I've had substantial memory issues for the last decade. It seemed to start with my cancer treatment, but I had no idea that other cancer patients had it or that it was actually a documented issue. I always learn so much from SciShow!
Some people can have personality changes, mood swings, and other drastic side effects but it's mostly a memory problem that most people get. An oncologist once told me chemo brain can act like a head injury or brain damage when it comes to side effects.
I'm 22. When I was 2 years old, I had kidney cancer and chemotherapy. Chemo brain continues to be a debilitating part of my life. Thanks so much for making a video about this!
Yeah, my sister has this. She's on chemo and complains about the chemo brain sometimes. Mind you, she's more than a decade passed her original Stage IV diagnosis, and several years after the remission, years where she's gotten to see her newborn grow into a tween., so she definitely likes that part.
I had chemo 19 years ago and realized very quickly that I couldn't remember simple names of things. It terrified me at the time but thankfully my memory came back after a few years. I'm amazed to discover it's a thing.
I'm having chemo for ovarian cancer right now. I have a good outlook, so don't worry. However, I've noticed chemo brain in two quite specific ways. I struggle to recall words that I don't use frequently (usually I have ver fluent conversations). Also, I'm struggling to make small decisions, whereas I usually just make them and move on. I'm very glad it'll go when chemo is finished.
@@martiemedlin9103I had a one week break for a meeting with some surgeons and got my thought clear right away. I've changed to something else now that doesn't give it to me, so in three weeks I should be clear of it altogehter and in a holding pattern until somehting else can be done. Ther are apparently several options but it's a manage as a chronic disease for a while and with the reductin of it fromt he original chemo, I feel much more energetic and with the chemo brain gone, I'll be able to work again, so that'll be just wonderful.
Chemobrain affects more than just the patient. As a husband and caregiver of a survivor, I am still getting used to her chemobrain a couple years after treatment. I most often need to be more patient with her in our conversations, especially when it involves her ability to recall memories (I see the problem more when she's trying to remember data rather than events) since the treatment.
Sean Lamb hey, thanks for sharing. Yeah it does effect everything in orbit of the person effected. I’ve found that for me it’s helpful to write the thing down rather than struggle to say it. It’s like, half of my brain knows what’s up but has been disconnected from the other half. Maybe that’ll be helpful for you guys too?
I had horrible chemo brain with my treatment for stage IV colon cancer, and even had significant trouble a year after completing treatment. My brain has not ‘bounced back’ even after two years. I make silly mistakes, forget minor things, and have trouble with working memory. It was like a forest fire in my brain. They hit me hard with chemo to save my life, but it took a toll.
when i was on chemo, i would walk into a room, forget what i was in there for, walk back, remember, walk back into the room and forget again. Ive been off chemo for almost 3 years now but it still happens a lot at work.
I had chemo for non-cancerous autoimmune condition and I have been experiencing these symptoms, especially working memory and coordination issues. None of my doctors have mentioned CICI.
Hey, thanks for doing this video. I’m going through chemo now and chemo brain has made parts of my life incredibly frustrating. The forgetfulness is one thing, but at times it has been difficult to access my full vocabulary. As a college instructor, this can make things difficult to perform my job when I “know” the right word, but can’t access it to speak it. Thankfully there’s always more than one way to explain things, it’s just not as fluid as it was 18 months ago. Even my therapist was unfamiliar with chemo brain. So hopefully going forward, more people will be able to acknowledge, cope, and be able to adapt to the changes that go on in the brain, whatever the cause may be.
I went through chemo last year. And I've also have had an incredibly hard time accessing my vocabulary as well. I'd be able to see the image of what I want to say but not the word. It's so annoying, and sometimes ppl don't have patience to wait for what I want to say. It's at least once a day. Sometimes I'll end up just describing it instead, if it's possible. But I do get the word eventually just takes me a minute. But I wonder how much worse is going to be as I get older. I'm only 31. I hope it gets better for you, especially since you're teaching.
I had cancer (lymphatic) twice and chemo when I was 2 and 3/4, at adult doses too and i had no idea this was a thing. This explains alot, like alot alot.
For reference for my following rant: I am 5 (coming up on 6) years cancer free When looking back on when I went through chemo, I always realize how foggy my memory is of that time and the months following, I still feel like I struggle with dumb memory things One thing I’ve always been frustrated with post-cancer treatments is when I still have various (and seemingly random) health issues, and so many doctors will just brush it off saying “oh that chemo and radiation is nasty stuff” but this has become my constant, regardless of what I’m struggling with, if there isn’t an obvious answer the doctor just blames it on my cancer treatments
Thank you for this video! I’m a 5 year cancer survivor and this has been part of my life ever since. It’s something I struggle with at work and at home. Your video was wonderful and I hope you understand not only the symptoms for questions. I have often ask myself which is why it’s so hard to find answers how to help myself with this..
There's lots of cognitive side effects from physical and pharmaceutical medical interventions that go unrecognized, unstudied, and all but ignored. Many people who have gone under anesthesia have experienced some sort of cognitive side effects that lingered for weeks, months, or years.
I would like more info on this, I have been under anaesthesia twice in significant amounts... I wouldn't be surprised if the severe depression I experienced was related... and I mean I wasn't sad, I mean, I couldn't feel sadness Nor happiness, empty, nothing... I healed it with Functional Medicine treatment...
@@kristinabaker4433 There's a lot of information from patients out there, mostly anecdotal, but also a few industry articles trying to protect the good name of anesthesiologists. In between there's a few studies and findings that are available. Some of the effects are being examined by some researchers now, but I think it's just the tip of the iceberg. www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/11/141103192130.htm
The real question here is where does the risk outweigh the benefit of the treatment. I think, based on what I've researched in the literature, that anesthesia is a net benefit to the general population. I for one am glad to have had anesthesia while my wisdom teeth were ripped out and my shin put back into place after a football injury saw it poking through my skin. I experienced no long term side effects, and the scientific literature supports that my experience is the norm. Despite bad effects suffered by some individuals, the risk-benefit analysis is massively in favor of anesthetic use.
@@ManfredDudesonVonGuy That's absolutely not the real question here. No one is talking about banning anesthesia or getting rid of it. We're talking about how lots of medications and treatments have unintended cognitive side effects for a lot of people and how it's often overlooked.
This also applies to people with autoimmune diseases, such as Rheumatoid Disease and Lupus, who experience “brain fog.” It needs to be better recognized, as it impairs ability to work, contributing to disability.
I've had terrible short-term (or working) memory since my intensive chemo 13 years ago. From what you're saying it should improve? No sign of that yet. My short term memory is also badly affected by chemo I had 13 years ago...
Chemo brain made me suddenly and completely forget the 4-digit pin code I use to pay for things with my debit card, when I was out shopping for groceries. I had to request the bank to send me a new pin code because I couldn't recall it no matter what. That code was something I use very frequently (obviously) so forgetting it so completely was super weird and kinda funny. I'm 3 years cancer free now. (Hodgin's Lymphoma, nodular sclerosis)
I think every chemo patient should be notified of that possibility but im glad that it actually isn't too widely known. I got a bad feeling people would not get a job anymore and be considered dumb by some employers
As someone who has a partner with Lupus, and has taken lengthy oral and injection based chemo to treat, chemo brain affects her in a very real way. without cancer.
My grandmother deals with this stuff all the time. I forget what she had but she went through it when I was younger, she got more easily frustrated and forgetful. Blew up a bit easier because of it too.
Thank you for this video. I suffer from chemo brain and it is awful. My mind has always been my most treasured thing and to feel like I'm loosing it drives me crazy, frustrated me and terrifies me. My short term is shot. My long term has a few holes and its terribly embarrassing to literally loose all train of thought mid word. Frequently! So thank you so, so much for putting this out there. The more people know it exists the better it is for everyone suffering from it.
Just leaving this comment to cheer things up a bit. When Hank said "in it" I had a flash back to my school days: for some reason everybody was saying "in it" at the end of their sentances all the time - like "yeh like you've got to serve the blancmange could though in it" where "in it" means "haven't you" of course. Like just as bad as "can you borrow me your phone" rather than "can you lend me your phone" - of suggesting that one's phone belongs to them and you are their slave. A lot of people got punched.
At the end of my chemo, I had to carry cards in my pocket, up to 3 at a time, that I could look at when I got confused, which was always. Things like, “make coffee,” “find clean clothes,” “get book to read” etc. It was a year before my thinking process and memory were (almost) normal, and I’m still not back in executive function. No one warned me about this. If I had been warned I would have at least had some understanding of what was (and to some extent is) happening.
Thanks for talking about this. It's been almost 2 years (this August) since I finished chemo and radiation for my breast cancer. The doc put me on the harshest chemo- and I agreed- due to my otherwise good health. I wanted to hit it hard and hit it fast. After 4 treatments (they laid me out!), they switched me to a more tolerable chemo. I think there need to be studies done on whether the less - harsh Taxol is a effective as A/C, and if so, maybe A/C needs to be retired or its use modified. Studies are being done on chemicals called Catechins which cause cancer cells to go through the dying cycle. Catechins don't seem to bother healthy cells, so that would be a plus. Meanwhile, when you visit your grocery's produce, follow your gut and your cravings. Don't try to eat citrus fruits if your body says "no way!" if it's vitamin C you're after, then you can get it in all fresh fruits and vegetables. But if you have a craving for a particular kind of produce, more than likely it means there's something in it that you need, and if you look it up on the Internet, most likely some study is done with it in connection with cancer.
We already know many memory related problems stem from the buildup of certain proteins and 'junk' accumulating in the brain.we Also know that sleep is important for the removal/cleanup of these things under normal circumstances. Add to this many chemo patients have trouble sleeping and it looks like a likely cause of the memory issues, including why they can last so long. Not saying this is the reason but it would seem like an obvious first line of enquiry. Personally l would start by assessing if there is a correlation between reported memory problems and problems sleeping and if there were then conduct a study using sleeping aids(pills, or simply strategies to teach people to sleep better) then compare groups to see if better sleep had a clear effect on memory or not. Of course lots more follow up work would be needed but definitely seems like an obvious way to start.
I was dxed apml leukemia in October 2011. They killed off all my blood and marrow cells. I have no memories the first two weeks. From then til 2015 it's like remembering your childhood. I still have a terrible time losing memories and forgetting what I was going to do within seconds.
So interesting! My working memory is pretty bad because I have ADHD, fascinating how chemo/ cancer treatment could possibly cause symptoms similar to a neurodevelopmental disorder, and if it's the treatment or the cancer that causes this. ADHD is one of the most treatable mental disorders, I wonder if they incorporate memory focused CBT used for ADHD into treating CICI
Hank, where do you get your shirts? I've only seen a couple that I wouldn't wear and most, like the one in this video, I would love to have in my wardrobe.
It reminds me of my dissociative disorder and ptsd. I mean...being diagnosed and treated for cancer probably can be quite traumatic considering you often don't know if you will even survive so maybe there is a link to ptsd?
Whenever studies mention "STRESS" as a possible cause, those of us who know history of science, can only replace that word with the following: "UNKNOWN".... we live in a primitive age.
I haven't had cancer, but I have has a stroke and spinal cord injury before I turned 23. I have had extreme working memory issues since my stroke and although it has improved mostly, fatigue and memory is still a big issue for me. I wonder if it is not just an issue for those undergoing chemo or cancer but just serious health issues and the stress and hard work that you body has to undergo to recover. I don't know but I'm studying psychology now and would love to learn more about
I assumed it was the fatigue. Lots of chronically ill people have cognitive impairment “brain fog” even without meds. The biggest commonality is that fighting your own body is hard.
Hi James. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos like this, with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
It's a nerve agent. And when it spreads through the body it "numbs" some nerve receptacles somewhat. I watched my father go through it, before he died; And I as well for a short time. But the long range effects are in the extremities. The hands and bottom of feet. Heck! I used to run and play basketball. But since the chemo's lasting effect, I'm afraid to take full running strides for fear I'll flop an ankle. My reaction time, is slowed. The hands can't properly feel the ball on occasion. But; I've been in remission since 2013, so that is good. With Chemo, there is a trade off. You may live through it; but you lose other things that are part of a quality of life. And they always tell you it's about quality of life. I guess it depends on each persons perspective.
i think it may be due to fatigue. i experience similar symptoms to chemo brain after dialysis (every treatment). it lasts the entire day (where its really bad) but after a few years, thought processes are harder, as a student ive run across problems where i know the answer, its something ive known for a long time, but i just cant get there. i have many challenges in math, even basic problems- addition/subtraction. i couldnt tell you how many times ive had to sit there and work really hard to solve things like "28+34" before i just give up and use a calculator. i have noticed that the symptoms (or their effects) decrease with certain medications- one of them being nuvigil, which is prescribed to maintain alertness and help those with shift work disorders to stay awake. i and my doctor were both surprised to discover that. its not a miracle drug by any means, but i go from having to hear things multiple times to understand what is said to maybe once or twice. i can make abstract connections again and have a faster response time (something important in my line of work).
Antioxidant foods help, but not just for removing free radicals. There are other chemicals in these foods, like catechins, that scientists are finding they seem to make cancer cells go through the dying cycle. Cancer cells don't die. That's why you have chemo in the first place, to make dividing cells die. But catechins and other nutrients seem to target only cancer cells. I hope the research shows this and help us make better Chemo treatment.
Luckily my doctors and klinic were nice enough to tell me that it might happen and that it is a bit different for each patient. I have it the worst the day of the chemo, it gets better until the next but i'm more clumsy, more forgetful and easily frustrated and as you might see my writing is very bad. I just hope that i can combat the symptoms with a healthy diet and exercise because i want to finish my bachelor in winter. Until then i have my calender to remind me and i take more breaks. Stay strong folks!
I was fortunate enough not to have to go through chemo but I am now on tamoxifen and it has aged my brain by 20 years. And this is just within a few weeks of being on it. I do stupid things and have glitches all the time. It’s super frustrating.
That's an awful one! It needs to be treated. If he's on chemo, he should say the neuropathy is too much; adjust the dose (they're supposed to). There are medicines that help reduce that. Tell his doctor you insist they find one. No one likes to walk on gravel all their lives. Or worse.
I have this thing that is similar to perfectionism but I am not sure it’s that. Sometimes when I make a mistake, I can’t stop thinking of it, kind of weird especially when it’s just among me, and without other people involved. Also if I have homework or something like that, and I thought of an idea for them, it can sometimes be difficult for to concentrate on something else until I do something with that, and sometimes even after I finish it. The thing is sort of like my subconscious tries to force me to think about stuff usually associated with school and mistakes that none else is involved with, and stuff like that too hard and in amount that is not proportional to thier real importance. Anyone has an idea if it is a known disorder, and can you maybe do a video on it?
I had chemo brain. It affected my short term memory. It took me a while to realize this because...it affected my short term memory. This caused some problems.
Hii , my father had brain tumor before 1 year and then we have been completed operation . and that tumor was of cancer stage IV. that was glioblastoma stage IV . we have been completed chemo capsule temozolomide and radiation . then the tumor size is increasing therefor we have taken 6 injection of bevacizumab and irinotecan . even though the tumor size is increasing . then doctor has suggested to take PCV chemotherapy so plz tell me about all side effect of PCV chemotherapy . is it dangerous ? what can happened after PCV chemotherapy ?
inhibition of neurogenesis??? this is the most straight forward explanation, should have definitely been mentioned here... it's a gap in scishow research :(
That's what I've always thought. It seems straightforward, tbh... The whole point of chemo is to prevent cells from regenerating. Neurons would obviously factor in.
Inhibiting hippocampal neurogenesis, and therefore memory-formation? I haven't read anything about that being affected. I'm more leaning towards an inhibition of glial cell function.
@@RBuckminsterFuller either could have been mentioned, definitely any sort of new cells as @Shay writes is missing - also not saying this is proven or anything but it's definitely straight forward to think about it and one remark 'you might think this but it's not the case' would suffice
Most chemo drugs do not cross the blood brain barrier. I had to receive intrathecal chemotherapy to get chemo directly to the spinal column for this reason. (That felt REALLY weird at first ) Also, many chemo drugs target cells which are actively dividing. Brain neurons are notorious for not dividing nor regenerating. Some drugs do damage nerves quite a lot, but they don't cross the BBB (or they would outright kill patients...which has happened, accidentally.)
Hi Bean. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Hmm, I wonder if anti TNFa drugs (which already exist and are frequently used for autoimmjnr disorders) have been tested for that, since it's thought that mainly TNFa causes it.
My most complete solution would seem possible to me to be a diet including the 3:6:9, Nac+ because it uses a pathway that helps ameliorate homo-cysteine, also use of this pathway may help keep the enzyme levels appropriate. Also blueberries or an extract of such. Lastly, a CDB oil may be helpful. Along with the "free" radical treatments currently used.
Seems as though they could study people who are treated with chemo who don't have cancer (patients with severe R.A., etc). Study their brains before and after to see if they're similar to the cancer patients. That would help answer the question of if it's chemo brain or cancer brain I'd guess?
Chemo brain sounds quite similar to fibro fog. Perhaps the chemo or the cancer causes too much stress on the body, and that causes the fog, and the same goes for things like fibro, or even mental illnesses that affect cognition. I also know someone who recently finished chemo and then started to experience fibromyalgia symptoms - I was wondering if perhaps it could be a trigger for that. I've heard that stress can trigger fibro (extreme stress of course). Could be connected in some way? But hey we can all hang out in UA-cam comments making up theories :')
Wow, watching the video and reading comments, chemo brain sounds pretty similar to the cognitive issues I deal with coz of ADHD and autism. I wouldn't wish the frustration with your own brain on anybody.
Hi Hugo. I see you like science. I'm starting doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you might like it. I'll d¡be so grateful if you can check it out and tell me what do you think about. Thanks ^^
Hold on, doesn't this make total sense given the importance of neurogenesis in memory/the hippocampus and thus if you're taking drugs/treatment that decrease cell division (to fight rapidly dividing cells aka cancer) then it'd be expected to lose neurogenesis in the hippocampus and thus have a negatively affected memory?
Not decrease it, kill off dividing cells altogether. This is why you often have sores in the mouth, because that is one of the few places where cells divide rapidly.
Hi Joy. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
It’s not that difficult. People who do drugs can get brain damage. So why wouldn’t dumping gallons of toxic chemicals into a persons body have the same effect? I had an amazing brain prior to chemo. I never had to write anything down because my memory was superior compared to the average person. They’ve known there’s non toxic ways to reverse cancer for many many decades. Yet they refuse to use these ways. And they continue to find new chemicals to use for cancer treatment.
And exercise. And eat well. And sleep well. And pray and love, too. I would not have survived without prayer and devotional and my religion. Whatever you do spiritually, do it every day. It will save your life quite literally.
This is phenomenally slow grasp for research, when we already know that the trickle of new neuronal emplacement underlies memory formation in the hippocampus. That would mean chemo's assault on dividing cells is affecting the stem cell progenitors still active in neurogenesis, apparently across multiple brain regions. Actually this means more neurogenesis in brain regions where it has been yet to be confirmed, like the coordination effects meaning populations in the cerebellum!
I hate when that happens because one time I came up with a great character to draw but then I just suddenly forgot about it and remembered it a few months later
Having 2 rounds of deadly chemo for a stem cell transplant... yea it is a thing. Can't remember names, for example. I could tell you all about a person or thing - everything, but the name.
After Hours is real short, so go for that if you have little time. Tangents is a happy middle with a good bit of structure and silliness. HFS is pretty random, but the production value is high and it has a rotating cast of hosts that lends a lot of variety.
Hi Bobby. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Hi Littaly. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Hi Lisa. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Hi David. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
I've had substantial memory issues for the last decade. It seemed to start with my cancer treatment, but I had no idea that other cancer patients had it or that it was actually a documented issue. I always learn so much from SciShow!
my aunt had chemo brain! I never knew it was a thing other people experienced, I thought it was just being exhausted from such intensive treatment.
Some people can have personality changes, mood swings, and other drastic side effects but it's mostly a memory problem that most people get. An oncologist once told me chemo brain can act like a head injury or brain damage when it comes to side effects.
I'm 22. When I was 2 years old, I had kidney cancer and chemotherapy. Chemo brain continues to be a debilitating part of my life. Thanks so much for making a video about this!
Yeah, my sister has this. She's on chemo and complains about the chemo brain sometimes. Mind you, she's more than a decade passed her original Stage IV diagnosis, and several years after the remission, years where she's gotten to see her newborn grow into a tween., so she definitely likes that part.
Wow! Congratulations to your sister!
As a breast cancer survivor, it’s so nice to see someone validating that this is a very real thing that is happening to patients.
My hospital advised me it was one off the side effects.
I had chemo 19 years ago and realized very quickly that I couldn't remember simple names of things. It terrified me at the time but thankfully my memory came back after a few years. I'm amazed to discover it's a thing.
I'm having chemo for ovarian cancer right now. I have a good outlook, so don't worry. However, I've noticed chemo brain in two quite specific ways. I struggle to recall words that I don't use frequently (usually I have ver fluent conversations). Also, I'm struggling to make small decisions, whereas I usually just make them and move on. I'm very glad it'll go when chemo is finished.
They say that chemo brain can last 10 years after the chemotherapy. But, every person is different.
@@martiemedlin9103I had a one week break for a meeting with some surgeons and got my thought clear right away. I've changed to something else now that doesn't give it to me, so in three weeks I should be clear of it altogehter and in a holding pattern until somehting else can be done. Ther are apparently several options but it's a manage as a chronic disease for a while and with the reductin of it fromt he original chemo, I feel much more energetic and with the chemo brain gone, I'll be able to work again, so that'll be just wonderful.
wr
Chemobrain affects more than just the patient. As a husband and caregiver of a survivor, I am still getting used to her chemobrain a couple years after treatment. I most often need to be more patient with her in our conversations, especially when it involves her ability to recall memories (I see the problem more when she's trying to remember data rather than events) since the treatment.
That's gotta be tough on you.. How's she faring now compared to two years ago?
Sean Lamb hey, thanks for sharing. Yeah it does effect everything in orbit of the person effected. I’ve found that for me it’s helpful to write the thing down rather than struggle to say it. It’s like, half of my brain knows what’s up but has been disconnected from the other half.
Maybe that’ll be helpful for you guys too?
I had horrible chemo brain with my treatment for stage IV colon cancer, and even had significant trouble a year after completing treatment. My brain has not ‘bounced back’ even after two years. I make silly mistakes, forget minor things, and have trouble with working memory. It was like a forest fire in my brain. They hit me hard with chemo to save my life, but it took a toll.
when i was on chemo, i would walk into a room, forget what i was in there for, walk back, remember, walk back into the room and forget again. Ive been off chemo for almost 3 years now but it still happens a lot at work.
Oof
@@dannyagunbia206 OooOoOOoOOoOoooooffff
Cancer free for 7 years, and I had to ask my wife how long because my memory is shot. That reads like it should be a joke.
I had chemo for non-cancerous autoimmune condition and I have been experiencing these symptoms, especially working memory and coordination issues. None of my doctors have mentioned CICI.
Hey, thanks for doing this video. I’m going through chemo now and chemo brain has made parts of my life incredibly frustrating. The forgetfulness is one thing, but at times it has been difficult to access my full vocabulary. As a college instructor, this can make things difficult to perform my job when I “know” the right word, but can’t access it to speak it. Thankfully there’s always more than one way to explain things, it’s just not as fluid as it was 18 months ago.
Even my therapist was unfamiliar with chemo brain. So hopefully going forward, more people will be able to acknowledge, cope, and be able to adapt to the changes that go on in the brain, whatever the cause may be.
I went through chemo last year. And I've also have had an incredibly hard time accessing my vocabulary as well. I'd be able to see the image of what I want to say but not the word. It's so annoying, and sometimes ppl don't have patience to wait for what I want to say. It's at least once a day. Sometimes I'll end up just describing it instead, if it's possible. But I do get the word eventually just takes me a minute. But I wonder how much worse is going to be as I get older. I'm only 31. I hope it gets better for you, especially since you're teaching.
I had cancer (lymphatic) twice and chemo when I was 2 and 3/4, at adult doses too and i had no idea this was a thing. This explains alot, like alot alot.
For reference for my following rant: I am 5 (coming up on 6) years cancer free
When looking back on when I went through chemo, I always realize how foggy my memory is of that time and the months following, I still feel like I struggle with dumb memory things
One thing I’ve always been frustrated with post-cancer treatments is when I still have various (and seemingly random) health issues, and so many doctors will just brush it off saying “oh that chemo and radiation is nasty stuff” but this has become my constant, regardless of what I’m struggling with, if there isn’t an obvious answer the doctor just blames it on my cancer treatments
That's awful! At least when I bring them up, my Oncologist -and psychiatrist-try to find a solution.
Thank you for this video! I’m a 5 year cancer survivor and this has been part of my life ever since. It’s something I struggle with at work and at home. Your video was wonderful and I hope you understand not only the symptoms for questions. I have often ask myself which is why it’s so hard to find answers how to help myself with this..
There's lots of cognitive side effects from physical and pharmaceutical medical interventions that go unrecognized, unstudied, and all but ignored. Many people who have gone under anesthesia have experienced some sort of cognitive side effects that lingered for weeks, months, or years.
+
I would like more info on this, I have been under anaesthesia twice in significant amounts... I wouldn't be surprised if the severe depression I experienced was related... and I mean I wasn't sad, I mean, I couldn't feel sadness Nor happiness, empty, nothing...
I healed it with Functional Medicine treatment...
@@kristinabaker4433 There's a lot of information from patients out there, mostly anecdotal, but also a few industry articles trying to protect the good name of anesthesiologists. In between there's a few studies and findings that are available. Some of the effects are being examined by some researchers now, but I think it's just the tip of the iceberg.
www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/11/141103192130.htm
The real question here is where does the risk outweigh the benefit of the treatment. I think, based on what I've researched in the literature, that anesthesia is a net benefit to the general population. I for one am glad to have had anesthesia while my wisdom teeth were ripped out and my shin put back into place after a football injury saw it poking through my skin. I experienced no long term side effects, and the scientific literature supports that my experience is the norm. Despite bad effects suffered by some individuals, the risk-benefit analysis is massively in favor of anesthetic use.
@@ManfredDudesonVonGuy That's absolutely not the real question here. No one is talking about banning anesthesia or getting rid of it. We're talking about how lots of medications and treatments have unintended cognitive side effects for a lot of people and how it's often overlooked.
I think I'm gonna become a Patron today! :) That's the kind of podcast I LOVE to listen to
This also applies to people with autoimmune diseases, such as Rheumatoid Disease and Lupus, who experience “brain fog.” It needs to be better recognized, as it impairs ability to work, contributing to disability.
Yes, I have noticed this effect on someone who is taking methotrexate for treating psoriatic arthritis.
I've had terrible short-term (or working) memory since my intensive chemo 13 years ago. From what you're saying it should improve? No sign of that yet. My short term memory is also badly affected by chemo I had 13 years ago...
Chemo brain made me suddenly and completely forget the 4-digit pin code I use to pay for things with my debit card, when I was out shopping for groceries. I had to request the bank to send me a new pin code because I couldn't recall it no matter what. That code was something I use very frequently (obviously) so forgetting it so completely was super weird and kinda funny. I'm 3 years cancer free now. (Hodgin's Lymphoma, nodular sclerosis)
I think every chemo patient should be notified of that possibility but im glad that it actually isn't too widely known. I got a bad feeling people would not get a job anymore and be considered dumb by some employers
As someone who has a partner with Lupus, and has taken lengthy oral and injection based chemo to treat, chemo brain affects her in a very real way. without cancer.
Wish I'd known about this phenomenon when my Dad was being treated.
Why is that?
@@UnderstandingCode to better deal with the situation
My grandmother deals with this stuff all the time. I forget what she had but she went through it when I was younger, she got more easily frustrated and forgetful. Blew up a bit easier because of it too.
Thank you for this video. I suffer from chemo brain and it is awful. My mind has always been my most treasured thing and to feel like I'm loosing it drives me crazy, frustrated me and terrifies me. My short term is shot. My long term has a few holes and its terribly embarrassing to literally loose all train of thought mid word. Frequently! So thank you so, so much for putting this out there. The more people know it exists the better it is for everyone suffering from it.
Just leaving this comment to cheer things up a bit. When Hank said "in it" I had a flash back to my school days: for some reason everybody was saying "in it" at the end of their sentances all the time - like "yeh like you've got to serve the blancmange could though in it" where "in it" means "haven't you" of course. Like just as bad as "can you borrow me your phone" rather than "can you lend me your phone" - of suggesting that one's phone belongs to them and you are their slave. A lot of people got punched.
At the end of my chemo, I had to carry cards in my pocket, up to 3 at a time, that I could look at when I got confused, which was always. Things like, “make coffee,” “find clean clothes,” “get book to read” etc. It was a year before my thinking process and memory were (almost) normal, and I’m still not back in executive function. No one warned me about this. If I had been warned I would have at least had some understanding of what was (and to some extent is) happening.
A friend of mine is almost finished going through chemotherapy. Thankfully he hasn’t had any memory issues.
Thanks for talking about this. It's been almost 2 years (this August) since I finished chemo and radiation for my breast cancer. The doc put me on the harshest chemo- and I agreed- due to my otherwise good health. I wanted to hit it hard and hit it fast. After 4 treatments (they laid me out!), they switched me to a more tolerable chemo. I think there need to be studies done on whether the less - harsh Taxol is a effective as A/C, and if so, maybe A/C needs to be retired or its use modified.
Studies are being done on chemicals called Catechins which cause cancer cells to go through the dying cycle. Catechins don't seem to bother healthy cells, so that would be a plus.
Meanwhile, when you visit your grocery's produce, follow your gut and your cravings.
Don't try to eat citrus fruits if your body says "no way!" if it's vitamin C you're after, then you can get it in all fresh fruits and vegetables.
But if you have a craving for a particular kind of produce, more than likely it means there's something in it that you need, and if you look it up on the Internet, most likely some study is done with it in connection with cancer.
We already know many memory related problems stem from the buildup of certain proteins and 'junk' accumulating in the brain.we Also know that sleep is important for the removal/cleanup of these things under normal circumstances. Add to this many chemo patients have trouble sleeping and it looks like a likely cause of the memory issues, including why they can last so long.
Not saying this is the reason but it would seem like an obvious first line of enquiry. Personally l would start by assessing if there is a correlation between reported memory problems and problems sleeping and if there were then conduct a study using sleeping aids(pills, or simply strategies to teach people to sleep better) then compare groups to see if better sleep had a clear effect on memory or not. Of course lots more follow up work would be needed but definitely seems like an obvious way to start.
I was dxed apml leukemia in October 2011. They killed off all my blood and marrow cells. I have no memories the first two weeks. From then til 2015 it's like remembering your childhood. I still have a terrible time losing memories and forgetting what I was going to do within seconds.
So interesting! My working memory is pretty bad because I have ADHD, fascinating how chemo/ cancer treatment could possibly cause symptoms similar to a neurodevelopmental disorder, and if it's the treatment or the cancer that causes this.
ADHD is one of the most treatable mental disorders, I wonder if they incorporate memory focused CBT used for ADHD into treating CICI
Hank, where do you get your shirts? I've only seen a couple that I wouldn't wear and most, like the one in this video, I would love to have in my wardrobe.
Not sure where you live but winners or Marshall's has similar ones! Or maybe H+M
When I'm stressed I have trouble remembering, learning and thinking in general. Having cancer and intense treatment could simply be very stressful
do an episode on fibromyalgia. i have it and i would love to see y’alls ideas on it
it's a very fuzzy disease mostly treated with antidepressants. We don't know enough yet
They already did one!
I hope this eventually gets figured out
Reminds me of my Fibro. Or Fibro Fog. And medications to treat ptsd.
It reminds me of my dissociative disorder and ptsd. I mean...being diagnosed and treated for cancer probably can be quite traumatic considering you often don't know if you will even survive so maybe there is a link to ptsd?
Whenever studies mention "STRESS" as a possible cause, those of us who know history of science, can only replace that word with the following: "UNKNOWN".... we live in a primitive age.
Yikes, I forget enough things as it is...
@JIM LUNN Making Matzo ball soup lol
@JIM LUNN how about "zoinks"?
I haven't had cancer, but I have has a stroke and spinal cord injury before I turned 23. I have had extreme working memory issues since my stroke and although it has improved mostly, fatigue and memory is still a big issue for me. I wonder if it is not just an issue for those undergoing chemo or cancer but just serious health issues and the stress and hard work that you body has to undergo to recover. I don't know but I'm studying psychology now and would love to learn more about
I assumed it was the fatigue. Lots of chronically ill people have cognitive impairment “brain fog” even without meds. The biggest commonality is that fighting your own body is hard.
Could this drug also aid those with Alzheimer's, dimentia, or other long term neurodegenerative diseases
It's possible. Chemo does cause neuropathy. (They adjust the doses for that.) And when the nervous system is involved, so is the brain.
It might, chemo brain can sometimes act similar to brain damage and an oncologist once told me it was essentially chemical induced brain damage.
Hi James. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos like this, with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Quark up
Upload schedule?
Hi @@jamesbaxterfirst , once a week ( I'll try ) on Wednesdays.
Jokes on you chemo, my organ was removed and the cancer along with it. BOOYA!
Nice!!
@JIM LUNN yup, I ain't got no brain no moars.
No brain = No chemo brain
This checks out.
Booya !
Good question here.
Why do you get goosebumps when listing to music?
NEW PODCAST!!!!!! YAYYYYYY!!!!11!11`~~~!!!
It's a nerve agent. And when it spreads through the body it "numbs" some nerve receptacles somewhat.
I watched my father go through it, before he died; And I as well for a short time. But the long range effects are in the extremities. The hands and bottom of feet.
Heck! I used to run and play basketball. But since the chemo's lasting effect, I'm afraid to take full running strides for fear I'll flop an ankle. My reaction time, is slowed. The hands can't properly feel the ball on occasion. But; I've been in remission since 2013, so that is good.
With Chemo, there is a trade off.
You may live through it; but you lose other things that are part of a quality of life.
And they always tell you it's about quality of life. I guess it depends on each persons perspective.
Ketatmine helps to regrow lost connections.
Then again it IS Ketamin
I've been learning a large variety of subjects.
As an bedside Oncology RN, can confirm. My patients lose a step after the chemo, especially IT chemo.
I've a similar thing from being on Colchicine for 15 years almost.
it sounds like having cancer and chemo just makes people depressed
i think it may be due to fatigue. i experience similar symptoms to chemo brain after dialysis (every treatment). it lasts the entire day (where its really bad) but after a few years, thought processes are harder, as a student ive run across problems where i know the answer, its something ive known for a long time, but i just cant get there. i have many challenges in math, even basic problems- addition/subtraction. i couldnt tell you how many times ive had to sit there and work really hard to solve things like "28+34" before i just give up and use a calculator. i have noticed that the symptoms (or their effects) decrease with certain medications- one of them being nuvigil, which is prescribed to maintain alertness and help those with shift work disorders to stay awake. i and my doctor were both surprised to discover that. its not a miracle drug by any means, but i go from having to hear things multiple times to understand what is said to maybe once or twice. i can make abstract connections again and have a faster response time (something important in my line of work).
If it’s oxidative stress, does eating more antioxidants help...?
Antioxidant foods help, but not just for removing free radicals. There are other chemicals in these foods, like catechins, that scientists are finding they seem to make cancer cells go through the dying cycle. Cancer cells don't die. That's why you have chemo in the first place, to make dividing cells die. But catechins and other nutrients seem to target only cancer cells. I hope the research shows this and help us make better Chemo treatment.
Luckily my doctors and klinic were nice enough to tell me that it might happen and that it is a bit different for each patient. I have it the worst the day of the chemo, it gets better until the next but i'm more clumsy, more forgetful and easily frustrated and as you might see my writing is very bad. I just hope that i can combat the symptoms with a healthy diet and exercise because i want to finish my bachelor in winter.
Until then i have my calender to remind me and i take more breaks.
Stay strong folks!
I was fortunate enough not to have to go through chemo but I am now on tamoxifen and it has aged my brain by 20 years. And this is just within a few weeks of being on it. I do stupid things and have glitches all the time. It’s super frustrating.
Lori Vance I hope they can find something to help with your mental fog. Best wishes
I have never had chemo and yet I have spent large parts of my adult life with chemo brain.
Do chemo neuropathy, my brother is suffering from that
That's an awful one! It needs to be treated. If he's on chemo, he should say the neuropathy is too much; adjust the dose (they're supposed to). There are medicines that help reduce that. Tell his doctor you insist they find one. No one likes to walk on gravel all their lives. Or worse.
I have this thing that is similar to perfectionism but I am not sure it’s that.
Sometimes when I make a mistake, I can’t stop thinking of it, kind of weird especially when it’s just among me, and without other people involved.
Also if I have homework or something like that, and I thought of an idea for them, it can sometimes be difficult for to concentrate on something else until I do something with that, and sometimes even after I finish it.
The thing is sort of like my subconscious tries to force me to think about stuff usually associated with school and mistakes that none else is involved with, and stuff like that too hard and in amount that is not proportional to thier real importance.
Anyone has an idea if it is a known disorder, and can you maybe do a video on it?
That happens in liver failure patients too. Weird.
I had chemo brain. It affected my short term memory. It took me a while to realize this because...it affected my short term memory. This caused some problems.
Hii , my father had brain tumor before 1 year and then we have been completed operation . and that tumor was of cancer stage IV. that was glioblastoma stage IV . we have been completed chemo capsule temozolomide and radiation . then the tumor size is increasing therefor we have taken 6 injection of bevacizumab and irinotecan . even though the tumor size is increasing . then doctor has suggested to take PCV chemotherapy so plz tell me about all side effect of PCV chemotherapy . is it dangerous ? what can happened after PCV chemotherapy ?
inhibition of neurogenesis??? this is the most straight forward explanation, should have definitely been mentioned here... it's a gap in scishow research :(
That's what I've always thought. It seems straightforward, tbh... The whole point of chemo is to prevent cells from regenerating. Neurons would obviously factor in.
Inhibiting hippocampal neurogenesis, and therefore memory-formation? I haven't read anything about that being affected. I'm more leaning towards an inhibition of glial cell function.
@@RBuckminsterFuller either could have been mentioned, definitely any sort of new cells as @Shay writes is missing - also not saying this is proven or anything but it's definitely straight forward to think about it and one remark 'you might think this but it's not the case' would suffice
Most chemo drugs do not cross the blood brain barrier. I had to receive intrathecal chemotherapy to get chemo directly to the spinal column for this reason. (That felt REALLY weird at first )
Also, many chemo drugs target cells which are actively dividing. Brain neurons are notorious for not dividing nor regenerating. Some drugs do damage nerves quite a lot, but they don't cross the BBB (or they would outright kill patients...which has happened, accidentally.)
@@lekeAchgeketum good point, thanks! Guess it would've been equally as easy to think about that ;)
I thought it was already known to be due to chemo patients not producing new neurons. At least, that what was claimed in a TED talk.
Chemo is sometimes used to treat lupus. Does chemo brain happen in those cases, or primarily/strictly with cancer?
Hi Bean. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Chemo stops new cells and synapses forming in hypothalamus
Hmm, I wonder if anti TNFa drugs (which already exist and are frequently used for autoimmjnr disorders) have been tested for that, since it's thought that mainly TNFa causes it.
Wondering if Hank felt this first hand?
My most complete solution would seem possible to me to be a diet including the 3:6:9, Nac+ because it uses a pathway that helps ameliorate homo-cysteine, also use of this pathway may help keep the enzyme levels appropriate. Also blueberries or an extract of such. Lastly, a CDB oil may be helpful. Along with the "free" radical treatments currently used.
I'm going to show this to my employer to hopefully get an extra "second chance". :D
Seems as though they could study people who are treated with chemo who don't have cancer (patients with severe R.A., etc). Study their brains before and after to see if they're similar to the cancer patients. That would help answer the question of if it's chemo brain or cancer brain I'd guess?
It's a possible research route.
Chemo brain sounds quite similar to fibro fog. Perhaps the chemo or the cancer causes too much stress on the body, and that causes the fog, and the same goes for things like fibro, or even mental illnesses that affect cognition.
I also know someone who recently finished chemo and then started to experience fibromyalgia symptoms - I was wondering if perhaps it could be a trigger for that. I've heard that stress can trigger fibro (extreme stress of course). Could be connected in some way?
But hey we can all hang out in UA-cam comments making up theories :')
Wow, watching the video and reading comments, chemo brain sounds pretty similar to the cognitive issues I deal with coz of ADHD and autism. I wouldn't wish the frustration with your own brain on anybody.
I just found out I have Chromehidrosis or the pseudo kind. Please do that. The www is actually quite stingy on the info
The problems/symptoms sounds just like my ADHD... 🤔
Hi Hugo. I see you like science. I'm starting doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you might like it. I'll d¡be so grateful if you can check it out and tell me what do you think about. Thanks ^^
Same!
Hold on, doesn't this make total sense given the importance of neurogenesis in memory/the hippocampus and thus if you're taking drugs/treatment that decrease cell division (to fight rapidly dividing cells aka cancer) then it'd be expected to lose neurogenesis in the hippocampus and thus have a negatively affected memory?
Not decrease it, kill off dividing cells altogether. This is why you often have sores in the mouth, because that is one of the few places where cells divide rapidly.
5:45-6:13
I have been through chemo. I lost lots of my memories.
That is sad
I’m so sorry
Cici. Sounds like how I talk to my cat.
What about HIV meds? Mine have horrible side effects and im certain theyve taken a toll on my cognitive state
I am patient zero for PRE ADOLESCENT bone marrow transplant. 'LL HELP YOU FIND OUT...
Ci Ci, reminds me of someone!
Ever heard of pregnancy brain ? I have had it and this sounds similar.
Hi Joy. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
It’s not that difficult. People who do drugs can get brain damage. So why wouldn’t dumping gallons of toxic chemicals into a persons body have the same effect? I had an amazing brain prior to chemo. I never had to write anything down because my memory was superior compared to the average person. They’ve known there’s non toxic ways to reverse cancer for many many decades. Yet they refuse to use these ways. And they continue to find new chemicals to use for cancer treatment.
Daily reminder to go outside & breathe some fresh air
And exercise. And eat well. And sleep well. And pray and love, too.
I would not have survived without prayer and devotional and my religion. Whatever you do spiritually, do it every day. It will save your life quite literally.
Ginny Jolly
Spirituality is a scam. I find was more pleasure In knowing I don’t believe in fairy tales.
This is phenomenally slow grasp for research, when we already know that the trickle of new neuronal emplacement underlies memory formation in the hippocampus. That would mean chemo's assault on dividing cells is affecting the stem cell progenitors still active in neurogenesis, apparently across multiple brain regions. Actually this means more neurogenesis in brain regions where it has been yet to be confirmed, like the coordination effects meaning populations in the cerebellum!
i cant stop reading it as tseetsee
The moment Walter White forgot that he cooked meth
SciShow After hours is that a rehash of HFS?
scishow tangents is more like hfs, after hours is much shorter
I hate when that happens because one time I came up with a great character to draw but then I just suddenly forgot about it and remembered it a few months later
Having 2 rounds of deadly chemo for a stem cell transplant... yea it is a thing. Can't remember names, for example. I could tell you all about a person or thing - everything, but the name.
okay, so between holy F#ing science, scishow tangents and now after hours, which of these should I be listening to and why?
After Hours is real short, so go for that if you have little time. Tangents is a happy middle with a good bit of structure and silliness. HFS is pretty random, but the production value is high and it has a rotating cast of hosts that lends a lot of variety.
So treating cancer gives you ADD.
4:30 pan 811
Just put my brain in a jar and feed it oxygen, glucose, and information. Also, remove all the gunk my brain cells produce
You forgot the critical fats, proteins, minerals and vitamins.
@@4G12 I guess if it were easy to sustain a human brain outside of the body, we'd be doing it ;-)
Maybe they're just distracted by the deadly diseases.
Hi Bobby. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
loneliness be over
This week in sci-yans? Sorry, no, that was terrible :
Hi Littaly. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
Who knows someone who's undergone chemo🙋
I've gone through it. Repeatedly.
how does this comment contribute to conversation at all?
@@nyctodrome6187 I know someone who's gone through it because I'VE gone through it...how is that unclear?
@@AlthenaLuna I don't think the reply was targeted at you, you're fine.
Myself. I have been through it.
Maybe it's chemo.
Hi Lisa. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^
1000th like. Second time that's happened to me!
Hi David. I think you like science, so I would like to recommend my channel. I'm starting at doing science videos with motion graphics, and I think you are going to like it if you give me one opportunity. Thanks for your time ^^