Somehow I only discovered A Curious Feeling a couple years ago, and it has really grown on me. I think it's actually a very strong album with great songs across the board. For A While is a lovely pop song with a touching vocal and melody. Tony has a lot to be proud of putting this together virtually by himself.
I've always liked it since it came out, although I don't play it much these days. Not because it isn't good, just so many other things have come along.
A Curious Feeling didn't totally blow me away, but I think it's certainly far better than one would think when listening to especially Ken Golden and Luis Nasser here. Then again, I'm a fairly devoted Tony Banks fan (apologist?), and his musical language has resonated with me ever since I was a kid. There is no doubt in my mind that he was the heart and soul of Genesis, and that's simply because he wrote most of the music (plus numerous of the lyrics too), both in the Peter Gabriel era and after. So, if you're gonna blame him for the 'bad' in Genesis, you have to also give him much credit for the 'good'.
IMO no need to apologize for liking Banks...About the songwriting it's hard to say exactly how much he wrote, versus the other members. There's a web chat board specifically about that subject. Many tracks are credited to all members - across the first 6 albums they list Banks as the main/only songwriter on only like 6 total tracks (and for some of those it's primarily for lyrics). Could be incorrect of course...
@@wolf1977 That's definitely incorrect. I'm not totally sure how it was when Anthony Phillips was in the band (they have always emphasized his importance in the early Genesis), but Tony Banks writing/mainly writing only six songs on the first six albums?! Total nonsense. Officially they credited the whole band on every song when Peter Gabriel (and Anthony Phillips) was in the band. However, there is a fairly recent Genesis book (by Mario Giammetti, 2020) where the actual writers on most of the songs are revealed; Banks is all over the renewed credits (sole composer of songs like "Time Table", "Firth of Fifth", "In the Cage" "The Lamia", and main composer of e.g. "Watcher of the Skies", "Supper's Ready" and "The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway" etc etc. The official writing credits on A Trick of the Tail should tell something; Banks is credited on all of the album's 8 songs (2 solo credits), whereas the second guy (Rutherford) has 4 co-writes. On Wind and Wuthering, Banks has 3 solo compositions and 3 co-writes; no one else comes even close! Amazing that this has to even be argued.
@@askoholli9306 Not arguing, just pointing out that there are some chat boards out there that paint a different picture (correctly or not), and that the album notes themselves mainly list all/multiple members for most of the (music) songwriting credits - until Trick where as you pointed out Banks dominates (and Rutherford takes 'a step back' - result of Gabriel leaving?). For example on Selling England both Banks & Rutherford get equal amount of credit (5 each) for the music, and Gabriel has 4. Similar for Foxtrot...Again the actual truth could be different. I haven't read the book you mentioned & obviously wasn't there when these songs were written - I have no reason to dispute Giammetti's info (which presumably came directly from the band's members)...
Have had all of these since 1979-80 and they’ve been part of my history. So following my heart on my rankings: 1. Smallcreep’s Day (wish it’d be re-released with Compression and any other goodies) 2. Curious Feeling (I know it’s a bit light-weight, but there’s an earnestness to it that I dig) 3. Voyage of the Acolyte (agree that it’s a classic. Just don’t turn to it as much as the first two) 4. Car (I love Humdrum, Solsbury, Moribund, and Modern Love, but side 2 bores me for whatever reason)
Preciously I suggested the same thing with the YES solo albums circa 1973 to 1979. Anything to make Dr. Nasser listen to Olias of Sunhillow would be comedy gold.
Brings me to tears every time too, but now for a different reason. Smallcreeps Day was a huge favorite of my Dad who passed away in 2023. He’d gush over how awesome Phillips was on that album, and especially the string arrangements on that track. RIP Dad, thank you for introducing me to all this great music.
I'm glad you brought up Tony being the dictator. Peter has said things about when he and Tony were at Charterhouse together that suggested that. He has said that Tony's response to his personal situation at the time of The Lamb led to his leaving. Steve has said that Tony was the one that nixed his stuff for Wind And Wuthering, and also complained that Steve was keeping his best stuff for solo albums, and also didn't think Steve should make solo albums at all. When they did the reunion thing, Tony says Daryl plays Steve's solo on Firth Of Fifth better than Steve..Steve being a little stiff. Funny...Tony fluffed up his intro to the same song live once, and they omitted it from then on. But Steve's keyboard player plays it live no problem. Hmmm. One final thing - Tony has said that he resented the solo success of the other guys. He probably got more writing credits than anybody.
It's ironic that Tony had the least success of all the members. Because, even Phil's admitted that what most people love about Genesis is what Tony's brought to the band.
@@johnmavroudis2054 Hackett was a trouble maker and a problem, apparently from early on. 'Voyage..' and 'Please Don't..' contain nothing I would want to hear from a would-be Genesis album.
Cool episode. Love when the episodes go tangential. That discussion on The Who and what the band might have been like with Collins on skins, was fascinating. Great stuff, chaps... 👏👏👏
The only one I'm familiar with is Steve Hackett's "Voyage of the Acolyte". I bought it after I read an article in Guitar Player magazine. It was an interview with Alex Lifeson and he said it influenced him greatly. It's why the second side of "Caress of Steel" (his words) sounds like Hackett. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Oh, boy. Oooh! Need more like this theme. Anticipation. Yes guys next? I think you already did something like Yes solos, seem to remember? On record for voting Peter windshield rain. Hackett a close second.
Cannot wait. Acolyte is a perfect album and PG1 hardly puts a foot wrong. I've tried for years to like the Rutherford and there is good stuff there but not close to Steve or Peter.
Our local radio station played the entire Windshield album on the day it was released and I thought it was a great album. I have a soft spot for this abum!
In The Air Tonight was used in the Miami Vice pilot - where Crockett and Tubbs are chasing after Calderon (the drug lord) towards the end - the Ferrari racing through the streets of Miami. As for the replacement drummers in The Who - Martin Chambers, Zac Starkey, Mark Brezczicki, Roger Taylor, Stewart Copeland, Cozy Powell and Carl Palmer all feature on the title track of Roger Daltrey's 1985 solo album 'Under a Raging Moon'....what a line up!
These album wars always seem easy to predict because there are 1-2 of the choices that are clearly better or been discussed on the show before (so one knows how much the participants like those albums). This one will be won by either Gabriel or Hackett and, whoever does not win, will likely finish second. I know this is extremely difficult, but it would generate more fun discussion and banter if four equally strong albums were selected and folks had to really struggle with them and end up ranking them differently. This is done well on the 4Fusion Friday show.
I actually thought something similar going in but found, after relistening, that for me anyway the two underdogs here (Rutherford & Banks) won out. I suspect I'm in the minority but that's OK...
Wow...I'm a big Genesis fan but really had no clue that Rutherford did a solo record in 79/80 with the great Simon Phillips on drums!? And Tony Banks first record has Chester Thompson on it. Gotta check them out stat.
Yes I think those are two really good records that often get overlooked due to the focus on Hackett & Gabriel - and to be fair Rutherford's Mike & The Mechanics project was a flop. IMO Banks' A Chord Too Far is a must own! And Anthony Phillips has tons of good records out
John Beaudin of Rock History Music described Smallcreep’s Day as his favorite album. He did Interview vocalist Noel McCalla and Simon Phillips. I take that album over any Mechanics album.
If it's a question of what is the best Prog album among these four, then the answer is Hackett's. If the question is best album of songs, then it's Gabriel's.
I've been waiting for a coverage on a band and all of the member's debut solo albums, this one was definitely worth the wait. It's only fitting that it's Genesis especially as everyone have all had great solo careers, some which are highly successful. As a fan, I have to go with Steve Hackett 'Voyage Of The Acolyte' as it is not only a fantastic debut which has legendary music but in some ways it's kind of like the lost great Genesis album due to the fact that it featured material that the band rejected. All of the Genesis members have put out fine debut albums but for me Hackett's still remains to this day untouchable
Thanks to Ken and Luis for verbalising why I could never get into the Rutherford and Banks albums. I always thought it was my fault for not trying hard enough, but they're just lacklustre for the most part.
1. Tony Banks 2. Steve Hackett. 3.Peter Gabriel. 4. Mike Rutherford. The numbers 1 and 2 are so close but “A Curious Feeling” is potentially in my top 20 albums of all time by anyone if only I could decide on a definitive top 20. I simply go on one of the best musical journeys ever with “A Curious Feeling” and I am deeply immersed in its beauty from the first second to the very last. For me, Kim Beacon’s soulful singing is just perfect.
Tony Banks was the heart of Genesis, no doubt. If anyone was the leader and musical director, it was him. I know lots of prog fans like to shit on the guy for his personality (i.e. being a dick to Hackett) and taking the band in a more pop direction, but the importance of his influence and creative input in the early stuff that we prog fans love cannot be overstated.
@@coltonbeatty6117 That's true. Banks always tried to keep the band somewhat progressive when the other two wanted pure pop. That's just another reason prog fans shouldn't shit on him so much. I think from Abacab onwards, the creative control was pretty evenly split between the three of them, but everything prior to that, Banks is the clear leader and primary creative force. There's really no need for prog fans to hate on him except that he was a dick to Hackett and maybe kept him down creatively somewhat. But Genesis is a keyboard-driven band and that's the way it was always going to be. Hackett is a genius but I'm fine with where he is in the mix.
Curious, Smallcreep's, Voyage, Gab 1, (Geese) in that order are my preferred tastes although Voyage is the proggiest. All classics (except Geese although good) for me.
1. Smallcreep's Day (fine lead by Mike on Working in Line) 2. Voyage 3.Car (primarily for Solsbury Hill) strange chords? 4. Curious Feeling 5. Geese and the Ghost ( bucolic England) All records very good!!
Hackett's first album would rank high in Genesis catalog...best of the 4 first album, though I do like the "Peter Gabriel" self titled quartet better as a whole.
Great episode. My favs are 1. Hackett, 2. Gabriel, 3, Rutherford, 4. Banks. I have a soft spot for the Rutherford album. I like Luis' "serious question" towards the end. He is on point. I've asked the same question before and I agree with answers and views on the subject. I am guilty of being loyal and a completist regarding certain artists. For example, I have Giant For A Day in my collection both on CD and LP.
Anthony Philips was a better guitar player than Rutherford which is why MR was on bass but the bass playing on those Hackett era Genesis albums is sublime. I saw Steve with Genesis three times in the 70s and countless times since; his playing just gets better everytime . Can't wait for the Lamb tour, with lots of stuff from his new album.
Among Genesis fans A curious feeling is reveered. I think it is good. As a whole it does not work completely but it has 3 o4 songs really great. No more hammond, mellotron of course. I'ts 1979. But tasty layers. After the lie to me is a classic.
This is great. For what it's worth, my order is 4 Tony Banks - A Curious Feeling. Sounds to me like background music 3 Mike Rutherford - Smallcreeps Day. I like side 1, side 2 not so much. 2 Peter Gabriel - "Car". A good album which would be great without the aforementioned barbershop song but fair play to PG for trying it. 1. Steve Hackett - Voyage of the Acolyte. Simply outstanding; the fact that I knew Steve's father and he got Steve to personally sign me a copy has nothing to do with my comments.
Great episode, gentlemen! For me, my ranking of these goes like this: 1. Steve 2. Peter 3. Tony 4. Mike All are fantastic but I feel like Steve’s Voyage Of The Acolyte is almost a lost Genesis album.
They're right, 'Face Value" definitely wasn't prog, but it's probably the most honest, because it's Phil's true feelings about what he was going through at the time. Phil says he played "In The Air Tonight" for the band before "Face Value" was put together. But Tony says he doesn't remember that, and he says if he had heard it, he would've wanted Genesis to do it.
As many stated , Gabriel and Hackett are easily top two of these four. My top choice today is Gabriel's Car though this can change day to day or listen to listen. Thanks to all in the episode for taking time to listen to all four of these for the discussions.
Good morning from New York City. Four very good solo albums, sadly I couldn’t attend this recording (yet again) although just me personally I love “Face Value” more than any other former mates solo debut. I’m with Eric, I love Peter Gabriel yet I find his solo material post “Security” more miss than hit.
Mad props to Mike Rutherford’s Smallcreep’s Day. A fantastic record for the time. My ranking is 4. Tony Banks-A Curious Feeling 3. Peter Gabriel-Car 2. Mike Rutherford-Smallcreep’s Day 1. Steve Hackett-Voyage of the Acolyte
Where's Anthony Philllips - The Geese and The Ghost? That would be my number 1... otherwise: 1.Steve Hackett - Voyage of the Acolyte 2.Tony Banks - A Curious Feeling 3.Peter Gabriel - Car 4.Mike Rutherford - Smallcreeps Day
How I hear it. 1Steve Hackett 2Tony Banks 3 Peter Gabriel 4 Mike Rutherford. Gabriel's solo albums would get better and him finding his way Mike Rutherford is good thus sound to pre Mike and The Mechanics so and Genesis would be mostly secondly dominating the 80s so Collins would have his say with some solo albums and the other two and Collins doing Genesis. Hackett in the 80's would somewhat along eclipsing Genesis and today the main solo artists of Genesis Steve running away with the sound of mesmerizing music. May change opinion after hearing the panel. Hackett always number one.
Has anyone seen the last Genesis documentary in which the 5 of them sit together and talk about the bands history? I am still to this day unhappy with the way they did Steve Hackett dirty. He had next to no screen time. And when he did speak, the look on Tony's face? Damn.
Would also be fun to use one episode to pick the best album of four different bands and then do a follow up episode where those four band's best albums are in an Album War or combine it into one longer episode. For example, take Marillion, Transatlantic, Spock's Beard and Porcupine Tree. My choices for best albums would be: Marillion - Misplaced Childhood Transatlantic - Bridge Across Forever Spock's Beard - Beware of Darkness Porcupine Tree - In Absentia It would be a real struggle for me to rank those four albums, fun exercise!
Acolyte for me. Saw Steve 1st time ever @ the Orpheum in L.A. late last year, opened with Wands, I was so stoked! Also Im a total gearhead. Ive often wondered what other than a ES 335, LP & SG does Pete have on his cool guitar stand. Most of what I watch on YT aside from metal/prog content is gear related.
I'm going totally left field here: 4. Smallcreep's Day - only because I've never really heard it 3. Voyage Of The Acolyte - it's a good album but for me, Spectral Mornings is Steve's best solo album despite The Ballad Of The Decomposing Man. 2. Peter Gabriel 1 AKA Car - Peter was trying to find his feet here, but I love it all apart from Excuse Me. 1. A Curious Feeling - I love And Then There Were Three and I love this. Tony's solo career has been underwhelming, but this album is easily his best.
Cool show men, but l knew that it would go the way that it went. (“Go the Way You Go?” Hmmm… ) l have a slightly contrarian take on these four: 4. Tony Banks ~ A Curious Feeling 3. Mike Rutherford ~ Smallcreep’s Day 2. Steve Hackett ~ Voyage of the Acolyte 1. Peter Gabriel ~ 1 (Car). The Gabriel debut is my favorite album by him. 1. I love the songs and the diversity. 2. Great supporting cast of musicians. 3. I’m a huge fan of Bob Ezrin’s production work. 4. I’m the odd duck - quack - who loves “Excuse Me.” 5. No duff tracks on Peter’s album - same as Steve - l just happen to love Gabriel’s record a wee bit more. Keep up the stellar, and interstellar, work. Cheers from Chuck’s Big Apple. Rock Out and Prog On! Your clone and mine, ~ The Devastatingly Divine & Diverse Davey Cretin, from CRETIN CLASSICS.
It's a good thing tastes are different. I usually don't want to create lists like this, it's like picking one child over another, but I thought Tony Banks needs a bit more love. I think ACF is brilliant but the others are really good too. 😎. 1. A Curious Feeling 2. Smallcreep's Day / Voyage of the Acolyte 3. Peter Gabriel I
My ranking: 1 - Steve 2 - Tony 3 - Mike 4 - Peter You're so hard with Tony. He wasn't really the one who fired Steve, more Mike. And his album had gorgeous mélodies and chords progressions. Of course it sounds a lot like ATTWT and Duke, but that's pretty normal.
Loved this. I wouldn’t disagree with the overall view. I know it would mess with the format, but the first Phil Collins album would put the cat amongst the pigeons as it is significant in the history of music for the drum sound he extracts. That being said, y the time Peter Gabriel released his third album (Melt) he’d left everyone trailing a long way back. What mystifies me about Tony Banks is how good his work was in Genesis before they went down to a three piece. Where there are writing credits, his stuff was fantastic. What happened? Looking forward to seeing Steve Hackett in October.
I haven't listened to Mike's and Tony's records but to answer Pete's question at the end, yes, I would have the other two in a different order so Peter wins and Steve comes in second. My favorite Hackett solo record is by a long shot Spectral Mornings so... Amazingly enough, only a year ago I wasn't into PG's solo catalog at all...! Around the time I got into prog-Genesis in 2004 I did try listening to it but it never clicked with me at all. Over the years I tried again a once or twice and...nothing. I didn't even like Solsbury Hill! But around last November we had a Genesis Top 40 countdown-thread over at the Steve Hoffman Forum where around 100 participants submitted their own ranking of forty Genesis songs and then the thread host did the number crunching and presented the master ranking list in a countdown format over a three week period. These are loads of fun and the discussion is great. During this countdown Peter's solo career of course came up and I finally decided to take one last shot at it by watching a concert video from 1978 on UA-cam. I LOVED IT!!! I then went and listened to his debut album on Apple Music and I LOVED IT. Now I'm a huge fan of almost all of his studio albums and yes, I adore his latest record as well, I/O. It's immensely listenable! So, Eric, if I can go from being completely indifferent for twenty years to being a big fan, well, I guess there is still hope for you as well! 🙂
You all got the correct winner. STEVE HACKETT's "VOYAGE OF THE ACOLYTE" is a SUPERB album from beginning to end. I'm a huge Peter Gabriel fan and I love his solo debut, but this was an easy call. Having said that, there were so many great songs on that Gabriel album (Shoutout to "MORIBUND THE BURGERMEISTER"... which never gets enough love... and it's THE most GENESIS song Gabriel ever did, post-Genesis... Whoever said it should have been on the Lamb was spitting facts. It's THAT good.) I CONSTANTLY played the "What if that Hackett song was on a Genesis album... and there's a wealth of material from his first four solo albums that would have been as good, if not better, than a few of the songs that made the album. "Shadow of the Hierophant," "A Tower Struck Down," ""Ace Of Wands," "Please Don't Touch," "Narnia," "Every Day," "Clocks," "Spectral Mornings," "The Steppes," "Slogans," "Jacuzzi"... any of those would have been fantastic if folded into the Genesis catalog. Gabriel and Hackett were the edge that made Genesis truly great. As for my rankings: 1. HACKETT - Voyage 2. GABRIEL - Gabriel I 3. RUTHERFORD - Smallcreep's 4. BANKS - Curious
I would flip flop back and forth between Hackett & Gabriel in the #1 spot. I do wonder why you left off Collins & Phillips. Phillips remained influential beyond his Genesis exit, especially considering his work on Smallcreep’s Day and working with Gabriel on the demos for his first solo album. I would be interested in your rankings of the individual members solo albums within their own silos. For instance, I think Hackett’s Wild Orchids is his best album, Voyage is second, Spectral Mornings third, etc.
You all seem to mention that Bob Ezrin produced Kiss and Alice Cooper and Lou Reed and how unusual this was a choice, but didn't he also do Pink Floyd's The Wall which is definitely in the prog universe and the same time frame as these albums?
Impossible to decide. I bought all these records as they came out, and I thought they were masterworks in their own right. But the comparison is a little unfair as they were published in very different periods of time. Let's put them in Genesis' timeline. 75- Hackett, 77- Gabriel (after a 2-year hiatus) and Phillips (after a longer hiatus). 79- Banks, 80- Rutherford and I would add Collins' Face value which was out in 81. Imagine a Genesis record in 1980 with The lie/after the lie (Banks), Moonshine (Rutherford), You (Banks), In the air tonight (Collins) Somebody else's dream (Banks) and Smallcreep (Rutherford). You have a 55-minute record, which would have been better than Duke. In fact, it could have been a double album!
1) Voyage of the Acolyte 2) A Curious Feeling 3) Car 4) Smallcreep's Day. To me as a guitar player, Tony Banks is Genesis and their manager even said Genesis was Tony Banks' solo project. Even some of his worst work is near the top of this list because it's all about melody for me and the development of it. Check out this Faye Dunaway movie score by Banks: ua-cam.com/video/ZIocCoonTOY/v-deo.html
Way late to this ballgame. As I hear them: 4. Tony Banks - "A Curious Feeling" 3. Mike Rutherford - "Small Creeps Day" 2. Peter Gabriel - "Peter Gabriel" (a.k.a.: car) 1. Steve Hackett - "Voyage of the Acolyte"
"The Geese & the Ghost" deserved a place in this war, but "Voyage" is the absolute winner anyway!
I like Geese too - about on par with the Gabriel debut for me
Love the g & g.. probably my personal dark horse winner of the bunch!
@@CBell-dt3pvwould be second for me, Voyage is my fav.
The Geese a bit too mellow and suffers from lack of variation. And Ant needed someone else and not him singing Collection.
absolutely! Ant Philips' is my no 1!
Steve was the George Harrison of Genesis. Voyage was his All
Things Must Pass, blowing everything else away
That is a very interesting take
Interesting analogy. I will not disagree.
But, what's ironic is he's the one out there keeping the music of Genesis alive. 75% of his show is Genesis material.
@@robertkramer2271 And he does it amazingly. It does show how central Steve was/is to the Genesis sound.
Steve Hackett sucks
Somehow I only discovered A Curious Feeling a couple years ago, and it has really grown on me. I think it's actually a very strong album with great songs across the board. For A While is a lovely pop song with a touching vocal and melody. Tony has a lot to be proud of putting this together virtually by himself.
Me too! It's a 'grower'
I've always liked it since it came out, although I don't play it much these days. Not because it isn't good, just so many other things have come along.
Steve Hackett is my #1 amongst these four, and I think it's head & shoulders above the others. Excellent discussion as always gents!
Voyage sucks you moron
A Curious Feeling didn't totally blow me away, but I think it's certainly far better than one would think when listening to especially Ken Golden and Luis Nasser here. Then again, I'm a fairly devoted Tony Banks fan (apologist?), and his musical language has resonated with me ever since I was a kid. There is no doubt in my mind that he was the heart and soul of Genesis, and that's simply because he wrote most of the music (plus numerous of the lyrics too), both in the Peter Gabriel era and after. So, if you're gonna blame him for the 'bad' in Genesis, you have to also give him much credit for the 'good'.
IMO no need to apologize for liking Banks...About the songwriting it's hard to say exactly how much he wrote, versus the other members. There's a web chat board specifically about that subject. Many tracks are credited to all members - across the first 6 albums they list Banks as the main/only songwriter on only like 6 total tracks (and for some of those it's primarily for lyrics). Could be incorrect of course...
@@wolf1977 That's definitely incorrect. I'm not totally sure how it was when Anthony Phillips was in the band (they have always emphasized his importance in the early Genesis), but Tony Banks writing/mainly writing only six songs on the first six albums?! Total nonsense.
Officially they credited the whole band on every song when Peter Gabriel (and Anthony Phillips) was in the band. However, there is a fairly recent Genesis book (by Mario Giammetti, 2020) where the actual writers on most of the songs are revealed; Banks is all over the renewed credits (sole composer of songs like "Time Table", "Firth of Fifth", "In the Cage" "The Lamia", and main composer of e.g. "Watcher of the Skies", "Supper's Ready" and "The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway" etc etc.
The official writing credits on A Trick of the Tail should tell something; Banks is credited on all of the album's 8 songs (2 solo credits), whereas the second guy (Rutherford) has 4 co-writes. On Wind and Wuthering, Banks has 3 solo compositions and 3 co-writes; no one else comes even close!
Amazing that this has to even be argued.
@@askoholli9306 Not arguing, just pointing out that there are some chat boards out there that paint a different picture (correctly or not), and that the album notes themselves mainly list all/multiple members for most of the (music) songwriting credits - until Trick where as you pointed out Banks dominates (and Rutherford takes 'a step back' - result of Gabriel leaving?). For example on Selling England both Banks & Rutherford get equal amount of credit (5 each) for the music, and Gabriel has 4. Similar for Foxtrot...Again the actual truth could be different.
I haven't read the book you mentioned & obviously wasn't there when these songs were written - I have no reason to dispute Giammetti's info (which presumably came directly from the band's members)...
1. Hackett
2. Gabriel
3. Rutherford
4. Banks
Have had all of these since 1979-80 and they’ve been part of my history. So following my heart on my rankings:
1. Smallcreep’s Day (wish it’d be re-released with Compression and any other goodies)
2. Curious Feeling (I know it’s a bit light-weight, but there’s an earnestness to it that I dig)
3. Voyage of the Acolyte (agree that it’s a classic. Just don’t turn to it as much as the first two)
4. Car (I love Humdrum, Solsbury, Moribund, and Modern Love, but side 2 bores me for whatever reason)
Hey we match! We're also in the definite minority here...🤷♂
@@wolf1977Yeah everyone’s taste is a little different. No worries 😊
Spot on, Louis. I honestly believe Steve Hackett's talent scared the crap out of Banks. Steve's Genesis Revisited tours are a Revelation.
nail on the head , your right on their
Interesting and austounding, that all the members released solo albums of great quality, in the prime of thier career.
Preciously I suggested the same thing with the YES solo albums circa 1973 to 1979. Anything to make Dr. Nasser listen to Olias of Sunhillow would be comedy gold.
Or fish out of water
This is a great idea. I really hope they do this. I love Olias but having Luis rank it last would be hilarious.
Anthony Phillips's keyboard work on "At the End of the Day" is so powerful and moving. I got choked up the first time I heard the ending of that song.
Brings me to tears every time too, but now for a different reason. Smallcreeps Day was a huge favorite of my Dad who passed away in 2023. He’d gush over how awesome Phillips was on that album, and especially the string arrangements on that track. RIP Dad, thank you for introducing me to all this great music.
@@greg.shred83 What a moving tribute to your dad. That's wonderful!!
Really like Christian's involvement in the Prog Seat. I know he has been involved for quite a while, but I've not given him his due yet. Nice job
Hey, thanks man.
I'm glad you brought up Tony being the dictator. Peter has said things about when he and Tony were at Charterhouse together that suggested that. He has said that Tony's response to his personal situation at the time of The Lamb led to his leaving. Steve has said that Tony was the one that nixed his stuff for Wind And Wuthering, and also complained that Steve was keeping his best stuff for solo albums, and also didn't think Steve should make solo albums at all. When they did the reunion thing, Tony says Daryl plays Steve's solo on Firth Of Fifth better than Steve..Steve being a little stiff. Funny...Tony fluffed up his intro to the same song live once, and they omitted it from then on. But Steve's keyboard player plays it live no problem. Hmmm. One final thing - Tony has said that he resented the solo success of the other guys. He probably got more writing credits than anybody.
It's ironic that Tony had the least success of all the members. Because, even Phil's admitted that what most people love about Genesis is what Tony's brought to the band.
Maybe too much. Not that I dislike it! But so there‘s less good material for his solo stuff.
Steve Hackett is a snake. Voyage of the Acolyte is an over rated pile of shit
@@coltonbeatty6117 Show us where Steve hurt you, Tony. lol.
@@johnmavroudis2054 Hackett was a trouble maker and a problem, apparently from early on. 'Voyage..' and 'Please Don't..' contain nothing I would want to hear from a would-be Genesis album.
Cool episode. Love when the episodes go tangential. That discussion on The Who and what the band might have been like with Collins on skins, was fascinating. Great stuff, chaps... 👏👏👏
I walked up Solsbury Hill recently. Lovely spot just outside Bath, UK.
I love them all and yes, love to have Antonio Phillips here as well. They are all different, but I enjoy them all.
Great show, love Steve Hackett, so glad everyone agreed he was such a key member of Genesis. They were never the same after he left.
The only one I'm familiar with is Steve Hackett's "Voyage of the Acolyte". I bought it after I read an article in Guitar Player magazine. It was an interview with Alex Lifeson and he said it influenced him greatly. It's why the second side of "Caress of Steel" (his words) sounds like Hackett. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Oh, boy. Oooh! Need more like this theme. Anticipation. Yes guys next? I think you already did something like Yes solos, seem to remember?
On record for voting Peter windshield rain. Hackett a close second.
I'm right in line with Ken. Hackett benefits greatly from his Genesis collaborators.
Cannot wait. Acolyte is a perfect album and PG1 hardly puts a foot wrong. I've tried for years to like the Rutherford and there is good stuff there but not close to Steve or Peter.
1. Car
2. Voyage of the Acolyte
3. A Curious Feeling
4. Smallcreep’s Day
Ken never fails to crack me up. Asking Luis if that's him on Sonassombra's cover did the trick ha ha
Our local radio station played the entire Windshield album on the day it was released and I thought it was a great album. I have a soft spot for this abum!
Hackett, hands down!
For me, 1) Smallcreep's day, 2) Car, 3) Voyage of the acolyte, and 4) Curious feeling. But, truthfully they are all great albums.
In The Air Tonight was used in the Miami Vice pilot - where Crockett and Tubbs are chasing after Calderon (the drug lord) towards the end - the Ferrari racing through the streets of Miami. As for the replacement drummers in The Who - Martin Chambers, Zac Starkey, Mark Brezczicki, Roger Taylor, Stewart Copeland, Cozy Powell and Carl Palmer all feature on the title track of Roger Daltrey's 1985 solo album 'Under a Raging Moon'....what a line up!
These album wars always seem easy to predict because there are 1-2 of the choices that are clearly better or been discussed on the show before (so one knows how much the participants like those albums).
This one will be won by either Gabriel or Hackett and, whoever does not win, will likely finish second. I know this is extremely difficult, but it would generate more fun discussion and banter if four equally strong albums were selected and folks had to really struggle with them and end up ranking them differently. This is done well on the 4Fusion Friday show.
I actually thought something similar going in but found, after relistening, that for me anyway the two underdogs here (Rutherford & Banks) won out. I suspect I'm in the minority but that's OK...
Stay tuned for next episode….
Wow...I'm a big Genesis fan but really had no clue that Rutherford did a solo record in 79/80 with the great Simon Phillips on drums!? And Tony Banks first record has Chester Thompson on it. Gotta check them out stat.
Yes I think those are two really good records that often get overlooked due to the focus on Hackett & Gabriel - and to be fair Rutherford's Mike & The Mechanics project was a flop. IMO Banks' A Chord Too Far is a must own! And Anthony Phillips has tons of good records out
John Beaudin of Rock History Music described Smallcreep’s Day as his favorite album. He did Interview vocalist Noel McCalla and Simon Phillips.
I take that album over any Mechanics album.
I'm in for "The Pedal Board Show" !
King of Prog never lets me down. Never disappoints , just so much waffle.
1.- Voyage, 2.- Car, 3.- Smallscreep, 4.- Curious Feeling
If it's a question of what is the best Prog album among these four, then the answer is Hackett's. If the question is best album of songs, then it's Gabriel's.
Agreed
1. Peter Gabriel
2. Voyage of the Acolyte
3. A Curious Feeling
4. Smallcreep’s Day
I've been waiting for a coverage on a band and all of the member's debut solo albums, this one was definitely worth the wait. It's only fitting that it's Genesis especially as everyone have all had great solo careers, some which are highly successful. As a fan, I have to go with Steve Hackett 'Voyage Of The Acolyte' as it is not only a fantastic debut which has legendary music but in some ways it's kind of like the lost great Genesis album due to the fact that it featured material that the band rejected. All of the Genesis members have put out fine debut albums but for me Hackett's still remains to this day untouchable
Thanks to Ken and Luis for verbalising why I could never get into the Rutherford and Banks albums. I always thought it was my fault for not trying hard enough, but they're just lacklustre for the most part.
Thanks for mentioning Phil. He had no problem using Daryl Stuermer.
1. Tony Banks 2. Steve Hackett. 3.Peter Gabriel. 4. Mike Rutherford. The numbers 1 and 2 are so close but “A Curious Feeling” is potentially in my top 20 albums of all time by anyone if only I could decide on a definitive top 20. I simply go on one of the best musical journeys ever with “A Curious Feeling” and I am deeply immersed in its beauty from the first second to the very last. For me, Kim Beacon’s soulful singing is just perfect.
Tony Banks was the heart of Genesis, no doubt. If anyone was the leader and musical director, it was him. I know lots of prog fans like to shit on the guy for his personality (i.e. being a dick to Hackett) and taking the band in a more pop direction, but the importance of his influence and creative input in the early stuff that we prog fans love cannot be overstated.
The pop direction is more attributable to Rutherford, and then Collins, than to Tony.
@@coltonbeatty6117 That's true. Banks always tried to keep the band somewhat progressive when the other two wanted pure pop. That's just another reason prog fans shouldn't shit on him so much. I think from Abacab onwards, the creative control was pretty evenly split between the three of them, but everything prior to that, Banks is the clear leader and primary creative force. There's really no need for prog fans to hate on him except that he was a dick to Hackett and maybe kept him down creatively somewhat. But Genesis is a keyboard-driven band and that's the way it was always going to be. Hackett is a genius but I'm fine with where he is in the mix.
Curious, Smallcreep's, Voyage, Gab 1, (Geese) in that order are my preferred tastes although Voyage is the proggiest. All classics (except Geese although good) for me.
1. Smallcreep's Day (fine lead by Mike on Working in Line)
2. Voyage
3.Car (primarily for Solsbury Hill) strange chords?
4. Curious Feeling
5. Geese and the Ghost ( bucolic England) All records very good!!
1) Smallcreep's day
2) Voyage of the acolyte
3) Car
4) A curious feeling
Hackett's first album would rank high in Genesis catalog...best of the 4 first album, though I do like the "Peter Gabriel" self titled quartet better as a whole.
Smallcreeps day is a great album! I’m a real big fan of Mike Rutherfords’ solo material as well as Mike + The Mechanics
Great episode. My favs are 1. Hackett, 2. Gabriel, 3, Rutherford, 4. Banks. I have a soft spot for the Rutherford album. I like Luis' "serious question" towards the end. He is on point. I've asked the same question before and I agree with answers and views on the subject. I am guilty of being loyal and a completist regarding certain artists. For example, I have Giant For A Day in my collection both on CD and LP.
Anthony Philips was a better guitar player than Rutherford which is why MR was on bass but the bass playing on those Hackett era Genesis albums is sublime. I saw Steve with Genesis three times in the 70s and countless times since; his playing just gets better everytime . Can't wait for the Lamb tour, with lots of stuff from his new album.
His playing sucks. Gimmicky sound effects mostly
@@coltonbeatty6117
1. Steve Hackett - Voyage of the Acolyte
2. Mike Rutherford - Small Creeps Day
3. Peter Gabriel - 1
4 Tony Banks - A Curious Feeling
Among Genesis fans A curious feeling is reveered. I think it is good. As a whole it does not work completely but it has 3 o4 songs really great. No more hammond, mellotron of course. I'ts 1979. But tasty layers. After the lie to me is a classic.
This is great. For what it's worth, my order is
4 Tony Banks - A Curious Feeling. Sounds to me like background music
3 Mike Rutherford - Smallcreeps Day. I like side 1, side 2 not so much.
2 Peter Gabriel - "Car". A good album which would be great without the aforementioned barbershop song but fair play to PG for trying it.
1. Steve Hackett - Voyage of the Acolyte. Simply outstanding; the fact that I knew Steve's father and he got Steve to personally sign me a copy has nothing to do with my comments.
McCalla was with Manfred Mann from about 1991-2010.
Peter Gabriel from Trespass to Up, no artist can clam the quality of output.
Great episode, gentlemen! For me, my ranking of these goes like this:
1. Steve
2. Peter
3. Tony
4. Mike
All are fantastic but I feel like Steve’s Voyage Of The Acolyte is almost a lost Genesis album.
My picks
1) Voyage of the Acolyte
2) Face Value
3) Peter Gabriel Car
4) Smallcreeps Day
5) A Curious Feeling
They're right, 'Face Value" definitely wasn't prog, but it's probably the most honest, because it's Phil's true feelings about what he was going through at the time. Phil says he played "In The Air Tonight" for the band before "Face Value" was put together. But Tony says he doesn't remember that, and he says if he had heard it, he would've wanted Genesis to do it.
As many stated , Gabriel and Hackett are easily top two of these four. My top choice today is Gabriel's Car though this can change day to day or listen to listen. Thanks to all in the episode for taking time to listen to all four of these for the discussions.
Good morning from New York City. Four very good solo albums, sadly I couldn’t attend this recording (yet again) although just me personally I love “Face Value” more than any other former mates solo debut.
I’m with Eric, I love Peter Gabriel yet I find his solo material post “Security” more miss than hit.
Mad props to Mike Rutherford’s Smallcreep’s Day. A fantastic record for the time.
My ranking is
4. Tony Banks-A Curious Feeling
3. Peter Gabriel-Car
2. Mike Rutherford-Smallcreep’s Day
1. Steve Hackett-Voyage of the Acolyte
Where's Anthony Philllips - The Geese and The Ghost? That would be my number 1... otherwise:
1.Steve Hackett - Voyage of the Acolyte
2.Tony Banks - A Curious Feeling
3.Peter Gabriel - Car
4.Mike Rutherford - Smallcreeps Day
100 % agree, exactly my ranking, exactly my opinion on Geese! 👍
1. Face Value
2. Voyage
3. Geese & Ghost
4. Car
Peter Gabriel always ahead of his former band mates. In variability, imagination, in every respect.
How I hear it. 1Steve Hackett 2Tony Banks 3 Peter Gabriel 4 Mike Rutherford.
Gabriel's solo albums would get better and him finding his way Mike Rutherford is good thus sound to pre Mike and The Mechanics so and Genesis would be mostly secondly dominating the 80s so Collins would have his say with some solo albums and the other two and Collins doing Genesis. Hackett in the 80's would somewhat along eclipsing Genesis and today the main solo artists of Genesis Steve running away with the sound of mesmerizing music. May change opinion after hearing the panel. Hackett always number one.
Re release dates, the Rutherford and Banks albums were both released in the UK on the same day, 15th February 1980.
Noel McCalla is great! I think he started out in a band called Moon in the 70s. Good call from Eric & Christian.
1 Gabriel 2 Hackett 3 Rutherford 4 Banks
Has anyone seen the last Genesis documentary in which the 5 of them sit together and talk about the bands history?
I am still to this day unhappy with the way they did Steve Hackett dirty.
He had next to no screen time.
And when he did speak, the look on Tony's face?
Damn.
Would also be fun to use one episode to pick the best album of four different bands and then do a follow up episode where those four band's best albums are in an Album War or combine it into one longer episode. For example, take Marillion, Transatlantic, Spock's Beard and Porcupine Tree.
My choices for best albums would be:
Marillion - Misplaced Childhood
Transatlantic - Bridge Across Forever
Spock's Beard - Beware of Darkness
Porcupine Tree - In Absentia
It would be a real struggle for me to rank those four albums, fun exercise!
“In the Air Tonight” was on the soundtrack for the movie Risky Business. This helped it become popular.
4. Smallcreep's Day
3. A Curious Feeling
2. Voyage Of The Acolyte
1. Peter Gabriel (1977)
@Luis I love the John Myung reference! "Myunged" so appropriate a phrase. Steve buried in the mix.
1. Voyage of the Acolyte
2. Peter Gabriel 1
3. Smallcreep's Day
4. A Curious Feeling
Best cover- A Curious Feeling
Acolyte for me. Saw Steve 1st time ever @ the Orpheum in L.A. late last year, opened with Wands, I was so stoked!
Also Im a total gearhead. Ive often wondered what other than a ES 335, LP & SG does Pete have on his cool guitar stand. Most of what I watch on YT aside from metal/prog content is gear related.
I'm going totally left field here:
4. Smallcreep's Day - only because I've never really heard it
3. Voyage Of The Acolyte - it's a good album but for me, Spectral Mornings is Steve's best solo album despite The Ballad Of The Decomposing Man.
2. Peter Gabriel 1 AKA Car - Peter was trying to find his feet here, but I love it all apart from Excuse Me.
1. A Curious Feeling - I love And Then There Were Three and I love this. Tony's solo career has been underwhelming, but this album is easily his best.
Cool show men, but l knew that it would go the way that it went. (“Go the Way You Go?” Hmmm… ) l have a slightly contrarian take on these four:
4. Tony Banks ~ A Curious Feeling
3. Mike Rutherford ~ Smallcreep’s Day
2. Steve Hackett ~ Voyage of the Acolyte
1. Peter Gabriel ~ 1 (Car).
The Gabriel debut is my favorite album by him. 1. I love the songs and the diversity. 2. Great supporting cast of musicians. 3. I’m a huge fan of Bob Ezrin’s production work. 4. I’m the odd duck - quack - who loves “Excuse Me.” 5. No duff tracks on Peter’s album - same as Steve - l just happen to love Gabriel’s record a wee bit more.
Keep up the stellar, and interstellar, work.
Cheers from Chuck’s Big Apple.
Rock Out and Prog On!
Your clone and mine,
~ The Devastatingly Divine & Diverse Davey Cretin, from CRETIN CLASSICS.
I knew what my ranking was, and it didn't change after listening to a couple.
4. Banks
3. Rutherford
2. Gabriel
1. Hackett
It's a good thing tastes are different. I usually don't want to create lists like this, it's like picking one child over another, but I thought Tony Banks needs a bit more love. I think ACF is brilliant but the others are really good too. 😎.
1. A Curious Feeling
2. Smallcreep's Day / Voyage of the Acolyte
3. Peter Gabriel I
The Geese and the Ghost needed to be recognized....Anthony Phillips solo albums are wonderful.
1. Voyage, 2. Smallcreep, 3. Curious, 4. Car
My ranking:
1 - Steve
2 - Tony
3 - Mike
4 - Peter
You're so hard with Tony. He wasn't really the one who fired Steve, more Mike. And his album had gorgeous mélodies and chords progressions. Of course it sounds a lot like ATTWT and Duke, but that's pretty normal.
Agree with Ken. Good job, baby!
Loved this. I wouldn’t disagree with the overall view. I know it would mess with the format, but the first Phil Collins album would put the cat amongst the pigeons as it is significant in the history of music for the drum sound he extracts.
That being said, y the time Peter Gabriel released his third album (Melt) he’d left everyone trailing a long way back. What mystifies me about Tony Banks is how good his work was in Genesis before they went down to a three piece. Where there are writing credits, his stuff was fantastic. What happened?
Looking forward to seeing Steve Hackett in October.
My order would be just how Pete showed them at beginning of the show. Top to bottom.
Hackett wins for me as well.
I haven't listened to Mike's and Tony's records but to answer Pete's question at the end, yes, I would have the other two in a different order so Peter wins and Steve comes in second. My favorite Hackett solo record is by a long shot Spectral Mornings so...
Amazingly enough, only a year ago I wasn't into PG's solo catalog at all...! Around the time I got into prog-Genesis in 2004 I did try listening to it but it never clicked with me at all. Over the years I tried again a once or twice and...nothing. I didn't even like Solsbury Hill!
But around last November we had a Genesis Top 40 countdown-thread over at the Steve Hoffman Forum where around 100 participants submitted their own ranking of forty Genesis songs and then the thread host did the number crunching and presented the master ranking list in a countdown format over a three week period. These are loads of fun and the discussion is great. During this countdown Peter's solo career of course came up and I finally decided to take one last shot at it by watching a concert video from 1978 on UA-cam. I LOVED IT!!! I then went and listened to his debut album on Apple Music and I LOVED IT. Now I'm a huge fan of almost all of his studio albums and yes, I adore his latest record as well, I/O. It's immensely listenable!
So, Eric, if I can go from being completely indifferent for twenty years to being a big fan, well, I guess there is still hope for you as well! 🙂
Agree, it’s not a dislike at all, but it just doesn’t seem to excite me or make me want to reach for his solo material
1. Steve Hackett
2. Peter Gabriel
3. Michael Rutherford
4. Tony Banks
1. PG 2. Steve Hackett 3. Mike Rutherford 4. Tony Banks
You all got the correct winner. STEVE HACKETT's "VOYAGE OF THE ACOLYTE" is a SUPERB album from beginning to end. I'm a huge Peter Gabriel fan and I love his solo debut, but this was an easy call. Having said that, there were so many great songs on that Gabriel album (Shoutout to "MORIBUND THE BURGERMEISTER"... which never gets enough love... and it's THE most GENESIS song Gabriel ever did, post-Genesis... Whoever said it should have been on the Lamb was spitting facts. It's THAT good.)
I CONSTANTLY played the "What if that Hackett song was on a Genesis album... and there's a wealth of material from his first four solo albums that would have been as good, if not better, than a few of the songs that made the album. "Shadow of the Hierophant," "A Tower Struck Down," ""Ace Of Wands," "Please Don't Touch," "Narnia," "Every Day," "Clocks," "Spectral Mornings," "The Steppes," "Slogans," "Jacuzzi"... any of those would have been fantastic if folded into the Genesis catalog. Gabriel and Hackett were the edge that made Genesis truly great.
As for my rankings:
1. HACKETT - Voyage
2. GABRIEL - Gabriel I
3. RUTHERFORD - Smallcreep's
4. BANKS - Curious
Voyage... sucks. Compositionally incompetent. People must like it for reasons that are incidental
@@coltonbeatty6117 Thanks for your input, cupcake. Now get your juice box and go play with your fellow 2nd graders. The adults are talking here.
Voyage ,Car , Curious , Smallcreeps
I love to be loved is special especially the ending goosebumps
I would flip flop back and forth between Hackett & Gabriel in the #1 spot. I do wonder why you left off Collins & Phillips. Phillips remained influential beyond his Genesis exit, especially considering his work on Smallcreep’s Day and working with Gabriel on the demos for his first solo album. I would be interested in your rankings of the individual members solo albums within their own silos. For instance, I think Hackett’s Wild Orchids is his best album, Voyage is second, Spectral Mornings third, etc.
I saw Entwistle do "My Wife" with Zak Starkey and it was magical.
Actually on Duke guitars are very limited. on And then there were three they are much more upfront. On Duke they are calculated, well executed, tasty.
Banks is credited with 12 string guitars
You all seem to mention that Bob Ezrin produced Kiss and Alice Cooper and Lou Reed and how unusual this was a choice, but didn't he also do Pink Floyd's The Wall which is definitely in the prog universe and the same time frame as these albums?
Impossible to decide. I bought all these records as they came out, and I thought they were masterworks in their own right. But the comparison is a little unfair as they were published in very different periods of time. Let's put them in Genesis' timeline. 75- Hackett, 77- Gabriel (after a 2-year hiatus) and Phillips (after a longer hiatus). 79- Banks, 80- Rutherford and I would add Collins' Face value which was out in 81.
Imagine a Genesis record in 1980 with The lie/after the lie (Banks), Moonshine (Rutherford), You (Banks), In the air tonight (Collins) Somebody else's dream (Banks) and Smallcreep (Rutherford). You have a 55-minute record, which would have been better than Duke. In fact, it could have been a double album!
Face Value should also be here.
1) Voyage of the Acolyte
2) A Curious Feeling
3) Car
4) Smallcreep's Day.
To me as a guitar player, Tony Banks is Genesis and their manager even said Genesis was Tony Banks' solo project.
Even some of his worst work is near the top of this list because it's all about melody for me and the development of it.
Check out this Faye Dunaway movie score by Banks:
ua-cam.com/video/ZIocCoonTOY/v-deo.html
Right Luis! Genesis reunion!!!
Interesting... meant to say all the members of YES
Clean sweep for Steve
Please, Please, Please, Please, Please, do The Pedal Show! " I'd Pay A Dollar For That". BTW, this is a great episode Genesis are awe inspiring.
Way late to this ballgame. As I hear them:
4. Tony Banks - "A Curious Feeling"
3. Mike Rutherford - "Small Creeps Day"
2. Peter Gabriel - "Peter Gabriel" (a.k.a.: car)
1. Steve Hackett - "Voyage of the Acolyte"