What is a LUNCHBOX LOCKER? How do the work?(Automatic Differential Locker)
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- Опубліковано 6 вер 2024
- What is a lunchbox locker? How does it work? What does it do? Lets find out!
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We hope you enjoyed this video and will keep in mind that all information included is intended to be purely academic and in fact is only the opinion of D&E. We are not professionals, nor are we qualified to knight you a professional. D&E want to ensure that anyone modify or fixing their own vehicle does so in a safe manner which leaves the vehicle in a legal, roadworthy state. In short, DON'T BE A MONKEY WITH A TOOL BOX! If you don't know what you are doing, leave it the professionals!
Awesome video! Went from
Not knowing wtf a lunchbox/Aussie locker was at all to pretty much being able To explain it to someone else!
These lockers are more genius than anyone realizes and I haven't found a YT video yet that explains one of their coolest features. I'm not sure if all "lunchbox" style lockers have this, but mine does and it appears this one does too. You will notice the alignment pin holes are slotted on one half. Have you ever wondered why? Why not just straight bored holes? Well, it's to allow one half of the inner spider to be clocked at a slightly different rotation than the opposing one. You're probably wondering how that would even be possible considering there is a huge pin between them and also what is the purpose? It's to allow your outside tire to rotate in a turn even under mild acceleration. What happens is at first you are accelerating in a straight line, both axles are locked, now...as you begin to turn a corner your outside tire starts to rotate faster than the inside. This differential of rotation causing the outside half of the locker to want to rotate AHEAD of your carrier rotation. The slotted pin holes allow this shift. At the same time the angled hole which was being pushed by the carrier pin is now allow to slide inward just a hair (while the carrier pin still is applying force to the inside wheel). It's genius actually. If you give it too much power your carrier pin will override this allowance and put everything back into lock, but under moderate power this thing acts like an open diff.
What a great explanation man. I'm a mech. engineer and didn't know how these work. You hit the nail on the head. Great job! I'm going through a rear diff problem on my own jeep and looking to upgrade to one of these. Thank you for the explanation and advice!
I have had one of these exact units installed into front diff and it was the best money i have spent and makes a huge difference to the places i can go and without now having to panic about getting a big run up to climb, Awesome product.
roger flame I’ve been thinking about this for my F-150 front axle so I have real 4 WD. When it’s in 2WD the outer wheel ends allow the wheels to be free of axle shafts as well as lets the front driveshaft disengaged
@@donaldpauli129 When in 2WD there will still be enough meshing from the locker to keep the driveshaft spinning so what i did to my Hilux was to install free wheeling hubs and then when you only need 2WD, you simply unlock the hubs and only the wheels spin, not the drive shafts and diff and saves a bit on fuel too
How many miles do you gave on the unit a d how noisy is it?
What vehicle did you install your front diff lunchbox into please? I have a mid 90's Toyota 4x4 and am about to fully regear both axles so I'm shopping locker options.
@@flamethrower161 This is good info! What year Hilux? Mine already has Warn manual hubs. I assume they are free wheeling because you have to stop the truck, get out, and manually lock or unlock them when you want to use 4WD. So I assume I'm good??
I had a spartan lunchbox locker in the front of my xj. It was a dedicated ranch rig and the thing clicked like crazy on asphalt, but worked awesome off road. Tight, reliable lockup every time.
👍 I have a lockright in my fj 60. rear. been fine back there put in early 2001. still going.
I had a 93 2wd Toyota pickup that I installed a Lock-Right in; it was by far the best and most worth every penny modification I ever made to any vehicle I'v owned.
This was such a good explanation!
Great explanation. My Aussie locker in my rear Dana 44a is very loud when turning a low speeds but I love it!
That GM video you talk about is super good. And they have a few of them for different systems.
Get one of those tennis racket style fly zappers. They work great and less than $5 at harbor freight. I use it mine on yellow jackets all the time.
WOW. Laid that out well. I'm picking up an '01 Tracker and will be putting some sort of these in, eventually. Sooner rather than later, I hope. Thanks for these details. Genius engineering indeed.
Im new to all this and automotive in general and this is probably the best video explaining how this locker works.
Really great video man. Auto lockers are so overlooked these days, with everyone on the air locker and E locker bandwagons. I think I'd rather have auto lockers than having to mess with buttons and switches before and after every obstacle. A funny (to me anyway) I bought a front locker for my Can Am X3 and its the same exact thing, but smaller... it's like a 3 inch, but it works like a charm, and I hear it click when I'm maneuvering through camp or around the driveway at home.
Remember.... Strength wise the lunchbox locker is driving through the cross pin only and putting all the load on the pin hole in carrier case.
Other lockers load into the side of their carrier case.
A limited slip/posi tranfers the load to the sides of the carrier itself by compressing the clutches between the axle gear and the case.
The pin carries almost no load....
Except in a Ford traction lock which only locks the drivers axle and locks up the other wheel by forcing the spider gears to not turn/ transferring load through the center pin.
A lunchbox locker rear is NOT AS STRONG as other differentials.
Great video man. Helped convince me to buy auto lockers for my TJ. I went with the Torq Locker by the same company that makes the Aussie locker. Made in the USA. Thanks for the vids man they are all very helpful!
Brilliant video. You made it look so simple. Thank you brother!!
Thanks for mentioning that advertisement, actually it's my favorite)
Are these suitable for a daily driver?
Bug-a-Salt gun is fantastic. Fun way to season a steak, too.
I'm pretty sure the gm video you're talking about was from 1936. I could be wring, but the one I'm thinking of was the first full floating axle.
That is a different one. There are a bunch of awesome GM vids from the era
Putting one in my 1990 GEO Tracker I bought.
This is the best explanation I’ve seen .
Great job, thanks
Just got a spartan locker in the mail for my Samurai. Can't wait to try it!
Good luck!
Finally you explain how it works in a clear way !
Thanks a lot !
Spectacular explanation, thank you.
I have a spartan in the rear and I never hear it clicking. It does unload once and awhile and makes a loud noise.
Love those Lockrights and ticking noises
This video made me a lot more confident on the choice of doing this to my jeep thanks for the info
From the sound of this, the new FAD (front axle disconnect) on 2021 jeep would actually pair up perfect with this. Since it wouldn't be turning at all when disconnected. A selectable for the rear would then be better also, either falling or out. Ya ? No ? Anyone?
A diff locker is usually the first thing I install on any Truck I buy I have also ''Lincoln Locked'' a few.
😱😱😱😱
@@hotrodray6802 Because the box they come in looks like those old lunch boxes.
Thanks my level of knowledge just went up.
Totally agree. One of the best mods I ever did to my XJ. Even with the added ratcheting.
Awesome. Is your XJ driven on the road much? How long have you had it in?
I'm sold. I will get this. my dif is making noise and need work anyway.
Thanks and praise
No your explanation is wrong the springs that go in gives tension keeping it locked the only time it unlocks is when you turn left or right and one wheel is moving faster then the other and that causes the springs to compress letting the slower axle to slip till they equal in rotation speed ie going straight then it locks back up again
Thank you Edward for your correction.
Nooo! It is the faster axle the one which will do the slip! The slower turning axle will be locked solid by the center bolt or pin!
This type of lockers are basically permanently locked. But they have two states of been locked.
1. SOFT LOCK (Spring tension only)
2. HARD LOCK (Center bolt or pin tension from the engine drive shaft)
When you turn the vehicle, the inside shaft will turn slower and because of that the drive shaft from the engine will turn the bolt/pin which will push on that side of the gear and lock it solid. But on the faster turning side, the wheel is turning the shaft faster than the drive shaft from the engine! In that case the gear will take the pressure of the bolt because the center hole is not perfectly round and with the pressure gone, the gear can move past the inside gear (and skip a tooth or two or how many is needed)! If the inside wheel starts to spin (because of too much drive shaft power from the engine), it will catch up with the speed of the outside wheel and then the bolt/pin will push on that gear too and hard lock it. This is the advantage of this type of locker vs a permanent locker. It allows you to turn by powering only the slower moving wheel but if the slower moving wheel begins to lose grip and spin, it will automatically and instantly "call" on the other wheel to help with traction.
No axle can turn slower than the ring gear.
The outside one can turn faster in a turn.
If they could turn slower than the ring gear, the car couldnt move.
Think about it.
Great video dude, i learned a lot. So basically this gives you a posi traction rear the faster you go?
Not all lunchbox locker's can be installed with the carrier still in the housing, depending on if the cross pin can clear the ring gear or not.
Also, the Dana 44a has retaining bolts for the axle shafts on my WJ instead of the c-clips.
My 01 durango 8 1/4 is LSD (suregrip since i need to be an ass about it), found out the hard way, wasnt smart enough to lift the rear end and spin the wheels, but point is, not all 8 1/4 mopars are open
haha.. fair point
Liked and subned though. Good vid and good info
@@andrewkahler9359 Thanks! Appreciate it!
My liberty renegade has the factory LSD but I’m thinking of putting the lunchbox in there because my front is open and I only have command trac. So I’m barely ever in 4wd.
My 2004 WJ jeep has the bolted in axles, no c clips. Dana 35
When you accelerate it locks up, and when you go around the corner it unlocks ... can anyone explain what if you're going around a corner and accelerating at the same time, what will happen
Great explanation of how it all works! I knew exactly what video you were talking about that explains how differentials work. That’s the video that helped me understand how they work.
Sorry mate, but imo you've got it slightly wrong.
These lokkas are locked all the time when driving straight ahead or when you load up the system during acceleration.
They unlock when you go around corners and then relock when going straight again.
They are rough in operation in a rear differential and can be quite abrupt, they require a slightly different driving technique than an open diff or you will have the noises and changes in turning radius or tyre slip on the road.
Very important to NOT fit one of these into the front diff of a full time 4x4, in vechicles with a standard old school 4wd system ie transfer case and locking hubs these are good.
Another point you will probably get to in your fitting video is that shimming the required clearences in the instructions is very important to the lokkas operation, get it right they are quieter and operate consistently and correctly. Fitting to spec also lowers steering forces although you will still get a noticable return to centre force on the steering wheel.
Having said that getting the required clearences is the biggest hangup of fitting these and can blow out the time taken to fit these. On occasion it will slip right in and everything is right where it needs to be, other times you have to have shims made to suit to get it all correct. I fitted one of these to an Isuzu pickup with ifs in the front diff (transfer case and manually locking front hubs) it made a massive difference to its offroad ability and really decreased the requirement to use momentum as your primary tool in getting over the rough stuff and all the damage that can cause.
Thanks for posting.
@John
Sorry I missed this.
I've mainly used these in the front, however from your description and what I've been told by others, yep that's normal. Under power they stayed locked and can unlock with a bang, whereas they unlock as they are designed to when coasting.
This is the major reason people fit selectable lockers in the rear or learn to drive to their limitations on the road.
Cheers
You’re 100% correct! I once had a rock crawler CJ7 that someone else built with 2 lunch box lockers front and rear. It was a white knuckle ride at anything over 25 mph! Dangerous as all get out really! Even on dry pavement you had no idea where the JEEP wanted to go! The suspension was so soft for articulation that it was truly gnarly to drive.
Roulette table ! 👍
Excellent descriprion. 👍👍
Just to clarify, my 2000 WJ with the 4.0L has a D35 rear axle without c-clips. The rear axle bearings are cartridge bearings.
Is the Lunchbox Locker going in the front? Just curious about this subject. It's great! 👍
I was going to go in the rear of my Cherokee
Never use a locker in the front on any street driven vehicle.
Use a limited slip posi.
@@hotrodray6802 it's fine on a part time 4wd system
Thanks so much, you explained it really well!
Excellent explanation! Thanks, man.
Love me some lunchbox lockers. I only run one up front. Have for the past 2 XJs. Makes the road manners the same as before but exponentially increases off road capability.
I've had previous Jeeps where I was locked in the back and both ends but for a daily driven XJ I found that I liked having the locker up front far more than int he back.
It's just the opposite for me, I have them in both ends of my XJ but if I could only pick one it would be the rear, daily driving with an open rear differential sucks.
@@Lray4x4 why do open diffs suck? Not too informed
@@armandosoria7993 because its easy to spin out when trying to accelerate since an open differential allows the tire with the least traction to spin, loose gravel, rain and snow make it worse.
@@Lray4x4 Oh ok. Thanks.
@@Lray4x4 its not the open diff that makes it a hard daily driver it your shitty driving. Never heard anyone say an open diff makes it a hard daily driver
Yo thumbs up for the bostitch!!
Awesome. Thanks for the knowledge. I’ve been looking for info for sometime. 👍🏽
Can you use a lunchbox in front and rear diff?
Yes, but a lunchbox in the front on the road makes a LOT of noise.
I just bought a 93 Toyota 4 Runner and I think it might have a locker in the front. When I locked both front hubs the tires went the same direction when I turned one. Plus it has fresh rtv gasket sealer on the front diff. Plus it has a Yukon sticker on it lol. It has lots of nice stuff added and it would be cool if it already had a front locker. If so is it bad to only lock 1 hub if you want to turn easier? I heard some guys doing this. It didn't seem very hard to turn and I have 35's but I was in snow and only had it out one time so far.
I can hear that annoying fly. Great info. I love Northern California because we don't have a lot of annoying flys. Just annoying Teslas and Priusus...
Sorry man... I'll take the flies. lol
I'm in nor Cal also. Priuses are a fucking plague!
I'm in NorCal too and there's tons of biting flies up in both the Sierra and Klamath ranges.
Mendocino (lower) and Sonoma counties are fine...hardly any if any annoying flies.
Can't think of any other places to wheel here in NorCal. Except Hollister...which is like fun training grounds lol
This the best explanation .
Great video! I just ordered my lunchbox locker for the front and rear of my Land Cruiser 80 series! It has a selectable 4x4 system. Quick question about the drivability on-road. I live in a hill-y area, is it okay to drive up inclines with turns? Will the lockers in the rear lock-up while I go up inclines while turning? Thanks!
Yeah I've seen that dif video. It is real good.
With the parts continually clicking around when it is not locked in does that wear out the metal components at all?
They do wear over time
Your video is outstanding. Very informative. Like Jimmy below, I had no idea what a lunchbox locker was. Great job. Thank you!
Excellent video! Are there any areas where you need to check clearance relating to the pins? I don’t have your average off-road vehicle, and there is only one locker available for it. Considering it’s Korean, the only thing I gather Is That there is a clearance necessary between pins? It looks just like a regular lunchbox locker
So if I'm turning off road will it be engaged or not? Just disengaged until I hit the gas?
Essential yes because of two reasons, these are designed to lock under load do to the ramp effect of the ecentric holes of the halves spreading to lock both wheels together, but once there is a difference in wheel speeds the locking teeth don’t match up enough to engage and they are essentially disengaging constantly with the difference in wheel spin when turning, but once driven straight they match and the load can then be applied to keeping them locked, but the transition of unlocking is what causes the weird behavior sometimes and sometimes they get stuck locked also, those are the main drawbacks of not setup properly or inconsistent transition of most lunch box lockers, all depends on budget
awesome though it full lock like welded diff
have you made a instal video yet?
I actually sold that jeep before i could instal it. sorry. If you are lookiing for a good instal vid checkout Vermont Jeep Girl
What's the quietest lunch box locker?
Cool.
Nice vid - can you really remove locking pin with carrier still inside diff?
Yes, 100%. That is the beauty of a lunchbox locker like this
If its too noisy for you use thicker gear oil. Quite it right down.
Does this affect day to day driving
It'll make your day very eventful if you aren't careful in slick conditions, it'll easily get you sideways or worse if you are too heavy on the skinny pedal. Once you find out how it acts and feels its fine though, just takes a bit of a learning curve to get used to the handling difference between an open differential and a locker/limited slip.
It behaves like a Detroit locker essentially? Ratcheting action when you’re turning, locked when going straight?
Yes. Detroit, Lokka, Lock rite, Spartan.... they all work basically the same way
Awesome video. Thanks. 👍
And feed that fly to the lokka lizard
LOL
Good explanations , thank you.
My zj has a dana 44 rear
Thanks for this video. I had to replace my d44 with an AMC20 that came with a locker and 1-piece axle conversion. The CJ5 on acceleration (street driving) and when I let off the gas wiggles the rear. Is that normal for these? Just need to get used to it? Thanks
Do they make a lunchbox locker with clutches so that it's not so noisy?
Absolutely perfectly explained!
Thanks bud.
You stated you don’t need to pull differentials. If you are running a larger tire and using a bigger ring gear, you will be pulling your differential.
Great vid man explained it perfectly 👍🏼
Can I install one of these in a 08 Silverado 2500 h.d.? Or is it just for jeeps?
Very good explanation thanks
Has anybody seen a kit for BMW e39 diff? My homemade UTV could use one.
I watched a video that said they're always locked until you turn.
Absolutely great video my friend
Great explanation
Is it really that good?
How long would you reckon the pins and springs last? Anyway to know when they are going bad?
It depends on how hard you are using it. Tire size, gearing, all that. These things make a LOT of noise when the pins start to go, so you will know
ScottRidesHonda not really for hard use you need to buy a full posi unit for hard use these are really for 4x4 use on sand or snow where your not putting a lot of HP to is link in a drag race. Cause they will brake under extreme pressure just a lil fyi
God jobb men. But what about c lips its possibile to put spartan locker to dana 35 ?
Yes, 100%. The spacer cups act as the side gears to retain the c-clips
I put 85w140 oil in my axles and it quiets the locker down.
Interesting.... I will have to try that. Thanks!
So it is not indicated to go off roading with a slectable locker?
Honestly i am new into this whole jeep world and i just strated researching because i want to buy an xj this summer or next year (i am 17 and in the country where i live you can only get your licence at 18) and i want to know what an proper off roader should contain. Any suggestions and information (even if it is off topic) is welcome
An XJ is a great starting spot for getting in to Jeeping. very easy and inexpensive to mod
How strong is this locker compared to a Detroit?
If you are going to be out on trails rock crawling you want a Detroit, these lunchbox lockers are for light duty use.
ALL the torque load is on the cross pin shaft/holes.
Light duty.
NO 5,000 RPM CLUTCH DROPS ALLOWED.
Any bad things about these automatic lockers? Besides the obvious you can't unlock them if you want
They make noise when you drive, sometimes give a harsh on-road feel, and eventually wear out
Thank you very much, simple and intuitive video. I will mount a similar block on my AMC20, what is Your differential?
This locker was a for a Chrysler 8.25
D&E In The Garage ok thank you
How long do these hold up? Do they wear out?
I'm looking into the powertrax locker that is basically the same design as this one. It'll go into the front end of my 2013 F-150. It's my daily driver though. Would you still recommend this locker for a daily driver or should I stay away from an automatic locker?
All depends. you will definitely hear it everyday while driving and in some conditions on-road ride quality and handling may suffer. that said, it is a great way to add some capability to your truck for cheap
I had powerertrax. If anything ever breaks in your front axle,thats what is gonna let loose. Also if you have auto hubs you'll absolutely hate it. You'll feel clicking in your steering wheel and it's gonna drive you crazy. I had it in the front of my Dana 44. I went back to open diff. I wouldn't put it in a daily, unless you have manual hubs.
I’ve been debating on putting a locker in my truck, I drive it on & off road. And I do a little plowing with it during the winter so something like this would really help me out there I’d imagine. I understand how they work & with that being said plus what you mentioned about driving on & off road with them I think I’d be absolutely fine. But I’ve had tons of people tell me it would ruin my trucks road manners & make it hard to maneuver on road etc..? What’s your opinion on this?
If you are used to a rougher ride anyway, go for it. If you want to be running Cadillac smooth this may not be for you. It will effect on-road manners
Alright thank you very much I will take this into consideration!👍🏼
Great video man...
Thank you
I thought WJ axles didn't have C Clips
would this work to make a 2wd a true 2wd instead of having to put in a posi diff
yes. a "posi" is just GM's proprietary name for their limited slip differential. A "lunchbox locker" is another form of limited slip differential
Great video....
Now where's the link to buy it
Other than name, what's the difference between brands of these lockers?
in most cases, nothing
Lunchbox lockers are not as strong because they put ALL the load on the cross pin holes in the carrier.
See my other post explanation.