2K through mine. Zero issues and cleaned and lubed before first 1k and cleaned and 1k total to 2K and cleaned and lube. Impressive pistol and first 2011. Carried striker fire in duty for 19 years but not anymore.
I had a lot of the same issues people have complained about with their Prodigies with my C2. I finally traded it in towards an XC. I’ve got the 2019 P, XC, and XL. I love them all with zero issues. I’ve got both prodigies as well with zero issues from the 4.25 after a few thousand rounds. And only 6 failures within the first 500 round break-in period on the 5”. None since. It’s a great platform in general
Ya i think he didn't lube it again because he mentioned he re-cleaned it but not lubed again. I have 2k through mine as well, no malfunction. I have rented polymer guns and had bad malfunctions. The latest one is p365 macro trigger spring.
I don't have a C2 but I do have a P. Nearly 5,000 rounds through it with zero failures. The failure to lock back so often might be caused by riding the slide stop.
Force failing staccato pistols is a popular video for clicks and views. UA-camrs post videos for views and money, every thing else is secondary. Take that with a grain of salt.
I have a Staccato C2, P and XC all 3 with 0 malfunctions. I have 5,500 through the C2, 5,200 through the P and 2,500 through the XC. All three guns were shot without cleaning (oil only) up until 2,500 rounds. If you look at the dozens of other Staccato reviews including Sage Dynamics which shows how reliable these guns are. I can almost guarantee you that the stovepipe and fail to lock back were caused by the weak PMC ammo. I carry a staccato every day (on and off duty) without hesitation as do thousands of other cops around the country. Very well put together video though sir. Take care and be safe.
Hey Erik, thanks for watching and commenting. It could very well be the ammo. I think it is from the extra weight of the Holosun. This is some privy information from a reliable source. I am quoting. “The c2 didn't make initial t&e for agencies for those issues. “ “The P passed because they would lighten the spring when adding a dot. Thus it comes with a spring kit. The extra reciprocating mass hinders lockback and stove pipes.”
That information has to be old. The Staccato P has not come with a spring kit for probably 2 years now. Both my c2 and P have dots with factory springs, again, not 1 malfunction with over 5,000 rounds. At my agency, we have 50+ deputies who carry the staccato with a dot with factory springs and all have been 100% reliable.
@@ElevatedPerformanceConcepts man I wonder if you’re biased, your UA-cam name has the word Staccato in it 😂 I own a Staccato P, it’s a great gun but it’s not perfect, it takes more maintenance and is more finicky than Glocks, they just are. Theres a reason Glocks still reign supreme.
@@Puddin127… they reign supreme because they’re cheap and 85% of the country lives paycheck to paycheck. If Staccato’s were Glock price they’d be the most popular firearm out there. Proof is in the pudding, look at the views on staccato videos when the majority of viewers CANT BUY ONE. That says it all
Thanks for the review, I really enjoy your evaluations. My gun of choice is the 1911 type platform because after decades of shooting I am more accurate and quicker with them. I'm in total agreement with you that like a high performance race car they should be well maintained, even to the point that they should be re-lubed periodically even if they have not been fired. My C2 DUO has 1,674 rounds through it, many of which are my reloads, without a single failure. As a side note they all have been 124 gr. loads and I have it topped with a SRO. My longest session has been 350 rounds. That being said, I have experienced failure on other platforms, some of which required part replacement, and I do not believe any of them are immune from failures. Also I would note that the Staccato is tuned as a duty gun and maybe optimized for hotter ammo. Therefore, I would definitely give Staccato a call and discuss this with them.
i’ve carried a C2 duo for about a year. I’ve put about 1500 through it in that time without any malfunctions. I’ve used mostly Blazer and Troy for practice and Speer GD for carry. I grew up in the 80’s with the idea of the 1911 as America’s gun and always wanted one since childhood. I love shooting regular 45s but the C2 is really the perfect combo of modern performance and that old nostalgia. I’d trust my life to it any day of the week. I will say that I do clean it after every range trip. It’s definitely not a Glock where you can just shoot it dry or use mud for lube and have it keep going 😂
2150 round in with my c2 with zero malfunction, clean and oil after every 500 round, no issue what so ever, slide lock every time, no failure to extract from what I see the round that you use must be under power or the recoil spring is too heavy since the ejection pattern is very weak compare to the ejection pattern that I see on my gun.
Good review. I did a 1000 round test on my Staccato P. I got a few stovepipes in the last 100 rounds. I do agree that you have to stay on the maintenance part. I'm willing to do that and I have been. I'll continue to EDC mine.
With over 2k through my C2 I've never had a single issue. The weight of the closed emmiter optic could slow the slide? Hilton at 10-8 did an in depth discussion on this. Yes the weight of the optic is minimal, but these things are highly balanced machines and even the smallest deviation can make a difference. As I mentioned earlier I have the C2, but I choose to run an American made SRO ( yeah it matters to most of us) and I've never had a single issue. I'm not an ammo snob, I expect an EDC to run anything I feed it. My C2 ran garbage Monarch Steel Case with no problems....and it doesn't get cheaper than that junk. My EDC ammo is 147 Hydra Shok. My C2 is more dependable than my EDCX9.
@@nickgoldfarb98 These are kind of limping out and not consistent. Also when mags start not locking back a stovepipe is coming. The extractor is probably a little too loose. This is almost a carbon copy of the behavior of my SA Ronin 4.25 9mm. Tightening the extractor solved it.
I have had a c2 for over 2 years now and probably have 3k+ rounds through it. I think I had 1 stove pipe and one failure to lock back (which was just a bad mag) that whole 3k rounds. 115 grain new brass all 3k rounds. I did a several 750 round range sessions with no problems. I always clean my guns after I shoot them and I lube them up before I shoot them. Also I lube my c2 once a week even if I don’t shoot it. I use hoppe’s gun lube. Oh and MBX mags are great to use as well.
Its interesting to see different folks have different results. I am a few rounds shy of 2k rounds (assorted ammo 115gr Range ammo to 147 +p+ Underwood) and so far so good. Even swapped mags to the 20 rounders to see if there was any difference, they all ran as advertised. PMC bronze ammo runs the gambit of barely consistent to dumpster fire and most definitely does run dirty.
It's funny, the issues I typically see people have with 1911 platforms nearly always has to do with either running cheap low power target/plinking ammo in a 1911 with stiff recoil springs for shooting hot defensive loads (the fact ejected cases dribble out instead of flying out illustrates this, and explains why the stove pipping) , or magazines with soft springs; not due to some inherent design issue with the 1911 platform.
We can’t pretend this doesn’t happen with a Glock tho. I’ve been carrying Langdon Berettas for about 5 years now with zero malfunctions. (~10,000 rds/yr between four guns) My Glock 19, which I previously carried, had 44 malfunctions in 3000 rounds before I dumped it for being the most unreliable handgun I’ve ever owned. Only recently eclipsed by the p365 380 which had malfunctions every mag.
I have a few Staccatos and a BUL SAS. That issue isn’t with the gun, it’s the mags. 2011 mags have come a LONG way-but are still not as durable as what Striker Polymer guns have. But my point is the GUN is working fine, once I saw it didn’t lock back on last round I knew what was coming. Had the EXACT same issue. I’ve found 4 mags that work flawlessly and have had zero issues. Wilson in my opinion has the best 2011 mags.
Where you place your hands also effects lock back. On a striker fired gun I stack my thumbs very tight. If I do that on my Staccato C2 the back thumb sits of the safety and the front thumb sits on the slide release. Pressing the slide release keeps the gun from locking back. It could be something as simple as his grip, I had to adjust mine and now zero lock back issues.
I carried a C2 for a while. I had no reservations carrying it . Never had a malfunction but ended up trading it away and now have a Bul Armory 3.25” 2011. Was considering another C2 because I liked it so much now have been leaning towards the MPS DS9 commander size, in part because of your DS9 video.
We believe those stove pipes are happening because the casings are bouncing off of the optic. Notice how some of the casings are ejecting directly downward and to the front (meaning they are ejecting backwards, smashing into the optic and then flying forward). That would be a non-issue for the pistol itself since it probably would not happen if there was no optic on it. PMC is good ammo, but some ammo types work/eject differently in different guns. Maybe a different type of ammo would eject higher and faster so that it would clear the optic and prevent it from dunking back into the ejection port. In regard to the failure to lock open on a few of the last rounds, we could not see the left-side of the pistol while you were shooting. Maybe thumb was riding the slide lock lever? Not sure. We are Wilson fans, so just throwing out our ideas based on what we have seen in our daily experiences with these issues and things we saw in the video, too. Definitely only throwing out unbiased opinions and things to consider. Hope it encourages you (and others) to try many types of ammo in a certain gun, try a certain gun with and without the optic and see if there is a difference in performance. Awesome video, and thank you for sharing! 🇺🇸
Well done and informative. I carried a G22 for almost my entire LE career, but we didn’t have options. We also didn’t have red dots at the time. I knew some officers who had filthy firearms, so I often wonder if officers today who carry firearms with red dots, get them wet or dirty to the point it becomes an issue. I once had a Sergeant who spilt salsa on his firearm and it was there for almost a full year! I care for my firearms, but I’m not sure I’d carry a 1911/2011 for duty if I was still working. I know that many guys do, but like you mentioned, they have higher tolerances and I worked in AZ which is a dry area with dirt/sand
I bet the police force wished they had you back! Thank you for your service, and I am a subscriber now for sure. Just picked this bad boy up, and can’t wait to get to my lesson today. I will visualize your technique and relaxed effective style!!! I don’t mind the extra maintenance, and I am not a spring chicken so I understand the importance of it too😂🤣
All you stated about EDC an 2011 is true. I’ve found my safety swept down twice. My Romeo 3 gets sooo dirty I’m going to try swapping it out with a acro p2. Yes failures occur but Never in the 1st few mags no matter how dirty it is. I should never need more than that. That’s all the reliability I need for the gun I shot best. Love your content.
Stumbled across your video for the first time. You have a new subscriber at a point where I find myself inscribing from several channels. Very well done. Thanks for your time in producing it.
I have had a few stove pipes out of my staccato p duo with a dpp dot. I have alittle over 500 rounds through it. It’s still my favorite pistol to shoot
Great video!just bought the same staccato. Ive shot 1911’s for over 20 years.yes you have to clean them regularly.but if you lube them often you will be ok in my experience.ive never been a law enforcement officer so they may not be good for them. But i never had a malfunction on my nighthawk or wilson combat.
I love my C2 but after carrying this iwb for 6 months I couldn't take it anymore. Bought the G43x mos and haven't looked back. Over a pound lighter. I know how can you compare a Staccato to a Glock??? Don't care! Train with what you carry.
Thank You Sir! I shot a Stuccato this summer after a match. I was impressed with the pistol. I was able the dispatch the plate rack 25/30 yds with iron sights. I appreciate your sharing/demonstrating "use of cover" strategy. 👍🇺🇸 #22aday
I always wanted to build a 80% 2011 in 40s&w but it was always cheaper to buy one. They’re cool but I wouldn’t carry one. Staccato makes awesome pistols. Hopefully some day I’ll have the spare scratch to buy one
Ray I love the new camera and your honest reviews. It is so chill to listen to and you don't force any particular opinion to the consumer, you let us make our own assessement about the product. Do you plan to make any videos about competition shooting? As to what pistols you'd recommend for starters and some tips and trick that helped you get better? Keep it up and take care!
I very much like the honest review. However I have always seen very good reviews on staccatos in recent times. I just ordered my first one and it just so happens to be a staccato C2 with a trijicon SRO. Hope it runs very well, the bundle I bought with a couple extra mags was $3,900 so I hope it ends up being worth it lol
You definitely deserve more subs. I have a cheapo kimber 1911 LW - it was a malfunction machine, i tuned the extractor, polished up the feedramp and am now 2k rounds with no malfunctions. Cleaned it at 1k. i was using Wilson Combat magazines though. I bought a 1911ds Prodigy and at 500 rounds with no malfunctions. I will probably try to hit 1k by the end of the month, if i could ever have a day off work.
I’ve noticed that the c2 with the bulkier dots have that issue on rare occasions. I run the 507k on mine and have had no failures with over 3500 rounds. Cleaned it one time.
I bought the Staccato P and too many issues in the first 500 rounds to ever trust it. After 500 it is now "reliable" but not fully trusted. I like and trust my three Bul Armory SAS2 pistols over my sample of one Staccato P.
I have a couple of C2s. One DUO and one regular. I had a 509t on the DUO but swapped it for an EPS. I like that much better. I’ve never had a malfunction with either. I’ve probably fired about 3,000 rounds through each. I noticed that ammo is barely ejecting. May need something with more power like Gold Dot to prevent stove pipes in that particular pistol.
I wanna get 2011 pretty bad but I don't think it's all that practical for my application. I already have 2 EDC / HD and 1 Comp Pistol . I can use my HD Pistol in a pinch if my comp PISTOL goes down . If I were to get 2011 . I'd probably go with Prodigy only because it would be a range toy . I definitely think 2011s in general are getting way more reliable than what they used to be . I owned 2011 10 years ago or so and it ran fine 80% of the time . 2011s are definitely making hell of a come back... Nice video bro. Production of the video quality is absolutely phenomenal
The SOG Marshals had over 130k rounds through their original 3 guns from Staccato with no issues. Don’t take one youtuber as the sole reason you base a decision on.
Seems possibly as simple as upgrading the springs in the magazine, for the lack of lock back. Otherwise seems like a bit of a contradiction to expect a platform known to run wet, to perform like a platform known to run “dry”. I highly doubt they they’ve passed so many agencies testing if they were that untrustworthy. Survived Sage Dynamics testing, so I’m sure it’ll work fine. For those who lack on maintenance you probably have bigger concerns because they likely lack on training as well. So if the gun is full of lint and has dried up, their flashlight batteries are probably dead as well. Milspec Mojo is a prime example of what a squared away officer would train like. Concerning debris getting on the red dot, hence closed emitter. I would even argue that the RMR body is more useful than the closed emitter because the rear window would still be blocked on that first shot. Being able to use the body out to a certain distance is nice, should the window be blocked or cracked to the point the dot is not useable. Debris getting in the way of the hammer, possible yet doubtful. Again between not being super lazy and then plenty of testing done, even the striker guns can run into issues. Some of those issues can sometimes give the favor to the hammer fired guns. Garand Thumb shows that in some testing between mud/freezing conditions.
As a retired firearms instructor for the largest LE in west coast, I experienced all type of malfunctions from striker pistols and hammer action pistols. Not all guns are perfect.
I'd like to see your non-ejection port side while shooting this gun. More than once I've seen guys (yes, even very experienced shooters) using under powered or inconsistent ammo cause failure to lock back as well as stovepipes by applying too much pressure with their thumbs. I can do this with 9major myself due to the size of my hands. Also, due to the DLC finish, these guns require quite a bit of lube during the first couple thousand rounds. Finally, these guns need extractor work, that's a fact, not an opinion. I've actually measured a good number of this brand and they all have the same extractor set up. It's done for a reason, but it can complicate the function of the gun with certain kinds of ammo and gun handling. Other than that, nice to see someone out there shooting these guns on video from different positions and in different drills. They are great pistols for their price point.
Great Review. The C2 is an engineering masterpiece, but I don't see myself swapping out my Glock 19 for it or any other pistol for EDC or home defense. The Glock19's reliability and 'fit for use' is just unmatched in the handgun firearm space.
My guy needs to play back the video in slow motion. The gun didn’t malfunction and stove pipe. The brass ejected and hit the optic and went back in the chamber. Just watched again and the same thing happened at 17:17. 😂 You can’t blame the gun for the optic being in the way of ejecting brass.
A good video. I do prefer staccato. It is a great experience when shooting. It is approved by over 650 LEO agencies and passed the Us Marshalls and Texas Rangers testing. So durability and reliability isn’t a issue. Is it a Glock or Hk when discussing reliability? No, but they’re not a Staccato when discussing tight tolerances and trigger with great accuracy.
Better than the prodigy? Or is the prodigy relatable? Either better than the other accuracy wise? Totally agree as far as duty and ccw, dust and lint galore unless you constantly upkeep.
I appreciate your presentation style and the quality of your videos. You always present the information in an experienced, professional manner. Your evaluation was balanced and well thought out. Thank you!
Ray, I've been carrying a 1911 on duty for 37 years, switched to STI about 5 or 6 years ago. I assure you there's no lint in my hammer or barrel. Yes, my nickname for most of my career has been Tackleberry. I currently carry a DVC Omni .45, but I have just received a Staccato XC 9mm. I'm trying to get to the range and torture test the XC before I carry it. I won't carry polymer frame pistols, a good 25% of the body camera shootings I see have limp wristing malfunctions. Nothing against the pistols or officers, but it's just not always easy to get a good, proper grip on the pistol in that "OH CRAP" situation. Limp wristing malfunctions are pretty much only associated with polymer frames, so I'll stay away from them. As for your stovepipes, that's a head scratcher. Typically it would be associated with an underpowered round, or an overpowered recoil spring. My XC has what feels like half the recoil spring my Omni has, and other than caliber they're the exact same pistol.
Great comment! I was also called Tackleberry back in the day. While they have gotten a LOT better, I really don’t think 1911/2011 pistols are a good choice for most patrol officers. Thanks again for watching.
@@XRING As a rangemaster & instructor I'll agree that a 1911 style platform isn't for most people. Some of the rookies I see these days have a hard time with a striker fired pistol, I don't want them carrying a cocked & locked manual safety platform. I fail people in qualifications because they can't even follow rangemaster directions, I don't want them carrying a 1911. I'm so used to one it's pure muscle memory, but I pretty much have to carry one now. I can't shoot some pistols as the end of my left index finger was lost in a duty related incident, so I need the 1911's short throw trigger to qualify weak handed. I'm also an armorer for 1911's, several other pistol platforms, and a few automatic rifle/smg platforms. I can adjust a 1911 extractor in my sleep, and probably have. So yeah, I guess I'm the perfect person to carry this platform. The only thing I wish STI would do is go to an external extractor like S&W and SIG did. I notice that Staccato has a new sub-compact pistol with an external extractor. When I went to instructor school I used a 1911 and fired over 3,000 rounds in 5 days. Other than a serious cleaning every night the pistol wasn't cleaned during the ~600 rounds we fired every day. I didn't have one malfunction of any kind that entire week. I, on the other hand, had a huge bandage on my right thumb because the safety had shredded it. I must have flicked the safety on and off hundreds of times each day, by day 4 my thumb was hamburger. I'd have loved to have had a 2011 then, it wasn't unusual for me to walk to the line carrying 8 to 10 mags, because the courses of fire weren't friendly towards lower capacity magazines. One other thing, on your stovepipes they can also be caused by a broken ejector. Stovepipes aren't normally associated with the extractor.
I’ve always been curious about these. One thought I had was maybe the ammo could be underpowered, but regardless you’re right - never encounter these issues in my G34 race gun even with tons of mods and thousands of rounds
I was wondering also maybe it’s ammo because my G45 did the same with some cheaper brand ammos The other was after market magazines last but not least lt needs to be cleaned more often
I had to many issues with my 43X so I got rid of it. Bought an M&P 2.0 that has been incredibly reliable unless I use aluminum. I bought it cause it was cheapest during the pandemic. I switched to CZ and no issues at all. I did just order a Staccato P and I look forward to shooting it. I shot some friends 1911 and fell in love with the gun, not the 8 rounds, so Staccato here we come. Good review and great shooter.
That sucks to have some bad magazines. If they are not locking back, you need to send the back ti staccato. Springs are made by the thousands and you can get some bad ones here and there. You do showcase why it is important to test your carry gun and gear.
It was lubed at the start of the shooting but after 500 rounds, you mentioned it is re-cleaned. Well it should be lubed again because if it was re-cleaned after 500 rounds, oil could have came off. Try lubing more and not cleaning as much. My Staccato after 2000 rounds, no malfunction when properly lubed.
I like the single stack c better. As a kid my grandpas 1911 fit my hand so well as it was a single stack. I’ve been wanting a C2 threaded DLC barrel for a while now but man does the staccato single stack (regular C, which I’m not even sure they make anymore) feels good in the hand.
The only gun that should ever need cleaning to get it to function properly is a .22. They're dirty and low powered, but I still love those little buggers.🤗
I've been debating on getting a bul armory light because it is the lightest 2011 for carry but I may just keep carrying my 1911 45. If I want high capacity I have several polymer frames including the old fnp 9mm. The 2011 platform is just still in its infancy, the stattco is too pricy to my standards, the prodigy is too heavy for what it is amd the bull armory seems to be the best choice for carry and reliability but doing my due diligence first
Meh, I've had plenty of stove pipes with striker fired polymer pistols as well. Never had that many failures to lock back tho unless it's some of the lighter charged rounds in a ladder work up. Maybe for duty carry I could see having some reservations, but for concealed carry, where most people don't even bother with one spare mag, much less enough for a prolonged firefight, I would have no problems with this. The caveat would be that you would really need to stay on top of cleaning regularly. I'm much better about it now, but there used to be times I'd go to just give my carry pistol a wipe down only to find lots of lint, especially right behind the trigger. That doesn't happen anymore, but I see your point.
Ray, I am always impressed with your shooting skills!! I could be wrong but it looks like you are slamming those magazines into the pistol and as you know that could be wearing the ejector prematurely. Also I agree with you that a 2011 is best left for competition not carry.
Do you think the added weight of the Holosun had some contributing factor to the stove pipe malfunctions? And I missed it if that was a factory threaded barrel or not? Good tips on shooting while prone w/ a barricade btw, thx!
Just to note, if you did lose the battery in a self-defense encounter, that holosun has a solar failsafe. Definitely not 'just as good' but still a feature to note
2K through mine. Zero issues and cleaned and lubed before first 1k and cleaned and 1k total to 2K and cleaned and lube. Impressive pistol and first 2011. Carried striker fire in duty for 19 years but not anymore.
I had a lot of the same issues people have complained about with their Prodigies with my C2. I finally traded it in towards an XC. I’ve got the 2019 P, XC, and XL. I love them all with zero issues. I’ve got both prodigies as well with zero issues from the 4.25 after a few thousand rounds. And only 6 failures within the first 500 round break-in period on the 5”. None since. It’s a great platform in general
Ya i think he didn't lube it again because he mentioned he re-cleaned it but not lubed again. I have 2k through mine as well, no malfunction. I have rented polymer guns and had bad malfunctions. The latest one is p365 macro trigger spring.
I don't have a C2 but I do have a P. Nearly 5,000 rounds through it with zero failures. The failure to lock back so often might be caused by riding the slide stop.
Force failing staccato pistols is a popular video for clicks and views. UA-camrs post videos for views and money, every thing else is secondary. Take that with a grain of salt.
I have a Staccato C2, P and XC all 3 with 0 malfunctions. I have 5,500 through the C2, 5,200 through the P and 2,500 through the XC. All three guns were shot without cleaning (oil only) up until 2,500 rounds. If you look at the dozens of other Staccato reviews including Sage Dynamics which shows how reliable these guns are. I can almost guarantee you that the stovepipe and fail to lock back were caused by the weak PMC ammo. I carry a staccato every day (on and off duty) without hesitation as do thousands of other cops around the country. Very well put together video though sir. Take care and be safe.
Hey Erik, thanks for watching and commenting. It could very well be the ammo. I think it is from the extra weight of the Holosun. This is some privy information from a reliable source. I am quoting.
“The c2 didn't make initial t&e for agencies for those issues. “
“The P passed because they would lighten the spring when adding a dot. Thus it comes with a spring kit. The extra reciprocating mass hinders lockback and stove pipes.”
That information has to be old. The Staccato P has not come with a spring kit for probably 2 years now. Both my c2 and P have dots with factory springs, again, not 1 malfunction with over 5,000 rounds. At my agency, we have 50+ deputies who carry the staccato with a dot with factory springs and all have been 100% reliable.
@@ElevatedPerformanceConcepts man I wonder if you’re biased, your UA-cam name has the word Staccato in it 😂
I own a Staccato P, it’s a great gun but it’s not perfect, it takes more maintenance and is more finicky than Glocks, they just are. Theres a reason Glocks still reign supreme.
@@Puddin127… they reign supreme because they’re cheap and 85% of the country lives paycheck to paycheck. If Staccato’s were Glock price they’d be the most popular firearm out there. Proof is in the pudding, look at the views on staccato videos when the majority of viewers CANT BUY ONE. That says it all
Thanks for the review, I really enjoy your evaluations. My gun of choice is the 1911 type platform because after decades of shooting I am more accurate and quicker with them. I'm in total agreement with you that like a high performance race car they should be well maintained, even to the point that they should be re-lubed periodically even if they have not been fired. My C2 DUO has 1,674 rounds through it, many of which are my reloads, without a single failure. As a side note they all have been 124 gr. loads and I have it topped with a SRO. My longest session has been 350 rounds. That being said, I have experienced failure on other platforms, some of which required part replacement, and I do not believe any of them are immune from failures. Also I would note that the Staccato is tuned as a duty gun and maybe optimized for hotter ammo. Therefore, I would definitely give Staccato a call and discuss this with them.
Amen 👍🏾
i’ve carried a C2 duo for about a year. I’ve put about 1500 through it in that time without any malfunctions. I’ve used mostly Blazer and Troy for practice and Speer GD for carry. I grew up in the 80’s with the idea of the 1911 as America’s gun and always wanted one since childhood. I love shooting regular 45s but the C2 is really the perfect combo of modern performance and that old nostalgia. I’d trust my life to it any day of the week. I will say that I do clean it after every range trip. It’s definitely not a Glock where you can just shoot it dry or use mud for lube and have it keep going 😂
2150 round in with my c2 with zero malfunction, clean and oil after every 500 round, no issue what so ever, slide lock every time, no failure to extract
from what I see the round that you use must be under power or the recoil spring is too heavy since the ejection pattern is very weak compare to the
ejection pattern that I see on my gun.
Good review. I did a 1000 round test on my Staccato P. I got a few stovepipes in the last 100 rounds. I do agree that you have to stay on the maintenance part. I'm willing to do that and I have been. I'll continue to EDC mine.
I'll bet your extractor loosened up a bit. Might need to retune it a bit tighter.
I’ve got at least 3k out of my C2 and I haven’t a single stove pipe or any kind of malfunction. Good review sir thank you!
Perfect timing after the Prodigy
With over 2k through my C2 I've never had a single issue.
The weight of the closed emmiter optic could slow the slide? Hilton at 10-8 did an in depth discussion on this. Yes the weight of the optic is minimal, but these things are highly balanced machines and even the smallest deviation can make a difference.
As I mentioned earlier I have the C2, but I choose to run an American made SRO ( yeah it matters to most of us) and I've never had a single issue. I'm not an ammo snob, I expect an EDC to run anything I feed it. My C2 ran garbage Monarch Steel Case with no problems....and it doesn't get cheaper than that junk.
My EDC ammo is 147 Hydra Shok.
My C2 is more dependable than my EDCX9.
The weight of the optic should not cause this kind of malfunctions. Weight difference is really not a factor.
I just came back from the range with mine and your video popped up! Exact same setup, same optic and barrel. About 700 though mine , zero issues.
Great review…I have Stacattos and love them but carry a p365xl.
One of the top channels out here !!! Thanks for all you do!! I’m gonna stick with the bland, vanilla tools that I know work every time.
Thanks Red Out! I am trying.
@@XRING the cases are bouncing off the dot causing the stove pipe that’s what has been happening to mine
@@nickgoldfarb98 These are kind of limping out and not consistent. Also when mags start not locking back a stovepipe is coming. The extractor is probably a little too loose. This is almost a carbon copy of the behavior of my SA Ronin 4.25 9mm. Tightening the extractor solved it.
I have had a c2 for over 2 years now and probably have 3k+ rounds through it. I think I had 1 stove pipe and one failure to lock back (which was just a bad mag) that whole 3k rounds. 115 grain new brass all 3k rounds. I did a several 750 round range sessions with no problems. I always clean my guns after I shoot them and I lube them up before I shoot them. Also I lube my c2 once a week even if I don’t shoot it. I use hoppe’s gun lube. Oh and MBX mags are great to use as well.
Great information True Patriot and thanks for the comment.
Its interesting to see different folks have different results. I am a few rounds shy of 2k rounds (assorted ammo 115gr Range ammo to 147 +p+ Underwood) and so far so good. Even swapped mags to the 20 rounders to see if there was any difference, they all ran as advertised. PMC bronze ammo runs the gambit of barely consistent to dumpster fire and most definitely does run dirty.
I just ordered a CS, can't wait till it gets here. When I saw your Infinity my jaw hit the floor. Wow.
Staccato does make great pistols. You will be happy with yours for sure. I appreciate you watching the channel. 👍🏼
@@XRING No problem. You have very good taste and a lot of knowledge. Had to sub.
Love shooting reviews that actually include shooting and show us the malfunctions they encounter. Subscribed cuz you also hit that 400yarder
Holy smokes. Footage looks great. Kinda like back in the cable tv days when your favorite shows upgrade footage and its night and day difference.
It's funny, the issues I typically see people have with 1911 platforms nearly always has to do with either running cheap low power target/plinking ammo in a 1911 with stiff recoil springs for shooting hot defensive loads (the fact ejected cases dribble out instead of flying out illustrates this, and explains why the stove pipping) , or magazines with soft springs; not due to some inherent design issue with the 1911 platform.
We can’t pretend this doesn’t happen with a Glock tho. I’ve been carrying Langdon Berettas for about 5 years now with zero malfunctions. (~10,000 rds/yr between four guns) My Glock 19, which I previously carried, had 44 malfunctions in 3000 rounds before I dumped it for being the most unreliable handgun I’ve ever owned. Only recently eclipsed by the p365 380 which had malfunctions every mag.
I have a few Staccatos and a BUL SAS. That issue isn’t with the gun, it’s the mags. 2011 mags have come a LONG way-but are still not as durable as what Striker Polymer guns have. But my point is the GUN is working fine, once I saw it didn’t lock back on last round I knew what was coming. Had the EXACT same issue. I’ve found 4 mags that work flawlessly and have had zero issues. Wilson in my opinion has the best 2011 mags.
Where you place your hands also effects lock back. On a striker fired gun I stack my thumbs very tight. If I do that on my Staccato C2 the back thumb sits of the safety and the front thumb sits on the slide release. Pressing the slide release keeps the gun from locking back. It could be something as simple as his grip, I had to adjust mine and now zero lock back issues.
I carried a C2 for a while. I had no reservations carrying it . Never had a malfunction but ended up trading it away and now have a Bul Armory 3.25” 2011. Was considering another C2 because I liked it so much now have been leaning towards the MPS DS9 commander size, in part because of your DS9 video.
If you are talking about the Bul SAS II Ultralight, that is an amazing little pistol!
Great channel! Honest and no b.s reviews. One of THEE best guntubers out here👍🏼.
Thanks Dax! I really appreciate it. 👍🏼
Had to sub almost instantly, just listening to you speak I can already tell this channel *carries* quality! 🙏
Keep up the awesome work! 👏
We believe those stove pipes are happening because the casings are bouncing off of the optic. Notice how some of the casings are ejecting directly downward and to the front (meaning they are ejecting backwards, smashing into the optic and then flying forward). That would be a non-issue for the pistol itself since it probably would not happen if there was no optic on it.
PMC is good ammo, but some ammo types work/eject differently in different guns. Maybe a different type of ammo would eject higher and faster so that it would clear the optic and prevent it from dunking back into the ejection port.
In regard to the failure to lock open on a few of the last rounds, we could not see the left-side of the pistol while you were shooting. Maybe thumb was riding the slide lock lever? Not sure.
We are Wilson fans, so just throwing out our ideas based on what we have seen in our daily experiences with these issues and things we saw in the video, too. Definitely only throwing out unbiased opinions and things to consider.
Hope it encourages you (and others) to try many types of ammo in a certain gun, try a certain gun with and without the optic and see if there is a difference in performance.
Awesome video, and thank you for sharing!
🇺🇸
Well done and informative.
I carried a G22 for almost my entire LE career, but we didn’t have options. We also didn’t have red dots at the time. I knew some officers who had filthy firearms, so I often wonder if officers today who carry firearms with red dots, get them wet or dirty to the point it becomes an issue. I once had a Sergeant who spilt salsa on his firearm and it was there for almost a full year! I care for my firearms, but I’m not sure I’d carry a 1911/2011 for duty if I was still working. I know that many guys do, but like you mentioned, they have higher tolerances and I worked in AZ which is a dry area with dirt/sand
Great comment and thank you for watching the channel. 👍🏼
I bet the police force wished they had you back!
Thank you for your service, and I am a subscriber now for sure.
Just picked this bad boy up, and can’t wait to get to my lesson today.
I will visualize your technique and relaxed effective style!!!
I don’t mind the extra maintenance, and I am not a spring chicken so I understand the importance of it too😂🤣
Thanks Ray. I always enjoy and have a lot of confidence in your honest reviews.
All you stated about EDC an 2011 is true. I’ve found my safety swept down twice. My Romeo 3 gets sooo dirty I’m going to try swapping it out with a acro p2. Yes failures occur but Never in the 1st few mags no matter how dirty it is. I should never need more than that. That’s all the reliability I need for the gun I shot best. Love your content.
Thanks Todd and thanks for watching the channel.
Stumbled across your video for the first time. You have a new subscriber at a point where I find myself inscribing from several channels. Very well done. Thanks for your time in producing it.
I appreciate that Steve! Thanks for subscribing.
I have had a few stove pipes out of my staccato p duo with a dpp dot. I have alittle over 500 rounds through it. It’s still my favorite pistol to shoot
Great video!just bought the same staccato. Ive shot 1911’s for over 20 years.yes you have to clean them regularly.but if you lube them often you will be ok in my experience.ive never been a law enforcement officer so they may not be good for them. But i never had a malfunction on my nighthawk or wilson combat.
I love my C2 but after carrying this iwb for 6 months I couldn't take it anymore. Bought the G43x mos and haven't looked back. Over a pound lighter. I know how can you compare a Staccato to a Glock??? Don't care! Train with what you carry.
Thank You Sir! I shot a Stuccato this summer after a match. I was impressed with the pistol. I was able the dispatch the plate rack 25/30 yds with iron sights. I appreciate your sharing/demonstrating "use of cover" strategy. 👍🇺🇸 #22aday
Awesome video!!! I would like to see a video of 1k round evaluation on your choice of polymer frame pistol for carry. Thanks!
I always wanted to build a 80% 2011 in 40s&w but it was always cheaper to buy one. They’re cool but I wouldn’t carry one. Staccato makes awesome pistols. Hopefully some day I’ll have the spare scratch to buy one
Awesome video. Truth about most not doing regular maintenance on their 1911’s/2011’s .
Thanks and I think that’s pretty much a fact across the board. 👍🏼. I appreciate you watching the channel.
Love your honest review
Thank you Devil.
Thanks for a honest review. I was hoping it wouldn’t have any failures at 1K rounds. Thanks Ray
Production has increased exponentially
Ray I love the new camera and your honest reviews. It is so chill to listen to and you don't force any particular opinion to the consumer, you let us make our own assessement about the product.
Do you plan to make any videos about competition shooting? As to what pistols you'd recommend for starters and some tips and trick that helped you get better? Keep it up and take care!
Really like your videos, style of presentation !
Thank you Kelly and thanks for watching! 👍🏼
Honest and factual. Thanks for all the work that goes into your videos!
As a former firearms instructor with a large city department, we've seen stove pipes on Glocks. Greater sample size than 1
For sure. It happens to all manufacturers.
I very much like the honest review. However I have always seen very good reviews on staccatos in recent times. I just ordered my first one and it just so happens to be a staccato C2 with a trijicon SRO. Hope it runs very well, the bundle I bought with a couple extra mags was $3,900 so I hope it ends up being worth it lol
Great video! Very precise
I love my Staccato P. Iron sights all the way. I will get the C2 tho.
Ray I’ve been a subscriber since you began making videos , I appreciate your information
I know Talking Rock! I really appreciate you watching the channel
as always. Thank you. 👍🏼
Enjoy your vids, honest reviews and as a new shooter, I’m learning new stuff - thanks!
I enjoy your channel and your expertise very much!
You definitely deserve more subs. I have a cheapo kimber 1911 LW - it was a malfunction machine, i tuned the extractor, polished up the feedramp and am now 2k rounds with no malfunctions. Cleaned it at 1k. i was using Wilson Combat magazines though. I bought a 1911ds Prodigy and at 500 rounds with no malfunctions. I will probably try to hit 1k by the end of the month, if i could ever have a day off work.
Another great video from Ray!! His reviews are always spot on and informative!
You are a skilled shooter. Great video and review. Really like your content !!!!!
Thanks Marcelo and thanks for watching the channel.
I just bought one. Waiting for it to come in
Always clear and concise with no bullshit. Thank you.
I’ve noticed that the c2 with the bulkier dots have that issue on rare occasions. I run the 507k on mine and have had no failures with over 3500 rounds. Cleaned it one time.
I bought the Staccato P and too many issues in the first 500 rounds to ever trust it. After 500 it is now "reliable" but not fully trusted. I like and trust my three Bul Armory SAS2 pistols over my sample of one Staccato P.
The 2011 reliability issue was resolved positively years ago with the re-design of the Staccato magazines, years before this C2 ever came out.
Honest informative real world. Spot on dude
Thanks Michael and thanks for watching.
Appreciate the honest reviews.. love the channel.
Thanks Raymond and thanks for watching.
Great review! I too prefer striker fired pistols for CCW because of that debris catcher that's created in front of a cocked hammer.
I have a couple of C2s. One DUO and one regular. I had a 509t on the DUO but swapped it for an EPS. I like that much better. I’ve never had a malfunction with either. I’ve probably fired about 3,000 rounds through each. I noticed that ammo is barely ejecting. May need something with more power like Gold Dot to prevent stove pipes in that particular pistol.
Wanted to say thanks for all your videos and info. Your know and reviews are much appreciated. Thanks and can't wait for the next one.
Thank you John and thank you for watching the channel.
I wanna get 2011 pretty bad but I don't think it's all that practical for my application. I already have 2 EDC / HD and 1 Comp Pistol . I can use my HD Pistol in a pinch if my comp PISTOL goes down .
If I were to get 2011 . I'd probably go with Prodigy only because it would be a range toy .
I definitely think 2011s in general are getting way more reliable than what they used to be . I owned 2011 10 years ago or so and it ran fine 80% of the time . 2011s are definitely making hell of a come back...
Nice video bro. Production of the video quality is absolutely phenomenal
Thanks Sean and thanks for the comment. The 2011’s have definitely gotten better.
The SOG Marshals had over 130k rounds through their original 3 guns from Staccato with no issues. Don’t take one youtuber as the sole reason you base a decision on.
Seems possibly as simple as upgrading the springs in the magazine, for the lack of lock back.
Otherwise seems like a bit of a contradiction to expect a platform known to run wet, to perform like a platform known to run “dry”. I highly doubt they they’ve passed so many agencies testing if they were that untrustworthy.
Survived Sage Dynamics testing, so I’m sure it’ll work fine. For those who lack on maintenance you probably have bigger concerns because they likely lack on training as well. So if the gun is full of lint and has dried up, their flashlight batteries are probably dead as well. Milspec Mojo is a prime example of what a squared away officer would train like.
Concerning debris getting on the red dot, hence closed emitter. I would even argue that the RMR body is more useful than the closed emitter because the rear window would still be blocked on that first shot. Being able to use the body out to a certain distance is nice, should the window be blocked or cracked to the point the dot is not useable.
Debris getting in the way of the hammer, possible yet doubtful. Again between not being super lazy and then plenty of testing done, even the striker guns can run into issues. Some of those issues can sometimes give the favor to the hammer fired guns. Garand Thumb shows that in some testing between mud/freezing conditions.
You’re awesome Ray. Thank for always producing the great content. Hope to see you at the Memorial 3Gun.
Thanks Justin! I will be there Lord wiling.
As a retired firearms instructor for the largest LE in west coast, I experienced all type of malfunctions from striker pistols and hammer action pistols.
Not all guns are perfect.
I completely agree.
We used adjusted point of aim when didnt have rifles ........ worked !!!!
I'd like to see your non-ejection port side while shooting this gun. More than once I've seen guys (yes, even very experienced shooters) using under powered or inconsistent ammo cause failure to lock back as well as stovepipes by applying too much pressure with their thumbs. I can do this with 9major myself due to the size of my hands. Also, due to the DLC finish, these guns require quite a bit of lube during the first couple thousand rounds. Finally, these guns need extractor work, that's a fact, not an opinion. I've actually measured a good number of this brand and they all have the same extractor set up. It's done for a reason, but it can complicate the function of the gun with certain kinds of ammo and gun handling.
Other than that, nice to see someone out there shooting these guns on video from different positions and in different drills. They are great pistols for their price point.
Good review Ray. I have a MPA DS9 2011 It's my only 2011, and with the addition of the Aggressive grip it's a keeper
Great Review. The C2 is an engineering masterpiece, but I don't see myself swapping out my Glock 19 for it or any other pistol for EDC or home defense. The Glock19's reliability and 'fit for use' is just unmatched in the handgun firearm space.
My guy needs to play back the video in slow motion. The gun didn’t malfunction and stove pipe. The brass ejected and hit the optic and went back in the chamber. Just watched again and the same thing happened at 17:17. 😂 You can’t blame the gun for the optic being in the way of ejecting brass.
I just peeped that 😂
A good video. I do prefer staccato. It is a great experience when shooting. It is approved by over 650 LEO agencies and passed the Us Marshalls and Texas Rangers testing. So durability and reliability isn’t a issue. Is it a Glock or Hk when discussing reliability? No, but they’re not a Staccato when discussing tight tolerances and trigger with great accuracy.
I dont know how I found your channel but Im glad I did. Good stuff
Better than the prodigy? Or is the prodigy relatable? Either better than the other accuracy wise?
Totally agree as far as duty and ccw, dust and lint galore unless you constantly upkeep.
Awesome video. Thanks for your honesty. Amazing range and competition toy.
I’ll stick to my Glock and m&p
For carry.
I like your reviews because you show malfunctions. Most other channels I watch don’t
Well Presented Brother! Carry On
I appreciate your presentation style and the quality of your videos. You always present the information in an experienced, professional manner. Your evaluation was balanced and well thought out. Thank you!
Thank you for that and thanks for watching the channel! 👍🏼
Ray, I've been carrying a 1911 on duty for 37 years, switched to STI about 5 or 6 years ago. I assure you there's no lint in my hammer or barrel. Yes, my nickname for most of my career has been Tackleberry. I currently carry a DVC Omni .45, but I have just received a Staccato XC 9mm. I'm trying to get to the range and torture test the XC before I carry it.
I won't carry polymer frame pistols, a good 25% of the body camera shootings I see have limp wristing malfunctions. Nothing against the pistols or officers, but it's just not always easy to get a good, proper grip on the pistol in that "OH CRAP" situation. Limp wristing malfunctions are pretty much only associated with polymer frames, so I'll stay away from them.
As for your stovepipes, that's a head scratcher. Typically it would be associated with an underpowered round, or an overpowered recoil spring. My XC has what feels like half the recoil spring my Omni has, and other than caliber they're the exact same pistol.
Great comment! I was also called Tackleberry back in the day. While they have gotten a LOT better, I really don’t think 1911/2011 pistols are a good choice for most patrol officers. Thanks again for watching.
@@XRING As a rangemaster & instructor I'll agree that a 1911 style platform isn't for most people. Some of the rookies I see these days have a hard time with a striker fired pistol, I don't want them carrying a cocked & locked manual safety platform. I fail people in qualifications because they can't even follow rangemaster directions, I don't want them carrying a 1911. I'm so used to one it's pure muscle memory, but I pretty much have to carry one now. I can't shoot some pistols as the end of my left index finger was lost in a duty related incident, so I need the 1911's short throw trigger to qualify weak handed. I'm also an armorer for 1911's, several other pistol platforms, and a few automatic rifle/smg platforms. I can adjust a 1911 extractor in my sleep, and probably have. So yeah, I guess I'm the perfect person to carry this platform. The only thing I wish STI would do is go to an external extractor like S&W and SIG did. I notice that Staccato has a new sub-compact pistol with an external extractor.
When I went to instructor school I used a 1911 and fired over 3,000 rounds in 5 days. Other than a serious cleaning every night the pistol wasn't cleaned during the ~600 rounds we fired every day. I didn't have one malfunction of any kind that entire week. I, on the other hand, had a huge bandage on my right thumb because the safety had shredded it. I must have flicked the safety on and off hundreds of times each day, by day 4 my thumb was hamburger. I'd have loved to have had a 2011 then, it wasn't unusual for me to walk to the line carrying 8 to 10 mags, because the courses of fire weren't friendly towards lower capacity magazines.
One other thing, on your stovepipes they can also be caused by a broken ejector. Stovepipes aren't normally associated with the extractor.
C2 EDC 2000+ rounds. Plus taken
many classes. Yes, I had a few no lock back but no stove pipe.
I’ve always been curious about these. One thought I had was maybe the ammo could be underpowered, but regardless you’re right - never encounter these issues in my G34 race gun even with tons of mods and thousands of rounds
I was wondering also maybe it’s ammo because my G45 did the same with some cheaper brand ammos
The other was after market magazines last but not least lt needs to be cleaned more often
I had to many issues with my 43X so I got rid of it. Bought an M&P 2.0 that has been incredibly reliable unless I use aluminum. I bought it cause it was cheapest during the pandemic. I switched to CZ and no issues at all. I did just order a Staccato P and I look forward to shooting it. I shot some friends 1911 and fell in love with the gun, not the 8 rounds, so Staccato here we come. Good review and great shooter.
That sucks to have some bad magazines. If they are not locking back, you need to send the back ti staccato. Springs are made by the thousands and you can get some bad ones here and there.
You do showcase why it is important to test your carry gun and gear.
Your content and the Humble Marksman's are the two I get the most out of and enjoy. Thanks for sharing the wealth of knowledge with us! 👍👍👍🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
It was lubed at the start of the shooting but after 500 rounds, you mentioned it is re-cleaned. Well it should be lubed again because if it was re-cleaned after 500 rounds, oil could have came off. Try lubing more and not cleaning as much.
My Staccato after 2000 rounds, no malfunction when properly lubed.
I bought my C2 in Dec 2021..5000 rounds later not 1 failure
I like the single stack c better. As a kid my grandpas 1911 fit my hand so well as it was a single stack. I’ve been wanting a C2 threaded DLC barrel for a while now but man does the staccato single stack (regular C, which I’m not even sure they make anymore) feels good in the hand.
The only gun that should ever need cleaning to get it to function properly is a .22. They're dirty and low powered, but I still love those little buggers.🤗
Interesting that the Prodigy did better in the last 300 rounds than the C2. Great reviews.
I love mine. Well over 1,000 rounds with zero malfunctions.
This will make prodigy guys happy 😅😂
Do you recommend upgrade to DLC coated barrels vs plain steel?
I've been debating on getting a bul armory light because it is the lightest 2011 for carry but I may just keep carrying my 1911 45. If I want high capacity I have several polymer frames including the old fnp 9mm.
The 2011 platform is just still in its infancy, the stattco is too pricy to my standards, the prodigy is too heavy for what it is amd the bull armory seems to be the best choice for carry and reliability but doing my due diligence first
Meh, I've had plenty of stove pipes with striker fired polymer pistols as well. Never had that many failures to lock back tho unless it's some of the lighter charged rounds in a ladder work up. Maybe for duty carry I could see having some reservations, but for concealed carry, where most people don't even bother with one spare mag, much less enough for a prolonged firefight, I would have no problems with this. The caveat would be that you would really need to stay on top of cleaning regularly. I'm much better about it now, but there used to be times I'd go to just give my carry pistol a wipe down only to find lots of lint, especially right behind the trigger. That doesn't happen anymore, but I see your point.
Ray, I am always impressed with your shooting skills!! I could be wrong but it looks like you are slamming those magazines into the pistol and as you know that could be wearing the ejector prematurely. Also I agree with you that a 2011 is best left for competition not carry.
Staccato fan boys aren't going to be happy with this. Thanks for the review!
Is the brass hitting the red dot and not ejecting?
Do you think the added weight of the Holosun had some contributing factor to the stove pipe malfunctions? And I missed it if that was a factory threaded barrel or not?
Good tips on shooting while prone w/ a barricade btw, thx!
I have about 2,000rds through my C2 without ever having a malfunction. I think it might be the heavier optic with somewhat weaker ammo at play here.
5K rounds through my c2 and xc. Never clean them, no malfunctions.
Just to note, if you did lose the battery in a self-defense encounter, that holosun has a solar failsafe. Definitely not 'just as good' but still a feature to note
Great to know!
Good review - thanks!