The voice actors for Chitanda and Mayaka also sing the song that plays, and we intuitively tie their singing to the visuals on-screen. There is no individual action in this ED: almost all motion is doubled, at least by a bounce. The whole thing feels sleepy and voyeur, and their stares are blank yet also toward the camera/viewer. The sakugabooru post is very interesting.
Until I re-watched the show for the third time earlier this year, I had forgotten just how strange and uncharacteristic for KyotoAnimation this ED was. They usually treat their characters with respect and dignity, yet here the two girls are sitting in decidedly cute and sexy underwear, longingly looking at the camera. As the video discusses, it's not so much the fan service that gets me, it's that it strips the characters of their personalities completely. For a comparison, take the school festival, where Eru has her pictures taken in various outfits. You can see her shy, wavering and embarrassed expressions as she's posing for the camera. That's Chitanda. In the ED, the two are like possessed shells of their usual selves.
Absolutely. One of my favourite OPs of all time is completely dissonant with the show and that's the "Death Parade" OP. But when it comes to this ED it's always been uncomfortable to watch for me. For what it's worth, I think the "story" of this ED is pretty simple. Polaris is the north star, associated with 'finding a direction'. The night sky lights up and goes into the classic timelapse. It's about feminine naive sexuality, sending signals and longingness to be noticed. I don't think that's actually a story about a lack of agency. I just agree that this conceptualization of their sexuality is out of character for both of them. Maybe less so Mayaka, but even then her relationship with Satoshi at least that we get to see is marked by frustration at this point and not really this naive *allure*. But it doesn't end there, even If we do take the assumption that this is happening inside Satoshi or even Houtarou's head *that too is out of character for both of them*. We know they don't feel this way about these girls and we know they don't wish for them to be playfully seductive naive and utterly lovestruck. And at that point we have to come to the unsatisfactory conclusion - this is for the viewer and the creators and to that extent isn't even about the characters.
God, I love your analyses. I started rewatching Hyouka after you started you videos on it (and found it to be WAY WAY better than I had thought the first time around, and I had really liked it the first time), and this ED definitely stood apart from the show in my mind. I didn't put it together, but I liked every individual aspect of it except the individuality, just like you say.
I've been in love with Hyouka ever since I first saw it. I decided it a masterpiece directly. I though it had been forgotten. I'm so happy to see it get some attention again. You must finish this series!!! Thank you so much!
I felt the same way as you did about the ed I actually skipped it every episode until episode 12 Ed blew me away. And you know what Hyouka is still among the top3 anime i feel among what I've watched, its that brilliant everywhere else
One of the reasons I love Hyouka is it's treatment of it's female characters. Compared to other animes there is relatively no fan service outside of the pool episode, the ED and the hotspring to a smaller extent. Mayaka and Chitanda are treated with respect for who they are and I admire that a lot when many another shows I otherwise might enjoy treat their female characters like garbage. (see: kill la kill)
damn this is the first time you actually changed my opinion on something, with the previous videos i mostly didnt have a standpoint so i accepted your reading and conclusions of the show. i guess fake characterers should deserve respect ;P
I felt something was off with the ending, and always skipped it afterwards, but I couldn't put my finger on the reason why it felt that way. Like, if an ending isn't interesting enough to me, I tend to skip it to get to the next episode; that's just what I do. But here, I didn't just find it uninteresting; it really felt off. I blamed fan service at first, but after some time, I realized fan service doesn't always bother me, or at least not that much, so maybe it wasn't that... Now, I understand why it felt off. Yes, what's been bothering me all this time as exactly that : it doesn't match the characters; that's not who they are. They're objectified. Alienated from their personality. That's why it feels off. Great analysis.
but you also need to keep in mind that the title is "a promise of slumber". This refers that the whole ending may be a dream of one of the characters (probably Oreki). This may be his version of a desired Chitanda and Mayaka. Considering how they have suddenly become aloof and energy conservative. But this ending is not seen again after ep 11.5 which kind of means that Oreki has given up on his energy conservative nature (as seen in the new year episode where he suggests that they break the door or dig a hole, which is really energy consuming) thus the more energetic and lively "mystery" ending. This ending might be to show Oreki's desired version of the world but it changes along with Oreki's point of view.
Completely agree with what you explained! Glad to know I'm not the only one bothered by the ED and would prefer skipping it in contrast to never skipping the beautiful OP
Chances are little. There are 6 volumes of hyouka(light novel), anime has already covered 4 of them in 22 episodes. There is little source to make season 2 , and I don't think we will get a new volume soon as the author has said that he works on hyouka for fun, like he's not very passionate towards finishing this. I too am a diehard fan of the series, and waiting for season 2 myself.
New Hyouka video? Count me in! Throughout this series I was wondering what your thoughts on this ED were. Now having watched the video I have to say that they are rather close to mine. I do in fact love all the OP and ED songs of Hyouka and the music is definitely the best part about this one. I originally watched Hyouka at a time where I didn't really pay attention to details in shot composition and direction (as well as fine details in general) all that much (that mainly changed due to this videoseries). This is also partly (at least I think so) why the small story eluded me up until this point. The other reason being my dissapointment in its presentation. I always find it interesting when people describe their outfits in this scene as fanservice while they always seemed rather infantalized to me. Actually now that I think about it the entire scene feels incredibly infantalized (which for obvious reasons is an instant turn-off). The combination of this blanket, their outfits and their slow crawling simply leave this impression on me. Add to that the fake star filled sky that could resemble the cover of a crib (although I might be reading a bit too much into this) and you've got a few minutes of wonderful animation that I refuse to watch. Anyways good job as always. I'm looking forward to part two of this series while the similarities between Oreki and me grow even more. I'm quite excited to see what your talent for fusing thematic and compositional anlaysis can create. See you in the next video!
That's not what Takemoto said in an interview: --- Takemoto: At the beginning, producer Makoto Itou requested the ending to be about Eru and Mayaka’s character song... Since there are two girls in the cast and there isn’t much steaminess in the show itself, I thought we should add some steaminess in the ending at least (laughs). Gatou: Cough cough cough (laughs). Takemoto: Why are you coughing so violently? (laughs). After that, I drafted the ending and included my favorite gestures in it. --- blog.sakugabooru.com/2017/11/04/hyouka-roundtable-yasuhiro-takemoto-x-shouji-gatou-otona-animedia-5-2012-part-2/
I'm not so sure it isn't what Takemoto said. Itou requested that the ED to be about the girls' character song. Just how many places are the visuals for a song called "Promise of Slumber" likely to go? Part of what you elided from Takemoto's answer is possibly relevant (and is also relevant to RP's take that the ED doesn't fit the show): >>> Personally, I consider Hyouka, at its quintessence, a work about Houtarou’s mind. I had already imagined how to portray the world from his point of view and how he perceives certain types of people. But since the ending ended up being about Eru and Mayaka’s character song, I thought we should model it independently from the main show - without paying heed to Houtarou’s perspective.
@@proper1420a Oh yea he definitely indulged in it. The ED wouldn't have been as great as it is otherwise. I guess what I wanted to say was if Takemoto had his way he probably wouldn't have made it this way.
Takemoto saying "I thought we should add some steaminess in the ending at least" is basically admission that the fanservice was his idea. Itou wanted the ED to be about Eru and Mayaka's character song, a request that sounds like the opposite of "strip away these two characters' personalities and make them sexy/infantile." Takemoto goes on to joke(?) that his female coworkers gave him some grief about how he handled the ED, which only makes sense if the fanservice was his idea
It is a dream, something disconnected from reality. It reinforces the romance which has always been rather minimal or subtle all through out the first 19 episodes. I agree that it is fan service though, but I view it as something inside a dream, so it isn't necessary to retain all the aspects of the two girls' characters. The only downside for me is that it was also used in the episode prior to introducing Mayaka. That can cause confusion to the romantic aspect of the ED and make the viewer think that there's bound to be a love triangle in the future. I don't dislike it. I loved the poetry of the song, and for me the animation matched the song's theme.
Yeah I really don’t like the clothes or poses, and definitely agree with you man, I don’t like the fan service in this anime, it takes away from the beauty and importance of the characters and story 🤔🤗
I think I am going to be the first to admit, yes, the video is dissonant and out of place from the characters' personalities but I am a male and I do enjoy the shape of the female form and the ED didnt bother me.
I like the sings of both the first op and the first ed. I am not going do discuss the imagery of either though. ;-) That has to be up the the individual. I am just going to actually wonder why I usually like ed music MORE than op music. Sometimes it is because the op is in a style/genre I don't like but sometimes both can be equally good but still the ed resonate more with me than the op Which is still the case here, both songs I really like but the endthing song is by a hair the one I like more. :-) Something that I stil have not found an answer to after 25 ish years of watching anime. Doesn't really matter I guess but at some point if only for my own piece of mind I would like to find out why I feel that way. :-P
When you really think about it, like the author of this and other videos reviews of the episodes did - Hyouka is a cross between slice of life/ middle school mysteries novella and beautiful, multilayered poem. All the hidden meanings I never really noticed BEFORE the author if this video pointed them out made themselves worth it to watch the anime. It is really poetic and meaningful, allegoric and funny.
i don't think this is about fun service. this is all about how both girls are together in the same situation, like girls tend to be. both finding love in the same position (vulnerable by their personal insecurities) and helping each other during the process.
I think it was alright, the fanservice for me didn't ruin anything for me. In anime where fanservice goes too far is when it is done excessively enough so that it can define a show, but Hyouka has minimum fan service and doesn't take away from the entire show
Others seem to share your viewpoint and I can understand why. While the ED does nothing wrong per say, if the ending were instead more character driven like all the rest of the opening and ending sequences then it could have added to the show and it's narrative. Because it didn't necessary do so, it inherently detracts from the overall experience. This belief is held by like-minded people.
The voice actors for Chitanda and Mayaka also sing the song that plays, and we intuitively tie their singing to the visuals on-screen.
There is no individual action in this ED: almost all motion is doubled, at least by a bounce.
The whole thing feels sleepy and voyeur, and their stares are blank yet also toward the camera/viewer.
The sakugabooru post is very interesting.
Great video as always man, you're keeping up the quality
Until I re-watched the show for the third time earlier this year, I had forgotten just how strange and uncharacteristic for KyotoAnimation this ED was. They usually treat their characters with respect and dignity, yet here the two girls are sitting in decidedly cute and sexy underwear, longingly looking at the camera. As the video discusses, it's not so much the fan service that gets me, it's that it strips the characters of their personalities completely.
For a comparison, take the school festival, where Eru has her pictures taken in various outfits. You can see her shy, wavering and embarrassed expressions as she's posing for the camera. That's Chitanda. In the ED, the two are like possessed shells of their usual selves.
Not that uncharacteristic. Don't forget about Amaburi (same director as Hyouka) and Phantom World.
Absolutely. One of my favourite OPs of all time is completely dissonant with the show and that's the "Death Parade" OP. But when it comes to this ED it's always been uncomfortable to watch for me. For what it's worth, I think the "story" of this ED is pretty simple. Polaris is the north star, associated with 'finding a direction'. The night sky lights up and goes into the classic timelapse. It's about feminine naive sexuality, sending signals and longingness to be noticed. I don't think that's actually a story about a lack of agency. I just agree that this conceptualization of their sexuality is out of character for both of them. Maybe less so Mayaka, but even then her relationship with Satoshi at least that we get to see is marked by frustration at this point and not really this naive *allure*. But it doesn't end there, even If we do take the assumption that this is happening inside Satoshi or even Houtarou's head *that too is out of character for both of them*. We know they don't feel this way about these girls and we know they don't wish for them to be playfully seductive naive and utterly lovestruck. And at that point we have to come to the unsatisfactory conclusion - this is for the viewer and the creators and to that extent isn't even about the characters.
God, I love your analyses. I started rewatching Hyouka after you started you videos on it (and found it to be WAY WAY better than I had thought the first time around, and I had really liked it the first time), and this ED definitely stood apart from the show in my mind. I didn't put it together, but I liked every individual aspect of it except the individuality, just like you say.
Drendude Same here
I've been in love with Hyouka ever since I first saw it. I decided it a masterpiece directly. I though it had been forgotten. I'm so happy to see it get some attention again. You must finish this series!!! Thank you so much!
"beautiful" yeah.. armpits, thighs, midriff, and yuri bait... ehehe
Milo Fedriko don't forget the feet
“The ED is visually stunning”
I felt the same way as you did about the ed I actually skipped it every episode until episode 12 Ed blew me away.
And you know what Hyouka is still among the top3 anime i feel among what I've watched, its that brilliant everywhere else
One of the reasons I love Hyouka is it's treatment of it's female characters. Compared to other animes there is relatively no fan service outside of the pool episode, the ED and the hotspring to a smaller extent. Mayaka and Chitanda are treated with respect for who they are and I admire that a lot when many another shows I otherwise might enjoy treat their female characters like garbage. (see: kill la kill)
R.I.P studio and 33 people had died in fire..
dude im firmly into my first watch of hyouka and you upload this video now :eyes:
*YES YES YES*
Does this mean you will talk about the 2nd ending?
Yeah I've kinda obligated myself into it...same with the second OP.
Whoa, thanks for replying, I love your content!
Finally!!! I had to wait a long time for another Hyouka vid!! 💓
Good decision, and excellent video as usual.
damn this is the first time you actually changed my opinion on something, with the previous videos i mostly didnt have a standpoint so i accepted your reading and conclusions of the show. i guess fake characterers should deserve respect ;P
"I guess it's August 52nd"
you go me there
One day I will watch Hyoka and it would be in part to be able to see your videos after it.
hope she sees this bro
lmaoooooooooooooooooooo
I felt something was off with the ending, and always skipped it afterwards, but I couldn't put my finger on the reason why it felt that way.
Like, if an ending isn't interesting enough to me, I tend to skip it to get to the next episode; that's just what I do. But here, I didn't just find it uninteresting; it really felt off.
I blamed fan service at first, but after some time, I realized fan service doesn't always bother me, or at least not that much, so maybe it wasn't that...
Now, I understand why it felt off. Yes, what's been bothering me all this time as exactly that : it doesn't match the characters; that's not who they are. They're objectified. Alienated from their personality. That's why it feels off. Great analysis.
but you also need to keep in mind that the title is "a promise of slumber". This refers that the whole ending may be a dream of one of the characters (probably Oreki). This may be his version of a desired Chitanda and Mayaka. Considering how they have suddenly become aloof and energy conservative. But this ending is not seen again after ep 11.5 which kind of means that Oreki has given up on his energy conservative nature (as seen in the new year episode where he suggests that they break the door or dig a hole, which is really energy consuming) thus the more energetic and lively "mystery" ending. This ending might be to show Oreki's desired version of the world but it changes along with Oreki's point of view.
How can they create ss 2 when kyoto animation is ruiend😔😔😔 can anybody hear me???
Ahhhh, I should watch this anime. I really should. You've finally convinced me!
Glad to hear it - I hope you enjoy.
I can't remember where did I heard that BGM at 3:33... ¿Anyone knows the name?
walt - Terror in Resonance (Yoko Kanno)
@@ReplayValue Thanks a lot!
@@ReplayValue Thanks! It was bothering me so much.
The second ED is so much better
Great work till now,
And I got a question:
Why don't you consider analysing the lyrics along with the video?
Completely agree with what you explained! Glad to know I'm not the only one bothered by the ED and would prefer skipping it in contrast to never skipping the beautiful OP
hyouka
Chances are little. There are 6 volumes of hyouka(light novel), anime has already covered 4 of them in 22 episodes. There is little source to make season 2 , and I don't think we will get a new volume soon as the author has said that he works on hyouka for fun, like he's not very passionate towards finishing this. I too am a diehard fan of the series, and waiting for season 2 myself.
Hyouka isnt a light novel, its a novel
New Hyouka video? Count me in! Throughout this series I was wondering what your thoughts on this ED were. Now having watched the video I have to say that they are rather close to mine. I do in fact love all the OP and ED songs of Hyouka and the music is definitely the best part about this one. I originally watched Hyouka at a time where I didn't really pay attention to details in shot composition and direction (as well as fine details in general) all that much (that mainly changed due to this videoseries). This is also partly (at least I think so) why the small story eluded me up until this point. The other reason being my dissapointment in its presentation. I always find it interesting when people describe their outfits in this scene as fanservice while they always seemed rather infantalized to me. Actually now that I think about it the entire scene feels incredibly infantalized (which for obvious reasons is an instant turn-off). The combination of this blanket, their outfits and their slow crawling simply leave this impression on me. Add to that the fake star filled sky that could resemble the cover of a crib (although I might be reading a bit too much into this) and you've got a few minutes of wonderful animation that I refuse to watch.
Anyways good job as always. I'm looking forward to part two of this series while the similarities between Oreki and me grow even more. I'm quite excited to see what your talent for fusing thematic and compositional anlaysis can create.
See you in the next video!
The producer is responsible for this ED. It wasn't Takemoto's idea actually, even though he was the one who storyboarded it.
That's not what Takemoto said in an interview:
---
Takemoto: At the beginning, producer Makoto Itou requested the ending to be about Eru and Mayaka’s character song... Since there are two girls in the cast and there isn’t much steaminess in the show itself, I thought we should add some steaminess in the ending at least (laughs).
Gatou: Cough cough cough (laughs).
Takemoto: Why are you coughing so violently? (laughs). After that, I drafted the ending and included my favorite gestures in it.
---
blog.sakugabooru.com/2017/11/04/hyouka-roundtable-yasuhiro-takemoto-x-shouji-gatou-otona-animedia-5-2012-part-2/
I'm not so sure it isn't what Takemoto said. Itou requested that the ED to be about the girls' character song. Just how many places are the visuals for a song called "Promise of Slumber" likely to go?
Part of what you elided from Takemoto's answer is possibly relevant (and is also relevant to RP's take that the ED doesn't fit the show):
>>>
Personally, I consider Hyouka, at its quintessence, a work about Houtarou’s mind. I had already imagined how to portray the world from his point of view and how he perceives certain types of people. But since the ending ended up being about Eru and Mayaka’s character song, I thought we should model it independently from the main show - without paying heed to Houtarou’s perspective.
@@proper1420a Oh yea he definitely indulged in it. The ED wouldn't have been as great as it is otherwise. I guess what I wanted to say was if Takemoto had his way he probably wouldn't have made it this way.
Takemoto saying "I thought we should add some steaminess in the ending at least" is basically admission that the fanservice was his idea. Itou wanted the ED to be about Eru and Mayaka's character song, a request that sounds like the opposite of "strip away these two characters' personalities and make them sexy/infantile." Takemoto goes on to joke(?) that his female coworkers gave him some grief about how he handled the ED, which only makes sense if the fanservice was his idea
It is a dream, something disconnected from reality. It reinforces the romance which has always been rather minimal or subtle all through out the first 19 episodes. I agree that it is fan service though, but I view it as something inside a dream, so it isn't necessary to retain all the aspects of the two girls' characters. The only downside for me is that it was also used in the episode prior to introducing Mayaka. That can cause confusion to the romantic aspect of the ED and make the viewer think that there's bound to be a love triangle in the future. I don't dislike it. I loved the poetry of the song, and for me the animation matched the song's theme.
Yeah I really don’t like the clothes or poses, and definitely agree with you man, I don’t like the fan service in this anime, it takes away from the beauty and importance of the characters and story 🤔🤗
I think I am going to be the first to admit, yes, the video is dissonant and out of place from the characters' personalities but I am a male and I do enjoy the shape of the female form and the ED didnt bother me.
Lmao 💯
I like the sings of both the first op and the first ed. I am not going do discuss the imagery of either though. ;-) That has to be up the the individual. I am just going to actually wonder why I usually like ed music MORE than op music. Sometimes it is because the op is in a style/genre I don't like but sometimes both can be equally good but still the ed resonate more with me than the op Which is still the case here, both songs I really like but the endthing song is by a hair the one I like more. :-) Something that I stil have not found an answer to after 25 ish years of watching anime. Doesn't really matter I guess but at some point if only for my own piece of mind I would like to find out why I feel that way. :-P
WHEN YOU ARE GONNA TOUCH HYOUKA AGAIN AAAAAAAAAA I WANT MOOOOAR!!!!1
I love the 1st ending!
Felt the same way
70th comment: I have broken the balance
second ED. now.
Even for Chitanda it is weird - during the festival ark she's clearly bothered when he has looked through her photo's.
Can't we just consider this ed as a dream instead? Like the lyrics kinda tell you to already🤔
I should really watch hyouka when i have time. How good do u think the series is and why?
When you really think about it, like the author of this and other videos reviews of the episodes did - Hyouka is a cross between slice of life/ middle school mysteries novella and beautiful, multilayered poem. All the hidden meanings I never really noticed BEFORE the author if this video pointed them out made themselves worth it to watch the anime. It is really poetic and meaningful, allegoric and funny.
I always prefer the second ending, since my personal taste of music is the upbeat one.
But then again, those armpits doe...
i don't think this is about fun service. this is all about how both girls are together in the same situation, like girls tend to be. both finding love in the same position (vulnerable by their personal insecurities) and helping each other during the process.
*fan
@@RinFade no, no, it actually is a fun service
@@angeluriel2725 DId you come from the future to haunt me?
i hate this ed i have never completed it and i won't cause i hate fanservice and i love those characters so i don't want to see them like that
You sound like "ParashockX", idk maybe just me but yeah.
I liked your videos without all the humor.....Serious Replay Value is much better in my opinion.
Omg.
A dislike
Yup, I absolutely hated the ED. I tried to watch through ED1 once but couldn't make it. Btw, too absolutely hate fan-service in anime.
I think it was alright, the fanservice for me didn't ruin anything for me. In anime where fanservice goes too far is when it is done excessively enough so that it can define a show, but Hyouka has minimum fan service and doesn't take away from the entire show
Your opinion is bad and you should feel bad.
Insert hate comment
Bet you can't eat only one
Others seem to share your viewpoint and I can understand why. While the ED does nothing wrong per say, if the ending were instead more character driven like all the rest of the opening and ending sequences then it could have added to the show and it's narrative. Because it didn't necessary do so, it inherently detracts from the overall experience. This belief is held by like-minded people.