I grew up near Hahndorf, where, as a kid it was just another local town. It didn’t turn “touristy” until the 70’s I’d say, with the advent of things like Sunday (alcohol) trading started and a general expansion of tourism in Australia happened. The kids I went to school with, including Otto’s daughter, were essentially Australian. So I’m not surprised a lot of the German soul has been bred out of the town. It’s always been a quaint place for Adelaide folk to visit on the weekend to get out of town. To us locals it was a place to avoid on Sundays. But worth a quick trip to Otto’s for a feed any other day. Reasonable review but I could’ve told you you won’t find little Germany there.
That's so interesting! Yes, there was a lot of people there over the weekend! We haven't filmed much with so many people around so it was certainly a challenge, hopefully it didn't show that we did feel a little uncomfortable :) Still a lovely place to visit, even if it's not as 'German' as we thought it might be
They should learn as part of the heritage. Other cultures learn many languages, but Anglo-Saxons look like they can't 😂. That make all of look kinda generic like English.
A lot of Germans who came over were determined to fit into the Australian culture. When my great-grandparents came over they didn't want their kids speaking German because they were Australian now and they wanted to embrace the culture and speak English. There was also a lot of stigma and racism around Germans until they embraced the Australian culture and became part of the country
Australian from German descent here, the German was passed down a couple of generations in my family, my grandfather was able to speak it but he never taught my mother. In another area in SA my family settled, I do have still have at least one family member who speaks German but he's not passed it onto his kids (as far as I know)
My partner and I live in the Adelaide Hills. He is from Germany and he always calls Hahndorf the Chinatown of Germany 🙈 We still go up 1-2 times a year to get his German beer and sauerkraut fix ☺️
Omg haha 😅 that is such a good call! Had to share that with our German parents who are here with us at the moment. Maybe your husband has to open a bakery or restaurant and make some good original German food ♥️
Please read about the history of Hahndorf to understand why it is the way it is. It was settled by Lutheran Germans who were being persecuted in their own country. They came and settled here; (my husband's great grandparents were some of them) bringing their traditions with them but also over time assimilated with the locals. Their offspring became more australian and so some of the traditions/way of cooking etc became a melange of german and aussie. A lot of the main street is heritage listed; the old buildings you like were built by the german settlers - using local materials so of course couldn't be 100% german. Today it is a tourist town; holding onto the history of the area. There is a genuine german bakery off the tourist strip that does the bread you were looking for, pity you didn't know about that.
That bakery no longer exists . The proprietor now runs the German Cakeshop in the main drag opposite the Hahndorf hotel. It purchases genuine german bread and pretzels from brezel bakery in Mount Barker which bakes on Friday and Saturday and the owners are fluent german speakers. Children of more recent migrants than the old Lutherans !
Yes, good point. We made a video about the Barossa and went to a bakery where the owner gave us a tour of the 100 year old oven and explained the history and settlement of the area, we loved the Adelaide Hills region ❤️
My mother wrote a history of Hahndorf back in the 1960's. It was published by Rigby's. She interviewed many of the oldest residents who were able to tell her a lot about the earliest days of the settlement. As a teenager my mother had lived in Hahndorf for while with a German aunt who had some quaint habits inherited from her forebears.
@@lapwithnomap Another weird place with German origin is a village north of Albury in NSW. It started out as Ten Mile Creek, then, due to a majority of German settlers, became Germanton, because the erasing policy of WW I had it named into Holbrook after a British commander of a British submarine in Europe. Now the decommissioned HMAS Otway submarine has been placed in a park next to the busy Hume Highway in line with the Australian culture of "Big Things", appearing like it has just submerged through the soil after a subterranean journey to that spot. However, no "Bavarian" culture in that village.
1st mistake, thinking it's going to be German in Australia, just because it was started by Germans, all cultures coming together, is what makes our food Australian, you have to remember, they couldn't get stuff readily from Germany and had to adapt, even beers in early days were made without hops, using a native plant instead. 2nd mistake, going to 1 of the biggest tourist places in Adelaide and thinking you were going to get non commercial food (instant mash is sacrilegious), all fastfood and a lot of tourist places use premade food (schnitzel for example) and commercial suppliers, I lived in Adelaide in 90s and was way different, it was a gimmick then and even more so these days.
Kaffehaus is what Otto’s used to be. BALHANNAH Bakery bought the property and kept the name Otto’s. Mum still makes the yeast buns and one of her daughters makes the other sweets. Otto passed away a couple of years ago 😢 Nobody speaks German anymore. I drove through last week thinking I would miss it when I did but honestly I’m glad I moved. It’s not like it used to be but I’m glad I had some of the good time there, when the locals all knew each other. You went to the worst German Pub. No locals go there. The German Cake Shop closed last week for a reason 😂
Oh yes 👍🏻 we really liked the Kaffeehaus!!! Sorry to hear that Otto passed away a few years ago must be a legend there! Interesting to hear you think it’s the worst pub. I had a look at the reviews and it was decent. Wouldn’t go back after our experience though
@@lapwithnomap the last time I went there to “support local” I got a chicken schnitzel with mushroom sauce because who can stuff that up right? The mushrooms were champignons out of a can!
@@claireskinner9077 with a kitchen full of not one German. You are correct though. The Haus does have half decent food. I’ve not been put the Old Mill since being taken over by the Woolshd mob is supposed to be ok too.
@@karen1351 OMG that's appalling! That's what we found on our trip around Oz, cafes/restaurants can be hit and miss (and expensive). We have cooked a lot for ourselves for that reason. We still think it was packet mix mashed potatoes we had in Hahndorf, very disappointing
My mother’s family came from Hahndorf they were some of the first pioneer families in that area. My Mum told me that they weren’t encourage to speak German because of the shame of the second world war. It was frowned upon and their language & heritage was kept hidden because of the Nazi stigma. ☹️
Wow yeah that’s interesting! We also read that the towns name was changed with the anti German sentiment around WW2 times. Would be so interesting to talk to some of the locals who moved here originally and listen to their stories and how the place has changed over the years
@@lapwithnomap Not WW II. The "anti-German" sentiment did eventuate from WW I (1914-1918). In a recent report a current teenage girl (~13 years of age) was shown correcting a language club of older residents, having German roots and being taught the language by their ancestors, how ordinary German is spoken and written now. There were a lot of stunned faces, looking like being stock of an outdated museum. On closer inspection, one can clearly see how mixed up these people are. 2:40 The coat of arms on the right of the sign is the one of the Federal State of Lower Saxony in the North of Germany. It has a lot of links to the former state of Prussia and kingdom of Hannover, strong opponents of the State of Bavaria within the German Federation. 2:57 The musical Duo is dressed in that code, so the music in this "Lower Saxonian" village is not of Nordic origin but linked to the Oktoberfest style of the South. Well, matching the cliche of tourists what Germany should be like. 3:50 Beer Steins - Bavarian culture ... say no more. 4:23 Brezel ...Bavarian ... 8:56 So much alcohol. Australia is having a limit for drivers of 0.05%. Don't risk your license or someone else's life. 9:10 Cuckoo Clocks are typical for the Southwest, the Black Forest only. More mixing of culture. Thanks for your honest and straightforward review and rating. I have been living in Melbourne for 40 years and started out before that as a tourist from Germany on an exploration trip in 1982. All the time, based on information similar to this report, I have given Hahndorf a big miss, especially as I am not fond of locations like Disneyland, orientating themselves on what tourists want to pay for and not what one can present to them as one's culture and history.
Nomenclature Act during WW1 changed several hundred names. Also you wouldn't be able to speak to any of my Hahndorfer ancestors as they mostly arrived in SA in 1830s and 40s. They were mostly Silesians and spoke a variant dialect. My families include names such as Tepper, Koop, Schroeder, Nitschke, Seidel... My grandfather still spoke Platt- Deutsch @@lapwithnomap
The legacy of every immigrant group reflects things from the old country they wanted to keep, the choices they had to make to adapt to their new home, and the reasons they left their homeland, and hence the conscious decisions they made to let go of certain aspects of history and culture.
The cafes in Hahndorf have more Aussie customers than German so it makes sense that they would amend their menus to suit the locals' tastes albeit with a Germanic influence.
It's to be expected. The German people who made and built the town are actually Aussies because they were born here. The people who would speak German would also speak in an older fashioned way because they were cut off from the evolving language back in Germany. Most of the people are descendants of those German settlers but these days, yup, they are basically Aussies with maybe a slighty German twist to their food and culture.
Yep, it's interesting to see how those early settlers shaped the town and how different things were back then. I read in the museum that the women would walk to Adelaide to attend markets and sell their goods! Would have been a tough way to earn a living!
@@lapwithnomap also a lot of German schools and the language was suppressed during WW1-Hahndorf’s name was only reinstated in 35 and a few places never had their names reinstated. Also those children of settlers who learned English a lot of the time didn’t bother teaching their children German-thus the language diminished. In the Barossa there is a specific German dialect which attempts have been made to document and retain it
That's so interesting! Yes, we read that the town name was changed to Ambleside due to the anti-German sentiment during WW1. There was still a few places under this previous name such as Ambleside Distillery @@p4tchwerk
German was the mother tongue of both of my grandmothers but my parents only knew a few words in German due to the stigma of the two world wars. My mother remembered not being able to have much direct conversation with her maternal grandfather due to him not being able to speak much English and her knowing next to no German.
Actually we are predominantly of "Prussian" descent. But it is true, very few genuine food places exist now. "Linke's" meats are gone from the barossa, too. And "klemzig" was set up before Hahndorf.
Guten Tag! When passing thru Melbourne, how about a German pub crawl and review? Hofbrauhaus, The Hof, Munich Brauhaus, Beer DeLuxe, HopHaus, German Club, Belgian Beer Cafe, Bratwurst Shop, Gasthaus, Cuckoo Restaurant, and the Pension Grimus Mt Buller (winter). If you are are anywhere near Omeo, not sure if they are retired, but there was a Cookoo Shop at Omeo. Cheers, Klaus.
Guten Tag Klaus, that's an awesome idea! Who wouldn't love an excuse to drink German beer and eat some bratwurst haha! Thanks for all the great suggestions we'll certainly have a look into it ❤️
When I migrated to Melbourne from West-Germany in 1984, some older German migrants of the post-war generation questioned me about my motivation as in their opinion Germany had been rebuilt and there was no reason to leave for Australia anymore. A lot of Australians are crazy chasing German industrial products for their perfection, however, when one is being employed in a trade and wants to practice that perfection here, the process leading to it is regarded as "too slow", being "sand in the gearbox", grabbing a fast profit. It should look "German" without the "expensive" quality. This fakeness is being represented in the running of Hahndorf as a "fast tourist buck processor". Not only there. Quite a few of the "German" places Klaus has mentioned have deteriorated, sold on or even closed when the original owners retired or passed on. The original Hofbräuhaus in Market Lane inside is clearly advertising DAB, Dortmunder Beer. A "Prussian" product ... (Even the famous football/soccer club is "Prussian". Borussia Dortmund). Considering Melbourne, it does have a lot of German history, which, however, due to the suppression in the 2 World wars has been watered down if not washed away severely. What is left are suburban names with not much meaning or visible history such as Altona, Heidelberg, Coburg, "Waldau" now Doncaster, "Germantown" now Thomastown, "Westgarthtown" now Northcote and Brunswick. The establishment of the Botanical Gardens has been the work of Baron Ferdinand von Müller. Will one hear German here ? Rarely, most of them will be tourists from that country.
If you check out the local cemeteries you will see that the inscriptions on tombstones suddenly changed from German to English in 1914. Can't think why.
I live in Adelaide, and went to Hahndorf last year for the first time in years. Nice little town. I am Catholic now, but my grandparents Carl and Freida Strehlow were Lutheran missionaries at Hermannsburg, up in the Northern Territory for over twenty-seven years from 1895 until my grandfathers death in 1922. ( My grandparents returned to Germany in 1910/11 but went back to Australia in 1912,) My grandmother returned to Germany in 1930 to be reunited with her other five children while my father remained in Australia. My father was old when I was born.
There's a tiny little restaurant in an arcade in Perth which does fantastic German food. Toffee Cafe in the Equus Arcade in the CBD. I eat there from time to time and the chef really nails it. But he is a German..... To be fair to Hahndorf, German settlement in the area was in the early 19th century so it's understandable the language has not survived. I'd recommend a visit to the cemetery if you ever visit there again.
Omg we had a look at Toffee Cafe, that looks terrific! Would have loved to go there when we were in Perth. Had to share it with a German friend of ours who's moving there soon 👌🏼
i used to go to the schutzenfest in hahndorf in the early seventies, loved it, loved the beer, the real steins, not plastic, shooting gallery and the excellent food. my mothers side is from munster in NW germany. since the fest came to adelaide it went downhill. took my children but it will never be the same
Danke für Ihren Besuch in Hahndorf! Im Laufe des Jahres finden verschiedene Veranstaltungen statt, die deutsche Geschichte feiern. Hahndorf is definitely one of the most beautiful places in SA ❤
love that place only problem is every store has the same things for sale, the indigenous art gallery has some stunning paintings, and the art gallery across the road has great stuff too,
Matt… there is always room for cake! Really enjoyed this video, especially having a German rate it first hand haha. A perspective that is hard to have for most!
I love Hahndorf ❤️ its definitely super touristy but still such a cute little town with lovely architecture and a very interesting history and is always a fun day out. Me and my hubby love to get our fix of wurst and sauerkraut when we're there. Its especially pretty during Autumn when all the European trees lining the road have golden/red leaves - which is unusual to see in Australia. I think you gave a fair review. 😊
A very entertaining episode! Matt is very good with his German language skills! Very impressive actually! 👏 I like “Weizenbier” too. The variety of beers you can get 0:36 in Germany is mind blowing!! Totally agree that you will have to go to Germany for the real food experience. Particularly as it is regional so specific and varied We don’t have many Bretzels in North Germany. And while we have not hot dogs, rather Bratwurst mit Senf oder Curry Wurst- the Danes over the border are so BIG on HOT DOGS… Looks like you had a great fun time checking it all out!
Das geht runter wie Öl! 😊 we'll have to speak some German with Julius. Yes it's so interesting all the regional cuisines of Germany and surrounding countries. Certainly something that most people don't know about, especially from Australia. If something is popular here it seems to travel everywhere. In Frankfurt they have the "Frankfurter Schnitzel", which is a normal schnitzel topped with a specific selection of seven herbs, each one local to the Frankfurt area, all in specific amounts. Our favorite! We did have a good time, it was busy being a weekend though, lots of other tourists there
Going in two months to Germany and looking forward to have some typical German food from my area! And nice bread! ( Mind you , we are lucky here and have an American dude making the most amazing sour dough breads and the most amazing cake/ Gebäck. so good!!! ) Good idea to speak German with Julius and Brook. They both will benefit from practice! Julius used to be fluent when he was little and understands still heaps…But he never lived in Germany! Hope you two practice your German! So good to have another language!
Weihnachtsmärkte sind das beste! Wir würden gerne irgendwann wiederkommen, um zu sehen, wie sie in Hahndorf sind! Das wäre interessant, da wir Weihnachtsmärkte mit kalten Dezemberabenden und Glühwein verbinden!
A lot of the older people of Handorf have passed on now, and those who are descended from those first families are not always the ones running the shops. Until recently, you could get a decent bienenstich, pre Otto's bakery changing hands from the original family. You would have loved old Mrs Thiele's general store years ago when she was still alive, as it was a step back in time and not at all designed with the tourist in mind. Gordon Kramm has passed, and he was a well loved local who delivered groceries in his van for decades. I believe Noske's butcher shop is still as authentic as it ever was. Many of the families are still here, just not on show :P If you like fachwerk houses, try a drive through Paechtown, where some of the original houses still survive. I think some of the more authentic German aspects are a little hidden, as they aren't always on show to tourists. However, I've never heard German spoken by any in Hahndorf, although some of us did learn it in school. Glad you enjoyed your stay!
It’s was a very small German settlement area, but over time other influences have moved into the area to commercialise the interest of tourists. My grandmothers family were Germans and lived up there as a small town. They were rounded up during the war and sent to a detention camp and the town name was changed during the war.
Hello from a Liebelt descendant - my ancestors came over on Zebra, the ship Captain Hahn commanded. I think the Barossa towns and Klemzig (now an Adelaide suburb) were settled the same time as Hahndorf. I know German was still being spoken by my grandparents generation in the Barossa and the German club still has original German settler descendants that speak German.
As a descendant of German great-great-grandparents, one from Hesse and another from Niedersachsen, when I visit Adelaide from Queensland, I make a pilgrimage with my family to Hahndorf to remind ourselves of our Germanic background! I understand your feedback about the Germanism of Hahndorf, it was unfortunate that German Australians has virtually been assimilated into Australian society though they have left a strong influence in both Queensland and especially South Australia. You might see Schnitzel in almost all pubs in South Australia and occasionally elsewhere in Australia for example. I do make homemade schnitzel with panko crumbs! However, the German language are still being taught in schools especially in Lutheran schools and universities though English is spoken by German Australians. The architecture are different from Europe because of availability of building materials in Australia but German Australians did an amazing adaption of building. Hats off to people who did their best to retain German heritage although it has been adapted a lot just like Chinese dinners were adapted to Australian taste!
Pretty sure during the war all the german sounding towns changed name. Hahndorf became ambleside or something similar. They only changed back once people felt differently after the war amd wanted to claim back their heritage
Quick point, in the 1840s when the "Germans" came to Australia, German was almost synonymous with Central European, as a specific country called Germany didn't exist at the time. The remnants of the Holy Roman Empire were reforming into Austria-Hungary, what had been the north of the Empire had obviously experienced two centuries of turmoil and consisted of many independent states. Sure, German language unified much of central Europe in one sense, but the cultures and local languages were very diverse. So the "Germans" that settled in SA to begin with are actually broader than just the states that form modern Germany. Many came from Prussia, particularly Silesia, but there were also many Bohemians, Moravians, Danes, Poles, Czechs, many from non-German states. Also, there is a dialect of German spoken in Australia...but it's descended from mid-19th Century German, so is a bit different from modern German by that alone. But Barrossa Deutsch (as the dialect is called) is also a hybrid language of several languages - it was formed as a lingua franca by all the different groups that struggled with English but had migrated from the conflicts in Europe at the time. Also, it maintained the divergence from contemporary German changes over the early 20th Century, when there was a lot of oppression of anything deemed "Germanic". It was a sad reality, but while most German-Australians by 1914 were 2nd or 3rd Generation Australian, they were still treated with great suspicion during the wars. German was banned in schools, and was suppressed (although not fully banned) in churches and community groups. And while many sons went to war in Australian uniforms as part of South Australian units, their families were often interred in camps throughout the conflicts. So while German in Australia did recover over the succeeding decades, it almost emphasised the older style and vocabulary of the settlers, rather than adjust to the new styles of contemporary German. Obviously it's still fully mutually intelligible, but Barrossa Deutsch is a bit like reading an olddr Luther Bible, rather than a modern book. (Indeed, the Luther Bible is still in wide circulation in the German speaking circles of Australia.) Also, the Barossa is in many ways more authentically German-Australian than Hahndorf, as Hahndorf has commercialised the concept, whereas the Barossa is naturally German. But even outside the Barossa, in rural SA, there are many places that have a surprising amount of German influence about them. Number one is the sheer number of Lutheran churches - I mean, Adelaide is the City of Churches, but every town has a little collection of churches too, most including a Lutheran Church (the other common ones were Methodist and Reformed (Congregational or Presbyterian), most of whom merged into the Uniting Church in the 70s, Anglican, and Catholic. But in towns with only one or two churches, almost guaranteed one will be Uniting and the other Lutheran or Anglican. The other surprising thing for those visiting is the sheer number of central European names in SA. From mayor lists to club presidents, even war memorials, German names exist right next to British names. It's just what it is to be South Australian.
I suppose they need to cater for what most there are eating. When I went to Hahndorf I did come across a couple of people talking German together. Most of my great grandparents when they came out to Australia during the 1840-1880s were German and a couple of them settled near Hahndorf. In another place my family settled in Sth Australia *Wudinna", I know at least one of my older family members still speak German but i don't think their kids (now adults) do. My Grandfather was also capable of speaking German from his family but he died about 10 years or so ago. So yeah not many of the German settler families still speak German.
I lived in the Barossa during the 1970's, when the people over 70 still spoke 'Barossa Deutsch'. The schools in the Barossa still teach 'proper' High German. Hahndorf is a 'tacky tourist kitsch' town using its origins to attract tourists, without the depth of history of say Birdwood (AKA Blumberg before 1917).
You guys were so polite about your disappointment. Haha. 😂 I am from SA and I agree, it's overrated. Like it's worth a visit, but it's not as good as it's made out to be to tourists. The little cultural clubs that still exist are where you'll find authentic stuff. Thanks for visiting!
I have been there and found it a beautiful place to visit, I agree the food wasn't very German, but it was great food. I thoroughly enjoyed my trip there and will definitely visit it again. As I come from Qld and don't see rabbits, I was surprised at the little rabbit pen at the back of the leather shop.
Totally agree! It's a beautiful little town. Didn't see the rabbits but we did go through the leather shop and the owners were super nice. They do a belt for a lifetime offer where they repair or replace if it breaks, which we both thought was a very unique and cool concept
I think you've misunderstood Hahndorf. I don't think anybody claims that it is a facsimile of *modern* German villages/cuisine/beer etc. It is a town settled by Germans nearly 200 years ago, not a display village at the EPCOT centre in Florida. It's not supposed to be a copy of modern Germany. What elements of German culture have been retained? What have been lost? How do people in Hahndorf descended from Germans think about their heritage? You know what else would probably irritate you? My grandfather still spoke only German at home as a child, in South Australia, until 1914. Even as an old man, he still used old-fashioned words like "Karnickel" (instead of Kaninchen). That's because he spoke the German of the mid 1800's, which is what the immigrants here spoke (and which was sort of frozon in time). I can imagine you complaining, "That's not how we speak German in Germany! I rate the language 2 out of 5. They speak weird German in South Australia!!"
During the world war many towns near hahndorf were renamed except for this town ..now signs have the old names on them which is also interesting. Did u visit Beerenberg the strawberry farm...very famous
@@lapwithnomap And the Fosters in Germany is brewed under a German recipe for being allowed to be called beer, not "Alkoholisches Getränk" (Alcoholic Drink).
My girlfriend is German Australian and we been to Hahndorf a few times. It's a nice day out with some good food. Yes she takes her mash potato and schnitzels seriously lol
Fair comments from you both, and in the comment section. Life moves on, nothing stays the same. We first went to Hahndorf 30 years ago, bought an electric cuckoo clock, which has recently died, but is still on the wall. Maybe we should move on.😂😁
2:45 'Unser Dorf soll schöner werden' is an annual competition to find Germany's most beautiful village. edit: It's mentioned in the UA-cam video below at 15.57 ua-cam.com/video/u05t-zlGgPw/v-deo.html
I think the point is missed on everyone here. In the 19th century the Prussians settled in South Australia when the Brits didn't exactly want or know what to do with this section of land. The Prussians or Germans whatever you want to call them being hard working people farmed the land and > prospered< Furthermore the city of Adelaide was also named after Queen Adelaide who herself was German. South Australia has a proud history of being a Free State it was not settled by convicts like the rest of Australia it was settled by free men. It's not meant to be an exact replica of Germany. It's literally an Australian town that shouldn't forget the people who founded it, it's not meant to be a copy it's meant to pay homage to the people's roots and history that is the point. The families of this area may not speak fluent German but they have the German last names and the German blood.
There's another cuckoo clock shop in Montville, north of Brisbane, that would have to be about twice the size of what I saw in Hahndorf. Hahndorf's may have increased in size since then though, it was over 10 years ago now. I'm not even sure if it was in the same building as it is at present.
Yes we actually went to the cuckoo clock store in Montville. It's bigger and probably better and more authentic than the one in Hahndorf but we didn't see a cuckoo clock Magnet there. Nice shop though!
Unfortunately Hahndorf has because very commercialised during the last 25 or so years. I grew up in the neighbouring town of Verdun, leaving about 1995. There are still alot of people related to the first settlers living there.
How confident are you that the mash was instant style and not just sub par real mash? As a chef I find it very dubious that any pub, let alone one that is plating up that kind of menu, would serve instant mash. With the exception of KFC and Red Rooster, that's not just unacceptable at a theme pub, it's unacceptable in any self respecting food and beverage establishment across Australia in general. Even a kitchen in an RSL bistro that served up instant mash would quickly find itself under review. Sometimes sub par kitchens don't source the correct potatoes for mash (russet, Yukon etc), they're not passed through a chinois, there's not enough butter, seasoning, or a combo of the above. Most classically French trained chefs won't add milk or cream, just butter (lots of butter), but some do. Some will use double cream or creme fraiche depending on the texture they want to achieve, and so on. If you genuinely thought it was instant, you should've asked the staff. If you were correct, I'd be very concerned about what other corners they're cutting in a kitchen with that type of clientele, i.e. humans.
We are pretty confident but you're right we didn't ask. Some people mentioned on the google reviews that they also suspected it was instant mash. In hindsight, we probably should have asked the staff. We'll be sure to do that next time
It's totally instant, mash. I live in Adelaide and have been to Hahndorf so many times. I've also worked in the hospitality industry for 20+ years. It's unmistakable. 1000% instant mash
My Oma and Opa came to Australia in the 60s and I grew up eating amazing food that she made and all of her friends made. When I went to Germany my Tante made great food but the kids, (gotta do something about your kids Marty) did not do food the same way
The Deutsch spoken in the Germanic areas of Australia are not easy for a modern German to understand because the spoken word has not evolved but maintained a kind of status quo.
what hot dogs arent german? Hot dogs were invented in germany, i know the USA kinda went crazy with them but Hot dogs or Frankfurters are very german. I grew up in germany we ate frankfurters and weisswurst every christmas.
Thanks for sharing your perspective! It's interesting how food histories can vary, especially since Germany still has so many regional dishes/foods. While hot dogs may have roots in German sausages like Frankfurters, the modern version as we know it today, with the bun and all, is often attributed to American culture. Thanks for sharing your experience with us! Where did you grow up in Germany?
Someone commented that this town was established by Australians and that’s not true. It was established by Germans escaping persecution in Europe. South Australia is a free state. They went through a lot. Prior to global warming it would snow heavily. As a child we would go there for the snow days. Women had to walk from there down to Burnside village to seek their wares.
There were no freeways in 1839s. The oldest example of the roads left is above Tea Tree Gully at the original nursery now situated in bushland. The road was mud and treacherous.
The town is a celebration of what they achieved prior to cars and electricity. It’s there to enjoy. I have spoken to the guy that sells the hot dogs over the years. He just loves the hot dogs. South Australians take pride in this community and what they had to overcome.
Yes that's true! We were shocked to find out that the women from the village used to walk 35kms through the night to attend Markets in Adelaide to sell their goods!! Mind boggling
@@lapwithnomap Not the only ones. In our suburb a farmer, having bought the land by auction in central Melbourne in the 1920s removed all trees and shrubs basically by hand and a Ford Model T as a tractor to convert it into fertile acreage growing Bussel sprouts, only to be bullied off by increased council rates and developer bidding for them to make a profit on housing.
Hahndorf was worth visiting in the 1970s when there were still semblances of the old working town still in existence. Things started to change in the 1980s and Hahdorf lost it's charm.
Im just curious why all German migrants speak English very well? They are much more socially involved in the main stream society than that of Italian or Greek.
It’s unfortunate that after 2 generations the language is gone and the food has changed to meet local conditions. Considering that any German descendants in Hahndorf are 6th and 7th generation family, if you had assessed the history as well I believe a fairer evaluation could have been made.
Hahndorf is just a tourist town now, those few remaining long termers arent fond of it as it's just tourist kitsch. I enjoyed the placew 50 years ago prior it turning into the Adel;aide Hills version of Vicrtor Harbour - except with more bunting The Barossa is more teutonic, less kitsch - and no powdered mash....
Gutes Review, kann dem nur zustimmen. Wir waren bei unserem Besuch damals auch eher enttaeuscht weil wir uns auch mehr deutsches Essen und Kultur versprochen hatten, allerdings muss man auch ehrlich zugeben das zwischen der Erstebesiedlung und Heute sehr viel Zeit vergangen ist. Unser Juengster spricht nach 10 Jahren inzwischen auch schon besser englisch als deutsch, und unsere Enkel vermutlich dann nur noch englisch was auch vollkommen normal ist ;-) Hahndorf ist definitiv einen Besuch wert aber wie ihr gesagt habt " wer authentisches Essen und Kultur sucht sollte wenn moeglich lieber eine Reise nach D machen.
Danke dir, da sind wir ja gleicher Meinung :) ganz genau, die Erstbesiedlung ist schon viel zu lange her und dennoch ist Hahndorf ein echt schönes Städtchen und sehenswert. Aber für deutsches essen muss man dann eben nach Deutschland
Und dort wird auch kein Deutsch mehr gesprochen. So viele Wörter sind "anglifiziert". "Dekade" anstatt Jahrzehnt, eine "desastrove" Situation anstatt katastrophal, "Sure, es ist so ..." anstatt "Sicher, so ist es ...". "Flughafen" ? Nein wir haben keine Flugboote mehr. Alle "Flieger" "moven" am "Airport". Und dann erst das "Handy" ... Kindergartensprache. In Australien ist ein "Beamer" ein BMW, in Deutschland wundert man sich bei der Autovermietung warum der Tourist einen TV Grossbildschirm (vermutlich gibt es das Wort auch nicht mehr) leihen möchte. Bei einem Besuch in Deutschland in 2014 wurde ich von einer Verkaufskraft/Shopassistant mit slawischem Akzent hinterfragt, als ich mit ihr in meinem Schuldeutsch der 60er und 70er Jahre sprach: "Wo kommen SIE denn her ...?"
The original German settlers were Lutheran and fled Germany because of persecution. There are Lutheran churches everywhere in SA. These settlers and their descendants have enriched SA with their culture and especially wine. Go to the Barossa Valley for wine.
Hahndorf is the oldest settlement, but the Germans left many years ago to the work in the city and suburbs. That is purely a tourist town now. But you did miss the best bakery that has a cherry strudel I am will to drive an hour for.
Kein gut streuselkuchen darum? Schade. Generally in S.A. you go to Hahndorf for Deutsch kitsch and Tanunda for reminant Deutsche culture, though even there Barossa Deutsch has largely died out. Less bier selection but better streuselkuchen and bienenstich.
Kein gute Streuselkuchen leider! Yes, we loved the Barossa Valley and went to Chateau Tanunda as well! We actually did a video about our trip there if you are interested check it out! Danke fuer zuschauen!
"Bienenstich" traditionally is being served on funeral wakes in Lower Saxonian villages. My mother always mocked it as "Niedersächsischer Beerdigungskuchen". (Lower Saxonian Funeral Cake). When served on a standard afternoon cake and coffee gathering, she automatically asked: "Has someone died ...?"
Fluent or effluent? But so much English is spoken in Berlin by people often don't speak German. In Australia, the seasons are marked by how the shade moves. It's unfortunate the gene pool isn't being refreshed with migrants.
Yeah, "Harndorf". Harn in German is "wee" or "p***". The village is named in honour of Captain Dirk Meinarts Hahn, the captain of the Zebra, the ship that brought the original settlers in 1838 from the village of Kay in Prussia. These days it is in Poland, although thanks to both nations are being part of the EU, it shouldn't matter one bit.
Hahndorf in South Australia has developed over many years to accommodate multicultural Australians, much like the evolution of Germany's cuisine to embrace tourism and immigration. Du bist sehr respektlos...
Hahndorf is the tacky tourist section. There are areas where there's still a german speaking community but you need to go outside of tourist towns. They exist.
Otto's is not nearly as good as Brezel bakery in Mt Barker . At Brezels the bread is german style that is chewy not soft its sourdough . The pretzels are better than most in Hahndorf. The German Cakeshop in hahndorf sells Brezels pretzels. At Brezels two people who serve there speak german fluently . Hahndorf has aways faked the german by associating with Bavaria. Whereas the settlers in South Australia are from the north near the polish border. There are a lot of people with German names . The butchers Noskes is good . Best ham there but the local pubs and businesses with the exception of the german cake shop don't buy their meat from him! You can get better german smallgoods in the Barossa than Hahndorf. I don't eat in Hahndorf except at the geran cakeshop because portion sizes are ridiculous . The rueben sandwich is quite well done at several shops but that's an invention of the german diaspora in America I think . Rye bread . Corned beef . Mustard Sauerkraut and pickled cucumber or gherkin with dill.
Nice but OZ can never be anything but OZZian. How about some real German heritage by visiting the interior of Argentina? I go there for Oktoberfest some years. In some ways it's more enjoyable than Munich.
We went to Oktoberfest in Munich a few years back. Very expensive, mostly international tourist there. I always recommend that people skip Oktoberfest and just visit the beer halls and beer gardens any other time of the year...
What is "German" these days ? Even the way the inhabitants of "Deutschland" are speaking is having my toenails curled, big time, 24/7. Not just migrants, but top politicians in interviews with highly skilled TV or radio journalists. I once heard that the origin of this evolution was the fact that 75% of school students were not able getting it right, so "instead of raising the bridge to pass the ship through, the water was lowered" with the vessel running aground. Now everyone born before that cultural disaster have to adjust to this cultural rubbish and become the "learners". In brief: Instead of having been the "Land der Dichter und Denker" (Land of the poets and thinkers) Germany has become the "Land der nicht mehr ganz dichten Denker" (Land of the no longer very tight [thick] thinkers)
I grew up near Hahndorf, where, as a kid it was just another local town. It didn’t turn “touristy” until the 70’s I’d say, with the advent of things like Sunday (alcohol) trading started and a general expansion of tourism in Australia happened. The kids I went to school with, including Otto’s daughter, were essentially Australian. So I’m not surprised a lot of the German soul has been bred out of the town. It’s always been a quaint place for Adelaide folk to visit on the weekend to get out of town. To us locals it was a place to avoid on Sundays. But worth a quick trip to Otto’s for a feed any other day. Reasonable review but I could’ve told you you won’t find little Germany there.
That's so interesting! Yes, there was a lot of people there over the weekend! We haven't filmed much with so many people around so it was certainly a challenge, hopefully it didn't show that we did feel a little uncomfortable :) Still a lovely place to visit, even if it's not as 'German' as we thought it might be
It's over 100 years since the first Germans arrived in Hahndorf. You can't expect their dependents to still speak German.
Yeah we agree! We were hoping that there would still be some spoken German but were happy to see the signs etc in German
They should learn as part of the heritage. Other cultures learn many languages, but Anglo-Saxons look like they can't 😂. That make all of look kinda generic like English.
A lot of Germans who came over were determined to fit into the Australian culture. When my great-grandparents came over they didn't want their kids speaking German because they were Australian now and they wanted to embrace the culture and speak English. There was also a lot of stigma and racism around Germans until they embraced the Australian culture and became part of the country
Australian of German decent here. My family hasn’t spoke German for generations now.
Australian from German descent here, the German was passed down a couple of generations in my family, my grandfather was able to speak it but he never taught my mother. In another area in SA my family settled, I do have still have at least one family member who speaks German but he's not passed it onto his kids (as far as I know)
My partner and I live in the Adelaide Hills. He is from Germany and he always calls Hahndorf the Chinatown of Germany 🙈
We still go up 1-2 times a year to get his German beer and sauerkraut fix ☺️
Omg haha 😅 that is such a good call! Had to share that with our German parents who are here with us at the moment. Maybe your husband has to open a bakery or restaurant and make some good original German food ♥️
Please read about the history of Hahndorf to understand why it is the way it is. It was settled by Lutheran Germans who were being persecuted in their own country. They came and settled here; (my husband's great grandparents were some of them) bringing their traditions with them but also over time assimilated with the locals. Their offspring became more australian and so some of the traditions/way of cooking etc became a melange of german and aussie. A lot of the main street is heritage listed; the old buildings you like were built by the german settlers - using local materials so of course couldn't be 100% german. Today it is a tourist town; holding onto the history of the area. There is a genuine german bakery off the tourist strip that does the bread you were looking for, pity you didn't know about that.
That bakery no longer exists . The proprietor now runs the German Cakeshop in the main drag opposite the Hahndorf hotel. It purchases genuine german bread and pretzels from brezel bakery in Mount Barker which bakes on Friday and Saturday and the owners are fluent german speakers. Children of more recent migrants than the old Lutherans !
Try the Barossa for more authentic food (especially butchers) and German language, although probably a dialect!
Yes, good point. We made a video about the Barossa and went to a bakery where the owner gave us a tour of the 100 year old oven and explained the history and settlement of the area, we loved the Adelaide Hills region ❤️
My mother wrote a history of Hahndorf back in the 1960's. It was published by Rigby's. She interviewed many of the oldest residents who were able to tell her a lot about the earliest days of the settlement.
As a teenager my mother had lived in Hahndorf for while with a German aunt who had some quaint habits inherited from her forebears.
That's so interesting! Would love to read your mothers book, I'm sure there would be some interesting tales!
@@lapwithnomap Another weird place with German origin is a village north of Albury in NSW. It started out as Ten Mile Creek, then, due to a majority of German settlers, became Germanton, because the erasing policy of WW I had it named into Holbrook after a British commander of a British submarine in Europe. Now the decommissioned HMAS Otway submarine has been placed in a park next to the busy Hume Highway in line with the Australian culture of "Big Things", appearing like it has just submerged through the soil after a subterranean journey to that spot. However, no "Bavarian" culture in that village.
1st mistake, thinking it's going to be German in Australia, just because it was started by Germans, all cultures coming together, is what makes our food Australian, you have to remember, they couldn't get stuff readily from Germany and had to adapt, even beers in early days were made without hops, using a native plant instead.
2nd mistake, going to 1 of the biggest tourist places in Adelaide and thinking you were going to get non commercial food (instant mash is sacrilegious), all fastfood and a lot of tourist places use premade food (schnitzel for example) and commercial suppliers, I lived in Adelaide in 90s and was way different, it was a gimmick then and even more so these days.
Kaffehaus is what Otto’s used to be. BALHANNAH Bakery bought the property and kept the name Otto’s.
Mum still makes the yeast buns and one of her daughters makes the other sweets. Otto passed away a couple of years ago 😢
Nobody speaks German anymore. I drove through last week thinking I would miss it when I did but honestly I’m glad I moved. It’s not like it used to be but I’m glad I had some of the good time there, when the locals all knew each other.
You went to the worst German Pub. No locals go there. The German Cake Shop closed last week for a reason 😂
Oh yes 👍🏻 we really liked the Kaffeehaus!!! Sorry to hear that Otto passed away a few years ago must be a legend there!
Interesting to hear you think it’s the worst pub. I had a look at the reviews and it was decent. Wouldn’t go back after our experience though
I was really surprised that they didn’t go to The Haus - I would rate their German Dishes as more authentic than The German Arms.
@@lapwithnomap the last time I went there to “support local” I got a chicken schnitzel with mushroom sauce because who can stuff that up right? The mushrooms were champignons out of a can!
@@claireskinner9077 with a kitchen full of not one German. You are correct though. The Haus does have half decent food. I’ve not been put the Old Mill since being taken over by the Woolshd mob is supposed to be ok too.
@@karen1351 OMG that's appalling! That's what we found on our trip around Oz, cafes/restaurants can be hit and miss (and expensive). We have cooked a lot for ourselves for that reason. We still think it was packet mix mashed potatoes we had in Hahndorf, very disappointing
Hahndorf doesn't say its an authentic German town, it is the remnants of German settlers from a long time ago.
The Germans have become Australians
Yes absolutely, you can see the history and how the early settlers shaped the town. Certainly a beautiful little town!
My mother’s family came from Hahndorf they were some of the first pioneer families in that area. My Mum told me that they weren’t encourage to speak German because of the shame of the second world war. It was frowned upon and their language & heritage was kept hidden because of the Nazi stigma. ☹️
Wow yeah that’s interesting! We also read that the towns name was changed with the anti German sentiment around WW2 times. Would be so interesting to talk to some of the locals who moved here originally and listen to their stories and how the place has changed over the years
@@lapwithnomap Not WW II. The "anti-German" sentiment did eventuate from WW I (1914-1918).
In a recent report a current teenage girl (~13 years of age) was shown correcting a language club of older residents, having German roots and being taught the language by their ancestors, how ordinary German is spoken and written now. There were a lot of stunned faces, looking like being stock of an outdated museum.
On closer inspection, one can clearly see how mixed up these people are. 2:40 The coat of arms on the right of the sign is the one of the Federal State of Lower Saxony in the North of Germany. It has a lot of links to the former state of Prussia and kingdom of Hannover, strong opponents of the State of Bavaria within the German Federation. 2:57 The musical Duo is dressed in that code, so the music in this "Lower Saxonian" village is not of Nordic origin but linked to the Oktoberfest style of the South. Well, matching the cliche of tourists what Germany should be like. 3:50 Beer Steins - Bavarian culture ... say no more. 4:23 Brezel ...Bavarian ... 8:56 So much alcohol. Australia is having a limit for drivers of 0.05%. Don't risk your license or someone else's life. 9:10 Cuckoo Clocks are typical for the Southwest, the Black Forest only. More mixing of culture.
Thanks for your honest and straightforward review and rating. I have been living in Melbourne for 40 years and started out before that as a tourist from Germany on an exploration trip in 1982. All the time, based on information similar to this report, I have given Hahndorf a big miss, especially as I am not fond of locations like Disneyland, orientating themselves on what tourists want to pay for and not what one can present to them as one's culture and history.
Nomenclature Act during WW1 changed several hundred names. Also you wouldn't be able to speak to any of my Hahndorfer ancestors as they mostly arrived in SA in 1830s and 40s. They were mostly Silesians and spoke a variant dialect. My families include names such as Tepper, Koop, Schroeder, Nitschke, Seidel... My grandfather still spoke Platt- Deutsch @@lapwithnomap
The legacy of every immigrant group reflects things from the old country they wanted to keep, the choices they had to make to adapt to their new home, and the reasons they left their homeland, and hence the conscious decisions they made to let go of certain aspects of history and culture.
Well said!
The cafes in Hahndorf have more Aussie customers than German so it makes sense that they would amend their menus to suit the locals' tastes albeit with a Germanic influence.
My great grandma mother still spoke Barossa Deutsch until she she passed at 91 in the early 70’s born in Cockatoo Valley.
It's to be expected. The German people who made and built the town are actually Aussies because they were born here.
The people who would speak German would also speak in an older fashioned way because they were cut off from the evolving language back in Germany.
Most of the people are descendants of those German settlers but these days, yup, they are basically Aussies with maybe a slighty German twist to their food and culture.
Yep, it's interesting to see how those early settlers shaped the town and how different things were back then. I read in the museum that the women would walk to Adelaide to attend markets and sell their goods! Would have been a tough way to earn a living!
@@lapwithnomap also a lot of German schools and the language was suppressed during WW1-Hahndorf’s name was only reinstated in 35 and a few places never had their names reinstated. Also those children of settlers who learned English a lot of the time didn’t bother teaching their children German-thus the language diminished. In the Barossa there is a specific German dialect which attempts have been made to document and retain it
That's so interesting! Yes, we read that the town name was changed to Ambleside due to the anti-German sentiment during WW1. There was still a few places under this previous name such as Ambleside Distillery @@p4tchwerk
I find that so interesting! Thanks for letting us know :)@@p4tchwerk
German was the mother tongue of both of my grandmothers but my parents only knew a few words in German due to the stigma of the two world wars. My mother remembered not being able to have much direct conversation with her maternal grandfather due to him not being able to speak much English and her knowing next to no German.
Actually we are predominantly of "Prussian" descent. But it is true, very few genuine food places exist now. "Linke's" meats are gone from the barossa, too. And "klemzig" was set up before Hahndorf.
Yes, we heard a bit about that Prussian history talking to the locals!
@@lapwithnomap I hope you eventually found something good. And enjoyed South Australia 🇦🇺
Guten Tag! When passing thru Melbourne, how about a German pub crawl and review? Hofbrauhaus, The Hof, Munich Brauhaus, Beer DeLuxe, HopHaus, German Club, Belgian Beer Cafe, Bratwurst Shop, Gasthaus, Cuckoo Restaurant, and the Pension Grimus Mt Buller (winter). If you are are anywhere near Omeo, not sure if they are retired, but there was a Cookoo Shop at Omeo. Cheers, Klaus.
Guten Tag Klaus, that's an awesome idea! Who wouldn't love an excuse to drink German beer and eat some bratwurst haha! Thanks for all the great suggestions we'll certainly have a look into it ❤️
When I migrated to Melbourne from West-Germany in 1984, some older German migrants of the post-war generation questioned me about my motivation as in their opinion Germany had been rebuilt and there was no reason to leave for Australia anymore. A lot of Australians are crazy chasing German industrial products for their perfection, however, when one is being employed in a trade and wants to practice that perfection here, the process leading to it is regarded as "too slow", being "sand in the gearbox", grabbing a fast profit. It should look "German" without the "expensive" quality. This fakeness is being represented in the running of Hahndorf as a "fast tourist buck processor". Not only there. Quite a few of the "German" places Klaus has mentioned have deteriorated, sold on or even closed when the original owners retired or passed on. The original Hofbräuhaus in Market Lane inside is clearly advertising DAB, Dortmunder Beer. A "Prussian" product ... (Even the famous football/soccer club is "Prussian". Borussia Dortmund).
Considering Melbourne, it does have a lot of German history, which, however, due to the suppression in the 2 World wars has been watered down if not washed away severely. What is left are suburban names with not much meaning or visible history such as Altona, Heidelberg, Coburg, "Waldau" now Doncaster, "Germantown" now Thomastown, "Westgarthtown" now Northcote and Brunswick. The establishment of the Botanical Gardens has been the work of Baron Ferdinand von Müller. Will one hear German here ? Rarely, most of them will be tourists from that country.
If you check out the local cemeteries you will see that the inscriptions on tombstones suddenly changed from German to English in 1914.
Can't think why.
The bakery used to he fully German with good berlinersl but it was sold about 12 years ago and lost its soul
Oh that's a shame, would have been good to visit then!
I live in Adelaide, and went to Hahndorf last year for the first time in years. Nice little town. I am Catholic now, but my grandparents Carl and Freida Strehlow were Lutheran missionaries at Hermannsburg, up in the Northern Territory for over twenty-seven years from 1895 until my grandfathers death in 1922. ( My grandparents returned to Germany in 1910/11 but went back to Australia in 1912,) My grandmother returned to Germany in 1930 to be reunited with her other five children while my father remained in Australia. My father was old when I was born.
There's a tiny little restaurant in an arcade in Perth which does fantastic German food. Toffee Cafe in the Equus Arcade in the CBD. I eat there from time to time and the chef really nails it. But he is a German.....
To be fair to Hahndorf, German settlement in the area was in the early 19th century so it's understandable the language has not survived. I'd recommend a visit to the cemetery if you ever visit there again.
Omg we had a look at Toffee Cafe, that looks terrific! Would have loved to go there when we were in Perth. Had to share it with a German friend of ours who's moving there soon 👌🏼
i used to go to the schutzenfest in hahndorf in the early seventies, loved it, loved the beer, the real steins, not plastic, shooting gallery and the excellent food. my mothers side is from munster in NW germany. since the fest came to adelaide it went downhill. took my children but it will never be the same
Danke für Ihren Besuch in Hahndorf! Im Laufe des Jahres finden verschiedene Veranstaltungen statt, die deutsche Geschichte feiern. Hahndorf is definitely one of the most beautiful places in SA ❤
love that place only problem is every store has the same things for sale, the indigenous art gallery has some stunning paintings, and the art gallery across the road has great stuff too,
Yeah that's true, we didn't really check out the art galleries. We'll have to do that next time, thanks for the tip
Another great vlog, thank you for sharing.
Thanks for watching!
My grandfather died in a German concentration camp. He got drunk and fell out of his guard tower.
Matt… there is always room for cake! Really enjoyed this video, especially having a German rate it first hand haha. A perspective that is hard to have for most!
Haha 😂 there really wasn't any room, maybe for ice cream though! Yep, what should Megan review next? Aussie chocolate, Aussie lollies, Aussie Beers?
I love Hahndorf ❤️ its definitely super touristy but still such a cute little town with lovely architecture and a very interesting history and is always a fun day out. Me and my hubby love to get our fix of wurst and sauerkraut when we're there. Its especially pretty during Autumn when all the European trees lining the road have golden/red leaves - which is unusual to see in Australia. I think you gave a fair review. 😊
A very entertaining episode!
Matt is very good with his German language skills! Very impressive actually! 👏
I like “Weizenbier” too. The variety of beers you can get 0:36 in Germany is mind blowing!!
Totally agree that you will have to go to Germany for the real food experience. Particularly as it is regional so specific and varied We don’t have many Bretzels in North Germany. And while we have not hot dogs, rather Bratwurst mit Senf oder Curry Wurst- the Danes over the border are so BIG on HOT DOGS…
Looks like you had a great fun time checking it all out!
Das geht runter wie Öl! 😊 we'll have to speak some German with Julius. Yes it's so interesting all the regional cuisines of Germany and surrounding countries. Certainly something that most people don't know about, especially from Australia. If something is popular here it seems to travel everywhere. In Frankfurt they have the "Frankfurter Schnitzel", which is a normal schnitzel topped with a specific selection of seven herbs, each one local to the Frankfurt area, all in specific amounts. Our favorite! We did have a good time, it was busy being a weekend though, lots of other tourists there
Going in two months to Germany and looking forward to have some typical German food from my area! And nice bread! ( Mind you , we are lucky here and have an American dude making the most amazing sour dough breads and the most amazing cake/ Gebäck. so good!!! ) Good idea to speak German with Julius and Brook. They both will benefit from practice! Julius used to be fluent when he was little and understands still heaps…But he never lived in Germany!
Hope you two practice your German! So good to have another language!
Wir waren im Dezember auf dem Christkindel Markt und das war ein Stück Heimat 🥰 wir lieben es dort !!
Weihnachtsmärkte sind das beste! Wir würden gerne irgendwann wiederkommen, um zu sehen, wie sie in Hahndorf sind! Das wäre interessant, da wir Weihnachtsmärkte mit kalten Dezemberabenden und Glühwein verbinden!
A lot of the older people of Handorf have passed on now, and those who are descended from those first families are not always the ones running the shops. Until recently, you could get a decent bienenstich, pre Otto's bakery changing hands from the original family. You would have loved old Mrs Thiele's general store years ago when she was still alive, as it was a step back in time and not at all designed with the tourist in mind. Gordon Kramm has passed, and he was a well loved local who delivered groceries in his van for decades. I believe Noske's butcher shop is still as authentic as it ever was. Many of the families are still here, just not on show :P
If you like fachwerk houses, try a drive through Paechtown, where some of the original houses still survive.
I think some of the more authentic German aspects are a little hidden, as they aren't always on show to tourists. However, I've never heard German spoken by any in Hahndorf, although some of us did learn it in school.
Glad you enjoyed your stay!
It’s was a very small German settlement area, but over time other influences have moved into the area to commercialise the interest of tourists. My grandmothers family were Germans and lived up there as a small town. They were rounded up during the war and sent to a detention camp and the town name was changed during the war.
Yep, a little know and dark past of our history. No wonder the language and culture didn’t really last
Hello from a Liebelt descendant - my ancestors came over on Zebra, the ship Captain Hahn commanded. I think the Barossa towns and Klemzig (now an Adelaide suburb) were settled the same time as Hahndorf.
I know German was still being spoken by my grandparents generation in the Barossa and the German club still has original German settler descendants that speak German.
As a descendant of German great-great-grandparents, one from Hesse and another from Niedersachsen, when I visit Adelaide from Queensland, I make a pilgrimage with my family to Hahndorf to remind ourselves of our Germanic background!
I understand your feedback about the Germanism of Hahndorf, it was unfortunate that German Australians has virtually been assimilated into Australian society though they have left a strong influence in both Queensland and especially South Australia. You might see Schnitzel in almost all pubs in South Australia and occasionally elsewhere in Australia for example. I do make homemade schnitzel with panko crumbs! However, the German language are still being taught in schools especially in Lutheran schools and universities though English is spoken by German Australians. The architecture are different from Europe because of availability of building materials in Australia but German Australians did an amazing adaption of building. Hats off to people who did their best to retain German heritage although it has been adapted a lot just like Chinese dinners were adapted to Australian taste!
Pretty sure during the war all the german sounding towns changed name. Hahndorf became ambleside or something similar. They only changed back once people felt differently after the war amd wanted to claim back their heritage
Quick point, in the 1840s when the "Germans" came to Australia, German was almost synonymous with Central European, as a specific country called Germany didn't exist at the time. The remnants of the Holy Roman Empire were reforming into Austria-Hungary, what had been the north of the Empire had obviously experienced two centuries of turmoil and consisted of many independent states. Sure, German language unified much of central Europe in one sense, but the cultures and local languages were very diverse. So the "Germans" that settled in SA to begin with are actually broader than just the states that form modern Germany. Many came from Prussia, particularly Silesia, but there were also many Bohemians, Moravians, Danes, Poles, Czechs, many from non-German states.
Also, there is a dialect of German spoken in Australia...but it's descended from mid-19th Century German, so is a bit different from modern German by that alone. But Barrossa Deutsch (as the dialect is called) is also a hybrid language of several languages - it was formed as a lingua franca by all the different groups that struggled with English but had migrated from the conflicts in Europe at the time. Also, it maintained the divergence from contemporary German changes over the early 20th Century, when there was a lot of oppression of anything deemed "Germanic". It was a sad reality, but while most German-Australians by 1914 were 2nd or 3rd Generation Australian, they were still treated with great suspicion during the wars. German was banned in schools, and was suppressed (although not fully banned) in churches and community groups. And while many sons went to war in Australian uniforms as part of South Australian units, their families were often interred in camps throughout the conflicts. So while German in Australia did recover over the succeeding decades, it almost emphasised the older style and vocabulary of the settlers, rather than adjust to the new styles of contemporary German. Obviously it's still fully mutually intelligible, but Barrossa Deutsch is a bit like reading an olddr Luther Bible, rather than a modern book. (Indeed, the Luther Bible is still in wide circulation in the German speaking circles of Australia.)
Also, the Barossa is in many ways more authentically German-Australian than Hahndorf, as Hahndorf has commercialised the concept, whereas the Barossa is naturally German. But even outside the Barossa, in rural SA, there are many places that have a surprising amount of German influence about them. Number one is the sheer number of Lutheran churches - I mean, Adelaide is the City of Churches, but every town has a little collection of churches too, most including a Lutheran Church (the other common ones were Methodist and Reformed (Congregational or Presbyterian), most of whom merged into the Uniting Church in the 70s, Anglican, and Catholic. But in towns with only one or two churches, almost guaranteed one will be Uniting and the other Lutheran or Anglican. The other surprising thing for those visiting is the sheer number of central European names in SA. From mayor lists to club presidents, even war memorials, German names exist right next to British names. It's just what it is to be South Australian.
I suppose they need to cater for what most there are eating. When I went to Hahndorf I did come across a couple of people talking German together.
Most of my great grandparents when they came out to Australia during the 1840-1880s were German and a couple of them settled near Hahndorf. In another place my family settled in Sth Australia *Wudinna", I know at least one of my older family members still speak German but i don't think their kids (now adults) do. My Grandfather was also capable of speaking German from his family but he died about 10 years or so ago. So yeah not many of the German settler families still speak German.
You were both very kind in your ratings, and I’d like to visit there one day 😊
You should! Definitely worth a visit! 😊
I lived in the Barossa during the 1970's, when the people over 70 still spoke 'Barossa Deutsch'. The schools in the Barossa still teach 'proper' High German. Hahndorf is a 'tacky tourist kitsch' town using its origins to attract tourists, without the depth of history of say Birdwood (AKA Blumberg before 1917).
You guys were so polite about your disappointment. Haha. 😂 I am from SA and I agree, it's overrated. Like it's worth a visit, but it's not as good as it's made out to be to tourists. The little cultural clubs that still exist are where you'll find authentic stuff. Thanks for visiting!
Love your content Love your van Love your adventures 💕
Omg thank you 🙏🏼so glad you are joining our adventures
I have been there and found it a beautiful place to visit, I agree the food wasn't very German, but it was great food. I thoroughly enjoyed my trip there and will definitely visit it again. As I come from Qld and don't see rabbits, I was surprised at the little rabbit pen at the back of the leather shop.
Totally agree! It's a beautiful little town. Didn't see the rabbits but we did go through the leather shop and the owners were super nice. They do a belt for a lifetime offer where they repair or replace if it breaks, which we both thought was a very unique and cool concept
@@lapwithnomap that's service and quality right there.
I think you've misunderstood Hahndorf. I don't think anybody claims that it is a facsimile of *modern* German villages/cuisine/beer etc. It is a town settled by Germans nearly 200 years ago, not a display village at the EPCOT centre in Florida. It's not supposed to be a copy of modern Germany. What elements of German culture have been retained? What have been lost? How do people in Hahndorf descended from Germans think about their heritage?
You know what else would probably irritate you? My grandfather still spoke only German at home as a child, in South Australia, until 1914. Even as an old man, he still used old-fashioned words like "Karnickel" (instead of Kaninchen). That's because he spoke the German of the mid 1800's, which is what the immigrants here spoke (and which was sort of frozon in time). I can imagine you complaining, "That's not how we speak German in Germany! I rate the language 2 out of 5. They speak weird German in South Australia!!"
During the world war many towns near hahndorf were renamed except for this town ..now signs have the old names on them which is also interesting. Did u visit Beerenberg the strawberry farm...very famous
It's like watching a review of an Australian themed restaurant in America.
Superficial, stupid and slippery.
Yeah it’s never really the same is it…at least we could get proper German beer unlike the Fosters you get overseas
@@lapwithnomap And the Fosters in Germany is brewed under a German recipe for being allowed to be called beer, not "Alkoholisches Getränk" (Alcoholic Drink).
Whatever is "earning a fast buck" ...
The German Spoon has the most authentic food.
My girlfriend is German Australian and we been to Hahndorf a few times. It's a nice day out with some good food. Yes she takes her mash potato and schnitzels seriously lol
Fair comments from you both, and in the comment section. Life moves on, nothing stays the same. We first went to Hahndorf 30 years ago, bought an electric cuckoo clock, which has recently died, but is still on the wall. Maybe we should move on.😂😁
2:45 'Unser Dorf soll schöner werden' is an annual competition to find Germany's most beautiful village.
edit: It's mentioned in the UA-cam video below at 15.57
ua-cam.com/video/u05t-zlGgPw/v-deo.html
Wow great find!!! That's so interesting!! I'm going to watch that whole youtube video sometime soon :) Danke!
I think the point is missed on everyone here. In the 19th century the Prussians settled in South Australia when the Brits didn't exactly want or know what to do with this section of land. The Prussians or Germans whatever you want to call them being hard working people farmed the land and > prospered< Furthermore the city of Adelaide was also named after Queen Adelaide who herself was German. South Australia has a proud history of being a Free State it was not settled by convicts like the rest of Australia it was settled by free men. It's not meant to be an exact replica of Germany. It's literally an Australian town that shouldn't forget the people who founded it, it's not meant to be a copy it's meant to pay homage to the people's roots and history that is the point. The families of this area may not speak fluent German but they have the German last names and the German blood.
The hot dog thing is by demand from families. Trust me when we take our kids anywhere they demand hotdogs or hot chips and nuggets 😂
The food & mash potato is noicest at the Hahndorf Inn.
Also It may not be German but hope you tried the award winning vanilla slice at Otto's. 😋
There's another cuckoo clock shop in Montville, north of Brisbane, that would have to be about twice the size of what I saw in Hahndorf. Hahndorf's may have increased in size since then though, it was over 10 years ago now. I'm not even sure if it was in the same building as it is at present.
Yes we actually went to the cuckoo clock store in Montville. It's bigger and probably better and more authentic than the one in Hahndorf but we didn't see a cuckoo clock Magnet there. Nice shop though!
Go to Germany if you want Germany. Australia is Australia, with all its cultures, good and bad.
Yeah we pretty much said the same thing in the video
Germany is not really Germany anymore these days.
Unfortunately Hahndorf has because very commercialised during the last 25 or so years.
I grew up in the neighbouring town of Verdun, leaving about 1995.
There are still alot of people related to the first settlers living there.
How confident are you that the mash was instant style and not just sub par real mash?
As a chef I find it very dubious that any pub, let alone one that is plating up that kind of menu, would serve instant mash.
With the exception of KFC and Red Rooster, that's not just unacceptable at a theme pub, it's unacceptable in any self respecting food and beverage establishment across Australia in general. Even a kitchen in an RSL bistro that served up instant mash would quickly find itself under review.
Sometimes sub par kitchens don't source the correct potatoes for mash (russet, Yukon etc), they're not passed through a chinois, there's not enough butter, seasoning, or a combo of the above.
Most classically French trained chefs won't add milk or cream, just butter (lots of butter), but some do. Some will use double cream or creme fraiche depending on the texture they want to achieve, and so on.
If you genuinely thought it was instant, you should've asked the staff. If you were correct, I'd be very concerned about what other corners they're cutting in a kitchen with that type of clientele, i.e. humans.
We are pretty confident but you're right we didn't ask. Some people mentioned on the google reviews that they also suspected it was instant mash. In hindsight, we probably should have asked the staff. We'll be sure to do that next time
It's totally instant, mash. I live in Adelaide and have been to Hahndorf so many times. I've also worked in the hospitality industry for 20+ years. It's unmistakable. 1000% instant mash
My Oma and Opa came to Australia in the 60s and I grew up eating amazing food that she made and all of her friends made. When I went to Germany my Tante made great food but the kids, (gotta do something about your kids Marty) did not do food the same way
You guys missed the better lunch place option 😢
The Deutsch spoken in the Germanic areas of Australia are not easy for a modern German to understand because the spoken word has not evolved but maintained a kind of status quo.
what hot dogs arent german?
Hot dogs were invented in germany, i know the USA kinda went crazy with them but Hot dogs or Frankfurters are very german. I grew up in germany we ate frankfurters and weisswurst every christmas.
Thanks for sharing your perspective! It's interesting how food histories can vary, especially since Germany still has so many regional dishes/foods. While hot dogs may have roots in German sausages like Frankfurters, the modern version as we know it today, with the bun and all, is often attributed to American culture. Thanks for sharing your experience with us! Where did you grow up in Germany?
Someone commented that this town was established by Australians and that’s not true. It was established by Germans escaping persecution in Europe. South Australia is a free state. They went through a lot. Prior to global warming it would snow heavily. As a child we would go there for the snow days. Women had to walk from there down to Burnside village to seek their wares.
There were no freeways in 1839s. The oldest example of the roads left is above Tea Tree Gully at the original nursery now situated in bushland. The road was mud and treacherous.
The town is a celebration of what they achieved prior to cars and electricity. It’s there to enjoy. I have spoken to the guy that sells the hot dogs over the years. He just loves the hot dogs. South Australians take pride in this community and what they had to overcome.
Yes that's true! We were shocked to find out that the women from the village used to walk 35kms through the night to attend Markets in Adelaide to sell their goods!! Mind boggling
I would eat my Hut if it ever "heavily snowed" in Hahndorf lol
@@lapwithnomap Not the only ones. In our suburb a farmer, having bought the land by auction in central Melbourne in the 1920s removed all trees and shrubs basically by hand and a Ford Model T as a tractor to convert it into fertile acreage growing Bussel sprouts, only to be bullied off by increased council rates and developer bidding for them to make a profit on housing.
A Swabian style Bretzel to a beer of the Hofbräuhaus in Munich (Bavaria)?
Haha yes, it's a bit of a mix of regional foods/drinks. Not even sure Aussies are aware about that. Have to go to Germany for the real deal ;)
I leant German in primary school and in 2017 went to Germany and yet spoke English
Have you checked out the German club in the Adelaide CBD?
I love Almdudler.
... Australia was very involved in WW2; and the side effect was the Germanic parts of Australia was very suppressed as a result.
9:49 what's the name of that ?
räuchermann, it's an incense smoker where the smoke comes from the mouth haha who said Germans don't have a sense of humour
Hahndorf was worth visiting in the 1970s when there were still semblances of the old working town still in existence. Things started to change in the 1980s and Hahdorf lost it's charm.
Im just curious why all German migrants speak English very well? They are much more socially involved in the main stream society than that of Italian or Greek.
I've heard the old people at Sedan speak German.
It used to be more German when I was younger but over time it's become commercial.
It’s unfortunate that after 2 generations the language is gone and the food has changed to meet local conditions. Considering that any German descendants in Hahndorf are 6th and 7th generation family, if you had assessed the history as well I believe a fairer evaluation could have been made.
Hahndorf is just a tourist town now, those few remaining long termers arent fond of it as it's just tourist kitsch. I enjoyed the placew 50 years ago prior it turning into the Adel;aide Hills version of Vicrtor Harbour - except with more bunting
The Barossa is more teutonic, less kitsch - and no powdered mash....
Gutes Review, kann dem nur zustimmen. Wir waren bei unserem Besuch damals auch eher enttaeuscht weil wir uns auch mehr deutsches Essen und Kultur versprochen hatten, allerdings muss man auch ehrlich zugeben das zwischen der Erstebesiedlung und Heute sehr viel Zeit vergangen ist. Unser Juengster spricht nach 10 Jahren inzwischen auch schon besser englisch als deutsch, und unsere Enkel vermutlich dann nur noch englisch was auch vollkommen normal ist ;-) Hahndorf ist definitiv einen Besuch wert aber wie ihr gesagt habt " wer authentisches Essen und Kultur sucht sollte wenn moeglich lieber eine Reise nach D machen.
Danke dir, da sind wir ja gleicher Meinung :) ganz genau, die Erstbesiedlung ist schon viel zu lange her und dennoch ist Hahndorf ein echt schönes Städtchen und sehenswert. Aber für deutsches essen muss man dann eben nach Deutschland
Und dort wird auch kein Deutsch mehr gesprochen. So viele Wörter sind "anglifiziert". "Dekade" anstatt Jahrzehnt, eine "desastrove" Situation anstatt katastrophal, "Sure, es ist so ..." anstatt "Sicher, so ist es ...". "Flughafen" ? Nein wir haben keine Flugboote mehr. Alle "Flieger" "moven" am "Airport". Und dann erst das "Handy" ... Kindergartensprache. In Australien ist ein "Beamer" ein BMW, in Deutschland wundert man sich bei der Autovermietung warum der Tourist einen TV Grossbildschirm (vermutlich gibt es das Wort auch nicht mehr) leihen möchte. Bei einem Besuch in Deutschland in 2014 wurde ich von einer Verkaufskraft/Shopassistant mit slawischem Akzent hinterfragt, als ich mit ihr in meinem Schuldeutsch der 60er und 70er Jahre sprach: "Wo kommen SIE denn her ...?"
The original German settlers were Lutheran and fled Germany because of persecution. There are Lutheran churches everywhere in SA. These settlers and their descendants have enriched SA with their culture and especially wine. Go to the Barossa Valley for wine.
If you want to hear German speakers try Byron Bay! So many German backpackers!
Hahndorf is the oldest settlement, but the Germans left many years ago to the work in the city and suburbs. That is purely a tourist town now. But you did miss the best bakery that has a cherry strudel I am will to drive an hour for.
Yeah seems to be the case! What bakery is that?
Cherry strudel! Yum 😋
Its not GERMAN ANYMORE and its not disability friendly the food used to be great back in the 70s 80s not anymore and i live in ADELAIDE
Kein gut streuselkuchen darum? Schade. Generally in S.A. you go to Hahndorf for Deutsch kitsch and Tanunda for reminant Deutsche culture, though even there Barossa Deutsch has largely died out. Less bier selection but better streuselkuchen and bienenstich.
Kein gute Streuselkuchen leider! Yes, we loved the Barossa Valley and went to Chateau Tanunda as well! We actually did a video about our trip there if you are interested check it out! Danke fuer zuschauen!
@@lapwithnomap Ich alles fall mit den fälle. 😁
"Bienenstich" traditionally is being served on funeral wakes in Lower Saxonian villages. My mother always mocked it as "Niedersächsischer Beerdigungskuchen". (Lower Saxonian Funeral Cake). When served on a standard afternoon cake and coffee gathering, she automatically asked: "Has someone died ...?"
Ottos sell a nice beesting on saturdays.
Fluent or effluent? But so much English is spoken in Berlin by people often don't speak German. In Australia, the seasons are marked by how the shade moves. It's unfortunate the gene pool isn't being refreshed with migrants.
In Berlin nennt man den Berliner Pfannkuchen ✌️
Danke für das Video .
there's an old say build up, don't destroy.
If the food was 100% German they would go out of business, its Aussie German. Integration.
Dont give a damn for their opinion, love Harndorf ❤
That's great! We liked it too, just wanted to be objective :)
Yeah, "Harndorf". Harn in German is "wee" or "p***". The village is named in honour of Captain Dirk Meinarts Hahn, the captain of the Zebra, the ship that brought the original settlers in 1838 from the village of Kay in Prussia. These days it is in Poland, although thanks to both nations are being part of the EU, it shouldn't matter one bit.
I hope you bought an apron!! 😆
Haha 😂 unfortunately not! But Meg's birthday is coming up haha 🤣
Hahndorf is a cute little village but has absolute nothing to do with Germany really - it has a little German touch - that's it
Yes, agree with that!
Hahndorf in South Australia has developed over many years to accommodate multicultural Australians, much like the evolution of Germany's cuisine to embrace tourism and immigration. Du bist sehr respektlos...
Hahndorf is the tacky tourist section. There are areas where there's still a german speaking community but you need to go outside of tourist towns. They exist.
We loved the Adelaide hills, definitely had a 'European' feel to it! We'll be back for sure, any places you recommend?
Nuriootpa or Seppeltsfield in the barossa
Here are some SA bakeries that make beesting.
wait so you guys are not even German? I am a bit confused
More like 150 years
I hate to inform you but schnitzel is actually Italian........
Otto's is not nearly as good as Brezel bakery in Mt Barker . At Brezels the bread is german style that is chewy not soft its sourdough . The pretzels are better than most in Hahndorf. The German Cakeshop in hahndorf sells Brezels pretzels. At Brezels two people who serve there speak german fluently . Hahndorf has aways faked the german by associating with Bavaria. Whereas the settlers in South Australia are from the north near the polish border. There are a lot of people with German names . The butchers Noskes is good . Best ham there but the local pubs and businesses with the exception of the german cake shop don't buy their meat from him! You can get better german smallgoods in the Barossa than Hahndorf. I don't eat in Hahndorf except at the geran cakeshop because portion sizes are ridiculous . The rueben sandwich is quite well done at several shops but that's an invention of the german diaspora in America I think . Rye bread . Corned beef . Mustard Sauerkraut and pickled cucumber or gherkin with dill.
We will definitely check out Brezel bakery in Mt Barker next time we are in the area!
Voonderbarten 👍👍
(Translated by Google) it still does remain as "Voonderbarten"
@@thies7831 Wunderbarten ¯\_( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)_/¯
Very Tourist trappy here
Nice but OZ can never be anything but OZZian. How about some real German heritage by visiting the interior of Argentina? I go there for Oktoberfest some years. In some ways it's more enjoyable than Munich.
We went to Oktoberfest in Munich a few years back. Very expensive, mostly international tourist there. I always recommend that people skip Oktoberfest and just visit the beer halls and beer gardens any other time of the year...
Barossa Valley is more authentic.
Barossa is fantastic, you’re right! We made a video about our Barossa experience as well 😄
Name only.
What do you mean?
You don't have to go there.....if you don't like it......leave and don't go back
How we know if we like it or not without going there first?
Oh well you sound really German.Not
Haha we get that comment a lot 😂 I’ve taught her well (Matt)
What is "German" these days ? Even the way the inhabitants of "Deutschland" are speaking is having my toenails curled, big time, 24/7. Not just migrants, but top politicians in interviews with highly skilled TV or radio journalists. I once heard that the origin of this evolution was the fact that 75% of school students were not able getting it right, so "instead of raising the bridge to pass the ship through, the water was lowered" with the vessel running aground. Now everyone born before that cultural disaster have to adjust to this cultural rubbish and become the "learners". In brief: Instead of having been the "Land der Dichter und Denker" (Land of the poets and thinkers) Germany has become the "Land der nicht mehr ganz dichten Denker" (Land of the no longer very tight [thick] thinkers)