Hello Grim. When considering ship Classes, one must keep in mind the use to which the ship is designed to function. Cruisers come in three Classes. Light, Medium, and Heavy or 'Battle' Cruiser Classes. Unlike what most people think when seeing Lt, Med, Hvy... this is NOT a measure of their size, or mass. Although that does play a part in their classification. "Cruisers" are a general classification of a given size and mass range. Larger than previous ships like Destroyers and Frigates, but smaller than Battleships, Dreadnoughts, or Super Dreadnoughts. What determines the sub-class of Cruisers from each other other than mass and size is their Function in a Fleet. Light Cruisers have a higher thrust to mass ratio than their slower cousins, for which they sacrifice Armor, Weaponry, and Cargo. On the other end, the Heavy Cruisers sacrifice speed and maneuverability for additional Armor and Weapons. The Medium Cruiser balances all these factors somewhat equally. 'Light' Cruisers are designed to be faster than other Cruisers because they are usually tasked with hunting down and killing lighter Class ships. For their size and mass, they are fairly fast and maneuverable, and able to take repeated hits by the much lighter armed smaller vessels, while carrying enough firepower to defeat and destroy them. 'Heavy' Cruisers are primarily tasked with supporting even larger Classes of ships as a 'screen', and in multiples of their Type, can take down Battleships and Dreadnoughts. This is due to them having a 'relatively' heavier armament and armor over the other types of Cruisers, and their being much faster and more maneuverable than their 'prey'. 'Medium' Cruisers are the 'standard' by which the others are compared and classified. Generally able to do most of what both the others can do, but not nearly as well. A Medium Cruiser would never catch the smaller, faster, more lightly armed and armored classes, so it has to rely upon misdirection, stealth, and both tactical and strategic surprise to 'bag' its prey. Mediums take a pounding from larger ship classes, and usually a Battleship or larger Class can destroy them in short order. But enough Mediums can 'swarm' a larger, slower, more heavily armed and armored foe... eventually, although losses would be very large in number. There is more to be said about this entire concept, but I would refer anyone needing more clarification to read up on Naval Warfare and Ship Classes. Even though the 'theater' of war is Space, and not the surfaces of oceans, the concepts still will remain, in a future where the vast numbers, sizes, and masses of space ships will need organization. Oh, and for any 'Star Wars' fans out there: Star Destroyers are NOT 'Destroyer' Class ships! The would be classified as Dreadnoughts or Super Dreadnoughts! speaking, Frank-ly
@@GrimDarkNarrator thank you for the high praise. I like to think that I am at least minimally educated on most topics, and that i can speak somewhat from a stance of solid knowledge on most things that interest me.
Many consider the Battlecruiser to be separate from the Heavy, though I'm sure you're aware of this. With Battlecruisers frequently acting as flagships for detached cruiser units, or even acting as the smallest capital ships in a formation, rather than being part of the screen. This depends on the doctrine of the navy in question, obviously. Either way, cruisers in general; and the Heavy and Battlecruisers in particular; as they say, "can kill anything they can catch, and can escape anything that could return the favour."
@@bob_the_barbarian Agreed. Battle Cruisers can and do dish out the pain, and can run from heavier classes fairly easily.. although, having said that, it still requires that said Cruiser stay out of the Heavier Ship's weapons ranges! Yes, the Battle Cruiser can take a few hits from larger foes, but only a fool relies upon their relatively thinner defenses for long. "Speed is Life" is an old aphorism, and in this case, very true for the Battle Cruiser. As a 'Command Ship' for a Cruiser formation, it has the firepower to tilt an encounter into the formation's favor, while being armored enough to shrug off hits that would disable the other Cruisers. Where balance is found is having those lighter ships able to dart in and out, acting as a sort of 'mobile' shield or 'sharing the armor' to enable the slightly slower Battle Cruiser to maneuver as needed.
@@franksmedley8619 Indeed, but the demise of the capital ships in recent years has changed things, unless you want to consider a carrier to be a capital ships... Frankly, I don't. However, the modern networked defenses, ECM/ECCM, counter-missiles, and CWIS have made the whole thing even more interesting. I'd lost interest in naval warfare until I read Weber's Harrington series. It revitalized my interest by taking old doctrine and adding new technologies. 10/10 I recommend it.
I find it interesting that they put the effort in for these things, but I still think, just looking at the artwork, that it’s pretty clear they didn’t want to elevate any if these to a very interesting status. I mean it’s understandable - the stars of the Battletech show were always clearly meant to be the mechs. But it REALLY shows when looking at their space stuff and Aerotech stuff.
Novel wise, the Cruiser class is the most represented, with the Soyuz,Aegis and Avalon classes being in the most. In almost every Naval engagement, there is a Cruiser involved. Armament wise, these are all great ship killers. However, the SLDF had the same problem as the Empire in Star Wars; lack of anti fighter protection. The doctrine of the time was that the best defense against fighters was another fighter. Most Warships destroyed during the Amaris Coup and the Succession Wars were lost to fighters. Most of the post Star league designs ( such as the Avalon's) carried a much larger point defense armament. Unfortunately for the Inner Sphere, the Jihad did just what the Succession Wars did; destroyed most of the Warships and the capability to produce them.
I would think that indeed cruisers would be much more prevalent in regular engagements as they are smaller but still pack a punch compared to battleships. Its also obviously easier to make more of them.
@@GrimDarkNarrator You are quite correct Grim. Cruisers are far more easily constructed than Battleships or larger classes. In the same time to construct a Battleship, which would 'only' equal about twice the firepower of a Battle Cruiser, the same Construction Yard could easily construct at least four or five of said Cruisers. Numbers. Now we run into the Stalin Effect: "Quantity, as a Quality all of it's own".
There is one thing that was missed here about the Black Lion class: The Tripitz affair - in which one such vessel played the central role long after the class was believed to be extinct. To anyone interested, here is a video on that: ua-cam.com/video/DRWUkq_R6Os/v-deo.html
@@GrimDarkNarrator I seem to remember the same trick in the Shadowrun books as well. Money, it's probably about money. White is free to print. Not many Shadowrun lore vids here on youtube, wink wink.
Shame warships became a rarity and production value of them halted for awhile. I see a lot potential in many battletech warships. Ones created during and after clan wars are particularly interesting in my opinion
They were common before the Exodus and Succession Wars. Then almost all became lost/destroyed during the succession wars, and only make a reappearance after the clan invasion when the Inner Sphere gets access to old technology again.
Battletech has got some truly obscure stuff. Like the Rotunda a sports car with a large laser and an srm 2.
Hello Grim.
When considering ship Classes, one must keep in mind the use to which the ship is designed to function. Cruisers come in three Classes. Light, Medium, and Heavy or 'Battle' Cruiser Classes. Unlike what most people think when seeing Lt, Med, Hvy... this is NOT a measure of their size, or mass. Although that does play a part in their classification. "Cruisers" are a general classification of a given size and mass range. Larger than previous ships like Destroyers and Frigates, but smaller than Battleships, Dreadnoughts, or Super Dreadnoughts.
What determines the sub-class of Cruisers from each other other than mass and size is their Function in a Fleet. Light Cruisers have a higher thrust to mass ratio than their slower cousins, for which they sacrifice Armor, Weaponry, and Cargo. On the other end, the Heavy Cruisers sacrifice speed and maneuverability for additional Armor and Weapons. The Medium Cruiser balances all these factors somewhat equally.
'Light' Cruisers are designed to be faster than other Cruisers because they are usually tasked with hunting down and killing lighter Class ships. For their size and mass, they are fairly fast and maneuverable, and able to take repeated hits by the much lighter armed smaller vessels, while carrying enough firepower to defeat and destroy them.
'Heavy' Cruisers are primarily tasked with supporting even larger Classes of ships as a 'screen', and in multiples of their Type, can take down Battleships and Dreadnoughts. This is due to them having a 'relatively' heavier armament and armor over the other types of Cruisers, and their being much faster and more maneuverable than their 'prey'.
'Medium' Cruisers are the 'standard' by which the others are compared and classified. Generally able to do most of what both the others can do, but not nearly as well. A Medium Cruiser would never catch the smaller, faster, more lightly armed and armored classes, so it has to rely upon misdirection, stealth, and both tactical and strategic surprise to 'bag' its prey. Mediums take a pounding from larger ship classes, and usually a Battleship or larger Class can destroy them in short order. But enough Mediums can 'swarm' a larger, slower, more heavily armed and armored foe... eventually, although losses would be very large in number.
There is more to be said about this entire concept, but I would refer anyone needing more clarification to read up on Naval Warfare and Ship Classes. Even though the 'theater' of war is Space, and not the surfaces of oceans, the concepts still will remain, in a future where the vast numbers, sizes, and masses of space ships will need organization.
Oh, and for any 'Star Wars' fans out there: Star Destroyers are NOT 'Destroyer' Class ships! The would be classified as Dreadnoughts or Super Dreadnoughts!
speaking, Frank-ly
You should write my scripts, sir. You are a fountain of information :D
@@GrimDarkNarrator
thank you for the high praise. I like to think that I am at least minimally educated on most topics, and that i can speak somewhat from a stance of solid knowledge on most things that interest me.
Many consider the Battlecruiser to be separate from the Heavy, though I'm sure you're aware of this.
With Battlecruisers frequently acting as flagships for detached cruiser units, or even acting as the smallest capital ships in a formation, rather than being part of the screen. This depends on the doctrine of the navy in question, obviously.
Either way, cruisers in general; and the Heavy and Battlecruisers in particular; as they say, "can kill anything they can catch, and can escape anything that could return the favour."
@@bob_the_barbarian Agreed. Battle Cruisers can and do dish out the pain, and can run from heavier classes fairly easily.. although, having said that, it still requires that said Cruiser stay out of the Heavier Ship's weapons ranges! Yes, the Battle Cruiser can take a few hits from larger foes, but only a fool relies upon their relatively thinner defenses for long. "Speed is Life" is an old aphorism, and in this case, very true for the Battle Cruiser. As a 'Command Ship' for a Cruiser formation, it has the firepower to tilt an encounter into the formation's favor, while being armored enough to shrug off hits that would disable the other Cruisers. Where balance is found is having those lighter ships able to dart in and out, acting as a sort of 'mobile' shield or 'sharing the armor' to enable the slightly slower Battle Cruiser to maneuver as needed.
@@franksmedley8619 Indeed, but the demise of the capital ships in recent years has changed things, unless you want to consider a carrier to be a capital ships... Frankly, I don't.
However, the modern networked defenses, ECM/ECCM, counter-missiles, and CWIS have made the whole thing even more interesting.
I'd lost interest in naval warfare until I read Weber's Harrington series. It revitalized my interest by taking old doctrine and adding new technologies.
10/10
I recommend it.
I find it interesting that they put the effort in for these things, but I still think, just looking at the artwork, that it’s pretty clear they didn’t want to elevate any if these to a very interesting status.
I mean it’s understandable - the stars of the Battletech show were always clearly meant to be the mechs. But it REALLY shows when looking at their space stuff and Aerotech stuff.
All branches of the military in battletech are NOT equal :D
Novel wise, the Cruiser class is the most represented, with the Soyuz,Aegis and Avalon classes being in the most. In almost every Naval engagement, there is a Cruiser involved. Armament wise, these are all great ship killers. However, the SLDF had the same problem as the Empire in Star Wars; lack of anti fighter protection. The doctrine of the time was that the best defense against fighters was another fighter. Most Warships destroyed during the Amaris Coup and the Succession Wars were lost to fighters. Most of the post Star league designs ( such as the Avalon's) carried a much larger point defense armament. Unfortunately for the Inner Sphere, the Jihad did just what the Succession Wars did; destroyed most of the Warships and the capability to produce them.
I would think that indeed cruisers would be much more prevalent in regular engagements as they are smaller but still pack a punch compared to battleships. Its also obviously easier to make more of them.
@@GrimDarkNarrator You are quite correct Grim. Cruisers are far more easily constructed than Battleships or larger classes. In the same time to construct a Battleship, which would 'only' equal about twice the firepower of a Battle Cruiser, the same Construction Yard could easily construct at least four or five of said Cruisers. Numbers. Now we run into the Stalin Effect: "Quantity, as a Quality all of it's own".
There is one thing that was missed here about the Black Lion class: The Tripitz affair - in which one such vessel played the central role long after the class was believed to be extinct. To anyone interested, here is a video on that: ua-cam.com/video/DRWUkq_R6Os/v-deo.html
Thanks for the share.
@@GrimDarkNarrator You are welcome.
Thanks for the vid sir.👍🏼👍🏼
You're very welcome!
Warships are cool:)
Indeed.
Ah the Black Lion cruiser...aka The Tripitz. LOL
I really look forward to the battletech lore.
Good to hear.
Another fine video ..!
Thank you!
awesome stuff. can't wait for more. I just ordered a bunch of warship and aerospace miniatures. got the clan refit of the black lion though.
Hope they arrive soon.
What is it with Fasa only inking half of the background black? It's jarring.
Maybe having the whole background black is too much.
@@GrimDarkNarrator I seem to remember the same trick in the Shadowrun books as well. Money, it's probably about money. White is free to print. Not many Shadowrun lore vids here on youtube, wink wink.
Shame warships became a rarity and production value of them halted for awhile. I see a lot potential in many battletech warships. Ones created during and after clan wars are particularly interesting in my opinion
👍
Warships are extremely rare in the battle tech Universe right?
they were between the first succession war and clan invasion.
They were common before the Exodus and Succession Wars. Then almost all became lost/destroyed during the succession wars, and only make a reappearance after the clan invasion when the Inner Sphere gets access to old technology again.