Dear haas. maybe it would be worth making the 4th and 5th axis connectors somewhere on the side of the table? (like AUX air connector) The wires from the machine would be run like wires to the X-axis servo drives, so the disturbing or breaking cables would disappear.
Thank you very much, please make more videos like this and how to start to set up and how to adjust the set up to make its right for vertical haas 4 and 5 axis CNC machine center, thanks
@12:54 we need to enter the corresponding variables into the corresponding settings? It doesn’t do it on its own? Which one is our center of rotation? How do we know where to program from?
@Haas Automation I work with vf-2tr (tr160) and The features mentioned is available and enabled. However, the settings (300 to 305) not there. I tried to use DWO/ TCPC but not work as should be. Any advice please?
I wish you'd make a 5-axis machine for home use that is below $15,000. Maybe with steppers instead of servos. It doesn't need to be fast, just precise enough for the enthusiast DIYer. Fusion 360 has opened up so many possibilites in that price segment.
The key difference between stepper motor and servos is that servo motor knows its exact position, because it has the rotary encoder, whereas stepper motor doesn't. But it is possible to use some sort of limit switches to set the start position of the machine when using stepper motors. It's just a little bit more difficult comparing to the servos, I think.
First of all I don't have a HAAS. But if anyone can help answer my 5 axis question I would be thankful. I use Solidworks and Camworks. When I built my post processor in Camworks UPG I see nowhere to input my A axis offsets. I have a Table Table 5 axis. When I run simulation in Solidworks all axises turn correct and Z mills the parts. On my machine all axises turn correct as it's running a dry run but Z seems to mill the top of the part fine at A0 but when A90 the Z is still where it was and now 2" above the part. Coordinate plane is at A centerline in the CAM model
I just ran the MRZP template....it just flattens platter and just alarms out and says “set TC by pressing insert” it doesn’t tilt the platter and enter correct data in the machine variable.....so i guess i have to measure A+90 / A-90 and and find the values manually to finalize the MRZP?
Zachary Breeden I’m having trouble with this! His problem is the same one I’m having right now. It isn’t continuing with the probing routine. Just “set TC by pressing insert” but I have already set my A axis flat.
It's clear to see that you know what you're talking about but as for me, a machining hobbyist wanting to move from Tormach hobby mills to one of the smaller haas mills, just listening to you describe all of these steps is mind numbing. This mind-numbing effect has more to do with my dyslexia than it does with all of the steps involved. I'm a self-taught hobby machinist as well as being self-taught in CAD/CAM. When you're self-taught, you have a situation where the teacher is just as ignorant as the student. There's alot of trial and error involved. It will be a while till I come up with all of the funds to actually make such a machine upgrade. Hopefully by then Haas will have integrated a bit more "Artificial-Intelligence" into their CNC mills that will do all of this setting up for me so that all I have to do is create my ideas, designs and inventions and then machine them into existence. Doing all of the setting up of these 5th-Axis milling devices and calculation come very easy to some folks, but unfortunately for me, I'm not one of these lucky folks. I'm a creative dyslexic person who sucks at math but, given enough time I can eventually figure these things out for myself. Still, it will be nice if when I finally get all my ducks in a row to make the move to a larger milling machine, Haas will have integrated the "Artificial-Intelligence" into their newer mills to allow me to dive right in with a minimum of mental stress.
travisspeedee - Not every option is available for tryout, and that includes 4th and 5th axis since they each require an axis drive and wiring to power a rotary or trunnion table. If you go to that options page on your control, only the options that are available for 200 hour trials are listed with "Tryout Available"
Everytime I see that "tryout available" it pisses me off. Especially when I negotiated having High speed machining included but it's been more than 6 months that I've been fighting to get that turned on. HAAS really should re-evaluate those options, increase the price of the machine but include all "options".
You won't get an option for free unless it was in your purchase order for the machine at the time that you paid for it. If that's the case then call your HFO and get the code for it. However, if the option wasn't in your PO, they're under no obligation to give it to you regardless of any verbal agreements. That sounds like your salesman put one over on you.
The time companies put into software development on these features has to get recouped somehow. It doesn't matter that the hardware already exists. In this case, you end up with a freely upgradable base model with a low cost for those who don't need the advanced features. Much better position than back in the old days when actual hardware changes were needed.
It's only software (no physical components) so they load everything and you only pay for the software level you need. Downloading the software to the machine costs next to nothing so they put it all there but don't forget that it was HAAS who already paid up front for the thousands of hours that go into the development of each bit of software which rightly so, they want a return on their investment. Motec does the same with the engine ECU packages. In my case and relating to engine ECU's, I weighed up the cost of what I needed my ECU to do and it turned out another brand was cheaper. Do the same with HAAS, figure out what you need exactly and how much it'll cost then compare that with other brands but I'll guarantee you you'll find it difficult to find better value than HAAS when comparing features.
Why is the 5th axis drive and wiring option 3 TIMES the cost of the 4th axis drive and wiring option? Knowing Haas and how they standardize so many parts (which is reasonable of course given they are a business trying to make money) Can anybody tell me with any certainty that there is any physical difference between the two drives other than the Sticker and maybe some firmware so the control knows its not just a 4th axis drive??? seems a little like price gouging for the "premium" of a 5th axis??? As if the cost of the rotary product wasn't enough? I'd be willing to bet that if you cracked them open they are identical on the inside! I Also agree with others who say HSM should be a standard option. Haas even states that "Modern toolpaths NEED HSM..." in their video spotlight of the feature. So why not just include it from the start since most people want it anyway? the control is already capable of it from the start! Same goes with Macros, most other manufactures don't even consider it an option but a given?!? I understand picking and choosing options to best suit the application and save unnecessary costs but when it comes to software options that cost Haas $0 to activate that's where it gets a little ridiculous.
It is true it is expensive. 'But when you start looking at more than 3 axis you pay regardless of how you approach it. It is difficult to buy power without money, that is what it mainly comes down to. Simply put the more money you want to make, the more money you need to spend it,s pretty much that simple. If you look at buying a ready to go 5 axis you will quickly see the price go up. Regards Peter.
DWO and TCPC is very simple piece of math. You only need to know MRZP (coordinates of the intersection of the axes A and C) and G54 work offset in MRZP coordinates. Using the Denavit-Hartenberg parametrs, you can eseily find a homogeneous transformation matrix. Excel sheet: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19IQZWzaFsI3rdgrOZrXs-BVNhHD89n4hfWrxi9SXnh4/edit?usp=sharing
i watched all 3 parts but i dont got an answer to my question. Assuming you have a 3-Axis and a 4-Axis Machine, which parts can be made only with a 5-axis machine ? (yes i know 21% time saving, but thats not enough for me) (only example i found are impellers) any ideas anyone?
I will try with my best English ;) I think you are right with simultaneously parts like impellers or helical nuts on a 4th axis. The main factor i can think of, is the reason that you save a lot of time on parts, that have mill jobs on each surface. We needed 5X the most, because the accuracy of all jobs of each surface to each other, couldnt get realized when u clamp the part every single time for each surface. Also we needed it for holes that were angled in 2 ways (for example B5°A10°). But those were Machines over 300k €. We have only one Haas in our Firm and now thinking of buying a new VF4SS with an TRT200Y, because of the low price. The rest of our Machines are DMG and Spinner Mills. But im not sure how accurate this combination is. The Parts arn't this complicated (stuff like sensor holders) but need to be clamped 2-3 times without 5 axis, maybe well give it a try.
Except this doesn't work. Push insert in the Rotary settings menu, "saves" the new home position, then homes to some other arbitrary position when I re-home it -_-
The normal machines have simple mouse and keyboard. And Haases have a million of stupid mysterious buttons. Needlessly complicated to use. On the other hand, their youtube videos are very very good.
This is misleading and over simplified. Yes on the older machines you pick up the offsets manually, but you do it with probing routines. You can also automate the process with good tooling and smart macros. Nobody in their right mind spends the money on a 5-axis machine, and then picks up the offsets by hand like he shows here - give me a break. Of course the DWOs and TCPC are nice, but if you find a good deal on an older machine, you can still do great things with it.
This is too mechanical. Can't u just use laser scanner to configure your own machine instead of dumping your job on your customer? your machine should be able to 3d scan everything inside it that is not a tool or a part to be milled and find its own damn center in less than a minuet as the name indicates "CNC".
This is the best tutorial ever about 5 axis! Simple and direct! Thank you!!!
Haas does such a good job at these video's!
Dear haas. maybe it would be worth making the 4th and 5th axis
connectors somewhere on the side of the table? (like AUX air connector)
The wires from the machine would be run like wires to the X-axis servo
drives, so the disturbing or breaking cables would disappear.
Thank you very much, please make more videos like this and how to start to set up and how to adjust the set up to make its right for vertical haas 4 and 5 axis CNC machine center, thanks
@12:54 we need to enter the corresponding variables into the corresponding settings? It doesn’t do it on its own? Which one is our center of rotation? How do we know where to program from?
I only fear the price!
Buy a Hermle or DMG, then we talk about fear ;)
Instead, try to think how much you can make on each hour working that. ;-)
£30 grand delivered fyi
🤣🤣
@Haas Automation
I work with vf-2tr (tr160) and The features mentioned is available and enabled. However, the settings (300 to 305) not there.
I tried to use DWO/ TCPC but not work as should be.
Any advice please?
I wish you'd make a 5-axis machine for home use that is below $15,000. Maybe with steppers instead of servos. It doesn't need to be fast, just precise enough for the enthusiast DIYer. Fusion 360 has opened up so many possibilites in that price segment.
The key difference between stepper motor and servos is that servo motor knows its exact position, because it has the rotary encoder, whereas stepper motor doesn't. But it is possible to use some sort of limit switches to set the start position of the machine when using stepper motors. It's just a little bit more difficult comparing to the servos, I think.
Gracias.... por sus videos...
Muy instructivo...
Thanks for the terminology!
Rotary is the slave to tilt axis 👌
Is ''Macro Enabled'' a free option on next gen millers?. I know it's not free on the lathes.
My machine does not have Proble. If I option DWO/TCPC, do i need to buy more Proble?
First of all I don't have a HAAS.
But if anyone can help answer my 5 axis question I would be thankful.
I use Solidworks and Camworks.
When I built my post processor in Camworks UPG I see nowhere to input my A axis offsets. I have a Table Table 5 axis.
When I run simulation in Solidworks all axises turn correct and Z mills the parts. On my machine all axises turn correct as it's running a dry run but Z seems to mill the top of the part fine at A0 but when A90 the Z is still where it was and now 2" above the part.
Coordinate plane is at A centerline in the CAM model
I just ran the MRZP template....it just flattens platter and just alarms out and says “set TC by pressing insert” it doesn’t tilt the platter and enter correct data in the machine variable.....so i guess i have to measure A+90 / A-90 and and find the values manually to finalize the MRZP?
still giving you trouble Jason?
Zachary Breeden I’m having trouble with this! His problem is the same one I’m having right now. It isn’t continuing with the probing routine. Just “set TC by pressing insert” but I have already set my A axis flat.
Did you figure out the solution? I’m currently running into this issue.
Awesome!
Are new videos expected in this series?
Love the video
after he start find home position with a not rotating cutter on paper that was on a steel, everything became clear to me at once!!! big theory
It's clear to see that you know what you're talking about but as for me, a machining hobbyist wanting to move from Tormach hobby mills to one of the smaller haas mills, just listening to you describe all of these steps is mind numbing. This mind-numbing effect has more to do with my dyslexia than it does with all of the steps involved. I'm a self-taught hobby machinist as well as being self-taught in CAD/CAM. When you're self-taught, you have a situation where the teacher is just as ignorant as the student. There's alot of trial and error involved.
It will be a while till I come up with all of the funds to actually make such a machine upgrade. Hopefully by then Haas will have integrated a bit more "Artificial-Intelligence" into their CNC mills that will do all of this setting up for me so that all I have to do is create my ideas, designs and inventions and then machine them into existence.
Doing all of the setting up of these 5th-Axis milling devices and calculation come very easy to some folks, but unfortunately for me, I'm not one of these lucky folks. I'm a creative dyslexic person who sucks at math but, given enough time I can eventually figure these things out for myself. Still, it will be nice if when I finally get all my ducks in a row to make the move to a larger milling machine, Haas will have integrated the "Artificial-Intelligence" into their newer mills to allow me to dive right in with a minimum of mental stress.
I was the same but the more you learn and try it the easier it gets
Did I just hear that right a trial period for 4th and 5th axis Wtf that's an option you get hosed extra for??
travisspeedee - Not every option is available for tryout, and that includes 4th and 5th axis since they each require an axis drive and wiring to power a rotary or trunnion table. If you go to that options page on your control, only the options that are available for 200 hour trials are listed with "Tryout Available"
Everytime I see that "tryout available" it pisses me off. Especially when I negotiated having High speed machining included but it's been more than 6 months that I've been fighting to get that turned on. HAAS really should re-evaluate those options, increase the price of the machine but include all "options".
You won't get an option for free unless it was in your purchase order for the machine at the time that you paid for it. If that's the case then call your HFO and get the code for it. However, if the option wasn't in your PO, they're under no obligation to give it to you regardless of any verbal agreements. That sounds like your salesman put one over on you.
Trial... period... for stuff already on the machine? Did I just read that right???
Definitely it's better to buy some other brand.
@@John.Doe.2025Nowadays it is a usual practice for all companies to force customers to buy options.
They are BUSINESS. their purpose in life is to rip every last cent from their customers.
The time companies put into software development on these features has to get recouped somehow. It doesn't matter that the hardware already exists. In this case, you end up with a freely upgradable base model with a low cost for those who don't need the advanced features. Much better position than back in the old days when actual hardware changes were needed.
It's only software (no physical components) so they load everything and you only pay for the software level you need. Downloading the software to the machine costs next to nothing so they put it all there but don't forget that it was HAAS who already paid up front for the thousands of hours that go into the development of each bit of software which rightly so, they want a return on their investment. Motec does the same with the engine ECU packages. In my case and relating to engine ECU's, I weighed up the cost of what I needed my ECU to do and it turned out another brand was cheaper. Do the same with HAAS, figure out what you need exactly and how much it'll cost then compare that with other brands but I'll guarantee you you'll find it difficult to find better value than HAAS when comparing features.
I am using MRZP probe the trunnion. but its not registering the values in machine set up page ! help
Did you ever find out the issue? I’m in the same boat
Why is the 5th axis drive and wiring option 3 TIMES the cost of the 4th axis drive and wiring option? Knowing Haas and how they standardize so many parts (which is reasonable of course given they are a business trying to make money) Can anybody tell me with any certainty that there is any physical difference between the two drives other than the Sticker and maybe some firmware so the control knows its not just a 4th axis drive??? seems a little like price gouging for the "premium" of a 5th axis??? As if the cost of the rotary product wasn't enough? I'd be willing to bet that if you cracked them open they are identical on the inside! I Also agree with others who say HSM should be a standard option. Haas even states that "Modern toolpaths NEED HSM..." in their video spotlight of the feature. So why not just include it from the start since most people want it anyway? the control is already capable of it from the start! Same goes with Macros, most other manufactures don't even consider it an option but a given?!? I understand picking and choosing options to best suit the application and save unnecessary costs but when it comes to software options that cost Haas $0 to activate that's where it gets a little ridiculous.
What cam software is that?
Pak klo z axis di ganjal dengan plastik stell, apakah nanti tidak oblak pas terkena beban pas buat mill besi
wahyuprasetyo9850, Semua komponen yang dimuat dan coran antara kepala spindel sumbu Z dan meja mesin terbuat dari besi tuang atau baja.
Why does a 5th axis trunnion cost as much as a complete mill? Not trolling, I'm just curious what's in it other than some servos and worm gears
It is true it is expensive.
'But when you start looking at more than 3 axis you pay regardless of how you approach it.
It is difficult to buy power without money, that is what it mainly comes down to.
Simply put the more money you want to make, the more money you need to spend it,s pretty much that simple.
If you look at buying a ready to go 5 axis you will quickly see the price go up.
Regards Peter.
So will this work with the old control panels?
Nope
Did you forget to zero the Dynamic offset after indicating parrallel to the x-axis @9:58... And if iam correct, can i get a free haas pls. Thank you
Wait, what dynamic offset?
Incredible innovative
DWO and TCPC is very simple piece of math. You only need to know MRZP (coordinates of the intersection of the axes A and C) and G54 work offset in MRZP coordinates. Using the Denavit-Hartenberg parametrs, you can eseily find a homogeneous transformation matrix. Excel sheet: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19IQZWzaFsI3rdgrOZrXs-BVNhHD89n4hfWrxi9SXnh4/edit?usp=sharing
what happens if my CAM Software gives me only B axis values instead of C axis???
Probably a post processing issue
I have the same problem with MasterCam, did you find a solution?
i watched all 3 parts but i dont got an answer to my question.
Assuming you have a 3-Axis and a 4-Axis Machine,
which parts can be made only with a 5-axis machine ?
(yes i know 21% time saving, but thats not enough for me)
(only example i found are impellers)
any ideas anyone?
I will try with my best English ;) I think you are right with simultaneously parts like impellers or helical nuts on a 4th axis. The main factor i can think of, is the reason that you save a lot of time on parts, that have mill jobs on each surface. We needed 5X the most, because the accuracy
of all jobs of each surface to each other, couldnt get realized when u clamp the part every single time for each surface. Also we needed it for holes that were angled in 2 ways (for example B5°A10°). But those were Machines over 300k €.
We have only one Haas in our Firm and now thinking of buying a new VF4SS with an TRT200Y, because of the low price. The rest of our Machines are DMG and Spinner Mills. But im not sure how accurate this combination is. The Parts arn't this complicated (stuff like sensor holders) but need to be clamped 2-3 times without 5 axis, maybe well give it a try.
Except this doesn't work. Push insert in the Rotary settings menu, "saves" the new home position, then homes to some other arbitrary position when I re-home it -_-
That's because home position and machine home are two different things.
Where do I get a hass tshirt
first you have to buy a haas machine, you get a t-shirt free. save money that way lol.
Where are the rest of the vids?
asrthsntar - We have a playlist with all three videos in it: ua-cam.com/video/zTYmSQ2DbJ4/v-deo.html - Haas Automation
Am i the only one who paused this video every 5 seconds just to understand what he just said?
The normal machines have simple mouse and keyboard. And Haases have a million of stupid mysterious buttons. Needlessly complicated to use.
On the other hand, their youtube videos are very very good.
👍
by the way! there are easier ways to work with positioning
Armando Varillas how?
tiene razon jack flash deben vender con las opciones precio total - Peru
everything is trial with haas, greedy people
Daniel Machado - Brazil
Haas is becoming the EA of CNC Machining. Trial periods for shit already on the machine, that is the dumbest thing I've ever heard.
This is misleading and over simplified. Yes on the older machines you pick up the offsets manually, but you do it with probing routines. You can also automate the process with good tooling and smart macros. Nobody in their right mind spends the money on a 5-axis machine, and then picks up the offsets by hand like he shows here - give me a break. Of course the DWOs and TCPC are nice, but if you find a good deal on an older machine, you can still do great things with it.
poKEYS57 anyone ??
This is too mechanical. Can't u just use laser scanner to configure your own machine instead of dumping your job on your customer? your machine should be able to 3d scan everything inside it that is not a tool or a part to be milled and find its own damn center in less than a minuet as the name indicates "CNC".