Recognising a Palestinian state is ‘conceptually ridiculous’ | Melanie Phillips
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- Опубліковано 21 тра 2024
- “There’s no two-state solution because Palestinians are waging war.”
Recognising an independent Palestinian state is “conceptually ridiculous” because of how difficult it would be to define, says Melanie Phillips.
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Read the Hamas charter!
Which one ???? Have you read the Likud charter ?
Listen and read Zionist charters. It means ethic cleansing of Palestine. Listen and observe the actions and words of Israhell for the last 8 decades. It’s no mystery at all. Zionism = ethic cleansing of Palestinians.
Read rhe Lukid party's charter....forget that, just look at the Israeli flag, calling for the genocide of Palestinians
Many jewish people of different nationalities wish for happiness and peace for Palestinians. Not because it would make theur own lives easier but because they are genuinely humane and belive all peoples should have a homeland. That Giles fellow is beyond obnoxious.
If Melanie is against it,
it must be a good idea.
This is also a woman who has opposed Irish independence, and argued that "there is no evidence for global warming". There are far brighter minds you could be interviewing, Times Radio...
She is entitled to her opinions, whether you agree with them or not. She is entitled to say there is no evidence of global warming. In any case, what do you propose to do about it? Return society back to the Stone Age? Even if ecologically desirable, that , of course, is impossible.
@@OliverGrumitt yeah when did I say she wasn't entitled to her opinions? Just like I'm entitled to my opinion to see her as a bigot.
Yawn @@peaceforall1996
@@dominiclane8538 sleep well x
@@OliverGrumitthush
Can you tell that the Times is owned by Murdoch?
Sky News is owned by Murdoch
No im too dumb.
Melanie Philips also believes that Ireland has a tenuous claim to statehood so not that inclided to take her seriously
Sorry it bothers you that terrorists aren't being handed statehood on a silver platter
Times Radio and this guest are Pure zionists that is obvious. The British population, especially the english one is zionist. However there are some contradictions which denounce the lack of humanity and morality in this like for example the Queen never visiting Israel because it has not forgotten their behaviour towards british soldiers. Nowadays british play sort of a secondary role in aiding the US aid for the genocide of palestinians, just shows how zionism is entrenched in people's minds. Tell a lie too many times and it becomes true.
This ☝💯
I agree with her!
Listening to just a few seconds of this makes you realise there are some loathsome individuals who should keep opinions to themselves.
My new book coming out soon: How the West was lost
Lost by the West's useful idiots (many commenting here ) enabling terror .
This is the anniversary of 22 people including women and children being massacred in Manchester by a suicide bomber with the same extreme ideology as Hamas.
I bet most people don't even remember his name or the victims.
What about Zionism? I've noticed that Islam extremists didn't come out of nowhere
@@leslie-annmills-gomez8763 Stop.
5:08 minutes into the video, a female reporter, not participating in the conversation, shakes her head as Melanie speaks! Was it an anti-Semitic head shake or Parkinson's?
Please correct yourselves they are Palestinian Hamas
Giles Coren is a rambling bumbling man wow
Totally incoherent.
Civilised people in Ireland 🇮🇪 support Israel 🇮🇱.
They also support the Palestinian people
How on earth can a rational human be civilised and support Israel that is impossible
If the Irish who support the Palestinian terrorists took a trip to Israel they'd seen see the reality and understand and support Israel 💚🩵💚🩵
That dude phoning in is completely coked up. Took him 4 tries to form a sentence.
How can you have a state that has no defined borders? It's ridiculous.
Yes, and the government is a terrorist group.
1967…simple
@trevaudio why didnt and why don't the Palestinians take the deal? Because they want all the land rhst their ancestors stole during the Caliphates.
Israel exists, and that doesn't have any "defined borders"
@@alexgray2482 true! Cos it keeps on trying to gobble up more land for the Greater Israel project (Zios are the ones originally saying From the River to the Sea!
Where is this "state" located?
The Levant.
next to stable of pegasus or burach the flying donkey
Right next to Israel’s internally recognized border.
@@supersocashow3176 is Lebanon & Syria part of the "Levant" ?
@@annaannan6840 last time i checked the internationally recognized borders West Bank was part of the Jordanian Kingdom & Gaza part of Egypt...
Melanie Phillips is one of the few people left in journalism who speaks any sense! This brave straight speaking, strong woman is so right...! Viva Israel! 🇮🇱
You are surely jesting?
@@threedoodles No...not at all!
@@anthonycharnock6560 You know when we are so far apart in our beliefs, I do wonder how there will ever be peace.
I see her as a journalist who supports Israel in, to my mind, and to millions across the world, a campaign of g.......e against the Palestinians.
I guess we are all a product of our upbringing.
And look at the comments here, the way she is bashed for it, and 100% ed hominem. Have never seen this kind of hate against any man saying the same things btw, pure misogyny from these "woke" id*ots.
This is pathetic journalism. Allowing Melanie to spout IDF talking points unopposed is shockingly one sided. What a farce is the times.
And just what were you expecting. Western media excludes Palestinian and Arab voices entirely.
Have you ever seen People responding to Socratic Questions like or just ignoring them because they deconstruct their Narrative:
What’s a Palestinian?
Who gave the Name Palestine and to what Land?
Who are the Indigenous People of Palestine?
Do Jews have the right to a Jewish State in all Countries in the Middle East and North Africa?
What’s the West Bank?
What’s the Legal Status of Gaza and the West Bank?
@@andrew_owens7680 Sorry? I only hear the Palestinian narrative in our media nowadays.
They're not talking points if they are based in truth. You just don't like Jews.
The scope of propaganda against Israel is beyond anything any country has ever has had to endure.
Northern Ireland Independence tooooooooooooooo!
Nobody other than ttthemselves is standing in their way.
The less freeloaders in the UK the better
@@rogerphelps9939 Not true.
@@user-iz9co4qf6z There won't be a UK when they leave, half wit.
Not a bad idea. Better than their current situation, partly in the UK partly in the EU. But over the past 1000 years there have been many people of English and Scottish ancestry moved to Ireland and over the past 200 years many from Ireland that have moved to the UK. It would be more sensible to work out a common constitutional future. But the nutters, myth makers and terrorists would never let it happen.
Has any "just war " ever come under such relentless accusations of "genocide " when there are inevitable civilians casualties in the "crossfire " .Can you imagine if that had happening in WW2 when we were fighting the Germans on all fronts and civilian casualties must have been in the millions (besides the millions of Jews murdered by the Nazis of course ) .
Thats what they want and as usual their first victims are the Jews. These woke psychopaths crave chaos.
There are already two states in Palestine Jordan and Israel and there are a lot of of people in them who's ancestors lived in the mandate of Palestine. The residents of Gaza, who's ancestors left Israel voluntarily, have been given Gaza to look after and the current horror is of their making.
"left Israel voluntarily"
Just like all those people that had to buy their own tickets for Theresienstadt huh?
@@stream2watch That comment is beyond contempt. If you bothered to find out the history you will find that they moved out at the behest of the invading armies intent on destroying Israel. Many chose to stay, these people that stayed have become the 20% of Israel's population that are Arab Israeli.
@@loracle540 No, that is the copout. Besides, you do not actually get to take the land of people just because they are absent for the moment, in that case I'd take your house when you walk down to the grocery store.
Amen.
It is rediculous, may as well recognise Narnia and middle earth at the same time.
Need to hear more from Melanie, what a star, she speaks so much sense,
You should have heard Feijoo's speech in the Spanish Parliament ahead of the EU elections. Besides being all around excellent, the decision by the Pedro Sanchez to recognize a "Palestinian state" was denounced by Feijoo, to a standing ovation, as an affront to Spain. Feijoo's PP party trounced the social democrats a few days ago.
Palestinians are real people, Melanie. They are not invented, not animals...They have lived on thee lands for centuries - unlike the current Israelis who can rarely trace more than two or three generations going back in the Middle east. They deserve statehood. And many Jews agree.
The Palestinian people support Hamas. They absolutely do not deserve statehood, and as was mentioned in the video, nor do they want it. They want all Jews dead and gone from all of Israel. It has been that way since before Israel’s independence. A Palestinian state today would only be used as a springboard for furthering the goal and the war for the annihilation of Israel, just as it was with Gaza.
also, that’s nonsense about the living there for centuries. The majority of Arabs came after Jews had made the land habitable.
The people who call themselves 'Palestinians' are simply Arabs, part of the same Arab nation who live in Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Egypt etc.
Most of their families came into 'Palestine' from these surrounding areas in the 20th century.
The concept of a Palestinian nation was indeed invented as a political ploy to undermine the legitimacy of Israel. Some of their leaders have even admitted as much, e.g. Zuheir Mohsen, a senior leader of the Palestine Liberation Organization (PLO), said in 1977:
"The Palestinian people do not exist. There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are part of one people, the Arab nation. Lo and behold, I have relatives with Palestinian, Lebanese, Jordanian and Syrian citizenship. We are one people. It is only for political reasons that we carefully endorse our Palestinian identity. Indeed, it is of national interest for the Arabs to encourage the existence of the Palestinians in the face of Zionism. Yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity is only for tactical reasons. The establishment of a Palestinian state is a new means to continue the struggle against Israel and for Arab unity."
Whereas there has been a continuous Jewish presence in the land of Israel for more than 3000 years!
@@jeffbenson9090 Palestinians are Arabs in terms of culture, ethnicity. This has never been doubted. In that sense they do not differ much from those in surrounding lands. This whole area was once Arabia before it was divided into nation states by Mostly Europeans. But that doesn't mean a citizen of Jordan has no right to call himself Jordanian, since he and his family going back generations lived on the land and it was their home. Likewise, Palestinian Arabs have the right to call themselves Palestinians since their families living back through countless generations occupied that space. This is natural justice, which most people around the world accept. As for the continuing Jewish presence, the existence of a small community doesn't give that group a legal or moral right to seize large swathes of land from the majority indigenous community, even if they are joined by larger numbers people from the former colonizing countries who are, or claim to be of the same religion as the small ongoing presence.
@@jeffbenson9090 well said
In which borders?
Well, how about using the biblical borders of Israel? That would be the area around Jerusalem, the Sea of Galilee and Jerusalem. That would be a bit cramped but any more than Gaza .Everywhere else should be allocated to the descendants of those who lived elsewhere, you know, the Palestinians.
@@rogerphelps9939 The right of Israel is based on UN Resolution 181, not the Bible.
@@rogerphelps9939 The descendants of those who lived elsewhere? You mean the Jewish diaspora that was expelled in the first century AD and started to return during the last decades of the 19th century?
@@rogerphelps9939 which "palestinians" ? Did you actually read the Bible? No mention of them, sorry.
@@user-yb6eo1xp2f The Bible does not mention a lot of countries and so what?
From Pyrenees to Barcelona
Catalonia shall be free
It's ironic because it just so happens that this yoke is herself, both conceptually and materially, ridiculous.
What on earth is this? So little compassion for Palestinian aka human suffering.
Does she seriously wish us to believe that Catalonia in Spain have a similar experience cf Palestinians in greater Israel (rights, health, living conditions, respect)? She is just preposterous.
The ICC and ICJ have serious charges, and the ghoul is just denying facts that everyone can see.
You just can’t talk to these kinds of people - they simply need to be shown how international law works.
Sadly the facts are on her side. Please stop commenting on things you know nothing about.
@@Tom-le3yyPlease stop trying to curb speech. This is what this lady is trying to do, unsuccessfully.
The international community - and legal system sees the situation very differently from her (and you, evidently).
If you happen to follow anything that this lady has put forward in the public domain (debates, interviews), you will notice that her perspectives are broadly rejected by most reasonable and informed people, to the extent that she appears to have a damaging effect on her broad position. You seem to disagree - which ahould probably give you something to reflect on - rather than trying to silence criticism of her extreme and callous viewpoint.
Many prefer the State of Palestine and do not think it is ridiculous. Israel may be as ridiculous. Imagine those things
Stern gang seething intensifies.
Eire, Spain & Norway have an unfortunate history of antisemitism, so it came as no surprise to hear what the governments there have come up with. It is all so depressingly predictable you could see it coming.
Let's be fair anyone who says or does something israel doesn't like is an anti semite ! It's been like this for decades
LOL. Those famous nahtsess of Norway huh 🤣
Who is Eire? No such place
Ah the universal counter-argument to any criticism of the Israeli government
@@MijinLaw it is the perfect logical error. Be against Palestinian statehood = your views are acceptable. Be for it = hurr durr you are bad and should be ignored. Poisoning the well fallacy as a national pastime.
Wow Asma, you’ve come a long way girl! 😂
What a blusterer that Giles Coren is. Is he the son of the articulate ex-editor of ' Punch' Alan Coren ?
In the Falklands War, there was a total of 3 civilian casualties
As if anyone lives in the falklands compared to Gaza
Virtually all of the Falkland Islands landmass is uninhabited. The only centre of population is Port Stanley. And there was no fighting in Port Stanley itself because the Argentine forces surrendered before the British troops got there. It is really really easy to keep civilian deaths to a minimum when you confine your military operations to areas of land with a population density only fractionally higher than on the dark side of the moon.
@baltasarnoreno5973 Gaza has a higher population density than Washington DC, yet there are very ignorant people who think it's possible to target insurgents without thousands of civilian deaths. Collateral damage is just a fact of war. The guilt from loss of life lies with the aggressor not the victim.
Should Britain have surrendered to avoid those 3 civilian casualties?
@@laserdolphin6483 They don't think that it's possible for Israel to win without civilian casualties. They actually want Israel to lose.
The "Palestinian" Arabs have a state, it's called Jordan.
That’s right, the original two state solution after the Hashemites invaded in 1921!
Oh, and in common with every other Arab nation they hate the so-called “Palestinians”.
The Eastern European have a land it’s called Belarus
@@patabm9786 if that is an attempt to nullify my point, it's poorly phrased & badly executed.
That’s like saying: the native Americans have a state, it’s called a reservation…
@@ikabody
Well Executed phrased one,
the late British author Arthur Koestler, a Jew himself, wrote about the Declaration: “One nation solemnly promised to a second nation the country of a third.”
Interesting to see in these comments, even Times readers can’t stomach Mel P.
Shes a plank first class
Thank you for teaching me a bit of British slang. Yes. In Yiddish she's a shanda.
What type of conversion is this? How you debating about giving people there own home that you took
As she said recognising a Palestinian state is ‘conceptually ridiculous’ then how could Israel offer it over and over then..
Those offer of territorial independence diminishing time after time until it no longer exists as she herself try to explain.
Why should why Palestinians agree with this ?
What is ridiculous here are his misleading words on settlement ideology.
I don't agree with what she is saying but I think you are also misunderstanding her. She is not saying that the recognition of a Palatine state in general is ‘conceptually ridiculous’, she is saying what these countries are doing and the manor in which they are doing it is ridiculous. She is saying it should be done through the negotiated process outlined in the Oslo accords and through a UN sanctioned review. Instead, by unilaterally recognizing it there is no clerical understanding of what the state is.
That is why she said the comment about Catalonia and how equally ridiculous it would be if other nations just declared their independence and recognition for them.
Israel never offered the Palestinians a “state”
@@Alex-vo2ew No one is required to be convinced that Palestine has a territory, a population and a government as these terms are understood under international law. However, it is not forbidden to be either.
To date, Palestine has been recognized by 139 States out of the 193 that make up the United Nations: these are as many States which, through their recognition, have testified to the fact that they believe that Palestine has effectively united the conditions required by international law and already constitutes a State.
Palestine was admitted to the United Nations in 2012 as a non-member observer state; the number of favorable votes would be enough to admit Palestine as a full member of the organization if the procedure was not subject to the right of veto of certain permanent members.
The International Criminal Court admitted in 2021 that Palestine was validly able to ratify the Rome Statute - which is open to “accession by all States” (art. 125).
Certainly, these multiple recognitions cannot by themselves confer state status on Palestine: they are nevertheless all testimonies given in favor of its existence.
She said recognizing it now, externally, is ridiculous, not that it cant be done in negotiations. Though essentially, thats what Israel did 2005-2007 in Gaza and it backfired big time, so I wouldnt expect it to happen again anytime soon.
She is amazing 👏
Melanie Phillips (born 4 June 1951) is a British public commentator. She began her career writing for The Guardian and New Statesman. During the 1990s, she came to identify with ideas more associated with right-wing politics and the far-right and currently writes for The Times, The Jerusalem Post, and The Jewish Chronicle, covering political and social issues from a socially conservative perspective. Melanie Phillips was born in Hammersmith, the daughter of Mabel (née Cohen) and Alfred Phillips. Her family is Jewish and emigrated to Britain from Poland and Russia
Got any substantive disagreements with her comments or did you just want top copy paste Wikipedia?
Yes, she is excellent, isn’t she ?
@@robturvey9156
She’s a discredited clown…..no wonder Israel’s propagandists are a laughing stock
And a fanatical leftist who became a rabid right winger. And racist???
@@robturvey9156no she is awful and inhumane
A Palestine state would work if the Jews living in the West Bank accepted that sovereignty. Otherwise, it's really tricky...
So you don't believe Palestine has a right to exist? That's anti Semitic love......😂
Where is it? What is it? Is this not the authentic voice of English Nationalism in 1890-1921 talking about the ridiculous concept of Irish independence? Compare with Commander Oliver Stillingfleet Locker-Lampson MP CMG DSO Nutcase.
Well said. Of course it is. People who know history have a powerful tool.
I suppose Palestine is the West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem.
The entire world must unilaterally recognize Palestine and Catalonia and Svalbard and Galway.
I don't agree with what she is saying but I think many here are also misunderstanding her and just getting offended by the notion. She is not saying that the recognition of a Palatine state in general is ‘conceptually ridiculous’, she is saying what these countries are doing and the manor in which they are doing it is ridiculous. She is saying it should be done through the negotiated process outlined in the Oslo accords and through a UN sanctioned review. Instead, by unilaterally recognizing it there is no clerical understanding of what the state is and leads to further ambiguity and the possibility of more hostility in the region.
That is why she said the comment about Catalonia and how equally ridiculous it would be if other nations just declared their independence and recognition for them.
Palestine should absolutely receive it's statehood but we need the international community and Palestine and Israel itself to actually negotiate and define what that means. Not 3rd parties.
Brilliant !!!
Basil Faulty 1979.
and is the host Manuel?
Melanie is spot on as always 👏👏👏
Ireland made it clear that it was the border drawn and agreed to at the Oslo accord. Either that woman is dtupid ir being extremely disingenuous.
There was no border drawn in the Oslo accords which btw, were broken by the plo more than 20 years ago.
Independence for Catalonia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Haha - good one Melanie. You're on to them.
The dumbest idea ever!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As the Romans called Israel by the name of Palestina and the Romans were early stage Italians, i say give the Vatican to the Palestinians so we can have a just peace.
Not romans,emperor Hadrian renamed that land.
The spittle on Coren's lips is quite disturbing.
Embarrassing again from Times Radio.
❤❤❤❤
Palestine isn't a country, never was.
@4evaavfc You're a clown, always was
Think you'll find that makes zero difference as to whether or not it can be defined as such at this point in History ( or in the future ) .. borders and countries change over time as does the "name" of any particular territory ... thus does history roll on ...
@@IanSmithFrusionFizzion The point being that any claim to statehood based on a 'historical' Palestine is by definition invalid.
@@baltasarnoreno5973 well , thats one point of view ... actually there is a historical precedent as a "region" of Palestine and also a "state" depending on your point of view ... frankly neither my point of view or yours really matter very much as eventually it seems there will be enough countries in the world that accept that such a "country" exists. The question in hand is when does a state become a state .. ie when enough other states recognise said state is of course on metric ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_of_Palestine#Notes
@@baltasarnoreno5973 thanks for engaging
What was that country used to call before izyrael / PALESTINE HALLO .
What? You do know that the word Palestine was brought in by the Romans AFTER they defeated the Israelites( the original people)
thats the melanie phillips we know....preaching for "greater israel"..and then of course, after that there is "greater greater israel" :( yeah , lets not listen to her, she has beyond bias when it comes to israel :(
Conceptually ridiculous because of where it is? You are speaking on behalf of a nation that does not declare its own borders. Did not prevent the world from recognising you.
They recognized Israel AFTER it became a functioning country with self reliant institutions. Not the giant welfare case that is the plo, that never missed an opportunity to mess up and blame it on Israel. Whose only competition is equally corrupt but also more violent (aka Hamas). Demand higher standards, instead of caving to the most incompetent governing body in the middle east. Dont take my word for it, ask any palestinian that actually lives in the west bank/gaza what they think of their leadership.
They want Syria as well.
Self righteous, zero tolerance, no empathy, always right and worse, no learning
And how is that different from 1980s South Africa?
Born in Hammersmith parents Polish and Russian and she has the right to return ...why
Because it's the Jewish homeland. Just like all the Arabs and Pakistanis born in the UK have the right to move to their countries. By deporting all Jews in their territory in 1948, the Arab countries have proven and legitimised the need for a Jewish state. The Arabs who moved out of that land to make way for the expected campaign of annihilation of the Jews which the Arab countries attempted in 1948 have plenty of land to settle in - they wouldn't even have any trouble assimilating culturally. It's not the Israelis fault that the Arabs treat the "poor Palestinians" they allegedly care for so much like animals and deny them any rights to settle & work in their countries.
Oh and btw, the Palestinians decided to ally themselves to Germany in WWII, so why shouldn't they have to give up some of "their" land, just like Germany had to? Arafat and various other Palestinian leaders have direct ancestral relationships to Haj Amin al-Husseini, Adolphs personal friend.
B.I.B.L.E.
Jews aren't allowed to live in their ancestral homeland, but Arabs are allowed to live anywhere?!
Almost all countries have a right of return.
She doesnt, she has a right to aliya, Israel is a country that was created for ethnic Jews. Genetically of course, it has been proven that at least ashkenzi Jews originate in the levant, but thats not where the right to settle their originates.
All members of the tribe
Maybe they should stop building illegal settlements then. You're the one that's ridiculous.
She should be jailed
Look at Aasmah.😂
Phillips is sickening.
Giles can’t string a sentence together . Journalist ??????
Philips 😂😂😂 always good for a laugh
Palestine wants to be part of Israel but russian backed hamas don't let them.
Giles is the worst...
Is this journalism?? Pathetic and embarrassing
Then don't watch.
I agree that this is very bad journalism. At least the hypocrisy and double standard is now there for all to see
@@baltasarnoreno5973 Hey, I take a shot every time she tells a lie. I'm sloshed.
@@badomen9057 well this is the times of all publications is always going to be heavy double standards
I'm Irish and I humbly apologize for the uneducated populism and incompetent of our politicians.
as another Irish person, look at our history books and tell me how you can support the coloniser aka Israel
You’re not Irish
@@aoifeflynnfallon1434 If I look at the history books, I see that what is now Israel and Palestine is the ancestral homeland of the Jews. The Arabs are actually the colonists.
Furthermore, if I look at the history books, I see that Irish people colonised America, Australia and many other places.
How can you be a coloniser if you are returning to your own lands?@@aoifeflynnfallon1434
It is refreshing to have at least some news sources that are willing to speak the truth.
Complete nonsense
when melanie phillips says something is wrong you can almost be certain it is right.
So you support terrorism
Well said Melanie!
Just another excuse for business as usual. thanks for nothing.
Go knit a Sweater 😂😂
how can you claim a land that you came by boat.
How can they claim a land they been living in 4000 yrs as documented in the old and new testament? Very bizarre isn't it 😅😅😅
How you are asking??? See what Islamists are doing all over Western Europe ,UK and Ireland!! But I guess when it's your people ,then you are blind.
@@Rt2665 by the early twentieth century, indigenous Jews constituted about 10% of the population. And they lived peacefully with the Muslims and Christians.
Empires rise and fall, populations migrate.. you can’t just make a historical or religious claim- that’s irrelevant in LAW!
@@user-mu1vo2ys3x you are right, i agree with you.. but, you would agree that claim is a claim with some weight on it.. x
Who is funding you?
Conceptually ridiculous ??? What about their freedom ? What about their humanity ?? They were there before the Jews so what on earth is this woman going on about ?
Says who? Park well. Jerusalem was never Arab. Jerusalem wasn't mentioned in the Quran. This is Arabs modus operandi to build a Mosque in the ruins of the Old Temple of Jerusalem( Solomon Temple). Read well.
@@obadiahotowo9445 Do not be ridiculous. Jerusalem has been occupied by Arabs for most of it's life, not jews. If you did not know that then i suggest you get an education
No, they werent.
@@robsurname4054 Thanks for mentioning it was occupied, I see that being denied these days two. The religion of peace lol
@@Tom-le3yy As you probably realised, I did not use the word "occupied" to mean oppressing others by military occupation as the Israelis are doing .. I simply meant that Arabs lived (occupied in the common sense of the meaning) there and were the government for most of Jerusalem's lifetime
Yeah, conceptually ridiculous. Sure. You sound just like Brits did when they invaded pretty much everywhere.
Arabs come from the Hejaz region in what is now Saudi Arabia.
@@YorickReturns This makes you sound even more like Brits.
@@prophetsnake Yeah, it's funny to hear Arabs far away from their homeland screaming about Jews "colonising" the Jewish ancestral homeland.
The face of the lady-journalist is more eloquent than all the other speeches
The settlement just go away, why are u so bad to the humains?
Setting up a Jewish homeland against the wishes of those already living there and far exceeding the area historically occupied by Jews prior to the diaspora was well meant but conceptually ridiculous. The establishment of Israel is at the root of most of the problems that have occurred since 1948 in that region.
'those already living there' were Jews. Educate yourself
maybe there needs to be another UN vote, to disband this bloody European Zionist Racist Colonialist experiment in the Middle East.
Remember, the European Zionists still have their passports in their back pockets.
So no actual practical suggestions to solve the problem then, right?
Far exceeding??? Have you looked at a map of the United Kingdom of Israel in the time of David?
Sure, Modern Israel includes the Negev Desert, but historical Israel included much of Southern Lebanon, much of Jordan, and some of Syria.
@@baltasarnoreno5973 Israel backing off to the 1967 borders would be a start.
If the borders of Palestine are not defined, nor are Israel's. What is recognised as Israel includes areas where many Palestinians live, so why Palestine not include areas where Israelis live? Using her arguments, recognising an Israeli state is just as conceptually ridiculous. Either both should be recognised or neither
Palestine is the name of a region, not a country. Please try and get this through your skull
@@jackduane5555 Well, 143 countries out of 193, thats the majority by the way, say it is a country, and almost all the other agree that it will be a country. Please try and get that through your skull
@@josephknott6174 If the Nazis gained enough influence to convince 143 countries to say that they were genetically superior would you accept it?
@@josephknott6174 bandwagon fallacy. Try again
@@jackduane5555 the only thing that makes countries, countries is other countries recognising them, so by applying the bandwagon fallacy you can say every countries isn't a country as they're only countries because everyone said they are. Try again
What an awful segment.
The old lady is making a great case for a single state
Appalling. Shameful interview. Propaganda. 8:11
Ireland has a long track record of being on the correct side of history.
How many civilians died because of Ireland's struggle for independence? Should Ireland cancel its own sovereignty?
@@YorickReturns too many. Should Britain also be tried for war crimes?
@@annagilda1 Yes. You are not allowed to fight, if doing so would endanger any civilian.
What does Ireland have in common with Gaza? They both have no army, dine out on the goodwill of their neighbor and are breeding grounds for terrorism.
How much better the world would be if that were true. @@YorickReturns
When, interviewer, are you going to challenge her? Come on...waiting.
This person is vile. She said on Question Time that there was plenty of food in Gaza. She thinks all the dead children are a made up lie.😕
She's not vile, but you seem to be. The _numbers_ of dead children is a made up lie, made up by Hamas, and even the UN which went with those numbers, quietly halved them already. Also, Hamas considers everyone under 20 to be a child, so every Hamas fighter slain who is 20 or under counts as a "child killed by Israel, " knowing that people like you eat up whatever they say without question.
There is. The deaths were not from famine. But of course, she is the vile one, and not you spewing misinformation from half way across the world, on a conflict you know nothing about, to maybe feel good about your likeley pathetic life. Agents of chaos.
This loonie
Pretending the Israeli occupation of internationally recognized Palestinian lands precludes the concept of Palestinian statehood is conceptually ridiculous.
Big words for saying nothing.
I hope Mel may be guided and recovered from her Islamophobic racist illness and her heart could feel the pain of Palestinians and ego give way to sanity…Let Jews & Palestinians live peacefully in Palestine side by side…
Either people have a right to self-determination or they don't. It's really that simple. If you live in a place like Palestine, Catalonia or Scotland you have a right to govern yourself without inteference if that is what your people want. You have the right to defend yourselves from foreign rulers, anything is acceptable to fight occupation if you have no political avenues to follow. Look at Ireland, everything they did was completley warranted and acceptable. It was us British who were the perpetrators. Anything they did in response to our oppression was completley justified.
Am I to take it that the Jews also have a right to self determination? Or do you deny them the right that you claim for Ireland and the Irish?
Exactly. It really is that simple. No country is better than any other. There is no objective truth.
@@baltasarnoreno5973 Of course they have that right, everyone does. I don't understand what you're even getting at. Does Palestine having self-determination mean Israel loses self-determination? Are you saying Israel doesn't have self-determination right now? I don't get what you're saying. This is like saying interfering with Russia's invasion of Ukraine is removing Russia's self-determination. That's not what self-determination is. Self-determination doesn't mean free license to do whatever you want, it means self-governance.
@@baltasarnoreno5973 A person has the right of group level self determination on the basis of citizenship not on the basis of ethnicity or religious identity.
A Jewish citizen of (for example ) Sweden or in UK have just as much say on questions concerning those countries self determination and/or sovereignty as any of its other citizens..
A Jew in Israel should have just as much say as the Arabic citizens ( neither more or less).
More importantly! The only fair and just solution is obvious.
All persons who lives under the control of a government should have a EQUAL SAY on all matters and elections must be held on the basis of every adult getting one vote each.
Israel needs to choose between whether to control territory outside of Israels recognized borders ( The West Bank and Gaza ) and thereby allow all persons who lives there an equal say in elections and all other matters OR give up any attempt of controlling those territories and ACCEPT and respect the all the residents who live there THEIR RIGHT to form their own SOVEREIGN state……
@@annaannan6840
Self-determination for Jews ? Yes. I'm for it.
Self-determination for Jews _at the cost of Palestinians_ ? I'm against it.
No such thing
The ignorance on display from this guest is astonishing.
How can they sit back and let her spout this easily-refuted garbage