Attack on Titan SUB - 4x15 Sole Salvation - Group Reaction
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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- The Normies explore Zeke's backstory and childhood growing up in Marley, as well as his relationship with the former Beast Titan Ksaver in Season 4 Episode 15! The Normies review and discuss the exciting episode from The Final Season after the reaction!
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#Gabi #Falco #ErenJaeger
Eren mom : Eren isn’t special but he is special for being born in this world
THIS's what makes eren who he is
And Eren took that personally
Eren is the only way
Grisha: You're special because you're my son
Carla: You're special because you were born in this world
):
This show isn't just about violence begetting more violence (revenge) but really about horror creating monsters (trauma) and those monsters creating more horror and so on. Grisha was a crap Dad to Zeke but his kid sister was chewed to death by dogs. Zeke was put under impossible pressure to save his entire race when he was just a weak kid. Eren's mum was eaten in front of him. Even Gabi's probably seen some shit at her young age. Until the trauma stops, monsters will always be created
I think people like to think that its only Marley that hates the eldians but NO the whole world hates the eldians and for good reason.
Marley is even one of the nicest people to the eldians
As horrible and degrading as it is, Eldians actually have a place in Marley. They are essential for Marley's military might due to Marley's monopoly on Titans. In other nations, resident Eldians are just people who can transform into monsters. The fact that other nations also believe in the dark past of the Eldian Empire is proof that there is some truth to it beyond Marley's propaganda too, considering those nations have no reason to accept it otherwise.
@@hiyazekku66 yes i would find it hard to believe that their isnt some proof of the horrible Past the eldian empire had to make the world hate them
If episode 16 ends on chapter 115 or 116, there will be enough content left for another 12 episode cour.
It would be 16 episodes cour just like this season- as comparison, this season covers 91-115, which is 25 chapters. 116-140 amounts to exactly 25 chapters.
@@amirulhakim9898 it’s from 91-116 most likely so 26 chapters which means 117-139 23 chapters can be into 14 or 15 episodes
Could you imagine how much things would be different if Grisha decided to not go outside?
Damn, even though I think Eren would find a way to manipulate things
To use the full abilities of the founding titan they need to use a "TITAN WITH ROYAL BLOOD", not just someone with royal blood, so if they want to use historia then they need to turn historia into a titan first. The only one who has the requirements is zeke because he is a titan shifter and has a royal blood.
Onyakopon:”we were born cuz we were wanted”
Eren and zeke:”no “
wanted....Am I the only one who saw the joke there?
@@manavgala2361 nah I see it
Only Zeke
damn we could have the power to change all eldian.
all eldian
- could have the best genetics
- could have dark/brown/oriental skin
- could born with mutant powers
- could make all eldian be women
just imagine the possibility that could done with a very creative mindset
@@091696g Bruh
This is the moment we can see Levi the invincible make a huge ass mistake in which the consequence finally get to himself instead of others. Zeke may have underestimated Levi, but this time Levi underestimated Zeke that he wouldn't pull the trigger.
He’s related to a suicidal manic
Levi is my favourite character alongside Jean im not finished with s4 yet but i hope he survives or at least has some good last words
More like he didn't expect Zeke to go for the straight up suicidal option
“That’s like when my dad use to come watch me play basketball” You alright Suraj? Hahaha
Lmao nothing against my dad: I was just really shitty at basketball
@@Thenormies good to hear! I was getting some Simple Plan “Perfect” vibe when you said that!
@@Thenormies me too, Suraj. Me too.
AT THIS RATE HE NEVER GONNA BE IN THE NBA
LOL
Two opposing perspectives from two parent figures, inside different walls.
Carla, within Paradis' walls: _He's already special, because he has been born in this world._
Ksaver, within Liberios's walls: _If only I hadn't been born in this world._
Well, Carla didn't know shit about the reality around them.
I was about to comment the same thing lmao
Willy and Eren also said it, so the phrase revolves around everyone in aot
Kinda spoiler or foreshadowing
From this we know Eren doesnt support zeke plan
@@genarohonoriorengifo8317 ignorance is bliss
Maan, Zeke asking Levi for his glasses because it's the last thing that reminds him of the only true human connection he ever had will never stop being heartbreaking.
This might be a hot take, but I feel like you can sympathize with a character like Zeke without liking him. I feel bad for his child self, but it doesn't make me like his character as an adult, it just allows me to understand his actions. I think this flashback mostly helps you understand that Zeke thinks he is doing something that is good for the world as a whole.
Exactly this. It really shouldn't be a hot take. Zeke's backstory can allow you to understand him, but it doesn't absolve him of personal responsibility. Just like Reiner denies his environmental circumstances pushing him to do what he did. He himself still made those choices, regardless. I think Zeke's an excellent character in a narrative sense, but that doesn't mean I have to like him personally.
Exactly, for example with Eren, I understand his present intentions and I sympathize with him but that doesn’t mean I’m gonna act like he doesn’t do anything wrong
Yeah, if this were a different timeline then Zeke would’ve been the main character fighting against Paradis to save the world with that main shonen character backstory but he’s not and I guess it’s nice to know his side of the story
@@kaydollar2490 careful there, the Eren simps might try to lynch you for saying that. LOL
Exactly. His childhood is tragic, but he's still trying to commit genocide.
Honestly, Zeke is such an interesting character. It just goes to show how badly Grisha treated him, basically brainwashing him to his cause, not even treating him like his son, but rather a way to reach his own goals. Constantly yelling, giving him looks of disappointment, endangering their whole family, and even potentially getting violent when angry. It's nice to see that Grisha learned from his mistakes and never forced anything onto Eren, but still. Zeke's mindset definitely makes sense after this episode.
Too bad 137 had to mess it up, I really like Zeke as a character prior to that
@@alekseibrusilov7402 please don’t just nonchalantly talk about spoilers in the replies
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SPOILERS
137 wrapped up zeke’s character arc perfectly lmao
you mean didn't force anything on Eren until the end when he forced the attack titan on his own son lol
@@TobyR2000
There was no spoiler there since I drop no fact, and as you demonstrated people can have different opinion about it.
Actual spoilers:
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Armin pulled a talk no jutsu against Zeke, and within 5 or so panels changed him from his lifelong-held ideals. The writing is just lazy. Hath Zeke fought Eren back for his euthanasia plan, that would at least make sense and consistent with his character. Instead he just thought, "You're right Armin, it's best if I just die now"
Zeke is all kinds of boring tbh lol
for eren to use the founding titan he has to touch a titan with royal blood not just a person with royal blood
It can be a person, too. The memories of Grisha stealing the Founding Titan were revealed through contact with non-Titan royals, were they not?
@Alex Kalinin MANGA SPOILERS
Thats what I dont get since Eren's been adamant that you need a titan of royal blood but he activates the rumbling and the founding titan by just having Zeke hold his head out of titan form.
@@sharandeep9816 zeke is still a titan with royal blood it does not matter if he is in titan form or not
@@calvinjaynum1767 Oh ok I always thought it had to be in titan form. I guess it's because their coordinate or something has been activated that they can activate the founder by contact no matter their form.
Remember when eren kissed historia's hand? There was an electricity
This whole show is about using kids for war
DEEP, they are kids in the forest 😭😭
...and suicide
I think... all anime. Infact, in Eureka Seven AO too, some scientist was against using kids in war.
This one is just against stupidity of war and racism in general.
13:46 R.I.P. One of Jean's people
Lmao
That horse😢
@@xncl3866 Seriously, how many horses have died brutally in this show?
@@suicune690 mainly by zeke lol...... beast hates horses
@@nikhilmanuel5641 Monke no like horses 😂
Easily one of the best episode of the entire series, great storyboard and direction. Grisha competing with Ging for worst dad in a shounen. Tragic childhood for Zook. I love chapter 114 written by Isayama and MAPPA did it so much justice. And that cliffhanger..
100%. Hit hard.
It fell a little flat for me purely because there's only one episode left this season, I love lore dumps but not when we're this close to the end. I just keep thinking we don't have time for this
@@MrBobcat1237 The next episode is not the series finale, it's just this part of final season's last episode.
@@MrBobcat1237 It was necessary. If out of nowhere next episode we see Eren and Zeke say. "Ok now let's make it so no one can ever have kids again". We'd all be like "What? Where the f**k did this come from?". This episode finally showed us the story of a key character, what his goal is and tied up many things from all previous seasons. It had great voice acting, great animation, great use of soundtrack. 10/10 episode.
Also this is the final episode for now. There's 100% gonna be a part two. I know because manga readers have told me there's way too much left. Like a whole other season worth of story.
Worst dad in a shounen? For years that title has undisputably belonged to Shou Tucker.
I don't think feeling sympathy for a person and thinking that they have done horrible things they should be held responsible for are mutually exclusive. Feeling pride over not being able to sympathize with someone probably says more about you as a person than it does their actions.
Underrated Comment. You can feel sorry for someone and still feel they deserve punishment for their actions.
Exactly, it’s not illegal to sympathize with certain characters, it doesn’t erase or change the fact that they did horrible stuff and you can be aware of that. For example, Eren, he is going to do so much shit, he has his reasons and I sympathize with him but that doesn’t mean I can’t think that he is not an innocent poor little boy, because he visibly isn’t. It applies to almost very character in this series.
exactly thats why I dont like Marketa in these past episodes at all like wtf she is so proud of feeling hatred towards a character cmon
This right fucking here. This applies to the real world too. You can sympathize with someone's plight without empathizing with them. What I mean is you can understand how someone may feel, how the events and choices of their life made them who they are, how the unfair circumstances around them played into their actions without agreeing with what they do. Just to use a real world example, we see these school shootings and mass shootings happen. I can see someone being bullied, confused, lied to, or tricked into doing something horrible and I can sympathize with that. Doesn't mean their actions are justified and that they shouldn't be held accountable.
Anyway, Zeke did nothing wrong 🤬🤬
I think everyone in this show just needs to listen to pains cycle of pain speech.
Should see that next week
@@MikasaAckermann831 they reached that naruto arc at the perfect time lmao, AoT s4 and the pain arc hits alot of the same notes
@@sammy_1178 S1-3 Eren is Nagato before Yahiko dies, S4 Eren is Pain
@@sammy_1178 Damn i'm so hyped to see their reaction to peak of Shippuden!
Pain focuses on cycle of hatred tho, not pain
Idc what anyone says Zeke is one of the best characters in this show. He's also not some generic bad guy he clearly doesn't enjoy the terrible shit he does but does it cause he has no choice 10/10 episode.
Like when he played a perfect game in season 3?
He has a choice, all his choices are shitty, he just picked the one he could justify the most. I think he's compelling because he's a tragic character in a completely uphill situation who's convicted and confidently doing what he believes to be the right thing. It's easy to root for him since he's presented as trying to be merciful and as a vulnerable child
That’s something you can say for every antagonistic character in this show and that’s why Isayama is such a great writer. No one is just a bad guy for the sake of themselves, all of them are just choosing the best choice out of a line of shitty choices and are basically forced to do it.
@@Napstablooky Exactly.. They are written so good
@@stuff3862 rewatch the perfect game episode, you will see his dialogues hit different. You will see zeke getting mad and crushing some rocks in his hands, he wasnt happy at all.
There are 3 main "conflicting" ideologies in AoT:
Eren: is the embodiment of "primordial primitive life", "I was born, and will fight for my existence. If you messed up with me, I will mess you up. If you threaten my existence, I will eliminate you."
Zeke: is the exploration of "karmic salvation" with a bit of his own term. "Life is suffering, and the greatest salvation of all is not being born/reborn in this world."
Armin and the rest: are a bit of modern views on life where "we should talk things up. not sure what the meaning of lives are, but we are here anyway. se should get along."
Like of all things in this world, no one of them is a perfect ideology. Each one has naivety in their own ways.
Personally I think that's what make them good characters. They have ideology they believe in, and sacrifice themselves in. They have depths. That's when you can feel an empathy for them.
Compare this to yet explored characters like Gabi, and Porco; we hardly can sympathize because they seemed so full of themselves with no greater goals in mind.
Well said!
Very good Summary!^^
I mean, Gabi wanted to free Eldians from the internment zone but found out it was a effort in futility as the Scouts destroyed Liberio and put the Marleyan Eldians in further risk
Yeah, not explored at all 👀
zeke's ideoogy is not karmic salvation ,, he is a nihilist and self hating almost to the point of disgust ,, gabi is hated upon because she killed the potato girl but she did'nt knew her all she did was kill someone who attacked her village and rampaged upon but we can see the change in her once she gets to know them and their sufferings ,, zeke on the other hand is a maniac who himself inflicted pain and suffering on eldians and plan on forceful sterlisation becuase he thinks eldians dont deserve a life becuase of what they will suffer at the hands of marleyans ,,, so instead of fighting to end thsi discrimiantion he wants to end eldians ,, albeit slowly ,
i agree with eren
This episode reminded me of why Zeke is one of the BEST Character in this story. Damn...that was really sad back story of him.
Not really he's pretty much a POS
All yeagers are amazingly written characters...
@@darryljack6612 because you consider him a POS doesnt mean hes not one of the best written characters
Levi fangirls would disagree with u there.......
@@abhiroopdas3232 yeagers deadass carrying aot
Fun fact: We've actually seen "Tragedy of lago" before in the Season 2 ending song.
that ending spoiled so much 🤣 but only if you pay very much attention and already know some things. at that time, I wasn't a manga reader and only got some bits right according to a friend, who read the manga. after season 2, I started with the manga. I couldn't wait 😁
@@Sprife_ The ending shows stuff that's gonna happen in 139 too.
Yeah bro they literally spoiled the entire ending of AoT in that ending it’s nuts but you won’t know what it means if you don’t read the manga lol
@@ItsAv3rageGamer Damn you know the future that's crazy.
@@Mjandro Its just my theory haha, there's a lot of stuff in that ending scene though that I think will become more clear after the last chapter.
7:25 oh I don't know... sometimes people act out of accumulated anger, desire for vengeance, and self-righteousness, being absolutely convinced of the other side's "evilness" despite not knowing the whole story [shrug]... kinda like you did @4:16 :)
exactly
True lmao they can’t understand that
Marketa isn't Zeke's mother tho
Yes exactly
Facts
We see a part of Grisha we haven't seen, and same with Eren last episode. Personally I think Eren took on part of his father's personality with the whole unyeilding lust for freedom .
Isn’t that how they describe the attack titan though always looking for freedom or something
@@jaredflower4830 Yes, that's exactly what Kruger described the Attack Titan as. Now the question is, is Eren a slave for that feeling of freedom?or did he influence that feeling on the attack titan in some way in the first place?
Can you blame him? I'd simp for freedom
(I wouldn't commit warcrimes though)
More revelations to come on this point, for Anime viewers, put a pin in OPs though there, expectations are played with somewhat here and it begins to get very interesting when trying to pin blame...
That could be true but even before eren got the titan he already from the beginning sought freedom like when mikasa had her freedom taken away being kidnapped eren was pissed tf off and killed them with neither guilt or remorse
Actually to use Historia...she first needs to turn into a titan first, Eren didn't want that.
The scouts original plan was to feed Zeke to Historia, them Eren would have used Historia to use his founding titan power.
and what titan could they even give her
@@anish7183 beast titan
you guys were rooting for armin who literally just a few episodes bombed a whole city full of innocent people. get outta here with these double morals
Historia won't work, it has to be a titan with royal blood, not just a regular person with royal blood
They can turn her.
@@ninjadoublecurry not with a babie tho
@@ninjadoublecurry they can but eren won't allow it, thats why he get his brother instead who is already a titan shifter.
Then why did Zeke avoid shaking hands with Eren? Purposefully saying "we should not shake hands now" like something would be triggered by doing so.
@@matei9945 Because Zeke does have a titan. Titan form isn't a requirement, being in the possession of a Titan is.
‘I don’t think eren cares about using historia’ he was literally the only one who said no to the plan that uses historia and her children cmon guys 😂
Seriously. 🤦🏻♂️
I think they'll side with alliance without understanding Eren
@redwill17 Eren didn't sent them to a war zone, but it was inevitable, he knew that they were gonna be in danger but also trusted in their skills, more with the whole thing set up for the kart and jaw being locked up. Even so, they weren't the problem, it was a random kid that nobody expected after they drop their guard.
@redwill17 the war is inevitable either way, doing nothing makes a 100% chance that his friends don’t live long lives, i mean there were only 8 casualties that’s a ridiculously low mortality rate. As for the other part, a lot of things don’t make sense with eren rn and that’s probably the point we haven’t seen his perspective of anything yet. I trust Isayama, a great storyteller, to not make his MC either 1. a puppet being manipulated in the endgame or 2. some radical despot throwing away all his character development up to this point. Eren himself is the equivalent of what the basement was, a mystery box. The basement didn’t disappoint and neither will he
@redwill17 what's better sending them to fight a surprise fight against Marley one country with a plan to have all their titans either trapped (jaw and cart) and beast being on their side the only titan left being Warhammer which eren was fighting or let the entire world military attack and make sure all of his friends get annihilated on the spot?
Honestly child development is the most important part of your life, so I really feel for Zeke. I guess I usually take more of a liking to villains because they’re the most human to me. Sometimes you have to do bad for the greater good and I really enjoy characters like that in my opinion at least. It was a great episode, I’ll continue to support Eren and Zekes plans even tho I already read the manga lol rip
I thought I was the only person, like I feel for "villains" in every show because they are just trying to do what they believe in. I also feel like they also have a more realistic view on things not just some we just have to believe or let's just talk it out
Same man, I tend to sympathize and try to understand villians, which is why I've never hated zeke
I wish Gabi haters saw this comment, because you’re right, child development is VERY important.
@@malihoward6147 not gonna lie reiner and bertoldt are just evil. they went to paradise, saw that they arent all devils, but continued to attack
@@anish7183 I agree with that fully
I’m happy at how much they’re showcasing Jean this season. A few episodes ago he was biting Gabbie’s head, now he’s the big cliffhanger as he’s shown on fire. Really hope horseboy survived Zeke’s attack!
And Jesus fucking Christ, one last time, for the kids in the back of the class: it’s not “touch someone with royal blood,” it’s “be in contact with a TITAN with royal blood.” That’s why it matters that historia is pregnant, that’s why Zeke is such an important piece of the plan.
wtf are you talking about? That's not Jean, that's Levi, how did you even make that mistake?
"This whole show is about using kids for war"
Naruto: What are we? Chop Liver?
Lol Naruto is a kids show bruh
@@azz4441 Actually no.
@@azz4441 Yeah no. Watch the Pain arc and stop the cap.
@@Blackfoxloki bro they came back to life like after one conversation the dude flipped
@@Blackfoxloki So what u on about
end only justifies the means when it’s convenient for characters we like. For example when eren kruger revealed all the fucked up shit he did we never questioned him. He had to do it for his Ideals and he is a hero. But zekes actions has to be discussed whether or not it was justified because we don’t like him.
EXACTLY
Spot on. So many people miss the point of this series, it makes me sad.
Not really though cause seek didn’t have to be cheering and stuff when he was killing them with boulders the owl did it undercover with people around no one was around with Zeke he’s even thinking crazy stuff during that part
@HUNG JEW I mean I would still call that crazy though he’s basically ignoring the killing and thinking of a game
@@JessChillN_ As Kruger did with the torture, he thought of it as for the greater good
I don't get suraj point of siding, hange levi and the main scouts have not given a single plan or way out of this besides just stalling for time. Eren doesn't have time and hange is trapped in a corner with no legitimate ways out of it. The scouts are even resorting to putting flagel and the rest of the eldian citzens in the dark because realistically they are screwed under the scouts leadership without eren. Some people condemn eren but legitmately its a dark reality ( doesn't mean our reality is lost of hope) when you have no hope and no way out you have to resort to twisted things to grab survival. I don't agree with them and I hate the world for removing any options for these people, thats all I can be mad about, but yes fuck the marley government as well.
@@gemelwalters2942 just ignore my thing until you read the manga
The author just manipulated the audience lol it doesnt make sense that they wont do nothing and plan nothing just to complain when they were about to have the whole world ganged up on paradise and hange failed to give solution till the end i wish they were laybe able to talk but they didnt have part to negotiate with marley
@@gemelwalters2942 Hanji and the rest of the military leaders didn't come up with any plan in the four years before Eren did anything. He literally waited all that time (half of the 8 years he had left) and they had nothing. They put the future of their home in the hands of a foreign nation and when that didn't work out they had...nothing. They were passive and indecisive. Eren got tired of waiting for the war to come to them. As for the rest of your comment, there's more to be explained.
Fun fact: in spanish: Lago, Monte and Valle are literally Lake, Mount, Valley. So the names are like wtf for us spanish hahahah
In italian too! And Liberio is a rare italian name as in libero (free) and they pronounced Marley as 'mare' (sea in italian) ... It's kinda strange indeed aha
@@chaosrulesinmymindseye It's from German, Eldia is a bad Anglicization of Erde which is German for "The Earth" while Mare is Italian for Sea. Shows how Marleyans are roman-influenced while Eldians are the Germans of the SnK world.
@@chaosrulesinmymindseye There's no official interview on it but the spellings prove it. AoT has some really bad translation some times, for example "Zeke's" name is written with the katakana for "Sieg" but the translators read it as hiragana which gives us "Zeke". Further reinforced by Grisha holding him and saying "this child will lead us to VICTORY" (Sieg= German for victory)
lmaoooo battle of lake. Reminds me of jojos (which is obv a much different series tone wise) but how araki made the characters names random food names in italian like abbachio and n-arancia
@@nonsansdroit3800 ughh yes, remember when everyone was calling levi rivaille for a good couple years because the translators messed up
Marceta's reasoning for how young zeke's childhood experience can't be used as a excuse to forgive old zeke's actions in the present, also applies to how Eren's suffering as a kid can't be used as an excuse to justify old Eren's actions in the present as well.
No one is saint and justifiable in attack on titan every character did fucked up things but can you really blame them.
You would make a valid point if she didn't literally just say she hates eren roo
That reasoning is absolute crap
Ahh but Eren's actions aren't just affected by the past anymore. Did you not listen to his conversation with Reiner. If the world had decided to leave Paradis alone, Eren wouldn't have done anything, after living in Marley he had given up on taking revenge, what he is doing now is directly motivated by the threat against everyone on Paradis. On the other hand Zeke's motivations are still completely rooted in his childhood.
Gotta keep the children out of the forest man....
I think what Zeke did was indeed a suicide card... but if you really think about it, it's a pretty great suicide card. He was probably thinking "well... if one of us's gonna make it alive out of an explosion it would probably be me, right?"
"...right?"
@@Bigdeathy "OH SHIT I TAKE THAT BA-"
It’s crazy how y’all forgot ZEKE CAN REGENERATE HE CAN JUST WALK IT OFF
They’re pretty slow at times. Well, more often than not.
He literally just took four nukes earlier in the episode and regenerated lol.....they just don't wanna face the realization that levi could be dead
@@queefburglarr hes not dead but hes certainly not very alive for the next 15 chapters😂😂
Which makes me think wtf was levi thinking, he could have just kept chopping his limbs every 30 minutes instead of the thunder spear nonsense.
@@bavandeep4683 I suspect Levi didn't think Zeke was the type to purposefully set it off, even at the chance of escaping.
armin nuking a whole city: marketa Sleeps. Zeke turning people in titans: marketa Woke
I swear like she gets on my nerves
preach!
Without a doubt one of the best episodes of the entire series.
IMO it will be episode 16
@@mybestfriendisaduck7992 Yeah I said ONE of. So I hope 16 is just as good if not better.
@@splinter360 yeah but man shits still pretty chill now part 2 is when aot is at its absolute peak
@@mybestfriendisaduck7992 what would make 16 better
@@madmoxxi7397 the action
Grisha said “what did I do wrong, I just wanted to see the airship”, which they cut from the anime.
When did he say that?
@@kaydollar2490 probaby when Zeke brought up Faye
They are probably saving it for the “big” flashback. Just like how they’re probably saving all the stuff Annie did during the invasion for a potential flashback for her. Then again idk how they’re going to wrap up things next episode
Suraj: “they’re all in the drip pose”
Casual: “huh?”
Gordon Ramsay to surj: “oh dear oh dear gorgeous”
I hope Marketa keeps this attitude when it is revealed Historia was in for genocide.
By the way, Deku's VA was doing little Zeke's voice, it was bothering me bc I couldn't figure it out who was.,I thought it was Hinata's VA, they do sound pretty much similar, but I was wrong.😅
Is funny how people can’t forgive zeke for the horrible things he did. But got no problem in forgiving Reiner ,Annie and pieck who did horrible things too. Some of this people need to go back and watch season 1 and see how many people died in that season.
To me it's not forgiveness, it's understanding. People watch this show and somehow they think they can be selective about who they show empathy. Well, to me, that's kind of missing the point. Eren has done monstrous things, but I understand him and feel for him. Same goes for Zeke. Same goes for Reiner, Annie, Bertholdt, Pieck, etc... I don't forgive their crimes, but I understand them, and I'm not smug enough to think I'd necessarily be any different in their situation.
Lol yep and them hating Zeke for what he's doing is just being biased asf like everyone in this show now, are turning into monsters no one is safe it's all about survival of the fittest. The weak die and the strong survive. Everyone vs everyone people will backstab you for their survival in that world
That's human nature as people we tend to be biased. Honestly I hate no one on this show in fact my favorite character is Berthold since season 2. I saw the good in him even before his monologue in season 3 when he said there's no right or wrong they just have to do what they have to do.
@@MarkHogan994 yea there is a diff with understanding and forgiving
Reiner, bertholdt and annie were children who were brainwashed when they broke the wall. I'm not mad at them but the people who made them that way, they are literally child soldiers made to atone for there ancestors sins.
One fact on why i side with Eren is because the Paradis military was stupid enough to think that peace was possible, no it never was and the show shows that
Peace is possible, it's just not easy, quick, painless, or guaranteed. Or permanent. But that's always what peace is like. Does that mean it's not worth working towards?
@@gemelwalters2942 but did it, if I were Eren I wouldn’t want to rely on an if and that’s a BIG IF.
@@gemelwalters2942 What are you talking about? Marley attacked Paradis when they'd been peaceful for 100 years because they want to retake the Founding Titan to dominate the rest of the world and steal the island's resources. Another attack was always going to be inevitable whether Zeke and Eren did something or not. Willy Tybur wanted to make world peace/stability forged in the blood of the Paradis Eldians, he was not going to help them.
@@HorseandHattock Peace is still possible? Tyber seemed to have a different plan in mind.
@@gemelwalters2942 LOLLLLLLLLLLLLL...marley wanted the founding titan and the resources ALL ALONG..thats why they sent annie,rhainer and bertholt,its a spy mission before a larger attack..didnt you hear what falco said to kaya?
"right now i'm only on the side of levi, mikasa, armin, and hange" oh, you mean the people who don't actually have any semblance of a plan to save the island from being nuked? nice.
Facts
Ya'll being too harsh on Zeke.
Zeke doesn't value individuals. He has so much blood on his hands.
@@bigman4407 as much as Eren and Armin though?
@@ramenbroth And Reiner, Annie, and Bert....
@@AigisVibes720 and every freaking characters on this show, people are just too biased
@@jotarokujo9620 Exactly man, these people are just too biased and don’t have a open mind.
If this story was told in reverse they would be calling Eren a monster who deserves no remorse after attacking the town and Zeke would look more like the hero. It's pretty wild, they all did some fucked up things for their goals.
Eh, I really don't think so. The circumstances under which Marley attacks Paradis and Eren attacks Liberio are very different. Context and motivations matter.
@@yukisohmas Doesn't matter, the outcome is that innocent people were killed. And I'm talking about the perspective of how they view characters, not the nations themselves. Eldia isn't exactly a saint nation, they had to have their memories erased for a reason. But watching from a character's perspective definitely matters. If we only got to see Eren from the start of his attack on Marley, he would look heartless and calculated.
12:38 I forget the episode, but Erens statement of “there’s no greater salvation than never being born in this world” contrasts with his mother’s statement “My baby is special because he was born in this world,” from Keiths flashback in like Season 3?
Just wait dude.
Won't say much but I can assure you there's much more, you'll get your answers.
Read the manga brother
lmao those replies are so spoilery. ''just wait'' - how about don't say anything and let them find out by themselves
Levi, Mickasa, Armin and Hange are trying to figure it out? What exactly? They have nothing but react to those with the initiative. All of them have become side characters right now, cause the one that commands it is Eren.
If Zeke was the main character they would be rooting for him...they only see him as a villain because they didn't start the show from his perspective...
because he make many scouts die thats why everyone hate him , but i don't hate him he have a reason doing this , he the most mysterious character in aot , if he not in there aot will be bored, he one of the best chracter in AOT
Big facts dude people just love those characters who have been shown good from the start...
Reiner betrayed eren and others but still so many people love him but nobody likes zeke
@@callistaaudi55 actually people are just biased, they're mad Zeke killing the scouts but already forgot that Annie in season 1 killed Levi's old squad and literally toyed with scout corpses
Zeke Jaeger, another goated character besides Eren and Reiner. Also Rip Lev 🖐🤟
Rip who?
Levi isn’t dead 😹
Rip who
@@Tiffany-ov2jf Lev is Levi without an i. He also lost 2 fingers. Sad.
@@Isabel-jf6id but nerf badly
This episode really is all about perspectives, so many different perspectives forced onto Zeke. He had a whole main shonen character backstory and could’ve easily been the main character of this story fighting against Paradis to save the world in a different timeline
Isayama is practically playing with nietzsche's philosophy, hiding ideas in the manga. Now people are keen to discover "evil". When good and bad are just social constructs, depending on the perspective they can have so many meanings. At this time where the fastest growing media is the overvalued 'heroism' media; of the valorization of one pole at the expense of another antagonistic pole, (we see this in the movies, in the comics, in the books, in the cinema) it is nice to know that Isayama has the courage to confront moral categorization. Another who does this very well in his work is George RR Martin.
Finally the episode that explains Zeke´s backstory. He is my favorite character since i read it a few years ago. I always get heated when people just talk shit about him (of course, until they get to this episode)
He is my favorite character since he come out from the beast titan nape (s2 last scene) 😂.
@@sayapmatahari4460 He is one of my favorite too for that same reason, just right behind eren and reiner. His beast titan's first appearance already make a lot of people curious but him emerging from his titan really made him so interesting.
Ever since he said "eren, someday I'll come rescue you" or something like that, I knew he had more depth than just the bad guy, ever since then I've been so interested in him. Most of the time when Zeke is shitted on is because of some biased levi simp view.
Zeke is an absolute piece of thrash. If Ymir got her powers from a devil then that means hell is real in this world, which is where Zeke is headed. good riddance
@@BhBc8f8 there's no devil.
Spoiler alert
Zeke went from one of my most hated character to my top 10 characters of all time in the span of an episode. Now that's great writing.
Damn even Rob started loving Zeke while Marketa is still on the hate train...
Right????? Rob gets a W and Marketa gets a L
Zeke is my 2nd fav but sad backstory doesn't make him a good person he killed thousands of humans he's getting what he deserve
Rob is great when it comes to AoT
i hated zeke even more when i found out about his backstory ,,,
@@leviackermann8399 and levy you will give him the punishment he deserves ,, why did'tn you cut him into more pieces ,, this backstory made me hate him even more ,,, so much more ,, i cannot evne understand how anyone can find even a sense of empathy for him ,,, he does'nt deserve that ,, people hated on gabi for killing shasha even though gabi only killed a person who attacked his village and once she gets to know them her brainwashing is slowly eliminating ,,,
Perfection is the writing in this show.
Yeah. But i dont like whats its implying. This show is too dark. I cant believe what im watching
@@bigman4407 What's it implying?
@@chriswave1992 Genocide
@@bigman4407 Oh nooo, don't *pfff* worry about that. 🤣
@@bigman4407 aot is worth because it is dark. there are tons of bright anime
PLOT TWIST: Zeke is the real protagonist
At this point anybody can be the protagonist. Levi may very well be the protagonist
No, that's actually John David Washington!
Isayama playing catch with his father:
Father: Nice catch son!!
Isayama: what if a monke throws a stone to whole ass squad n he has daddy issue who doesnt want to play catch with him when he was a kid???
The idea that an entire races extinction will bring “peace” to the world is BS. There will still be war, famine, and terrible ppl and events in that society. This plan honestly doesn’t 100% benefit anyone, yet I can understand Zeke’s reasoning. I’ve learned to watch this show from a neutral stand point because context is everything.
It's not so much peace as an end to suffering for Eldians and the elimination of the use of Titans as a means of war. At this point with the world's technology, the rumbling's potential for destruction is still the most powerful weapon on the planet. No more subjects of Ymir would eliminate it as a threat to the world. Not that I necessarily agree with Zeke's view.
18:27 Zeke wasn't enjoying that. He was trying to enjoy that to avoid being like his father, to stop sympathizing with the Eldians.
The change from how you guys were talking about Zeke at the beginning of the episode and at the end just shows how great this show is at character backstory
zeke did nothing wrong
The beast titan wasn’t useful before but since Zeke has it its really useful because he has royal blood from his mom
Tom Ksaver's Beast Titan was shown in the episode. Very subtle but amazing reveal. This is not a spoiler since I haven't read the manga, but I deducted that "beast titan" is not always monkey. Why not? because if it is, they will name it "Monkey Titan" or "Ape Titan", instead they named it beast which possibly means it could be many animals. And, they showed an animal near Tom Ksaver.
Wait what, where
@@sidh4780 🐏
@@bdlblob I know what it is, I'm asking at what point of the episode
@@sidh4780 when Tom Ksaver was telling zeke about his wife committing suicide.
Yes ...spotted that at 10:43. One of the toys. Also when Zeke runs with the Titans through the woods in the previous episode at 7:03, the way that titan holds him is the clue.
The voice cast is absolutely phenomenal in aot!
This chick is dense. Showing his background is not supposed to justify anything. It's just the reason he is the way he is. The whole point of this story is that nobody is right, there are no heroes in war and that the ends don't justify the means. Not every story has to have clear cut good and evil signaling.
This!
Historia would have to be turned into a titan for Eren to connect with her and use the Founder.
Do people realize that zeke just survives 4 or 5 of those thunder spears at once. I highly doubt hes dead from that.
La diferencia entre Eren y Zeke es que Grisha no le lavo el cerebro a Eren, el por su cuenta se da cuenta que viven encerrados y busca la libertad
Exacto.
Chingada madre esta gente no sabe nada.
Zeke "mejor no hago nada, mientras sea esclavo viviré."
Eren "prefiero morir peleando que vivir de rodillas."
Bien, me alegra que haya gente que se dé cuenta de estas cosas todavía y no caiga en el fácil odiar xd
Vulgärr Dile eso a los haters de Gabi JAJAJA
You probably wont care but Im trying to learn Spanish and I wanted to see if I would be able to understand this comment but I literally just blanked and cant remember anything😔 time to go practice again...
Keturah Edwards They said: “the difference between Eren and Zeke is that Grisha didn’t brainwash Eren, he found out that they lived “in a cage” and decided to fight for freedom by himself. Hope that helped.
3:58 suraj Dances like the abnormal titans run 😂😂
Its so easy to tell zeke he has a "different choice" especially if you didnt grew up with a traumatic childhood, you dont know the mental effects that can do to a child and how it changes your core at such a young age. So no you dont understand zeke unless you experienced what he did.
When I saw levi put the trap on zeke right away I was like are you dumb levi if he activates it your dead too and like I thought it did happen like bruhhh
I don't think a movie is going to be enough to finish the anime, the are at least 24 manga characters left and they usually do 1.5 or 2 characters per episode.
They would need at least one extra season.
Perhaps a part 2?!? I think they’d need at LEAST another 10 episodes
@@nic558 hopefully we can get a part 2 by fall 2022
I do wanna say being a guy bringing up daddy issues, only the courageous ones can talk about it... I was that kid that cried & covered my ears whenever my parents fought whether it being in the car or home. It hits mans. And out of all the people the show made you relate to...it was Zeke. Idk if Grisha hit Dina in that moment but doesn't change the feelings....What made it worst was that Zeke thought it was his fault & blamed himself. Only to betray his father and mother in the name of survival. That's deep guys.
And it's so strange to look back at season 1 and see how different Erens family was compared to Zeke... kind of a drastic change.
Ryan Stover true
Levi, armin and mikasa are not trying anything, they don't have any solution to the problem....just saying Suraj
Zeke was never whith marley or eldian
For me looking at their back story does not indeed change the fact that they did horrible stuff in the present, but it does in away made you realize and understand his ideals and why is he doing all those things, this ep was really needed.
Exactly, and this applies to almost all characters in this show. Gabi, Eren, Grisha, Zeke, Reiner.. those are examples of characters that get a lot of hate, all of them have done bad stuff but you can sympathize with them without forgetting that. Eren... well we know what he has been through but he still.. you know (manga), Grisha literally got his sister killed and felt betrayed by his family but became a HORRIBLE dad that mentally disturbed and hurt his son (and other things), Zeke went through what we saw this episode but he still murdered thousands of people (the scouts for example; he also did other bad stuff), and Reiner broke the wall, killed scouts, etc. but we also know where he came from. Gabi had a big ego and murdered a character that everyone loved, but if you think a little you can definitely see where she came from, even if you don’t like her (even though she had a BIG ass character development). And well, the list continues, that’s the cool thing about AOT, there’s no good or evil, it’s just people giving their bests and fighting for what they believe it’s right. Well, the only exception is the mustache guy who killed Grisha’s sister, fuck that man.
I don't think eren supports this "euthanization plan"
Because he said he is "free"
Titan shifter can survive that blast lol
In Lost Girls, Annie got shot through the heart and healed it after she collapsed, Bertholdt had his throat slashed opened by Mikasa in S2. The Nine are tough as hell to kill with regular violence. It’s crazy impressive.
i'm still waiting for the biggest explanation of the story of AOT being translated to anime ------
ATENTION SPOILLER ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!
shingeki no kyojin manga chapter 122
The story just keeps getting better and better. So many conversations to be had about Zeke, Eren, and even Yelena's motivations and beliefs. I may have to start reading the manga soon
the manga is basically just the extended cut with a whole lot of extra dialogue they had to cut from the show for run time.
Well if you stay here for story, I definitely recommend you to read manga, anime is good but manga has lots of content, so you will see a better view of story
Read it after ep 16
The chapter you need is 116-117 after this season finale
people thinking that eren got his freedom lust from grisha.......isayama will pull up an UNO reverse card on that real soon.....
it was all Ayren's decision and self-motivation after all~~~
It's interesting to see your body language. Some of you still believe that Zeke is a bad guy at the beginning.
If they took away the ability to turn into titans, Marley will immediately just kill all the living Eldians. The hatred will remain even if titans disappeared.
I'm gonna call it isayama gonna wreck marketa with Zeke backstory.
@kupis1408 except that bitch in the middle. She is so one minded and has no no brain cells, the typical casual anime only fan
@@i-dont-miss chill buddy
When you can't watch this anime with different perspective .....the reaction going to be somewhat toxic........
At the end rather than rooted for the whole purpose...if you think only about levi...then you know 😅
Wow Zeke backstory made me lost respect for Grisha...
Xaver-san is the real Daddy...
Now i understand Zeke, i feel your PAIN...
@Hazey A. After his failure in raising Zeke.
@SPARTAN PB he didn’t need to
Zeke wasn't being mean out of spite. He was doing for the greater good. I.e to save all Eldians. So even though he went about it the wrong way his intentions were just. We also know he regretted it because we see his memories in season 3 when he says: "I of all people should know how much a sin it is to force your beliefs on your children".
@Hazey A. he only became a good parent after he failed Zeke and didnt want to fail eren aswell
@SPARTAN PB yeah I know... I’m saying it didn’t end up mattering because Eren became what Grisha wanted from Zeke
I love how it shows zekes perspective of things like how grisha was as a father, but then we see grishas point of view and why he put so much pressure on zeke. This show is S tier.
Zeke is one of my favorite characters and his backstory is so well done. I can relate heavily to parents pressuring a kid and treating the kid like an adult. Some scenes really brought back memories for me. So I can see why Zeke became so messed up. I don't agree with the Euthanasia plan but I understand how Zeke came to that conclusion. If you have only seen suffering in your whole life, from yourself and others. I can understand the logic of "maybe it's just better to not be born. Zeke is such a tragic character I wish he could be happy.
hate normies for 1 reason .... without knowing zeke ,they trash talk him..he is one the key player
he is actually the most human in the series. most of them have personal agenda. armin just wants sight seeing, mikasa wants to be with eren no matter what, eren just wants to end the world so his race could live while zeke wants to end eldian suffering.
I feel Bad For Zeke
14:40, Wrong, even if Ayren had royal blood, it means he wouldn't be able to use it due to the vow of renouncing war. The reason the founding titan's power could be used is that Ayren activated it being a regular Eldia Jin coming in contact with a royal blood, it bypasses the vow. The Rice family wasn't able to use it because of the vow, despite having royal blood, that's why Kreesha had to steal it from them as they weren't of any use.
Zeke’s secret plan was to euthanise all Eldians. He wanted to use the Founding Titan to order Ymir to alter bodies of Eldians to stop them from reproducing, thus ending the line of Eldian Race a.k.a Extinction.
While Eren's plan.....
Y'all see Zeke as a bad person because he killed countless of scouts for a specific reason, but y'all see Armin as a good person even tho he killed countless of innocent people in order to save Eren. Ok
True Erwin to he sacrificed a city to catch the female titan in s1, it hard to say who is good or who is bad in Aot world
one word: biased
One thing I always don't like about Mickey here is that he can't understand the concept of the difference between "feeling bad" to a character and "empathizing with that character". It's the same understanding he had when Demon Slayer shows one demon's backstory.
Levi got blown up point blank by an anti armored tital explosive
Navi: omg the horse :0
Its all about perspective, or you agree with their plan or you hate him, you can't do both.
Zeke is already lost, but he can't do what he's suppose to do without sacrifices people, if u stop to think about it was the same with Erwin.
If you will aways follow the politic correctly answer in this specific mess up world the war will never end, people will keep dying and all this Titan shit will keep happening forever, a least what they're doing will put a end in all that of a long term thing, even if they're doing in this mess up way, cuz really, what are their options again?
As Eren said: *the best thing that can happen to you is not to be born in this world*