Classified Powershift review: race tested at Crooked Gravel
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- Опубліковано 12 сер 2023
- The Classified Powershift hub effectively puts the functionality of a front derailleur into the rear wheel with a Bluetooth activated shifter that reduces the front chainring size by 70%.
I raced an ENVE Mog with a 48t Rotor ring paired to the Classified Powershift hub. Some parts were great; some were not.
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As someone who loves the feel of mechanical shifting, adding this to a x1 mech group seems great for having the best of both worlds
I just got my first chain keeper after 2 years of gravel. Dropping my chain 5 times during my last 2 races finally made me frustrated enough to get a cheap one off of Amazon and WOW the difference it makes. You can actually commit to pedaling over washboard, forget the fear of dropping a chain, and no more grease on your hands from putting it back on. I've been a bunch of rides and fun "races" with friends and haven't dropped a chain since. So worth it!
Wax!
@@bobfoster687My first thought as well. Why would anyone want to coat their chain with dust catcher on a gravel ride?
I ride the Classified Hub on Zipp 353s on my Wilier road bike and am very happy with it! It's physically wired into the left DI2 shifter which eliminates the need for the sprint shifter button provided by Classified. It was a little effort to perform the wiring, but not terribly difficult. The Hub integrates into my Karoo head unit and I have a field setup on my screen which displays a 1 or a 2 to indicate the state of the Hub mechanism. I installed a k-edge chain keeper on my 52t 1x front chainring which keeps things in place.
Cool! Normal road derailleur or a clutch derailleur?
It's a standard Shimao R8100 rear derailleur, Ben. Side note: I had to search around the globe to find a Classified retailer that would sell me just the Classified components without rims. I ended up purchasing my Zipp 353s from the same bike shop in London and they laced the rear wheel and shipped the front and rear wheels to me here in the US. I was very happy with their work! Pearson 1860 Bike Shop.
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney
Can you take apart a wheel set of your choice and build it up by replacing the hub with a classified Powershift hub? The wheel options are a little boring
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney Sheesh, sorry for the delayed response! Normal road derailleur
@@theinstigatorr Yes, but you should confirm with Classified which wheel set (a.k.a. hoops) you want to use before you buy them. I went with Zipp 353s as I mentioned and the bike shop laced them up with spokes. I have the Zipp 353 rear hub in a box in the basement!
The problem with this system is that you're forced to use a dedicated rear wheel. That means that a broken spoke, etc., will be an issue. Also, a number of people prefer to have a selection of rear wheels, e.g., one for road and one for gravel, which would imply buying two of these. For comparison, rear wheel power meters, which were popular 15 years ago, have been completely superseded.
I personally find it's a good deal quicker and more convenient to change a tire than to change a wheel+ derailleur limits and cable tension.
Plus, the wheels for road, wheels for gravel concept only works if your cassettes are broadly similar ratios (within 4-6t in the big cog). Otherwise your chain is going to be massively too long on the road wheels and your shifting is gonna be garbage.
I'm much more bothered by the cassette options. If you're spending this kind of money, you probably already have dedicated wheels to each bike. Things were different in the rim brake days when most of us trained on an aluminum wheel and raced on deep carbon wheels.
It's sort of the same problem having a wheel for SRAM XDR freehub or a Shimano freehub; you pick and camp and you're stuck there. But a new player with a new standard means you have no friends and limited support to share or fix your special wheel standard (see Specialized SCS). Good luck to this company...
@@SmolSnake not really. I readily use XDR cassettes and Shimano cassettes between bikes. All my bikes have SRAM shifters. Flat top chains work great on Shimano cassettes. I also run a 1×12 AXS setup on my TT bike with a Dura Ace chain for friction benefits. I train with XDR cassettes for the range and race with Shimano and it's perfect
@@veganpottertheveganso you are running flattop chains on GRX/105/Ultegra cassettes with no issues
Thanks for the review - the chain dropping is real bummer. For me it also looked you are right, it looked really lose when you put it back on.
Really loving your commentary on these products and events.
Love your videos, awesome content. My lower back tends to protest after a few hours in the saddle, adding to the adventure. Enjoy the Ride!
Great honest review Ben. Awesome video. So tempted to buy a MOG😱
A good honest review like always man
so far that has been the best outro music you've had! 😀👍
Awesome! Great ideas and very nice listening to your presentation. The sizes on the plan would be interesting as well.
Very cool setup. The ENVE MOG is 👌
Ben, good to see you do have some emotions on your rides. I understand that frustration.. Great review..
I would like to see some independent testing of the frictional loss.
Tour magazine from Germany has done this test.
@tomvanlaer7507 and what were their findings?
I'll look it up.
Can't find the article anymore, and online also without a trace. There was only a friction loss in the low setting. I hope my memory serves me well. They found enough loss to write that for climbing races they had their reservations... Classified themselves say that the possibility to use larger rings on crank an bigger sprocket on the cassette when using their hub solves this powerloss. A shame I lost that magazine.
Dude! What about the MoG?? Can you please tell us more about it? Love the video and your work overall. Outstanding. Keep it up!
Remember back in the day when you didn't have to have a degree in Computer Information Systems to ride your bike.
Thanks for a great review.
Ben, The problem with the Classified hub is not the non-integrated shifter. It's the friction power loss when the step-down gear is engaged. Some estimate 5% efficiency loss.
Yeah that's way too much, since you need all that power on steep climbs
That is significant. I didn’t have time to test that.
Gotta sew 3rd party testing. Wouldn't surprise me if the loses are over 5% considering you already have significant loses from running 1x out front
They are on to something. Time will tell. More refinements needed.
I found with that particular Selle Italia saddle, the nose was too wide which caused rubbing. I think I measured it at 7-10mm wider than what I use, which made a real difference in practice. I loved it was a recycled material, but I couldn't use it due to the rubbing.
The Classified hub looks like it is 70-90% of the way there. But it does need the integration with shifters to push it over the ledge.
Thanks for the great videos and reviews
Ben, as always, thanks for the honest review, where a product has both good and bad and you actually take a side in the argument.
Honestly, just go 2x. Your chain won't fall off!
I just installed this set up on my MOG. I placed the button on the top of the bar so you don’t hit it going down a decent. I have been really pleased with the set up. It shift well. I’m running GRX mechanical and have had not issues on chain drop.
Cool. What size chain ring? I wish the hub would step *up*, so you could run a little ring like a 38 and have it add gear inches.
I’m running a 42 on the front. But have a 48 ordered. As for the cassette in the rear I am running the 34-11.
I am also running the enve dropper with the left shifter operating the dropper. So the button isn’t really that big of deal for me. I do think you have to find the right position for the button so you don’t hit it on accident.
Pleased so far.
Heck yeah, Bennie D! Dropped chains are right up there with punctured tires--No Bueno. Suffered a handful of maddening dropped chains at Foco Fondo too, and cost me considerable time and energy trying to get back on the group for sure. 2x is the way to go!
With the advent of 1x and electronic shifting, the days of just half shifting the FD to get your chain back on are long gone. Now every chain drop mandates a stop, and an electronic FD makes getting the chain back on much harder.
I guess that's the price of progress. 😁
I’ve been thinking about getting that hub. One of the main reasons is I like a 2X11 set up on my gravel bikes. A 1X is nice and simple but dedicated to either a climbing bike or non-climbing bike set up for flat out pacing with less elevation gain. I guess you could have 2 drivetrain “kits” with the combos that are best for your adventures.
Yeah that chain looked pretty dangly with not much keeping it in place. Interesting info on the eagle vs xplr, I never knew that about the better retention from eagle. It looks like you need a fox gravel fork on that! It would make the ride WAY better and faster. Yeah you definitely need a waxed chain. The k-edge chain catcher is good. I also run the Garbaruk rings which have longer teeth than SRAM which seems to help keep the chain in place.
Thanks!
Thank you, Kevin!
Haha! You sound like me! Sailor language FTW!
With my Shimano GRX 815 Di2 the Classified shifter is fully integrated and you can shift via the left lever. Absolute breeze in my opinion.
Using SRAM it's still the struggle with the satellite shifter.
Using SRAM has always been a struggle for me… I want to like them, wireless and all but build quality leaves something to be desired.
How did you get it fully integrated?
@@matthewbenger8355 Bought it already fully integrated with the new bike. With Shimano it's somewhat easier to do, since the front deraileur shifting mechanics via left lever are pretty much similar to the Classified system, unlike SRAM where you're pushing both levers for the front deraileur.
Riding without a chain catcher is totally noob! 😂😂😂 why torture yourself? You were doing so well and was rooting for you. On such an expensive bike to not have one is criminal!
Regarding classified well… it’s first gen, so we stay away and wait for the upgrade. That button relocation issue is an annoying thing if you running a dropper post, plus you gotta retrain your hands were to be.
Anyways always great content. 👍🏻
I had the exact same complaint with the specialized saddle that came with my diverge. The hard edge...
I too share your anger. My chain popped off once so far on my Red AXS 2x system with the Red ring, and it took way too long for me to fish it out and fix it so I could keep riding.
I could listen to you rattle off Shimano TLAs all day long. *(Three Letter Acronyms)😍
Great video! Where can one purchase that ccol T-Shirt? Thank you!
Meanwhile it’s possible to use a Shimano shifter with the Classified hub. I’ve got this combination on my Rose Backroad and it works perfectly.
Classified needs to start making a 0.5x instead of focusing on mimicking a classic small ring
Id like to see you review an ism pl 1.1 saddle. I've had mine for a while after going through a bunch of selle italias, fiziks, specialized mimic brooks etc, and it's been great for gravel. a bit heavier but super comfortable. just spray some cable lube or something into the plastic areas on the bottom of the saddle the rails contact because its a sqeaky saddle. I think because there's no bridge on the nose of the saddle so the saddle flexes more. Its a longer saddle too so you have more room to slide back for descents or forward when you're hammering. lots of foam too, which i think is way more important than the seatpost for comfort.
That saddle is the only saddle I ever had that completely RUINED my skin, had massive issues and couldn't cycle for a couple days before it healed and the "blisters" went away. Never again. I now have a Selle Italia X-Bow Superflow and I love it to bits.
i always put wolf tooth-lone wolf chain guide for one by setup.
Yo Ben! Just glue the button to the lever. :)
As others have already stated. It IS integrated with the shifters if you run Shimano Di2.
Side subject: I got rid of 1x chain drop issues with a simple Aliexpress 15$ CDN chain guide.
Something no-one talks about when reviewing Classified is the bearings? What type? Are they serviceable? Also, I have not heard anyone talk about points of engagement?
I think SRAM should absolutely buy into this- it’s a no brainer. And Classified should make the button light up when it’s activated or something so there is a visual indicator….integration would be best obviously….
I'd rather see SRAM go back to their Hammerschmidt cranks and improve those than work on a wheel like this. Not that I want them to, just that it makes more sense than this
@@veganpotterthevegan I just think if they’re going to ditch 2X chainrings altogether they should have something like this to compensate for it….
@stevekelly6544 they're not ditching them unless the gaps between gears shrink and that will take a lot more cogs. Going from 9sp to 10sp cassettes was great, but going from 11 to 12 was a lesser benefit. We'd really need 15 or 16 to really properly get rid of front derailleurs on road bikes(which would make them unavailable for gravel). That's far enough away that it's not worth worrying about as we'll likely have a new frame standard at that point.
Don't stop being honest Ben❤
I think this was a solution looking for a problem. 2x works well enough to not need to change, and if you're going to go 1x, you're prepared to make the range sacrifice.
…or, just use a MTB cassette (10-52), and have tons of range with no faffing about with 2x or Classified.
@@GHinWI not enough range
I can see Sram allowing them to join / give access to the AXS system and be able to shift with their shifters someday, but doubt Shimano will ever add them to the group from how stubborn they are.
Regarding which ratio you are on, they can probably integrate them to head units in the future so the unit can let you know which ratio you are on like other electronic systems.
Also I heard since they're funded so much atm, they have no plans of getting bought out by Sram / Shimano at least for the near future.
I once had a kick-hub on a single-speed and I agree; great idea, but the lack of integration required you to pay attention to something that wasn't the joy of the ride.
Thank you for a very objective review! Im curious to the pedals that you are using. Is that xpedo? or a new not released xtr?
SRM power meter pedals. Got a video on those vs Garmin Rally if you're interested.
Hey Ben , maybe off topic but would you rate BMC Kaius with 36cm cockpit as your top 3 bikes for racing ?
I have ordered one already 😅so a bit late to ask
I feel like the issues with throwing the chain would have been substantially worse with a 2x chainring setup as you would have more articulation on the derailleurs part to compensate for different chainring size.
Also, I feel like a ceramicspeed OSPW on gravel is just asking for trouble. The tension changes for the worse, and you have a $500 marginal gain just asking to whack a rock.
I really like this technology but I don’t see it going prime time until in integrates with the Shimano or SRAM shifters.
I think as many have said before, that theyve missed a trick with the ratio being exactly the same as a traditional 16T shimanno difference. Having a big front ring (56/58T) but your little gear could be 34 or 36T (or smaller?)
It would make a 48 to 33
@@graemeross1998 yeah exactly.. but why not make it like a 60 or 50% difference
Increase the odds of my least favorite things to do (touch the chain to get it back on the chainring, and service the rear hub) so I can look like a cool fixie rider. im alright with my 6600 groupset still.
How about the range of a front derailleur plus the Classified system?!?!?! You could climb vertical walls.
The big elephant in the room is installing the hub on any existing build wheel would be a big deterant, also I think dropping the front derailleur is not something you change often as you do the rear derailleur, and is mostly anticipated beforehand. It should be fair to find a place on the bar out of mistaken click's way 🤷🏻♂️
Agreed on the rear wheel situation! It’s kinda like the old PowerTap hub that way. Re the button placement, you could put it on the bar top by the stem where accidental nudges are impossible, but then shifting is inconvenient and far inferior to a normal front shifter.
Great subject for one of those "Whatever happened to...?" features in 5 years when this thing is long-gone and just a (bad) memory with the investor's money long-gone as well.
The people that build up this bike without a chaincather made a big mistake
You CAN integrate it into Shimano, I’ve used it
If integration is your big issue it’s solved if you use Shimano
maybe if you kept pedaling over the rough stretches?
I don't love that it's hub based. Should be possible to make a crankset/spider with this technology. Would also like to see some independent testing of the mechanical losses.
Sram would love to by them out but Classified wont let them 😅
No mention of the looney cost of the propriety cassette
Surprised SRAM hasn't bought them yet.
Sram buys Classfied before they email you back.
The chain is way too long. Even on the larger cogs your derailleur cage was pointing backwards. You probably had zero tension on the 11t cog.
Agreed. This was the setup on the demo bike.
Why though ? Cycling doesn’t need to be so complicated
Isn't a geared system massively less efficient than a chain? I'd imagine you're losing somewhere 8% - 10% due to friction in the gears
The button could be placed out of the way, most chain ring shifts are deliberate and infrequent. I would never waste money on Ceramic Speed products, they don’t work perfectly and claimed benefits are questionable. Best 1x aftermarket chainrings are made by TA and much less money than Rotor, Wolf Tooth, etc.
Sorry for the negativity, but how ever they package this, to me, it is still just a very expensive front mech😂 then you have to deal with all the in-house stuff and lose some features on the host groupset like shimano GH+ (because cassette doesnt support it).
i bet your main complaint is a high priority for Powershift....and that integration may prove to
be difficult to achieve as Shimano / SRAM etc would rather own that componentry than integrate with a small Belgian company.
It's too bad for them this will never take off
It's not a new technology. It hasn't bee used in the past because there are inherent power losses when using the 70% gearing. Those losses are probably in excess of 5% over a 2X setup. For casual use, its probably fine. For racing, it's probably to be avoided. Classified has disputed these loss estimates, but I don't know that there has been any independent testing verification.
“Were SRAM to buy this…” we would like see it drop in quality and lose even more integration🙄; have not had good experience with the overall function and quality of SRAM, first to market but all too often have lost quality and durability in the race to be first. Also, note to self, never use a Rotor front chain ring.
In theory a great system…………..you’re still young so hang in and enjoy…….I’m so jealous
Classified's Powershift is a 2-speed gear system housed in the rear hub. It effectively replaces a front derailleur on a 1x drivetrain. The system can be actuated wirelessly via a modified Shimano 11-speed Di2 shifter, or with a separate remote mounted to the
46/30 up front, mechanical for me. Too many restrictions on wheels, cassettes etc to make it practical. Looks cool, but it is a very over engineered solution to a relatively simple problem.
I have NEVER accidentally engaged a Shimano sprint shifter. Perhaps this “accidental shifting” is a “you problem.”
Wow, you're so incredible! 👏
Just get a belt drive and relax.
hambini already proved it is garbage.a watt loss device
You can set it up for tge Di2 to do the shifting