Hopefully you guys enjoy this quick video on Schopenhauer and Stoicism. If you found this video helpful, please like & subscribe. It helps out the channel a great deal. Thank you for watching!
Nietzsche wrote a really good article in his Untimely Meditations calles ´Schopenhauer as educator´. Might be worth a video as your channel already has a lot of Nietzsche and Schopenhauer in it I think it would be a great addition
Your content is brilliant. I’ve read & tried to read quite a lot of philosophy. I’ve always struggled with the language & relating it to modern language/thinking. Often reading and struggling to understand.
Stoicism and its rationality & aim to attain the good life through duty, work and purpose is the way forward. Always making videos on stoicism so appreciate seeing this video on Weltgeist! Cheers
Love is neither wise nor beautiful; But rather a passion for wisdom and beauty. Actual love in itself inflames people’s hearts with das desire for de beautiful object, Not so without das hope That too the affection is mutual.
I like your Schopenhauer videos. I can tell you actually read the texts and form your own opinions. Most people just rely on commentary or snippets. Cheers
Great video as always! Can you make a break down of Schopenhauers “On the Fourfold Root of the Principle of Sufficient Reason” ? It seems like anyone who’s talking about Schopenhauers work has missed this topic.
To summarize, despite its instrumentality, Stoicism is rejected by Schopenhauer because of its purely rational foundation. This the same reason that Kantian ethics along with its categorical imperative is also rejected by Schopenhauer. As Schopenhauer said, rational acts and virtuous acts can be completely different. A virtuous person can possess very little analytical power, but always has a profound, intuitive (not rational) understanding of the nature of the world. In fact, insofar as deemphasizing the role of reason, Schopenhauer's ethical position goes hand in hand with his epistemology (in which reason is secondary to understanding)and metaphysics (in which reason serves the will).
All is 1 because 1 is all. This is das fundamental law of Buddhism because it gives rise to 4 noble truths: 1. Illness exists because of 2. Illinterbeing. 3. Wellness exists because of 4. Wellinterbeing. This is because that is; This is not because that is not, This and that: You are in me because I am in you. We=1, earthly brothers!
As far as I know, stoics didnt "reccomend suicide". They talked about embracing death even if the emperor forced you to suicide. I might be wrong but I never read any stoic offering suicide.
When I no longer see das road to freedom, Then all I have to do is To turn over my wrist. To live is to suffer. To die is to perish. To survive is to find meaning in suffering because suicide is a cowardly act.
I'm not so familiar with Schopenhauer, but did he discard it, just on the basis that it allowed suicide as an option? As a choice, to end unbearable suffering?
The end goal of Stoicism is a happy life. The contradiction (according to Schop) is that ending your own life can’t be part of a system of ‘the good LIFE’. Schopenhauer will recommend his own system instead (which is not based on rationality btw. Another disagreement w Stoicism)
@@WeltgeistYT I really don't see how suicide due to extreme circumstances will erase a lifetime of virtue. A good life is a good life. I see no contradiction at all except in semantics. But anyway, i'm sure there's a more detailed explanation for it.
I might be wrong, but I do not think that the Stoics think that life is suffering. Actually, as we only control our judment and not the events, it can be either a suffering or not. I think Schopenhauer might be wrong on this point. He is right that suicide is an exit point for Stoics, we can find this explanation on How to be a Stoic, by Massimo Pigliucci, but as life is not suffering for the stoics, the philosophy would not be wrong or incorrect.
Unplesant physical sensations,such as pain,are inevetible in life. That was a qoute from Marcus Aurelius. The dicotomy of control also I think derives from the fact that stoics viewed life as suffering,because they did not precisely focused on being happy but they focused on not carrying about things that they cant control because those things cause pain so they said that you need to focus on your judgement about things
to me the reccomandation of suicide is not a flaw: if you have a painful and incurable disease that makes your life an hell on earth who would not prefer death? well...one who believes that a God will punish you in the afterlife if you take your own life, but for an atheist the stoic point is perfectly rational, that is good. Obviously that must be a really really painful condition: those who asks for assisted suicide for a depression, or for a disability, should not be helped, because even if they are persuaded that life cannot be enjoyed, the others have the responsability to help them to find a way to live (stoically, for example): everybody can attain virtues and better the world, if they are not prostrated by terrible pain.
@@WeltgeistYT Seneca committed suicide as he was going to be executed anyway, it's not like the Stoics wouldn't have frowned upon a person committing suicide if they had another way. It was literally as a last resort
Just a little correction, ataraxia is not a stoic concept. Stoics do not search for a state free of trouble. Actually the stoics do seek a positive state of happiness (eudaimonia) characterized by unceasing joy.
Stoicism & unceasing joy? What the hell are you talking about? 🤔 Their goal was to achieve a life of virtue according to nature & "apátheia" - freedom from unhealthy passions/emotions.
@@joejohnson6327 yes sage enjoys eudaimonia, a state of joy and tranquil mind coming from performance of virtue. It is of course not joy in the sense of pleaure, which is indifferent. I suggest you look up eudaimonia in the stoic context to learn more about the issue.
@@Super8034 Eudaimonia in the context of Stoicism has nothing to do with "a positive state of happiness characterized by unceasing joy". I suggest you look up the term "apátheia" if you wish to learn more about the Stoics.
Indeed my friend, "apatheia" as state free from passions is essential part of stoic philosophy. However, joy is a species a good emotion, similar to aidos, shame, that sage's cultivates. Additionally, the sage's good life is also characterised by joy arising from performance of virtue. Seneca talks a lot about this. I suggest you look into some academic sources if you want to have a better view. For instance, Joy, flow, and the Sage's experience in Seneca by Sam McVane is a good source! @@joejohnson6327
As far as I know, stoics didnt "reccomend suicide". They talked about embracing death even if the emperor forced you to suicide. I might be wrong but I never read any stoic offering suicide.
Oj nie nie byczku -1. I read composite knowledge on stoicism. The idea is to firstly accept death and practices for ex. thinking that for millions years you were already dead before birth so it's nothing scary. But If you think you cannot live fulfiling life, suicide is always an option.
Several commenters posted that the Stoics recognized that we didn't exist before we were born and we weren't any less happy for it. Marcus Aurelius said that since death is natural, we shouldn't see death as evil. Some people commenting on this video then committed the error of saying that this line of reason embraces suicide. Although some self-described Stoics may have condoned suicide, it doesn't appear to be a common Stoic belief. I've never seen it in the writings of Marcus Aurelius.
That's why I took care in choosing my words by saying, "Although some self-described Stoics may have condoned suicide, it doesn't appear to be a common Stoic belief." Judging from your choice of words, Epictetus was pro-choice on suicide without necessarily approving of the decision to do so, even in specific instances.
As far as I know, stoics didnt "reccomend suicide". They talked about embracing death even if the emperor forced you to suicide. I might be wrong but I never read any stoic offering suicide.
Epictetus did definitely consider it an option if you couldn't handle life, by saying that "the door is always open". So if your pain was too much to bear, you had the choice to walk out the door of life, if you so deemed it.
Hopefully you guys enjoy this quick video on Schopenhauer and Stoicism. If you found this video helpful, please like & subscribe. It helps out the channel a great deal. Thank you for watching!
Thank you for teaching for de love of wisdom.
The history of philosophy could be seen as a long dialogue with those who have come before. Great video man, keep it up!
And those who will come after us-
But before total extinction.
Nietzsche wrote a really good article in his Untimely Meditations calles ´Schopenhauer as educator´. Might be worth a video as your channel already has a lot of Nietzsche and Schopenhauer in it I think it would be a great addition
Yes definitely! It’s coming
Arthur would be happy with the idea of that video W
Great video, looking forward to the "Will to Power" video next week.
Working on it!
Das struggle itself towards great heights is sufficient to replenish a man’s heart.
Your content is brilliant. I’ve read & tried to read quite a lot of philosophy. I’ve always struggled with the language & relating it to modern language/thinking. Often reading and struggling to understand.
Thank you
Stoicism and its rationality & aim to attain the good life through duty, work and purpose is the way forward. Always making videos on stoicism so appreciate seeing this video on Weltgeist! Cheers
Yes! Thank you!
What if you reject the Stoic definition of happiness?
Love waking up to a little Schopenhauer in the morning.
Love is neither wise nor beautiful;
But rather a passion for wisdom and beauty.
Actual love in itself inflames people’s hearts with das desire for de beautiful object,
Not so without das hope
That too the affection is mutual.
Does it come with batteries?
@Maronidas lol, no but I have a bobble head of Ulysses Grant on my shelf. He grants me a good day and reminds me to not be afraid to get get gritty.
I like your Schopenhauer videos. I can tell you actually read the texts and form your own opinions. Most people just rely on commentary or snippets. Cheers
Ty. I spent a lot of time with his works
@@WeltgeistYT what do you like about him Welt?
Great video as always! Can you make a break down of Schopenhauers “On the Fourfold Root of the Principle of Sufficient Reason” ? It seems like anyone who’s talking about Schopenhauers work has missed this topic.
Official video once again.. I thourouly enjoyed it... would like to see more Stoicism if possible 🗡️
Your wish is my demand
To summarize, despite its instrumentality, Stoicism is rejected by Schopenhauer because of its purely rational foundation. This the same reason that Kantian ethics along with its categorical imperative is also rejected by Schopenhauer. As Schopenhauer said, rational acts and virtuous acts can be completely different. A virtuous person can possess very little analytical power, but always has a profound, intuitive (not rational) understanding of the nature of the world. In fact, insofar as deemphasizing the role of reason, Schopenhauer's ethical position goes hand in hand with his epistemology (in which reason is secondary to understanding)and metaphysics (in which reason serves the will).
Yes! All is one. Ethics = metaphysics = aesthetics = epistemology
All is 1 because 1 is all.
This is das fundamental law of Buddhism because it gives rise to 4 noble truths:
1. Illness exists because of
2. Illinterbeing.
3. Wellness exists because of
4. Wellinterbeing.
This is because that is;
This is not because that is not,
This and that:
You are in me because I am in you.
We=1,
earthly brothers!
As far as I know, stoics didnt "reccomend suicide". They talked about embracing death even if the emperor forced you to suicide.
I might be wrong but I never read any stoic offering suicide.
When I no longer see das road to freedom,
Then all I have to do is
To turn over my wrist.
To live is to suffer.
To die is to perish.
To survive is to find meaning in suffering because suicide is a cowardly act.
Dope broer
Stress the i αταραξία
fascinating lesson
I'm not so familiar with Schopenhauer, but did he discard it, just on the basis that it allowed suicide as an option? As a choice, to end unbearable suffering?
The end goal of Stoicism is a happy life. The contradiction (according to Schop) is that ending your own life can’t be part of a system of ‘the good LIFE’. Schopenhauer will recommend his own system instead (which is not based on rationality btw. Another disagreement w Stoicism)
@@WeltgeistYT I see. Thanks for the reply
@@WeltgeistYT I really don't see how suicide due to extreme circumstances will erase a lifetime of virtue. A good life is a good life. I see no contradiction at all except in semantics. But anyway, i'm sure there's a more detailed explanation for it.
I might be wrong, but I do not think that the Stoics think that life is suffering. Actually, as we only control our judment and not the events, it can be either a suffering or not. I think Schopenhauer might be wrong on this point. He is right that suicide is an exit point for Stoics, we can find this explanation on How to be a Stoic, by Massimo Pigliucci, but as life is not suffering for the stoics, the philosophy would not be wrong or incorrect.
Unplesant physical sensations,such as pain,are inevetible in life. That was a qoute from Marcus Aurelius. The dicotomy of control also I think derives from the fact that stoics viewed life as suffering,because they did not precisely focused on being happy but they focused on not carrying about things that they cant control because those things cause pain so they said that you need to focus on your judgement about things
to me the reccomandation of suicide is not a flaw: if you have a painful and incurable disease that makes your life an hell on earth who would not prefer death? well...one who believes that a God will punish you in the afterlife if you take your own life, but for an atheist the stoic point is perfectly rational, that is good. Obviously that must be a really really painful condition: those who asks for assisted suicide for a depression, or for a disability, should not be helped, because even if they are persuaded that life cannot be enjoyed, the others have the responsability to help them to find a way to live (stoically, for example): everybody can attain virtues and better the world, if they are not prostrated by terrible pain.
Are u Flemish?
Very good .
What is good ?
Suicide was not recommended by the Stoics as far as I have read, it was an option that one could take.
Sure. It’s not frowned upon in any case
@@WeltgeistYT Seneca committed suicide as he was going to be executed anyway, it's not like the Stoics wouldn't have frowned upon a person committing suicide if they had another way. It was literally as a last resort
Just a little correction, ataraxia is not a stoic concept. Stoics do not search for a state free of trouble. Actually the stoics do seek a positive state of happiness (eudaimonia) characterized by unceasing joy.
Stoicism & unceasing joy? What the hell are you talking about? 🤔
Their goal was to achieve a life of virtue according to nature & "apátheia" - freedom from unhealthy passions/emotions.
@@joejohnson6327 yes sage enjoys eudaimonia, a state of joy and tranquil mind coming from performance of virtue. It is of course not joy in the sense of pleaure, which is indifferent. I suggest you look up eudaimonia in the stoic context to learn more about the issue.
@@Super8034 Eudaimonia in the context of Stoicism has nothing to do with "a positive state of happiness characterized by unceasing joy". I suggest you look up the term "apátheia" if you wish to learn more about the Stoics.
Indeed my friend, "apatheia" as state free from passions is essential part of stoic philosophy. However, joy is a species a good emotion, similar to aidos, shame, that sage's cultivates. Additionally, the sage's good life is also characterised by joy arising from performance of virtue. Seneca talks a lot about this. I suggest you look into some academic sources if you want to have a better view. For instance, Joy, flow, and the Sage's experience in Seneca by Sam McVane is a good source! @@joejohnson6327
Schopenhauer's view of suicide is so annoying.
As far as I know, stoics didnt "reccomend suicide". They talked about embracing death even if the emperor forced you to suicide.
I might be wrong but I never read any stoic offering suicide.
Oj nie nie byczku -1. I read composite knowledge on stoicism. The idea is to firstly accept death and practices for ex. thinking that for millions years you were already dead before birth so it's nothing scary. But If you think you cannot live fulfiling life, suicide is always an option.
Several commenters posted that the Stoics recognized that we didn't exist before we were born and we weren't any less happy for it. Marcus Aurelius said that since death is natural, we shouldn't see death as evil. Some people commenting on this video then committed the error of saying that this line of reason embraces suicide. Although some self-described Stoics may have condoned suicide, it doesn't appear to be a common Stoic belief. I've never seen it in the writings of Marcus Aurelius.
@@AmericanActionReport hmm actually I did my research and Epictetus does support suicide as a choice
That's why I took care in choosing my words by saying, "Although some self-described Stoics may have condoned suicide, it doesn't appear to be a common Stoic belief." Judging from your choice of words, Epictetus was pro-choice on suicide without necessarily approving of the decision to do so, even in specific instances.
As far as I know, stoics didnt "reccomend suicide". They talked about embracing death even if the emperor forced you to suicide.
I might be wrong but I never read any stoic offering suicide.
Epictetus did definitely consider it an option if you couldn't handle life, by saying that "the door is always open". So if your pain was too much to bear, you had the choice to walk out the door of life, if you so deemed it.
It was neve recommended as far as I have read. It was an option, not a recommendation.
@@clxvii_ But I don't think the human predicament permits this.
Seneca and Epictetus did if I remember correctly