Forging a Pine Cone starts with making tools
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- Опубліковано 15 тра 2024
- For the blacksmith, learning to think backwards is an important skill. If you know what you want to make working backwards through he process helps you find the starting point.
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00:00 - Think backwards
00:55 - Master shape
04:08 - Spring dies
13:16 - Bottom swage
16:51 - forging a pine cone
25:40 - Final thoughts
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#blacksmithing #forged #blacksmith
Blacksmithing and related activities can be hazardous. These videos are not a substitute for competent professional instruction. Your safety is your sole responsibility. Always use appropriate safety equipment including eye and ear protection when working in the shop. Follow manufactures safety guidelines for the use of all equipment. In the event something shown in one of these videos seems unsafe, it is up to you to make the appropriate changes to protect yourself.t yourself.
Loved the longer video. I know it takes a lot more of your time to create longer videos, but it’s greatly appreciated. Thanks John.
Agreed, love them.
If there's one thing for certain when mucking around in the shop is that a small project idea can quickly become a much bigger project once you work out you need to make tools for the job. ;-)
Every time I swear 🤣
That or a broken tap
Or a broken screw
Its kind of nice to see that even a master has bad days/mistakes in the shop, it makes me feel a little better. And of course I mean this all in good humor.
Still so jealous of that Fontanini. What a beauty.
Thanks for including so much detail on all the steps, even the mishaps!
It can be a two day video and I would still wach it. It's teaching me what I don't know and I thank you for teaching me.
You are so welcome
John, thank you so much for this very instructional video, I can see how to adapt this for making many different types of dies. The good thing is once you've made the dies you can always go back and make more of the piece you needed if later you or someone else needs them.
The part you said about not getting frustrated when things go wrong is so true in everything we do. Who knew you gave basic life lessons as well as blacksmithing lessons?
Thanks for all the great information you provide, keep up the great work and here's wishing you and your family a truly wonderful new year!
John V.
Timberine Lodge is incredible! I had no idea how much ironwork was there before we visited. I was blown away, and definitely took a lot of pictures for references later on.
thank you all yt mebers and patrion
You are my inspiration for blacksmithing, thank you so much for sharing your experience with your watchers.
Blacksmithing never ceases to amaze me. We have tools that make tools to use on tools to make a tool lol
Thanks for letting us tag along as you develop the tools and means of forging a new piece John. It’s like having a mentor. One of your best videos yet!
Thanks John. It's very instructive to see how you work through a process, mistakes and all. It's also a bit overwhelming to a very amateur smith like myself who doesn't have all the tools - just tapering a hardy tenon or isolating a mass on the end of a 1" bar is a lot of work by hand!
Very nice Iron work touch for the home. Well done.
Watched the whole thing and enjoyed all of it
Great work, John. Happy 2024 🙂
Everything that doesnt go the way you thought it would is a learning experience in how not to do it next time.
That was a lot of pinecone grinding ...who new those things were so hard 😅
Thankyou for sharing its a great way to teach the timeline involved in reaching the goal
Luckily the ones made using the dies won’t require much grinding.
@@BlackBearForge good stuff ....and that's why we make dies in the first place. It's one of the big advantages of metalworking over wood, it's often much easier to make another one the same or near enough the same
I have lived most of my life in the north west and timberline lodge has always been a magical place for me as a kid and as an adult. Thank you
Believe me, it is our pleasure and our benefit to have the content you share. Thank you.
Nice video John, I liked the way it was shot with minimal to no talking during the making.
My projects like this involve a dozen side projects.
Been to timberline Lodge many times when I was younger, always liked at the wood work and framing though. That's a big building made without bolts or nails from what I remember. Gonna have to go back one of these days and look at the iron.
We visited Timberline to see the iron. No welding, all art deco 1930s iron work. While I will NEVER make an andiron from a solid 100+ lbs rail, the gates, fittings & details inspire new work. Keep it coming John! Thx
Thanks, this is the video I've needed. I've been trying to figure out how to make a ball sweg. I want to add a ball to the end of the tongs I make. My biggest setback, no power hammer no press. I wasn't sure if the master ball shape needed to be heat treated. Now I know, thanks. I really appreciate your videos they save me a lot of questions.
Glad it helped
really enjoyed watching you show your skills. this is not an instructional for beginners , but its what beginners need to see to encourage development towards higher skills. Happy New Year , stay warm.
Loved it. Thank you John.
It's nice to watch! more Health to the master!!! Thanks! Greetings from Russia!
Outstanding craftsmanship!!!
Always enjoy watching you create , planning out every step is a art some people don't do or as i prefer to say is follow the six P method
I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and experience. You're a very skilled blacksmith, and it shows.
Thanks for watching
Thanks for another great video. Love the content you have been coming out with. Would love to see more historic blacksmithing videos as well showing work that would have been happening at the anvil 150 years ago. Maybe a Lewis and Clark themed video ? They brought a blacksmith with them !
Been a huge fan of the channel for a while, and one of the things I admire the most about your videos is your humility. You're not only fine with showing failures, you're happy to talk about them. I'm sure all of us blacksmiths know how quickly things can go pear-shaped and how frustrating it can be, and I think it's good that we can share those experiences and learn from them.
I just started working out of a coal forge more frequently after moving shops, and just as I was starting to get comfortable with using one again, I was humbled in under a minute. I had been making a meat-flipping fork, and as I was finishing up the tines, I thought I had enough times to run and grab my bending tongs... I was wrong! They weren't in the place I thought they were, and in my search for them, one of the tines had burned half way and completely ruined the piece I had spent the better part of an hour working on. I simply looked at it, set it down, and turned off the fire with the intention of coming back later.
After a failure like that, there's simply nothing you can do short of welding on a new tine or starting over. It's good to embrace your failures and learn from them in the future. Next time I need a pair of tongs, I'm going to have them ready BEFORE putting my piece in the fire! Great vid as always John :)
I've been to Timberline a number of times. The last time I went was after attending a demo by Daryl Nelson where he talked about the iron work at Timberline. As he explained it the style was unique because it was done by industrial smiths from the shipyards as part of a WPA project to build Timberline. The lodge itself has interesting history. My father in law talks about how it turned into a house of rather low repute during the 1950's and 60's.
Thanks for the video John, i'm looking forward to seeing how the project turns out!
You and me both!
my blacksmithing hero!! thank you sir!! Gracias por tanto y perdon por tan poco, abrazos desde Argentina.
Thanks for this video. I really enjoyed it.
Wow what a great video, thanks!!!
Very nice and informative video. Best of this year😉. Thank you John!
Love seeing the main shop again I've missed seeing you work in there
Happy New Year to you and yours!
Cheers John that was a good vid.
I truly love the video and the fact that you share everything including when things don't work out as planned thanks for letting us see everything
Nice job.
Thank you for making yet another educational and inspirational video!
Incredibly educational video as usual, thank you!!
Excellent video as always. Great advice about thinking backwards, and it's a concept that applies to so many problems we face in life.
thanks for your video. It is an intensive process. And then also filming. The result is beautiful.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thanks again, another terrific video. Wishing you and yours a safe, happy, healthy, and prosperous New Year.
Great work as always. The project finished is beautiful 👏👏
Pulled the second attempt out of the spring die and I thought it could be used as an acorn as well.
Merry Christmas thank you for the video and I really like it...🎅
Wonderful project as always!😊
You inspired so many of us to pick up a hammer and smash some steel, in your videos you explain step by step with a lot of patience the techniques. Thank you very much John for your videos! You are a great teacher and an inspiration for us hobbyist blacksmiths!
Have a wonerful and prosperous new year! All the best to you!😊🙏🏻
Fascinating video John! Thank you for sharing. Really put things into perspective for me and I’m sure others.
Wonderful video and full of useful information, I like the longer shows(but I know that is a tremendous amount of work on your end!). Thank you!
Ohhh! Thanks for the video!
Hope you enjoyed it!
Nice work and great video. Thanks John.my shop will never have the capability of doing that but love the knowledge you give
Great video, good to see the process needed to find the best way to the end result, most people have no idea the amount of work that has to be done to make it happen , thank you.
Your press reminds me of the old AMKUS jaws units that you had to wait on that second stage to kick in before you would get a full cut.
Wonderful video! Really lovely and inspiring.
I personally loved the longer pine cones... very elegant looking...
Thanks John for sharing and for All your videos very good info again thanks for sharing God bless you all ✝️ stay safe out there
Thanks for the excellent video! It was really enjoyable to watch this process start to finish and to see all the different tools and equipment you used to make it! Special shout out to the hydraulic press! I don't know why, but they have a special place in my heart. Keep up the great work!
I just realized I don’t even know your first name yet though I’ve been watching your videos for a few years now.😅 Anyway I was wondering if you could do a video or two on how to make an arrow head and or a spear head. I would love to be able to make my own arrowheads. Love your videos by the way. 😁👍🏽
Thank you for sharing. Have a great 2024 and stay safe.🙂🙂
Thanks John. Happy New Year to you both.Always enjoyable watching your videos, thanks
Happy new year!
Another great and useful video John. Lots of useful information for joy only blacksmithing! Thanks for the longer video and all of your great content!
Glad you enjoyed it
Existe algo místico em trabalhar o metal quente e é sempre um prazer assistir esse trabalho. Obrigado por mostrar!
Good morning John. That's some awesome work you did in this video. Very interesting to watch such Craftsmanship and you presented it so well. Thanks for sharing with us. Stay safe up there and keep up the great videos. Fred.
Thanks 👍
I’m guessing that with a little more precision is the way bullet molds we’re made back then. Nowadays a exact replica of a bullet is machined on a lathe then flutes are cut into it with a milling machine. Then it’s heat treated and made into a cutter; two blocks are simultaneously squeezed on each side of the rotating cutter to produce an exact mold. It’s fascinating how things were produced back then and how things progressed to nowadays.
They were typically cut with a ball shaped cutter called a cherry.
John, very helpful video, as usual. Could you please comment on why you use the press over the power hammer and vice-versa?
In this case I wanted to make sure the master shape didn't jump or bounce leaving a double impression
Great Wolf! Congratulations. Did you put it on a scale?
This is exactly what I was talking about with regards to showing more complex projects. Great work!
Side note: now that you’ve had it awhile, how are you liking that kanca post vice? May be in the market for an upgrade myself soon, and would prefer to buy new vs antique.
So far I have been happy with it
John, can you show me how to make these with only a clay Spencer treaddel hammer?
👍
As usual John, great video.
Just one question: Why not start out with a round rod for the pine cone instead of square stock? Just curious.
The final projects will be square bar, so thats what the finial will be out of. Otherwise I would have the added step of forge welding the finial onto the bar
When you're forging the cone in the last section you hang a weight on the stock before going in to put the grooves on, is the weight to keep it from bouncing with each strike?
I have an armoring anvil used to form pauldrons for armor I will use I just don't know how to attach it to my anvil stand
Yes, the whole making a tool in order to make a tool in order to make a thing. I go through that all the time. Out of curiosity, I know you used tool steel for the bottom swage but in the Mark Aspery books he shows making a similar swage but he uses mild steel and then says to case harden it. I know the stuff he uses for case hardening is basically toxic, but there's a newer version of that called Cherry Red Case Hardening Compound that's supposed to do the same thing but without the cyanide gas. Have you ever tried that stuff or case hardening in general for tools like this?
I haven't done much case hardening
Cyanide hasn't been used for case hardening for decades. Mark shows using Kasenit for case hardening which contained no cyanide it is no longer made. The Cherry red compound you mention is basically the same as Kasenite.
Did you get a new gas forge or did I miss that video? What brand is it?
Its been a while - ua-cam.com/video/b6Td3jvizGc/v-deo.htmlsi=XJFPzWt25csxzfzA
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Just saw this on the pine cone, would not a shallow v chisel be closer to the scales on the pine cone than a rounded one?
Possibly. I think a criss cross with a straight chisel might also look good
How would you add the chisel marks into the swage
I don't think it would be practical. The stock needs to be rotated to keep the forging even and any chisel marks in the die would line up as you turned the material
That is true didn’t think about that. Trying to get a feather die set made for the power hammer
Where do you find 1.25” 5160? I have been trying to find stock big enough to make a hammer
www.jasonalonontoolmaker.com/steel-sales/p/5160-1-14-round
@@BlackBearForge thank you 🙏
I have a hard time filing stuff that I need to be round. Is there a simply way to file round objects like a punch?
Lots of practice. A grinder does make life a bit easier
I didn't think about using grinder I figured it would put more flat spots on it. I made a hot chisel and a 1/4" punch out of 5/8 spring got a beautiful taper but after square, octagon, then round it turned our more oval then round I'm guessing my square was more rectangle lol. So I have been hand sanding for hours because the file was making it more oval/octagon
Been watching your videos for about year and a half. Only been smithing on weekends for last 2 or 3 months. You have enspired me to get off my butt on my days off and stay busy in my shop thanks!
Edit: when you said grinder I was thinking an angle grinder with flap disc.
👍✌️⚒️
why would you not just hot rasp the top? making so much dust grinding
Man, make me your student please
What rpm motor is on your press? Yours is to slow and mine can be to fast if not careful with the pedal🤦♂️ The 2 stage on mine isn’t noticeable but it has a 3500rpm motor also. Not sure if that’s the difference or not but it’s possible.
this is a 1750 2 hp motor. I would need to use a 5 hp motor to run at 3500
Surprised me, as you formed the spring dye, you didn't spin the plug, but, when you used the dye to form the "pinecone", you did spin it.
The master used to make the dies does’t really need to be turned since it’s already symmetrical.
Why does the press seem to hesitate before it starts to put the hard squeeze on things? 👍🍻
It has a two stage pump and it has to build pressure as it switches to the second stage
@@BlackBearForge Got it. Thanks!
This doesn't pertain to this video. I've watched all of you're forge welding videos, but I'm not quite getting it. I'm heating the pieces slowly; to a red for a couple minutes, then I turn the gas up to an orange, then to almost yellow, then a bright yellow lemon almost turning white. I get an initial weld, brush and flux then back to the heat. I repeat that multiple times slowly working up the piece, but I can't seem to get more than about 1" of weld on what needs to be about 3" before it starts trying to pull itself apart as I'm working up it. If it helps to know I'm trying to faggot weld three pieces of rebar together to make a bending fork for the hardy hole and I'm using borax for flux. Any advice would be appreciated.
Guy sounds just like ron swanson
Could you make a hammer?
Here is one of several videos on making a hammer - ua-cam.com/video/Ct3bN0PHUSQ/v-deo.html&pp=ygUXYmxhY2sgYmVhciBmb3JnZSBoYW1tZXI%3D
Hi I’m actually a blacksmith to I’m 12 years old and my businesses name is is isaacson forge. I love watching your videos
My
SOME PROFESSIONAL ADVICE. I have watched 3 or 4 of your videos and find you Very knowledgeable and a quite pleasnt demeanor. You are an Excellent Instructor.
The advice presented is from my career as a Certified Welding Inspector since 1986.
At 3:38, you post the wrong order of events/procedure (twice in this video) by "Tack, Preheat, then Weld". PREHEAT FIRST!!! Then Tack, (maintain interpass temperature of 400*F for 4140) , then weld away.
MANY so called professional welders (and most beginners) make this same error of sequences. I get to make them cut it apart and reweld it the correct way.
Here's why... preheat is for reduction of thermal shock from the intense heat of the arc and (in this case a tackweld) and liquid weld metal deposit onto the cold base metal. The rapid cooling can cause stresses and cracking is often the result. Sometimes in the weld and sometimes Underneath the weld. 4140 is an HSLA (high strength low alloy) steel and needs to let the heat disperse slowly and evenly. Hope this helps you in the future and your viewers. to let the heat disperse slowly and evenly.
Should have turned it into a morel mushroom at the one point. Great vid
Seeing other possibilities in a project is a great way to stretch your imagination.