Adventures at AMD: AMD and the Linux Kernel
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- Опубліковано 4 січ 2024
- Wendell gets the inside scoop on what the fine folks at AMD are doing for the Linux community!
Be sure to check out the other video in this series where Wendell takes a deep dive into the history of Threadripper: • Adventures at AMD: Ori...
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Intro and Outro Music By: Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License
creativecommons.org/licenses/b... - Наука та технологія
I love AMD chatting to us on this level of complexity. Go Wendell
chatting is nice, but even Intel has better support for stuff like Coreboot than AMD
Another great story about AMD's openness - back in the day when some developers wanted to create Amiga OS 4 they knew that they needed to create graphics drivers, so they reached out to AMD and NVidia requesting documentation necessary for developing those graphics drivers. AMD delivered everything needed - NVidia never even responded.
Until recently, the only time Nouveau driver team got some Nvidia documentation was for their ARM SOC. So for a long time only Fermi and Kepler cards were kind of usable with FOSS drivers on Linux. The proprietary driver is solid but only Linux x86 compatible and for a long time it lacks native resolution framebuffer (meaning TTY were on default VGA mode).
And how much do we want to bet, the AI clusters out there are running Linux?
I finally got some money from working in tech. I got the 7900XTX and 7800X3D just for the Linux support alone. If there only was adrenaline software for Linux, my life would be complete!
You are on linux, you should compile your on adrenaline
@@asmrnaturecat984 hmmm, I did not know that the source is available. Thanks for the tip.
Its not lol @@zipkitty
It's livable w/o adrenaline, at least I don't find anything useful you would need on Linux.
duuude what i needed the most right now are adrenaline GUI on linux, i don't care if it "bloat" it i have 32GB ram so bring it on!
I am so happy that you advocate/lobby stuff to the key people that are important to us peasants like iommu and GPU virtualization in general , you are da real MVP
I'm glad you keep bringing up the virtualization stuff. Like ECC memory, it is NOT an optional enterprise thing, but a critical capability that has been completely neglected in the consumer space and as a result untold amounts of damage has been done. Securely confining things from each other is the only way forward when it comes to security.
Software Engineers, or should I say engineers in general, working on specific things that they truly enjoy, are easily amongst the most exciting to talk to people. Get a bad rep and get stereotyped as "nerds", but they enjoy their work a lot. Can't say the same about a lot of professions.
(Maybe I'm biased as a Computer Scientist but hey. :D)
Great video Wendell. You should prod AMD folks about ROCm next time, I'm getting tired of Nvidia (deep learning of course!).
The masses mock what they don’t want understand because that would take respect for others and ultimately themselves. /s
As a Computer Scientist we have the last laugh - we are laughing all the way to the bank with the pay. :-)
I like it when you can have direct conversation with people actually developing the software and hardware, it is much more deep conversation. But I think the features that use to be server only coming to consumer hardware was the best things. Its nice being able to run containers and virtual machines instead of having multiple systems.
Big thanks to AMD and Wendell for the awesome discussion and video.
I'm not just a Linux fan, but an AMD fan too! I got my first AMD 486 DX 80 processor way back when and was happy to see Intel had competition, and competent competition at that! It gave my 33MHz system quite the boost! When the Pentium came out their prices were high, but AMD came out with the K series and again at a much better price and so I got a K6, then I moved to an Athlon, then an Athlon II Phenom which became my first Linux only box, and now I'm rippin' threads like nobodies business with Tux at my side, but still haven't got a better GPU because of the price gauging still in process!
Even if they don't completely have their shit together, they are way better than NVIDIA as far as Linux is concerned. Meanwhile Intel is still charging a higher price, for a questionably "better" processor. Well at least Intel is good with Linux support too, and their GPU's are not bad given the circumstances.
What I want from AMD:
* Coreboot / libreboot support
* SR-IOV on consumer GPUs
* CEC support on consumer GPUs
* HDMI 2.1 support on consumer GPUs
* A graphical control panel with the same amount of features available for Windows
This was awesome Wendel!
Absolutely loved this.
Awesome start to the year Wendell! Super charming interview with 3 Computing Menschen.
Amazing piece of content, thank you!
I would really love to see SRIOV support on more of thier GPUs, it would be a massive help when trying to use hypervisors like proxmox and virtualisation in general.
I like the format of this video. The breakaway to commentary is a great touch. It's certainly better than just a rant or VLOG type video.
This is AMAZING! I'm so excited to see this sort of work being done - even better that there are open standards and the Linux kernel is getting so much love with this amazing new tech!
That intro was amazing! So hyped!
Thank you! Happy new year!
you showed so many peeks and snippts, I hope this will be a series! Yet alone the ECC test was surely longer (he was about to insert a non-correctable error)
Wendell, I am a fan of how the intro was edited. This was a great video as well!
Same! "Future Wendell" popping in with context where applicable, rather than interrupting the guys, worked exceptionally well.
Thanks Wendell. Next time, you should have asked about vendor-locking CPUs to a single-vendor's motherboards.
Great conversations to be having!
I really enjoyed this, thank you Wendell!
Thank you for bringing all of this up. I want to run a single server for my household and then everything is just a thin client. You can do it but virtualization is a pain. Whenever I attempt deploying a VM and try passing through a GPU the AMD drivers can't recognize it. I really wish this were just plug and play. Hopefully we will get there if you keep pushing it.
wendell that opening music goes hard.
I'm a simple man, i see Wendell, Linux and Kernel, i murder that like button until UA-cam DDOSed 🔥🚀
Stellar content as always guys ❤
Happy new year to you and all your family 🙏🏽
I'm from India and this by far is your best video ever, Wendell !
You Rock, AMD Rocks !
love the intro AND music :D
Running Linux EOS on a full AMD system, and it's flawless. Great work!
This was really great stuff!
Very nice "little keyboards" call out on Jaun's laptop sticker!
Amazing video with amazing insights.
love the intro!
That's crazy and and all but when are they giving us SMBus host notify?
WOW. Great Episode !! I agree on the phone VM system.
I wish Google Pixel would go with a mainstream chip like ARM so GrapheneOS might be more available for other phones eventually.
It can be done since I have a phone that has VM From boot up that is locked down for a medical device. When got it looked it up and it’s a $300 Samsung device which I thought was overkill for what it does. Can’t even install any other apps on there and always in Airplane mode.
Really liked those AMD guys.
Good Job!
Great to see from AMD engineers. More of this please!
Go AMD. All the CPU's I've bought in the last 10+ years have been AMD.
You have my admiration and condolences for weathering through the FX era
@@DrathVader Bulldozer was the worst, though K10 and Zen1 were not great either.
I'll eat my hat if you haven't actually bought more ARM CPUs but you're just not counting them 😝
@@majorgnu In every AMD Zen there is an ARM core so it's not very difficult. Though if you count every microcontroller embedded in our electronic devices then there is probably even more good old 8051, AVR and mips. Might even got a couple of Risc-V as well.
@@PainterVierax Zen 1 was alright for mid ranged Gpu's of its time especially for the price, if albeit the memory stability and the compatibility starting out left a lot to be desired.
Nice, more of this.
Glad these dudes exist! They are awesome!
this is so funny to watch as I sometimes get these kinds of hardware errors as notifications on my desktop system and I'm so happy that linux can just keep running with no issues. Interestingly I have a habit of unearthing things like this with Minecraft every few years, but this time I've only had a single random crash in Xorg, but no data corruption in minecraft or my browser :3
This is cool, i'm happy they are doing this, currently AMD processors are the superior ones on the market, what i care is price/performance/efficiency ratio, and they bang. Keep doing good work!
I wish I had a better understanding of all this. What I am getting from the conversation is AMD and Linux is a good thing. It already is, and it's getting better. Great. I use MacOS, Windows and Linux. Yet I know the least about linux. So, thanks for the video Wendell! I love this stuff!
That's actually kind of rare, as Linux is the OS it's the most easy to learn everything about since everything is in the open, and most Linux projects obsess about having good documentation.
Godly...I love this intro!
You're right! I don't think we really understand how big of a deal these "datacenter-oriented" technologies will be to personal computing in the future.
One of the main problems slowing things down, which will grow into a bigger headache with time, is the irreproducability and undefined nature of our environments. This is critical for debugging, compatibility, security, reliability, knowability, predictability,.... The application, the development, and the server environments; from snap, to docker, to qubes and nixos, to infra & config as code solutions: there have been many efforts pointing in vaguely similar directions, trying to solve a range of vaguely similar problems, at many different scales.
But all signs converge: I'm 100% certain that minimal-overhead isolation and virtualization (in some sense) is the future of computing.
What an amazing video! Thanks for making this one and thanks to those who participated
i love this kind of videos
Cool Video Sir!
Tell them to fix the Legacy Drivers so I stop getting the Blinking Cursor of Death when trying to install Debian on Older systems lol.
I'd pull my hair out if I had any left.
New Sub; Dryden, Mich.
Nice outro!
Sr-iov on consumer gpus when?
Will SEV allow for anti-cheat to not be so dumb about gaming in a vm?
I'd love to go vdi for my normal use, and clean up my desk, but without the gaming stuff working I'll have to keep it on my desk.
Uber nerdy, love it
The AMD rep is definitely talking to Wendell as a individual and not for a video when not opening the acronyms :D
Yeah! And it was great. A conversation between people that aren't necessarily "peers," but both recognize that the other is about on their level of understanding and expertise.
It blows my mind
I would LOVE to have a way to run my professional Windows (or mac) CAD/CAM programs, which is very ironic considering the existence of LinuxCNC!
Imagine having a professional tier CNC controller OS but not be able to run AutoCAD...
It's not the os not being able to run Autocad, and more Autocad not being able to run on the system. You should be talking to the software vendor :)
A ton of interesting information, but the editing really made it for me
I've gone 100% AMD since 2017 and have even built a lot of AMD based systems for other people since then as well.
I really do look forward to the day that I can build one high-powered server and stream my games from it to the Steam Deck. I would prefer if it was a completely virtual GPU instead of messing about with PCI-Passthrough.
I would also love to see every computing device use ECC RAM and have diagnostic software. Why shouldn't I be able to teat my RAM, CPU and storage for errors and defects on my phone?
Do the sections where you're sitting at your desk have a slight rolling-shutter/wobble effect going on? If you watch your face there's an occasional line that slides down and kinda shears your forehead. I didn't notice it in the other clips. But great video! (I'm just being picky :) )
Holy shit this sort of AMD/Linux content just gives me a freakin h**d-on. LOL!
Help me! The intro song triggered so much nostalgia, but from where???
I'd still love to know if AMD is ever going to introduce tools to under overclock threadripper on Linux. Is best I can tell there's some clutch solutions out there, but most solutions are you do it from the bios which is meh.
Wendell when do we get a studio tour 2024 edition?
Having to talk to more people for the Linux kernel compared to talking with one Windows-team, that seems a good thing to me, not a double edged sowrd. Yes, it takes longer. So what? With more eyes on the code and more people actively engaged longer in discussing how to approach it you also get beter code at the end.
YA! LEVEL1Linux!
I don't understand everything here, but will it change few game developers stand on gaming in vm?
Is the best component hardware to run Linux, not only normally, but optimally - an all AMD system, or Intel- Nvidia, or Intel-Radeon?
You had some caffeine before this one son! You're fired up😂
Keep fighting the virtualization fight!
Maybe the scheduler fixes will help my X3D CPU on Linux as Linux doesn't seem to properly utilize it, ive noticed it just uses all my 32 cores in my 7950X3D,, Linux doesn't seem to bother with vcache cores..
Epic intro
I'm confused. the opening music is same as HPC (HydraulicPressChannel) :D
Just don't go putting Threadrippers in hydraulic presses and alll will presumably be well! (and there will be less tears, too!)
I think it's a royalty free riff from somewhere.
Would those new security features that isolate the VM memory from the hypervisor even further theoretically allow for a Windows VM that can run anti-cheat and they won't throw a fit about it? That would be a big save for just having a League of Legends VM since they want their rootkit anti-cheat Vanguard.
Wondering this too
Yeah, my 7900XTX can still only be used by 1 OS at a time. Whither VGPU?
Did you see Zen 5 ?
Rocm for consumer cards and make it easier to install. Make it part of the driver!
ROCm is supported on the RX 7900 XTX and recently the RX 7900 XT. (Hopefully the cards lower down the stack also get support over time.)
Edit: Personally I’m using ROCm on my RX 7900 XTX to self host an AI model.
Why the flags at half mast @ 00:17
I just realized (and I'm only 40 seconds in, so I don't know if it's discussed at all) that both AMD and Intel have Linux kernel developers on payroll; by a certain way of thinking, those developers are almost coworkers, despite working for competing companies.
See, THIS is what I subscribe for! Thank you Wendell, that's awesome.
A thought ~ there is money in (let's say for example) encrypted virtual machines. You and a few other Linux geeks have an interest in gaming, and doing pass-through of video cards. Alright, that's nice, now who are your big software / gaming companies? Are Disney in on this? Are EA Games in on this? Is Play Station in on this? (X-box is Micro$oft and they still think Linux is a cancer. They're not doing it.) Who wants it, and has money to pay for it, and will make a screaming_motza of profit from it?
As long as nobody is going to get rich from it, then it isn't going to happen.
It's going to remain the plaything of Linux Neck_beards like us.
--- Let's take this a step further.
Adobe own a suite of software that hooks into the Window$ operating system, to do some clever things. People pay money for that. Are they going to port this to Linux? Not unless they can be pretty confident that Linux users and businesses and such, are going to cough up money. Does the existing Linux User_base show a willingness to cough up money? (That's the sound of tumble-weed rolling past ~ )
Photo-chop -> GIMP ... meh. There is a degree of equivalence, but the use case is rather different ...
What about Chat_GPT? I dunno if there's a client for that in Linux or not. I'm trying not to find out ...
There's not going to be a Year Of The Linux Desktop until greedy old business people can see a way to get rich ~ in the way that Bill Gates saw in 1980 to get rich, was to *GIVE* IBM an operating system, as long as he had a guaranteed monopoly. He saw a path to world domination and nobody else saw it. Until somebody in the Linux world sees a path to world domination ....
Okay, now you need to get yourselves some velomobiles :D
I installed Linux Ubuntu on an older laptop with AMD CPU. Problem was when logging in the screen went black. I had to reboot the laptop at least three times to be able to login into the desktop. I tried a few suggestions like adding bad drivers to the block list and installing the AMD Linux drivers on AMD website to no avail. I reverted back to windows at least the laptop is usable now.
you dont need to mess with amd drivers on linux, whatever the problem was def wasnt the driver.
probably xorg or whatever ubuntu uses now
How can the kernel detect such memory errors?
I just wished my Ryzen 7 3700U based HP Envy x360 wouldn't crash on wakeup from s2idle without having to patch the acpi tables.
that intro gave me "you wouldnt download amd linux kernel modules" vibes.
but. I would
Was the Wendell who inserted commentary between shots made with AI?
I containerize my gaming and stuff using systemd namespaces with separate UIDs instead of VMs. Mainly because I don't want to run windows at all and I don't want to deal with GPU pass-through so containers keep things isolated without going overboard. I have not joined the church of IOMMU
Wooooo linux!
Still waiting on a proper implementation of Passthrough on the desktop. c'mon AMD
Amen onthd phone bit!
1:19 BANGLORE MENTIONED
Amdgpu modules for 6.5+ when?
yep gotta get the Virtualization love , sucks how its disabled in bios by default and buried away to enable ... some also mean you have to void warranty to get into the menu to enable .. absolute stupidity, I just wish you could still use GPU on the host when passed to guest's
Welcome to the Hydraulic Linux Channel
Aaaah....virtualization options...oh my.
Now do nvidia and linux kernal
I am reminded of a certain meme of a certain linus
worst possible combination honestly
AMD has been absolutely killing it on Linux for the past decade.
wendell doin God's work
Good video
very good - even Xilinx is going same good route :)
It is always one line of code!
ARM has TrustZone Virtualization!
love amd but they forgot good cpu compatibility for first Zen arch on linux... amd-pstate is not compatible and the kernel uses some generic driver, and can only use 3 speeds.