from the character's perspective, they were thinking they would need to survive on their own for up to 70 years. Meanwhile this was released at the height of Star Trek's popularity - TNG just ended, DS9 was picking up steam, a new movie series was launching - the writers fully expected to get a full 7 seasons like TNG (which they did) and intended the supply rationing to be a real long-term need. In fact the 38 torpedoes almost did last an entire 4 seasons. It was only in the last few years the writers pretty much abandoned the idea (but without giving an explanation for the change), apparently because ratings were slipping and they thought they needed a more "action" oriented show.
I'm honestly surprised anyone took that comment seriously enough to come up with a sensible reply, but that's awesome :D Thanks!
Despite the way this video is presenting it, this really is less a continuity problem and more the writer's flip-flopping on the intended tone. They easily could have made torpedoes offscreen, and we can assume they did, but the point of the original line is to show that their resources are limited. But as the series go on rarely do things just stop working or run out as a routine thing rather than as a central plot point. It's kinda a shame.
TheEliteGir No, it's the theme of this particular episode where they don't have the resources, especially to replace the torpedoes. But they are not ALWAYS so low on resources.
It's the nature of their journey: They have to stockpile fuel, weapons, supplies, food, energy, etc, as well as do repairs and regular maintenance. Depending on circumstances, some things may get used up or damaged more or less than expected. When something critical starts running low, or it's time for maintenance, they come out of warp, and gather up supplies and all that, and start another stretch. Since they were new to the area, and their situation, they'd likely run low a few times before they know or anticipate what they need to stockpile more of, and what they can safely recycle and/or convert. Unneeded supplies can be recycled back into the energy reserves & base materials, like the replicators do when you put unused portions, plates and stuff back. However, they need energy reserves to use replicators to make parts for constructing weapons, so... It's a juggling act with resources that they had to learn to manage so they didn't run low on anything critical, and the goal is to be able to stay at high warp without running out of anything before the need to do regular maintenance.
Gramps Ford
No, but it only occasionally seems like they have to worry about their resources. All I'm saying is that that would have made the show a ton more interesting if it wasn't just business as usual on Starship Voyager just without being able to Skype command on demand.
That's because the ships are capable of massive amounts of recycling so if something did completely shut down, they are likely almost entirely out of energy. Which happened on many episodes.
It wasn't. They were on food rations the entire series. The whole point of Neelix cooking food was because they couldn't afford to put all their energy supply into food replication. They instead relied on people farming in cargo bays and trading for more food.
Running out of Coffee is way sillier than running out of Torpedoes is.
That bit about having 30-something torpedoes and no way to replace them had always stuck with me. It made me self-conscious each time they used them, and wondering how many they had left. They sold it with that single exchange of dialogue, and if they wanted to drop the limit and opt for "torpedoes go brrr", they could've done so just as easily. Personally, it would've been really satisfying if they said that a room was repurposed for torpedo production. 😌 Perhaps early Season 4, when they upped the budget and frequency of space battles, and it could've been a 7 of 9 thing like the new atrometrics lab.
4:25 We're low on torpedoes, what should we do?
Janeway: Keep firing until you hit something!
So they did find a way of manufacturing photon torpedoes at an average rate of about one per month, but “I need 20 more by tomorrow” remains an impossible request.
Doesn’t sound very implausible to me. It’s just a missed opportunity to make a good episode or two about the struggle of torpedo manufacturing.
They build Shuttles and later the deltaflyer. twice. building a couple of Torpedos is no biggy. the antimatter might be tricky,they never explained where a spaceship gets it from. probably trading of some kind.
@@aikrichter5403 IIRC they can collect it slowly (how fast depends on the nature of the area of space they are in I think?) but they also need it to power their ship so they could only build new ones when they had a power surplus.
On the next episode of How It's Made...
Replicated casings and components + Antimatter + Deuterium = Photon Torpedo. Photon Torpedo Stocks can be replenished albeit slowly.
Clip 1: “with no way to replace them after they’re gone.”
No way to replace them cuz there stranded in the delta quadrant. Of course givin the right material they could make new ones. Its be silly if they couldnt, thou a few line about it would have shut all the haters up
@@pwnerj when she said that, they weren't scavaging and trading at that point.
@@pwnerj She said that because they did not know how long they'd be in the delta quadrsnt
I can't believe the person who uploaded this might actually call themselves a Star Trek fan and not know that ships can with the right resources and time make all manner of replacement parts and munitions, don't forget that over the course of Voyager they built several shuttles while over in the D-quad.