Mercedes Benz W108 vs. W109 plus other differences
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- Опубліковано 20 гру 2020
- Since I have the W108 and W109 together I thought I'd make a video with some of the differences. I also cover U.S. vs. Euro and year-to-year differences in these cars. Both models were available with a variety of engines, some only in one or the other, i.e the 300SEL 6.3 and the 280SEL. No 108's were made with 6.3's and no 109's were made with the M130 six.
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Thank you for posting this video! I am new to owning a W108 and appreciate all of the information.
I'm glad you liked it, the details are interesting for sure.
Interior is stunning! Gorgeous.
Both of these cars have great interiors, the 6.3 has been restored with new material, the 280SEL is the original interior.
Thank you! Very helpful. Hoping to be in the drivers seat of one soon...
Keep your eye on the channel, the W109 6.3 will be on auction in January, and the W108 likely February. Both are clean, the 108 is a 47,000 mile very original car.
Two very nice cars in your garage! The limited slip differential and the tachometer came standard only with the 6.3, but we’re available at extra cost for the lesser models. Very early 6.3s lacked the limited slip.The 6.3 was the only variant to have the 2.82:1 final drive. U.S. 6.3s had a lower compression ratio and were rated at 220HP (DIN), whereas all other 300SEL 6.3s had a compression ratio of 9:1 and 250HP. Early 6.3s had vented rear brake discs. My June 1970 6.3 has the burled wood window surround.
Dan, you are correct on all points thanks for adding these items. I find the details interesting.
Yours sounds like a nice car. Your info on the 6.3 is correct. These are the brain child of Eric Waxenberger. He, & a few of his engineering team wondered what would happen if they shoehorned the running gear from the 600 Pullman, into a 300sel (w109, which are wrongly called long wheel base w108). The temptation was too great to ignore, so Eric & his mates got busy, working in secret. Eric then tried to sneak the car past Rudolph Uhlenhaut, but he insisted on testing the car. Rudolph drove the car in his usual press on style. He was amazed & mystified by the car's performance characteristics, so he opened the bonnet at the first set of lights to see what they had done. The car then went into production. The team had done their work very well. I have worked on these, & there isn't much room in the engine bay to access different components.
@@christophermarshall5765 Yep, it’s the air suspension that differentiates the W108 from the W109. The long wheelbase, but steel sprung 280SEL is a W108. An interesting piece of trivia regarding the long wheelbase W108s and W109s is that although Mercedes produced extra length rear door skins and the roof panel, the actual bodies and the rear door structures were cut in two and extra panels were welded in to provide the 100 millimeters of additional length. When W109 bodies are stripped, two redundant mounting points for the front seat belts appear on the transmission tunnel as well as a redundant opening for the electric window switch in each door.
@@HLife719 I've seen W108's with air suspension. The 280 variants were also designated as W109's. In my time with Prestige Automotive, we had a lot of 280's come through that were designated W109, & these were the same bodies as the 300SEL 6.3 Some of these were stripped back for extensive corrosion repairs. The "so called" 280SEL, is not a W108 at all. They are a W109 with different suspension & interior. I did not need you pointing out how these cars are built, because unlike some here, I am NOT an idiot, like you seem to think. Now, fucking STOP treating me like one.
The classic Mercedes Benzs are so nice to drive. Nothing compares, not even BMW.
6.3 yum
Wunderbarr
The W109s were given a different internal build code from the W108 because they are an air suspension car. In the same way that a 300se is called a W112 instead of a W111 because it's also an air suspension car. Another difference between the W108 and W109 is that all W109s are 5.0m long. With the exception of the 280 SEL, all W108s are 4.9m long. The extra 100mm is made by larger rear doors, but as someone pointed out, the W109 doors are not interchangeable with the W108 280 SEL doors due to the chrome mounting points.
Good points, both cars in this case are long wheelbase cars.
Is the suspension interchangeable
Not likely and definitely not without a lot of work. Best to find the version you want and go with it.
Nice comparison. I wasn’t aware of the luck of the wood trim around the windows on the 109. What’s there in it’s place?
Were you filming with your phone? Nice quality footage.👍
The 109's had wood trim around the windows, the 108's had more plastic parts in those areas.
@@theburlingtongarage6255 I’m ever more confused 🤷♂️. I got the 1970 280SE and I see wood trim everywhere.
Maybe it was an option on my car. Good to know that I can consider 109 for some of the trim pieces as well.
@@theburlingtongarage6255 All W108 and W109s had wood trim to the sides and top of the side windows. The W109 had an additional strip near the top of the door card. Early W109s also had wood around the windshield up the A pillars and across the top.
Thank you.
You're welcome!
Many thanks for your insights, much appreciated.
Which one do you think is more reliable and which one the more comfortable cruiser? 109 much more comfortable?
Best regards
They are both comfortable cars, I have taken long-distance trips in both (1.5-3,000 miles) the 300SEL is more powerful by far, the 280SEL is less expensive to maintain.
I have a -69 w108 and a -68 w108 and I much prefer the 60's dash, with the spring loaded glovelid which shuts with authority when you nudge it up!
Two great cars! That's cool.
Nice i have same color eibengruen 822 colorcode w123 250 6inline .😊 same sunroof .greetings from netherlands
Nice! I like petrol W123's.
Nice Soap Box derby Jr car.
Thanks!
How rare are the two tone colors? I have a 73 280SEL 4.5 with two tone green. I haven't found another one in this color combo.
They are not as common as the single color models, but I don't have any data on specific production numbers. Sounds like a cool car!
@@theburlingtongarage6255 good morning ...i have one dark green 280se 4.5 model 72
W109 for me, thank you.
Good choice!
Hello
Do you have any cars available I'm interested
The 1970 280SEL will be for sale soon. Appears to have 47,000 original miles, it's a very clean car.
The big difference is also body length. The W109 was 100mm longer than a W108. The back doors are not interchangeable between the 2.
That's a long wheelbase W108, so the same length as the W109. All W109s are long, but there were both long and short W108s.
@@gotham61 wrong. the long wheel base variants were designated as W109. I do know this as FACT, & I got this from Mercedes themselves. If you have a long wheel base one, it's a 109, not 108. they called a 109 to avoid confusion. The 300SEL-6.3 was NOT a W108. They were in fact a 109. These are the long wheel base 108, & called a 109. I suggest you do your research better, because I have the book History Of Mercedes Benz right here, & ALL that info is in this book. You want to argue about the long wheel base cars? I can start on about The Grosser & Pullman variants, along with the Landaulet ones too, & the things unique to those. The other way to tell a true 6.3 W109 is to look at the brakes.
@@christophermarshall5765 Not trying to get into a argument, but you're simply misinformed. I was the secretary of the International M-100 Group, a club which covers the 6.3, 6.9, and 600 models, and I have owned eight W108 and W109 cars over the last 30 years. Yes, the 6.3 is a W109, I never said otherwise, and I have owned four of them. But there were also long wheelbase cars that were W108s, including the car on the left in this video. Factory model designation 108.019 was the 280SEL with the I6 2.8L M130 engine, 108.058 was the 280SEL 3.5 with the V8 M116 engine, and the 108.068 was the 280SEL 4.5 with the V8 M117 engine which was only available in North America. These three models were all long wheelbase W108 cars with steel spring suspension and the lower spec W108 trim.
As this video points out, the key factors that differentiate a W109 are the air suspension, and a higher specification of trim, including the wood, carpeting, upholstery, and exterior brightwork.
@@gotham61 you are wrong on all counts
@@christophermarshall5765 Not at all, but you clearly have a stubborn streak that prevents you from learning anything. I have lived and breathed these cars for decades, and have owned several examples of each. I have personally owned two long wheelbase W108 cars, both of them 280 SEL 4.5s, with steel spring suspensions. I currently own a long wheelbase 300 SEL 6.3 W109.
Hi. Are they for sale ?
The W109 sold on Bring-A-Trailer last week. The W108 is for sale. It has 47,000 miles, original sales invoice and is highly original.
@@theburlingtongarage6255
Which. City are you in ?
U can e mail me the asking price .
Berouzl@yahoo.com
Tnx
الله يبارك ممكن تبعت رقم لون السيارة
So a W108 & W109 share the same bodyshell with the W109 using engine, suspension etc. from the W100 ??
If so then it sounds confusing because I understood that the series W number tends to change only due to different body work used.. something like W114 & W115....both so similar looking yet different inside ?!
Daimler should have a clearer system of how to name the various series
In the case of the W108's and 109's the bodies were essentially the same the major difference was the suspension system, 109's with an air suspension and the 108 with steel springs. Engines could be the same, i.e. 280SEL 4.5 (108) and 300SEL 4.5 (109)
Also, 109's came with more than just the M100 6.3 V8, which was the engine used in the 600's
@@theburlingtongarage6255 So because of suspension type difference as the only main feature, the 280SEL4.5 is otherwise very similar to 300SEL4.5 ?? Even more confusing indeed ?!? I would have thought such a car be labelled simply as 450SEL with the '450' refering to engine size ? Thing here confusing also is sometimes the 3-digit number refers to engine size but other times it does not & then they put a '4.5' or '6.3' in such cases ?!?!
Initially the 300SEL was an air suspended car with a 3.0 six, the larger engines came later, hence the 6.3, 3.5, 4.5. Same with the 108's.
@@hseochin The body and chassis sheet metal is slightly different to accommodate the air suspension, there are different mountings for the air springs, valves, etc. Also, the doors are actually a different part and are not interchangeable, the frame part around the window is physically different to mount the stainless trim. Another difference is the seat patterns. The W109 seats have 4 pleats where the W108 has 5. Leather or Velour was standard on a W109, but a W108 could have anything from basic cloth, MB Tex vinyl, leather, or velour as options. The wood surround on the windshield changed after 68, later cars only having the lower wood bow, instead of wood on the upper part and sides.
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didnt the EU cars have tombstone headlights?
Not the 6.3's. The American style headlights were considered an upgrade in Europe at that time and all 6.3's came with them.
@@theburlingtongarage6255 The key word there is American "style". Euro 6.3s didn't use US sealed beam headlights, but came with separate round high and low beam lamps so they could take advantage of the newly available brighter H1 halogen bulbs of the era. At the time there wasn't a dual filament high/low halogen bulb, so they had to use two separate lamps to get that technology.
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