Par for the course for Marvel. there's an old story they avoided a tax on their action figures with the same argument. "they aren't dolls of human figures, they're mutants."
so, no one going to mention that they changed the order of the Casting Cost colors for Captain America to put it Red White and Blue instead of Blue Red White like all other Jeskai cards
Never before have I appreciated how much Crim just likes things and refuses to be a hater. No hypothetical makes Crim salty. He just loves card games. :)
LoTR set art did not match the Peter Jackson movies aesthetic and that set did just fine. I think Marvel will do well regardless of nitpicks on the art.
I think the difference is that Lord of the rings fans care less about the art because they're book fans. The arts could be bad and the set still going to sell like hotcakes because Marvel.
@@MakeVarahHappen While I have zero evidence for this, I would bet you that more people (both that bought Magic product and those that didn't) have watched the films and are more familiar with those than number of book readers. However I agree that Marvel will sell because Marvel.
@@MakeVarahHappen just because they existed doesn’t mean something brought it back into the modern day and to millions of people that hadn’t read the books. Both things can be true. The context here is that the podcast was asking if this looks like how “casual comic fans” i.e. MCU fans and not necessarily comic book fans would see the art. I’m analogizing this to art that did not represent the more modern take of a franchise in a similar way, and the product was successful. That is all.
I like how these cross-promotional cards 20 years ago would have Captain America with his colors inverted throwing a shield in the shape of a star and his ability would be flying, because no one could be bothered to actually figure out how the other IP worked. And Richard is complaining that they look like modern comic art covers with a Magic the Gathering art direction framing style when they have incredibly on-flavor card text.
Appreciate you guys actually giving your opinion on the bannings before waiting to hear the community response. Most podcasts actually wait to see which way the wind is blowing and just reflect what their audience wants to hear.
In contrast to Richard’s point about the art, I thought the Transformers cards had TERRIBLE art, I don’t want UB to be a copy and paste job, give us unique art that provides a magic feel while staying true to the IP. Richard the contrarian strikes again.
I think the Transformers cards are the only UB cards I feel actively bad seeing on Magic cards because even if it's art meant to resemble stills from the cartoons, it just makes it 'feel' unprofessional for that reason.
Shoutout to Seth for taking some serious heat on Twitter for essentially disagreeing with the community on the EDH bans. Looks like most voices are either mad that their expensive Commander investments evaporated in value overnight, or mad that the RC claims to want to ban fast mana but then still left Sol Ring or Ancient Tomb in (saying Sol being “iconic” isn’t an excuse). And then there’s a whole other discourse arguing the validity of R0 and how this applies to bans But seriously, a lot of people weren’t on Seth’s side on his tweets but he’s definitely taking it really well 😅
He had to get back on the community’s side after his anti-B Enchantment Removal take :p But seriously, I like that Seth is always willing to say what he believes about the game regardless of whether others agree with it or not.
No idea what he tweeted realy but im not a fan either.. commander is a casual format and one of the only placed where u could play what u want to play. If a card is borderline destroying the format fine but i dont see this with the 4 cards banned today. Nothing that couldnt be discussed on the table
@@RBGolbatYeah absolutely. Like most things, obviously people are going to have different opinions and takes. That’s what makes community interactions fun - to hear/debate different points of views. But this topic is just SOOO divisive because there’s a lot of “feels bad” EDH and cEDH players that lost out on hundreds, if not thousands of dollars because of these bans. So if you’re like Seth who thinks the RC did a good job with this, I guess I can see why some enthusiast players would take siding with the bans really personally/defensively
@@eisberg7681 I mean, that’s just the Rule Zero argument when it comes to this topic. But to Seth’s point on Twitter, outside of regular pods and familiar groups, Commander has outgrown the “let’s just talk it out” negotiations in 2024 when it comes to playing EDH with random people or players outside your group. Also, Rule Zero doesn’t solve the problem of these cards losing all of their value overnight, which is another reason behind the anger over on Twitter that a lot of EDH and cEDH players are having with those who think these bans are a positive.
@@RBGolbat same. Even though i dont totally agree on his enchantment take it provides interesting perspective. in general I think surrounding yourself with people that only think the same things as you is dangerous
Actually very glad to have Crim on the podcast talking about Marvel stuff. I'm essentially at Seth's level of knowledge when it comes to Marvel so it's great hearing the perspective of an entrenched comic fan that's also a high level MTG player!
The discourse around the art style of the marvel cards seems kind of sad and predictable to me. When they make 3rd party magic cards that look nothing like magic people complain about it, and then when they make 3rd party magic cards look like magic cards people complain about it. What could magic do that wouldn't create this kind of discourse at this point?
If the arguments they made against these cards are the best they can do, then these will be massively popular and WotC has won in transforming MtG from a unique IP into a platform for selling other IPs.
@@eegles yeah, that's totally what happened and why we no longer have story sets and lore articles coming out anymore since the first UB run, right? Oh wait...
@@casteanpreswyn7528 He ran his hand over his face in disgust, then froze. What happened to his face? Were those whiskers? Was he covered in fur? Was that … a tail? "I'm going to kill him!" Ral shouted, his eyes filling with lightning as he shook his paw at the sky.
This whole argument over the comic vs Mtg art just reminds me of how the street fighter cards didn’t have any capcom artists involved. I wouldn’t have gotten them either way (I did get all the universe within versions) but it would’ve been so hype if someone like Bengus actually got to do some of the street fighter cards instead.
I think the bans are alright. These rules are of course for pick up games and these banning will more likely help rather than harm most experiences. I think there are philosophical arguments to do take other approaches, but I think the RC is accomplishing what it envisions for the format.
Ajani and Chandra make perfectly good sense The first episode follows Chandra as she ignites her Spark. Which Plane they choose to Walk her to, she finds Ajani, who serves as a mentor teaching her (and the viewers) about Planeswalkers, the Multiverse, etc. Later down the line, they encounter one of Liliana's Demons she made a Pact with. They work together with Liliana to kill the Demon, but Liliana goes her own way Over the course of the series, as they Planeswalk around, they meet the other classic members of Magic - Nissa, Gideon, etc. Then you save Jace for the very end bc he's the Poster Boy and will probably have the most hype around him.
Alternately, have Chandra meet Jace while he's still an inexperienced nerd - or have him as an antagonist. He was a criminal on Ravnica and a member of the Infinite Consortium, after all.
I pulled a random Dockside out of a Lost Caverns of Ixalan pack a few months ago and immediately sold it for store credit. As someone who believes cards are meant to be played with not collected, I genuinely do not feel bad for anyone who invests in shiny cardboard.
Agree but with a bit of a difference. Cardboard is meant to be played with and also collected, not invested in. I won't feel bad for something "losing value." If there's a card I want in my binder I'll get it and part with the money.
I don't think it's right to say that this is a philosophy of banning based upon power level. While the banned cards are all undeniably powerful, the reasoning is not about power but play pattern, i.e. because mid-game cards have gotten so much more powerful, the 3 v. 1 dynamic for the fast start player is less effective, and that negatively impacts gameplay. It's an interesting philosophy that limits potential future bannings for cards that are strong or unpopular.
The EDH reddit is so salty about these cards being banned but i think that says more about the people that frequent that sub than about the cards themselves.
Finally listening to podcast. "Nobody will care"... You guys don't know magic players who put so much into getting these pieces. I do agree, ban was for best of the commander.
I'm still waiting for Time Sieve to get banned lmao. Extra turns are one of the saltiest mechanics in EDH and I've seen more than one person be convinced Time Sieve could be played fairly... only for them to slowly kill the table over 30 minutes because they *somehow* keep managing to scrounge together 5 artifacts to keep it going in the age of the Treasure, and for people to not scoop because it's non-deterministic.
I forgit WHERE i heard this, but rumor has it sheldon was the reason those bans didn't happen earlier. And now, about a year after his passing it was time to start the bannings he held back.
The podcast starts with Richard excited to talk about out the spoilers. I then get excited about a rare occurrence of Richard positivity. Then he starts to grumble about the art. Ahhh we’re back lol.
I’m not sure if the show would do this, but I’d totally watch Ajani and Chandra go on adventures while dealing with the aftermath of the phyrexian invasion and Jaya’s death.
28:36 The cereal box cards, baseball cards. And other SLDs have looked perfect. I hope we get some comic book arts similar to poster arts or horror movie covers. Full on comic book text and art.
Card is totally taking over the meta! ... and by "taking over" I mean, occasionally showing up in, and by "meta", I mean specifically aristocrat decks that play black.
I hope they do more with the banlist and by more I specifically mean unbannings. These new bans are a massive change in how the RC assesses cards (i.e. fast mana is bad now even though it's been acceptable since the inception of the format). There are so many cards on the ban list that do not deserve to be there. Set them free!
I’ve not played 60 card magic since OG Theros block, and haven’t played commander on like 3-4 years but still keep up with this and the other podcast. Keep up the great content, thanks for all yall do!
Maybe its a message from the rules committee to Wizards that says 'Stop forcing these ultra power chase $100 mythics to sell packs and ruin Commander!'
Given the chase card status of lotus and crypt, I honestly think WotC’s defense against the ban will be to simply errata them to each cost 1 mana in future printings, to try to get RC to unban them. Since they don’t control the RC, but they do control oracle text
The Commander Rules Committee makes announcements lining up with the prerelease weekend of every Standard-legal set, so it was scheduled. It's the fact that they haven't made an announcement in a while, and none as big since at least 2019, that made it seem out of the blue.
Julie Bell, known for her amazing art in Marvel Masterpieces trading cards, did a Secret Lair back in June. There’s 100% certainty she’ll be doing chase cards along with Peach Momoko and other artists that have been doing Marvel trading cards. I would imagine the comic artists will have been contracted as well for the high end chase cards. So many great artists throughout the years.
10 minutes in the video I thought that richard had a stroke ... This looks 120% like my Marcel comics I would not even see mtg when I just saw the art I would think marvel cover ... I rly don't understand what Richard is talking about this is how marvel looks to me
Given Wolverine's wearing his classic outfit and Cap looks more comic-y than MCU-y you can at least be fairly secure in thinking they're not "MCU sets", they're "Marvel sets".
@@charcharmunr My point is that I cannot conceivably care less, but people who otherwise put out content I like, like MTGGoldfish, will still be obsessing about these trivialities for the next year.
1:01:12 I don’t know if the team realizes this when Crim says these non Urza planeswalkers don’t have much lore. Dude Chandra and Ajani have a fuck ton of lore. They literally wrote tons of books about them. I remember reading one of the 400 page books in school that entailed mostly Chandra, Gideon Jura, and Sorin Markov.
Crim's right about the comic/card art. There's so much variety of cover art and actual comic art (because most comic art does not look like the cover art). I'm a comic collector, i have no issue with the art, but also not surprised if another comic collector does. But you can't say this "looks too magic" because there is just too much variety to pigeon hole comic art.
I disagree that these bans were power level bans. They were clearly play pattern bans. I know there aren't hard rules for this, but this seems very similar to when they banned Hullbreacher. It's because people in lower power levels were using a card when it should have been exclusive to CEDH. I feel this way about Docside and the other fast mana. Players might assume adding better ramp wouldn't warp the game the way that it actually does. It causes so many non games.
Magic players: the RC is useless and doesn't do any bans or unbans they afraid to take action they just say rule 0 it out Also Magic player: OMFG the RC banned *random card* why would they do this what about everyone who own this card
The Hero type on these makes me realize we're gonna see Hero and Villain as typal subthemes and man now I want to see them do a "Loki, God of Stories" Hero card and a "King Loki, God of Lies" Villain card. Which is never gonna happen but it would be super good I promise.
Just some thoughts of an ex-cEDH player (stopped playing MTG due to product fatigue but still follow content) on the commander bans. Nadu- Great ban, nondeterministic lines are awful to sit through. I'm surprised that Krark was not banned for the same reason, but maybe it's less annoying in casual? Dockside- Disappointing since it removes a huge swath of decks from viability, but understandable since new players might not understand how powerful it is and blink strategies are very popular in casual. Mana Crypt- Confusing. The high price point should make this a non-factor in casual games and in cEDH this seriously reduces the power of high-cost commanders and turbo decks. Also, since other fast mana is still in the format, this will just make blowouts (in casual and competitive) more likely, since multiple players being able to keep up with a fast start is less likely. Jeweled Lotus- Awful. I'm not sure what the casual impact is, but in cEDH all this does is hurt mono/duo colored commanders and high-cmc commanders (goodbye Tevesh, Atraxa, RG Etali, etc.), seriously reducing the pool of viable commanders. Not sure if this is relevant, but there was some drama a few weeks ago about a group of goons trying to name themselves the cEDH RC. They went about it horribly and some of them were awful people, leading the whole thing to blow up. Some think the RC is banning stuff to encourage another group trying to split the ban list (I personally don't, but thought it was worth sharing). Anyway, I'd love to hear some casual players takes on all this. P.S.: I think these bans showcase that even the RC knows rule 0 conversations don't work with random pods of casual players.
So since these cards have a sld tag in tye bottom left that means these will be in a secret lair that comes out right after the set release like they did with the other crossover sets and these will be cards you can get in the main set but these versions art wise will be the secret lair they sell to tie into the set release.
Watching all of these other content creators mad at these bans, I'm glad to see that you guys have a more reasonable take. The lack of active ban management has led to the slow degeneration of the format in my opinion, specifically in mid-level casual where all of these cards except Nadu will often be found. This sucks for collectors but the rules committee should only focus on how cards affect the gameplay of the format. It's not their fault that WOTC printed a commander-only black lotus that will now go to zero.
While I generally agree with Crim's take on the hypothetical mtg show, an adaptation of Brother's War would undoubtedly go hard, and would imo be much more in line with something like Arcane or Edgerunners.
Marvel cards all look like classic Marvel to me. Dunno if I like them or not but they look like what I would expect them to look like. And the Magic mechanics and flavor are impeccable. I'd probably have given Wolverine a stronger mechanic than Regenerate(it's old and does not hold up nowadays) but the flavor is there. As for the bans. GOOD NEWS EVERYONE! To shreds I say. These were well deserved and a long time coming I only wish they had done this sooner and I hope they continue in this vein and take that active role in curating the format I've been hoping they would for so long.
The only problem I see with the BnR is that I never saw the cards at my LGS or in my play groups, which means the community did self regulate (which is something lots of people wanted the community to do). So it kinda only hurts cEDH where these were consistently played
I think the art on the leaked cards looks pretty good, especially Captain America. Mechanically I like them all. I'm the least familiar with Black Panther, have only seen him in the movies. Initially I didn't like it, but the more I thought about it the more sense it made. At the end of the movie BP started doing the outreach centers, so having the mtg card be able to use the vibranium to buff your other creatures and draw a card makes a lot of sense.
On the topic of whether marvel fans would buy the art. If the miku cards are anything to go off of, people will buy anything even if the art is jarring if it has the character they like on it. This art looks objectively nice in my opinion, regardless of the style.
These leaks eased my skepticism on the set. These look great and like actual magic cards. My worry was that they’d do something like what they did with transformers, which look horrible.
I feel like an MtG series would be best if it followed the Avatar: Last Airbender formula. Focus on a small team and their opposition, with episodic stories that gradually build to a larger story. Give us a group of characters travelling between planes, giving us one iconic location or monster of the week. Go to Innistrad, Ixalan, Kamigawa, Theeros, New Phyrexia, Dominaria etc. Start the show with elves, goblins, merfolk, dragons, hydras, angels etc before introducing slivers, phyrexians, eldrazi and other iconic MtG original creatures - roughly following the monster of the week formula. Ideally, I would even have the inevitable final battle come down to a duel between two planeswalkers on a barren land. Then use an iconic tournament final or similar to structure the fight. Obviously don't have them take turns or run out of spells, but animate creating landscapes to power their abilities, pulling creatures from other realms and specific spells rather than having generic energy beams.
As a casual MTG & Marvel fan, I was raised from the Infinity Saga MCU, so I'm not too keen with all the comics with the exceptions of listening to snippets from stuff like Comicstorian (RIP to the GOAT), but seeing these card arts I think there fine since there doing iconic poses that i can recognize like Cap or just emitting insane aura. With that said, I would love to see them do combined borderless like they did in LOTR since that would be cool similar to how they would sell parts of a figure in different packages to build the Villain for that set or something like that.
Any example of the Combined Borderless is like The Avengers fighting Thanos, or The X-Men fight a Horde of Sentinels, and The Fantastic Four fighting Dr.Doom or Galactus. That would be insane for me to collect.
If they’re expecting a lot of new people to join the Magic community, they should’ve probably focused on putting words on each card. It’s OK to have a few complex cards, but the set needs to be easily adapted for new and existing players.
The flavor was fun on these MCU cards. Should be fun. As far as the bans, it sucks if you are a collector and a I guess a wake up call to the risks of investing in cardboard. Just remember it is okay for people to be salty over this ban. There will be an increase in your proxies, which is and should be, okay in commander format if this is the path.
I think if you're going to ban cards of this price point that effectively have no home anywhere else in magic, then the RC should have been a little more gracious with warnings about the possibility of fast mana pieces being banned, especially the artifacts.
Worth noting, if these are real, they're changing a lot of syntax: •Wolverine's card just says "double the damage" instead of the long replacement effect on •The card refers to itself as "him" instead of "it." So far only Planeswalkers (and the creature-side of the flipwalkers) refer to the cards with gender. •And regenerate's reminder text is completely reworded, plus it says "heal" instead of "remove"
The damage one is new (to my knowledge), but your second 2 points are not. -Other Universe Beyond cards have used gender before (ex. Themberchaud) -This wording for regenerate is already being used (ex. Experiment One in Ravnica Remastered)
I have not watched the video yet but I am sure Richard does not approve any of these cards because they draw too much attention or die to removal.
😂😂😂🤣🤣🤣 big facts 😂
Wolverine doesn’t always die to removal.👀
@@ZeroCr0wwhat are you saying? …farewell
@@Chiavica Yes, Farewell, but not Ondu Inversion or Hour of Promise. Not always at least.🤣
@@ZeroCr0wTHEY SAID THE LINEEEE
Big political statement from WotC to say mutants aren't human.
They probably hemmed and hawed on it and decided that "Human Mutant" would crowd up the typeline.
Par for the course for Marvel. there's an old story they avoided a tax on their action figures with the same argument. "they aren't dolls of human figures, they're mutants."
How is it political? They literally aren't humans. They are a different species that can still breed with humans.
Isn't that just literally true in the Marvel multiverse though? Mutants are a distinct species from Homo Sapiens
@@RasmusVJScorrect they just want equal rights
so, no one going to mention that they changed the order of the Casting Cost colors for Captain America to put it Red White and Blue instead of Blue Red White like all other Jeskai cards
Glad someone else noticed this. Thought I was going insane. Lol
Like a real American. xD
I'd like you to look up a card called Lightning Angel
Never before have I appreciated how much Crim just likes things and refuses to be a hater. No hypothetical makes Crim salty. He just loves card games. :)
Its a nice change of pace from every other youtuber being doom and gloom about everything.
tbh it's the same problem but on the other side of the coin. toxic positivity is just as bad as the negative side.
@@thegreatestbloodnot for the person being positive
@@thegreatestblood I don't care for the implication here. Are you saying Crim's positivity is toxic? Because, if you're not, why make the comment?
@@Pinfeldorf implication? what implication? explain.
i am saying its toxic. oh was that the implication you thought i was saying?
LoTR set art did not match the Peter Jackson movies aesthetic and that set did just fine. I think Marvel will do well regardless of nitpicks on the art.
I think the difference is that Lord of the rings fans care less about the art because they're book fans. The arts could be bad and the set still going to sell like hotcakes because Marvel.
@@MakeVarahHappen While I have zero evidence for this, I would bet you that more people (both that bought Magic product and those that didn't) have watched the films and are more familiar with those than number of book readers. However I agree that Marvel will sell because Marvel.
@@ZSA004 I think a lot of people neglect the fact that lotr has existed and been popular for decades pre-Peter Jackson.
They did a secret lair with that art
@@MakeVarahHappen just because they existed doesn’t mean something brought it back into the modern day and to millions of people that hadn’t read the books. Both things can be true.
The context here is that the podcast was asking if this looks like how “casual comic fans” i.e. MCU fans and not necessarily comic book fans would see the art. I’m analogizing this to art that did not represent the more modern take of a franchise in a similar way, and the product was successful. That is all.
I like how these cross-promotional cards 20 years ago would have Captain America with his colors inverted throwing a shield in the shape of a star and his ability would be flying, because no one could be bothered to actually figure out how the other IP worked.
And Richard is complaining that they look like modern comic art covers with a Magic the Gathering art direction framing style when they have incredibly on-flavor card text.
Appreciate you guys actually giving your opinion on the bannings before waiting to hear the community response. Most podcasts actually wait to see which way the wind is blowing and just reflect what their audience wants to hear.
The announcement literally popped up in the middle of our recording lol, so you're getting our live reaction.
Odd how no one pointed out that Caps Mana Cost was intentionally 'optimized' instead of the proper 'WUBRG' order.
In contrast to Richard’s point about the art, I thought the Transformers cards had TERRIBLE art, I don’t want UB to be a copy and paste job, give us unique art that provides a magic feel while staying true to the IP.
Richard the contrarian strikes again.
I think the Transformers cards are the only UB cards I feel actively bad seeing on Magic cards because even if it's art meant to resemble stills from the cartoons, it just makes it 'feel' unprofessional for that reason.
@@charcharmunradd the LotR Secret Lair to that. Those were simples screen grabs and look terrible.
Shoutout to Seth for taking some serious heat on Twitter for essentially disagreeing with the community on the EDH bans. Looks like most voices are either mad that their expensive Commander investments evaporated in value overnight, or mad that the RC claims to want to ban fast mana but then still left Sol Ring or Ancient Tomb in (saying Sol being “iconic” isn’t an excuse).
And then there’s a whole other discourse arguing the validity of R0 and how this applies to bans
But seriously, a lot of people weren’t on Seth’s side on his tweets but he’s definitely taking it really well 😅
He had to get back on the community’s side after his anti-B Enchantment Removal take :p
But seriously, I like that Seth is always willing to say what he believes about the game regardless of whether others agree with it or not.
No idea what he tweeted realy but im not a fan either.. commander is a casual format and one of the only placed where u could play what u want to play. If a card is borderline destroying the format fine but i dont see this with the 4 cards banned today. Nothing that couldnt be discussed on the table
@@RBGolbatYeah absolutely. Like most things, obviously people are going to have different opinions and takes. That’s what makes community interactions fun - to hear/debate different points of views. But this topic is just SOOO divisive because there’s a lot of “feels bad” EDH and cEDH players that lost out on hundreds, if not thousands of dollars because of these bans.
So if you’re like Seth who thinks the RC did a good job with this, I guess I can see why some enthusiast players would take siding with the bans really personally/defensively
@@eisberg7681 I mean, that’s just the Rule Zero argument when it comes to this topic. But to Seth’s point on Twitter, outside of regular pods and familiar groups, Commander has outgrown the “let’s just talk it out” negotiations in 2024 when it comes to playing EDH with random people or players outside your group.
Also, Rule Zero doesn’t solve the problem of these cards losing all of their value overnight, which is another reason behind the anger over on Twitter that a lot of EDH and cEDH players are having with those who think these bans are a positive.
@@RBGolbat same. Even though i dont totally agree on his enchantment take it provides interesting perspective. in general I think surrounding yourself with people that only think the same things as you is dangerous
Actually very glad to have Crim on the podcast talking about Marvel stuff. I'm essentially at Seth's level of knowledge when it comes to Marvel so it's great hearing the perspective of an entrenched comic fan that's also a high level MTG player!
He was READY with those comics on his desk lol.
The discourse around the art style of the marvel cards seems kind of sad and predictable to me. When they make 3rd party magic cards that look nothing like magic people complain about it, and then when they make 3rd party magic cards look like magic cards people complain about it. What could magic do that wouldn't create this kind of discourse at this point?
If the arguments they made against these cards are the best they can do, then these will be massively popular and WotC has won in transforming MtG from a unique IP into a platform for selling other IPs.
Just ignore the complainers. They're the loudest, but that doesn't mean they're the majority. The art on these is totally fine.
@@eegleslmao “magic killed its IP to become cardboard funko pops. Isn’t that great?”
@@eegles yeah, that's totally what happened and why we no longer have story sets and lore articles coming out anymore since the first UB run, right?
Oh wait...
@@casteanpreswyn7528 He ran his hand over his face in disgust, then froze. What happened to his face? Were those whiskers? Was he covered in fur? Was that … a tail?
"I'm going to kill him!" Ral shouted, his eyes filling with lightning as he shook his paw at the sky.
I love Crim reaction, how happy he is :)
Stole it from a Secret Lair distributor and used his real name for the facebook selling? That story, wow..
Richard is so stuck in the past. He views everything through an old 90s filter. Once again yelling at clouds.
This whole argument over the comic vs Mtg art just reminds me of how the street fighter cards didn’t have any capcom artists involved. I wouldn’t have gotten them either way (I did get all the universe within versions) but it would’ve been so hype if someone like Bengus actually got to do some of the street fighter cards instead.
I laughed when Seth said the community would be happy with the bans.
I think the bans are alright. These rules are of course for pick up games and these banning will more likely help rather than harm most experiences.
I think there are philosophical arguments to do take other approaches, but I think the RC is accomplishing what it envisions for the format.
Ajani and Chandra make perfectly good sense
The first episode follows Chandra as she ignites her Spark.
Which Plane they choose to Walk her to, she finds Ajani, who serves as a mentor teaching her (and the viewers) about Planeswalkers, the Multiverse, etc.
Later down the line, they encounter one of Liliana's Demons she made a Pact with. They work together with Liliana to kill the Demon, but Liliana goes her own way
Over the course of the series, as they Planeswalk around, they meet the other classic members of Magic - Nissa, Gideon, etc.
Then you save Jace for the very end bc he's the Poster Boy and will probably have the most hype around him.
Alternately, have Chandra meet Jace while he's still an inexperienced nerd - or have him as an antagonist. He was a criminal on Ravnica and a member of the Infinite Consortium, after all.
I pulled a random Dockside out of a Lost Caverns of Ixalan pack a few months ago and immediately sold it for store credit. As someone who believes cards are meant to be played with not collected, I genuinely do not feel bad for anyone who invests in shiny cardboard.
I’m glad there’s still players out there like you
Agree but with a bit of a difference. Cardboard is meant to be played with and also collected, not invested in. I won't feel bad for something "losing value."
If there's a card I want in my binder I'll get it and part with the money.
@@stevendefeo8424 I don't buy cards in the hope that they hold value. I buy them because I want them for a deck.
The art on these is fantastic. It reminds me of the old Marvel Masterpieces trading cards.
I don't think it's right to say that this is a philosophy of banning based upon power level. While the banned cards are all undeniably powerful, the reasoning is not about power but play pattern, i.e. because mid-game cards have gotten so much more powerful, the 3 v. 1 dynamic for the fast start player is less effective, and that negatively impacts gameplay. It's an interesting philosophy that limits potential future bannings for cards that are strong or unpopular.
The EDH reddit is so salty about these cards being banned but i think that says more about the people that frequent that sub than about the cards themselves.
Finally listening to podcast.
"Nobody will care"...
You guys don't know magic players who put so much into getting these pieces.
I do agree, ban was for best of the commander.
I'm still waiting for Time Sieve to get banned lmao. Extra turns are one of the saltiest mechanics in EDH and I've seen more than one person be convinced Time Sieve could be played fairly... only for them to slowly kill the table over 30 minutes because they *somehow* keep managing to scrounge together 5 artifacts to keep it going in the age of the Treasure, and for people to not scoop because it's non-deterministic.
I want all infinites banned, but it will never happen
I forgit WHERE i heard this, but rumor has it sheldon was the reason those bans didn't happen earlier. And now, about a year after his passing it was time to start the bannings he held back.
The podcast starts with Richard excited to talk about out the spoilers. I then get excited about a rare occurrence of Richard positivity. Then he starts to grumble about the art. Ahhh we’re back lol.
I’m not sure if the show would do this, but I’d totally watch Ajani and Chandra go on adventures while dealing with the aftermath of the phyrexian invasion and Jaya’s death.
The brothers war would be the most thrilling story line to do. It does everything that most anime does including ridiculously over powered characters.
@@atk9989 please, no more Urza. Ever.
@@atk9989 I don’t know that I’d care about the older characters so much though. I’d rather follow the modern characters.
I like how this is already old news thanks to the new Commander Ban announcement. Wonder if they will put out a commander podcast episode in time
They talk about it idk why they didn't put it in the title lmao that's way bigger news
28:36 The cereal box cards, baseball cards. And other SLDs have looked perfect. I hope we get some comic book arts similar to poster arts or horror movie covers. Full on comic book text and art.
The art looks very much Marvel cover art. That said, if you only think of the x-men shows, then yah, looks off, but it looks good
Petition for Dockside Chef to get the hammer
Card is totally taking over the meta! ... and by "taking over" I mean, occasionally showing up in, and by "meta", I mean specifically aristocrat decks that play black.
I hope they do more with the banlist and by more I specifically mean unbannings. These new bans are a massive change in how the RC assesses cards (i.e. fast mana is bad now even though it's been acceptable since the inception of the format). There are so many cards on the ban list that do not deserve to be there. Set them free!
Hooray for the editor for posting the time stamp to avoid spoilers!
I saw this on my marketplace listing. what shocked me was holding them together with rubberbands lol
The Cap art used throwing the shield is almost the exact same pose he has in the MCU intro.
I’ve not played 60 card magic since OG Theros block, and haven’t played commander on like 3-4 years but still keep up with this and the other podcast.
Keep up the great content, thanks for all yall do!
Seth: "I would expect and overwhelminly positive reaction to the announcement"
That comment aged like milk 😂
Maybe its a message from the rules committee to Wizards that says 'Stop forcing these ultra power chase $100 mythics to sell packs and ruin Commander!'
s/o the commander RC i agree with seth, really didn't think they had it in them
Given the chase card status of lotus and crypt, I honestly think WotC’s defense against the ban will be to simply errata them to each cost 1 mana in future printings, to try to get RC to unban them. Since they don’t control the RC, but they do control oracle text
The Commander Rules Committee makes announcements lining up with the prerelease weekend of every Standard-legal set, so it was scheduled.
It's the fact that they haven't made an announcement in a while, and none as big since at least 2019, that made it seem out of the blue.
Julie Bell, known for her amazing art in Marvel Masterpieces trading cards, did a Secret Lair back in June. There’s 100% certainty she’ll be doing chase cards along with Peach Momoko and other artists that have been doing Marvel trading cards. I would imagine the comic artists will have been contracted as well for the high end chase cards. So many great artists throughout the years.
I'll treasure Seth knowing nothing about Marvel until he inevitably has to learn the characters and more
Borderless is now "normal base version"
Oh boy these takes on the bannings, and community reaction, with hindsight lol...
10 minutes in the video I thought that richard had a stroke ... This looks 120% like my Marcel comics I would not even see mtg when I just saw the art I would think marvel cover ... I rly don't understand what Richard is talking about this is how marvel looks to me
I think any criticism of the art from these grainy images is unjust. Comic art is extremely varied. Especially when you consider cover art.
This podcast is why I'm dreading MCU sets. Endless tedious debates about what's Marvel-esque and what's Magic-esque.
Given Wolverine's wearing his classic outfit and Cap looks more comic-y than MCU-y you can at least be fairly secure in thinking they're not "MCU sets", they're "Marvel sets".
@@charcharmunr My point is that I cannot conceivably care less, but people who otherwise put out content I like, like MTGGoldfish, will still be obsessing about these trivialities for the next year.
36:01 “overwhelmingly positive” 😂😂😂😂
😂😂
If y’all are struggling to find topics in the future and no leaks or bans happen, we would always love more fishmailbag episodes!!
The marvel art on these looks like the old marvel masterpieces trading cards from the 90s
I'd like to see the War of the Spark as the TV show story focus.
I was hoping the Secret Lair was the original comic book covers of their first solo issue.
Crim is wildly overestimating Hollywood's ability to write a good story
Idk, plot-focused animated series have generally been pretty strong lately, even if they've generally been targeted at young audiences.
That Wolverine card is giving heavy Alex Ross art vibes.
1:01:12 I don’t know if the team realizes this when Crim says these non Urza planeswalkers don’t have much lore. Dude Chandra and Ajani have a fuck ton of lore. They literally wrote tons of books about them. I remember reading one of the 400 page books in school that entailed mostly Chandra, Gideon Jura, and Sorin Markov.
Black Panther + Jacked Rabbit will be nuts!
Edit - Also Llanowar Reborn is an easy way to always pass a +1/+1 counter to every creature you have enter
Crim's right about the comic/card art. There's so much variety of cover art and actual comic art (because most comic art does not look like the cover art). I'm a comic collector, i have no issue with the art, but also not surprised if another comic collector does. But you can't say this "looks too magic" because there is just too much variety to pigeon hole comic art.
I look forward to this program every week.
The show should cover war of the spark or war of the machine. Highlighting the planeswalk ability and then deny that would be a compelling story
The Captain America is directly from the marvel intro
I disagree that these bans were power level bans. They were clearly play pattern bans. I know there aren't hard rules for this, but this seems very similar to when they banned Hullbreacher. It's because people in lower power levels were using a card when it should have been exclusive to CEDH. I feel this way about Docside and the other fast mana. Players might assume adding better ramp wouldn't warp the game the way that it actually does. It causes so many non games.
Magic players: the RC is useless and doesn't do any bans or unbans they afraid to take action they just say rule 0 it out
Also Magic player: OMFG the RC banned *random card* why would they do this what about everyone who own this card
The Hero type on these makes me realize we're gonna see Hero and Villain as typal subthemes and man now I want to see them do a "Loki, God of Stories" Hero card and a "King Loki, God of Lies" Villain card. Which is never gonna happen but it would be super good I promise.
Just some thoughts of an ex-cEDH player (stopped playing MTG due to product fatigue but still follow content) on the commander bans.
Nadu- Great ban, nondeterministic lines are awful to sit through. I'm surprised that Krark was not banned for the same reason, but maybe it's less annoying in casual?
Dockside- Disappointing since it removes a huge swath of decks from viability, but understandable since new players might not understand how powerful it is and blink strategies are very popular in casual.
Mana Crypt- Confusing. The high price point should make this a non-factor in casual games and in cEDH this seriously reduces the power of high-cost commanders and turbo decks. Also, since other fast mana is still in the format, this will just make blowouts (in casual and competitive) more likely, since multiple players being able to keep up with a fast start is less likely.
Jeweled Lotus- Awful. I'm not sure what the casual impact is, but in cEDH all this does is hurt mono/duo colored commanders and high-cmc commanders (goodbye Tevesh, Atraxa, RG Etali, etc.), seriously reducing the pool of viable commanders.
Not sure if this is relevant, but there was some drama a few weeks ago about a group of goons trying to name themselves the cEDH RC. They went about it horribly and some of them were awful people, leading the whole thing to blow up. Some think the RC is banning stuff to encourage another group trying to split the ban list (I personally don't, but thought it was worth sharing).
Anyway, I'd love to hear some casual players takes on all this.
P.S.: I think these bans showcase that even the RC knows rule 0 conversations don't work with random pods of casual players.
11:34 Wolverine almost looks like the faithful looting meme art
Whenever I play Grenzo in arena, most of my matches are against Nadu. Basically boils down to whether or not they included time warp in their deck.
For some reason I thought y'all didn't cover leaks. It really is like Christmas!
They don't they made an exception
So since these cards have a sld tag in tye bottom left that means these will be in a secret lair that comes out right after the set release like they did with the other crossover sets and these will be cards you can get in the main set but these versions art wise will be the secret lair they sell to tie into the set release.
The fact that Crim didn't even rotate the image posted on reddit loool
Watching all of these other content creators mad at these bans, I'm glad to see that you guys have a more reasonable take. The lack of active ban management has led to the slow degeneration of the format in my opinion, specifically in mid-level casual where all of these cards except Nadu will often be found. This sucks for collectors but the rules committee should only focus on how cards affect the gameplay of the format. It's not their fault that WOTC printed a commander-only black lotus that will now go to zero.
While I generally agree with Crim's take on the hypothetical mtg show, an adaptation of Brother's War would undoubtedly go hard, and would imo be much more in line with something like Arcane or Edgerunners.
As a Marvel fan
I really want the show. Watching magic with my son would be the greatest thing
Captain America throwing Excalibur lol
Marvel cards all look like classic Marvel to me. Dunno if I like them or not but they look like what I would expect them to look like. And the Magic mechanics and flavor are impeccable. I'd probably have given Wolverine a stronger mechanic than Regenerate(it's old and does not hold up nowadays) but the flavor is there.
As for the bans. GOOD NEWS EVERYONE! To shreds I say. These were well deserved and a long time coming I only wish they had done this sooner and I hope they continue in this vein and take that active role in curating the format I've been hoping they would for so long.
The only problem I see with the BnR is that I never saw the cards at my LGS or in my play groups, which means the community did self regulate (which is something lots of people wanted the community to do). So it kinda only hurts cEDH where these were consistently played
Black Panther is going to make creature lands really nasty. Especially in Commander where land destruction is an enormous taboo.
25:42 - Mega Regenerate: When this card leaves the battlefield, return it to the battlefield tapped.
I would think itd be like megamorph where when it regenerates it gains a counter
One of my greatest pet peeves with commander is the fact that in a casual format you a banned list and then an additional shadowbanned list….
calling it now! comic panel break frame of 5 founding members of Avenger with insane hard to pull ratio
I think the art on the leaked cards looks pretty good, especially Captain America. Mechanically I like them all. I'm the least familiar with Black Panther, have only seen him in the movies. Initially I didn't like it, but the more I thought about it the more sense it made. At the end of the movie BP started doing the outreach centers, so having the mtg card be able to use the vibranium to buff your other creatures and draw a card makes a lot of sense.
On the topic of whether marvel fans would buy the art. If the miku cards are anything to go off of, people will buy anything even if the art is jarring if it has the character they like on it. This art looks objectively nice in my opinion, regardless of the style.
These leaks eased my skepticism on the set. These look great and like actual magic cards. My worry was that they’d do something like what they did with transformers, which look horrible.
I feel like an MtG series would be best if it followed the Avatar: Last Airbender formula. Focus on a small team and their opposition, with episodic stories that gradually build to a larger story.
Give us a group of characters travelling between planes, giving us one iconic location or monster of the week. Go to Innistrad, Ixalan, Kamigawa, Theeros, New Phyrexia, Dominaria etc. Start the show with elves, goblins, merfolk, dragons, hydras, angels etc before introducing slivers, phyrexians, eldrazi and other iconic MtG original creatures - roughly following the monster of the week formula.
Ideally, I would even have the inevitable final battle come down to a duel between two planeswalkers on a barren land. Then use an iconic tournament final or similar to structure the fight. Obviously don't have them take turns or run out of spells, but animate creating landscapes to power their abilities, pulling creatures from other realms and specific spells rather than having generic energy beams.
Richard is the reason we get 10X more sequels and remakes than we do original stories
Ultimate flavor win: give Cap Sunforger, but reskin Sunforger as Mjolnir
I like the more gritty dark art in the older X-Men comics. I feel this looks more like a cartoon instead to me.
I think Richard thinks the art should have big "BAM!"s and 'POW!"s and inner monologue thought bubbles. These look like the comics 100%.
As a casual MTG & Marvel fan, I was raised from the Infinity Saga MCU, so I'm not too keen with all the comics with the exceptions of listening to snippets from stuff like Comicstorian (RIP to the GOAT), but seeing these card arts I think there fine since there doing iconic poses that i can recognize like Cap or just emitting insane aura. With that said, I would love to see them do combined borderless like they did in LOTR since that would be cool similar to how they would sell parts of a figure in different packages to build the Villain for that set or something like that.
Also Richard continuing to be a D1 hater on MTG is always fun to watch lol
Any example of the Combined Borderless is like The Avengers fighting Thanos, or The X-Men fight a Horde of Sentinels, and The Fantastic Four fighting Dr.Doom or Galactus. That would be insane for me to collect.
Was waiting for for this to dropped
Crazy how leaked cards, a situation where the podcast typically avoids those, still overshadows the greatest banning in mtg history
If they’re expecting a lot of new people to join the Magic community, they should’ve probably focused on putting words on each card. It’s OK to have a few complex cards, but the set needs to be easily adapted for new and existing players.
The flavor was fun on these MCU cards. Should be fun. As far as the bans, it sucks if you are a collector and a I guess a wake up call to the risks of investing in cardboard. Just remember it is okay for people to be salty over this ban. There will be an increase in your proxies, which is and should be, okay in commander format if this is the path.
I think if you're going to ban cards of this price point that effectively have no home anywhere else in magic, then the RC should have been a little more gracious with warnings about the possibility of fast mana pieces being banned, especially the artifacts.
They literally look like the Fleer Ultra trading cards from the 90's
I think if the Marvel set had a more comic book feel.. like storyboarding and the colour pallets of a comic book
Worth noting, if these are real, they're changing a lot of syntax:
•Wolverine's card just says "double the damage" instead of the long replacement effect on
•The card refers to itself as "him" instead of "it." So far only Planeswalkers (and the creature-side of the flipwalkers) refer to the cards with gender.
•And regenerate's reminder text is completely reworded, plus it says "heal" instead of "remove"
The damage one is new (to my knowledge), but your second 2 points are not.
-Other Universe Beyond cards have used gender before (ex. Themberchaud)
-This wording for regenerate is already being used (ex. Experiment One in Ravnica Remastered)
Noticed this as well
Richard was THERE Seth! He was there was the Westfold fel----er.... when FIRE Design wreaked havoc on Standard/Modern
I hope you didn't expect Seth to get that reference.