How The Harkonnen Regime Secures Power Through Cruelty | Dune Lore

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  • Опубліковано 9 січ 2025

КОМЕНТАРІ • 106

  • @NerdCookies
    @NerdCookies  5 місяців тому +3

    Thank you for watching this video! If you enjoy my content, please consider supporting me on PATREON: www.patreon.com/nerdcookies

  • @davidlewis8814
    @davidlewis8814 5 місяців тому +67

    I remember thinking that Feyd and Rabban (and in other versions, the Baron as well) casually and randomly killing so many of the people around them would automatically mean that the best and the brightest of a given generation would work very hard to be as far away from power and leadership as possible, leading to a brain drain that would inevitably weaken the family beyond the breaking point.

    • @AldrickExGladius
      @AldrickExGladius 4 місяці тому +6

      Rabban is in like maybe 3 pages of the entire series. And Feyd is not a psycho like the movie portrays him. Neither is the Baron. They don't waste anything, including people.

  • @Jayjay-qe6um
    @Jayjay-qe6um 5 місяців тому +24

    "I make a point. Never obliterate a man unthinkingly, the way an entire fief might do it through some due process of law. Always do it for an overriding purpose - and know your purpose!"
    -- Vladimir Harkonnen to Glossu Rabban

  • @shanenolan5625
    @shanenolan5625 5 місяців тому +69

    I remember in the encyclopedia, when the baron took power he had all his staff, tortured / interrogated under drug influence, too see who was loyal or not , executed all those seenas disloyal,

    • @AnthonyClark177
      @AnthonyClark177 5 місяців тому +1

      Papa Doc Duvalier actually did that.

    • @stanpines9011
      @stanpines9011 5 місяців тому +2

      The more i hear about the baron the more he kinda reminds me of stalin

    • @shanenolan5625
      @shanenolan5625 5 місяців тому

      @@stanpines9011 yes he was like stalin ,

    • @rjramrod
      @rjramrod 5 місяців тому +2

      ⁠Sci-Fi Fans Read An Actual History Book Challenge (Impossible)

    • @shanenolan5625
      @shanenolan5625 5 місяців тому

      @@rjramrod I have read actual history books , like stalin and stalin are not the same thing, a evil dictator, that even family wasn't safe from , that killed vast numbers of people, and of Russian decent, ( OK stalin was from Georgia) not sure why you think Sci fi fans don't read history, you do i do ,
      Most Sci fi / fantasy writers steal their stories from history, like George Martin, his game of thrones books for example

  • @charleslathrop9743
    @charleslathrop9743 5 місяців тому +40

    Drop everything. Nerd Cookies uploaded.

  • @renuvatio9986
    @renuvatio9986 5 місяців тому +20

    Loyalty through Fear or by Financial means isn't true loyalty, It can work in the short term but by those means you make enemies another person can out pay the Harkonnen's and then there's trouble a person ruled over by fear will preach loyalty but would if there's a chance get out of it. Great Video as always a great thing to watch to start a weekend

  • @jamegumb7298
    @jamegumb7298 5 місяців тому +8

    Harkonnen was on the way down well before Paul.
    Bene Gesserit used them for their breeding program and they were kept where they were by the emperor to toil on the desert planet. Once they got too loaded fromn the spice, their one real power, the emperor used them to get rid of the Atreides that grew too well, 2 birds one stone. Harkonnen broke from the endeavour, Atreides wiped.

  • @js70371
    @js70371 5 місяців тому +28

    Omg thank you for the deep dive into Harnonnen lore - no one else does what you do with this show. Your attention to detail is second to none Elaine!! 🙏

    • @js70371
      @js70371 5 місяців тому +2

      *Harkonnen 😂

    • @philmccracken1392
      @philmccracken1392 4 місяці тому

      There are hundreds of channels that do exactly what they do on this show? lol

  • @jaywilliamsphoto
    @jaywilliamsphoto 5 місяців тому +31

    The troubling thought for me is that what you’ve described isn’t to dissimilar from the societies most of us live in. The key difference imo is subtlety. The harkonnen aren’t subtle, the real world is more so.
    I mean, look at the fear and anxiety around the workplace. Putting a foot wrong then finding yourself in poverty. Promises of opportunity (if you work hard) to keep you focused on betterment, then with moderate success it ensures most can’t live without it (addiction).
    Yes, most of us choose our path, but 99% of paths lead to the same outcome. Serving the system.

    • @rjramrod
      @rjramrod 5 місяців тому +2

      Bro you think that's wild, wait till you read Lenin's "Imperialism, the Highest Stage of Capitalism"

    • @andrewmalinowski6673
      @andrewmalinowski6673 4 місяці тому +2

      The way you describe it reminds me of a quote that often comes to mind from Eduoard Kagame; "You say that you are free, you point to your Constitution your Bill of Rights. What rights? You were born into crush debt to parents without hope, and your only right is to work for the corporations until you pay it off. Only that can never happen, because everything you need they provide; your food, your shelter, your water, and it all sends you deeper into the abyss of slavery." From "Continuum" S1E04; "Matter of Time"
      The fact the Harkonnen system isn't dissimilar from both social constructs or the 2070s system of the Corporate Congress from "Continuum" shows just how dangerous that could be

  • @Tommy1977777
    @Tommy1977777 5 місяців тому +25

    Machiavelli Saud something similar. However, it will eventually lead to rebellion as cruelty typically grows within a population and sparks eventual rebellion.

    • @reinereine1896
      @reinereine1896 5 місяців тому

      North Korea talks against you in this matter. Just as Stalins USSR and Maos China does.

  • @danelamoreaux4166
    @danelamoreaux4166 5 місяців тому +5

    New Nerd Cookies video? Instant like. I love the channel/content/host. Another awesome video to you and your team.

  • @pendragon0905
    @pendragon0905 5 місяців тому +5

    House Harkonnen's continued existence is a gift from House Corrino. While the Corrinos stand, the Harkonnens stand, but when the Corrinos fall, the Harkonnens fall. Furthermore, it is not even because the Corrinos even like the Harkonnens; the Harkonnens only continue to exist under the protection of the Imperial Family because the Imperial Family needs the Harkonnens to fight the Atreides, the wisest and most noble Great House in the Imperium.

  • @busterjay64
    @busterjay64 5 місяців тому +3

    As always the quality and quantity of info and interesting points in your videos is impressive. 👍

  • @danbeasley6135
    @danbeasley6135 5 місяців тому +8

    Similar to Imperial Japanese military structure where subordinates are treated with cruel disregard and the ranks above with absolute loyalty...... Yet every soldier loved and admired their god-like Emperor, not too sure about ole' Vlad.

    • @albertocruzado2899
      @albertocruzado2899 5 місяців тому +2

      Well, the book did mentioned that Harkonnen troops had similar traditions regarding the treatment of women. Harkonnen does seem to resemble the japanese military during the 30s and 40s in that regard. Very authoritarian, constantly humilliating and treating with cruelty the lower ranks, which made extremely easy for them to compensate their frustation with someone else, weaker than them (the civilians, the conquered foe), making easier to obey morally questionable orders. You dont even need to order grape and pillaging. They would do it in their own volition.

  • @champisthebunny6003
    @champisthebunny6003 5 місяців тому +10

    One thing that always puzzled me, was why the Harkonnen invested so much in conventional military forces. The structure of the imperium means any military force surplus to that needed to maintain planetary control is simply wasted. Forces for interstellar war is super costly in the dune universe, the 'baron' speaks to this himself when he reveals house harkonens operations on arrakis would cost 80 years of spice profits! So, while a certain level of military force on Geidi Prime would be useful for basic control and keeping potential troublemakers employed in the houses service, the high level of militarization implied does not make economic sense. You dont need a military to terrorize your subjects. secret police, secret agents and the like are more than able to achieve this at much lower cost.

    • @jamegumb7298
      @jamegumb7298 5 місяців тому

      A secret police is subtle and effective. How is House Harkonnen subtle and effective?
      Harkonnen uses brute force, large displays of wealth, opulence and power. They would use armies to oppress. People would rat on others anyway to save their own skin.

    • @albertocruzado2899
      @albertocruzado2899 5 місяців тому +2

      Well, they are filthy rich, and probably the only house in need of an actual big standing army, in comparison with other houses. They have been in Arrakis for half a century, fighting Fremen almost constantly, one must assume. That imply fifthy years of keeping troops going and coming from Giedi Prime and Dune. Entire generations of Harkonnen subjects would have been born, joined the military, have a family, died in Arrakis, and have their son do the same after them. Its even possible that military parades wasnt a thing in Giedi Prime before the Harkonnen being deployed in Arrakis, and were created later, as the military grew in size and importance, and the population had to face the harsh truth that entire generations of men were being conscripted to be send to a desert planet to die. Probably the Baron thought it was a good idea to make them participants in the "glory" of owning Arrakis. Its better if they cheer their boys as they go to war to defend the Baron's interests than to have them being bitter because the Baron just take the son, brother or father of someone to be gutted by some religious crazy chanting "Lisan al Ghaib".

  • @trentsteel4421
    @trentsteel4421 5 місяців тому +11

    I wonder if the baron had “died” prior to Dune. How would the power play play out. Not only in the Imperium in general. But in the harnonnen fiefdom.

    • @TheIslingtongirl
      @TheIslingtongirl 5 місяців тому +1

      Rabban and Feyd's parents were whale fur merchants or something, if I recall. They sounded normal. They lived on some other planet that I used to remember the name of.

    • @trentsteel4421
      @trentsteel4421 5 місяців тому

      @@TheIslingtongirl they were. I think the baron had them knocked off.

  • @jamsiepoolol
    @jamsiepoolol 5 місяців тому +2

    I needed this today, you're seriously the best! I love all of your Dune content! 😊

  • @nikoborz5854
    @nikoborz5854 5 місяців тому +1

    Very Cool Video ❤️❤️❤️🙏🙏🙏 I love the Storys of the Harkonnen. Please make a Video about the Harkonnen Soldiers (House Trooper) and their Warfare, Equipment, Technology, Vehicle, Aircraft, Artillery, Individual equipment, Small arms and light weapons, warrior psychology,
    Symbols and Tradition

  • @bwy553
    @bwy553 5 місяців тому +3

    It would be interesting to do a similar video on atriedies regime

  • @agesflow6815
    @agesflow6815 5 місяців тому +2

    Thank you, Nerd Cookies.

  • @lawrencereid2767
    @lawrencereid2767 5 місяців тому +3

    Love your content

  • @theterminaldave
    @theterminaldave 5 місяців тому +9

    Id be interested to learn more about the "drugs" used in the Dune universe, recreational and otherwise.
    Their effects on the people consuming them, their withdrawal symptoms and dangers, etc.
    Obviously Spice would be discussed, but I'm curious to know about the others mentioned in this video.

    • @TheIslingtongirl
      @TheIslingtongirl 5 місяців тому +3

      There is a key scene in Messiah where semuta is involved and also it goes into what kinda happens when you massive dose spice. Other stuff was likely mentioned in later books, but I don't recall. There's also the Fremen spice orgy which we didn't get to see.

    • @patrickhayden7206
      @patrickhayden7206 5 місяців тому +1

      Semuta and Hypnobongs.

  • @venkelos6996
    @venkelos6996 5 місяців тому +4

    Not necessarily related, but i sometimes wonder who else made up the Lansraad? Even the games have had to make up Houses, because it seems like only Houses Corrino, Atreides, and Harkonnen matter, and with so many workds basically beingvisolated, except for whatvtheir Spice stores can buy them, from the Guild, I don't know what other things said Houses might specialize in, and provide, that makes them valuable to each other, and the Landraad, in general? Honestly, I'm not even sure what House Atreides provides that makes other Houses want to associate with them? Leto's kindness, gallantry, and honesty seem to be things that make him special, meaning most are more like the Harkonnen, at least on the weekends. House Harkonnen controls the Spice, so they matter, qnd yhe Padashah Emperor rules the known universe, so Corrino matters, but who else is there, and how do they provide vaue to the greater Imperium?

  • @heruka369
    @heruka369 5 місяців тому +1

    This was great.

  • @ibnsabeel9466
    @ibnsabeel9466 Місяць тому

    After watching 4 episodes of the HBO series Prophecy, I have come to the conclusion that ruthless ambition driven by sociopathy are in Harkonnen DNA.

  • @OctavioOrtiz-q4f
    @OctavioOrtiz-q4f 5 місяців тому +5

    Can you make a video on the people next to? Rabban when he has made governor of arrkias and they were next to fade Rautha the people with the staff in black cloaks forgive my spelling errors.

    • @sectorgovernor
      @sectorgovernor 5 місяців тому +1

      They were probably officials or commanders

    • @OctavioOrtiz-q4f
      @OctavioOrtiz-q4f 5 місяців тому +2

      @@sectorgovernor or maybe priests

  • @Davepool-hs7vr
    @Davepool-hs7vr 5 місяців тому +1

    Can you do a video on the Corrino regime on Kaitan please?

  • @wxwxsrg
    @wxwxsrg 5 місяців тому +1

    Frank was always extremely prescient.

  • @NguyenQuangLuan802
    @NguyenQuangLuan802 5 місяців тому

    I wish more Dune lore will be explored more, Elaine

  • @jornhesl4707
    @jornhesl4707 5 місяців тому +4

    I think DV realized Dune never would have worked in the real world shortly before he created the "Chani fights back" storyline

  • @Nom_AnorVSJedi
    @Nom_AnorVSJedi 5 місяців тому +2

    Ibn Khaldun said assabiya is what makes a people strong. True loyalty can never be bought by money, drugs or fear. The Harkonnens have no assabiya. Therefore they could never truly be, these Harkonnens and their depravity wouldn’t last a generation.

  • @ToastyMcGrath
    @ToastyMcGrath 5 місяців тому +6

    Honestly, the Harkonnens were the biggest flaw in Herbert's work. He made them just so cartoonishly evil that it reached the point of absurdity, and really broke the immersion of his universe.

  • @IvanToshkov
    @IvanToshkov 5 місяців тому

    It's interesting to compare House Harkonnen and House Atreides. At first glance they look like total opposites. But I think they are quite similar, just using different methods. It's spelled out most clearly when Leto is exhausted and is very cynical about the importance of his propaganda corpus. But you can find it throughout the books (Frank Herbert's books that is) both Leto and Paul are using their charisma to instill admiration and adoration. E.g. when they save the workers from the harvester. It had quite an effect on Liet-Kynes even though he/she's a leader and even though Gurney told him it was a calculated risk.
    I'm not saying they didn't have real friends or were always cynical about it. But they were inside the same system and were playing the same game as the Harkonnens, just in a different way.

  • @mobious6340
    @mobious6340 5 місяців тому +1

    sting was the superior fede..boatloads of attitude..rocking the codpiece like a beast

    • @codename495
      @codename495 5 місяців тому

      Feyd wasn’t like that in the book. He was a ruthless murder twink in the book, but he learned the value of subtlety.

  • @MrAlubenco
    @MrAlubenco 5 місяців тому +3

    Wow, your commentary voice on this subject is vastly different from the one describing the "Acolyte" expose'. 😅Any who, the Harkonnens society is largely based upon the fact that Vvlad committed patricide in order to obtain power, so fear would be the only method keeping subjects from performing a coup.

    • @NerdCookies
      @NerdCookies  5 місяців тому +1

      It's just scripted vs an extemporaneous rant 😁

    • @MrAlubenco
      @MrAlubenco 5 місяців тому

      @@NerdCookies it's all good 👍!

  • @svensulzmann4282
    @svensulzmann4282 5 місяців тому +2

    In reality such systems don’t remain stable for very long because it fosters usurpation as the ultimate form of advancement leading to a crumbling of the whole system

  • @quentincollins1825
    @quentincollins1825 5 місяців тому +1

    Vincent Price as Baron Dmitri Harkonnen. 😈👍

  • @shanenolan5625
    @shanenolan5625 5 місяців тому +1

    Thanks Elaine,

  • @starwraithspacemarine8605
    @starwraithspacemarine8605 5 місяців тому

    I don't suppose you did a video on the levitation tech that the Harkonnen soldiers and Sardaukar used?

    • @NerdCookies
      @NerdCookies  5 місяців тому

      I did one on why the Baron floats that covers suspensor technology. Hope that helps!

  • @marknovak6498
    @marknovak6498 5 місяців тому +5

    The idea of control using addiction was a new concept that was devoted in the world of the 50s and 60s manly in underground organizations.

  • @calvinsuu1949
    @calvinsuu1949 4 місяці тому +1

    After Dune Messiah...the harkonnens were no longer...

  • @brown2889
    @brown2889 5 місяців тому

    I wonder if the Benijezeret create this type of rule all the way back?

  • @liamcore7203
    @liamcore7203 5 місяців тому +9

    Its like Herbert studied the soviet method in penning the Harkonnen. Stalin rounded up his dissidents and put them to work on a road. The "road of bones". Many documentaries on this. He killed over 20 million of his own citizens that might be a threat. Threw their bodies into the composition of the road as they built it through Siberia(like any muscovy effort, its a shambles now). Many memorials along its entire route still stand. The famous muscovy WWII general Zhukov once laughed as he described how he would send muscovy peasants charging right through German minefields in WWII while muscovy "barrier" troops were right behind them shooting into their backs to spur them on. Terror is the muscovy and Harkonnen, primary weapon. When you see muscovy "citizens" today, questioned on the streets of moscow, they will always quickly and carefully state "I am not poliitcal" as a reason for their lack of concern in the muscovite invasion of Ukraine. These "people" are Harkonnen. Yes, the muscovy parasites have done this for one thousand years and it's happening now with nobody to advocate for them. An incredible study on complete and absolute subjugation.

    • @weekendfisher
      @weekendfisher 18 днів тому

      What a LIE this is!!! Equal to how BIG LIER you are!!! Muscovy,🤣😅😂!!! You must be hohol or "usrani Poljak"!!! Stop spreading lies!!! Read real history moron, not written by westerners!!!

  • @kimsoares3271
    @kimsoares3271 5 місяців тому

    Härkönen perkele!

  • @jonber9411
    @jonber9411 4 місяці тому

    The constant throat slashing in the movies made their brutality a caricature though

  • @Omar_listenin
    @Omar_listenin 5 місяців тому

    capricious, great GRE word

  • @lsporter88
    @lsporter88 5 місяців тому +1

    I find your analysis and characterization of House Harkonnen both accurate and thorough. I also think that sadly, they are the most relatable House as far as what we have been experiencing here on Earth for the past Thousand or so years (with bright spots here and there).
    Rome near its end was probably a good Earthly example of how House Harkonnen did things (and you see what happened to Rome, as well as to House Harkonnen). Now contrast that with Ancient Egypt and it's protégé Greece. Their combined eras lasted much longer ( at least 5 times that of Rome) and with far fewer problems overall.
    One culture gave us the Pyramids, Medicine, Democracy etc., and the other the Gladiatorial Games of The Coliseum. So ultimately, the Governing style of House Harkonnen is lacking in overall power and longevity.
    Great video.

  • @tompearce5418
    @tompearce5418 5 місяців тому

    The Imperium in a nutshell.

  • @AncientRylanor69
    @AncientRylanor69 5 місяців тому +1

    😅☺

  • @Operator214PMCVTUBER
    @Operator214PMCVTUBER 5 місяців тому

    so its basically north korea of frank herberts universe 🤔🤔🤔

  • @erineddy7999
    @erineddy7999 Місяць тому

    Just a thought, educated people will try to find an escape, will use their intelligence to free themselves. Uneducated people either give up or live in ignorance. IMO. Video enjoyed!

  • @Thomasdutheildecholet
    @Thomasdutheildecholet 5 місяців тому +2

    I like how enforcing drug addictions is such a parallel with our own governments who always let some level of drugs circulate in our countries (unlike Singapore for example)

  • @jbtechcon7434
    @jbtechcon7434 5 місяців тому +5

    And all of this fascinating material was left out of the movie so that DV could focus on his tedious sermon about "religion is bad! religion is bad!"

    • @dennisduncan7561
      @dennisduncan7561 5 місяців тому +3

      Do you know how much longer the movies would've been if he had tried to include all these extra details? he probably would've needed a tv series. Dune is a very dense book and not everything can fit even in two films. Also DV never said religion was bad, the message of the book and the films is not to surrendering our thinking to charasmatic leaders. Don't be dense.

  • @user-zp8kj2cl9g
    @user-zp8kj2cl9g 5 місяців тому

    "How can a cruel and violent way of government attain long term stability?" I mean, haven't you read the history of ancient civilizations, like at all?

  • @sgt.grinch3299
    @sgt.grinch3299 5 місяців тому

    Nobody explains Dune better than you Elaine. Denis needs to hire you to regain the Lore.

  • @davidpalmer4184
    @davidpalmer4184 5 місяців тому +1

    Is it just me or does the Baron sound like an incredibly intelligent Donald Trump??

    • @nurgle333
      @nurgle333 5 місяців тому +1

      Just you

    • @codename495
      @codename495 5 місяців тому

      Just you. Trump has his shortcomings but he is far short of a murderous child predator.

    • @DesperadoRecordsIntl
      @DesperadoRecordsIntl 4 місяці тому

      Exactly but all of his brain dead/brain washed proponents will never see it that way.

  • @codename495
    @codename495 5 місяців тому +1

    North Korea. This sounds like North Korea.

  • @july9566
    @july9566 5 місяців тому

    Realistically this house wouldnt last long .

  • @Dcypher169
    @Dcypher169 4 місяці тому

    I don't think "faufreluches" is pronounced that way. Looks like it is based on a latin/french word.

  • @Draconisrex1
    @Draconisrex1 5 місяців тому +6

    Stalin and Mao did.

  • @gmfreeman4211
    @gmfreeman4211 5 місяців тому

    Sounds like the government.

  • @christiandesuede6770
    @christiandesuede6770 5 місяців тому +3

    Harkonnen is like a predecessor for 40k.. cruel, cunning and powerhungry. High lords, strange creatures and disfigured slaves living one day at the time... or hour maybe even.

    • @codename495
      @codename495 5 місяців тому +1

      40k took heavy inspiration from Dune

  • @neondemon5137
    @neondemon5137 5 місяців тому +7

    Russia exists, so I guess it's plausible.

  • @marcusmoonstein242
    @marcusmoonstein242 5 місяців тому +1

    The Harkonnens' have the same weaknesses that any totalitarian and class-stratified regime would have. High levels of central planning will always lead to a massively inefficient economy, and a lack of class mobility will disincentivize individual innovation and capital accumulation. Just look at Russia under Stalin, China under Mao or North Korea under Kim to see where this kind of society inevitably ends up. House Harkonnen would have collapsed by itself even without a major war.

    • @rjramrod
      @rjramrod 5 місяців тому +1

      My brother in Christ, you are literally just listing countries that were dealing with the crippling effects of being targeted for regime change by the crushing boot of Western imperialism

    • @marcusmoonstein242
      @marcusmoonstein242 5 місяців тому +2

      @@rjramrod Thank you! I had a bet with myself that somebody would claim that all the problems these socialist countries experienced were really caused by capitalist countries refusing trade with them. It's almost as if you're claiming that socialist countries need to be able to trade with capitalist countries or face collapse.

    • @rjramrod
      @rjramrod 5 місяців тому +1

      @@marcusmoonstein242 No all I'm doing is pointing out that historically capitalist nations like the U.S. have done & continue to do horrifically brutal things to eliminate literally any threat to their global dominance, including assassinations, regime change efforts, boots-on-the-ground invasions, monstrous embargoes & sanctions meant to starve civilian populations & occasionally even just straight up massacring countless innocent people for having the audacity to want to govern themselves
      But you go ahead & cope all you want

  • @ericthompson3982
    @ericthompson3982 4 місяці тому

    "Ruthless efficiency." Don't forget his almost fanatical devotion to the pope.

  • @CameronHuff
    @CameronHuff 5 місяців тому

    Gedi Prime sounds like a conservative paradise.

    • @ikept_the_jethryk2421
      @ikept_the_jethryk2421 4 місяці тому

      You figured it out! That's why places run by conservatives are all authoritarian urban hellholes, and places run by Democrats are all pleasant rural communities