I spent four years Army infantry. We were taught to have longer, thinner spikes, more weight, and a double swinging weapon that strikes the prey from both sides, and at two different heights. Your trap is very effective and dangerous, nicely done!
+Bill Sutherland Great points you make there on what you were taught. Interesting that you were taught something similar. I have never seen anything like this before, it is just what I could come up with as an effective trap for larger game. Thank you for your comments.
Cool idea. I think I would always set it with more spikes and more weight to handle multiple types of game. With your current setup if a deer tripped the trap it may not kill it but it could lame it. I do think it looks like very simple and functional trap. I believe it would be 2 hours well spent and after its set you could spend time foraging instead of hunting. Well done.
I can tell you from experience you don't have enough weight or speed for the trap to kill. About my experience...I work in the OR and have put trocars in the human body. A trocar is what we use to push through the skin muscle and fascia of the body. We then put laproscopic instruments through them to do surgery. It takes quite a bit of force to put a trocar though a human body. Also we put them in without hitting any bone (of course). Animal hide is thicker and stronger. You may poke a couple holes in the skin but that would be about it I'm afraid. The trap is good. All I'm saying is you need to at least double the weight and put thinner metal tips on the spikes. If your going for the use what you have available thing, then make some stone arrow heads. And please see this as constructive criticism. I'm going to try constructing your trap myself. Thanks for the great idea in this video.
Thank you for watching and for your comments. Of coarse the trap can be built to any size and weight added for whatever animal one targets. The weight used here was more than it looked and the trap hits pretty hard.. I wouldn't want to be in front of it. Unfortunately I can't leave this trap set and show it work, but I am quite confident it will do the job. I would love to see yours if possible, after you try it.
Thank you! This one being sized for medium game... The height of it would most likely detour deer around it. That's why at the end I said the poles would need to be longer for a deer sized set... so that the swing arm would be high enough for deer to go through it. As far as the spikes... a couple more wouldn't hurt, but you have to be careful how many. The more spikes you use... the more force it takes to drive them into the animal, if they all connect. Thank you for your input bud, John.
This is a comment and additional improvements for overall trap efficiency and speed. As many have commented the speed of the trap can be the difference in catching or missing a game animal. To increase speed I would first shorten the drop arms height and distance. I would add (which also adds to drop weight) an additional spear tip cross bar to double chance of impaling animal. I would also add two or three large rocks to increase drop speed and having two cross beams will make it easier help secure the rocks. I also thought you had a good idea about the cross beam on the static two trees to help trap animal in place by pinning it against the tree. I would improve on this idea by adding an additional two or three bars instead of one at different heights and having each with rows of spikes (with I would have slightly facing in a upward direction) I would be secure the spikes by a notch and tie system so if animal will be impaled the additional spikes would cause more damage due to gravity, blood loss and struggling. (basically using same method used in the Vietnam man traps) Now as for the triggering system. The one you have will work but as I noted unless animal are spooked or in hurry it may attempt to possible jump or avoid area. The one thing I would change is lowering trigger string height or better still use a pressure plate trigger. Although both will work the P.P trigger will probably not even be noticed by deer until it is to late and trap is released. There is one downfall though that I have to state with a P.P trigger it will no longer be multi directional as with the trip wire system your using. One final thing I thought I mentioned. Although this video was built for educational purposes and made in clear trail the best to use this trap would be in a choke spot so deer have to go through area or built up so it would guide deer to the area for so not to have to get off trail. Hope this helps for those interested in this trap system and good hunting.
I must admit I didn't get it at first but when you went through it perfect, I like it you can fine tune it with more spikes or like you said more weight, thank you for taking the time to show us.
I think I get what you are saying. Spikes in the cross stick so it would spike the animal from both sides? Possible, but you want the animal to walk as close to the trees as possible for maximum swing of the arm. Thank you for your comments, John.
Thank you! Do you know the bow hunting term "duck the string"? For example... A deer's first reaction is to drop and turn to look. This trap took less than two seconds to set off, and it's tripped by their front feet... you actually want them to "lunge" slightly to have the spikes hit behind the shoulder. With all that factored in, it should hit the target perfectly! More weight could be added for more speed for sure. Thank you for your comments, John.
Thanks for your video. I like this trap because you could make it a lot more lethal then you show here in the video. Mastering this trap makes all others that much more easy.
thank you for this video, i also thank you for the detailed info. i am just now getting into survival traps and getting every detail is important to me. i want to make sure i do it right, keep the videos coming as well as the info on making them. i have subscribed.
Thank you! This can be made to scale for any size animal... The smaller the animal, the more likely it will hold the animal right there. For the larger sized animals... It most likely would not hold them there. But, with four holes... It should be a short blood trail. Thank you for your question, John.
I talked about making it larger with more weight for deer sized. This increases speed and force. You are correct about deer jumping the string with bow hunting, and it would be similar with this. When they trip the trigger pole they will try to "lunge", but it took less than a second from trip to stick! And if you figure the deer will trip the line with it's front leg... You want it to lunge, putting the spikes hitting in the bread basket. Thank you for your questions, John.
Very nice. One thing I would do is add another cross bar below the spikes to pin the animal in case it was on the smaller side so it wouldn't get pushed under the top bar.
It did take me some effort to make what was in my head a reality. Now that I have figured out the best ways to do it, I could probably do it again in half the time. I have had a couple videos where I didn't explain small details (thinking it would be understandable) and people complained that I didn't show it well enough. This being something people have never seen... I figured I should show every detail. Thank you bud, John.
I think this trap has quite a lot of potential. This is obviously a small scale example and could be a little more refined. I could see this being set using a 3 metre (or longer) log with spikes spanning its length. Perhaps even 2 rows of spikes. That would provide quite a bit of force to the animal. Having a long log would also increase the chances of striking the animal, although it might be a little difficult in finding the balance point to place the trigger/support stake. It may be a 2 to 3 person job. There would also need to be a fair bit of fencing put in, unless the area selected already had good "natural fencing". I liked the idea of using a stake attached to a trip wire. It means that a lot of weight can be held in the trap (once it is correctly balanced) without worrying about the mechanism losing "springiness". Good job for coming up with something innovative. I think this could be quite useful in the right environment.
Have you thought about redesigning the "prop pole" to include a lynch pin design (sort of a promontory peg)... like on a Russian koolyokma deadfall... only way longer at the top portion of the pin (it would equal the trap height). Attach the trip string to the pin release causing the trigger to be exceptionally light! Rotating the drop stick at 90 degrees with this sort of trigger would also cause the drop stick to "kick" away from the trap when it triggers, making the trap more efficient in that way as well. There are many variations of this sort of trap... Here's a neat thought... how about replacing the deadfall weighted frame with sheer speed!! This can be accomplished by wrapping your bankline around the two main stationary support trees.... the ones you have your kill frame tied to... and then creating a "Spanish windless" by inserting a single hooked spear into the loop and rotating it (backwards from the direction you want it to kill)... this winding will create a great amount of force! (your kill engine) This will use less material, and probably less bankline in the end overall.. you wouldn't have all of those frame connections, and if you wish, you could weight this design as well. Use the same tripwire set up you have shown here and include the lynch pin design and I bet that would make a deadly trap! Thanks for the ideas, and keep up the hard work!! :)
I tried several trigger ideas and this one was the simplest, and easiest to do and reset. As far as making it into a "giant Kleptsy" trap.. This would be quite time consuming and extremely dangerous to set and reset. I do love that you have ideas and that it got you thinking though, thank you for watching and for your comments.
I'm so glad you used the word "Kleptsy" when I spoke of the Spanish windlass design, as the two are one in the same. So interesting question (I am asking because I really do not know)... where did the term kleptsy come from out of a Spanish windlass design? Do you have any idea where this originated?? I cannot seem to pick Google's brain hard enough yet. lol
This is a great trap, obviously this was for demonstration and can be modified, simple trigger and simple design. In a survival situation this would take very little effort to build
In an survival situation you will have more then one type of trap set. So there is alwasys room for improvements. ( Trail and error)If your setting traps it's because your in some serious trouble and in this for (x amout of time/days) Bottom line it keeps your mind busy and it's smart use of your energy. #1 key to survival is a positive mental outlook even when things seem hopeless. (Meaning your not going to die so easy) props to your ideas and please continue posting videos.
Very nice John. I wonder if the swing speed would be fast enough? You can see a deer react before a arrow gets there in bow hunting. greater weight would increase the impact and maybe the speed what do you think?
Your video was very interesting and I will give it a try to see if I can get something for dinner next trip to the woods.I see other peeps comments about how they think the setup is a little slow.I sometimes use a Kleptsy stile trap because they are wicked fast sooo-I will copy your trap and trigger system and see if I can incorporate both poles into the rope that will need to go between trees holding kill sticks. Have no idea if it will work but it will give me something to work on. Thank you for your video.
Perhaps some stashed away, sharp broadheads, omitting the pointed pegs, on a longer swinging pole so the critter has to cover more ground if it bolts.Follow the blood trail to your kill if it wanders away.
Hopefully, I can give you some helpful advise brother,. {1st}. A stick on the ground will not divert an animal off the trail that it normally travels. You have to put the trap on the trail, and you have to build it up slowly over a few days or so, any sudden changes will make them go around it .. {2nd}. You should make the trip wire a 3 point or 4 point, to catch the animal as it first walks into the zone, you can do this by making a triangle from the stake poles to the trigger pole. A 4 point, you need to add 2 adjacent stake poles parallel to the other stake poles, and attach the trip wire as to either side will make the trigger react. In my opinion a 3 point trip works better, because animals are normally walking the trails unless they are being chased or scared. ...{3rd}. The kill zone is too slow, you can increase the speed by attaching a spring pole opposite side of the hinge point, the shorter the hinge point pole the faster the swing falls and the more tension from the spring pole the faster the swing falls, with much more pressure, which is what is needed for trapping larger game. {4th}.... The spikes are way too large, the penetration will be blocked by the rib cage, maybe a broken rib. smaller spikes with sharper points will penetrate into the skin and go deeper into the lungs and heart, which will provide a better kill, if the animal does escape the trap, the penetration will give a blood trail to follow. You have done a good job building this trap, I like it, from my experience I hope i can help you improve on your trapping. please don't take my advise as criticism, hopefully it is helpful. thank you for your video.. dave
That's a cool design. For those not so mechanically inclined, a longer trigger stick and more weight would make it swing harder. I like the way you think. I just did a short video on doing a deadfall with a trip wire. I set it up slightly different, you should check it out.
I would do Both! I like salad and sides with my meat. It took me two hours to figure out the details of my idea and make it work. I could build another one in half the time now that I worked out the kinks, John.
Great trap. Reminds me of a similar version I once saw in J.O.T.C. Ft. Sherman Panama during land mine & booby trap course* Simplicity is genius bro and I like your idea very much* Great stuff*
It doesn't look fast enough, to me. Animals react very quickly, and I suspect most will bolt out, or just straight up, before the spikes reach them. More weight will give more power, but not much more speed because the can't speed up gravity.I haven't had any problem with properly chosen spring poles losing their spring, especially since you're going to be checking them several times per day in a survival situation. I'd guess even a weak spring pole still has more speed than this trap, but I simply haven't had a problem with poles getting weak under normal use.Anyway, until you trap a few animals with this trap, I have my doubts.
+James Ritchie This trap was thought out completely.. If you think about the animal tripping the line with its front leg, it requires a reaction from the animal for the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. The time from being tripped to the time it would hit an animal is under one second.Unfortunately I can't actually use this trap and show it working.Thank you for watching and your comments.
Hi Mate, thanks for share it... I have a suggestion, if you put a third stick in the middle of the two top ones and use a tree branch with a line (like the snare trap) to give more speed and force.
I am no positive I am understanding your suggestion... But to add a dead weight attached to cordage on this set wouldn't work. The cord would have to be strung through the path you need the animal to walk through... This set was pretty fast, but to make it faster, more weight can be added where I have the weight already. Thank you for your comments, John.
Centrifugal force is a bit of a red herring here. It's a phenomenon rather than a force, for one thing, and even then it's pointing in the wrong direction to drive the spikes. If I suggested that when you make a sharp right turn, the inertia pulling your body to the left makes the car go faster, I think you'd see clearly how that doesn't work. You are probably looking for impact force from a falling object. Some is lost changing direction from vertical to horizontal, but knowing the mechanism should clarify the important factors. F=mgh/s You can't change acceleration due to gravity easily, nor stopping distance I'd imagine, so the variables you can play with are mass and change in height. Putting the log at the end of the arm means it will fall further, which means it converts more potential energy to kinetic energy when the trap fires. I think that's the right answer. Neat widget in any case. ;)
are you fucking serious? so he said centrifugal force, no need to give a fucking science lesson, we know what he means, put the weight where its most effective for the trap, go fly your rocket somewhere else!
Love your videos and like this trap. Couple things for discussion. I love the concept & I think it has promise, but not there yet. Animals have fast reactions and can even jump out of steel traps. I am wondering if this is too slow with the length of fall. Would it be more effective if the weighted spikes fell from behind the animal so they did not see it falling and aim for the back of the head? 2 could you add a tension rope spring to the arms to speed it up?
I've been watching all sorts of trapping videos lately for research, I have yet to practice any so I may be wrong here, but wouldn't it seem like an extra bit of efficiency to add some sort of spring system? It's a good base for a trap, i just think it can be improved upon is all. Though I may be wrong
Hey, i saw there more traps no just this one... for example this rock, that benched tree :D is these next traps or its just the wild? sry for my english
Nice trap and thank you for sharing it.The only thing I would change would be to add more weight to make it swing faster and give it more penetrating value.All in all though,it's an awesome build.
I did say more weight could be added for a larger game set up. But, you also have to be careful not to make it to fast. The animal will trip the line with it's front leg, and you want the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. If the trap is too fast it will hit in the shoulder, and not find the "bread basket". Thank you for your comments and support, John.
It's more about having the spikes hit the vitals of the animal than it is about damaging meat. The best bet for a good dispatch and timely exit of the animal is to hit the lung and heart area of the animal. Thank you for the reply, John.
would it make more sense to have your trip wire attached to the bottom of the 1st tree instead of in between the 2 trees? that way the trap would be tripped a little earlier thus not allowing the animal to possibly escape....considering how fast and alusive most animals are. just a thought. nice vid.
+Ryan Tettenburn Not really the case. Not only would you need two trip lines for what you are saying in order to cover both directions of travel. But, think of where the animals front leg is compared to where you want the spikes to strike behind the shoulder. This design requires the animal to have a reaction in order for the spikes to find their mark already.Thank you for watching and for your question and comments.
Other materials could be used for sure. This was thought up with wilderness survival in mind. But if you were in a situation where things like RR spikes could be taken advantage of... Although they would be harder to lash to the rail. The wooden spikes are notched in a manner to keep them from being able to slip through the rail. Thank you for your comments, John.
this is effectively a vietcong door trap adapted to the animal trapping. I would say you could take this a step further and make one of the spikes a toggling point that breaks off in the animal and stops the animal from escaping either with a drag or just tying it directly to a large tree for a anchor.
smash it's hard to make good barbs in wood due to the grain from the growth rings making them weak, bone does a lot better if you want barbs, that's why I suggested a toggle instead.
+SirLobsterman I'm very analytical so please forgive,i like thought of toggle and Incorporated it into my own variation...one longer spike w/shaft sticking out to the rear and point even w/others...add second drop frame w/second weight attached so it adds momentum and strikes longer toggle spike to ensure penetration..if not successful it would increase blood trail.. loosely space 2nd weight from 1st w/18"? sticks when setting trap to allow 2nd hammer strike primarily to set toggle
Jack Springer sounds good, would rip a nice hole while being pulled out or cause a lot more damage to internals in a attempt to. my thought was like a toggling harpoon tip, the word harpoon was at a loss to me at the time of the original posting of this comment.
It's not a bad idea, I like your thinking. But, you do want the animal walking by as close to the cross bar as possible and spikes on it would force the animal that much further from it. The trap should do the job without an opposing spike rail as well. But, if I was going to play with the design at all, your idea would be an option. Thank you for your comments.
nice idea sorry this is a few years late but if your still playin with it, i would use a old tire an roll through the thing to determine count time for a animal passing through it. as it looks its swinging alil slow and a tire being rolled as quick as possible through will help narrow in the timing, as well as possibly making the spike arm longer to cover the broader area of the length, of the animal to insure it doesn't get away . But over all very interesting trap an appears easy enough ta make,, Oh sorry also forgot ta mention if you move the weighted end up about 16 ta 24 inches higher it should create more speed swinging down as well as a greater impact.
+interestin The trap actually requires the animal to keep moving or have a reaction. The string is tripped by the front leg and the desired spike strike is behind the shoulder. With just a hair over one second from trip to strike I believe this timing to be highly accurate. The weight being as far to the end as possible causes the most forceful strike possible from centrifugal force. And the more spikes that are added the more force needed to drive the extra spikes in, much like walking on a bed of nails vs stepping on one nail. I have completely thought out all these issues and believe this to be the best option. Thank you for watching and for your input.
I think it looks fast enough but not heavy enough. From what I have come to understand is counter weight needs to be the weight of the animal or twice as much. The trap is valid but I feel it's undersized for the game this hunter speaks of. It would work for fox or coyote but for pig, deer or goat it's just a bit small and the spikes were just a bit low. I'm not saying it would not kill the animal I'm just saying you would have to track it after the strike. All and all good trap, I would like to see more. Good job hunter.
+Tim Cirulis The piece of log on there is much heavier than it looks, but adding more weight it also easy enough. I think what I said was it could be scaled larger for deer, not that this one would work for deer. There will most likely be a tracking issue on an animal after being hit by this trap, with 3 or 4 holes in the animal it should be an easy track. Thank you for watching and your comments.
My only thought watching this video is the same as everyone else. That the trap goes off too slowly, missing any animal faster than a sloth. I don't want to sound negative at all as this would be a good design in a survival situation. I was thinking of what you could do in order to increase the speed that this trap springs. My solution, you run a couple wraps of cord between the two large trees and then twist the entire spiked arm around that cord multiple times. As you do this the cord is going to start pulling those two trees together and produce a lot of spring tension. This would make the trap close more like a mouse trap, rather than just gravity fall. Also, it is going to pin the animal to the tree. Of course this will make the trap more dangerous to set, so adding the spikes to the trap would be done after the trap is wound. Also, you will need a beefed up trigger.
I understand you are saying to turn the whole thing into a giant kleptsy style trap. You need to understand a few things about this design before you dismiss it though. 1. think about where the animals front leg is compared to where you want the spikes to strike. This design Requires the animal to have a reaction to the trap being tripped in order for the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. 2. if a one second time period from trap tripped to spikes strike (which is needed for the trap to work) is too slow... I believe I said once or twice that more weight could easily be added. and 3. A "sloth"? You are giving an animals reaction time too much credit. I know exactly where your thinking is and understand it completely as I have bow hunted for about 20 years. But, lets take a deer's reaction for example. Would the deer's first reaction be to move forward out of the trap? Not likely... Most often and I believe in this situation most always, the deer's first reaction will be to drop (or duck the string). So, with the animals initial reaction not being straight away, we have used up part of the traps one second travel time... And still need the animal to move forward 10-12 inches in order for the spikes to find their mark. This trap "goes off too slowly"? I would disagree, as I put much thought into its design. Thank you for your comments, would love a reply after considering comment, John.
Thank you for comments. I have no legal means to actually use this trap on an animal unless in a survival scenario. But, all my hunting and trapping experience says there is no reason it will not perform.
Where do you get your 550 paracord bro? Since I left military I don't live near any U.S. Calvary stores or Ranger Joe's. No military surplus stores near me either*
Could be done. This is not going to likely be an instant kill still and the animal will likely still thrash its way out.. But, they won't get far and the blood trail should be obvious. Thank you for watching.
i think it needs more weight to slam harder to make sure those stakes penetrate. i realize this is for demonstration but im not sure that it would stab them as is. i am thinking it would bounce off
+Taraz Pariseau I really should have figure out something I could have used for a "trap dummy" on this one. Something I could have put in front of the spikes to show how much penetration it would get. Thank you for watching.
i wasnt giving you a hard time, it was just an observation. in a shtf scenario you can bet i will try it out and would have you to thank for the knowledge. :)
Taraz Pariseau I didn't take your comment as giving me a hard time. Just saying, it is easy to question the spikes penetration because I didn't come up with a better way to demo it. In fact I think I mentioned (maybe more than once even) that more weight could easily be added to this. Thank you for your reply.
+CommonSenseOutdoors you mention more weight could be added for larger game....said was just fine for fox coyotes hogs pigs....and for some reason i dont think that your current trap set up would even kill a rabbit
I think you could add a better engine to this system than gravity. Of course the trigger would need to be worthy of higher tension with something like a windlass.
Love this concept. Do you think it is fast enough? The reason I ask is that I animals can jump steel traps and anything that moves will spook an animal. With that said, I love the chole concept. I originally found your twisted rope traps and have actually used that concept in portable thumper traps using 1x4's for birds and squirrels. I love your vids and hope to see you doing them for a lot of years to come.
+TheKlickitat If you time it, from setting it off to when it hits the crossbar is a hair over one second. This means I there was an animal there, the spikes make contact with the animal in under one second. I also take into account that the animal trips the trap with it's front leg and I want the spikes to strike behind the shoulder. This requires a continuation of the animals movement or a reaction to obtain. Thank you very much for your comments and support.
What if you used the sampling spring technique in conjunction with this? Then you'd have gravity and potential energy working together. Some spring might leave the saplings over time, but it could give this trap the push it needs to make it faster. Just some random thoughts. Love the trap!
I couldn't hurt anything. Although, an animal hit by this (even if they get free of the spikes and wander off) will leave a solid blood trail and will not make it far. Thank you for watching and for your comments.
I had previously replied to this comment, however it did not post. Not only will raising the weight not increase the speed, but it would reduce the force in which the spikes strike. Thank you for watching.
CommonSenseOutdors actually it would increase the speed although you would have to increase the weight it's simple physics you can't increase the speed of gravity but you can decrease the distance the bulk of the weight falls then project it outwards with a light pole such as in the case of a catapult where a slow falling heavy object sends a lighter projectile flying with greater speed.
Nice design...But it needs tweaking...at 12:37- you sprung the trap...Spikes hit home at a tad over 12:38..over one full second of sticks flying around...I dunno, maybe critters are more skittish east of the Mississippi... I once saw a raccoon jump almost 3 feet when he startled a grasshopper,LMAO..anyway...just something to think about. Oh..my son just watched it, said maybe greasing the pivot stick with lard or tallow might speed it up..or maybe twin trip wires set apart to make up the time difference...just throwing out our thoughts...Keep up the good work.
You are very correct on the reaction time! But, you forgot to account for one thing... The animal will trigger the trap with a front leg... And you want the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. So, my trap design counts on the animal to have a reaction in order to hit the correct spot on the animal, behind the shoulder. The speed of the swing arm can be increased with more weight added to it (which I think I mentioned). But, you don't want it so fast that it hits the shoulder either. I hope this makes sense and makes you feel better about the design. Thank you for your comments, John.
CommonSenseOutdoors Animal will most likely back up and watch the thing fall in front of him. I tried same idea and thats exactly what happened to me by the looks of tracks on the ground. Animal didn't step forward into trap. I improved speed of the drop with a tight line on arm angled downward, Might at least hit next animal in neck as he sets trip wire.
If you can get results out of that set, then hey, nobody's got the wherewithal to argue ya'. I would, however, look to a simpler option which doesn't require as much gear, prep or set-up. Were it me, I'd rather spend more of my energy in baiting the trap to ensure I am attracting game to my trap. I think you would get much more success with a flip-up trap, which is nothing more than a snare set attached to the end of a long pole tied off to the side of a tree. When triggered, the top-end of the pole provides counterweight and the business end pulls the snare tight. A 10' long 5-6" spruce pole will easily lift animals smaller than 55lb right up off of the ground, (attached 4' up the tree with 3' of the pole on the snare end and 7' of the pole acting as the counterweight), and it'll prevent animals of greater size/weight from being able to lay down. That's important because as soon as other animals smell blood, they'll be right there to inspect it and go for a free meal. Hanging the animal leaves no blood trail. Here's a fella' from Northwest Territories, Canada, who has recorded his results, (Please turn your volume down if you have little ones around - this fella's got a pretty wet tongue). ua-cam.com/video/YaRv3x9EC68/v-deo.html
+CommonSenseOutdoors Just as a follow-up to what I posted, I'm not denying you of any personal triumph in thinking through and constructing the trap you've crafted. I don't want you to think I'm being critical of your trap - surely you get enough of that from know-it-all city kids who'd think a conibear trap was for catching conibears. The only concerns I have, (if you don't mind me passing on a little bit of bushcraft wisdom), in this design are, 1.) its still swinging freely once tripped. Perhaps if you were to make it a side-mount or at least set it at a 70-75 degree angle to keep some of the weight putting downward pressure on the pegs, it would make it much more difficult for prey to escape. And 2.) by design, this trap will cause an injury to an animal that will surely attract other predators. Surely the idea behind the trap is to ensure you're the one getting a meal; not a bear, wolf, or big cat. Personally - and I by no means own a patent on the idea - I sewed a flap of burlap to the underside of my ruck where I could put a conibear 110 and a 220 on the outside of my pack without impacting weight distribution. They're out of the way, easy to access, and when I set my ruck down they actually help hold it upright, (unintended positive result). If you don't have conibear traps, or if you're in an area where only snares are legal, I would seriously look into a flip-up set like I was talking about earlier.
+JussTreddn The whole idea here as with a couple other sets I have shown is that for at least the first catch in a situation.. bait could be an issue. I believe it is important to have a few traps and sets that will catch animals being baitless. I do appreciate your comments and I am taking them as helpful opinions, Thank you for taking the time.
Why would you save "bait that could go in another trap set with a different scenario"? If you're going to spend the amount of time required to create a trap such as this, you likely expect a return on your investment. Irregardless, on every trap set, every effort should be made to ensure its' success. Saving bait? You might as well spare the trap.
A true survival situation or maybe a television production with permission is the only way to legally leave this trap set and operational. Thank you for watching.
Reading through your replies, I notice you keep mentioning adding more weight to increase the "speed" of the trap. Remember, a BB and a cannon ball fall at the same rate. Google "Newtons laws". You would however need MUCH more weight to drive those 4 spikes through an animal. You might be better off with just 1 or 2 spikes, less surface area to distribute the force(think bed of nails).
+virtualgib That is for rate of gravity, are you considering centrifugal force in this application? more weight at the end of an arm swinging that is fixed at the other end most certainly is increased in speed and force (similar to how a sling or bolas work).You are correct that less spikes require less force, but even if four spikes penetrate say three inches.. would two spikes penetrating say six inches be better? or would the four holes in an animal bleed it out faster?
Have you done any testing to see how much weight it would take to push those 4 spikes through a deer hide, much less 3 inches into it? Also, Mass does not affect the rate of a pendulum's swing, which is essentially what you are building.
virtualgib First of all, this one was not scaled big enough for deer, believe I said medium game. I did not thoroughly test this trap while I had it assembled.. however, I have tested the toughness of animals my whole life through trapping, hunting, bow hunting, and many hides through taxidermy. I have complete confidence the trap will do the job. "mass does not affect the rate of a pendulum's swing"... Really? So, what you are saying is a stick on a rope and a log on a rope.. released from the same point.. Both travel at the same speed and hit with the same force? You stand in front of the log and I will let the stick hit me.
definite success. use a small amount of line, simple and safe trigger. Rambo would be proud ;)
+Makery and Mischief Thank you for your comments and support.
I spent four years Army infantry. We were taught to have longer, thinner spikes, more weight, and a double swinging weapon that strikes the prey from both sides, and at two different heights. Your trap is very effective and dangerous, nicely done!
+Bill Sutherland Great points you make there on what you were taught. Interesting that you were taught something similar. I have never seen anything like this before, it is just what I could come up with as an effective trap for larger game. Thank you for your comments.
Cool idea. I think I would always set it with more spikes and more weight to handle multiple types of game. With your current setup if a deer tripped the trap it may not kill it but it could lame it. I do think it looks like very simple and functional trap. I believe it would be 2 hours well spent and after its set you could spend time foraging instead of hunting. Well done.
I can tell you from experience you don't have enough weight or speed for the trap to kill. About my experience...I work in the OR and have put trocars in the human body. A trocar is what we use to push through the skin muscle and fascia of the body. We then put laproscopic instruments through them to do surgery. It takes quite a bit of force to put a trocar though a human body. Also we put them in without hitting any bone (of course). Animal hide is thicker and stronger. You may poke a couple holes in the skin but that would be about it I'm afraid. The trap is good. All I'm saying is you need to at least double the weight and put thinner metal tips on the spikes. If your going for the use what you have available thing, then make some stone arrow heads. And please see this as constructive criticism. I'm going to try constructing your trap myself. Thanks for the great idea in this video.
Thank you for watching and for your comments. Of coarse the trap can be built to any size and weight added for whatever animal one targets. The weight used here was more than it looked and the trap hits pretty hard.. I wouldn't want to be in front of it. Unfortunately I can't leave this trap set and show it work, but I am quite confident it will do the job. I would love to see yours if possible, after you try it.
Thank you! This one being sized for medium game... The height of it would most likely detour deer around it. That's why at the end I said the poles would need to be longer for a deer sized set... so that the swing arm would be high enough for deer to go through it. As far as the spikes... a couple more wouldn't hurt, but you have to be careful how many. The more spikes you use... the more force it takes to drive them into the animal, if they all connect. Thank you for your input bud, John.
Thank you for your support Heith. I think is a better option for bigger game, John.
This is a comment and additional improvements for overall trap efficiency and speed. As many have commented the speed of the trap can be the difference in catching or missing a game animal. To increase speed I would first shorten the drop arms height and distance. I would add (which also adds to drop weight) an additional spear tip cross bar to double chance of impaling animal. I would also add two or three large rocks to increase drop speed and having two cross beams will make it easier help secure the rocks. I also thought you had a good idea about the cross beam on the static two trees to help trap animal in place by pinning it against the tree. I would improve on this idea by adding an additional two or three bars instead of one at different heights and having each with rows of spikes (with I would have slightly facing in a upward direction) I would be secure the spikes by a notch and tie system so if animal will be impaled the additional spikes would cause more damage due to gravity, blood loss and struggling. (basically using same method used in the Vietnam man traps) Now as for the triggering system. The one you have will work but as I noted unless animal are spooked or in hurry it may attempt to possible jump or avoid area. The one thing I would change is lowering trigger string height or better still use a pressure plate trigger. Although both will work the P.P trigger will probably not even be noticed by deer until it is to late and trap is released. There is one downfall though that I have to state with a P.P trigger it will no longer be multi directional as with the trip wire system your using. One final thing I thought I mentioned. Although this video was built for educational purposes and made in clear trail the best to use this trap would be in a choke spot so deer have to go through area or built up so it would guide deer to the area for so not to have to get off trail. Hope this helps for those interested in this trap system and good hunting.
I must admit I didn't get it at first but when you went through it perfect, I like it you can fine tune it with more spikes or like you said more weight, thank you for taking the time to show us.
You really put some work into this and elbow grease...I like how you explain every little thing about it...
Great demonstration John...That would forsure get some hogs and bigger game...Take care...
I think I get what you are saying. Spikes in the cross stick so it would spike the animal from both sides? Possible, but you want the animal to walk as close to the trees as possible for maximum swing of the arm. Thank you for your comments, John.
Thank you! Do you know the bow hunting term "duck the string"? For example... A deer's first reaction is to drop and turn to look. This trap took less than two seconds to set off, and it's tripped by their front feet... you actually want them to "lunge" slightly to have the spikes hit behind the shoulder. With all that factored in, it should hit the target perfectly! More weight could be added for more speed for sure. Thank you for your comments, John.
Thanks for your video. I like this trap because you could make it a lot more lethal then you show here in the video. Mastering this trap makes all others that much more easy.
thank you for this video, i also thank you for the detailed info. i am just now getting into survival traps and getting every detail is important to me. i want to make sure i do it right, keep the videos coming as well as the info on making them. i have subscribed.
Thank you! This can be made to scale for any size animal... The smaller the animal, the more likely it will hold the animal right there. For the larger sized animals... It most likely would not hold them there. But, with four holes... It should be a short blood trail. Thank you for your question, John.
I talked about making it larger with more weight for deer sized. This increases speed and force. You are correct about deer jumping the string with bow hunting, and it would be similar with this. When they trip the trigger pole they will try to "lunge", but it took less than a second from trip to stick! And if you figure the deer will trip the line with it's front leg... You want it to lunge, putting the spikes hitting in the bread basket. Thank you for your questions, John.
Good idea, and an easy fix! Thank you for your input, John.
Thank you! This one is something I came up with in my head and made it a reality, John.
Awesome video. Best trap I've watched made yet! Keep them coming!
Thank you for your kind words.
It is very easy to set once the trigger pole is in place, and to set from the side. It would be effective for sure. Thank you for watching, John.
Very simple and a good explanation No Matter how much weight or Spikes U need everyone can tune it for their own needs So Thank U 👍👍👍
Very nice. One thing I would do is add another cross bar below the spikes to pin the animal in case it was on the smaller side so it wouldn't get pushed under the top bar.
It did take me some effort to make what was in my head a reality. Now that I have figured out the best ways to do it, I could probably do it again in half the time. I have had a couple videos where I didn't explain small details (thinking it would be understandable) and people complained that I didn't show it well enough. This being something people have never seen... I figured I should show every detail. Thank you bud, John.
I think this trap has quite a lot of potential. This is obviously a small scale example and could be a little more refined. I could see this being set using a 3 metre (or longer) log with spikes spanning its length. Perhaps even 2 rows of spikes. That would provide quite a bit of force to the animal. Having a long log would also increase the chances of striking the animal, although it might be a little difficult in finding the balance point to place the trigger/support stake. It may be a 2 to 3 person job. There would also need to be a fair bit of fencing put in, unless the area selected already had good "natural fencing".
I liked the idea of using a stake attached to a trip wire. It means that a lot of weight can be held in the trap (once it is correctly balanced) without worrying about the mechanism losing "springiness". Good job for coming up with something innovative. I think this could be quite useful in the right environment.
Another outstanding video John.
Love it 👍
Greetings from Germany to everyone 🍀
Have you thought about redesigning the "prop pole" to include a lynch pin design (sort of a promontory peg)... like on a Russian koolyokma deadfall... only way longer at the top portion of the pin (it would equal the trap height). Attach the trip string to the pin release causing the trigger to be exceptionally light! Rotating the drop stick at 90 degrees with this sort of trigger would also cause the drop stick to "kick" away from the trap when it triggers, making the trap more efficient in that way as well. There are many variations of this sort of trap... Here's a neat thought... how about replacing the deadfall weighted frame with sheer speed!! This can be accomplished by wrapping your bankline around the two main stationary support trees.... the ones you have your kill frame tied to... and then creating a "Spanish windless" by inserting a single hooked spear into the loop and rotating it (backwards from the direction you want it to kill)... this winding will create a great amount of force! (your kill engine) This will use less material, and probably less bankline in the end overall.. you wouldn't have all of those frame connections, and if you wish, you could weight this design as well. Use the same tripwire set up you have shown here and include the lynch pin design and I bet that would make a deadly trap! Thanks for the ideas, and keep up the hard work!! :)
I tried several trigger ideas and this one was the simplest, and easiest to do and reset. As far as making it into a "giant Kleptsy" trap.. This would be quite time consuming and extremely dangerous to set and reset. I do love that you have ideas and that it got you thinking though, thank you for watching and for your comments.
I'm so glad you used the word "Kleptsy" when I spoke of the Spanish windlass design, as the two are one in the same. So interesting question (I am asking because I really do not know)... where did the term kleptsy come from out of a Spanish windlass design? Do you have any idea where this originated?? I cannot seem to pick Google's brain hard enough yet. lol
I have always assumed that "Kleptsy" comes from it's inventors name. I can not honestly answer that to be true or not. Sorry i'm not much help there.
Absolutely awesome design. Simplicity and a high chance of success, plus working an a little bit larger scale is always easier. Great vid! -Adam
Hun
This is a great trap, obviously this was for demonstration and can be modified, simple trigger and simple design. In a survival situation this would take very little effort to build
a great modification would be to also tunnel the animal in and roof the top to eliminate some of the jump of a spooked animal such as a deer
Thank you! Very interesting, I had never seen anything like this before! Thank you for your kind words and support Andrew, John.
Ha ha... I hope so! Thank you for your comment, John.
I think you have a good trap there but, i think you would agree that a little more weight would work wonders. Great idea.
I think I mentioned more weight could be added. Thank you for watching, John.
Thank you Adam! Glad you like it, John.
In an survival situation you will have more then one type of trap set. So there is alwasys room for improvements. ( Trail and error)If your setting traps it's because your in some serious trouble and in this for (x amout of time/days) Bottom line it keeps your mind busy and it's smart use of your energy. #1 key to survival is a positive mental outlook even when things seem hopeless. (Meaning your not going to die so easy) props to your ideas and please continue posting videos.
Thank you for your great words and for watching.
No problem, Thank you for he reply, John.
Very nice John. I wonder if the swing speed would be fast enough? You can see a deer react before a arrow gets there in bow hunting. greater weight would increase the impact and maybe the speed what do you think?
Thank you, Glad you like it, John.
Zip ties are handy for sure... But, one time use! Cordage is reusable and more versatile, John.
Awesome, glad to hear someone gave it a go! Stay safe and legal, John.
Ha ha, Thank you Carol for your comments, John.
Your video was very interesting and I will give it a try to see if I can get something for dinner next trip to the woods.I see other peeps comments about how they think the setup is a little slow.I sometimes use a Kleptsy stile trap because they are wicked fast sooo-I will copy your trap and trigger system and see if I can incorporate both poles into the rope that will need to go between trees holding kill sticks. Have no idea if it will work but it will give me something to work on. Thank you for your video.
Perhaps some stashed away, sharp broadheads, omitting the pointed pegs, on a longer swinging pole so the critter has to cover more ground if it bolts.Follow the blood trail to your kill if it wanders away.
Thank you Carlos, John.
How long did it take you to make for the first time? Thank you for your comments, John.
Looks like an excellent trap
+dalton vickers Thank you for watching and your comment.
Thank you! I think it would work well, John.
Hopefully, I can give you some helpful advise brother,. {1st}. A stick on the ground will not divert an animal off the trail that it normally travels. You have to put the trap on the trail, and you have to build it up slowly over a few days or so, any sudden changes will make them go around it .. {2nd}. You should make the trip wire a 3 point or 4 point, to catch the animal as it first walks into the zone, you can do this by making a triangle from the stake poles to the trigger pole. A 4 point, you need to add 2 adjacent stake poles parallel to the other stake poles, and attach the trip wire as to either side will make the trigger react. In my opinion a 3 point trip works better, because animals are normally walking the trails unless they are being chased or scared. ...{3rd}. The kill zone is too slow, you can increase the speed by attaching a spring pole opposite side of the hinge point, the shorter the hinge point pole the faster the swing falls and the more tension from the spring pole the faster the swing falls, with much more pressure, which is what is needed for trapping larger game. {4th}.... The spikes are way too large, the penetration will be blocked by the rib cage, maybe a broken rib. smaller spikes with sharper points will penetrate into the skin and go deeper into the lungs and heart, which will provide a better kill, if the animal does escape the trap, the penetration will give a blood trail to follow.
You have done a good job building this trap, I like it, from my experience I hope i can help you improve on your trapping. please don't take my advise as criticism, hopefully it is helpful. thank you for your video.. dave
I made fun of your traps one time but i take that back this is a amazing trap
That's a cool design. For those not so mechanically inclined, a longer trigger stick and more weight would make it swing harder. I like the way you think. I just did a short video on doing a deadfall with a trip wire. I set it up slightly different, you should check it out.
Thank you for your comments and for watching.
Hello john , great trap I've got to try this out , good stuff thanks for sharing atb Martin
Thank you for your comments, John.
I would do Both! I like salad and sides with my meat. It took me two hours to figure out the details of my idea and make it work. I could build another one in half the time now that I worked out the kinks, John.
Good idea! But is it fast enough to drive those spikes in and hold the animal?
Cool! another nugget of wisdom for our bag 'o survival tips :-) Love it!
nice traps the best I seen good job
Great trap. Reminds me of a similar version I once saw in J.O.T.C. Ft. Sherman Panama during land mine & booby trap course*
Simplicity is genius bro and I like your idea very much* Great stuff*
Thank you, John.
It doesn't look fast enough, to me. Animals react very quickly, and I suspect most will bolt out, or just straight up, before the spikes reach them. More weight will give more power, but not much more speed because the can't speed up gravity.I haven't had any problem with properly chosen spring poles losing their spring, especially since you're going to be checking them several times per day in a survival situation. I'd guess even a weak spring pole still has more speed than this trap, but I simply haven't had a problem with poles getting weak under normal use.Anyway, until you trap a few animals with this trap, I have my doubts.
+James Ritchie This trap was thought out completely.. If you think about the animal tripping the line with its front leg, it requires a reaction from the animal for the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. The time from being tripped to the time it would hit an animal is under one second.Unfortunately I can't actually use this trap and show it working.Thank you for watching and your comments.
+CommonSenseOutdoors why not?
its illegal thats why not
Hi Mate, thanks for share it... I have a suggestion, if you put a third stick in the middle of the two top ones and use a tree branch with a line (like the snare trap) to give more speed and force.
I am no positive I am understanding your suggestion... But to add a dead weight attached to cordage on this set wouldn't work. The cord would have to be strung through the path you need the animal to walk through... This set was pretty fast, but to make it faster, more weight can be added where I have the weight already. Thank you for your comments, John.
Centrifugal force is a bit of a red herring here. It's a phenomenon rather than a force, for one thing, and even then it's pointing in the wrong direction to drive the spikes. If I suggested that when you make a sharp right turn, the inertia pulling your body to the left makes the car go faster, I think you'd see clearly how that doesn't work.
You are probably looking for impact force from a falling object. Some is lost changing direction from vertical to horizontal, but knowing the mechanism should clarify the important factors.
F=mgh/s
You can't change acceleration due to gravity easily, nor stopping distance I'd imagine, so the variables you can play with are mass and change in height. Putting the log at the end of the arm means it will fall further, which means it converts more potential energy to kinetic energy when the trap fires. I think that's the right answer.
Neat widget in any case. ;)
+ExpressionAmidstCacophony Thank you for your comments and for watching.
are you fucking serious? so he said centrifugal force, no need to give a fucking science lesson, we know what he means, put the weight where its most effective for the trap, go fly your rocket somewhere else!
smash How sad.
Love your videos and like this trap. Couple things for discussion. I love the concept & I think it has promise, but not there yet. Animals have fast reactions and can even jump out of steel traps. I am wondering if this is too slow with the length of fall. Would it be more effective if the weighted spikes fell from behind the animal so they did not see it falling and aim for the back of the head? 2 could you add a tension rope spring to the arms to speed it up?
I think I'd put one more horizontal below the top horizontal for the spikes would go in- between them and also sandwich the animal better
Easy enough to do for added peace of mind, even as is will be enough though. Thank you for watching.
I've been watching all sorts of trapping videos lately for research, I have yet to practice any so I may be wrong here, but wouldn't it seem like an extra bit of efficiency to add some sort of spring system? It's a good base for a trap, i just think it can be improved upon is all. Though I may be wrong
Hey, i saw there more traps no just this one... for example this rock, that benched tree :D is these next traps or its just the wild? sry for my english
Nice trap and thank you for sharing it.The only thing I would change would be to add more weight to make it swing faster and give it more penetrating value.All in all though,it's an awesome build.
I did say more weight could be added for a larger game set up. But, you also have to be careful not to make it to fast. The animal will trip the line with it's front leg, and you want the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. If the trap is too fast it will hit in the shoulder, and not find the "bread basket".
Thank you for your comments and support, John.
Ahh yes..and that would damage good meat.
Thanks for pointing that out.
It's more about having the spikes hit the vitals of the animal than it is about damaging meat. The best bet for a good dispatch and timely exit of the animal is to hit the lung and heart area of the animal. Thank you for the reply, John.
would it make more sense to have your trip wire attached to the bottom of the 1st tree instead of in between the 2 trees? that way the trap would be tripped a little earlier thus not allowing the animal to possibly escape....considering how fast and alusive most animals are. just a thought. nice vid.
+Ryan Tettenburn Not really the case. Not only would you need two trip lines for what you are saying in order to cover both directions of travel. But, think of where the animals front leg is compared to where you want the spikes to strike behind the shoulder. This design requires the animal to have a reaction in order for the spikes to find their mark already.Thank you for watching and for your question and comments.
Beautiful trap I got two make one of them the spring cool........
I am glad you like it. Have fun with it and stay safe, John.
You'll need the arm to swing with a lot more force. You can use cordage for tension. It works like an upside down catapult.
this is essentially an over-engineered non-windless -- spike fall.
Great idea !! What about using RR spikes, with a little extra weight the force would be even greater.
Other materials could be used for sure. This was thought up with wilderness survival in mind. But if you were in a situation where things like RR spikes could be taken advantage of... Although they would be harder to lash to the rail. The wooden spikes are notched in a manner to keep them from being able to slip through the rail. Thank you for your comments, John.
this is effectively a vietcong door trap adapted to the animal trapping. I would say you could take this a step further and make one of the spikes a toggling point that breaks off in the animal and stops the animal from escaping either with a drag or just tying it directly to a large tree for a anchor.
barb the spikes
smash it's hard to make good barbs in wood due to the grain from the growth rings making them weak, bone does a lot better if you want barbs, that's why I suggested a toggle instead.
+SirLobsterman I'm very analytical so please forgive,i like thought of toggle and Incorporated it into my own variation...one longer spike w/shaft sticking out to the rear and point even w/others...add second drop frame w/second weight attached so it adds momentum and strikes longer toggle spike to ensure penetration..if not successful it would increase blood trail.. loosely space 2nd weight from 1st w/18"? sticks when setting trap to allow 2nd hammer strike primarily to set toggle
Jack Springer sounds good, would rip a nice hole while being pulled out or cause a lot more damage to internals in a attempt to. my thought was like a toggling harpoon tip, the word harpoon was at a loss to me at the time of the original posting of this comment.
would it be overkill to place conceiled spikes on the crossbar as well ? so the animal could pull off to it"s uninjured side?
It's not a bad idea, I like your thinking. But, you do want the animal walking by as close to the cross bar as possible and spikes on it would force the animal that much further from it. The trap should do the job without an opposing spike rail as well. But, if I was going to play with the design at all, your idea would be an option. Thank you for your comments.
nice idea sorry this is a few years late but if your still playin with it, i would use a old tire an roll through the thing to determine count time for a animal passing through it. as it looks its swinging alil slow and a tire being rolled as quick as possible through will help narrow in the timing, as well as possibly making the spike arm longer to cover the broader area of the length, of the animal to insure it doesn't get away . But over all very interesting trap an appears easy enough ta make,, Oh sorry also forgot ta mention if you move the weighted end up about 16 ta 24 inches higher it should create more speed swinging down as well as a greater impact.
+interestin The trap actually requires the animal to keep moving or have a reaction. The string is tripped by the front leg and the desired spike strike is behind the shoulder. With just a hair over one second from trip to strike I believe this timing to be highly accurate. The weight being as far to the end as possible causes the most forceful strike possible from centrifugal force. And the more spikes that are added the more force needed to drive the extra spikes in, much like walking on a bed of nails vs stepping on one nail. I have completely thought out all these issues and believe this to be the best option. Thank you for watching and for your input.
I think it looks fast enough but not heavy enough. From what I have come to understand is counter weight needs to be the weight of the animal or twice as much. The trap is valid but I feel it's undersized for the game this hunter speaks of. It would work for fox or coyote but for pig, deer or goat it's just a bit small and the spikes were just a bit low. I'm not saying it would not kill the animal I'm just saying you would have to track it after the strike. All and all good trap, I would like to see more. Good job hunter.
+Tim Cirulis The piece of log on there is much heavier than it looks, but adding more weight it also easy enough. I think what I said was it could be scaled larger for deer, not that this one would work for deer. There will most likely be a tracking issue on an animal after being hit by this trap, with 3 or 4 holes in the animal it should be an easy track. Thank you for watching and your comments.
If you got more I'd like to see it give me links.
What I show here on this trap is all I have done with it. I cant legally test it out or anything.
Thank you for the info. I like this and you did a great job with it.
Tim Cirulis Thank you.
My only thought watching this video is the same as everyone else. That the trap goes off too slowly, missing any animal faster than a sloth. I don't want to sound negative at all as this would be a good design in a survival situation. I was thinking of what you could do in order to increase the speed that this trap springs. My solution, you run a couple wraps of cord between the two large trees and then twist the entire spiked arm around that cord multiple times. As you do this the cord is going to start pulling those two trees together and produce a lot of spring tension. This would make the trap close more like a mouse trap, rather than just gravity fall. Also, it is going to pin the animal to the tree. Of course this will make the trap more dangerous to set, so adding the spikes to the trap would be done after the trap is wound. Also, you will need a beefed up trigger.
I understand you are saying to turn the whole thing into a giant kleptsy style trap. You need to understand a few things about this design before you dismiss it though.
1. think about where the animals front leg is compared to where you want the spikes to strike. This design Requires the animal to have a reaction to the trap being tripped in order for the spikes to hit behind the shoulder.
2. if a one second time period from trap tripped to spikes strike (which is needed for the trap to work) is too slow... I believe I said once or twice that more weight could easily be added.
and 3. A "sloth"? You are giving an animals reaction time too much credit. I know exactly where your thinking is and understand it completely as I have bow hunted for about 20 years. But, lets take a deer's reaction for example. Would the deer's first reaction be to move forward out of the trap? Not likely... Most often and I believe in this situation most always, the deer's first reaction will be to drop (or duck the string). So, with the animals initial reaction not being straight away, we have used up part of the traps one second travel time... And still need the animal to move forward 10-12 inches in order for the spikes to find their mark.
This trap "goes off too slowly"? I would disagree, as I put much thought into its design.
Thank you for your comments, would love a reply after considering comment, John.
I love the simplicity. Have you ever successfully killed an animal with this design ?
awesome man you helped me out a great deal ty so much.
Thank you for watching and for your kind words.
I order it online in 1000 foot spools (5 spool minimum per order). You can find shorter hanks all over ebay bud, John.
Very cool design, thanks for the video, looks like it needs to be more heavy duty or heavier, did it work? Thanks!
Thank you for comments. I have no legal means to actually use this trap on an animal unless in a survival scenario. But, all my hunting and trapping experience says there is no reason it will not perform.
everything should work as planned according to theory but one never truly knows until its tried and tested!
Where do you get your 550 paracord bro?
Since I left military I don't live near any U.S. Calvary stores or Ranger Joe's.
No military surplus stores near me either*
could you put spikes on that cross bar also so it it holds them in place better?
Could be done. This is not going to likely be an instant kill still and the animal will likely still thrash its way out.. But, they won't get far and the blood trail should be obvious. Thank you for watching.
i think it needs more weight to slam harder to make sure those stakes penetrate. i realize this is for demonstration but im not sure that it would stab them as is. i am thinking it would bounce off
+Taraz Pariseau I really should have figure out something I could have used for a "trap dummy" on this one. Something I could have put in front of the spikes to show how much penetration it would get. Thank you for watching.
i wasnt giving you a hard time, it was just an observation. in a shtf scenario you can bet i will try it out and would have you to thank for the knowledge. :)
Taraz Pariseau I didn't take your comment as giving me a hard time. Just saying, it is easy to question the spikes penetration because I didn't come up with a better way to demo it.
In fact I think I mentioned (maybe more than once even) that more weight could easily be added to this.
Thank you for your reply.
+CommonSenseOutdoors you mention more weight could be added for larger game....said was just fine for fox coyotes hogs pigs....and for some reason i dont think that your current trap set up would even kill a rabbit
tloutfitter Would you like to try and crawl through it to prove a point?
I think you could add a better engine to this system than gravity. Of course the trigger would need to be worthy of higher tension with something like a windlass.
Love this concept. Do you think it is fast enough? The reason I ask is that I animals can jump steel traps and anything that moves will spook an animal. With that said, I love the chole concept. I originally found your twisted rope traps and have actually used that concept in portable thumper traps using 1x4's for birds and squirrels. I love your vids and hope to see you doing them for a lot of years to come.
+TheKlickitat If you time it, from setting it off to when it hits the crossbar is a hair over one second. This means I there was an animal there, the spikes make contact with the animal in under one second. I also take into account that the animal trips the trap with it's front leg and I want the spikes to strike behind the shoulder. This requires a continuation of the animals movement or a reaction to obtain. Thank you very much for your comments and support.
What if you used the sampling spring technique in conjunction with this? Then you'd have gravity and potential energy working together. Some spring might leave the saplings over time, but it could give this trap the push it needs to make it faster. Just some random thoughts. Love the trap!
great vid!!! this would work great.
Could a v-notch behind the spike help so the animal cant shake it out kind of like a barbed hook
Great video!
I couldn't hurt anything. Although, an animal hit by this (even if they get free of the spikes and wander off) will leave a solid blood trail and will not make it far. Thank you for watching and for your comments.
Sweet trap
you could increase the speed by raising the position of the weight on the swinging arms.
I had previously replied to this comment, however it did not post. Not only will raising the weight not increase the speed, but it would reduce the force in which the spikes strike. Thank you for watching.
CommonSenseOutdors actually it would increase the speed although you would have to increase the weight it's simple physics you can't increase the speed of gravity but you can decrease the distance the bulk of the weight falls then project it outwards with a light pole such as in the case of a catapult where a slow falling heavy object sends a lighter projectile flying with greater speed.
I made it just to test it it wors so good thanks i just set it of with a stick
Nice design...But it needs tweaking...at 12:37- you sprung the trap...Spikes hit home at a tad over 12:38..over one full second of sticks flying around...I dunno, maybe critters are more skittish east of the Mississippi... I once saw a raccoon jump almost 3 feet when he startled a grasshopper,LMAO..anyway...just something to think about. Oh..my son just watched it, said maybe greasing the pivot stick with lard or tallow might speed it up..or maybe twin trip wires set apart to make up the time difference...just throwing out our thoughts...Keep up the good work.
You are very correct on the reaction time! But, you forgot to account for one thing... The animal will trigger the trap with a front leg... And you want the spikes to hit behind the shoulder. So, my trap design counts on the animal to have a reaction in order to hit the correct spot on the animal, behind the shoulder.
The speed of the swing arm can be increased with more weight added to it (which I think I mentioned). But, you don't want it so fast that it hits the shoulder either.
I hope this makes sense and makes you feel better about the design. Thank you for your comments, John.
CommonSenseOutdoors Animal will most likely back up and watch the thing fall in front of him. I tried same idea and thats exactly what happened to me by the looks of tracks on the ground. Animal didn't step forward into trap. I improved speed of the drop with a tight line on arm angled downward, Might at least hit next animal in neck as he sets trip wire.
i think you should have a little more weight overall, but its really cool!!!
Thank you for watching and for your comments.
Great video, thanks 4 the info. :)
Like it,good job
If you can get results out of that set, then hey, nobody's got the wherewithal to argue ya'. I would, however, look to a simpler option which doesn't require as much gear, prep or set-up. Were it me, I'd rather spend more of my energy in baiting the trap to ensure I am attracting game to my trap. I think you would get much more success with a flip-up trap, which is nothing more than a snare set attached to the end of a long pole tied off to the side of a tree. When triggered, the top-end of the pole provides counterweight and the business end pulls the snare tight. A 10' long 5-6" spruce pole will easily lift animals smaller than 55lb right up off of the ground, (attached 4' up the tree with 3' of the pole on the snare end and 7' of the pole acting as the counterweight), and it'll prevent animals of greater size/weight from being able to lay down. That's important because as soon as other animals smell blood, they'll be right there to inspect it and go for a free meal. Hanging the animal leaves no blood trail. Here's a fella' from Northwest Territories, Canada, who has recorded his results, (Please turn your volume down if you have little ones around - this fella's got a pretty wet tongue).
ua-cam.com/video/YaRv3x9EC68/v-deo.html
+CommonSenseOutdoors Just as a follow-up to what I posted, I'm not denying you of any personal triumph in thinking through and constructing the trap you've crafted. I don't want you to think I'm being critical of your trap - surely you get enough of that from know-it-all city kids who'd think a conibear trap was for catching conibears. The only concerns I have, (if you don't mind me passing on a little bit of bushcraft wisdom), in this design are, 1.) its still swinging freely once tripped. Perhaps if you were to make it a side-mount or at least set it at a 70-75 degree angle to keep some of the weight putting downward pressure on the pegs, it would make it much more difficult for prey to escape. And 2.) by design, this trap will cause an injury to an animal that will surely attract other predators. Surely the idea behind the trap is to ensure you're the one getting a meal; not a bear, wolf, or big cat. Personally - and I by no means own a patent on the idea - I sewed a flap of burlap to the underside of my ruck where I could put a conibear 110 and a 220 on the outside of my pack without impacting weight distribution. They're out of the way, easy to access, and when I set my ruck down they actually help hold it upright, (unintended positive result). If you don't have conibear traps, or if you're in an area where only snares are legal, I would seriously look into a flip-up set like I was talking about earlier.
+JussTreddn The whole idea here as with a couple other sets I have shown is that for at least the first catch in a situation.. bait could be an issue. I believe it is important to have a few traps and sets that will catch animals being baitless. I do appreciate your comments and I am taking them as helpful opinions, Thank you for taking the time.
its set on a fresh game trail what are you talking about bait for? wasting bait that could go in another trap set with different scenario
Why would you save "bait that could go in another trap set with a different scenario"? If you're going to spend the amount of time required to create a trap such as this, you likely expect a return on your investment. Irregardless, on every trap set, every effort should be made to ensure its' success. Saving bait? You might as well spare the trap.
because the trap is portable once you have spent the time!
Nice trap
+Kevin Grant Thank you.
Dangerous but effective me thinks.
think you'd do better with a heavy windlass with spikes up a vertical instead of horizontal.
Like the the trap
Thank you, John.
It looked so big until you got close to it lol
have you ever deployed this trap?
A true survival situation or maybe a television production with permission is the only way to legally leave this trap set and operational. Thank you for watching.
gonna make this trap at my next tree stand so ill see who keeps stealing the things
That's what trail cameras are for, John.
Reading through your replies, I notice you keep mentioning adding more weight to increase the "speed" of the trap. Remember, a BB and a cannon ball fall at the same rate. Google "Newtons laws". You would however need MUCH more weight to drive those 4 spikes through an animal. You might be better off with just 1 or 2 spikes, less surface area to distribute the force(think bed of nails).
+virtualgib That is for rate of gravity, are you considering centrifugal force in this application? more weight at the end of an arm swinging that is fixed at the other end most certainly is increased in speed and force (similar to how a sling or bolas work).You are correct that less spikes require less force, but even if four spikes penetrate say three inches.. would two spikes penetrating say six inches be better? or would the four holes in an animal bleed it out faster?
Have you done any testing to see how much weight it would take to push those 4 spikes through a deer hide, much less 3 inches into it? Also, Mass does not affect the rate of a pendulum's swing, which is essentially what you are building.
virtualgib First of all, this one was not scaled big enough for deer, believe I said medium game. I did not thoroughly test this trap while I had it assembled.. however, I have tested the toughness of animals my whole life through trapping, hunting, bow hunting, and many hides through taxidermy. I have complete confidence the trap will do the job.
"mass does not affect the rate of a pendulum's swing"... Really?
So, what you are saying is a stick on a rope and a log on a rope.. released from the same point.. Both travel at the same speed and hit with the same force?
You stand in front of the log and I will let the stick hit me.
Same speed, yes. Same force, no.
+virtualgib this guy might think he is smart...but in all accuality...fail...youtube warrior...