The question is.... will the ever happen to the most unimposing purple unit in the game - Halberdier Sergeants??? I saw someone post in one place 'the only way HS will ever be any good if if they get a retinue unit like the new cheveliers'
Rattan Vipers are one of my first units. Love em! They are sort of blue Houndsmen, with more range, no dogs, and slightly less damage / versatility. I REALLY want arrow rain for them, but have been unable to get it so far. I ran into a longsword with Shenjis on a wall, figting over the high ground as a maul. We both parked our units and rngaged the others unit in melee. I fully expected to lose my unit, but for some reason their numbers stayed constant. All of a sudden, a kill notification popped up.
I am happy that other people are finally coming to enjoy my rattan vipers. They carried me out of tithe early game until I could get some solid meta units and honesty one of my favorite units still.
So these guys or bagpipes/ alchemists as a support unit? Is it better to mitigate damage (and deal a bit back), boost your units' attack, or heal your units? Based on this video their debuff might be a bit overtuned when compared to other t3 units, especially support units. But it is always nice to have a blue unit have its moment in the spotlight. You could even switch one of the doctrines for a blue health doctrine so they are even tankier
These guys only have 2,000 hp at max level lol. Blue doctrine is a massive % increase! They only look tanky becauase it takes seven hits to kill one when you only do 300 damage haha
Same! I was looking for another support unit for my warband and then took them along... I noticed that their targets were getting eaten alive... so slowed down the action and realised what was going on :D
for me rattan units are a hidden gem from the other units especially rattan rangers since they are look trash but once we can use them well then you can obliterate anything . (Although their armor is flammable since they are made out of papers with high slashing defense and low blunt defense
They used to be absurdly OP back in the day, but now they are very poor performers which is why they are never used. Was there something special about them that you've found?
I started to play around the end of season 2, this unit was very meta, there almost wasn't a siege without them, I wanted them as I liked how they slowed enemy heroes, by how strong I thought they were, I thought that they were namkhans, because they said that the nams were the "strongest" archer unit at the time, so when I unlocked them I was pretty confused as why they didn't slow, I only found out way way later that they weren't the vipers
I ran the unit training test with namkhans vs spearmen and 3 died and about 5 more were red. I actually recorded it, but my wife is in the back ground telling me she changed our bank password lol. This is on NA3 server and as we already know, units are different on NA vs EU servers. I wish I knew what all units were different and how so. This might explain why it seems EU players seem to spam range units and sit back.
Been enjoying these vipers as a dual blade, this season gives runes that do extra damage to poisoned targets. I've been having a great time along with my own shuriken poison lol.
The new shuriken build is really deadly - I watched a CBL game where one entire team went DB and spammed shuriken's until there were no enemy left... it was crazy!
In my game the node says that the dmg get from poison is reduced but not that enemys make less dmg. Can anyone tell me if its a bug in translation or if they changed that maybe in last patch.
The vipers and the cross bow version of them were always my preferred archer class mostly the vipers if I want range that works while spending as little points as possible. Archers are a good class and everyone prob should have at least 1.
The general view is that archers are outclassed by muskets at the moment which makes me sad - because when you stand behind the line and shoot of course muskets are better, but, if a player uses the arrow arcs to volley into otherwise unreachable spots, they can be very effective
@@cameronmcclintock8394 I think it Is only wrong description and it works properly, but I dont test it. Because it dont make sense, 5% dmg reduction vs poison is literally useless, but i dont know...
Man, I love this unit too. There is lot of hate on this unit on reddit and other forum compare to Namkhans, but this unit have a lot more utility. You say debuff long only 4s, so the poison last 4s too. I am just curios how much dmg single tick of poison dot is? Do you know numbers, compare to Namkhans?
The poison damage ticks are very low, they do roughly 60-200/tick which is MUCH lower than Houndsmen or Namkhans - but of course Namkhans can't slow or debuff their target (Houndsmen can but they are a gold unit)
almost all rattan units are decent, the swordmens while not amazing are an ok unit, the pikemen have some decent dmg, and the marksmen, as most people should know, are really good at shredding heros and less armored units. tbh i feel like the rattan vipers just get outshadowed by other archer/range units because they dont do high dmg.
Yeah they are all pretty good, but they get second place a lot: Ironcap swords slightly better than Roundshields, Pike Militia slightly better than Ratpikes, Ironcap bow riders slightly better than Rattan Rangers lmao! The vipers are def not about the damage, like the Bagpipes and Alchemists they assist other units.
OMG I''ve been playing these guys since I like their green arrow rain and units that inflict poison since the damage can add up pretty quickly but never did I pay attention to the damage debuff lol
Aren't Marksmen just Vipers on steroids with better accuracy as well as higher fire rate at the cost of range and Rangers just Vipers and Marksmen mashed together on horses? Thats what they feel like to me anyway. Also since you've done a video on their archer comrades, why not do one on the Pikemen? May as well right?
There is a Rattan Pike guide under the guides tab :) Marksmen are definitely a higher damage unit, but their poison does not debuff like Marksmen do. Rangers same, they have a damage tick but I'm pretty sure they don't have a debuff (It's not like I play Rangers very often... maybe I should check?). The debuff is the key with Vipers, you know when you heroes jumped in an only did 1/4 health to the unit? Well Vipers at max have 2,000hp... those heroes did a total of 500hp. Thats the magic :)
Really? I always figured the poison weapons of all the Rattan units aside from the Roundshields caused a attack debuff. I don't have the Rangers atm so can't really say for them.
Weird, people join pretty much every day. Message me Knightstalker#4152 and I'll send you an invite. Pikes are countered by ranged and heroes primarily, but also shock troops... and cav (because they face only one direction)
@@johanasgutenberg5578 on my game they tooltip says that dmg take from poison is less not that inflikted enemys deal less dmg. Dont know if its a false translation or if they changed it with a patch.
@@KnightStalker Yes i have had them since they came out. they used to be required for rattan rangers. I'm assuming you play the frontier version of the game?
Yes I play mostly on Frontier but also on MG. I do not have vipers on MG. I've been discussing this with other creators (who play on different severs) and they seem to feel that while the numbers might be inconsistent, the general debuff is "a lot" on their servers too.
Hey... I was wondering, in my game it says: "reduces dmg taken from poisoned enemies by 5% each level". Was the unit nerfed in these last 8 months or is it just rephrased for being EU1 server, or whatever reason. Im kinda new to the game, i go back and forth with it. But often i start to level i unit, and it becomes trash, over and over again xD Can someone clarify if the Rattan Vipers still reduce the enemy dmg overall, or just against themselves? Also, Rattan Pikemen have a veterancy passive that says "they take less dmg from poison", which sounds terrible.
I believe there are translation errors between the two versions, as you say. An aside: Never judge a unit that is not max level. A level 20 unit is not even close to as good as it can be at 30 - the power difference is very significant
I have an arrow rain doctrine just sitting there...i will try this unit. Maybe you can also make a fire archer video...they are as good as this one....heroes dont have fireproof 😉
After seeing this and beeing a commander/caller in TW´s, i am instantly thinking about a way to implement those boys in a TW setup xD Those debuffs could easily nullify enemy pushes. But honestly, never thought those Rattan were such a good support unit.
I really never thought that I would be impressed by rattan vipers. It's like every unite you use become super strong.
Practice, practice, practice :)
Yeah these guys were a surprise!
The question is.... will the ever happen to the most unimposing purple unit in the game - Halberdier Sergeants???
I saw someone post in one place 'the only way HS will ever be any good if if they get a retinue unit like the new cheveliers'
@@Debbiebabe69 Turns out this post aged well :)
Its very interesting to watch how you make/discover usually useless/unpopular units to be killing machines. Hope for more vids like that
The stale meta drives me to do insane things :)
@@KnightStalker The one good thing about current meta
Rattan Vipers are one of my first units. Love em! They are sort of blue Houndsmen, with more range, no dogs, and slightly less damage / versatility. I REALLY want arrow rain for them, but have been unable to get it so far. I ran into a longsword with Shenjis on a wall, figting over the high ground as a maul. We both parked our units and rngaged the others unit in melee. I fully expected to lose my unit, but for some reason their numbers stayed constant. All of a sudden, a kill notification popped up.
Hahaha! Awesome :D
Be interesting to see if there are visibly more Rattan Vipers in play now :)
i've been waiting for a vid like this. this unit was my go to ranged unit when i was low level. very good unit
Yeah I got them very early on too, but debuffing Reapers and T5 cav is not something I'd tried before haha
I think we are about to see a lot more of these on the battle field especially if EVO notices
That would be so cool to see :)
I am happy that other people are finally coming to enjoy my rattan vipers.
They carried me out of tithe early game until I could get some solid meta units and honesty one of my favorite units still.
Turns out they were great all along :)
@@KnightStalker sadly only for frontier servers mainly. They’re still fun but don’t pack quite the punch that they do on frontiers.
So these guys or bagpipes/ alchemists as a support unit? Is it better to mitigate damage (and deal a bit back), boost your units' attack, or heal your units?
Based on this video their debuff might be a bit overtuned when compared to other t3 units, especially support units. But it is always nice to have a blue unit have its moment in the spotlight.
You could even switch one of the doctrines for a blue health doctrine so they are even tankier
These guys only have 2,000 hp at max level lol. Blue doctrine is a massive % increase!
They only look tanky becauase it takes seven hits to kill one when you only do 300 damage haha
Mate, you always manage to surprise me, keep it up!
Beats playing keshigs and reapers :)
Could you make a video about what the actual meta unit are right now?
wow didn't expect this unit to be this powerful.
Same! I was looking for another support unit for my warband and then took them along... I noticed that their targets were getting eaten alive... so slowed down the action and realised what was going on :D
for me rattan units are a hidden gem from the other units especially rattan rangers since they are look trash but once we can use them well then you can obliterate anything . (Although their armor is flammable since they are made out of papers with high slashing defense and low blunt defense
I do have a soft spot for the Rat-men :)
I loathe you, sir, for making this video and causing my future battles filled with this unit.
Great video anw, good work!
I just had a battle with impotent keshigs trying to stab them lol. It was a great time!
Knights stalker may I recommend to try to put a video on rattan rangers since they are so rare to see in battles .
They used to be absurdly OP back in the day, but now they are very poor performers which is why they are never used. Was there something special about them that you've found?
I started to play around the end of season 2, this unit was very meta, there almost wasn't a siege without them, I wanted them as I liked how they slowed enemy heroes, by how strong I thought they were, I thought that they were namkhans, because they said that the nams were the "strongest" archer unit at the time, so when I unlocked them I was pretty confused as why they didn't slow, I only found out way way later that they weren't the vipers
They are still great but really shine supporting major combat like deathballs
Skill description changed to "Each level reduces damage taken from poison by 5%"? (Though seems to still reduce enemies damage over all)
That appears to be a mistranslation on the MG sever, though some people are saying they cant replicate the results so maybe its more?
I would like to see a comparison with the Namkan archers.
I ran the unit training test with namkhans vs spearmen and 3 died and about 5 more were red. I actually recorded it, but my wife is in the back ground telling me she changed our bank password lol. This is on NA3 server and as we already know, units are different on NA vs EU servers. I wish I knew what all units were different and how so. This might explain why it seems EU players seem to spam range units and sit back.
Thanks Johanas, I get similar results :)
Awesome video! Want an Arrow Rain doc even more now. :D
Good luck on the RNG! Arrow rain? Best I can do is three breakthroughs and a move and fire musket doc
Been enjoying these vipers as a dual blade, this season gives runes that do extra damage to poisoned targets. I've been having a great time along with my own shuriken poison lol.
The new shuriken build is really deadly - I watched a CBL game where one entire team went DB and spammed shuriken's until there were no enemy left... it was crazy!
glad I saw this so soon so I can use it before it gets nerfed
Vipers OP, plz nerf lol
Is this still working? "To the Bone" now states: Each level reduces damage taken from poison by 5%?
Yes its working, I think that node description is wrong on the MG servers
Are they better than the Namkhan?
I have watched many of your videos and learned a lot from them. Thank you very much.
They are better support than Namkhans but Nams do a lot more damage.
You're very welcome, glad you found them helpful :)
In my game the node says that the dmg get from poison is reduced but not that enemys make less dmg.
Can anyone tell me if its a bug in translation or if they changed that maybe in last patch.
Test it. I have people saying it works and that the text on the nodes is wrong and at least one person saying it doesnt
My thickened poison honor upgrade gives 10% weakness ability. Not sure why? I'm on NA3 server.
Odd, usually server differences are only cosmetic
@@KnightStalker what server are u on. I'm not getting same results
Lotus Ash
@@KnightStalker IS this the frontier version of the game? I just checked all the servers for regular CB and none of them have those nodes.
The vipers and the cross bow version of them were always my preferred archer class mostly the vipers if I want range that works while spending as little points as possible. Archers are a good class and everyone prob should have at least 1.
The general view is that archers are outclassed by muskets at the moment which makes me sad - because when you stand behind the line and shoot of course muskets are better, but, if a player uses the arrow arcs to volley into otherwise unreachable spots, they can be very effective
I tried them and they pretty much make sure that your deathball wins against the enemy deathball. I'd choose this unit over Namkhans
Indeed, I hear some people saying its not as atrong as what I've tested but nonetheless the utility remains!
On NA east, those nodes reduce poison damage taken :(
Thats ok, the damage is not important. Its all about the debuffs :)
@@KnightStalker no I mean instead of the veterancy node where it increases weakness to enemies it reduces poison damage
Oh, weird
@@cameronmcclintock8394 I think it Is only wrong description and it works properly, but I dont test it. Because it dont make sense, 5% dmg reduction vs poison is literally useless, but i dont know...
Yea this doesn't work at all on NA east. Just did the test myself. Our nodes are completely different
9:20 is extra brutal because dogs also reduce damage :D
omg... that's dirty, I didn't even notice that!
Man, I love this unit too. There is lot of hate on this unit on reddit and other forum compare to Namkhans, but this unit have a lot more utility. You say debuff long only 4s, so the poison last 4s too. I am just curios how much dmg single tick of poison dot is? Do you know numbers, compare to Namkhans?
The poison damage ticks are very low, they do roughly 60-200/tick which is MUCH lower than Houndsmen or Namkhans - but of course Namkhans can't slow or debuff their target (Houndsmen can but they are a gold unit)
weakness lasts for 7s actually. vipers are just amazing (and pikes even better :P)
Wow, two positive things in my life today. Another great Knightstalker vid and a self test. And both kinda poisonous. Thanks!
The great Snake God has blessed you :)
almost all rattan units are decent, the swordmens while not amazing are an ok unit, the pikemen have some decent dmg, and the marksmen, as most people should know, are really good at shredding heros and less armored units. tbh i feel like the rattan vipers just get outshadowed by other archer/range units because they dont do high dmg.
Yeah they are all pretty good, but they get second place a lot: Ironcap swords slightly better than Roundshields, Pike Militia slightly better than Ratpikes, Ironcap bow riders slightly better than Rattan Rangers lmao!
The vipers are def not about the damage, like the Bagpipes and Alchemists they assist other units.
OMG I''ve been playing these guys since I like their green arrow rain and units that inflict poison since the damage can add up pretty quickly but never did I pay attention to the damage debuff lol
That's... that's the BEST BIT :D
Aren't Marksmen just Vipers on steroids with better accuracy as well as higher fire rate at the cost of range and Rangers just Vipers and Marksmen mashed together on horses? Thats what they feel like to me anyway.
Also since you've done a video on their archer comrades, why not do one on the Pikemen? May as well right?
There is a Rattan Pike guide under the guides tab :)
Marksmen are definitely a higher damage unit, but their poison does not debuff like Marksmen do. Rangers same, they have a damage tick but I'm pretty sure they don't have a debuff (It's not like I play Rangers very often... maybe I should check?).
The debuff is the key with Vipers, you know when you heroes jumped in an only did 1/4 health to the unit? Well Vipers at max have 2,000hp... those heroes did a total of 500hp. Thats the magic :)
Really? I always figured the poison weapons of all the Rattan units aside from the Roundshields caused a attack debuff. I don't have the Rangers atm so can't really say for them.
I hate that every time I watch KnightStalker use an obscure unit, I have to max level them the same day.
Hidden gems!
So... do you hate it.... or do you love trying new things instead of stale Meta? :)
I bet you not-secretly love it hahaha!
@@KnightStalkerGems indeed. I'm a medium armor Longsword.. what Meta?
Great job! Keep up!
does this currently work? , because I do not see that they reduce the damage
Yes, the video is only a couple weeks old.
@@KnightStalker i try again and is working. EU1
I can’t join the discord the address is unvalid :( Random question cuz I couldn’t find answers for my question:What counters Pike units:)
Weird, people join pretty much every day. Message me Knightstalker#4152 and I'll send you an invite.
Pikes are countered by ranged and heroes primarily, but also shock troops... and cav (because they face only one direction)
@@KnightStalker thanks:)
is this a new buff? I dont remember the damage reduction being a thing
Turns out it was in front of us the whole time :)
@@KnightStalker It doesn't work on the NA servers. Do you have a discord server so i can send you some screenshots of the vet nodes?
@@johanasgutenberg5578 on my game they tooltip says that dmg take from poison is less not that inflikted enemys deal less dmg.
Dont know if its a false translation or if they changed it with a patch.
@@reneherzberger445 ya it's been debunked, this doesn't work on CB only on Frontier
Did you test it? I have people saying it works and that the text on the nodes is wrong
So that why 4 mauls died rushing and trying to kill my rattan vipers. I brought them as a meme unit.
Haha FOUR??? Thats awesome :D
@@KnightStalker Yes four, for some reason most of the match I'm in has an average of 2-4 mauls on the enemy team.
Love it.
Keep being amazing brother. Longsword Best Sword!
STRONGSWORD BEST SWORD
What server are you on? This isn't working on NA it's completely different.
LA.
Have you got the unit tree nodes done as well?
@@KnightStalker Yes i have had them since they came out. they used to be required for rattan rangers. I'm assuming you play the frontier version of the game?
Yes I play mostly on Frontier but also on MG. I do not have vipers on MG.
I've been discussing this with other creators (who play on different severs) and they seem to feel that while the numbers might be inconsistent, the general debuff is "a lot" on their servers too.
I've been trying to tell folks this for a long time now. That poison is dirtyyyyy
Sooo dirty!
Hey... I was wondering, in my game it says: "reduces dmg taken from poisoned enemies by 5% each level". Was the unit nerfed in these last 8 months or is it just rephrased for being EU1 server, or whatever reason.
Im kinda new to the game, i go back and forth with it. But often i start to level i unit, and it becomes trash, over and over again xD
Can someone clarify if the Rattan Vipers still reduce the enemy dmg overall, or just against themselves? Also, Rattan Pikemen have a veterancy passive that says "they take less dmg from poison", which sounds terrible.
I believe there are translation errors between the two versions, as you say.
An aside: Never judge a unit that is not max level. A level 20 unit is not even close to as good as it can be at 30 - the power difference is very significant
I have an arrow rain doctrine just sitting there...i will try this unit. Maybe you can also make a fire archer video...they are as good as this one....heroes dont have fireproof 😉
Great idea!
Upvote before watching, because Vipers
Vipers STRONK!
I'm not super numbers and testing for hours sorta guy, but if you do send me a message I'd be very keen to hear some harder data!
How long does their damage debuff last for?
About 4 seconds from last application, each new hit appears to renew it
this unit might be the most enoying unit in the game!
I have a good time with them :)
thank you
Glad you liked it :)
Thumbnail 💯 got me lol
Thanks for hearing me out :)
My vipers are often my MVPs. You do have to be very very careful where you set them up though.
One musket bomb and its sad face all the way back to supply!
@@KnightStalker It happens....but i bring 3 ranged units anyway lol.
nice guide, keep it up
Glad you liked it, thanks for commenting :)
Absolute mad-lad.
Vipers, outta NOWHERE!
I can only imagine what those heroes were thinking when they suddenly do 300 damage with a skill lmao!
im really glad this only has 5k views.......and that i was one of them!
Secret knowledge :)
:O what??? Keep finding hidden gems. Thanks for the video.
Who'd have thought, eh? I'm enamored with them now :D
ok this is kinda nuts wow
Indeed! Very powerful low key
Now I need to save my honor and try these bad bois
They are lots of fun and I'd love to see the look on peoples faces when their skills do 300 damage haha
"laughs in musket bombs" XD
"cries in 2,000hp"
this is why i love rattan marksman, pure machine gun poison
PS -KS full toughness- yet :D
I'm pretty much always playing full toughness at the moment :)
OK, let's start testing :)...
Please do!
I'd be keen to see someone really work out the exact figures - send me a message on discord if you get some hard numbers!
love this video, sharing it with my house =)
It's crazy right? Hope you find a use for them :)
After seeing this and beeing a commander/caller in TW´s, i am instantly thinking about a way to implement those boys in a TW setup xD
Those debuffs could easily nullify enemy pushes.
But honestly, never thought those Rattan were such a good support unit.
Stack them with Houndsmen... I'll leave that one to your imagination :)
15 Vipers and all heroes go Nodachi for maximum lulz? ;-)
@@nerfharder554 imperial spear guards finding out nobody has melee or cavalry: EZ
@@ailajanelleconcepcion6940 15 vipers and all heroes go Maul then. Thanks for pointing out the flaw in my devious plan.
Testing testing…. Hearing hearing……
Glad you liked it :)
Thanks never imagened! :)
Quite the surprise :)
@@KnightStalker yes!!! :)
🤯🤯
Who'd have thought, eh? :D
Why 3am 😂😂😂
My kids talk about "xyz thing gone wrong at 3am" videos they watch so maybe I'm just in vogue with the young ones!
Holy F***!
Yah. Who'd have thought?
@@KnightStalker Quick follow up question...is the unit identical in EU as well? Like the debuff abilities and stuff?
DAMN not actual anymore=(
Whats changed? :)
@@KnightStalker vet line. Damage reduced only to them. Not to heroe or ally
think you over hype them abit but jzzzzzzzzzz they are dirty
Oh yeah I'm def hyping them up, but their abilities are real too!
Rattan vipers about to be nerfed now 😂😂
Haha low key OP
wtf mate
Poison is the new meta ;)