Darrin, be sure to lubricate the impeller housing lightly with waterproof grease (we use 2-4-C at our shop) so it's not starting dry, and also turn the drive shaft while you tighten down the impeller housing so you don't pinch the bottom corners of the impeller between the housing and the wear plate. Lastly, the original impeller looked pretty oily which means that you may be leaking oil out of the drive shaft or shift shaft seal on the lower unit. To find the leak it is best to pressurize the lower unit to around 10-12 psi and turn the drive shaft, prop shaft, and move the shift shaft while listening for leaks or watching your pressure gauge. Good luck and thanks for the videos!
I agree since I was a little kid my favorite thing to do in the world was to take things apart to find out how they work. Your channel lets me "take apart and learn" about more things than I'll get my hands on. Thanks and keep doing what you do.
I have always wondered what the inside of one of these looks like. Thanks Mustie for letting us get inside this outboard with you, very educational. Keep up the good work!
I'll say it again..."you are a patient man!" I'm using some of that Mustie1 problem solving on my snapper lawn tractor. Found out it isn't the motor that is frozen it's the mower deck. Thanks for demonstrating your patience in problem solving.
I was inspired by your tinkering so a few months ago, I purchased a seized 1970 Wards 55hp outboard and now you have a "new" one! I have experience working on cars and mowers but your videos inspired me to work on something new. I now have have not only gotten it unstuck but I have cleaned and set the points and cleaned out the carb, leading to a getting it running for the first time this weekend. Thanks for the inspiration and old engine repair skill brush-up :)
A small tip: when filling the lower unit leave your pump/bottle nozzle in the bottom and replace the vent screw (with new washers) first. Makes a vacuum which allows a bit more time to put the bottom screw back. Water in the gearcase ninety percent of the time is either fishing line that has ruined the seal on the prop shaft or a very old seal that has just failed. Good video reminds me of my youth when we had a lot of the brown blue Johnrudes around. Take care. Doug
I paid $2.20 for a 1956 Evinrude Fleetwin 7.5hp at the scrap yard a couple weeks ago (A minute after I picked it up off a mountain of scrap everything around it was crushed so she's a lucky one). It's not as pretty as yours, but has the same problem of not pumping water as well as a bad carb. I was able to verify that it runs with a couple squirts of gas. These series of videos will help me immensely. Thanks Mustie
Hey musti .you undo the bottom oil drain screw put a bowl under it and remove the top vent screw to allow the oil to flow out .when you fill the lower gear casing you get a pump type filler that scews onto your oil bottle and into the lower drain plug .a bit like a soap dispenser. And you pump the oil in from the bottom untill it starts to trickle oit of the top vent hole .you do it this way to avoid air locks .once you have correct leval , screw in top vent screw and this will create a vacume to allow you to unscrew filler tube and reinstall lower drain plug .
Well now you've done your pump water change I must do mine. I have put it off for all spring and most of summer but your video and no fear helped me get my self off the sofa and start. Thank you for the inspiration!
Seeing you try to disconnect that shifting rod made me thing off when I replace the shift bushing on my beetle. Taking needle nose pliers and trying to inch it to the back of the car. That took me forever... I even took the handle off my floor jack and slid it thru behind the rod and pushed it. That worked for a little while.
My kids and friends all laugh at me because I'm always taking things apart to see why they broke, even after I installed a new part. I'm with you on disassembling things. It's the best way to learn about something and discovering how it's made and how to repair it.
This probably sounds strange, but I do all my own car work and have a fear of small engines, so when I got my own house I bought an electric lanwmower. After two years it's just not keeping up, and I figure it would have cost about $650 to get one that would work for my situation... instead I've been watching your videos and decided that if 1) I own a lawnmower from it's birth and 2) maintain it properly that I should be able to keep it running. My parents had a history of buying and then destroying briggs and straton engined push mowers, so I made it a point to buy one with a Honda OHV engine. Man... what nice running engines. I'm sure it's made in China (if I'm lucky Taiwan), but it came with a thick manual and a blow up diagram of the entire engine, all the info on all the clearances and normal wear/how to check it. Really good stuff. Mowed my whole lawn in 1/5 the time of the electric mower (and more importantly mowed it all at ONCE which I couldn't with the electric). Here's to hoping the faith you gave me isn't unfounded lol.
When the engine is running there is an upward thrust on the driveshaft which keeps the impeller pin from bottoming out on the wear plate. Your Evinrude has the correct parts as you disassembled it. the driveshaft floats in the gearcase and does not damage anything. Do Not Add any parts.
Glad to see you figured it out. I would check the inside of the block via the cylinder head to be sure that the water passages are not clogged with corosion, if it is you an scrape it out easily with a pick.
Mustie1, your impact driver is one of your "go to" tools. I finally picked one up after seeing you use it for years. I also bought a set of JIS screwdrivers! Thanks for all your awesome videos over the years!
Learning about boat motors, as I never knew how they worked....Great job, and without books is usually the way I start anyway, but I may have to get one to get things back together again lol.....
you have to remove the bolt, it's a safety setup in case the bolt loosens it will still shift. also that lower unit normally leaks around the shift shaft or the prop shaft seal
cyigearup2 Agreed. Some may miss the shift shaft O-Ring, but is usually in rough shape. Something else that's recommended is using 3M 847 gasket adhesive around the spaghetti seal for the case halves. It helps immensely.
Hi Mustie, How about for peace of mind, drill a small hole and insert a roll pin just above the impeller drive pin. The impeller looks as if it would accommodate a woodruff key, so the roll pin wouldn't impede any up/down movement. Great Vid as always my friend. Cheers from the UK.
just weld a washer on the bottom of the pinion gear that will at least raise the pin to the desired height or if to high then weld a blob on the shaft so as it hits the top of pinion gear it cant fall below that point but remember to mock up first
so impressed with your trouble shooting skills! so many people cant appreciate the years of experience and the understanding of engineering to diagnose a machine your not trained to work on.
old video of course but i have owned 2 of these old omc motors a 7.5 johnson sea horse and a 18 horse evinrude ....i learned a lot about old engines early in my 20s on these 2 engines thank god he didnt have a 7.5 the entire power head had to come off to put a water pump in that one and this one he is working on i had a super cringe moment when he was taking apart linkage i was like take the damn dolt out on the lower shaft only its all u have to do to un hook it and honestly tons of people throw these motors away because no parts available bit if you do your research and you have a viable powerhead you can still buy parts for a reasonable price loved both i had hated water pumps on both i love my 2016 tohtsu but i really love knowing more about these engines id bet if now 20 years later id still have the 18 horse evinrude but times change and now i want to fix more than buy kudos to your channel love the content and ive learned a ton still to date wish i knew more 20 years ago
Oh,my, my hearts skips a beat when it comes to seized hardware on these! Had a head bolt that was one with the block, got lucky with a drill and tapped itout to 3/8 from 5/16. Hate to have to scrap a beautiful old motor for something like that
You are a lucky dog! That combination of stainless steel fasteners in cast aluminum, which is ubiquitous in outboards, has cost me quite a few hours of drilling, followed by cursing, followed by more drilling. Somebody else pointed out the missing clip in the pinion, but one more note- the copper tube that comes up from the pump housing, be gentle with that. It has to slide into a rubber bushing in the powerhead, and you won't be able to see it go in, so don't let it get even slightly pushed out of location.
Wow, does that bring back memories. 46 years ago my dad and I replaced a broken shift-fork linkage on a motor that was a lot like that one, but 5 h.p. instead of 10, and re-badged as a Montgomery Ward's model instead of Johnson or Evinrude, and perhaps a year or two newer than that one. It sure is easier taking apart the hub on one of those old motors than it is on the new ones.
You wouldn't happen to know what size a 57 sportwin water pump would be? I know mustie had problems with his as there are different sizes? Been waiting for responses so I can order one from Amazon
Happy to see a great video as always... If it was me i would personally put the new pump fins in with the offset side facing upward and then fit the thrust washer on top so that the pin will always be as near to the inside of the pump rather than fitting it to the underside and risking the shaft still falling down and tearing away at the brass insert again.. putting the washer on top rather than underneath would still do the same job as in not letting the pump fins move around loosely..
i'm thinking that the impeller is wear out and everything is looking fine. that shaft might need to have a little movement in it... love you video's.. keep up the great work...
This brings many memories into mind. I had a 1956 3HP Evinrude in the 1970's given by my father who got it second hand in 1958. I had to repair it many times during those years. Sometimes I did it at the sea as water had entered the fuel and the motor stopped. All possible repairs were made so I got familiar with it. Otherwise it is a most reliable engine.
I can only post a comment in the reply section. But maybe the horseshoe for the shifter should be routed where the driveshaft rests on top of it. That way the pin for the impeller rides above the plate.
Love the videos and agree that its more fun to just dive in and figure out how it ticks and whats wrong. Now for my take on it, I agree that the impeller that was in there was the wrong one.. The correct one you have has a place for a washer on the bottom side of it and fits the shaft correctly with no play. As for the washer on the bottom side, hardened or not I'm not sure. The way I think it works is like this ...washer goes in the bottom of the impeller, the shaft isn't connected to the gear on the bottom so the shaft can be lifted up high enough to slip the impeller drive pin into the shaft after the impeller and washer are already on the shaft. Then the shaft is lowered with the pin in place and the pin rests on top of the washer and drives the impeller from that position which is on top of the washer and now the pin isn't riding on the bottom plate. Just my take from what I see, sounds right to me. Thanks for sharing
You had water in the gear oil, so replace the o-rings on the drain plugs. Those fins staying bent over means it was bad, the chunks missing even more bad, and the wear on the plate just adds to the badness. The Impeller and wear plate should be replaced on a regular basis. It looks like they ran it for years without changing it. The manuel likely says after so many hours. You have heard the saying... a boat is a hole in the water you pour money into... :D
That some brutal work there. 1958 and it's final fight involves a hammer and a screwdriver. If it fights back that hard, you change our attack, as opposed to hammer and screwdrivers. Roughing it up only to find it goes together differently. That things a classic man!
Your videos documenting disassembly are better than a book. I am gradually learning to use pictures of questionable steps in order to supplement my failing memory. Some things are relatively easy to figure out based on purpose. The pin riding on the wear-plate would hold the shaft in the correct position and capture the impeller, but it seems a circlip for positioning and a repositioned pin might make for a cheaper repair.
Watched one video and subscribed, reminds me of how fun it used to be to hang out in the garage and work on my own stuff, before I started doing it for a living. That took all the fun out of it.
The shift rod seal is kind of a pain to replace, but I would recommend replacing it, the drive shaft seal, and the rope seal. Again, I'd recommend googling "Lee Roy's Ramblings" great info there.
Hi Mustie1. The video doesnt show it from the right angle. But is it possible that there should be a c-clip in the bottom of that pinion gear, which prevents it from going through? It looks like there is a space for it, because the splines don't go all the way through. Liked the video!
Just watching the video and have a thought on the drive shaft problem. Looking at the length of the splines on the ends of the shift, it looks like the shaft was put in upside down in the past. with the shorter spline down it will not extend through the drive gear. Great site!
I replace the impeller every two years because the rubber on the impeller develops a memory and will not function anymore. i also take a small amount of form a gasket and seal up the pump housing, the round box that you put over the pump. its important to remember which direction those impeller fins were when you took it apart, as the shaft only turns in one direction. and there should be a small keyway that fits into the notch in the impeller along a flat part of the shaft. it may be missing or completely worn away because of the condition of the old impeller. the kit usually comes with a new one. good luck you seem to be on the right track. one other thing is that you should blow some air from the pipe the comes from the pump housing into the engine water jacket and see if anything blows out of the water outlet jet. sometimes when an engine sits, mud daubers and other insects like to build nests in the outlet jet. and crud can build up in the water jacket making the engine over heat as well. and then check to make sure the water intake vents are clear as well. they pick up all sorts of debris like weeds and even silt.
Ah! Memories of staff days at BSA summer camp, an Island on the Delaware River, (1m ix 1/2 mi). Transport to/from mainland was the 4 scows. These were powered with dual 25HP Evinrudes. Those were maintained by the retired Sea Bee Master Chief "Russ". During the week the scows were used for supplies, But Saturdays were a mad house with the arriving/departing Scout Troops. The river was shallow on the PA side so a reasonable quantity of shear pins were expended. all the scows had a toolbox with pliers, cotter pins and shear pins.
if you decide to not go with the hardened washer when you put it back together, I would at least make sure the flush side is down so you get full engagement of the pin - the previous mechanic may have had it flipped ? By the way while you were prying on the shift linkage I was getting anxious for you to pull the bolt out!! LOL Again thanks for letting us into your garage
I rebuilt the lower unit and water pump on my 67 evinrude 40hp. It had a drive key and it did. Or ride against the wear plate. I do not recall if it had something to keep it from going into the pinion too far. You can normally find good parts diagrams on iboats website to see if there's something missing.
Hi Mustie1 for what its worth I would drill another pin in the shaft a little above the other!! so its more central to the pump drive, eliminate the problem all together , great vids man ATB Wayne UK.
I used to have a similar motor, a 1951 Super Fastwin about 30 years ago on a plywood runabout. I had to replace the ignition coil and water pump, The biggest pain was the fuel tank, which was pressurized by crankcase pressure. A leaky o ring on the connector, check valve, or loose gas cap would cause the engine to die. I fiddled with the gas tank and barb connectors a lot, and I had to do gravity feed to get it home a few times. I resorted to a mechanic to find the bad check valve, but by then I had a bigger boat to redo. It would have been a good museum piece but I used it and got the perfect paint all scratched up trying to keep it running.
One reason there might be water in the gear case is condensation (as it has sat for years), but another thing to check is to make sure the seal behind the prop isn't wrapped in fishing line. I just had that happen to the outboard on my pontoon. Wasn't a lot of water in there (similar to the amount that you had in your engine), but the fishing line creates enough of a path for the water to make its way past the seal and into the gear case.
don't forget that the wear plate also works as a seal for the water that whole compartment pushes water the water can go to the top or the bottom of the blades as well as past the blades that's probably how you got water into your gearbox the wear plate wore out and push water up inside.... I'm glad you start when we start I appreciate your buffoonery and your boondoggles bombacity chicanery that's all I know that's the only funk and wagnals I got I think it's number two and three
I love watching someone fumble around for the first time with something I have had apart many times. I'm just sitting here saying; You have to remove that shift shaft bolt completely before the shafts will come apart, Flip over the impeller and you'll get another 5 years out of it, good luck with the gear assembly screws!, You need to take off the prop first lol. I am just getting a kick out of watching someone figure it all out for the first time. These engines were so simple and just great engines.
That is exactly how you fill the gear case in an outboard - fill from the bottom. I just hope you can get the bolts out. More often than not they are corroded into the holes because of galvanic corrosion. I usually ended up breaking a few of them off and had to drill them out and use an easy out to get them out. I always coated the screws with RIG when I put them back in and replaced the sacrificial anode if it had one. Outboards are a PITA because they were usually not designed for maintenance or repair. I always though OMCStuff was a little easier to work on than Mercs.
Well, with a new guide plate in place and putting it back together as it was, the impeller drive pin will still be running at the bottom of the impeller. I have always had the idea of drilling another pin hole in the shaft, 1/4" above the existing pin hole. Add a second pin to the shaft, and this will locate in the center of the impeller. Just a thought, I have not actually tested this idea.Also, the drive shaft should have a clip of some kind,down on the pinion gear to reduce it from sliding so far down.
I recommend adding a nylon button on the end of the shaft inside the pinion gear. .125" thick would keep the pump vane pin engaged more towards the center of the drive slot in the vane.
edit. 27:02 i did find an image of a gear case diagram. of a 1957. like cyigearup2 said. retaining ring "number 21" is missing. i think this should be in the bottom of the gear pinion and the axle just stand on top of the retaining ring preventing to sink down. but a diagram of a 56 looks like it does not have any. strange. but it could be frankensteined a bit. i had a evinrude with a johnson tail. not the thing forget this piece. (is it possible there has to be or can there been put a single ball off a ball-bearing in the center point of the drive shaft. and then rest on the horizontal axle. just too keep the drive shaft up a bit? so the pin is in the center of the impeller more or less. do make shure there is no possible way to loose the ball and damage the gearings though! even if it is not surpose to be like that, maybe you can inprove this strange construction this way.)
Found myself screaming at the computer. "Take out the damn bolt in that shift connector". But you figured it out. And didn't even break anything. Haggetts Marine on Airport Road Concord, NH has lots of NOS seals and bearings for those old JohnRude motors. ( Johnson/Evinrude came off the same line and parts are interchangeable ) Later versions of those shafts had a Key instead of the pin. ( At least on the 28 and 40 horse versions ) Much more positive drive on the pump. There usually is an "O" ring on the shaft where the spline goes into the Crank. This is to keep water out of the internal spline and rusting out the crank, a common problem. Makes it a bear to get the shaft out of the crank sometimes. Grease up the spline where it goes into the crank. Still running my 1971 JohnRude on a regular basis. Was on Massabesic Lake today ( Sunday April 30 ) as a matter of fact with my 1971 StarCraft.
I made those observations before you did the close-up of the worn area where you stated that it looked like the pin had somehow rode out of its barrier. I would wonder about the possible clearances of the impeller shaft and pin size. My next guess would be that due to age those tolerances would be off 10 to 20 thousandths off.
I'm thinking the pinion gear splines are worn vertically allowing the shaft to drop down , in turn affecting the pump impeller key height. Outboards SLAM into action,..that's a lot of hammering and over time causing wear.
I think the drive shafts moves upward when you put it in gear, which moves the key upward into the center of the impeller. At idle out of gear they do not need a lot of cooling. This is just my memory from 40 years ago.😎
It's great that you can hear us when we are talking to you... cause I was saying "surely you can call a friend and ask" BOOM! and you did! another awesome video. #phoneafriend
The impeller and the shaft are running at the same speed so there is no way that the bush should get 'burnt out'. Like you said someone has put the wrong impeller into that engine. I'm not sure I could live with the crap design of the drive shaft, it needs something to hold it in the right position and control end float.
Those are cool old engines i have a Johnson about that same vintage. I think where the shaft fits into that lower gear about a quarter inch from going threw there should be a Cclip inside the gear. Kinda like the clip that holds a piston wrist pin in. Wish i knew the term but.... look in the end of the gear there should be a grove for a c clip
Your best bet is to google it and see if anything is missing. You said someone has already been in there. So they might have left a part out. I normally do that if I dont know the specs or way things work. Always someone that's done it on UA-cam anyway so you can get info that way. Enjoy it.😜
I agree . . . learn / discover as you go . . . plus if you bought a manual for each piece of equipment you worked on, you'd need another garage to be a library to store them all . . . :) Rog
There were a couple smaller Evinrudes in the inventory, that were used for the V-bottom runabout. It was for the Camp Director, and any emergencies. I think they were 12HP.
I believe you need to drain a little gear oil out after the oil spills out of the vent hole. I service my 60hp mercury myself, the manufacturers service instructions direct letting a little oil drain from fill plug after lower unit is full, for heat expansion. Otherwise, may run a risk of blowing out the lower unit oil seals in hot weather/water operation.
I'm not exactly sure the relationship between the key in the shaft and how it holds things together, but that recess in the impeller leads me to think maybe it was designed to have a small spacer in there from the get go. The damaged one's brass center shows there is some pressure/friction on it's face. That would be the perfect place for a hardened spacer.
Hey Mustie, love your video's! I think I see what the issue might be and no I know nothing about outboard motors. The shift fork, try installing it on the top side of the shaft. Almost looks like the pump shaft would then ride on top of that lifting it some so the pin sits in a better position in the impellor.Gregb
Darrin, be sure to lubricate the impeller housing lightly with waterproof grease (we use 2-4-C at our shop) so it's not starting dry, and also turn the drive shaft while you tighten down the impeller housing so you don't pinch the bottom corners of the impeller between the housing and the wear plate. Lastly, the original impeller looked pretty oily which means that you may be leaking oil out of the drive shaft or shift shaft seal on the lower unit. To find the leak it is best to pressurize the lower unit to around 10-12 psi and turn the drive shaft, prop shaft, and move the shift shaft while listening for leaks or watching your pressure gauge. Good luck and thanks for the videos!
The most I have ever seen of how an outboard boat motor works, cool stuff, thanks.
I agree since I was a little kid my favorite thing to do in the world was to take things apart to find out how they work. Your channel lets me "take apart and learn" about more things than I'll get my hands on. Thanks and keep doing what you do.
I have always wondered what the inside of one of these looks like. Thanks Mustie for letting us get inside this outboard with you, very educational. Keep up the good work!
I'll say it again..."you are a patient man!" I'm using some of that Mustie1 problem solving on my snapper lawn tractor. Found out it isn't the motor that is frozen it's the mower deck. Thanks for demonstrating your patience in problem solving.
I was inspired by your tinkering so a few months ago, I purchased a seized 1970 Wards 55hp outboard and now you have a "new" one! I have experience working on cars and mowers but your videos inspired me to work on something new. I now have have not only gotten it unstuck but I have cleaned and set the points and cleaned out the carb, leading to a getting it running for the first time this weekend. Thanks for the inspiration and old engine repair skill brush-up :)
A small tip: when filling the lower unit leave your pump/bottle nozzle in the bottom and replace the vent screw (with new washers) first. Makes a vacuum which allows a bit more time to put the bottom screw back. Water in the gearcase ninety percent of the time is either fishing line that has ruined the seal on the prop shaft or a very old seal that has just failed. Good video reminds me of my youth when we had a lot of the brown blue Johnrudes around. Take care. Doug
I paid $2.20 for a 1956 Evinrude Fleetwin 7.5hp at the scrap yard a couple weeks ago (A minute after I picked it up off a mountain of scrap everything around it was crushed so she's a lucky one). It's not as pretty as yours, but has the same problem of not pumping water as well as a bad carb. I was able to verify that it runs with a couple squirts of gas. These series of videos will help me immensely. Thanks Mustie
Hey musti .you undo the bottom oil drain screw put a bowl under it and remove the top vent screw to allow the oil to flow out .when you fill the lower gear casing you get a pump type filler that scews onto your oil bottle and into the lower drain plug .a bit like a soap dispenser. And you pump the oil in from the bottom untill it starts to trickle oit of the top vent hole .you do it this way to avoid air locks .once you have correct leval , screw in top vent screw and this will create a vacume to allow you to unscrew filler tube and reinstall lower drain plug .
Why wouldn't it work better to fill it from the top until the oil runs out?
@@Hoggdoc1946 The hole is too small for that.
im shouting, "take the bolts out all the way"...your not listening!!!
Well now you've done your pump water change I must do mine. I have put it off for all spring and most of summer but your video and no fear helped me get my self off the sofa and start.
Thank you for the inspiration!
DO NOT PUT IT OFF. I blew a really good 15Hp by putting that off.
My 1957 Johnson stopped pumping water. Pretty cool that someone I'm already subscribed to has the perfect video to help me fix up my outboard
I was sad to see there wasn't a random farm animal at the end.
Great video as always! I like how you take us on the journey of troubleshooting and problem solving.
He puts together very good content and teaches at the same time very good teacher home automotive mechanic jack-of-all-trades.
Seeing you try to disconnect that shifting rod made me thing off when I replace the shift bushing on my beetle. Taking needle nose pliers and trying to inch it to the back of the car. That took me forever... I even took the handle off my floor jack and slid it thru behind the rod and pushed it. That worked for a little while.
Install the overflow plug before you remove the gear oil bottle from the fill plug hole.
My kids and friends all laugh at me because I'm always taking things apart to see why they broke, even after I installed a new part. I'm with you on disassembling things. It's the best way to learn about something and discovering how it's made and how to repair it.
This probably sounds strange, but I do all my own car work and have a fear of small engines, so when I got my own house I bought an electric lanwmower. After two years it's just not keeping up, and I figure it would have cost about $650 to get one that would work for my situation... instead I've been watching your videos and decided that if 1) I own a lawnmower from it's birth and 2) maintain it properly that I should be able to keep it running. My parents had a history of buying and then destroying briggs and straton engined push mowers, so I made it a point to buy one with a Honda OHV engine.
Man... what nice running engines. I'm sure it's made in China (if I'm lucky Taiwan), but it came with a thick manual and a blow up diagram of the entire engine, all the info on all the clearances and normal wear/how to check it. Really good stuff. Mowed my whole lawn in 1/5 the time of the electric mower (and more importantly mowed it all at ONCE which I couldn't with the electric). Here's to hoping the faith you gave me isn't unfounded lol.
When the engine is running there is an upward thrust on the driveshaft which keeps the impeller pin from bottoming out on the wear plate. Your Evinrude has the correct parts as you disassembled it. the driveshaft floats in the gearcase and does not damage anything. Do Not Add any parts.
Glad to see you figured it out. I would check the inside of the block via the cylinder head to be sure that the water passages are not clogged with corosion, if it is you an scrape it out easily with a pick.
Mustie1, your impact driver is one of your "go to" tools. I finally picked one up after seeing you use it for years. I also bought a set of JIS screwdrivers! Thanks for all your awesome videos over the years!
Learning about boat motors, as I never knew how they worked....Great job, and without books is usually the way I start anyway, but I may have to get one to get things back together again lol.....
Harold Bevins I know the feeling brother. Lol
you have to remove the bolt, it's a safety setup in case the bolt loosens it will still shift. also that lower unit normally leaks around the shift shaft or the prop shaft seal
cyigearup2 Agreed. Some may miss the shift shaft O-Ring, but is usually in rough shape.
Something else that's recommended is using 3M 847 gasket adhesive around the spaghetti seal for the case halves. It helps immensely.
My wife is confused as to how I can spend so much time in the garage and never get dirty.
:)
I went in the garage with good intentions. Then I fired up Musti1 videos sat down got comfy :)
You really need to do live shows so some of us that have the knowledge! Yes.. take the bolt out! You're killing me!
Hi Mustie, How about for peace of mind, drill a small hole and insert a roll pin just above the impeller drive pin. The impeller looks as if it would accommodate a woodruff key, so the roll pin wouldn't impede any up/down movement. Great Vid as always my friend. Cheers from the UK.
the pinion gear that the drive shaft goes in is missing the internal clip, that's why the drive shaft goes in without stopping
correct
just weld a washer on the bottom of the pinion gear that will at least raise the pin to the desired height or if to high then weld a blob on the shaft so as it hits the top of pinion gear it cant fall below that point but remember to mock up first
my opinion is maybe that shaft is meant to float for the expansion and flexing of the housing.
Wondering the same thing myself, but didn't notice a grove cut in the shaft.
a 30 cent cir clip from napa keeps the proper pre load on the drive shaft, welding on gear is risky could change the temper (hardness)
when I get off work...I watch this guy work
so impressed with your trouble shooting skills! so many people cant appreciate the years of experience and the understanding of engineering to diagnose a machine your not trained to work on.
old video of course but i have owned 2 of these old omc motors a 7.5 johnson sea horse and a 18 horse evinrude ....i learned a lot about old engines early in my 20s on these 2 engines thank god he didnt have a 7.5 the entire power head had to come off to put a water pump in that one and this one he is working on i had a super cringe moment when he was taking apart linkage i was like take the damn dolt out on the lower shaft only its all u have to do to un hook it and honestly tons of people throw these motors away because no parts available bit if you do your research and you have a viable powerhead you can still buy parts for a reasonable price loved both i had hated water pumps on both i love my 2016 tohtsu but i really love knowing more about these engines id bet if now 20 years later id still have the 18 horse evinrude but times change and now i want to fix more than buy kudos to your channel love the content and ive learned a ton still to date wish i knew more 20 years ago
Oh,my, my hearts skips a beat when it comes to seized hardware on these! Had a head bolt that was one with the block, got lucky with a drill and tapped itout to 3/8 from 5/16. Hate to have to scrap a beautiful old motor for something like that
As a boat mechanic it was killing me to watch you pry on the shift linkage
i was thinking the same
No kidding!!!!
Maybe study before you perform a task like that..
Talk to a boat machanic before you destroy the partl!
Over 10 minutes to disconnect it 🤦♂️
You are a lucky dog! That combination of stainless steel fasteners in cast aluminum, which is ubiquitous in outboards, has cost me quite a few hours of drilling, followed by cursing, followed by more drilling. Somebody else pointed out the missing clip in the pinion, but one more note- the copper tube that comes up from the pump housing, be gentle with that. It has to slide into a rubber bushing in the powerhead, and you won't be able to see it go in, so don't let it get even slightly pushed out of location.
Wow, does that bring back memories. 46 years ago my dad and I replaced a broken shift-fork linkage on a motor that was a lot like that one, but 5 h.p. instead of 10, and re-badged as a Montgomery Ward's model instead of Johnson or Evinrude, and perhaps a year or two newer than that one. It sure is easier taking apart the hub on one of those old motors than it is on the new ones.
You wouldn't happen to know what size a 57 sportwin water pump would be? I know mustie had problems with his as there are different sizes? Been waiting for responses so I can order one from Amazon
Happy to see a great video as always...
If it was me i would personally put the new pump fins in with the offset side facing upward and then fit the thrust washer on top so that the pin will always be as near to the inside of the pump rather than fitting it to the underside and risking the shaft still falling down and tearing away at the brass insert again.. putting the washer on top rather than underneath would still do the same job as in not letting the pump fins move around loosely..
i'm thinking that the impeller is wear out and everything is looking fine. that shaft might need to have a little movement in it... love you video's.. keep up the great work...
you are definitely teaching an old dog new tricks .Thanks from UK.
Forget the shim. Replace the impeller drive pin.
I kept hauling at my IPad to take the bolts out. I guess you finally heard me. Good job!
This brings many memories into mind. I had a 1956 3HP Evinrude in the 1970's given by my father who got it second hand in 1958. I had to repair it many times during those years. Sometimes I did it at the sea as water had entered the fuel and the motor stopped. All possible repairs were made so I got familiar with it. Otherwise it is a most reliable engine.
Thanks for the take along. I've always wondered how these worked in the gear box.
gotta love finishing my last half an hour of my weekend with a mustie vid
You can put a drill on the drive shaft and turn it on a bucket and see if its pumping before you put it back together.
I can only post a comment in the reply section. But maybe the horseshoe for the shifter should be routed where the driveshaft rests on top of it. That way the pin for the impeller rides above the plate.
Love the videos and agree that its more fun to just dive in and figure out how it ticks and whats wrong. Now for my take on it, I agree that the impeller that was in there was the wrong one.. The correct one you have has a place for a washer on the bottom side of it and fits the shaft correctly with no play. As for the washer on the bottom side, hardened or not I'm not sure. The way I think it works is like this ...washer goes in the bottom of the impeller, the shaft isn't connected to the gear on the bottom so the shaft can be lifted up high enough to slip the impeller drive pin into the shaft after the impeller and washer are already on the shaft. Then the shaft is lowered with the pin in place and the pin rests on top of the washer and drives the impeller from that position which is on top of the washer and now the pin isn't riding on the bottom plate. Just my take from what I see, sounds right to me. Thanks for sharing
You had water in the gear oil, so replace the o-rings on the drain plugs.
Those fins staying bent over means it was bad, the chunks missing even more bad, and the wear on the plate just adds to the badness. The Impeller and wear plate should be replaced on a regular basis. It looks like they ran it for years without changing it. The manuel likely says after so many hours.
You have heard the saying... a boat is a hole in the water you pour money into... :D
Todd Abbott BOAT=Break Out Another Thousand.
Had a similar outboard wondered what the insides looked like... great vid, can't wait for part 2 !
Part 2 this is already part 3... Part 4 is already there waiting :)
That some brutal work there. 1958 and it's final fight involves a hammer and a screwdriver. If it fights back that hard, you change our attack, as opposed to hammer and screwdrivers. Roughing it up only to find it goes together differently. That things a classic man!
Your videos documenting disassembly are better than a book. I am gradually learning to use pictures of questionable steps in order to supplement my failing memory. Some things are relatively easy to figure out based on purpose. The pin riding on the wear-plate would hold the shaft in the correct position and capture the impeller, but it seems a circlip for positioning and a repositioned pin might make for a cheaper repair.
Watched one video and subscribed, reminds me of how fun it used to be to hang out in the garage and work on my own stuff, before I started doing it for a living. That took all the fun out of it.
The shift rod seal is kind of a pain to replace, but I would recommend replacing it, the drive shaft seal, and the rope seal. Again, I'd recommend googling "Lee Roy's Ramblings" great info there.
great old school impact driver demonstration! Thank you!
I like watching your stuff because like you say its good to see how stuff works and i never get bored .
I think one of the best parts of your videos is that it's all unscripted... Keeps it real and engaging.
When trying to remove a tight screw, put a dab of valve grinding compound on the screwdriver. It helps to grab the screw.
Hi Mustie1. The video doesnt show it from the right angle. But is it possible that there should be a c-clip in the bottom of that pinion gear, which prevents it from going through? It looks like there is a space for it, because the splines don't go all the way through. Liked the video!
Just watching the video and have a thought on the drive shaft problem. Looking at the length of the splines on the ends of the shift, it looks like the shaft was put in upside down in the past. with the shorter spline down it will not extend through the drive gear. Great site!
I replace the impeller every two years because the rubber on the impeller develops a memory and will not function anymore. i also take a small amount of form a gasket and seal up the pump housing, the round box that you put over the pump. its important to remember which direction those impeller fins were when you took it apart, as the shaft only turns in one direction. and there should be a small keyway that fits into the notch in the impeller along a flat part of the shaft. it may be missing or completely worn away because of the condition of the old impeller. the kit usually comes with a new one. good luck you seem to be on the right track. one other thing is that you should blow some air from the pipe the comes from the pump housing into the engine water jacket and see if anything blows out of the water outlet jet. sometimes when an engine sits, mud daubers and other insects like to build nests in the outlet jet. and crud can build up in the water jacket making the engine over heat as well. and then check to make sure the water intake vents are clear as well. they pick up all sorts of debris like weeds and even silt.
Ah! Memories of staff days at BSA summer camp, an Island on the Delaware River, (1m ix 1/2 mi). Transport to/from mainland was the 4 scows. These were powered with dual 25HP Evinrudes. Those were maintained by the retired Sea Bee Master Chief "Russ". During the week the scows were used for supplies, But Saturdays were a mad house with the arriving/departing Scout Troops. The river was shallow on the PA side so a reasonable quantity of shear pins were expended. all the scows had a toolbox with pliers, cotter pins and shear pins.
And you got a steal of a deal on that motor its super clean no electrolysis going on
if you decide to not go with the hardened washer when you put it back together, I would at least make sure the flush side is down so you get full engagement of the pin - the previous mechanic may have had it flipped ? By the way while you were prying on the shift linkage I was getting anxious for you to pull the bolt out!! LOL Again thanks for letting us into your garage
I rebuilt the lower unit and water pump on my 67 evinrude 40hp. It had a drive key and it did. Or ride against the wear plate. I do not recall if it had something to keep it from going into the pinion too far. You can normally find good parts diagrams on iboats website to see if there's something missing.
I was screaming "take the bolt out!".
Hi Mustie1 for what its worth I would drill another pin in the shaft a little above the other!! so its more central to the pump drive, eliminate the problem all together , great vids man ATB Wayne UK.
I love your videos Mustie1! Wish you were my mechanic guy👍🏽
I used to have a similar motor, a 1951 Super Fastwin about 30 years ago on a plywood runabout. I had to replace the ignition coil and water pump, The biggest pain was the fuel tank, which was pressurized by crankcase pressure. A leaky o ring on the connector, check valve, or loose gas cap would cause the engine to die. I fiddled with the gas tank and barb connectors a lot, and I had to do gravity feed to get it home a few times. I resorted to a mechanic to find the bad check valve, but by then I had a bigger boat to redo. It would have been a good museum piece but I used it and got the perfect paint all scratched up trying to keep it running.
Ah my sunday dose of mustie vids :) i am happy
So am I.
COFFEE TIME WITH MUSTIE---LOVE IT
HELL YEAH CAPTAIN KIRK!
Marco Stet you're lucky im in a monday morning 5 brushing and rushing.... eork has to wait... 🙄😜☕️☕️☕️
One reason there might be water in the gear case is condensation (as it has sat for years), but another thing to check is to make sure the seal behind the prop isn't wrapped in fishing line. I just had that happen to the outboard on my pontoon. Wasn't a lot of water in there (similar to the amount that you had in your engine), but the fishing line creates enough of a path for the water to make its way past the seal and into the gear case.
don't forget that the wear plate also works as a seal for the water that whole compartment pushes water the water can go to the top or the bottom of the blades as well as past the blades that's probably how you got water into your gearbox the wear plate wore out and push water up inside.... I'm glad you start when we start I appreciate your buffoonery and your boondoggles bombacity chicanery that's all I know that's the only funk and wagnals I got I think it's number two and three
WHAT?
I love watching someone fumble around for the first time with something I have had apart many times. I'm just sitting here saying; You have to remove that shift shaft bolt completely before the shafts will come apart, Flip over the impeller and you'll get another 5 years out of it, good luck with the gear assembly screws!, You need to take off the prop first lol. I am just getting a kick out of watching someone figure it all out for the first time. These engines were so simple and just great engines.
You missed the fact that the impeller was made for a larger diameter drive shaft.
@@JoeBlowski I must have lol.
Thanks! I am watching with detail, cause I have to work on my 1964 40hp and it has almost the same setup.
Another fun one, Mustie. Goofy way to design that system like you said. I guess they were trying not to overthink it.
That is exactly how you fill the gear case in an outboard - fill from the bottom. I just hope you can get the bolts out. More often than not they are corroded into the holes because of galvanic corrosion. I usually ended up breaking a few of them off and had to drill them out and use an easy out to get them out. I always coated the screws with RIG when I put them back in and replaced the sacrificial anode if it had one. Outboards are a PITA because they were usually not designed for maintenance or repair. I always though OMCStuff was a little easier to work on than Mercs.
I've never seen inside the business end of an outboard. Thanks.
Well, with a new guide plate in place and putting it back together as it was, the impeller drive pin will still be running at the bottom of the impeller. I have always had the idea of drilling another pin hole in the shaft, 1/4" above the existing pin hole. Add a second pin to the shaft, and this will locate in the center of the impeller. Just a thought, I have not actually tested this idea.Also, the drive shaft should have a clip of some kind,down on the pinion gear to reduce it from sliding so far down.
Really enjoy your channel, just stumbled upon it. Love the outboard and small engine repair. Ol retired guy. Keep up the good work!!
I recommend adding a nylon button on the end of the shaft inside the pinion gear. .125" thick would keep the pump vane pin engaged more towards the center of the drive slot in the vane.
I like this video as I was born in 56 and being the same age, I like to see "Older" engines given a second chance ;-)
edit. 27:02 i did find an image of a gear case diagram. of a 1957. like cyigearup2 said. retaining ring "number 21" is missing. i think this should be in the bottom of the gear pinion and the axle just stand on top of the retaining ring preventing to sink down.
but a diagram of a 56 looks like it does not have any. strange. but it could be frankensteined a bit. i had a evinrude with a johnson tail.
not the thing forget this piece. (is it possible there has to be or can there been put a single ball off a ball-bearing in the center point of the drive shaft. and then rest on the horizontal axle. just too keep the drive shaft up a bit? so the pin is in the center of the impeller more or less. do make shure there is no possible way to loose the ball and damage the gearings though!
even if it is not surpose to be like that, maybe you can inprove this strange construction this way.)
always smart to replace the pump when the vanes arent straight out anymore Mustie..good move bud! cheers!
Found myself screaming at the computer. "Take out the damn bolt in that shift connector". But you figured it out. And didn't even break anything.
Haggetts Marine on Airport Road Concord, NH has lots of NOS seals and bearings for those old JohnRude motors. ( Johnson/Evinrude came off the same line and parts are interchangeable )
Later versions of those shafts had a Key instead of the pin. ( At least on the 28 and 40 horse versions ) Much more positive drive on the pump.
There usually is an "O" ring on the shaft where the spline goes into the Crank.
This is to keep water out of the internal spline and rusting out the crank, a common problem.
Makes it a bear to get the shaft out of the crank sometimes. Grease up the spline where it goes into the crank.
Still running my 1971 JohnRude on a regular basis. Was on Massabesic Lake today ( Sunday April 30 ) as a matter of fact with my 1971 StarCraft.
april ?
On the Massabesic Lake you travels three months back in time, apparently :-)
Pete Shannon maybe that lake is a time portal
I made those observations before you did the close-up of the worn area where you stated that it looked like the pin had somehow rode out of its barrier. I would wonder about the possible clearances of the impeller shaft and pin size. My next guess would be that due to age those tolerances would be off 10 to 20 thousandths off.
I'm thinking the pinion gear splines are worn vertically allowing the shaft to drop down , in turn affecting the pump impeller key height. Outboards SLAM into action,..that's a lot of hammering and over time causing wear.
I think the drive shafts moves upward when you put it in gear, which moves the key upward into the center of the impeller. At idle out of gear they do not need a lot of cooling. This is just my memory from 40 years ago.😎
It's great that you can hear us when we are talking to you... cause I was saying "surely you can call a friend and ask" BOOM! and you did! another awesome video. #phoneafriend
your like me, not afraid to tear into it, to see what went wrong, all of your videos, are great keep them coming
""Totally agree, much more interesting tom discover as you go. By the way, you missed one screw!
That rubber impeller looks to have a Key or a shaft that may have a matching channel.
Love those old Evinrude/Johnsons. Beautiful motors
The impeller and the shaft are running at the same speed so there is no way that the bush should get 'burnt out'. Like you said someone has put the wrong impeller into that engine. I'm not sure I could live with the crap design of the drive shaft, it needs something to hold it in the right position and control end float.
Those are cool old engines i have a Johnson about that same vintage. I think where the shaft fits into that lower gear about a quarter inch from going threw there should be a Cclip inside the gear. Kinda like the clip that holds a piston wrist pin in. Wish i knew the term but.... look in the end of the gear there should be a grove for a c clip
From memory back in the 80's you might be missing a ball bearing we used to have to stick in place on shaft with grease
Your best bet is to google it and see if anything is missing. You said someone has already been in there. So they might have left a part out. I normally do that if I dont know the specs or way things work. Always someone that's done it on UA-cam anyway so you can get info that way. Enjoy it.😜
I agree . . . learn / discover as you go . . . plus if you bought a manual for each piece of equipment you worked on, you'd need another garage to be a library to store them all . . . :) Rog
There were a couple smaller Evinrudes in the inventory, that were used for the V-bottom runabout. It was for the Camp Director, and any emergencies. I think they were 12HP.
I believe you need to drain a little gear oil out after the oil spills out of the vent hole.
I service my 60hp mercury myself, the manufacturers service instructions direct letting a little oil drain from fill plug after lower unit is full, for heat expansion. Otherwise, may run a risk of blowing out the lower unit oil seals in hot weather/water operation.
I wish I had access to some of the people in your neighborhood that discards such good STuFFFF!!!!
I'm not exactly sure the relationship between the key in the shaft and how it holds things together, but that recess in the impeller leads me to think maybe it was designed to have a small spacer in there from the get go. The damaged one's brass center shows there is some pressure/friction on it's face. That would be the perfect place for a hardened spacer.
Hey Mustie, love your video's! I think I see what the issue might be and no I know nothing about outboard motors. The shift fork, try installing it on the top side of the shaft. Almost looks like the pump shaft would then ride on top of that lifting it some so the pin sits in a better position in the impellor.Gregb
How to chang to a fuel pump on a 55 evenrude
Good to see that you finally got your cast off.