Honestly, if you're dead set on working with or serving a demon lord, Dagon seems like one of the better options. While he certainly has an agenda, he at least is less inclined to capricious bouts of violence against his minions than most demons.
@@KyleJordanGamingI mean I always saw that as a more tense relationship. The aspects of undeath that Orcus values are all about the stagnation and degradation. Litches and similar intelligent undead are just more useful than living servants in reaching the goal of spreading his undead curse across all the realms. They aren't the ideal, they are an unavoidable imperfection.
I believe that Bilbdoolpoolp, is actually D&D's equivalent of Lovecraft's Hydra. Hydra is the mother goddess of the Deep Ones, which Kuo Toa are based on. The relationship between Hydra and Dagon is that of ancient parents of the aquatic depths with Dagon being the father and Hydra being the mother. Usually worshipping one or the other deity, results in worshipping of both deities in the Lovecraft universe. I would not be surprised that Dagon and Bilbdoopoolp share a similar bond in the D&D universe.
fun fact: the actual historical dagon was originally thought to have been a fish god due to similarities between his name and an old hebrew world for fish, but that is now thought to have been a linguistic coincidence, since we now have evidence that he was actually an agricultural deity.
I've never been satisfied with that. I don't see why the Philistines couldn't have an agricultural god that was also a fish. They were a coastal society, and there's similar precedent in Egypt with Sobek, a crocodile, as a god of fertility and crops.
"I am writing this under an appreciable mental strain, since by tonight I shall be no more. Penniless, and at the end of my supply of the drug which alone makes life endurable, I can bear the torture no longer; and shall cast myself from this garret window into the squalid street below. Do not think from my slavery to morphine that I am a weakling or a degenerate. When you have read these hastily scrawled pages you may guess, though never fully realize, why it is that I must have forgetfulness or death." That is what any encounter with Dagon should end in. great video AJ, Keep it up!
AJ Pickett have you considered doing an episode on some of the many weapon and item materials and there effects? Such as Mithral, adamantine, cold iron, astral driftwood, dragon hide, etc.
Interesting to see Dagon is not a “Destroy all creation because I hate it” sort. The long term planning and waiting seems to fit a lot with the Lovecraftian side of things from all I’ve heard and the Obereth. Definitely still an evil and brilliant being that you would never want to meet. Really enjoy these videos on individual beings in D&D!
sanddry well he's more like. Hey this sea is nice. I like this vast quantity of fluid. In fact I like this vast quantity of fluid so much I want the beings who spurned it to prove they deserve to come back to it.
This is another awesome one AJ! I've always found Dagon to be of interest, more as he pertains to Lovecraft's Cthulul mythos, rather than real world mythology. He is actually a part of real world demonolgy, another old god cast to the rank of demon! Which isn't all that suprising since so many cultures saw their gods converted to either demons or saints once the monotheists came to their lands. After hearing your video, I think that his D&D portrayal is the most interesting, to me personally.
Dagon actually comes from the sumeric God Dagān, who also was a God of the Sea and Weahter. Lovecraft invented alot of Gods, but Dagon was not one of them.
@Huginn Bodgaedir yes, it's pretty clear that Lovecraft took the Idea of Dagon from the sumeric Religion. H. P. was heavily influenced by Arabic Folktales and would probably have read about Dagon somewhere in there.
Dagon, Tsothagua, Kua Toa (deep ones), illithid (Star spawn of kthulu), gibbering mouthers (shoggoth), who'd I miss on my D&D list of lovecraftian monsters?
Thanks for the video, its great refrence. Ive been trying to play a Knowledge Cleric or Divination Wizard of Dagon for awhile now in Adventures League and this gave me some new ideas
We recently had to fight an aspect of this guy that was summoned by a bullywug priest. Except it was a really shitty aspect that statistically was apparently just a reskinned froghemoth, but look, the priest was doing his best.
eh, can't blame the poor guy, the bullywug are degenerating as a people over time, much like their evil frog god, how us barely holding onto existence do to all their prayers and constantly sleeping rather than doing anything
Hard to believe anyone can live a peaceful life in d&d. Anyways, I don't want advertise anything but there's this little app called iLovecraft where they visually display the dagon story quite well. Thought you might be interested. Actually some of your pictures come from it if my memory is correct
You are in the city of doors You go to wash your face off after running from a guard maybe you color sprayed them Suddenly as you push your face into a nearby barrel of water you peek just for a moment as the cold grabs your skin making you exhale Far far away deep down you see a sunken city on a throne you swear sits a massive squid or some unknown horror it stares back at you as this happens you feel the panic of drowning the burning in your lungs and a hand pull you out a large minotuar pissed off you just dunked your head in his salt water he was saving to make pickles begins to yell at you but stops as you shake and cry uncontrollably be careful where you go in the city of doors be careful which puddle you step in
Well he certainly brings to mind of the Lovecraft incarnation, although I previously thought of Kuo-toa as a bit of deep one's. Although in D&D he is as you said a demon lord, rather than Great Old One, that is the more Lovecraft pick, such as Great Cthulhu. I was just recently looking up Merrow, and apparently they were merfolk altered by the abyss, could there be any connection there? Actually, the MM mention Demogorgon, who as you mentioned is in a sort of ally to Dagon. Sounds like a story there. And my knowledge of humanoids transformed into sea creatures, is the Deep Scion, Sea Spawn, and maybe the Kraken priest. They would probably be thrall of his followers, right? Which I guess makes him terrifying among other demon cults. And I was totally not long ago thinking of ideas of a Shadow out of Innsmouth story.
Whatever you do, don't eat the fish pies. I just finished a first draft of land economics. And I was just now trying to get a feel of the economies of sea races, so was just trying to figure out what trade with sea folk is possible. And what the different groups want.
I would love to see a shalaran lore video, or even an aquatic races lore series. The deep sea fascinates and terrifies me, and I would never want to be an aquatic humanoid IRL but I would gladly roleplay one
Not sure if you check these old videos, but do you think Dragon would ever have Tieflings? kinda like the Lovecraft innsmouth or for some dark purpose that his machinations hope to bring to reality? what do you think their subtype abilities would be?
Dagon really needs some better recruiting practices. Insanity doesn't entice people into an underwater cathedral. Just hand out lanyards, and everyone will be back into the sea in no time.
Awesome video! Have you done anything on Lord Soth and/or Ravenloft? That's what got me into DnD back in the day. Many good men met a twisted and horrible fate inside the mists of Ravenloft.
DeangeloIDK Dagon is not a monster he is as far removed from them as the highest of divine are removed from your player character he's not a monster he's more like an idea a concept
I just watched it, and yes, that is a really good movie! By about half way I wanted to find somewhere dry and warm.. and the chanting, the sudden silences, it is a spooky story done very well.
It is possible. But Dagon is not unlike an alien god. He has that kind of ability to perceive and move. Facing him would just be an aspect. He would be weakened by the defeat but in the same way you would feel weak and disoriented by a really bad nightmare. Even then you gotta ask how many such nightmares has he endured, and how many can you?
Maybe 🤔 But Dagon would also have competition of obtaining Aboleth worshipers from Demogorgon As most of the followers for Demogorgon are aquatic creatures
Maybe, maybe not. Those two actually seem to cooperate fairly well for ego driven horrors. Despite they both have the significant number of their followers under water they do not seem to be all that jealous of this overlaping of spheres. One can only guess they have some kind of understanding that allows them to be something close to allies. Obviously still demon lords so they won't sacrifice their own interests for each other. But they are something of an oddity. Two powerful demonlords who are not actively sizing up each other's domains.
@@jacobfreeman5444 Dagon works as an oracle for Demogorgon. My guess is that while the demon lords themselves might not have beef with each other and have similar end goals, I'm sure there are a few points of contention between the three of them (Dagon and both of Demogorgon's heads)
@@litchqueenasenath5995 I would see the heads are less seperate entities and more disassociative outlooks of the same entity. The fractured self is lost and cannot find itself despite seeing itself. Who knows what Demogorgon would become if he could reconcile himself with his mirror image. Maybe a god.
@@digunder14 Given Dagon's approach to Demogorgon, I suspect he is a smooth operator type that would try to placate Umberlee. But you're right. That would be like walking the mother of all minefields.
Did you write it? Please let me know! I am adding it to my collection of quality poems for my younger students to read to practice their fluency and expression and I would like to accredit it rather than have written as author unknown.
I think a fun game idea for D&D would be your in a port town and you overhear strange happenings things like a old rotted pirate ship and you fight Davey johns and his fishmen crew along with the kraken but in the end you either have to fight and beat dagon who was using them to control that territory or banish him
AJ Pickett you see, I remember this canpaign against Dagon in an underwater setting, and an NPC was an angel disguised as some type of merfolk (at the time I still thought of tritons and mermaids), and when it actually showed itself it was rather weird to see this white-winged humanoid swimming around (he died rather horribly).
I'm DMing a game where they are about to make it to the boss Abolith and had named the guy Dagon already. I know I can play it however, but is there any link with Aboliths and Dagon the demon lord. Aboliths arnt really the same thing as Obyrith/ Demons right?
Aboleth are some of the first living creatures to exist, the Obyrith are completely different, and no, there is no real relationship between the two. Aboleth, like Dagon, seek to rule the ocean and keep all creatures in their own domain. They don't want to 'evolve', as they consider their form to be perfect, just how it is.
I could see an aboleth performing a false flag on their enemies. If they think they're fighting Dagon itself they'll be on the back foot. If they never see the creature they might blame Dagon instead of an aboleth making their victory all the sweeter.
In a previous video you mentioned how some of the ancient aboleths are almost godlike in power, Shame they havent flushed out the underwater conflicts that must occur between dagon and aboleths as they vie for control of the depths
It seems that Dagon and the other lords of the deep are dormant for long periods of time, so, perhaps the Aboleth just get up to no good while the old ones sleep, and scatter for safety when they rouse.
I've been wondering how does all this lore get established is a process required with like certain writers or can you write some cool concepts or draw some crazy creature with a name and it's abilities and the d&d community somehow make it canon or do you write to a magazine or something ?
Dragon magazine, Dungeons magazine, official sourcebooks, and novels endorsed by Wizards of the Coast. At this point, I'd accept Tome of Beasts creatures from Kobold Press as like, a present-day Fiend Folio. Also, adventure league material is offical lore. Things that happen in video games endorsed by Wizards of the Coast are official lore as well, unless contradicted by sourcebooks (sourcebooks can also contradict material from novels)
Technically, you can just write some cool concepts or draw crazy creatures and Wizards of the Coast might decide to make it ‘Official Lore’ by *stealing* it. So there’s that.
Water daddy. Hahaha. So named cause being a charismatic sorcerer anti hero. I decided to tell the rest of the table I'd seduce the next next monster our party faced as a joke. And the DM took that as a personal challenge not expecting I did also. Turns out you can seduce a demon lord through thier aspect. My sorcerer has the dubious honor of rolling three nat 20s in a row and the much more dubious honor of being abducted mid campaign and never seen again until very late into epic.
In actual history the fish god Dagon from the Babalonian Mysteries Religions (modern freemasonry york,scottish rites) had hats called a mitre that their high priests wore are absolute duplicates of the ones the Catholic popes wear! True story!
@@DCdabest I've forgotten more about Freemasonry,the Knights of Malta as well as the Rosicrucians than you'll ever know sonny.......and i'm NOT your mate bud!
"He's an Oberyth demon lord..." >goes on to literally describe what can only be a deity. I guess the distinction seems really fuzzy to me? Would that be a good video topic, in itself, I wonder?
@@AJPickett Aah. I'll try and find it then. Does it go into the distinction between the modt powerful demons/devils etc and actual deities? Sorry people are being twerps there.
Dieties (the original ones) have very different origin to demon lords. Ofc. "anyone" can attain a divine portfolio, and gain divinity in this sense (see guys like Vecna for reference). In terms of powers there is little difference between divines, or a demonlord holding a divine portfolio.
Demon lords are almost like Gods in every aspect, their origin being very different though. Oberyth demon lords are even more powerful : they had to reform after passing in our reality,with thousands of lesser entities continuously grasping,biting, tearing at their very being in a desperate attempt to maintain or regain a physical form. Then they had to fight against the primordials first, the tanari later just to keep existing. The fact Dagon is still standing is testament to its incredible power.
Dagon is trans-dimensional, he could be temporarily removed from the world/dimension of Toril, but he would simply slither back in from a parallel dimension, shortly after, or perhaps before he was about to be destroyed (since dimensions don't need to line up, temporally, case and point, the Feywild). The crystal sphere boundary exists as far away from the outermost planet of a stellar system, as the outmost planet exists from the system's central star (or however the system is arranged, not all of them are star systems), so, it is a very large sphere, and yes, there are spheres for Toril, Greyhawk, Krynn, Athas, Mystara, etc.
AJ Pickett but what are the stars that humans on Toril see in the night sky? I mean simple, non transdimensional humans. And, do they know what the stars are ? I'm starting to doubt there should be stars in the sky of Toril at all. Maybe they should just be seeing the reflected light on the few planets inside the sphere and that should be it for the night sky.
With Dagon it's hard to say, he's been around so long he might be from an entirely different event in a now replaced timeline. The multiverse is littered with the refugees of temporal paradoxes
So Captain Foster's is a Scion of Dagon? You had no way of knowing this obviously as you made the video years ago but I am working my way through the audiobook of the final book of the key of stars so that was something of a minor spoiler for me I'm about 3/4 of the way through the book all that being said that's my fault for clicking on this video again rather than just finishing the audiobook all of that said I really might consider incorporating more of the four e lore into some of my own stories
Fistimus Maximus "We must!... ... ... Let. Them. Fight?!?!" 🤓🙏😵🐙⚔🦑💪🌍👑 *had too much fun watching godzilla king of monsters* "Who are we!?!?... To decide... The legitimacy... Of the gods!?!?!?!?" *starts cheering on dagon*
How do non-deities grant spells? I thought that was a special power of gods, and other unique superbeings, like the Dragon Kings, in worlds where there aren't deities. I wonder if Dagon might have servants who can do something similar to the Aboleth, and force others to be aquatic? I know Fiends often like to offer choice, so they can tempt, but a forced ability like this could still be cool.
Warlocks do not need faith to use their powers. It is more of a business contract. Clerics feed their patron faith, which has power. So the bond is stronger and allows greater growth. Paladins kinda tap into that too but the bond is formed on a soul bond vow. I guess you can say the gods let paladins touch a bit of the faith power since the contract is based on a strict code. So more or less self regulating. The magic they draw on will retract when they fail to uphold their side of things. So warlock bonds are usually the weakest and most easily severed. A mere trickle of power. But I suppose any being of demigod or higher power can bestow power on another being and decide what kind of bond they wish to sponsor.
Wait a minute. Talking about boundaries between gods? What does that mean? It there some kind of consequence for them to screw with each other on the huge scale or is it just a huge gentleman's agreement?
Ao cannot do anything about the actual power of a god that is not purely local to (at most) Realmspace. Any god with a presence in multiple spheres, such as Lolth, or the elemental deities, or even the entire Mulhorandi pantheon, is constrained by Ao's rules only as far as their interaction with Faerun goes.
The gods can't destroy the spheres, nobody knows where they came from and for all intents and purposes, they are indestructible (though, there are exceptions to even that rule). The Abyss is multidimensional, so, it is all over the place, and no, I don't think destroying realmspace would kill Ao, he is just.. I guess you could say he is assigned there.
Ao is the boss of that sphere. That is all there is to it. It take another with similar or superior authority to perform a feat like killing him...and I suspect all such are part of some agreement that binds them to non-interference. So long the rules are kept the Overgod and over crowd don't care. That said the actual rules can be...murky. And mortals not exactly beholden to the same set as gods. So...lets say...you had a devious god work on a scheme for eons to get mortals to put the right series of rituals in place that would allow a temporary suspension of said rules for that god...it doesn't even have to go right. Perhaps it having a critical fail is part of the storyline and now somethimg even worse is about to be unleashed. Like Tharizdun. Or accidentally dumping the Dawn War on the planet. Ect. You get the idea.
5:22 What's that race again? I'm always looking for new fishpeople. My first ever player character was a sahuagin. 😀 EDIT: Sh- Shelaren? Searches yield nothing (except for, surprisingly, porn stars 😅).
.... perhaps I did not make it very clear. He corrupted and destroyed the civilization of an entire ocean, the transplantation of one sea into another caused massive devastation and he turned the people who he damned near annihilated, into his simpering minions. If it was not such a bothersome task, he would simply flood the entire surface of Toril and destroy all life on the land. He is not, a nice, thing. :)
Not really as much of HP Lovecraft is over 100 years old now and Lovecraft himself died pretty young so yeah nearly everything that he published in the 1910s - 1920s is either in the public domain or is about to enter the public domain
@@rejvaik00Theft may have been the wrong word, but the overall theme did come from Lovecraft. I remember seeing Dagon in the 4e MM and it looked almost exactly like the Dagon from the film, Dagon. Homage is fine, but the look should have been changed enough to make it their own.
demogorgon is not even friend with himself. idea, cult of demogorgon finds a artifact of love and will give it to their lord so his two heads stopp trying to kill each other and instead will marry each other. adventurers must break them up
Well, Demogorgon is the Prince of demons. So most are wise to play nice with him. But Dagon is the true demon lord of the depths. It is only because of their amicable relationship that Demogorgon can expand his reach to the oceans. No doubt Dagon is more than strong enough to stop that if it suited him. It is just too profitable for Dagon to be buddy buddy with Demogorgon is all. After all who is gonna say no to Dagon's interests, which scorn dry land, with Demogorgon looming in the background?
well last i checked, dagon is the one manipulating demogorgon a lot of the time and they have an alliance of sorts, dagon secretly whispering things into the ears of one of demogorgon's heads
Honestly, if you're dead set on working with or serving a demon lord, Dagon seems like one of the better options. While he certainly has an agenda, he at least is less inclined to capricious bouts of violence against his minions than most demons.
But if you’re *undead* set on serving a demon lord, go with Orcus.
@@KyleJordanGamingI mean I always saw that as a more tense relationship. The aspects of undeath that Orcus values are all about the stagnation and degradation.
Litches and similar intelligent undead are just more useful than living servants in reaching the goal of spreading his undead curse across all the realms. They aren't the ideal, they are an unavoidable imperfection.
I believe that Bilbdoolpoolp, is actually D&D's equivalent of Lovecraft's Hydra. Hydra is the mother goddess of the Deep Ones, which Kuo Toa are based on. The relationship between Hydra and Dagon is that of ancient parents of the aquatic depths with Dagon being the father and Hydra being the mother. Usually worshipping one or the other deity, results in worshipping of both deities in the Lovecraft universe. I would not be surprised that Dagon and Bilbdoopoolp share a similar bond in the D&D universe.
fun fact: the actual historical dagon was originally thought to have been a fish god due to similarities between his name and an old hebrew world for fish, but that is now thought to have been a linguistic coincidence, since we now have evidence that he was actually an agricultural deity.
I've never been satisfied with that. I don't see why the Philistines couldn't have an agricultural god that was also a fish. They were a coastal society, and there's similar precedent in Egypt with Sobek, a crocodile, as a god of fertility and crops.
Dagon to the first animal that left the sea: "..... OH, What?! The sea isn't good enough for you?!?!"
"I am writing this under an appreciable mental strain, since by tonight I shall be no more. Penniless, and at the end of my supply of the drug which alone makes life endurable, I can bear the torture no longer; and shall cast myself from this garret window into the squalid street below. Do not think from my slavery to morphine that I am a weakling or a degenerate. When you have read these hastily scrawled pages you may guess, though never fully realize, why it is that I must have forgetfulness or death."
That is what any encounter with Dagon should end in.
great video AJ, Keep it up!
AJ Pickett have you considered doing an episode on some of the many weapon and item materials and there effects? Such as Mithral, adamantine, cold iron, astral driftwood, dragon hide, etc.
Cody Chavez oh my Gods, PLEASE YES!
Good idea Cody, thanks :)
Interesting to see Dagon is not a “Destroy all creation because I hate it” sort. The long term planning and waiting seems to fit a lot with the Lovecraftian side of things from all I’ve heard and the Obereth. Definitely still an evil and brilliant being that you would never want to meet. Really enjoy these videos on individual beings in D&D!
sanddry well he's more like. Hey this sea is nice. I like this vast quantity of fluid. In fact I like this vast quantity of fluid so much I want the beings who spurned it to prove they deserve to come back to it.
_Captain Dagon, He's our Hero!_
_Gonna take pollution down to zero!_
Key of Stars, reading that series, is what cemented my interest in the Far Realm. It also showed more feywild politics than I expected to see
Lovecraft created some truly amazing monsters in his stories.Great video.
Dragon wasn’t originally from lovecraft
This is another awesome one AJ! I've always found Dagon to be of interest, more as he pertains to Lovecraft's Cthulul mythos, rather than real world mythology. He is actually a part of real world demonolgy, another old god cast to the rank of demon! Which isn't all that suprising since so many cultures saw their gods converted to either demons or saints once the monotheists came to their lands. After hearing your video, I think that his D&D portrayal is the most interesting, to me personally.
The term for Lovecraft's mythos is yoggsothathery
Dagon actually comes from the sumeric God Dagān, who also was a God of the Sea and Weahter. Lovecraft invented alot of Gods, but Dagon was not one of them.
@Huginn Bodgaedir yes, it's pretty clear that Lovecraft took the Idea of Dagon from the sumeric Religion. H. P. was heavily influenced by Arabic Folktales and would probably have read about Dagon somewhere in there.
I've always found ancient evils that are incomprehensible to the mortal mind a lot more interesting than any other type of evil.
my favorite demon lord :) thanks AJ
Dagon, Tsothagua, Kua Toa (deep ones), illithid (Star spawn of kthulu), gibbering mouthers (shoggoth), who'd I miss on my D&D list of lovecraftian monsters?
Shoggoth you say? Well, I have good news for you this week :)
DDAAGGOONNN ALL HAIL THE LORD OF THE DEPTHS! THE SPREADER OF MADDNESS AND THE PRINCE OF THE DEEP!!
You know, Dagon actually seems pretty mellow by Obiryth standards.
Well, the deep ocean is very chill.
AJ Pickett
I think that might speak more to the horror that is the other Obyrith than the chillness of the ocean.
You know Dagon is not to be messed with when even Demogorgon respects him.
Someone should commission you to write a movie script for the lords of ruin. Ten part series if it's a hit.
Track now playing: Go Into The Water - Dethklok
great song
“This one’s called ‘Murmaider’! It’s about Mermaid Murder!” - Dagon, probably
Thanks for the video, its great refrence. Ive been trying to play a Knowledge Cleric or Divination Wizard of Dagon for awhile now in Adventures League and this gave me some new ideas
AJ that intro is so camp its off the chart.... love it ....AND THEN THE LIGHTNING HITS!!!!!!.... oh and THEN you started rhyming -
We recently had to fight an aspect of this guy that was summoned by a bullywug priest. Except it was a really shitty aspect that statistically was apparently just a reskinned froghemoth, but look, the priest was doing his best.
eh, can't blame the poor guy, the bullywug are degenerating as a people over time, much like their evil frog god, how us barely holding onto existence do to all their prayers and constantly sleeping rather than doing anything
Hard to believe anyone can live a peaceful life in d&d.
Anyways, I don't want advertise anything but there's this little app called iLovecraft where they visually display the dagon story quite well. Thought you might be interested. Actually some of your pictures come from it if my memory is correct
It's fine as long as you aren't the innkeeper's daughter.
Yeah, why aren't people living behind 60 meter high walls? (Attack on Titan reference).
Because of wizards with legions of exploding zombies and teleport spells, that's why.
Thomas Rush Pretty much. If you are a commoner in D&D and someone wants to ruin your day, they can and inevitably will.
You are in the city of doors
You go to wash your face off after running from a guard maybe you color sprayed them
Suddenly as you push your face into a nearby barrel of water you peek just for a moment as the cold grabs your skin making you exhale
Far far away deep down you see a sunken city on a throne you swear sits a massive squid or some unknown horror it stares back at you as this happens you feel the panic of drowning the burning in your lungs and a hand pull you out a large minotuar pissed off you just dunked your head in his salt water he was saving to make pickles begins to yell at you but stops as you shake and cry uncontrollably be careful where you go in the city of doors be careful which puddle you step in
Well he certainly brings to mind of the Lovecraft incarnation, although I previously thought of Kuo-toa as a bit of deep one's. Although in D&D he is as you said a demon lord, rather than Great Old One, that is the more Lovecraft pick, such as Great Cthulhu.
I was just recently looking up Merrow, and apparently they were merfolk altered by the abyss, could there be any connection there? Actually, the MM mention Demogorgon, who as you mentioned is in a sort of ally to Dagon. Sounds like a story there.
And my knowledge of humanoids transformed into sea creatures, is the Deep Scion, Sea Spawn, and maybe the Kraken priest. They would probably be thrall of his followers, right? Which I guess makes him terrifying among other demon cults. And I was totally not long ago thinking of ideas of a Shadow out of Innsmouth story.
Yeah, Dagon has his tentacles in many pies (fish pies).
Whatever you do, don't eat the fish pies.
I just finished a first draft of land economics. And I was just now trying to get a feel of the economies of sea races, so was just trying to figure out what trade with sea folk is possible. And what the different groups want.
I would love to see a shalaran lore video, or even an aquatic races lore series. The deep sea fascinates and terrifies me, and I would never want to be an aquatic humanoid IRL but I would gladly roleplay one
Great video on perhaps my favorite demon lord.
Not sure if you check these old videos, but do you think Dragon would ever have Tieflings? kinda like the Lovecraft innsmouth or for some dark purpose that his machinations hope to bring to reality? what do you think their subtype abilities would be?
Hmmm, something like the Innsmouth people, yes. Think... transformation into Koa Toa
New player character concept?🤔
Dagon really needs some better recruiting practices. Insanity doesn't entice people into an underwater cathedral. Just hand out lanyards, and everyone will be back into the sea in no time.
Free drinks voucher for the church of Dagon, also, free laundry services (no dry cleaning)
Thanks for posting this. Just bought my reaper Father Dagon mini a couple days ago!
Very well done love the descriptive narration.
I so wish you had an animated series
That beginning is actually some asmr
The song of the sea
Love the pictures though too beautiful
Awesome video! Have you done anything on Lord Soth and/or Ravenloft? That's what got me into DnD back in the day. Many good men met a twisted and horrible fate inside the mists of Ravenloft.
We must return to the sea! Dagon wills it!!!
Can I settle for a weekend at the beach?
My favorite d and d monster will always be the aboleth. But shoot, the way you explain it, a dagon might be #2
DeangeloIDK Dagon is not a monster he is as far removed from them as the highest of divine are removed from your player character he's not a monster he's more like an idea a concept
*chews a suspiciously large squid ring*
Their are many Aboleths. Their is only one Dagon
Dagon, My favorite obrinth! I'm inking in my tank!
Obyrith.... It's Obyrith.... Don't listen to AJ's pronunciations
Oh-Brith.
Have you seen the movie? I believe it was filmed right somewhere in your backyard there. It's low budget but I've always been a fan of it.
No? Oh I will have to hunt that one down, thanks Arthur :)
I just watched it, and yes, that is a really good movie! By about half way I wanted to find somewhere dry and warm.. and the chanting, the sudden silences, it is a spooky story done very well.
World of MONSTERS It was filmed in Spain or Portugal. 😑
Brother Malachai what is the movie called
+Damian Struiken Dagon?
Well I enjoy imagining the perverse rites ;)
If Guts can slay the Sea God, I can see an adventuring party besting Dagon in battle
That would be a *rough* campaign, dude. You thought losing levels in 2E was bad? My brother, you do not yet know the meaning of Sacrifice...
@@KyleJordanGaming perhaps I do, and my players have yet to learn
@@punchlord That moment when you realize the DM is Griffith...
It is possible. But Dagon is not unlike an alien god. He has that kind of ability to perceive and move. Facing him would just be an aspect. He would be weakened by the defeat but in the same way you would feel weak and disoriented by a really bad nightmare. Even then you gotta ask how many such nightmares has he endured, and how many can you?
Would Aboleths work with Dagon?
Maybe 🤔
But Dagon would also have competition of obtaining Aboleth worshipers from Demogorgon
As most of the followers for Demogorgon are aquatic creatures
Maybe, maybe not. Those two actually seem to cooperate fairly well for ego driven horrors. Despite they both have the significant number of their followers under water they do not seem to be all that jealous of this overlaping of spheres. One can only guess they have some kind of understanding that allows them to be something close to allies. Obviously still demon lords so they won't sacrifice their own interests for each other. But they are something of an oddity. Two powerful demonlords who are not actively sizing up each other's domains.
@@jacobfreeman5444 Dagon works as an oracle for Demogorgon. My guess is that while the demon lords themselves might not have beef with each other and have similar end goals, I'm sure there are a few points of contention between the three of them (Dagon and both of Demogorgon's heads)
@@litchqueenasenath5995 I would see the heads are less seperate entities and more disassociative outlooks of the same entity. The fractured self is lost and cannot find itself despite seeing itself. Who knows what Demogorgon would become if he could reconcile himself with his mirror image. Maybe a god.
I wonder what the interactions between Dagon and Umberlee must be like?
frosty
Don't Google it with safe search off.
given umberlee's personality and reputation as the "Bitch queen" i'd say would be a minefield to say the least
I'm guessing contentious 😁
@@digunder14 Given Dagon's approach to Demogorgon, I suspect he is a smooth operator type that would try to placate Umberlee. But you're right. That would be like walking the mother of all minefields.
What about him vs Leviathan from the Lords of Ruin book? Or would he be in support of him?
They probably hang out.
That poem you read at the start? Where is that from? I love it!
Did you write it? Please let me know! I am adding it to my collection of quality poems for my younger students to read to practice their fluency and expression and I would like to accredit it rather than have written as author unknown.
@@Craig_Tucker48I looked up the lines and couldn’t find anything so I’m led to believe he wrote it
I wanna hear the story on this poem
I think a fun game idea for D&D would be your in a port town and you overhear strange happenings things like a old rotted pirate ship and you fight Davey johns and his fishmen crew along with the kraken but in the end you either have to fight and beat dagon who was using them to control that territory or banish him
Important question. D&D Dagon vs Lovecraft Dagon
Demogorgon.
AJ Pickett Transformers Primus vs D&D Primus? Lol
0111001010101101010101010010101011101010101010101001
AJ Pickett good answer 👍
OK, the real answer is
01010100 01101000 01100101 01111001
01100001 01110010 01100101
01110100 01101000 01100101
01110011 01100001 01101101 01101000
one question, are there "water angels"? I mean, what do marine deities send as soldiers?
There are celestial versions of all terrestrial creatures, so, there are celestial whales, seals, and dolphins.
Essentially, yes.
AJ Pickett
you see, I remember this canpaign against Dagon in an underwater setting, and an NPC was an angel disguised as some type of merfolk (at the time I still thought of tritons and mermaids), and when it actually showed itself it was rather weird to see this white-winged humanoid swimming around (he died rather horribly).
Only 12 dislikes and 1K likes you sir are a legend
Metallica, the thing that should not be.
Thoroughly enjoying the vids.
I'm DMing a game where they are about to make it to the boss Abolith and had named the guy Dagon already. I know I can play it however, but is there any link with Aboliths and Dagon the demon lord. Aboliths arnt really the same thing as Obyrith/ Demons right?
Aboleth are some of the first living creatures to exist, the Obyrith are completely different, and no, there is no real relationship between the two. Aboleth, like Dagon, seek to rule the ocean and keep all creatures in their own domain. They don't want to 'evolve', as they consider their form to be perfect, just how it is.
I could see an aboleth performing a false flag on their enemies. If they think they're fighting Dagon itself they'll be on the back foot. If they never see the creature they might blame Dagon instead of an aboleth making their victory all the sweeter.
In a previous video you mentioned how some of the ancient aboleths are almost godlike in power, Shame they havent flushed out the underwater conflicts that must occur between dagon and aboleths as they vie for control of the depths
It seems that Dagon and the other lords of the deep are dormant for long periods of time, so, perhaps the Aboleth just get up to no good while the old ones sleep, and scatter for safety when they rouse.
I am a warlock fathomless and my patron is Dagon.
How is playing that class & patron combo?
@@FathersUnited-fufathomless is very cool, probably the best controller that warlock has to offer.
I've been wondering how does all this lore get established is a process required with like certain writers or can you write some cool concepts or draw some crazy creature with a name and it's abilities and the d&d community somehow make it canon or do you write to a magazine or something ?
Dragon magazine, Dungeons magazine, official sourcebooks, and novels endorsed by Wizards of the Coast. At this point, I'd accept Tome of Beasts creatures from Kobold Press as like, a present-day Fiend Folio. Also, adventure league material is offical lore. Things that happen in video games endorsed by Wizards of the Coast are official lore as well, unless contradicted by sourcebooks (sourcebooks can also contradict material from novels)
Technically, you can just write some cool concepts or draw crazy creatures and Wizards of the Coast might decide to make it ‘Official Lore’ by *stealing* it. So there’s that.
6 Dislikes were probably disgruntled Arch Devils or
Jealous Demon Lords
No way this was released 5 years ago. I was thinking like 2 years at most.
Are those Aboleth moving into his mouth at 10:30?
Aboleth are more like catfish iirc those look like squid or something
Did a video on those shalarens ever get done?
How many Creatures and Gods were heavily inspired by HP Lovecraft
Alot!
Dagon was around well before mr. Lovecrafts stories. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dagon
@@chrisrapelstapskirappe5367True, but Lovecraft's version is used here, especially the one from the film.
Great video
Aww, but the intro again. Don't think I don't pay attention! ;3
Just havin' a gaff, keep up the juicy lore.
Dagon a good name for a powerful being ;]
Water daddy. Hahaha. So named cause being a charismatic sorcerer anti hero. I decided to tell the rest of the table I'd seduce the next next monster our party faced as a joke. And the DM took that as a personal challenge not expecting I did also. Turns out you can seduce a demon lord through thier aspect. My sorcerer has the dubious honor of rolling three nat 20s in a row and the much more dubious honor of being abducted mid campaign and never seen again until very late into epic.
Tentacles.
In actual history the fish god Dagon from the Babalonian Mysteries Religions (modern freemasonry york,scottish rites) had hats called a mitre that their high priests wore are absolute duplicates of the ones the Catholic popes wear! True story!
He was also the main god of the Philistines
Literal meme tier nonsense mate.
@@DCdabest I've forgotten more about Freemasonry,the Knights of Malta as well as the Rosicrucians than you'll ever know sonny.......and i'm NOT your mate bud!
@@michaelkelligan7931
I ain't your buddy, guy
I wondering if there are any hp lovercraft inspired monster aside from ilithids in the forgotten realms?
Kuo-toa for sure.
sorry for being so late to ask this but, is their any way I might get copies of dragon magazine either paper back or pdf.
I think there's an app called Dragon+. I believe you can find issues there, but I'm not positive.
@@ryderma1 you're correct, although issues aren't released regularly
Love Dagon ~ 💖
Anyone else watching the new Critical Roll season and hope Dagon is Fjords Patron?
where did you get this lore?
Which part?
There is a AL mod in T4 that you do get battle Dagon
Cthulhu/Dagon 2020!
#NoLivesMatter
#MakeAmericaMadAgain
So...where is Cthulhu? LOL
He's at your mom's house fingerblasting her ass.
Far Realm, I believe
How many ancient dragons would it take to defeat dagon?
I’m 5e probably like 2 or 3, they do epic creatures so dirty
More than what's needed to change a lightbulb.
"He's an Oberyth demon lord..."
>goes on to literally describe what can only be a deity.
I guess the distinction seems really fuzzy to me? Would that be a good video topic, in itself, I wonder?
I do have a video on the Ecology of Gods... the comment section is a dumpster fire, as you would imagine.
@@AJPickett Aah. I'll try and find it then. Does it go into the distinction between the modt powerful demons/devils etc and actual deities?
Sorry people are being twerps there.
Dieties (the original ones) have very different origin to demon lords.
Ofc. "anyone" can attain a divine portfolio, and gain divinity in this sense (see guys like Vecna for reference). In terms of powers there is little difference between divines, or a demonlord holding a divine portfolio.
Thanks!
Demon lords are almost like Gods in every aspect, their origin being very different though. Oberyth demon lords are even more powerful : they had to reform after passing in our reality,with thousands of lesser entities continuously grasping,biting, tearing at their very being in a desperate attempt to maintain or regain a physical form. Then they had to fight against the primordials first, the tanari later just to keep existing. The fact Dagon is still standing is testament to its incredible power.
But what are stars in dd, if the crystal spheres end little after the last planet ? Are they other spheres?
Dagon is trans-dimensional, he could be temporarily removed from the world/dimension of Toril, but he would simply slither back in from a parallel dimension, shortly after, or perhaps before he was about to be destroyed (since dimensions don't need to line up, temporally, case and point, the Feywild). The crystal sphere boundary exists as far away from the outermost planet of a stellar system, as the outmost planet exists from the system's central star (or however the system is arranged, not all of them are star systems), so, it is a very large sphere, and yes, there are spheres for Toril, Greyhawk, Krynn, Athas, Mystara, etc.
AJ Pickett but what are the stars that humans on Toril see in the night sky? I mean simple, non transdimensional humans. And, do they know what the stars are ? I'm starting to doubt there should be stars in the sky of Toril at all. Maybe they should just be seeing the reflected light on the few planets inside the sphere and that should be it for the night sky.
So was he one of the first Obyriths to come over intact from over "there"?
Or was he mostly already here in Toril?
With Dagon it's hard to say, he's been around so long he might be from an entirely different event in a now replaced timeline. The multiverse is littered with the refugees of temporal paradoxes
Someone should commission a TV series along the lines of Game of Thrones but instead of the noble families have Demon lords of the Abyss.
A Game of Souls?
The Elder Scrolls is basically just single player D&D
Is there a dagon mini
There is a Reaper Bones Dagon mini. He doesn't look like how he is described in Forgotten Realms lore but still very cool.
@@Red0Leader not bad bub
So Captain Foster's is a Scion of Dagon? You had no way of knowing this obviously as you made the video years ago but I am working my way through the audiobook of the final book of the key of stars so that was something of a minor spoiler for me I'm about 3/4 of the way through the book all that being said that's my fault for clicking on this video again rather than just finishing the audiobook all of that said I really might consider incorporating more of the four e lore into some of my own stories
crawl back into ocean, and forget thy sacreliged of dagon!!! @_@ elderitch abominations are always wonderfull to learn about.
He is still young to the true rulers of the sea..aboleth..
Fistimus Maximus "We must!... ... ... Let. Them. Fight?!?!" 🤓🙏😵🐙⚔🦑💪🌍👑 *had too much fun watching godzilla king of monsters* "Who are we!?!?... To decide... The legitimacy... Of the gods!?!?!?!?" *starts cheering on dagon*
@@thedarkmaster4747 Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn
I had a Druid pc who ended up indoctrinated into a cult of Dagon and it was pretty awesome tbh 😂
How do non-deities grant spells? I thought that was a special power of gods, and other unique superbeings, like the Dragon Kings, in worlds where there aren't deities.
I wonder if Dagon might have servants who can do something similar to the Aboleth, and force others to be aquatic? I know Fiends often like to offer choice, so they can tempt, but a forced ability like this could still be cool.
Well, like warlocks, its a pact you see, the cleric or paladin has a pact with their divine patron.
Warlocks do not need faith to use their powers. It is more of a business contract. Clerics feed their patron faith, which has power. So the bond is stronger and allows greater growth. Paladins kinda tap into that too but the bond is formed on a soul bond vow. I guess you can say the gods let paladins touch a bit of the faith power since the contract is based on a strict code. So more or less self regulating. The magic they draw on will retract when they fail to uphold their side of things.
So warlock bonds are usually the weakest and most easily severed. A mere trickle of power. But I suppose any being of demigod or higher power can bestow power on another being and decide what kind of bond they wish to sponsor.
cool.
US HeroQuest has a Zargon in it too. Intentional coincidence perhaps?
Is Zargon the big floating head from the power rangers?
@@justicedemocrat9357 That's Zordon.
Wait a minute. Talking about boundaries between gods? What does that mean? It there some kind of consequence for them to screw with each other on the huge scale or is it just a huge gentleman's agreement?
Ao cannot do anything about the actual power of a god that is not purely local to (at most) Realmspace. Any god with a presence in multiple spheres, such as Lolth, or the elemental deities, or even the entire Mulhorandi pantheon, is constrained by Ao's rules only as far as their interaction with Faerun goes.
Can an multipsphere god kill by destroying him and his sphere? Also is the Abyss is the forgotten realms or in ever D&D realm?
The gods can't destroy the spheres, nobody knows where they came from and for all intents and purposes, they are indestructible (though, there are exceptions to even that rule). The Abyss is multidimensional, so, it is all over the place, and no, I don't think destroying realmspace would kill Ao, he is just.. I guess you could say he is assigned there.
So he can not be killed sucks.
Ao is the boss of that sphere. That is all there is to it. It take another with similar or superior authority to perform a feat like killing him...and I suspect all such are part of some agreement that binds them to non-interference. So long the rules are kept the Overgod and over crowd don't care. That said the actual rules can be...murky. And mortals not exactly beholden to the same set as gods. So...lets say...you had a devious god work on a scheme for eons to get mortals to put the right series of rituals in place that would allow a temporary suspension of said rules for that god...it doesn't even have to go right. Perhaps it having a critical fail is part of the storyline and now somethimg even worse is about to be unleashed. Like Tharizdun. Or accidentally dumping the Dawn War on the planet. Ect. You get the idea.
Well Creepy water monster= fun Goo
9:43 who do they also worship, sorry?
Swanster meister Umberlee, the bitch queen.
Nyte Shay Thankee kindly
5:22 What's that race again? I'm always looking for new fishpeople. My first ever player character was a sahuagin. 😀
EDIT: Sh- Shelaren? Searches yield nothing (except for, surprisingly, porn stars 😅).
Here you go, the name is Shalarin
forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Shalarin
Thank you ~ 💖
what if DnD dagon faced of with Cthulhu?
Cthulhu would bend the knee.
Doesnt seem all that evil to me, if you look at it from a certain (aquatic) point of view.
.... perhaps I did not make it very clear. He corrupted and destroyed the civilization of an entire ocean, the transplantation of one sea into another caused massive devastation and he turned the people who he damned near annihilated, into his simpering minions. If it was not such a bothersome task, he would simply flood the entire surface of Toril and destroy all life on the land. He is not, a nice, thing. :)
arnt Dagon THE oldest demon lord? in 4.E he was already there whean the abyss was opened
Yes, he is among the first, and there are only a dozen of them as far as I know.
It's beginning to look a lot like fishmen.
Now this is just blatant theft of Lovecraft's creations.
Not really.
Dagon was worshipped as part of a actual religion.
So lovecraft stole him to.
More like a homage. While obviously the character of this Dagon goes back to Lovecraft the entity is far older than him.
Public domain yo
Not really as much of HP Lovecraft is over 100 years old now and Lovecraft himself died pretty young
so yeah nearly everything that he published in the 1910s - 1920s is either in the public domain or is about to enter the public domain
@@rejvaik00Theft may have been the wrong word, but the overall theme did come from Lovecraft. I remember seeing Dagon in the 4e MM and it looked almost exactly like the Dagon from the film, Dagon. Homage is fine, but the look should have been changed enough to make it their own.
Your take on Dragons is weird; never heard of any like this. Also, you misspelled 'Dragon' in the title; left out the R.
(Yes, kidding. A'iah Dagon)
Also are Dagon not best pal with Demogorgon? this song fits dagon to ua-cam.com/video/OaMj1GwjaEo/v-deo.html
Demogorgon has only one friend.... chuck norris.
demogorgon is not even friend with himself. idea, cult of demogorgon finds a artifact of love and will give it to their lord so his two heads stopp trying to kill each other and instead will marry each other. adventurers must break them up
IÄ! IÄ!
Why does Dagon even exist? Even Demogorgon is hogging the sea.
Well, Demogorgon is the Prince of demons. So most are wise to play nice with him. But Dagon is the true demon lord of the depths. It is only because of their amicable relationship that Demogorgon can expand his reach to the oceans. No doubt Dagon is more than strong enough to stop that if it suited him. It is just too profitable for Dagon to be buddy buddy with Demogorgon is all. After all who is gonna say no to Dagon's interests, which scorn dry land, with Demogorgon looming in the background?
well last i checked, dagon is the one manipulating demogorgon a lot of the time and they have an alliance of sorts, dagon secretly whispering things into the ears of one of demogorgon's heads
Demogorgon is dagons little pet.
I love dragon, the lord of deformity
Ia Ia Cthulhu Ryleh!