No clue if 7 backcountry will succeed, but I’m certain glad it’s out there. We need creative stuff like this to push the industry forward even if it sucks at first. We should give technologies like this time too. So many of today’s gun influencers would’ve likely wanted to dump the M16 during its initial troubles. Will your old rem mag/win mag/30-06 etc work damn well? Yes, heck I own a rem mag and am certainly not going to swap it out. But we should still support stuff like this. Plus it’s cooler
Pretty sure its not. Too niche and for hunting there's no real point. Horny already innovated in the right direction with the PRC, the odds that people will want to go out and buy a whole other caliber is slim.
@@MissouriBoatRide420 Cody - We know nothing about how it will group or what bullets will work with 80,000 psi ! I don’t understand why people want to jump on the switch to anything new Bandwagon ! You do remember all the ( hype ) about the 6.5 needsmore don’t you ! So buy one and then wine about how expensive the ( new ) special alloy steel ammo is that’s if you can get any !…… New doesn’t always mean better it’s just different………
"The peasants may be conned by every pitchman that introduces a new super magnum, but the members of the cognoscenti stick with classic calibers." - Jack O'Connor.
@eduardoolaechea re: "No match for his .270 winchester loads inside 600 yards". You need to put into perspective that the his "classic calibers" remark was from 1967 and that he still considered 600 yard shots with this 270 and its 130grain, flat based bullets nearly impossible. Look at Federal Blue box for contemporary loads.* O'connor died in the 1970's, decades before laser rangefinders would make estimating range for long shots relatively easy. That's why he was a big proponent of point-blank-range shooting, ie, 250 - 300 yards. He considered 500 yards to be a very long shot. At the time of the quote, the "super magnum" cartridges included things like the relatively new 300 Win Mag, still using low-BC, relatively light bullets. In the 1960's and 1970's, 30 cal (and under) magnums were mainly used to increase the MPBR by tens of yards at the disadvantage of high recoil and short barrel life. *at 600 yards, a 50-yard range estimation causes over 16" change in drop - you can run the numbers yourself, if you want.
This is probably the reason why it is marketed specifically towards hunters who wants a short barrel with a suppressor. The name itself and the Peak alloy logo is directed straight at hunters as opposed to Hornady's approach to focus on precision first. We'll see soon enough but I think brass is so much easier to work with anyway.
I would like to ask a question and if you want for you to answer it. Do you think federal dropped the ball on this new alloy case by not releasing it in legacy cartridges like 308, 30-06, 7mm08 and so on? I understand that it would have to have the "not for use in all rifles" lawyer writing like 45-70 does but a 80000psi 7mm08 giving 7prc performance that also allows you to load sweet and mild brass sounds amazing to me.
There’s nothing saying they can’t still release new cartridges in that material. Plus 280 is still one I would for sure consider a legacy cartridge and that is what the 7BC is based on
@carlpreston1680 that was kinda my point I don't think we need new cartridges. The real achievement here for me is that case. Federal can make any case using this alloy so why not just do that. 80000psi 308 gets you right at 300wm. I just think Federal missed the mark on this one.
@@Paul-q3m7k oh why you think that? In 3 to 5 years we're see if anybody is still talking about that 7mm backcountry....I don't think it's going to work out.... LMFAO 😂
@rockie307 Interesting ? I would love to see your data ? Even if I go on Nosler load data. Most of the 30-06 bullets are more or less 100fps slower and .284 has better bc when you compare the same weight.
From what I heard, early releases of ammunition from Federal to the guntubers for testing was all over the place, large SD's and bad groups. More than one of them said that the SD's tightened up and accuracy got a lot better as Federal perfected the load. Backfire was showing great SD's and even though he did not show the groups, he said they were really good. Still waiting for him to release his second, more in-depth review of the cartridge and Horizon rifle.
ALLEGEDLY guns and ammo did review, and the SD on the fusion tipped was 8.8 and a group avg. Of .49.. and LRx has an avg group of .32.. Now.. this was done with a Gunwerks $7000 Clymer rifle.. but im wondered how did they get the low SD while Allterra was all over the place.. Holding out for the 338 Version.
I’m not anti Hornady but I think it’s the future of firearms . For me to burn out a barrel it would take about 10 years with the amount I shoot my hunting rifles . I do most of my practice with my 6.5 cm and 22lr . For most hunters I don’t think burning out a barrel in 1500 shots or so is an issue. You didn’t mention that here but did in another video . You call it not accurate due to one rifle you’ve seen not shoot it well. Ron spomer and backcountry both shot that ammo very well . Not really fair to judge accuracy off of that one rifle . Also , federal is working with one of the big reloading companies to designs presses that can reload it like brass . I think in time we will see this technology take over the market . The hunting market at least.
They built 4 test rifles with different barrel lengths and all the same result. If a small batch precision company isn’t getting it why would the savage that 95% of us would buy do better. It could happen but alterra makes damn good rifles. It it was Christianson I would agree with you😂
What I heard is that some of the first loads that Federal was handing out had accuracy issues and they weren't the final loads. They sent out a second batch and from what I hear they fixed the accuracy issues and its shooting pretty good.
I could see it being a pretty cool cartridge for a lightweight mountain rifle and suppressor. I’m more interested in the 338 rpm for that, 18” backcountry 6 lug mark v, 5 1/2 lbs and still like 3500+ ft lbs at the muzzle, easier to reload, etc. But even then my 24” mark v 30-06 and 6.5 rpm aren’t that long/heavy suppressed and can do about anything in that 7mm ballpark for medium-long range hunting. The 6.5 rpm is close to 7mm mag numbers and the 30-06 is what it is, still great.
This should be good. I'm hearing and reading the same intel about inaccuracy. At the end of the day, what difference does any cartridge make in any particular rifle if the accuracy doesn't make us say WOW? I love new stuff. I'm open to innovation. I think the 7mm Backcountry concept is great. Many of us have our criteria that must be met when it comes to our ammunition and rifles. Jim at Backfire says, "if it doesn't feed, it doesn't hunt." If I have a rifle, for example, that I had built with my chosen components, and it doesn't shoot to my satisfaction, and quickly, I MAY consider the time and effort to rebarrel it so long as the barrel maker replaces it at no cost to me (which I've never had to do so far) - but that rifle will be parting ways with this household if it doesn't shoot half MOA or better with little effort. Same for a factory rifle. I'll extend every consideration to any new rifle with a variety of factory ammo first, then handloads. Crappy groups equals new home - not staying here. The point is, if we end up shackled to factory ammo in a 7mm Backcountry and it's mediocre at best, I'll stick with what I have and continue to carry that extra 8 inches of barrel around. I've somehow been able to manage those excessively heavy rifles (9 pounds) in British Columbia, Alberta, New Brunswick, Ontario, Maine, Colorado, Wyoming, Texas, Alabama, South Dakota, South Carolina - since 1985. Not sure how I managed all those miles without a 16 inch barrel and suppressor. I say give it time, let Federal and the rifle makers iron out glitches. The 7mm Backcountry (and likely the 6.5, 6mm, 30 cal coming) may turn out to be outstanding. The handloading part is what is most important to me. Time will tell if we can and how much more it will cost to do so
@ agreed!! managing case fill, burn, and pressure are critical to consistency IMO…… you can do everything perfect and those factors can cause random results… a 93%-103% case fill is important - the sweet spot somewhere in the middle… a trip to some of the databases that list fill… the big N brand being one, most of the best combos aren’t at the top velocities… and fill.
@@BeaterJeepNothing is a guarantee is all i can say. My Sharps shoots awesome with black powder loads, so maybe we need to go back to that. The rules that apply for a brass case are completely useless for a different case material.
Modern magnum cartridges will be around for a very long time and might well remain preferred for those who want long range accuracy and don't mind the longer barrels. However, I do see that high-pressure cartridges like the 7mm Backcountry and 277 SIG Fury have significant advantages in two areas: Shorter barrels and "dual identity" use. A smaller volume of propellant burning faster to reach higher chamber pressures does more work in the first few inches of the bullet's travel in the barrel. There are hunters who want a shorter barrel for suppressor use or want a rifle to be more handy in the woods. Ironically, Hornady's CEO, Steve Hornady was an early proponent of shorter barrels and there still are commercials on YT from 2009 with him touting the RCM cartridges from compact rifles. In an interview from a couple of years ago, he reiterated that he still considered the 338 RCM in a 20" barrel the best single overall cartridge for North American game. By "dual identity", I mean that with lower pressure and less expensive brass-cased loads it can also compete with traditional deer rifles in the 280 Rem/7mm-08 class. In large areas of the country, those less expensive (and easy-to-reload) lower pressure ammo may will be most popular option*. I suspect that a brass-cased 280 Backountry could also provide typical 7mm-08 performance but in a suppressed or "woods rifle" with a 16-18" barrel. Yes, it is also possible to download a traditional magnum, but I have not heard of it being done very often. • I live in an area where many hunters have never taken a shot over 200 yards, but shoot a 7mm Mag. They can only afford one good rifle/scope combo and dream of a trip "Out West" where they might need the extra power and range provided by a magnum cartridge.
I've never even heard of the 338 RCM and had to look it up. Ballistically it looks like what I've been after, but I'm guessing finding rifles chambered in it is nearly impossible... My search for .338fed or .358win continues, though maybe I'll poke around to see if there are any .338RCM's on the used market. Ruger comes out with some cool cartridges but none of them ever really take hold. .204 is probably their most adopted as you can still find factory ammo for it. My poor .480ruger doesn't seem to have factory support anymore. Last time I saw a box on the shelf it was like $90 for 20rd, lol. Shame too, as its quite manageable while giving similar terminal performance as the ultra mags that most can't shoot accurately. But it was lost in the .460/.500Smith craze, that sold a lot of X-frames who would shortly return to the store... Turns out the general shooting public isn't a fan of firing artillery in a handgun, lol. Got my 460v for a steal though, so I can't be too salty. I got WAY off topic...
@@mfallen2023 The RCMs (Ruger Compact Magnums) were developed by Hornady on shortened 375 Ruger cases. They are also related to the PRCs. The 6.5 PRC uses a necked down 338 RCM case. It has roughly the same powder capacity as the 30-06, but Hornady's factory ammo used the custom propellants that would later go into Superformance ammo. This made it virtually impossible to reload to factory performance. Hornady just made another batch of the ammo, but it is otherwise rare.
Excellent perspective. Accuracy, consistency and ease of use including reloading beats pure speed. Even though speed kills and helps. You already know that I want a left handed 7mm with a threaded barrel to go in between my old classic LH 270 Win that is unthreaded and my right handed 300 WSM that has a muzzle brake. Probably stick with either the 7 PRC, 280 AI or 7 Rem Mag.
Well we agree on one thing. It looks like powders in the burn rate necessary to hit 80k psi in this case do not include very temp stable consistent options.
It’s comparing apples to oranges. One can push 65k psi and more if you lean on it. The other is 80k psi and higher if you lean on it. You can’t compare them. It’s like racing a Dodge Hellcat against an alcohol fueled funny car. They aren’t the same
We talked before. I hung out with my brother recently, he is a pro for Buckventures and a cameraman for The Woodsman TV, also a regional director for the National wildlife Turkey Federation. He gets invites to all the big insider hunting/shooting events. He knew about the cartridge before any of us did from one of his friends. From what he was told, that 170 grain TA load is a problem across the board. . But, the Fusion tipped and the Barnes loads and the 155 TA loads have been getting great accuracy. He is a 7prc guy, and is forced to buy factory ammo because of his schedule and always being gone. He said his 7 prc isn’t shooting as accurately as it used too. Probably because Reloader 26 is unicorn dust for the foreseeable future. He is making the switch as soon as Bergara or CVA chamber the round, those are his sponsors so he cant shoot any other rifle. So maybe, the 7 BC is more accurate than 7prc 🤷🏻 he also said he hasnt heard anything about it taking 12 passes to reload the ammo.
@@ReloadingWeatherbyi think there is room for both. I bet less than a 1000 people in all of the usa can take a 800 yard shot at a 6” target in a real hunting scenario with wind and connect with a cold bore. That’s extremely hard. Precision long range hunting is unethical for most people (myself included)
I'm surprised Hornady doesn't use a blended powder for the seven PRC a lot of manufacturers do that even them I've pulled lever evolution rounds and it wasn't the same powder sold on the shelf .
@@carlpreston1680 Yeah I don’t know. They still advertise it at 3000 fps, and for you to grab a box of eldx or match and go long range shooting. Neither are true. To get the SD you need for precision long range, you have to hand load. I have no idea if the 7BC will ever be able to do that, even handloaded. Hopefully new powders come out that can get the SD’s low enough too. Even then, i can count on 1 finger the people i know that can take a 800 yard shot and hit a deer first try in the vitals. Even he wouldnt take it unless every condition is perfect. This whole LR precision thing is a selling point, thats it, not something 99.999% of people have any business doing.
I watched the AllTerra video when it first came out last week and enjoyed their review. (I also own an AllTerra rifle so know what they are capable of). After that video, I'll stick with my 7 PRC.
Honestly cartridge development has got stagnant. Im glad someone is stepping up to put some pressure on hornady. As a hunter 7mm back country fits the bill. Ive seen allterras video and just about every video on 7mm back country i can find. Horizon, seekins, and even savage have said they have found accuracy to be good in testing. I think this is one of those no one has any info untill it gets in our hands to test for ourselves. I Plan on getting a seekins element or horizon to see for myself when ammo is availble. A 16 inch rifle in the mountains i think would be perfect. I do agree the 7mm prc is a great hunting round and an even better target round. Its just a 16 inch rifle is perfect to use with a suppressor. Im not sold on 7mm backcountry yet but im impressed so far. I think in 10 years the alloy cases will be king. Brass is maxed out unless you add barrel length to give you more speed. As a hunter who uses suppressors i want to go shorter not longer. But honestly its all speculation until the ammo is getting cranked out and people start testing it out across the country. Rcbs is supposed to be almost finished with the dies for it. Actually excites me to play around with something new that no one knows any info on. Its like new territory for reloaders as well as hunters. It isnt gonna replace 7mm rem mag or 7prc. But it might just make a better package for how i want to hunt. I figure you will pick one up to test so im gonna keep up with your results to see if they match what i see out of whichever rifle i decide on getting.
The largest advantage is for those that use 6-8 inch suppressors and want the higher performance normally lost on shorter length barrels...so a guy could rock a 16 inch barrel with a 6-8 inch suppressor and still be under 24 inches total length on barrel and around that 40 inch mark for rifle...... If dont run suppressor or dont care about the length as dont backpack in thick brush and such.....then not much of an increase. Great idea.....and will revolutionize the industry but think will be more for people wanting to take 270, 308, 264, 280 cartridges and load in the steel alloy case to increase pressures and turn old tried and true rounds into magnums in performance. That is the true gift.... My 30-06 or 280 AI or 7mm-08 getting extra 200-300 fps without any needed modifications. ;)
I hate it when you talk logically. And make sense. Its hard for me to disagree. Dare I say it take the wind out of my sails on the " troll ship" I captain from time to time. Appreciate the research and short vid. Keep up the good work. Look forward to your vids. Smashed the like button
It’s fascinating to me how the cartridges that are launched to focus on the hunting market very often flop. And the cartridges that are focused more on target shooting often find a place and stick around. I think it’s because we handloaders don’t care about box velocity, we care about what our data shows. I sold a couple kegs of RL26 last year because the market was stupid and I the proceeds funded a nice Foundation/TL3/Bartlein build. The Backcountry ammo will be super expensive and yet not precise. And with those pressures and this much overbore, the barrel life will be well under 1000rds. If a person wants a bit more than the 7 PRC, there’s always the 28 Nosler. The PRCs are excellent cartridges because they are BALANCED. In all of the PRCs, Hornady didn’t just try to make the fastest biggest or baddest. They could have just necked down the 300prc to make the 7mm, but they didn’t. Why not? Because it wasn’t balanced anymore. Nothing is dumber to me than the “controversy” of the 7 PRC missing 150fps with non RL26 powder. The entire point of these cartridges is letting the BC do the work so you don’t have to launch them at stupid speeds. I’ve shot a good bit of RL26 and it’s famous for a reason, but it’s also giving up some accuracy potential IME relative to the Bofors RL powders (RL26 and RL17 are made by Swiss Nitrochemie and are the only non-Bofors powders in the RL line).
Wonder if Federal had the foresight to consider making these new high pressure cases - steel alloy - in cartridges already in existence. Of course we'd still be relying on factory ammo accuracy but imagine if they said, "here ya go, try our new 7PRC, 7RemMag, 300PRC, 300WM, 6.5PRC, 300WSM terminal ascent ammo with our new steel alloy case at 80,000" hmmmmmm. May be in the works?
@@Accuracy1st it would make them the only place to buy cases from if they did this, I’m sure it’s only a question of scaling up production to meet that level of demand for already existing cases, and probably an eventual lawsuit for a monopoly if no one else makes a comparable alloy case.
Great video! I like the way you compared them. Also I’m wondering not only trying to get the proper powder what about the steel cases? Are they readily available and affordable??
You make a good point. If it isn't 1/2 minute accurate then it isn't much good at long range. For a 400 yard and in gun, existing cartridges can hit 2700 fps out of a 16" barrel which provide plenty of power for Elk sized game to 400 yards. You don't need the extra power unless you are shooting long range, you can't shoot game at long range without excellent accuracy. If your choices of ammo is limited to a handful of offerings from Federal then the chances of high accuracy are much lower than if you have a lot of ammo choices and can handload to find ammo that your individual rifle shoots well. My new years resolution, use a 300 WSM for every game animal and quit worrying about the latest and greatest.
I personally don't think people should long range hunt. But if you do... you better know your equipment and have a great load at distance. Not every half MOA load is good at distance.
Not a reloader. I'll pick one up this year. Most likely a Seekins ph3 if i can get my hands on one. Quick change barrel and bolt head so if the round dies i can always change easily down the road. It's going to make one hell of a hunting round. A lot of people mention or focus on how it extends your hunting distance. I dont plan on shooting anything at 800yds, but having that higher/extra energy at 3-400 yds without any extra recoil is a nice bonus for me.
I agree with you. If you keep your shots within 450 you will be fine. And if you aren’t shooting steel every weekend. Just using it for hunting. Then buy factory ammunition and enjoy it. Seekens makes very good rifles. Cheers
Reread the marketing it doesn’t say less recoil. It says “perceived felt recoil” which means nothing you don’t get 500ftlbs of energy without feeling it. It’s about how a rifle is set up. You can make anything shoot as tame as you want. It will not mean it has less recoil. Comes down to weight and muzzle device. 7 prc vs 7bc same weight and no muzzle device your gonna feel the difference.
@@GarrettRowland-ic1uoit has less powder charge so it has less recoil. You gain the extra ftlbs of energy downrange from the higher pressure and subsequent higher velocities. That's what makes it a step forward. The case technology allowing higher pressures.
@@daltonv5206 powder charge means nothing not all powders are the same. Your comparing gasoline to diesel it’s not the same. I know you don’t reload but powders are way different between calibers you cannot just go off of weight. Faster burning powder like this has a quicker recoil impulse and way more energy. You’re almost getting 28 nosler energy and speed why would it be any different? But the 28 nosler wouldn’t be able to handle the powder charge that is in the 7 bc. But go ahead and fall for all the marketing bs behind this cartridge. I do think it was a cool idea but is not gonna pan out. Federal cannot keep any terminal accent ammo in stock or even make the bullets just to sell for reloaders and you think you’ll be able to get ammo for this when all the bandwagon jumps on?
You are 100%correct. The 7-PRC was designed for good ballistics and efficiently. Altera did a fanomanal job with their review on the 7mm BC . The other problem they revealed was that the primers on the 7- BC would pop out with the factory ammo. In my opinion, that's over pressure, but that's my opinion . 1 good question is how would you determine pressure signs with steel ? With Steel case ammo, all shooter's and reloaders know it's bad news for your chambers, and as far as I know their's not any equment or components for reloading steel . For instance, how would you resize the neck/sholder junction without extreme heat to resize steel case's . If all their trying to do is increase pressure that a case can handle, like 80,000 PSI, why wouldn't they just use a stronger brass ? If i am not mistaken, there are 6 different types of brass, and 2 of them can handle pressure over 80,000 PSI, and one of them can handle pressures of 88,000 PSI😮. We need to stay with a material so we can still detect high pressure without having a catastrophique failure that would cause major injuries to the shooter and surrounding bystanders . We would also have to have a major upgrade to our rifles and components to handle an extra 20,000+PSI . It's like trying to walk before you crawl. Personally, I think we need to build a good rifle to handle high-pressure cartridges. What we currently have today will handle it for a short time, but eventually, it will fail because rifles today are built to handle 65,000-70,000-P.S.I maximum . So I hope they have considered that with the new 7mmBC rifles before someone gets hurt . I didn't hear Altera say anything about an upgrade on the chamber or receiver of the rifle materials . They could have done what SIG did and built a rifle around their new cartridge 277-Fury .Great vedio, my friend. Keep it coming . It's always a pleasure to watch your videos. Thank you . God bless you and your family.God bless america 🇺🇸 🇨🇱🇺🇲 🇨🇱 🇺🇲🇨🇱🇺🇲🇨🇱.
Supresspors safe @ 80,000 psi? I've only seen one video using a Supresspor. I've heard no mention as to Supresspor pressure ratings! I would guess it's going to be awhile b4 available for the masses. Time to work the gremlins out.
Yep, still waiting for someone to do a suppressor explanation on this. I think, even though it's 80,000 in the chamber, it won't be much, if any, more than a normal cartridge produces at the muzzle. A fast burning powder does not necessarily produce more gasses than a slower powder, it just burns faster, giving that initial spike of pressure in the chamber. I think a fast burning powder could even reduce pressure at the muzzle as the powder will have completely consumed it's self before it gets to the end of the muzzle.
@@biggs8729 It would be a combination of pressure AND volume the suppressor has to withstand. The short barrels on conventional/magnum loads likely have lower overall pressures than 24-26 inchers, but the 80k is not going to reduce much as it was designed for the short barrel. It will be interesting to see which suppressor mfgs certify their products for this.
Entirely dependent on suppressor construction. It’d have to be pretty robust (TBAC said my 6.5 Ultra-9 can handle 6.5-300 Wby, but that’s out of a 24 inch barrel and those MAPs are only about 65k psi), which kinda defeats the short barrel/light weight idea behind the round.
First I have no horse in this race. I don't own either cartridge nor do I intend to. But I really think you missed the mark, pun intended. From what I've seen I haven't seen Federal claim this is a precision round nor is it part of the cartridge name. The 7 PRC in the accuracy department does what it claims. In the speed department it is nothing more than snake oil as you pointed out and for Hornady not to change their information is nothing short of lying. The 7 Backcountry didn't claim precision and therefore didn't fall short on their claim. It did however claim velocity from a much shorter barrel and it delivered in spades. I would personally be more inclined to accept the short coming in precision accuracy and know what I have rather than buy something that will never deliver unless you handload for it. Watch Hornady's videos or the people paid to hype them and you hear a consistent phrase "this is an off the shelf answer to a custom gun" but it cannot deliver what they promised.
The 7mm Backcountry reminds me of Sig's 277 Fury cartridge. The military wanted to utilize short barrel (10 -12 inch) suppressed M4 rifles for CQB fighting. So, Sig created the 277 Fury which uses a hybrid steel base and brass for higher pressures. Federal is targeting the hunter that use a suppressor. Not sure how large that market is, which likely dictate the profitability of the Backcountry line. I am with you. I will stay with the traditional brass cartridges for factory and hand load ammunition.
I hunt with a suppressor, I only know one other person that does and dozens that don't. I think if you spend your time online and at gun enthusiast conventions you can mistakenly draw the conclusion that far more people are using suppressors than actually are.
I have one question, in ten or twenty years I know I’ll be able to walk into most outdoor stores and find 7mm mag ammo. Can I say the same for all these new seven’s????
@ I hope they succeed, I really like the 7prc but it makes me a little apprehensive. I hunt with a 7mm mag but the ackley is a better cartridge, I’m also a fan of the 280 rem but always passed on them because I’m not a hand loader.
If u had to resize that brass. That many times for 1 use. How many times can u reload the brass? Or just neck sizing the brass? I bet the die's will be costly. I will stick with my 280AI and 7mm mag 1@8 26-inch barrels.
i dunno man i’m not a reloader and only an occasional recreational hunter but i watched the Spomer/Benedict video on it yesterday and it was pretty good. And Benedict had his 11 year old daughter take a bear with it already. Eleven! So jealous, I never shot no stinkin’ bear😅 Anyways as an outsider and recreational shooter I think I am still able to understand your points. Nevertheless, I speculate also that Federal marketing department maybe knows that a lotta people type a lot of things about their shooting abilities online but that most shooters do not enter precision shooting competitions on the regular and usually shoot their animal within 400 yards. And if it does what it says on the box then like u said, they gonna be taking some of the market on that vs Hornady. Anyways I admit i am totally speculating. Not even gonna buy one. Cuz i gotta stay in my lane of budget hunter until i save up more or get promoted or make some killer trades😅
It's the casing material that gives it a slight advantage in ballistics, but not in reloading..... Give the 7prc or even the old 7rem mag a steel casing and im sure they can throw numbers similar.
Accuracy issues could be a number of things. Is it the high pressures? Maybe, but there are other tweaks made to the cartridge that could improve the accuracy. Also, at what distance does accuracy become a problem. I guess it would be the MOA mark. We have to remember that the PRC is built with competition shooting in mind. Federals 7mm backcountry is a hunting designed cartridge. So, how accurate do you need it to be effective?
I'm going to hold off of both and see what transpires, yes the 7mm bullet is the sweet spot for hunting and long range with a good amount of bullet options out there. I would rather build a 7mm wsm over these two.
Hate to break your bubble but your wrong on most counts. Accuracy is more a function of the bullet and rifle than cartridge. Also I have seen .23" group with the 7 BC with the 175gr. .37 with the 155. Also federal says they will sell the powder at some point. Plus you don't have any understanding of effects of pressure on ES. One guy got ES of 13 with early 168gr federal load.
I completely agree with you. There is nothing technically special or new about this design. It’s just a reinvention of the same wheel. Just added psi that isn’t good for anything.
Still waiting for someone to do a suppressor explanation on this. No one has explained if it is even safe to run this cartridge in a short barrel thru a suppressor. I think, even though it's 80,000 in the chamber, it won't be much, if any, more than a normal cartridge produces at the muzzle. A fast burning powder does not necessarily produce more gasses than a slower powder, it just burns faster, giving that initial spike of pressure in the chamber. I think a fast burning powder could even reduce pressure at the muzzle as the powder will have completely consumed it's self before it gets to the end of the muzzle. Slow powders burn all the way down the barrel and in short barrels, are still burning when they leave the muzzle, producing the large fireball. We need a reloading physics guy to weigh in on this.
Great comparison. Thanks. My main concern with Federal and Remington ammo is their sale to Czechoslovak Group. This sales should never been allowed to happen.
@ CSG is a foreign holding company with a questionable history. Their primary interests rest in their country not ours. They now own Federal, Speer, CCI, and Remington. It seems like a bad idea that may never be a problem but could be a huge problem for Americans in the future. I hope my concern is wrong.
I don't like it either... I didn't like Vista group as it was, with three major primer manufacturers under the control of one group. Now that group isn't even American. Too easy to take it all down with one fell swoop. Lawsuit, activist anti-gun executive sabotaging it... It's not likely to occur, but the fact that someone could, theoretically, take out that many pillars of the industry at once is a situation that should never be allowed to occur. Not to mention the more likely negatives, like having that many primer companies under the control of one group/board. They could just withhold them to drive the price up; it's not like our government will do anything to stop them.
@@ReloadingWeatherbyYeah that's what I'm getting at. Just like the Federal 7 PRC ammo got box velocity or better. I agree they seen a good opportunity. Interested to see how it goes with this. I'm still kinda leaning towards 280AI for my next .284. I figured it'll be hard to get components for this cartidge at first.
Great comments but caught my ear was your accurate analysis of the velocities many cartridges. The Sweet spot, and I believe that Sweet spot remains the same in a short barrel. Thus your 2,850 fps 7 PRC will likely be 2,750 with a 20” barrel, try then to push velocities back up to 2,850 out of a short barrel and your groups may widen back out and ES will likely also increase. As always Austin, excellent thoughts.
Big call. Seems like an arbitrary conclusion based on some limited data... Appears like some are getting excellent SD/ES and accuracy during testing. Could just be cherry picked results however? 7BC targets a small niche and time will tell if it succeeds or fails. I hope it does do well because it’s nice to see progress for a change.
Allterra was the only one that showed more than a couple of groups. For the record I don't see anything wrong with this cartridge for the average hunter that doesn't reload. I think this cartridge will have success.
I think the marketing support behind Federal is much stronger than Hornady - I think this is also having some play in people's opinions when it comes to both.
At 80,000 psi I’d be very interested to see the recoil numbers for this thing. They can market it as a 7prc competitor, but I have a feeling it will recoil more like a 28 nosler.
Recoil is a factor of caliber, bullet weight, and powder charge not pressure. I would expect this to have significantly less recoil then the 7prc due to how much less powder it's using. If this is reloadable at some point in the near future, I can see this eventually killing off the 280 AI and putting a big dent in 7 Rem Mag sales. This seems like a hunters cartridge not a precision shooters cartridge especially since their using the 30-06 case essentially. If anything this will probably end up putting the 6.8 Western in it's grave as well.
Here's an old argument 308 is more inherently accurate than 30-06. Might be true in factory rifles due to loose tolerance in 30-06 but custom guns 30-06 is just as accurate. Sounds like they were paid to give bad press. Other content creators getting sub moa.
SAMMI chamber specs for 308 and 30-06 are the same on tolerances. I really don't think Allterra was paid to crap on the 7mm Backcountry. For the record... Hornady isn't paying me to do this video.
I’ve extremely doubtful that the steel alloy is so ductile that you need 12 passes to form the case, it will probably require carbide dies and more powerful presses because it has higher yield strength, but these are relatively simple engineering challenges to overcome.
@@carlpreston1680 people already only neck size their brass for bolt action rifles, because they will always be used in the same chamber, so it’s less work on the brass. So yeah, should be exactly the same here. The 12 times to size just sounded like typical alarmist, afraid of new ideas mindset.
Let’s just see how this cartridge actually shakes out. When you said accuracy is going to be found at around 59-65k psi I’m not sure if you can call that reliable when most of the cartridge design is very different then what we have traditionally seen. I will certainly want to see the dies and reloading process before picking up a 7 BC rifle either way. That is my real concern here.
My thing is the 7mm BC is a hunting cartridge not a pension cartridge most people will shoot there game within 300 yards no one shoot past 500 on game in my opinion!! Federal will have more offerings in ammo yet, you will find one to shoot, with PRC your pretty much stuck with eldx which sucks as a hunting bullet!! And the CX in the factory doesn't really shoot well and has terrible fps, I shot 6 deer with eldx from 80 to 300 yards 28 nosler 175 gr and everyone exploded!! I would take a inch and a half group with a good bullet over a quarter inch group with a eldx cause crippling a animal with eldx is always high !! Just my opinion!!! Great video!!
I'm thinking the .280 Ackley Improved Weatherby 307 Range XP I got coming is going to fit nicely with my .28 caliber rifles, 7mag and 28 Nosler. No need for the PRC in that caliber. The 300 PRC I have is a better choice in those Hornady chamberings.
Hmm very interesting to see I usually shoot a .300 win mag / .308 in the MK-22 MRAD I shoot the .300 Weatherby and I was looking into this bullet, yet as a hand loader myself. I use the 220/230 grain bullets and in quite acccurste at 1,000+ Just wonder if this type of material is too hard to reload which would cut down the needs / items needed for reloading thus cutting the amount of ammo out there. Long weird thought, but it’s just my opinion. Really do appreciate the video review.
@ from what you are saying which was more detailed than the other videos I researched, you’re definitely right. Looking at these rifles shooting the new 7 BC, a lot of hype just about the case. Don’t seem too accurate, but I don’t know if there are other loadings out there besides the terminal ascent
I think the case is game changing for handloaders. If everything turns out to be viable for the handloaders you could probably load it down a bit and get some and regain some consistency. The reported accuracy isn't something I buy into with any advertisement/youtuber especially when they measure that with 3 round groups. 7-10 shot groups are much more telling and few rifles will print minute or better with that.
Listened to a podcast yesterday talking about this and that Alliance who makes RL26 is owned by the same parent company as Federal. Maybe that’s why hornady can’t get their hands on it.
I was listening to the Big Game Hunting podcast and he had a rep from Federal on who said modern rifle actions could handle the increased pressures because it was the case that took the pressure, not the chamber. He also said (not exactly wording) that this technology could be applied to existing cartridges. So why another new round? Maybe they had to demonstrate the tech to SAMMI and the public before applying it to existing cartridges? One would think they could have owned the market if they opened with a lineup of +p rounds using new case technology. It would have been a statement, here is the future buy Federal, our ammo is faster, more efficient and turns everything into a Magnum.😂
The first video listed below said that RCBS was making dies and quite the project saying it was not feasible to reload these cases as the case is hard on the dies and wears them out fast, and you have to run the cases a lot of times through the sizing die to get it sized properly. Basically one big pain that eat dies up. So no reloader is going to do it, as it is way more time consuming and costly an endeavor. Not to mention the lack of the powder's availability. Plus accuracy is not there at the higher pressures and it needs to be slowed down to get accuracy whereby back to where the brass lives at in the first place. This case is DOA. I give it 4 years max being there are people that will try it, but the ammo cost to much to shoot a lot so the stuff will sit on selves and once it get used up this thing will go the way of the dodo. So as to my understanding once the factories drop the cartridge from their product line, in order to continue shooting the rifles one would have to convert some brass to fit the chamber. Of which will not hold the higher pressures. Right back to where they where before having fell for a niche item. At the price of the ammo no one will be blasting away with it at the range, to the point the cartridge boxes will sit on the shelf too long for the manufactures taste, whereby they will drop it from their line of products and the 7mm Backcountry will enter the Dodo's abode. I would not be surprised if the 7m product assembly line blows up, whereby collecting the insurance, to recoup from this debacles. ua-cam.com/video/IZ_amvpjjQ0/v-deo.html&lc=UgzjKZE9simM6N3bySp4AaABAg.AD4n4ABya7bADGBzwI-2TM This next video was from a Beta tester and they claim accuracy is lacking- ua-cam.com/video/pvC-GYFE2SI/v-deo.html
To be honest if someone just made the 7BC with brass cases (65k psi) it would make a pretty good 500 yard mountain rifle cartridge. ~ 2800 fps 175 gr loads
I want to see these peak alloy cases for a 30-378 weatherby I think the case design is the future honestly every since the self contained cartridge came out the limiting factor has been the brass most actions can handle the pressure already the limiting factor is the brass if they can make a case the is malleable as brass but handle more pressure that’s the future as long as it’s reloadable brass will be obsolete in 10 years
Great video. I am into reloading for all my rifles. This rifle having a steel alloy case is why it can take such high pressure. I really don't think that the steel alloy case is going to be reloaded. And you are spot on if it does not have very sub-MOA it isn't worth anything for long range hunting. Not better than anything else that is out there. But someone will like it. It seems Backfire likes it. BTW I do think Reloader 16 is more available. I can buy it or have been able to. It may not be available for the bulk buy that Hornady would need. They may want to supply reloaders with it and not be filling everyone's high volume orders like Hornady would be. It may also be they don't want to supply that bulk powder to a competitor in the ammo business. Just saying. Enjoyed the video. I don't like steel cased ammo of any type, so I am out on this one. But for the guy that has a lot of money and wants another bing bang have at it. Shooting sports are one thing to one person and another to someone else. It should be fun.
@ReloadingWeatherby I see nothing wrong with that, most people (myself included) aren't capable of shooting past 500 yards. But a short, suppressed rifle that can easily handle elk, bear and moose is still something.
One thing I will add is that your simulation is accounting for known case volume of brass cased 280 rem/ai. Steel could change the case wall thickness which would show a pretty significant shift in case volume. Plus a blanket statement of a lack of precision due to 80k psi doesn’t seem relevant. Only time will tell I guess
I have seen some say it accurate and some reliable people love it. BTW they where the first to say its a problem for them with accuracy. Lets see what federal does and don't. I like the idea but I would not rush out and buy a new rifle. Edit maybe it's just me but I definitely don't like burning my barrels out and this rd would definitely do that or it would seem. We still should wait for it to come to market with some solid rifle options.
I bought a 300 PRC. Because I think the bullets look cooler and I was in the Market for a 300 WM. Lets be real here this numbers dick measuring contest doesn't really matter except for the like .5% of shooters trying to hit things round about 1000 yards. For the other 99.5% of people that use a rifle, most of which can't hit anything consistently at 500 yards, pretty much any caliber with enough weight and speed for filling the freezer is all that matters. Which is most of them.
Fantastic video. That earned you my subscription. So for a Gucci-priced ammunition that costs essentially double the cost of "regular" Federal Premium factory ammo, one still doesn't get fantastic performance out past 400 yards. Funnily enough, my sub-MOA Tikka T3x in .30-06 Sprg with factory Federal Premium Berger Hybrid Hunter 168-grain ammunition will certainly get it done inside 400 yards, accurately, for half the ammo cost, and no need to buy the latest "super-rifle". I can see some of the merits of 7PRC, but 7PRC factory ammunition literally retails in Canada for twice the price of my ammunition ($119.99 Cdn/box versus about $62/box). But, since, for ethical reasons, any hunting shot that I take will certainly be well under 400 yards, and since I don't even have convenient access to a practise range beyond 300 yards, I see no point whatsoever. If I were to take up handloading, I'd bet I could further improve on that sub-MOA accuracy and do it even more cheaply (after absorbing reloading equipment costs, of course).
From a hunting standpoint if you already have a 7mm rem mag save your money
No clue if 7 backcountry will succeed, but I’m certain glad it’s out there. We need creative stuff like this to push the industry forward even if it sucks at first. We should give technologies like this time too. So many of today’s gun influencers would’ve likely wanted to dump the M16 during its initial troubles.
Will your old rem mag/win mag/30-06 etc work damn well? Yes, heck I own a rem mag and am certainly not going to swap it out. But we should still support stuff like this. Plus it’s cooler
Thanks for your comment
That’s part of the problem , people want to be Cool ! Cool has nothing to do with hunting or target shooting !
@@thomasdaum1927who cares? Do you want to claim this cartridge wont kill everything? It will do exceptionally well I’m sure.
Pretty sure its not. Too niche and for hunting there's no real point.
Horny already innovated in the right direction with the PRC, the odds that people will want to go out and buy a whole other caliber is slim.
@@MissouriBoatRide420 Cody - We know nothing about how it will group or what bullets will work with 80,000 psi ! I don’t understand why people want to jump on the switch to anything new Bandwagon ! You do remember all the ( hype ) about the 6.5 needsmore don’t you ! So buy one and then wine about how expensive the ( new ) special alloy steel ammo is that’s if you can get any !…… New doesn’t always mean better it’s just different………
"The peasants may be conned by every pitchman that introduces a new super magnum, but the members of the cognoscenti stick with classic calibers." - Jack O'Connor.
Jack would be busy proving the validity of the creed if he were around today.
we should all still be using pinfire blackpowder guns
@@mmorris6341 No match for his .270 winchester loads inside 600 yards.
@ there is a reason he felt compelled to prove the 270 was viable.
@eduardoolaechea re: "No match for his .270 winchester loads inside 600 yards".
You need to put into perspective that the his "classic calibers" remark was from 1967 and that he still considered 600 yard shots with this 270 and its 130grain, flat based bullets nearly impossible. Look at Federal Blue box for contemporary loads.* O'connor died in the 1970's, decades before laser rangefinders would make estimating range for long shots relatively easy. That's why he was a big proponent of point-blank-range shooting, ie, 250 - 300 yards. He considered 500 yards to be a very long shot. At the time of the quote, the "super magnum" cartridges included things like the relatively new 300 Win Mag, still using low-BC, relatively light bullets. In the 1960's and 1970's, 30 cal (and under) magnums were mainly used to increase the MPBR by tens of yards at the disadvantage of high recoil and short barrel life.
*at 600 yards, a 50-yard range estimation causes over 16" change in drop - you can run the numbers yourself, if you want.
I'll stick to a 7rem mag!
This is probably the reason why it is marketed specifically towards hunters who wants a short barrel with a suppressor. The name itself and the Peak alloy logo is directed straight at hunters as opposed to Hornady's approach to focus on precision first. We'll see soon enough but I think brass is so much easier to work with anyway.
I would like to ask a question and if you want for you to answer it. Do you think federal dropped the ball on this new alloy case by not releasing it in legacy cartridges like 308, 30-06, 7mm08 and so on? I understand that it would have to have the "not for use in all rifles" lawyer writing like 45-70 does but a 80000psi 7mm08 giving 7prc performance that also allows you to load sweet and mild brass sounds amazing to me.
I think Federal would eventually want to do that.
There’s nothing saying they can’t still release new cartridges in that material. Plus 280 is still one I would for sure consider a legacy cartridge and that is what the 7BC is based on
Handloaders have been doing what you suggest with 277 fury brass. 7mm-08ai on a sig steel based case.
I wonder what other cartridges will evolve from the 7 BC , 30 , 6.5 . 6.8 maybe
@carlpreston1680 that was kinda my point I don't think we need new cartridges. The real achievement here for me is that case. Federal can make any case using this alloy so why not just do that. 80000psi 308 gets you right at 300wm. I just think Federal missed the mark on this one.
280 AI vs 7mm Backcountry!
That’s not even close bud .
@@Paul-q3m7k oh why you think that? In 3 to 5 years we're see if anybody is still talking about that 7mm backcountry....I don't think it's going to work out.... LMFAO 😂
Same as all the rest of federal made stuff...big hype an it fails... LMFAO 😂
Not a comparison even the 30-06 has factory ammo that beats 280 ai.
@rockie307 Interesting ? I would love to see your data ? Even if I go on Nosler load data. Most of the 30-06 bullets are more or less 100fps slower and .284 has better bc when you compare the same weight.
From what I heard, early releases of ammunition from Federal to the guntubers for testing was all over the place, large SD's and bad groups. More than one of them said that the SD's tightened up and accuracy got a lot better as Federal perfected the load. Backfire was showing great SD's and even though he did not show the groups, he said they were really good. Still waiting for him to release his second, more in-depth review of the cartridge and Horizon rifle.
We will see...
ALLEGEDLY guns and ammo did review, and the SD on the fusion tipped was 8.8 and a group avg. Of .49.. and LRx has an avg group of .32.. Now.. this was done with a Gunwerks $7000 Clymer rifle.. but im wondered how did they get the low SD while Allterra was all over the place.. Holding out for the 338 Version.
@dores34 Because amateur hour Alterra isn't on the same level as Gunwerks.
Ok, I have my popcorn ready...
I love your honest opinions.
Thanks. I may be wrong on this... but we will see
I’m not anti Hornady but I think it’s the future of firearms . For me to burn out a barrel it would take about 10 years with the amount I shoot my hunting rifles . I do most of my practice with my 6.5 cm and 22lr . For most hunters I don’t think burning out a barrel in 1500 shots or so is an issue. You didn’t mention that here but did in another video . You call it not accurate due to one rifle you’ve seen not shoot it well. Ron spomer and backcountry both shot that ammo very well . Not really fair to judge accuracy off of that one rifle . Also , federal is working with one of the big reloading companies to designs presses that can reload it like brass . I think in time we will see this technology take over the market . The hunting market at least.
Thanks for watching
They built 4 test rifles with different barrel lengths and all the same result. If a small batch precision company isn’t getting it why would the savage that 95% of us would buy do better. It could happen but alterra makes damn good rifles. It it was Christianson I would agree with you😂
Some great information for those who like to jump on every new thing that comes along,
Nailed it. And for a hunting rifle, at 400-500 yards on in, there are literally countless cartridges that work perfectly for that.
Thanks for watching
7mm PRC is reloadable, 7mm Backcountry is not (as best I can tell). So it’s a No for me. 😁
From what I’ve read is it will be but hasn’t bin out long enough have the stuff out to do it yet.
What I heard is that some of the first loads that Federal was handing out had accuracy issues and they weren't the final loads. They sent out a second batch and from what I hear they fixed the accuracy issues and its shooting pretty good.
I would like to see the ES of the new ammo.
I could see it being a pretty cool cartridge for a lightweight mountain rifle and suppressor. I’m more interested in the 338 rpm for that, 18” backcountry 6 lug mark v, 5 1/2 lbs and still like 3500+ ft lbs at the muzzle, easier to reload, etc. But even then my 24” mark v 30-06 and 6.5 rpm aren’t that long/heavy suppressed and can do about anything in that 7mm ballpark for medium-long range hunting. The 6.5 rpm is close to 7mm mag numbers and the 30-06 is what it is, still great.
Pre-liking this just because I've been waiting for it :-)
When Ron was shooting the 7mm backcountry he mentioned that the primers was starting to pop out. That was a negative for me.
This should be good. I'm hearing and reading the same intel about inaccuracy. At the end of the day, what difference does any cartridge make in any particular rifle if the accuracy doesn't make us say WOW? I love new stuff. I'm open to innovation. I think the 7mm Backcountry concept is great. Many of us have our criteria that must be met when it comes to our ammunition and rifles. Jim at Backfire says, "if it doesn't feed, it doesn't hunt." If I have a rifle, for example, that I had built with my chosen components, and it doesn't shoot to my satisfaction, and quickly, I MAY consider the time and effort to rebarrel it so long as the barrel maker replaces it at no cost to me (which I've never had to do so far) - but that rifle will be parting ways with this household if it doesn't shoot half MOA or better with little effort. Same for a factory rifle. I'll extend every consideration to any new rifle with a variety of factory ammo first, then handloads. Crappy groups equals new home - not staying here. The point is, if we end up shackled to factory ammo in a 7mm Backcountry and it's mediocre at best, I'll stick with what I have and continue to carry that extra 8 inches of barrel around. I've somehow been able to manage those excessively heavy rifles (9 pounds) in British Columbia, Alberta, New Brunswick, Ontario, Maine, Colorado, Wyoming, Texas, Alabama, South Dakota, South Carolina - since 1985. Not sure how I managed all those miles without a 16 inch barrel and suppressor. I say give it time, let Federal and the rifle makers iron out glitches. The 7mm Backcountry (and likely the 6.5, 6mm, 30 cal coming) may turn out to be outstanding. The handloading part is what is most important to me. Time will tell if we can and how much more it will cost to do so
Well said!
One of the rifle manufacturers was able to get the Barnes LRX down to .2 MOA.
There's been one report from one group of mediocre accuracy. And everybody else has had good accuracy. I wonder what the difference is
One thing that the YT channels taught me…… high pressure (max pressure) is an accuracy killer……echoed here
I'm trying to become a better handloader... My best accuracy isn't found at the highest pressures.
@ agreed!! managing case fill, burn, and pressure are critical to consistency IMO…… you can do everything perfect and those factors can cause random results… a 93%-103% case fill is important - the sweet spot somewhere in the middle… a trip to some of the databases that list fill… the big N brand being one, most of the best combos aren’t at the top velocities… and fill.
@@BeaterJeepNothing is a guarantee is all i can say.
My Sharps shoots awesome with black powder loads, so maybe we need to go back to that.
The rules that apply for a brass case are completely useless for a different case material.
Modern magnum cartridges will be around for a very long time and might well remain preferred for those who want long range accuracy and don't mind the longer barrels. However, I do see that high-pressure cartridges like the 7mm Backcountry and 277 SIG Fury have significant advantages in two areas: Shorter barrels and "dual identity" use.
A smaller volume of propellant burning faster to reach higher chamber pressures does more work in the first few inches of the bullet's travel in the barrel. There are hunters who want a shorter barrel for suppressor use or want a rifle to be more handy in the woods. Ironically, Hornady's CEO, Steve Hornady was an early proponent of shorter barrels and there still are commercials on YT from 2009 with him touting the RCM cartridges from compact rifles. In an interview from a couple of years ago, he reiterated that he still considered the 338 RCM in a 20" barrel the best single overall cartridge for North American game.
By "dual identity", I mean that with lower pressure and less expensive brass-cased loads it can also compete with traditional deer rifles in the 280 Rem/7mm-08 class. In large areas of the country, those less expensive (and easy-to-reload) lower pressure ammo may will be most popular option*. I suspect that a brass-cased 280 Backountry could also provide typical 7mm-08 performance but in a suppressed or "woods rifle" with a 16-18" barrel. Yes, it is also possible to download a traditional magnum, but I have not heard of it being done very often.
• I live in an area where many hunters have never taken a shot over 200 yards, but shoot a 7mm Mag. They can only afford one good rifle/scope combo and dream of a trip "Out West" where they might need the extra power and range provided by a magnum cartridge.
I've never even heard of the 338 RCM and had to look it up. Ballistically it looks like what I've been after, but I'm guessing finding rifles chambered in it is nearly impossible... My search for .338fed or .358win continues, though maybe I'll poke around to see if there are any .338RCM's on the used market.
Ruger comes out with some cool cartridges but none of them ever really take hold. .204 is probably their most adopted as you can still find factory ammo for it. My poor .480ruger doesn't seem to have factory support anymore. Last time I saw a box on the shelf it was like $90 for 20rd, lol. Shame too, as its quite manageable while giving similar terminal performance as the ultra mags that most can't shoot accurately. But it was lost in the .460/.500Smith craze, that sold a lot of X-frames who would shortly return to the store... Turns out the general shooting public isn't a fan of firing artillery in a handgun, lol. Got my 460v for a steal though, so I can't be too salty.
I got WAY off topic...
@@mfallen2023 The RCMs (Ruger Compact Magnums) were developed by Hornady on shortened 375 Ruger cases. They are also related to the PRCs. The 6.5 PRC uses a necked down 338 RCM case. It has roughly the same powder capacity as the 30-06, but Hornady's factory ammo used the custom propellants that would later go into Superformance ammo. This made it virtually impossible to reload to factory performance. Hornady just made another batch of the ammo, but it is otherwise rare.
I haven't seen tight groups with the 7mm Backcountry yet.
I have... but no low ES
@@ReloadingWeatherbyspoomers video had a 3 shot SD at 10 or less o believe
@ One 3 shot group doesn't tell much.
@ 🤷🏻♂️ a lot of speculation going around. How many factory offering currently are hitting single digit SDs? I’ll bet not many at all
I’ve been waiting for this one!
What powder might they be using? Assuming dies become available, what available powder could be used to get these high velocities?
No idea
Excellent perspective. Accuracy, consistency and ease of use including reloading beats pure speed. Even though speed kills and helps.
You already know that I want a left handed 7mm with a threaded barrel to go in between my old classic LH 270 Win that is unthreaded and my right handed 300 WSM that has a muzzle brake. Probably stick with either the 7 PRC, 280 AI or 7 Rem Mag.
Well we agree on one thing. It looks like powders in the burn rate necessary to hit 80k psi in this case do not include very temp stable consistent options.
Probably not... but maybe Federal has access to it
@ maybe H4895 or H322? Just stabbing in the dark.
It’s comparing apples to oranges. One can push 65k psi and more if you lean on it. The other is 80k psi and higher if you lean on it. You can’t compare them. It’s like racing a Dodge Hellcat against an alcohol fueled funny car. They aren’t the same
Am I only allowed to compare the 7mm Backcountry to the 277 Sig Furry?
@ lol 😆 not a lot of room yet. I have a feeling there are more coming that will open Pandora’s box
We talked before. I hung out with my brother recently, he is a pro for Buckventures and a cameraman for The Woodsman TV, also a regional director for the National wildlife Turkey Federation. He gets invites to all the big insider hunting/shooting events. He knew about the cartridge before any of us did from one of his friends. From what he was told, that 170 grain TA load is a problem across the board. . But, the Fusion tipped and the Barnes loads and the 155 TA loads have been getting great accuracy. He is a 7prc guy, and is forced to buy factory ammo because of his schedule and always being gone. He said his 7 prc isn’t shooting as accurately as it used too. Probably because Reloader 26 is unicorn dust for the foreseeable future. He is making the switch as soon as Bergara or CVA chamber the round, those are his sponsors so he cant shoot any other rifle. So maybe, the 7 BC is more accurate than 7prc 🤷🏻 he also said he hasnt heard anything about it taking 12 passes to reload the ammo.
Thanks for watching. I do think the cartridge will do fairly well
@@ReloadingWeatherbyi think there is room for both. I bet less than a 1000 people in all of the usa can take a 800 yard shot at a 6” target in a real hunting scenario with wind and connect with a cold bore. That’s extremely hard. Precision long range hunting is unethical for most people (myself included)
I'm surprised Hornady doesn't use a blended powder for the seven PRC a lot of manufacturers do that even them I've pulled lever evolution rounds and it wasn't the same powder sold on the shelf .
@@carlpreston1680 Yeah I don’t know. They still advertise it at 3000 fps, and for you to grab a box of eldx or match and go long range shooting. Neither are true. To get the SD you need for precision long range, you have to hand load. I have no idea if the 7BC will ever be able to do that, even handloaded. Hopefully new powders come out that can get the SD’s low enough too. Even then, i can count on 1 finger the people i know that can take a 800 yard shot and hit a deer first try in the vitals. Even he wouldnt take it unless every condition is perfect. This whole LR precision thing is a selling point, thats it, not something 99.999% of people have any business doing.
Multiple people in the industry said they have been struggling to get better than 2.5 inch 5 shot groups. No thanks 7mm Brokeback
I've also heard that... unfortunate
Especially since those are with high dollar rigs, lord knows what it’ll do in a ruger American lol
Brokeback, LMAO. Federal might as well have named it 7mm DEI !
You have to take that with a grain of salt though, people like Ron spomer have also tested it and got 5 3 shot groups sub MOA
@@brianklamer3328 Lol...Well, I was talking crap in the comments of one of Federal's videos and they called me a racist, bigot. 😁
Boundaries should be pushed like this. I hear stories all the time when Barnes popularized copper bullets and they had their initial issues.
Those Elk aren't going to know if they got hit with a 7mm PRC, 7mm Backcountry, 7mm Rem mag etc....
No they won't
I watched the AllTerra video when it first came out last week and enjoyed their review. (I also own an AllTerra rifle so know what they are capable of). After that video, I'll stick with my 7 PRC.
Thanks for watching
Good analysis. 100% agreed.
Honestly cartridge development has got stagnant. Im glad someone is stepping up to put some pressure on hornady. As a hunter 7mm back country fits the bill. Ive seen allterras video and just about every video on 7mm back country i can find. Horizon, seekins, and even savage have said they have found accuracy to be good in testing. I think this is one of those no one has any info untill it gets in our hands to test for ourselves. I Plan on getting a seekins element or horizon to see for myself when ammo is availble. A 16 inch rifle in the mountains i think would be perfect. I do agree the 7mm prc is a great hunting round and an even better target round. Its just a 16 inch rifle is perfect to use with a suppressor. Im not sold on 7mm backcountry yet but im impressed so far. I think in 10 years the alloy cases will be king. Brass is maxed out unless you add barrel length to give you more speed. As a hunter who uses suppressors i want to go shorter not longer. But honestly its all speculation until the ammo is getting cranked out and people start testing it out across the country. Rcbs is supposed to be almost finished with the dies for it. Actually excites me to play around with something new that no one knows any info on. Its like new territory for reloaders as well as hunters. It isnt gonna replace 7mm rem mag or 7prc. But it might just make a better package for how i want to hunt. I figure you will pick one up to test so im gonna keep up with your results to see if they match what i see out of whichever rifle i decide on getting.
The largest advantage is for those that use 6-8 inch suppressors and want the higher performance normally lost on shorter length barrels...so a guy could rock a 16 inch barrel with a 6-8 inch suppressor and still be under 24 inches total length on barrel and around that 40 inch mark for rifle...... If dont run suppressor or dont care about the length as dont backpack in thick brush and such.....then not much of an increase. Great idea.....and will revolutionize the industry but think will be more for people wanting to take 270, 308, 264, 280 cartridges and load in the steel alloy case to increase pressures and turn old tried and true rounds into magnums in performance. That is the true gift.... My 30-06 or 280 AI or 7mm-08 getting extra 200-300 fps without any needed modifications. ;)
Thanks for watching
My thoughts is 7mm prc casing that can stand higher pressures. Boom I solve everything for hornady!!!
I hate it when you talk logically. And make sense. Its hard for me to disagree. Dare I say it take the wind out of my sails on the " troll ship" I captain from time to time. Appreciate the research and short vid. Keep up the good work. Look forward to your vids. Smashed the like button
It’s fascinating to me how the cartridges that are launched to focus on the hunting market very often flop. And the cartridges that are focused more on target shooting often find a place and stick around. I think it’s because we handloaders don’t care about box velocity, we care about what our data shows.
I sold a couple kegs of RL26 last year because the market was stupid and I the proceeds funded a nice Foundation/TL3/Bartlein build.
The Backcountry ammo will be super expensive and yet not precise. And with those pressures and this much overbore, the barrel life will be well under 1000rds.
If a person wants a bit more than the 7 PRC, there’s always the 28 Nosler.
The PRCs are excellent cartridges because they are BALANCED. In all of the PRCs, Hornady didn’t just try to make the fastest biggest or baddest. They could have just necked down the 300prc to make the 7mm, but they didn’t. Why not? Because it wasn’t balanced anymore.
Nothing is dumber to me than the “controversy” of the 7 PRC missing 150fps with non RL26 powder. The entire point of these cartridges is letting the BC do the work so you don’t have to launch them at stupid speeds. I’ve shot a good bit of RL26 and it’s famous for a reason, but it’s also giving up some accuracy potential IME relative to the Bofors RL powders (RL26 and RL17 are made by Swiss Nitrochemie and are the only non-Bofors powders in the RL line).
Wonder if Federal had the foresight to consider making these new high pressure cases - steel alloy - in cartridges already in existence. Of course we'd still be relying on factory ammo accuracy but imagine if they said, "here ya go, try our new 7PRC, 7RemMag, 300PRC, 300WM, 6.5PRC, 300WSM terminal ascent ammo with our new steel alloy case at 80,000" hmmmmmm. May be in the works?
@@Accuracy1st it would make them the only place to buy cases from if they did this, I’m sure it’s only a question of scaling up production to meet that level of demand for already existing cases, and probably an eventual lawsuit for a monopoly if no one else makes a comparable alloy case.
@@alexmills1329 I'm not overly excited about 80K pressure to begin with.
@ I can buy a barbell with 200k psi test steel for $250, I’m not concerned about 80k psi.
Great video!
I like the way you compared them.
Also I’m wondering not only trying to get the proper powder what about the steel cases? Are they readily available and affordable??
You make a good point. If it isn't 1/2 minute accurate then it isn't much good at long range. For a 400 yard and in gun, existing cartridges can hit 2700 fps out of a 16" barrel which provide plenty of power for Elk sized game to 400 yards. You don't need the extra power unless you are shooting long range, you can't shoot game at long range without excellent accuracy.
If your choices of ammo is limited to a handful of offerings from Federal then the chances of high accuracy are much lower than if you have a lot of ammo choices and can handload to find ammo that your individual rifle shoots well.
My new years resolution, use a 300 WSM for every game animal and quit worrying about the latest and greatest.
I personally don't think people should long range hunt. But if you do... you better know your equipment and have a great load at distance. Not every half MOA load is good at distance.
Now if I can get steel alloy cases for my .300 and .340 Weatherby mags I could get some serious velocity increases.
True
Not a reloader. I'll pick one up this year. Most likely a Seekins ph3 if i can get my hands on one. Quick change barrel and bolt head so if the round dies i can always change easily down the road. It's going to make one hell of a hunting round. A lot of people mention or focus on how it extends your hunting distance. I dont plan on shooting anything at 800yds, but having that higher/extra energy at 3-400 yds without any extra recoil is a nice bonus for me.
It will be sweet for you! Have fun!
I agree with you.
If you keep your shots within 450 you will be fine.
And if you aren’t shooting steel every weekend.
Just using it for hunting. Then buy factory ammunition and enjoy it.
Seekens makes very good rifles.
Cheers
Reread the marketing it doesn’t say less recoil. It says “perceived felt recoil” which means nothing you don’t get 500ftlbs of energy without feeling it. It’s about how a rifle is set up. You can make anything shoot as tame as you want. It will not mean it has less recoil. Comes down to weight and muzzle device. 7 prc vs 7bc same weight and no muzzle device your gonna feel the difference.
@@GarrettRowland-ic1uoit has less powder charge so it has less recoil. You gain the extra ftlbs of energy downrange from the higher pressure and subsequent higher velocities. That's what makes it a step forward. The case technology allowing higher pressures.
@@daltonv5206 powder charge means nothing not all powders are the same. Your comparing gasoline to diesel it’s not the same. I know you don’t reload but powders are way different between calibers you cannot just go off of weight. Faster burning powder like this has a quicker recoil impulse and way more energy. You’re almost getting 28 nosler energy and speed why would it be any different? But the 28 nosler wouldn’t be able to handle the powder charge that is in the 7 bc. But go ahead and fall for all the marketing bs behind this cartridge. I do think it was a cool idea but is not gonna pan out. Federal cannot keep any terminal accent ammo in stock or even make the bullets just to sell for reloaders and you think you’ll be able to get ammo for this when all the bandwagon jumps on?
You are 100%correct. The 7-PRC was designed for good ballistics and efficiently. Altera did a fanomanal job with their review on the 7mm BC . The other problem they revealed was that the primers on the 7- BC would pop out with the factory ammo. In my opinion, that's over pressure, but that's my opinion . 1 good question is how would you determine pressure signs with steel ? With Steel case ammo, all shooter's and reloaders know it's bad news for your chambers, and as far as I know their's not any equment or components for reloading steel . For instance, how would you resize the neck/sholder junction without extreme heat to resize steel case's . If all their trying to do is increase pressure that a case can handle, like 80,000 PSI, why wouldn't they just use a stronger brass ? If i am not mistaken, there are 6 different types of brass, and 2 of them can handle pressure over 80,000 PSI, and one of them can handle pressures of 88,000 PSI😮. We need to stay with a material so we can still detect high pressure without having a catastrophique failure that would cause major injuries to the shooter and surrounding bystanders . We would also have to have a major upgrade to our rifles and components to handle an extra 20,000+PSI . It's like trying to walk before you crawl. Personally, I think we need to build a good rifle to handle high-pressure cartridges. What we currently have today will handle it for a short time, but eventually, it will fail because rifles today are built to handle 65,000-70,000-P.S.I maximum . So I hope they have considered that with the new 7mmBC rifles before someone gets hurt . I didn't hear Altera say anything about an upgrade on the chamber or receiver of the rifle materials . They could have done what SIG did and built a rifle around their new cartridge 277-Fury .Great vedio, my friend. Keep it coming . It's always a pleasure to watch your videos. Thank you . God bless you and your family.God bless america 🇺🇸 🇨🇱🇺🇲 🇨🇱 🇺🇲🇨🇱🇺🇲🇨🇱.
Just out of curiosity, can you load the 7mm prc and other cartridges with these new ally cases at higher pressures too?
No
Is 7mm backcountry slightly less power compare to 7mm mag ?
Supresspors safe @ 80,000 psi? I've only seen one video using a Supresspor. I've heard no mention as to Supresspor pressure ratings!
I would guess it's going to be awhile b4 available for the masses. Time to work the gremlins out.
You're probably right
I know mine is rated to 300win mag, but 80k psi? that I need to email the manufacturer and ask
Yep, still waiting for someone to do a suppressor explanation on this. I think, even though it's 80,000 in the chamber, it won't be much, if any, more than a normal cartridge produces at the muzzle. A fast burning powder does not necessarily produce more gasses than a slower powder, it just burns faster, giving that initial spike of pressure in the chamber. I think a fast burning powder could even reduce pressure at the muzzle as the powder will have completely consumed it's self before it gets to the end of the muzzle.
@@biggs8729 It would be a combination of pressure AND volume the suppressor has to withstand. The short barrels on conventional/magnum loads likely have lower overall pressures than 24-26 inchers, but the 80k is not going to reduce much as it was designed for the short barrel. It will be interesting to see which suppressor mfgs certify their products for this.
Entirely dependent on suppressor construction. It’d have to be pretty robust (TBAC said my 6.5 Ultra-9 can handle 6.5-300 Wby, but that’s out of a 24 inch barrel and those MAPs are only about 65k psi), which kinda defeats the short barrel/light weight idea behind the round.
First I have no horse in this race. I don't own either cartridge nor do I intend to. But I really think you missed the mark, pun intended. From what I've seen I haven't seen Federal claim this is a precision round nor is it part of the cartridge name. The 7 PRC in the accuracy department does what it claims. In the speed department it is nothing more than snake oil as you pointed out and for Hornady not to change their information is nothing short of lying. The 7 Backcountry didn't claim precision and therefore didn't fall short on their claim. It did however claim velocity from a much shorter barrel and it delivered in spades. I would personally be more inclined to accept the short coming in precision accuracy and know what I have rather than buy something that will never deliver unless you handload for it. Watch Hornady's videos or the people paid to hype them and you hear a consistent phrase "this is an off the shelf answer to a custom gun" but it cannot deliver what they promised.
The 7mm Backcountry reminds me of Sig's 277 Fury cartridge. The military wanted to utilize short barrel (10 -12 inch) suppressed M4 rifles for CQB fighting. So, Sig created the 277 Fury which uses a hybrid steel base and brass for higher pressures. Federal is targeting the hunter that use a suppressor. Not sure how large that market is, which likely dictate the profitability of the Backcountry line. I am with you. I will stay with the traditional brass cartridges for factory and hand load ammunition.
I hunt with a suppressor, I only know one other person that does and dozens that don't. I think if you spend your time online and at gun enthusiast conventions you can mistakenly draw the conclusion that far more people are using suppressors than actually are.
I wonder what kind of velocity you would get from the backcountry with a rebarrel to 26" or would it be to risky with 80,000 psi ?
That would be fun to see what it does in a 26 inch barrel
I'll keep my Savage 110 rebarreled in 280 AI with a 24" Criterion and 1-8 twist.
I have one question, in ten or twenty years I know I’ll be able to walk into most outdoor stores and find 7mm mag ammo. Can I say the same for all these new seven’s????
Some of them will for sure be gone
@ I hope they succeed, I really like the 7prc but it makes me a little apprehensive. I hunt with a 7mm mag but the ackley is a better cartridge, I’m also a fan of the 280 rem but always passed on them because I’m not a hand loader.
Yeah I was wondering about the 280ai comparison. Shoulda just called it 280ai TURBO. Then they could start turboing all kinds of old cartridges Lol
If u had to resize that brass. That many times for 1 use. How many times can u reload the brass? Or just neck sizing the brass? I bet the die's will be costly. I will stick with my 280AI and 7mm mag 1@8 26-inch barrels.
Honest question.
What percentage of rifle shooters, hunters and target are hand loader's.
I would say pretty low. I think this cartridge has a good chance of being successful
i dunno man i’m not a reloader and only an occasional recreational hunter but i watched the Spomer/Benedict video on it yesterday and it was pretty good. And Benedict had his 11 year old daughter take a bear with it already. Eleven! So jealous, I never shot no stinkin’ bear😅 Anyways as an outsider and recreational shooter I think I am still able to understand your points. Nevertheless, I speculate also that Federal marketing department maybe knows that a lotta people type a lot of things about their shooting abilities online but that most shooters do not enter precision shooting competitions on the regular and usually shoot their animal within 400 yards. And if it does what it says on the box then like u said, they gonna be taking some of the market on that vs Hornady. Anyways I admit i am totally speculating. Not even gonna buy one. Cuz i gotta stay in my lane of budget hunter until i save up more or get promoted or make some killer trades😅
It's the casing material that gives it a slight advantage in ballistics, but not in reloading..... Give the 7prc or even the old 7rem mag a steel casing and im sure they can throw numbers similar.
Accuracy issues could be a number of things. Is it the high pressures? Maybe, but there are other tweaks made to the cartridge that could improve the accuracy. Also, at what distance does accuracy become a problem. I guess it would be the MOA mark. We have to remember that the PRC is built with competition shooting in mind. Federals 7mm backcountry is a hunting designed cartridge. So, how accurate do you need it to be effective?
I'm going to hold off of both and see what transpires, yes the 7mm bullet is the sweet spot for hunting and long range with a good amount of bullet options out there. I would rather build a 7mm wsm over these two.
I'll wait for what Weatherby has to offer in the coming year
@ReloadingWeatherby Oh has weatherby announced someone they're cooking up? Or is it speculation that they are?
Hate to break your bubble but your wrong on most counts. Accuracy is more a function of the bullet and rifle than cartridge. Also I have seen .23" group with the 7 BC with the 175gr. .37 with the 155. Also federal says they will sell the powder at some point. Plus you don't have any understanding of effects of pressure on ES. One guy got ES of 13 with early 168gr federal load.
What is the name of the software estimating pressures?
I completely agree with you. There is nothing technically special or new about this design. It’s just a reinvention of the same wheel. Just added psi that isn’t good for anything.
Thought the Hornady Factory stuff was better now and close if not on box velocity
Still waiting for someone to do a suppressor explanation on this. No one has explained if it is even safe to run this cartridge in a short barrel thru a suppressor. I think, even though it's 80,000 in the chamber, it won't be much, if any, more than a normal cartridge produces at the muzzle. A fast burning powder does not necessarily produce more gasses than a slower powder, it just burns faster, giving that initial spike of pressure in the chamber. I think a fast burning powder could even reduce pressure at the muzzle as the powder will have completely consumed it's self before it gets to the end of the muzzle. Slow powders burn all the way down the barrel and in short barrels, are still burning when they leave the muzzle, producing the large fireball. We need a reloading physics guy to weigh in on this.
Is terminal ascent nickel plated?
Great comparison. Thanks.
My main concern with Federal and Remington ammo is their sale to Czechoslovak Group. This sales should never been allowed to happen.
Why?
@ CSG is a foreign holding company with a questionable history. Their primary interests rest in their country not ours. They now own Federal, Speer, CCI, and Remington. It seems like a bad idea that may never be a problem but could be a huge problem for Americans in the future. I hope my concern is wrong.
I don't like it either... I didn't like Vista group as it was, with three major primer manufacturers under the control of one group. Now that group isn't even American. Too easy to take it all down with one fell swoop. Lawsuit, activist anti-gun executive sabotaging it... It's not likely to occur, but the fact that someone could, theoretically, take out that many pillars of the industry at once is a situation that should never be allowed to occur. Not to mention the more likely negatives, like having that many primer companies under the control of one group/board. They could just withhold them to drive the price up; it's not like our government will do anything to stop them.
What is this 106 ES your speaking about. I’m not familiar with
The velocity difference of each shot you make. You want to keep your ES under 50
@ thank you
Good to only 400 yards or so due to poor ES? Then there’s no reason for trying to squeeze out a couple hundred extra feet per second.
Makes me wonder if this why Hornady got shorted on RL26 from Alliant since I'm sure this has been in development for a bit.
The company that owns Alliant powder also owns Federal.
@@ReloadingWeatherbyYeah that's what I'm getting at. Just like the Federal 7 PRC ammo got box velocity or better. I agree they seen a good opportunity. Interested to see how it goes with this. I'm still kinda leaning towards 280AI for my next .284. I figured it'll be hard to get components for this cartidge at first.
Spot on !!!
Thanks for watching
6.8 Western is a better round than either
I agree with that
Great comments but caught my ear was your accurate analysis of the velocities many cartridges. The Sweet spot, and I believe that Sweet spot remains the same in a short barrel. Thus your 2,850 fps 7 PRC will likely be 2,750 with a 20” barrel, try then to push velocities back up to 2,850 out of a short barrel and your groups may widen back out and ES will likely also increase. As always Austin, excellent thoughts.
I was thinking reloading it was not going to be as easy as brass, I was figuring you’d have to have all new tools for that one case but 🤷🏻♂️
Big call. Seems like an arbitrary conclusion based on some limited data...
Appears like some are getting excellent SD/ES and accuracy during testing. Could just be cherry picked results however?
7BC targets a small niche and time will tell if it succeeds or fails. I hope it does do well because it’s nice to see progress for a change.
Allterra was the only one that showed more than a couple of groups. For the record I don't see anything wrong with this cartridge for the average hunter that doesn't reload. I think this cartridge will have success.
I think the marketing support behind Federal is much stronger than Hornady - I think this is also having some play in people's opinions when it comes to both.
At 80,000 psi I’d be very interested to see the recoil numbers for this thing. They can market it as a 7prc competitor, but I have a feeling it will recoil more like a 28 nosler.
Recoil is a factor of caliber, bullet weight, and powder charge not pressure. I would expect this to have significantly less recoil then the 7prc due to how much less powder it's using. If this is reloadable at some point in the near future, I can see this eventually killing off the 280 AI and putting a big dent in 7 Rem Mag sales. This seems like a hunters cartridge not a precision shooters cartridge especially since their using the 30-06 case essentially. If anything this will probably end up putting the 6.8 Western in it's grave as well.
@ i dont know why i keep forgetting that higher pressure doesnt mean more recoil.
Here's an old argument 308 is more inherently accurate than 30-06. Might be true in factory rifles due to loose tolerance in 30-06 but custom guns 30-06 is just as accurate.
Sounds like they were paid to give bad press. Other content creators getting sub moa.
SAMMI chamber specs for 308 and 30-06 are the same on tolerances. I really don't think Allterra was paid to crap on the 7mm Backcountry. For the record... Hornady isn't paying me to do this video.
One thing i feel they will need to do is make a factory match offering to really compete with the prc and get those spreads down across the board.
I’ve extremely doubtful that the steel alloy is so ductile that you need 12 passes to form the case, it will probably require carbide dies and more powerful presses because it has higher yield strength, but these are relatively simple engineering challenges to overcome.
I was thinking too if the case doesn't expand that much because of being alloy you might only have to neck size it
@@carlpreston1680 people already only neck size their brass for bolt action rifles, because they will always be used in the same chamber, so it’s less work on the brass. So yeah, should be exactly the same here. The 12 times to size just sounded like typical alarmist, afraid of new ideas mindset.
Let’s just see how this cartridge actually shakes out. When you said accuracy is going to be found at around 59-65k psi I’m not sure if you can call that reliable when most of the cartridge design is very different then what we have traditionally seen. I will certainly want to see the dies and reloading process before picking up a 7 BC rifle either way. That is my real concern here.
My thing is the 7mm BC is a hunting cartridge not a pension cartridge most people will shoot there game within 300 yards no one shoot past 500 on game in my opinion!! Federal will have more offerings in ammo yet, you will find one to shoot, with PRC your pretty much stuck with eldx which sucks as a hunting bullet!! And the CX in the factory doesn't really shoot well and has terrible fps, I shot 6 deer with eldx from 80 to 300 yards 28 nosler 175 gr and everyone exploded!! I would take a inch and a half group with a good bullet over a quarter inch group with a eldx cause crippling a animal with eldx is always high !! Just my opinion!!! Great video!!
Thanks for your comment
I'm thinking the .280 Ackley Improved Weatherby 307 Range XP I got coming is going to fit nicely with my .28 caliber rifles, 7mag and 28 Nosler. No need for the PRC in that caliber. The 300 PRC I have is a better choice in those Hornady chamberings.
Hmm very interesting to see
I usually shoot a .300 win mag / .308 in the MK-22 MRAD
I shoot the .300 Weatherby and I was looking into this bullet, yet as a hand loader myself. I use the 220/230 grain bullets and in quite acccurste at 1,000+
Just wonder if this type of material is too hard to reload which would cut down the needs / items needed for reloading thus cutting the amount of ammo out there. Long weird thought, but it’s just my opinion.
Really do appreciate the video review.
I think it will be difficult to reload.
@ from what you are saying which was more detailed than the other videos I researched, you’re definitely right. Looking at these rifles shooting the new 7 BC, a lot of hype just about the case. Don’t seem too accurate, but I don’t know if there are other loadings out there besides the terminal ascent
I think the case is game changing for handloaders. If everything turns out to be viable for the handloaders you could probably load it down a bit and get some and regain some consistency.
The reported accuracy isn't something I buy into with any advertisement/youtuber especially when they measure that with 3 round groups. 7-10 shot groups are much more telling and few rifles will print minute or better with that.
Listened to a podcast yesterday talking about this and that Alliance who makes RL26 is owned by the same parent company as Federal. Maybe that’s why hornady can’t get their hands on it.
Yep
I didn't know Alliance was in the same group... Now I have even more of a reason to hate "vista" and whatever the Euro version is now called.
Just saw a video on the Geissle Instagram with some 5.56 loaded in peak alloy. I assume it's coming in other calibers
Interesting...
I was listening to the Big Game Hunting podcast and he had a rep from Federal on who said modern rifle actions could handle the increased pressures because it was the case that took the pressure, not the chamber. He also said (not exactly wording) that this technology could be applied to existing cartridges. So why another new round? Maybe they had to demonstrate the tech to SAMMI and the public before applying it to existing cartridges? One would think they could have owned the market if they opened with a lineup of +p rounds using new case technology. It would have been a statement, here is the future buy Federal, our ammo is faster, more efficient and turns everything into a Magnum.😂
I watched a video so now I’m an expert.
Feel free to go talk with a local gunsmith or professional reloader. You will probably be disappointed with what they say about the 7mm Backcountry
The first video listed below said that RCBS was making dies and quite the project saying it was not feasible to reload these cases as the case is hard on the dies and wears them out fast, and you have to run the cases a lot of times through the sizing die to get it sized properly. Basically one big pain that eat dies up. So no reloader is going to do it, as it is way more time consuming and costly an endeavor. Not to mention the lack of the powder's availability. Plus accuracy is not there at the higher pressures and it needs to be slowed down to get accuracy whereby back to where the brass lives at in the first place.
This case is DOA. I give it 4 years max being there are people that will try it, but the ammo cost to much to shoot a lot so the stuff will sit on selves and once it get used up this thing will go the way of the dodo. So as to my understanding once the factories drop the cartridge from their product line, in order to continue shooting the rifles one would have to convert some brass to fit the chamber. Of which will not hold the higher pressures. Right back to where they where before having fell for a niche item. At the price of the ammo no one will be blasting away with it at the range, to the point the cartridge boxes will sit on the shelf too long for the manufactures taste, whereby they will drop it from their line of products and the 7mm Backcountry will enter the Dodo's abode.
I would not be surprised if the 7m product assembly line blows up, whereby collecting the insurance, to recoup from this debacles.
ua-cam.com/video/IZ_amvpjjQ0/v-deo.html&lc=UgzjKZE9simM6N3bySp4AaABAg.AD4n4ABya7bADGBzwI-2TM
This next video was from a Beta tester and they claim accuracy is lacking-
ua-cam.com/video/pvC-GYFE2SI/v-deo.html
Thanks for commenting
To be honest if someone just made the 7BC with brass cases (65k psi) it would make a pretty good 500 yard mountain rifle cartridge. ~ 2800 fps 175 gr loads
I personally think it's great new case technology hopefully they make it in standard cartridges.
Thanks for commenting and watching
Exactly, I'm interested to see if this new case material will be used to level up traditional cartridges in the future.
If it accurate enough for hunting, it will be a big hit because short barrels + suppressors are the future.
I think it will have success
@ it will be interesting to see if they roll out the family of cartridges.
Nailed it
I want to see these peak alloy cases for a 30-378 weatherby I think the case design is the future honestly every since the self contained cartridge came out the limiting factor has been the brass most actions can handle the pressure already the limiting factor is the brass if they can make a case the is malleable as brass but handle more pressure that’s the future as long as it’s reloadable brass will be obsolete in 10 years
Great video. I am into reloading for all my rifles. This rifle having a steel alloy case is why it can take such high pressure. I really don't think that the steel alloy case is going to be reloaded. And you are spot on if it does not have very sub-MOA it isn't worth anything for long range hunting. Not better than anything else that is out there. But someone will like it. It seems Backfire likes it. BTW I do think Reloader 16 is more available. I can buy it or have been able to. It may not be available for the bulk buy that Hornady would need. They may want to supply reloaders with it and not be filling everyone's high volume orders like Hornady would be. It may also be they don't want to supply that bulk powder to a competitor in the ammo business. Just saying. Enjoyed the video. I don't like steel cased ammo of any type, so I am out on this one. But for the guy that has a lot of money and wants another bing bang have at it. Shooting sports are one thing to one person and another to someone else. It should be fun.
Thanks for watching and commenting!
The backcountry is designed around people that hunt with suppressors and want more velocity with the shorter barrel to keep it manageable.
Yes it is. It's just not a long range precision cartridge. And for the vast majority of people that's okay.
@ReloadingWeatherby I see nothing wrong with that, most people (myself included) aren't capable of shooting past 500 yards. But a short, suppressed rifle that can easily handle elk, bear and moose is still something.
One thing I will add is that your simulation is accounting for known case volume of brass cased 280 rem/ai. Steel could change the case wall thickness which would show a pretty significant shift in case volume. Plus a blanket statement of a lack of precision due to 80k psi doesn’t seem relevant. Only time will tell I guess
I have seen some say it accurate and some reliable people love it. BTW they where the first to say its a problem for them with accuracy. Lets see what federal does and don't. I like the idea but I would not rush out and buy a new rifle. Edit maybe it's just me but I definitely don't like burning my barrels out and this rd would definitely do that or it would seem. We still should wait for it to come to market with some solid rifle options.
Thanks for watching
@@ReloadingWeatherby Your welcome!
I bought a 300 PRC. Because I think the bullets look cooler and I was in the Market for a 300 WM. Lets be real here this numbers dick measuring contest doesn't really matter except for the like .5% of shooters trying to hit things round about 1000 yards.
For the other 99.5% of people that use a rifle, most of which can't hit anything consistently at 500 yards, pretty much any caliber with enough weight and speed for filling the freezer is all that matters. Which is most of them.
Very true
Sounds like a good pistol idea.
Fantastic video. That earned you my subscription. So for a Gucci-priced ammunition that costs essentially double the cost of "regular" Federal Premium factory ammo, one still doesn't get fantastic performance out past 400 yards. Funnily enough, my sub-MOA Tikka T3x in .30-06 Sprg with factory Federal Premium Berger Hybrid Hunter 168-grain ammunition will certainly get it done inside 400 yards, accurately, for half the ammo cost, and no need to buy the latest "super-rifle". I can see some of the merits of 7PRC, but 7PRC factory ammunition literally retails in Canada for twice the price of my ammunition ($119.99 Cdn/box versus about $62/box). But, since, for ethical reasons, any hunting shot that I take will certainly be well under 400 yards, and since I don't even have convenient access to a practise range beyond 300 yards, I see no point whatsoever. If I were to take up handloading, I'd bet I could further improve on that sub-MOA accuracy and do it even more cheaply (after absorbing reloading equipment costs, of course).
Thanks for watching