Thanks for this. Personally, I stopped racing because I was sick of the crashes. Too many broken bones over the years caused by people over their threshold making mistakes - although this can happen in group rides I don’t sense riders take as many silly risks while fatigued.
Chris. Before you do a segment on alloy bikes try one with 30mm tire set up. Alloy was harsh in the day but that’s because we were riding around on 23mm pumped up to 120psi. I believe alloy should make a comeback, very underrated.
I have a Allez Sprint and an SW Tarmac S7. The only major performance difference is the lower weight of the SL7. Fully specked with pedals etc; Allez 8.2, SL7 7.3kg. Comfort is maybe marginally better on the Tarmac
Love that these two are trashing the Argon 18 B-roll for not being pro enough and somehow missing that it's being ridden by retired Monument winner Dan Martin 🤣
Im just surprised that other people are surprised... Is this the first Nero Show you've watched - this is exactly the content we expect, and the reason why we come back week after week. It may be not the most factual, but sure is entertaining
Nice one on the sponsor. I got mine for a year now and really like them. It's also cool to see such a specialized company just making a really solid product, and they end up becoming the go-to piece of kit.
The Orbea Orca Aero's storage compartment is not UCI legal, however you can remove it, so not sure what the fuss is about. Pretty sure Arnaud de Lie won a couple of pro races on exactly that bike this year.
Regarding the El Tour de Tucson, I was one of the 10,000 racers there… to provide some insight for the Elite and Platinum Men and Women groups started their race 5 mins prior to the larger group. This allowed for the lead group of more experienced racers have their race day.
I'd personally rather have a really good aluminum frame over a cheap carbon one. They approach every bike from a racing perspective. Very, very few riders race. And the 10 watts they mentioned is pretty much meaningless.
4 or 5 years back Chris spent some time in California on a green and white Cannondale think he liked it then. I had a CAAD 5 way back when thought it was to harsh for 5 hr rides. But we rode 23 mm tires north of a 100psi
Just to clarify: while Quarqs are an "estimated right/left balance" power meter, they are in fact "dual sided" in that the power meter is accurately measuring pedal strokes on both sides. IMO, L/R balance is completely irrelevant for most people.
I rode the El Tour de Tucson and could tell you all about that day. The front group is for Elite and Platinum (Cat 1/Cat 2/Pro or riders that competed in previous years that finish under 5 hours) riders and they get a 5 minute headstart with police escort before the general riders are able to join. The front group is furiously fast at about 27 mph avg over 102 miles and this year had several bad crashes. Its an an incredible event and you should both come in 2025
Correction to your video. Decathlon sells the Triban 520 here in Australia. $1100 aud which is pretty cheap for a 105 groupset bike (minus the brakes = TRP HY/RD)
Good little interview with Max Mann. It’s good to have a race in your sights to have something to work towards and gauge how your riding is progressing!
The new Madone Gen 8 is shockingly overlooked. I think here in the US, it's in a shop with cruiser bikes and lower tier stuff, and it doesn't get the hype. It's a solid, light, very comfortable, race frame with gobs of clearance. The inside of the frame looked clean, threads were chased, disc mounts square, all of the good stuff accounted for, as it should be at that price range.
Molly Bendum had me dying 😆 "mall ib denim" would be fairly close. Or just call it by the steel alloy name of chromoly (crow molly or chrome olly are both good enough)
How can they be so confident that the Argon18 (or any others they have not tried) is not a worthy contender to be a decent race bike when they have never ridden one. Low credibility I say
I generally enjoy these two, but they are so oblivious to the bubble they live in. They don't recognize that bikes are enjoyed and used by literally millions of people that have zero interest in racing. Trashing non-racing bikes or the people highlighting them is super cringe.
I have the Triban 520 as a winter bike and on the trainer. For that price, it is a great bike. Weight is not all. And not everybody in this world can or want afford a x-thousand dollar bike. It always depends, what the rider is doing with it. On hills I overtook guys with their Pinarellos.
It's disappointing to hear you trashing the Cannondale aluminium frame. Cycling has already become unfordable for many people and for somebody who might do a couple of big rides each summer, this is a great option. You risk shamming people who don't ride the latest carbon creations.
You have to take them with a pinch of salt. I love the show, but the economic bubble these two live in is not the same as most of the world. Chris wouldn't even touch Ultegra 🤣
I have a triban 520 actually! I have the rim brake version from 2017 and use it for commuting and some winter training in the uk. It's been a great little bike.
Never seen an Argon 18 bike myself so my thoughts are whatever, but I do think their "3D System" head set is pretty neat. Solves a safety and aesthetic problem so seems a win.
So saying all aluminum is the same would be like me saying every carbon bike is the same. Carbon is carbon right…??? I’d take a high end alloy bike over a low end carbon frame every day of the week
I'm using a triban rc520 as a full on winterbike! Upgraded the wheels and put some 32mm gp5k tyres on, feels like riding on a cloud. Very very comfortable, relatively cheap for the quality components (except original wheels) and mud guard mounts which make it the best.
I actually enjoyed your "sponsored" element. Thinking in the background the sponsor saying "you must mention the material used!". Always good to watch Chris squirm with a script 😂
I respectfully disagree with the criticism of aluminum (alloy) bikes. They are a cost-effective entry-level choice that helps introduce new riders to cycling. Many aluminum models are available for around $1,500 and still feature rim brakes, making them accessible to newer riders. Not everyone wants to go through the process of sourcing a Chinese mold frame, assembling components, or dealing with complex hydraulic brakes and tubeless tire setups. While aluminum has lost its appeal for people who have moved on to carbon, (I wont be going back love my Pinarello's) I believe they are a good choice for new riders and commuters, again not this audience.
😂 The part where Chris rips about the Quad Lock on the Argon bike had me absolutely rolling! That's some hard-hitting investigative journalistic criticism right there-exposing the real issues!
Chris and Jesse & Colnago. It’s my opinion that you really need to ride both a C68 and a V4RS. Colnago negative appears every week but neither of you has ridden either frame. From the point of the C68: it’s beautifully made and the paint is immaculate, the ride is firm with some compliance but the bike has a power “push” through the rear triangle, weight isn’t amazing but I built mine to 6.5kg exactly with peddles, cage and computer mount. Does it go up hill - well I did a 1:43 up The Gap a few weeks ago (it’s on Strava) and have placed in a couple of B grade Sydney crits. I’d also add and ask you to look at “cycling efficiency” as a measure rather than this obsession with aero drag. CE is applicable 100% of the time and if a frame is 5% more efficient it’s going to be a huge watts saving. You bag the V4RS but perhaps it’s a lot more CE than an SL8 and therefore could be the best in the pro peleton - has anyone actually tried to measure this???
Chris early in the episode: Argon 18 is shit. Who would bother riding this?! 1:17:06 Projects Echelon rider wins solo vs 10,000 riders. That’s crazy! Must be that dog of a bike Argon 18 he was on….
I still have an rc520, which people use when they come to my house to go out together. Tbh it's pretty great, and well specced. The main problem with it is the wheels, which are dogs***
What turns me off racing is the goddam sandbaggers! I raced twice at C grade ok and both came second. Both first place were A2 riders! Mind you I am the right W/kg, Age and weight deservingly to be in that category. How would you fix this problem? Would more people race?
Ouch that hurts, I have entered an event with Jay Vine, actually should be pretty good fun. a Canberra Cycling Club event with a race up Black mountain and a crit up the top. Should be a awesome event. I'm tempted to wear my old green dog paw nero kit haha, ok here is the deal you guys sign up and ill wear it :)
This is simple. Picking the pepper out of the fly sh_t. All top brand high end race bikes are almost the same. Why? Because the engineers who design them with the same computer computational analysis all perform competitive analysis. They buy their competition and have rooms where they tear them down and cut them up for lessons learned. They chart the metrics of each bike and evaluate how those metrics are met and rank them in terms of importance specific to individual brand. Pro riders are given bikes to race. The rest is left to amateurs to decide what to ride. Since top level race bikes are similar, other than for personal preference, it doesn't matter. Pogacar would have won the Tour de France on 'any' top brand race bike. Be sure to pick the color you prefer. You will get used to the rest because humans are highly adaptive creatures. Obliquely, I had this conversation with Sheldon Brown decades ago before his untimely death.
@chrismiller when is the last time you rode an alloy bike? You speak like you know but, your speaking from history over 10 years ago. And, it amazes how worked up your getting over someone else's selection of bikes that doesn't fit your spec. So, once you get bikes to review like they are getting you give us a list that is based on your actual ride an review. You both make me laugh
Seattle To Portland (STP) is a 200mi/320km fondo, it used to have 10000 participants but they've capped numbers in more recent years and it is now 5000-6000 in size. It's well supported with small and large food stops along the way, enterprising businesses also setup shops along the route which is great. Most people do it in 2 days, but a smaller group complete it in a single ride. I did it in 2023 in a single ride, hoped to do it in 2024 but was flying home to Australia the following day so thought that might be a bit rough ;)
Aus cycling race license is getting close to $400/year + need to pay race fee $10-20 per race, prohibitively expensive, hard to race after work during the week and risk of damage/crashes is moderate to high. I love racing as a c grader having said all that
53:00 my response to "why do alot of people go club rides but dont race:" Alot of people that dont race do challenge themselves, but in a way of improving themself FOR themself instead of improving themself to beat or compete against others. with Racing there are alot of external requirements like getting race certified, being willing to lose and replace thousands worth of equipment and frankly alot of faff, complications or messy paperwork / costs affiliated with it when alot of people who want to challenge themselves know they can do it for free by just recording their stats and becoming a more confident, fitter rider.
Colnago might be made in Italy, but the company is mainly owned by the UAE investment fund since 2020. So this idea of buying an Italian bike has it's limits and If I can support someone else instead of a state investment fund of a country with that kind of human rights record I'll do it. Yes, sportswashing is the reason why decent money is in Pro Cycling atm, but going out of your way to buy a bike from a company directly owned by such an organization is a hard pass for me...
You are not quite correct, it is owned by a privately held investment company - Chimera Investment - it is not a state owned fund as you have suggested.
Haha I think you guys are way off with the alloy take.. I don't know about the Australian crit/road race scene but here in Murica they are still a thing. Specialized allez's huge here and with some hi-end kit added you can have a sub 16/17 lbs bike that kicks ass. Funny with the c-dale caad13 is not as big a hit as the caad10 and 12 was. The Allez killed the alloy competition 🤷
Thanks for a fun and reliant show! They are the best. Glad to hear I was ahead of my time. Never ate solid always various of mixtures of Vitargo, and gels carboloading for longer events, +4h. But did not experimented higher than 60g h in the bottles could have used more but it was not known then and these packed gels was so expensive. Have ridden Vätternrundan one of the biggest rondos in the world. only on Vitargo and a two gels from Enervit 2012, 315km in 7h and 55min 5-6*750ml bottles changed in 2stops.
@ shortage of money and a steel belly I guess. Sparked the innovation. I became a cyclist in 1991 on a MTB and I think you heard about Power bars that NASA was a part of in the beginning. Maybe you got a story to the show there also. MTB people was the Gravel bikers for the cycling community back then. Swedish cycling federation wanted the Motorsport and cross association to take on MTB. Thankfully I ended up as a roadie 1998 on a Bianchi Chorus. 😉thanks Chris welcome to Sweden 🇸🇪 would be fun chatting and cycling some.
I think all the sl8 shit is rubbish. I'm riding the sl8 and came from a SEKA exceed rdc. Yeah the sl8 can climb and descend. Even with the roval cockpit and fine tuning my fit and position. From my riding perspective I don't think the sl8 lives up to its hype😅 I've only been cycling for a staggered 7months of the last year. But spending alot of time on the bike from June 24-nov 24. Started racing first month back on the bike. Actually started in the d grade. And got my 1st win on my first race. And over 3 months landed in the B grade and riding break aways and winning but not on the sl8 but the seka. My last race on the sl8 landed 3rd got caught solo breakaway. And really trying to hammer the bike. 90 pro wins over the amount of teams is definitely a marketing scheme aswell. Yet to find my grove on the sl8. Just don't think it's got that all out breakaway solo TT style of ride to it. I hated sitting in the bunch because half the people in the bunch are sitting there to save energy. And I found that out the hard way being beaten in a sprint off a breakaway from a guy that never contributed to the break and sat in the back saving energy. Now I just breakaway to solo to draw out who really wants to go and do some battling. Did a bunch ride in Townsville north Queensland in Sept this year. The biggest group ride I'd ever been on at this point. My ftp was only 270 when I has visited. The bunch did between 52-60km for the last 30kms and here's the 270ftp kid having shots on the front at 55-60km on a SEKA exceed 😅 When I explained to them I'm a runner and only been on the bike since June after having hip surgery on the 10th of June. They were a bit stumped I went home 3days after and got a bump in fitness from riding with those boys. And set a new ftp of 290 on a 40minute threshold interval. Tarmac sl8 is just a run off the mill bike. It's good like pretty good but not blistering nor mind blowing. Wich from all the jargon it was
Guys, the colnago TT Bike has a functional integrated water bottle, that conforms well with its integrated bottle cage/cradle, and yes, it is UCI legal.
12:22 I can't agree to that. What is the real point of paying $100s for a cycling computer when you can get a secondhand cellphone with more capability that you could slap out front?
Kudos to Max for getting out and racing. It's so much fun and you can really push yourself beyond the group ride. I must say that people like Max really annoy me in races. I like to attack and not have to sprint, but I often get chased by people like Max doing turns on the front, who then gets beaten in the sprint!
Many top pros at UnBound were using road pedals & shoes, I use the Favero road pedals & they have been flawless. I would get the MB’s for mnt biking for sure!👍
SL8 is the best road bike period. Specs, performance, objective testing. The mix of weight, stiffness, compliance, etc it’s just not a competition. Doesn’t mean everyone will prefer one but what they did was just unrivaled this year (hold for the new Addict).
3 дні тому
I listen this show and have ridden the Triban 520. Greetings from Brussels
That was a big slap on the Maxi’s face when he realised racers won’t necessarily take turns! 😂 It’s all about saving your energy for the right moment. Pogacar never takes turns, nor does Vingegaard. Does that make them bad cyclists!?
I prefer the mechanism on the eggbeaters. They feel as though they clamp on both directions vs only one side. They stomp in at all directions. Of course they are not power meter pedals but eggbeater 11s weigh 89 grams per pedal.
They aren’t saying things that are inaccurate by any measure but their delivery sounds so tone deaf to what cycling should be. The bit about the Merida, the Scultura with 105 di2 is 3.5k aud, which is probably the cheapest 105 di2 bikes you can get. I know the content is based around high spec, performance bikes, but they’re not welcoming at all towards anything even slightly cheaper. There’s a lot of other categories that have very high end price tags but they still cover and appreciate mass market affordable items. I’ve been road biking for 7 years at this point, worked in a bike shop for 2 years. I’ve seen time and time again that the industry is very skewed to those who can throw unlimited money at it. Probably why the sport has dropped so much in popularity, the most positive thing about the industry is that there’s more affordable options now.
Btw, the rude quality of a caad13 is actually very good. I have had caad 4,5 etc etc and the new caad is good. I also have a S6E Hi Mod and have had many other hi end carbon bikes
Chris I think you are forgetting about the amount of carbon fiber expertise colnago has. Look at old c40s smashing cobbles. I’d argue that at this point colnago has as much carbon heritage as they do steel. C68 represents that. Also. I’m an old school kinda guy. I want the heritage of a colnago, but I still wanna ride carbon. Never understood why colnago doesn’t have uae ride their made in Italy bikes. No one could touch that marketing
Already a subscriber! As for the southern hemisphere summer, we’re sick of hearing about winter kit, winter tyres, winter bikes, cycling in the rain and cold, and bloody indoor cycling, so suck it up northern hemisphere!
I'll only subscribe if Jessie does a gravel event
I'll unsubscribe now and then subscribe again...only if Jessie does a gravel event
X2 😂
Second that, but he must do it on Christmas day as well
Everyone who Jessie beats in the gravel event must subscribe :)
Agree. But Chris also has to buy an SL8 to get me sorry.
Thanks for having me on the show gents! Stay tuned for more racing 😏
Nice one max! Thanks for your time. You missed a good one on Tuesday, hopefully next week
Thanks for this. Personally, I stopped racing because I was sick of the crashes. Too many broken bones over the years caused by people over their threshold making mistakes - although this can happen in group rides I don’t sense riders take as many silly risks while fatigued.
Chris. Before you do a segment on alloy bikes try one with 30mm tire set up. Alloy was harsh in the day but that’s because we were riding around on 23mm pumped up to 120psi. I believe alloy should make a comeback, very underrated.
especially in the gravel segment
The caad 13 in question is super smooth but they’ve obviously no experience with it.
I have a Allez Sprint and an SW Tarmac S7. The only major performance difference is the lower weight of the SL7. Fully specked with pedals etc; Allez 8.2, SL7 7.3kg. Comfort is maybe marginally better on the Tarmac
Love that these two are trashing the Argon 18 B-roll for not being pro enough and somehow missing that it's being ridden by retired Monument winner Dan Martin 🤣
😂
The best part of every show is reading people cracking the sads in the comments when you've rubbished their bike.
I know the whole programme is 2 guys spending an hour slagging ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING off, but this is another level.
Im just surprised that other people are surprised... Is this the first Nero Show you've watched - this is exactly the content we expect, and the reason why we come back week after week. It may be not the most factual, but sure is entertaining
Nice one on the sponsor. I got mine for a year now and really like them. It's also cool to see such a specialized company just making a really solid product, and they end up becoming the go-to piece of kit.
Argon 18 sum pro rips man, US conti team project échelon loves them! They look generic but its a pretty original bike to own
I got one, very light, aero
Argon 18 is cool, I don't hate it. These boys are on their periods today.
Back in the day the Argon 18 track was THE pursuit bike. Brigham, MTM,…. were in the know.
Chris and Jessie accidentally stumbling on the etymology of 'chain gain' and not realising it is fantastic
My experience from the 80s and 90s in Texas called it a pace line.
The Orbea Orca Aero's storage compartment is not UCI legal, however you can remove it, so not sure what the fuss is about. Pretty sure Arnaud de Lie won a couple of pro races on exactly that bike this year.
Regarding the El Tour de Tucson, I was one of the 10,000 racers there… to provide some insight for the Elite and Platinum Men and Women groups started their race 5 mins prior to the larger group. This allowed for the lead group of more experienced racers have their race day.
The CAAD 12 and 13 are amazing riding frames. Liked them more than a couple brand name carbon frames I've had. The 12 was particularly good.
I'd personally rather have a really good aluminum frame over a cheap carbon one. They approach every bike from a racing perspective. Very, very few riders race. And the 10 watts they mentioned is pretty much meaningless.
My CAAD10 was amazing. Still got the frame for a one day revival project
@@CycleXplorer I had a CAAD10 too. I thought it was a bit uncomfortable but had amazing feeling of power transfer on steep climbs.
4 or 5 years back Chris spent some time in California on a green and white Cannondale think he liked it then.
I had a CAAD 5 way back when thought it was to harsh for 5 hr rides. But we rode 23 mm tires north of a 100psi
Top bikes list for 2025 seem to be closely aligned to the brands that do most online marketing and advertising in the U.K. 😂
thats Cycling "weakly" for you... "weakly" being the content they provide.
Just to clarify: while Quarqs are an "estimated right/left balance" power meter, they are in fact "dual sided" in that the power meter is accurately measuring pedal strokes on both sides. IMO, L/R balance is completely irrelevant for most people.
I rode the El Tour de Tucson and could tell you all about that day. The front group is for Elite and Platinum (Cat 1/Cat 2/Pro or riders that competed in previous years that finish under 5 hours) riders and they get a 5 minute headstart with police escort before the general riders are able to join. The front group is furiously fast at about 27 mph avg over 102 miles and this year had several bad crashes. Its an an incredible event and you should both come in 2025
dang !
Correction to your video. Decathlon sells the Triban 520 here in Australia. $1100 aud which is pretty cheap for a 105 groupset bike (minus the brakes = TRP HY/RD)
And yes, wouldn't ride it either. My cheapest bike, my CAAD10 would be much nicer to ride
I loves the giggles when old mate said he was shocked how much people sit in.😂
Good little interview with Max Mann. It’s good to have a race in your sights to have something to work towards and gauge how your riding is progressing!
I was sure there is going to be something about the new 5.9kg disc brake Scott Addict in this episode, but I guess there's always next week
The episodes are usually filmed earlier in the week so the addict probably came out after this was recorded
Same here, was really looking forward for it :-)
Jesse's going to have to include the new 5.9kg Scott Addict 👀
A race is a race, not a workout Max
The new Madone Gen 8 is shockingly overlooked. I think here in the US, it's in a shop with cruiser bikes and lower tier stuff, and it doesn't get the hype. It's a solid, light, very comfortable, race frame with gobs of clearance. The inside of the frame looked clean, threads were chased, disc mounts square, all of the good stuff accounted for, as it should be at that price range.
it is a heavy slug compared to the sl8 which is a heavy slug compared to any rim brake sworks tarmac.
I ride ALL the bikes.
RIP Saint Piran
Yeh that news came out over night. Super sad, though things were trending that way.
Molly Bendum had me dying 😆
"mall ib denim" would be fairly close.
Or just call it by the steel alloy name of chromoly (crow molly or chrome olly are both good enough)
and it being crankshaft material made me do a rewind :DDDDD
Welcome to a new episode of Chris and Jesse review bikes that they’ve never even seen in person, never mind ridden…
Is it better than the SL8?
They can see aero.
and, what’s your point ?
How can they be so confident that the Argon18 (or any others they have not tried) is not a worthy contender to be a decent race bike when they have never ridden one. Low credibility I say
I generally enjoy these two, but they are so oblivious to the bubble they live in. They don't recognize that bikes are enjoyed and used by literally millions of people that have zero interest in racing. Trashing non-racing bikes or the people highlighting them is super cringe.
I have the Triban 520 as a winter bike and on the trainer. For that price, it is a great bike. Weight is not all. And not everybody in this world can or want afford a x-thousand dollar bike. It always depends, what the rider is doing with it. On hills I overtook guys with their Pinarellos.
My partner has a Triban 520, and I've got a 120. Great bang for buck. Perfectly fine to ride.
Tour of Tucson was a 3 man break 10 miles in and winner attacked break mates the final 10 miles of the 100 mile race- as explained by their IG stories
It's disappointing to hear you trashing the Cannondale aluminium frame. Cycling has already become unfordable for many people and for somebody who might do a couple of big rides each summer, this is a great option. You risk shamming people who don't ride the latest carbon creations.
You have to take them with a pinch of salt. I love the show, but the economic bubble these two live in is not the same as most of the world. Chris wouldn't even touch Ultegra 🤣
Cannondale alloy frame is the crit racers dream bike on budget. Versatile, light and stiff. I found out that people had that as a starter bike.
I like these 2 guys and their content but sometimes they go overboard talking about other’s content.
Its not them it's China
But those welds though 😮
I have a triban 520 actually! I have the rim brake version from 2017 and use it for commuting and some winter training in the uk. It's been a great little bike.
Another good episode w/ lots of comedic points!
Never seen an Argon 18 bike myself so my thoughts are whatever, but I do think their "3D System" head set is pretty neat. Solves a safety and aesthetic problem so seems a win.
70% more subs in 4 weeks that’s a lofty goal there boys 😅
It's a taller task, 69.5% increase in subs, 59,000+69.5% = 100,000
Just getting back into cycling, and I’m so glad I stumbled on this channel, been binge watching these podcasts. Keep up the great content boys 👍
Awesome!! Great to have you aboard
Iphone MAX Pro slopping about hahahahahaha GOLD
Saved the controversy for the final few seconds. Allen's over Natural Confectionary snakes? What on earth?
Madness … true madness. Don’t start me on Haribo
@@ChrisMillerCycling I assume Haribo is some sort of joke and the rest of the world just don't get the famous German sense of humour.
I'm TNCC on road, and Allens on the gravel - need some variety!!
"Ökovital-Bär ohne Gelatine" in the 1.25 kg bag is the go-to
So saying all aluminum is the same would be like me saying every carbon bike is the same. Carbon is carbon right…??? I’d take a high end alloy bike over a low end carbon frame every day of the week
I'm using a triban rc520 as a full on winterbike! Upgraded the wheels and put some 32mm gp5k tyres on, feels like riding on a cloud. Very very comfortable, relatively cheap for the quality components (except original wheels) and mud guard mounts which make it the best.
Also, riding the last gen specialized venge during the summer but have ridden almost the same amount of kilometers on both bikes! (+/- 20k)
I actually enjoyed your "sponsored" element. Thinking in the background the sponsor saying "you must mention the material used!". Always good to watch Chris squirm with a script 😂
I respectfully disagree with the criticism of aluminum (alloy) bikes. They are a cost-effective entry-level choice that helps introduce new riders to cycling. Many aluminum models are available for around $1,500 and still feature rim brakes, making them accessible to newer riders. Not everyone wants to go through the process of sourcing a Chinese mold frame, assembling components, or dealing with complex hydraulic brakes and tubeless tire setups. While aluminum has lost its appeal for people who have moved on to carbon, (I wont be going back love my Pinarello's) I believe they are a good choice for new riders and commuters, again not this audience.
1. Race Bike - S works SL8
2. Gravel - S Works Crux
3. All Road - Enve Fray
4. Budget Carbon - Trek Madone SL6
5. Tri/TT - Trek SpeedConcept
6. Titanium - Moots CRD
7. Aero - Factor Ostro
8. Interesting Technology - Ribble Allroad TI
9. Climbing - Factor O2 VAM
😂 The part where Chris rips about the Quad Lock on the Argon bike had me absolutely rolling! That's some hard-hitting investigative journalistic criticism right there-exposing the real issues!
@Chris Miller, you should have like a S,A,B, C,D,E Tier list per category of bikes where you rank 2024 models of bikes. Would be fun to see!
Saint Piran have just ceased to exist, so I guess they didn't get many applicants
why are all gravel shoes just slop, any recommendations ?
Chris and Jesse & Colnago. It’s my opinion that you really need to ride both a C68 and a V4RS. Colnago negative appears every week but neither of you has ridden either frame. From the point of the C68: it’s beautifully made and the paint is immaculate, the ride is firm with some compliance but the bike has a power “push” through the rear triangle, weight isn’t amazing but I built mine to 6.5kg exactly with peddles, cage and computer mount. Does it go up hill - well I did a 1:43 up The Gap a few weeks ago (it’s on Strava) and have placed in a couple of B grade Sydney crits.
I’d also add and ask you to look at “cycling efficiency” as a measure rather than this obsession with aero drag. CE is applicable 100% of the time and if a frame is 5% more efficient it’s going to be a huge watts saving. You bag the V4RS but perhaps it’s a lot more CE than an SL8 and therefore could be the best in the pro peleton - has anyone actually tried to measure this???
Remember, Cannondale was the flagship large tube aluminum bike manufacturer back in the beginning. It’s their heritage
Chris early in the episode: Argon 18 is shit. Who would bother riding this?!
1:17:06 Projects Echelon rider wins solo vs 10,000 riders. That’s crazy!
Must be that dog of a bike Argon 18 he was on….
I still have an rc520, which people use when they come to my house to go out together. Tbh it's pretty great, and well specced. The main problem with it is the wheels, which are dogs***
What turns me off racing is the goddam sandbaggers! I raced twice at C grade ok and both came second. Both first place were A2 riders! Mind you I am the right W/kg, Age and weight deservingly to be in that category. How would you fix this problem? Would more people race?
Ouch that hurts, I have entered an event with Jay Vine, actually should be pretty good fun. a Canberra Cycling Club event with a race up Black mountain and a crit up the top. Should be a awesome event. I'm tempted to wear my old green dog paw nero kit haha, ok here is the deal you guys sign up and ill wear it :)
Jesse overcooked the acting in the paid segment. Don't be that guy, please.
There was something pretty jarring about that for sure
This is simple. Picking the pepper out of the fly sh_t.
All top brand high end race bikes are almost the same. Why? Because the engineers who design them with the same computer computational analysis all perform competitive analysis. They buy their competition and have rooms where they tear them down and cut them up for lessons learned. They chart the metrics of each bike and evaluate how those metrics are met and rank them in terms of importance specific to individual brand.
Pro riders are given bikes to race. The rest is left to amateurs to decide what to ride. Since top level race bikes are similar, other than for personal preference, it doesn't matter. Pogacar would have won the Tour de France on 'any' top brand race bike. Be sure to pick the color you prefer. You will get used to the rest because humans are highly adaptive creatures.
Obliquely, I had this conversation with Sheldon Brown decades ago before his untimely death.
@chrismiller when is the last time you rode an alloy bike? You speak like you know but, your speaking from history over 10 years ago. And, it amazes how worked up your getting over someone else's selection of bikes that doesn't fit your spec. So, once you get bikes to review like they are getting you give us a list that is based on your actual ride an review. You both make me laugh
Your sooking cause he doesn’t agree with your spec. Who the frig wants an alloy bike?
I usually only ever listen on Spotify, came over to UA-cam and it’s such a better experience. I will watch here from now on. 👍
Awesome! Thank you!
@@ChrisMillerCycling sames, I listen to it on Apple podcast the minute it drops but now I will try to save the episode on YT for trainer time.
Love the cycling gear discussions! Keep it up 💪
Ever thought of changing channel name to Nero Cycling? I think it would help
Seattle To Portland (STP) is a 200mi/320km fondo, it used to have 10000 participants but they've capped numbers in more recent years and it is now 5000-6000 in size. It's well supported with small and large food stops along the way, enterprising businesses also setup shops along the route which is great. Most people do it in 2 days, but a smaller group complete it in a single ride. I did it in 2023 in a single ride, hoped to do it in 2024 but was flying home to Australia the following day so thought that might be a bit rough ;)
I got Sum pro, super light, team discount
The dog itself 😂😂😂😂
Aus cycling race license is getting close to $400/year + need to pay race fee $10-20 per race, prohibitively expensive, hard to race after work during the week and risk of damage/crashes is moderate to high.
I love racing as a c grader having said all that
53:00 my response to "why do alot of people go club rides but dont race:" Alot of people that dont race do challenge themselves, but in a way of improving themself FOR themself instead of improving themself to beat or compete against others. with Racing there are alot of external requirements like getting race certified, being willing to lose and replace thousands worth of equipment and frankly alot of faff, complications or messy paperwork / costs affiliated with it when alot of people who want to challenge themselves know they can do it for free by just recording their stats and becoming a more confident, fitter rider.
Colnago might be made in Italy, but the company is mainly owned by the UAE investment fund since 2020. So this idea of buying an Italian bike has it's limits and If I can support someone else instead of a state investment fund of a country with that kind of human rights record I'll do it.
Yes, sportswashing is the reason why decent money is in Pro Cycling atm, but going out of your way to buy a bike from a company directly owned by such an organization is a hard pass for me...
You are not quite correct, it is owned by a privately held investment company - Chimera Investment - it is not a state owned fund as you have suggested.
@@CG-99 My bad, that is indeed a bit different and not exactly the same.
Latest news is that St Piran has pulled the plug on its racing team in 2025. This leaves the UK with only Ineos in the pro ranks.
Haha I think you guys are way off with the alloy take.. I don't know about the Australian crit/road race scene but here in Murica they are still a thing. Specialized allez's huge here
and with some hi-end kit added you can have a sub 16/17 lbs bike that kicks ass. Funny with the c-dale caad13 is not as big a hit as the caad10 and 12 was. The Allez killed the alloy competition 🤷
A Cannondale CAAD 13 is better than a low-end Chinese build; especially when you need warranty service.
Thanks for a fun and reliant show! They are the best.
Glad to hear I was ahead of my time. Never ate solid always various of mixtures of Vitargo, and gels carboloading for longer events, +4h. But did not
experimented higher than 60g h in the bottles could have used more but it was not known then and these packed gels was so expensive.
Have ridden Vätternrundan one of the biggest rondos in the world. only on Vitargo and a two gels from Enervit 2012, 315km in 7h and 55min 5-6*750ml bottles changed in 2stops.
Sounds like you were an early adopter like Jay!
@ shortage of money and a steel belly I guess. Sparked the innovation.
I became a cyclist in 1991 on a MTB and I think you heard about Power bars that NASA was a part of in the beginning. Maybe you got a story to the show there also.
MTB people was the Gravel bikers for the cycling community back then. Swedish cycling federation wanted the Motorsport and cross association to take on MTB.
Thankfully I ended up as a roadie 1998 on a Bianchi Chorus. 😉thanks Chris welcome to Sweden 🇸🇪 would be fun chatting and cycling some.
Idk about the caad 13 but my caad 12 is a beast and rides great sure not as good as top end carbon but I’ve won some local crits on it.
As a owner of a CAAD13 (purchased 4 yrs ago) I Sat in my car crying when Chris said the CAAD13 is shit
Fell to my knees in a Walmart parking lot
I would love specialized to offer you both an SL8 to ride for a year and watch you both say NO 😬
😂
I'd definitely watch that episode! So much marketing hype on the SL8.
I think all the sl8 shit is rubbish.
I'm riding the sl8 and came from a SEKA exceed rdc.
Yeah the sl8 can climb and descend. Even with the roval cockpit and fine tuning my fit and position.
From my riding perspective I don't think the sl8 lives up to its hype😅 I've only been cycling for a staggered 7months of the last year. But spending alot of time on the bike from June 24-nov 24.
Started racing first month back on the bike. Actually started in the d grade. And got my 1st win on my first race. And over 3 months landed in the B grade and riding break aways and winning but not on the sl8 but the seka.
My last race on the sl8 landed 3rd got caught solo breakaway. And really trying to hammer the bike.
90 pro wins over the amount of teams is definitely a marketing scheme aswell.
Yet to find my grove on the sl8. Just don't think it's got that all out breakaway solo TT style of ride to it.
I hated sitting in the bunch because half the people in the bunch are sitting there to save energy. And I found that out the hard way being beaten in a sprint off a breakaway from a guy that never contributed to the break and sat in the back saving energy. Now I just breakaway to solo to draw out who really wants to go and do some battling.
Did a bunch ride in Townsville north Queensland in Sept this year. The biggest group ride I'd ever been on at this point. My ftp was only 270 when I has visited. The bunch did between 52-60km for the last 30kms and here's the 270ftp kid having shots on the front at 55-60km on a SEKA exceed 😅
When I explained to them I'm a runner and only been on the bike since June after having hip surgery on the 10th of June. They were a bit stumped I went home 3days after and got a bump in fitness from riding with those boys. And set a new ftp of 290 on a 40minute threshold interval.
Tarmac sl8 is just a run off the mill bike. It's good like pretty good but not blistering nor mind blowing. Wich from all the jargon it was
Big praise for icu intervals!
Guys, the colnago TT Bike has a functional integrated water bottle, that conforms well with its integrated bottle cage/cradle, and yes, it is UCI legal.
Ive got the sworks SL8 tarmac and it feels so slow compared to my other sworks rim brake tarmacs Im putting a 750w motor on it.
12:22 I can't agree to that. What is the real point of paying $100s for a cycling computer when you can get a secondhand cellphone with more capability that you could slap out front?
I have a Caad13 as a winter bike and it's perfect for it 👌
Great interview, really interesting
LETS GET THESE BOIS A UA-cam PLAY BUTTON!!!!!!
Kudos to Max for getting out and racing. It's so much fun and you can really push yourself beyond the group ride. I must say that people like Max really annoy me in races. I like to attack and not have to sprint, but I often get chased by people like Max doing turns on the front, who then gets beaten in the sprint!
Many top pros at UnBound were using road pedals & shoes, I use the Favero road pedals & they have been flawless. I would get the MB’s for mnt biking for sure!👍
SL8 is the best road bike period. Specs, performance, objective testing. The mix of weight, stiffness, compliance, etc it’s just not a competition. Doesn’t mean everyone will prefer one but what they did was just unrivaled this year (hold for the new Addict).
I listen this show and have ridden the Triban 520. Greetings from Brussels
Love the Nero Show but feel highly offended by the CAAD13 disrespect 😂🤣🤣
The Argon 18 was released 3 years ago. You should ride before commenting.
Like who isn't already subscribed... come on people subscribe
That was a big slap on the Maxi’s face when he realised racers won’t necessarily take turns! 😂 It’s all about saving your energy for the right moment. Pogacar never takes turns, nor does Vingegaard. Does that make them bad cyclists!?
lol that new racer saying it’s not a win if you didn’t pull or work the front. He has a lot to learn. 😂
Keep up the racing @max!
I prefer the mechanism on the eggbeaters. They feel as though they clamp on both directions vs only one side. They stomp in at all directions. Of course they are not power meter pedals but eggbeater 11s weigh 89 grams per pedal.
can you get jay on whilst he's in oz?
You cannot compare an Argon18 to a Specialized, but you can ABSOLUTELY compare it to a Tavelo.
"If you buy a C68 in 2025 you've given up." Classic!!
The jersey behind Chris looking like Tour de Weed 😂
I wish you to reach the 100k Goal Guys 💪
They aren’t saying things that are inaccurate by any measure but their delivery sounds so tone deaf to what cycling should be. The bit about the Merida, the Scultura with 105 di2 is 3.5k aud, which is probably the cheapest 105 di2 bikes you can get. I know the content is based around high spec, performance bikes, but they’re not welcoming at all towards anything even slightly cheaper. There’s a lot of other categories that have very high end price tags but they still cover and appreciate mass market affordable items. I’ve been road biking for 7 years at this point, worked in a bike shop for 2 years. I’ve seen time and time again that the industry is very skewed to those who can throw unlimited money at it. Probably why the sport has dropped so much in popularity, the most positive thing about the industry is that there’s more affordable options now.
I listen all the time but wasn’t subscribed, my bad. I’m subscribed now. Love you guys.
Btw, the rude quality of a caad13 is actually very good. I have had caad 4,5 etc etc and the new caad is good. I also have a S6E Hi Mod and have had many other hi end carbon bikes
An alloy is an alloy. Aluminum is an element and is used in an alloy in every application.
Chris I think you are forgetting about the amount of carbon fiber expertise colnago has. Look at old c40s smashing cobbles. I’d argue that at this point colnago has as much carbon heritage as they do steel. C68 represents that. Also. I’m an old school kinda guy. I want the heritage of a colnago, but I still wanna ride carbon.
Never understood why colnago doesn’t have uae ride their made in Italy bikes. No one could touch that marketing
I bet Tadej breaks out the C68 next season!
@ doubtful!
Already a subscriber! As for the southern hemisphere summer, we’re sick of hearing about winter kit, winter tyres, winter bikes, cycling in the rain and cold, and bloody indoor cycling, so suck it up northern hemisphere!
Hear hear!
The dog is back!