3D Printer - Power Supply Fan noise control
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- Опубліковано 18 бер 2017
- The newer switch mode power supplies have their fans running all the time, which can be annoying. My other power supply has its fan thermally controlled.
In this video I install a thermal switch for fan control, as it was originally designed for.
360w 12v 30A Power Supply:
www.banggood.com/Wholesale-12V...
240w 12v 20A Power Supply:
www.banggood.com/12V-20A-240W-...
KSD9700 Thermal Switch:
www.banggood.com/KSD9700-250V-...
Silicone Thermal Adhesive:
www.ebay.com.au/itm/10g-HC-910...
Imajeenyus Power Supply reverse engineered:
www.imajeenyus.com/electronics...
Electro Bob - Quiet 3D Printer:
www.electrobob.com/quiet-3d-pr...
Buy cheap 3D Printer kits and parts from Banggood here:
goo.gl/bFyz5H - Наука та технологія
Great detailed how to video. Just upgraded the PSU on my Trinus from a overheating brick to a 360w like yours so this mod will come in handy.
If you have a newer power supply (my new one was dated 05/2020), it’s the same procedure but the fan control circuit has been moved down to near the terminals.
The old markings are still on the board but all components are moved. The jumper to replace is marked “RT3”
I have two of those power supplies here!
good INFO thanks!
Friendly greetings from Netherlands!
Rob.
Always cool videos! Really like the occasional humor curves you throw in. The unexpected humor keeps me attentive.
Thank you so much for this, i installed a new fan on a psu and the fan wouldnt turn on so I thought something was wrong but now i understand its thermally controlled.
Thanks for this! I will definetely use it to upgrade my power supply because I still have a fan-less one.
I got the same power supply with the build in temp sensor.
I found out that my fan was installed the wrong way around. It was blowing out rather then in. So it would turn on when the temp was reached but never turned off.
I flipped the fan and now it’s working like yours.
do you have an explanation on how to get the ramps/ marlin to set individual temperatures ?
this is brilliant
ordered them for my 3 ridiculous noisy power supplies
simple but very effective indeed.
You have your wiring nice a neat, i have about 20 wires coming from my power supply, it's hidden under my desk though so no biggie. Can't wait to get my core xy going, the prusa i3 is a great platform to get you into it but now I'm going for an enclosed core xy so i can get good prints with abs and other higher temp materials.
Tom Salanderer has a quick fix for the encoder wheel. Yours look like when you spin the encoder the temp setting jumps
Your video is great for explaining how to reduce fan noise, many thanks.
anyway to turn off the default extruder fan that a8 came with? when not printing at least?
nice little hack, I also have that same kind of power supply . im sure they skimped on that thermostat because the fan is always running. Thanks for sharing.
Just what i needed to know. Thanks very much for the info, will make all the difference to my printer.
Can you send that lead to a fan on the control board? That a way you can fire it on when you want?
i Have the same power supply but there are differences i have a resistor connected where the jumper is sitting and there are components missing and j1toj4 are on your psu connected but my j1-j4-and j7 are connected with a bridge why are the same psu different?
Interesting, my PSU came without a thermistor as well, but I have replaced the fan with a silent fan instead of replacing the thermistor. My other printer has a thermistor and the fan starts spinning after 15 minutes of printing and then keeps throttling on and off when some kind of equilibrium has been reached. I'm just curious; why didn't you replace the fan as well?
Why don't you have more subs? Your my favorite youtube!!
Just what I was wanting to look into - Was going to investigate various options of different "no-fan" PSUs, increasing the air gaps in the fan mount, external mounting, expensive silent fans, restricting the fan current - but it looks like you've sorted all that for me!?
Went ahead and bought some of the thermal switches to do the upgrade and can't wait for a more silent printer! I think I will miss the audio feedback of the fan kicking in though as I know when one of the heat cartridges is being switched on, and when the print is finished without needing to look at the printer!! :)
Steve
Silence is blissful. I expect you won't miss the fan noise too much soon after adding the thermal switch... ;)
Haha - I hope so! Thanks again for the great tutorial(s)!
Steve
When I inspected my PSU's board, there was no jumper soldered in, but rather 2 diodes coming into that location. In your opinion, would this thermal switch still do the trick if I spliced it into the fan's negative lead?
Edit - On a whim, I tried splicing the thermal switch into the negative lead from the fan and that did the trick and now my PSU is also quieted. Thanks for this video!
I have a 24V power supply but the fan connection is different. Do you have the scheme for that type of Power supply? Thank you.
Hi I think you may be able to help me as I got ultimaker original but missing the 19 v power supply with 4 pin din output so I want to make it myself but I need the 4 pin polarity diagram, do you have it? Thank you
I have Tevo Tarantula.
It’s possible to use this method for Tevo power supply?
Thanks for sharing this. Looking at applying it to a Biqu B1 power supply.
My Anycubic I3 Mega came with the 45c thermal switch for the fan. I split the difference here and fed the fan with a resistor around the thermal switch. So, my fan is on at about 35% speed all the time, (quiet), and only kicks up to high when it's needed.
In most cases, I get through a full print without it going to high at all.
Which resistor you use and how
what is the resistor value? thanks in advance
Hello, I have a power supply with the symbol CL-400-4A and I do not have a schematic for it. The fan is very loud and constantly working. There are markings on the pcb for two fans. Can you help me? Maybe smooth regulation?
Why you place thermostat an coil? why no switch element like mosfet ? I think it can easily break with over temp more than that coil.
Great video! I'm going to go the opposite direction and remove the switch. Make it always on and install buck converter to drop the fan voltage to about 9v. That'll slow it down and should quiet it down.
Love your videos, keep up the great work!
You are great. It works perfectly. And without Tmc drivers the printer is so silent.
are there cheap components that control the speed of the fan based on temperature. I personally prefer a constant low background noise to a fan on full power every now and then.
I have a thermally controlled version of that fan. When the fan kicks in it sounds like a jet taking off. So I can understand why you might want to make it thermally controlled
Just done the modification....thanks for the video !!!!
I just did this .. and now my psu doesn't turn on. Didn't break anything. Just opened it up and soldered it on.
So worried that I had broke something, i de-soldered it. And then it worked again.
My board looks a bit different, and has a resistor in parallel next to the RT2 holes. Maybe I need to remove that?!
I'm using a thermaltake 1000w ps from one of my old PC's. Had a scare with the original one on my printer so I had the PSU just sitting on a shelf and wired it up. My bed and nozzle are on their own rail from it.
Very clear illustration Cheers!
Hi, awesome job! I would love to have that PSU cover... Can you share the link? Thanks!
Great video!! My workshop gets a little noisy when I have two or more printers going so any techniques to reduce the fan noise a bit are welcome. So what caused the failed print at the end of the video???
Clogged nozzle. Cleaned it out re-printed that 6 hour print with ease.
Electrobob replaced his noisy fan with a much larger, quiet fan, and throttled its speed also. I think that's a much better solution both for comfort and reliability.
my power supply does not have the room for a larger fan, there are large capacitors in the way, 60mm is the largest that will fit
Excellent video...I'm following your steps by just ordering the ksd9700 and the silicon based thermal adhesive...just one thing i need to know which was not very clear in the video...is the ksd9700 switch the (white part) inside the silicon ? as we dont see it, except for the black wires on the pcb...I'm new to this. thanks.
Yes it's embedded within the toroid covered in the silicone goop.
What criteria was used to determine where that switch went? Your choice seemed fairly arbitrary. Why not the output diodes on the supply or actual component supplying the power?
my hpercube has weird lines in the print ?? everthing is tight what is wrong?
Does the fan blow outside or inside the power supply?
this will help a lot. Thank you
"The power supply is not magic" hahahaha best
nice idea helped me a lot!
This is timely info thanks.
On the topic of fans, have you found the hypercube hotend/extrusion cooling fan to be _too_ good? Sli3r is set to _Enable Auto Cooling_ with the range between 35 and 100 percent. It seems my vertical layers are separating, particularly the final outer layer... Would lowering the fan speed help adhesion? (printing PLA @ 190 - 195 deg. on a 50 deg. bed)
- Eddy
Turn up the hotend temp. 190 is a bit low. Try 210.
Thanks, will try that today. Much appreciated.
- Eddy
mine has a different board inside, no omitted switch place on it. and fanspeed is controlled by the set voltage and current. :( that is stupid
I needed a better power supply for mine, I ended up with a computer power supply, it has a pot to assist the fan shipped and I just turn it down to an acceptable level. The fans on my got end are super noisy, I've replaced one and it was equally noisy.
Do you plan on using a mosfet in the future ? I would not be tranquil knowing the ramp board has to handle the 10A going to the heat bed.
On my other ramps board i added a heatsink to the bed mosfet. It still gets hot but hasn't failed me yet.
Really good and informative video thank you i think i am going to mod my psu too
Electrobob stated that the mechanical thermostat would lead to a shortened lifespan of the power supply due to the continual variation in temperature of the components caused by the switching on and off of the fan....So whilst it may be quieter, it may result in pre-mature failure of the power supply. Anyway that's what he said, not sure if it is right or wrong, but the fan continually running would tend to make temperatures more stable during operation.
i don't see a RT2 jumper on my 3d printer power supply
You could have used 65°C just as well. The only part that do not like such a temperature is the electrolyte caps. But a combination of a 45° (half speed fan) and a 65° (full speed fan) solves the problem then. Just disconnect the fan from the mother board, put the 45°C and 65° in it's place to measure the temperatur and add a small pcb with a ciruit for providing half voltage and full voltage depending on the temperature detected by the two bimetal switches. You could use some very cheap 8 pin microchip or atmel microcontroller for this ... they already come for at around 20 cents and some mosfets or relays to drive the fan depending on what the microprocessor detects from the bimetal switches. All in all something for at around 5 USD for the switching, but half voltage does a lot when it comes to noise!
I have a slightly different PCB in my power supply, the RT1 and RT2 switches are over the other side of the transformer and have NTC 5D-11 thermistors soldered in there, however the fan turns on as soon as power is applied so either they're not the correct rating for the use case, or the design of the PCB is totally different. I think I'll just get a quieter fan as I don't have the nouse to reverse engineer the circuit.
Same here... I wanted to do the mod, but now I'm not sure what to do. Can one just replace one of these with the KSD9700? Any chance for an update? ;)
You don't really need to follow step by step. You can directly put the thermal switch to the + of the fan
Just going to guess that switch is jumpered on, not just to save a few cents on the thermal switch, but also for safety/reliability. You should ensure that the fan will be always on if the thermal switch fails. You could run into dangerous heat issues if that thermal switch fails.
Hi Tech2C - how come you don't use crimped ferrules on your wires? They aren't expensive at all, and give better strain-relief and reduced chance of loose strands shorting out.
I do. When I disassembled the 3D printed cover from the power supply it exposed the crimped terminals on the wires. The power supply under test was temporary.
Ah, cool! Cheers!
Why did the print failed? Cause of the power supply?
MIght even be worth thowing a small resistor across that switch to leak some current to the fan, so it spins super slow, and makes minimal noise. And possible woudl prevent the full speed switch from triggering accept it in extrmly loaded conditions
I initially replaced the 22ohm resistor with a 39ohm resistor to reduce fan speed/noise. That worked great while idle, but as soon as I engage the bed the noise was loud instantly. It seems the more load you pull from the supply the higher the voltage the fan receives. I guess a zener diode would work to clamp the voltage to a fixed value. Either way this power supply stays around room temperature during prints.
I have the same power supply,and it sounds like a ruddy vacuum cleaner.I'll definitely do this mod.Parts on the way.
My power supply looks almost the same, but without the port for the thermal switch. Can i just solder it between the + cable of the fan???
That's what I did. I'm monitoring my psu to make sure it's all good for now.
@@victorlazaro6331 I just wondered how you got on with the thermal switch connected to the plus minus?
@@slicedpage You only need to cut the plus side of the fan supply and insert the switch between the disconnected parts of the cable. This way the switch will control the fan. The jumper in RT2 is just a shortcut for when the hardware has the option to take the switch.
Can the 250 volt switch you mentioned be also used at 110v???
Yes, you can. The 250v is the rated maximum which means you can use it on any equivalent or lower voltage settings. Hope that helps!
Btw, as part of the noise series have you looked into alternative stepper drivers like TMC2100 or even DRV's as a comparison?!
I've tried the DRV8825, but it caused the motors to produce a high pitched squeal.
TMC 2100 or 2300 the way to go . Makes a a huge difference !!
Tech2C Yeah for some reason the DRV8825's don't like running some steppers with VMOT at 12V. I modified my DRV8825 driver boards to push up the header pins on VMOT and GND up through the board. I connected VMOT to 24V and the squealing 95% gone.
warranty hehehe :D
i bought a new papst blower thats actually fits in.
it makes far less noise.
but im thinking about adding your thermal switch solution too.
Very good.
What I see is that the power supply is cheap, I think they decided to bypass the sensor to have the fan always on, less chances to get a fire 😬.
I am switching to Meanwell power supply.
Awesome video. A very simple upgrade but invaluable nonetheless.
Did you find out what caused the print failure?
Clogged nozzle. This was the second time it has happened with this orange PETG filament.
Thats annoying, especially on a long print.
But then thats how we get to learn which are the best filaments/manufacturers to use.
there are news on this nozzles front.
try one of the coated ones. got one but not tested so far.
or the ultimative olssonruby.com/ :D
Have you tried running the filament through a foam ear plug, just to make sure it is wiped clean of any external debris?
No I haven't as of yet. Chances of dust causing the clog is quite high in the spare room.
I just put one of these switches in series with the fan and glued it the same way as you did. Didn't need to mess with the circuit board at all. I used one rated for 40°C. That works very well for me. I did this on two printers.
Is it safe to touch PSU components like that? 🤔
Use computer power supply , get a 450w 80+ gold or white psu , they have much bigger fan so lower noise and they r build better & has pfc , also u can get 650w ones that can supply 65amps.
I bought a 40A 12v server power supply on ebay, with shipping included, for 20 dollars. Its as silent as a could be.
I just put 60mm Noctua fan on the outside of PSU and cut stainless steel mesh over it. Its barely noticeable now and looks pro
Yeah you're better off with constant airflow. Heat shortens the life of a lot of electronic components.
Please change both fans to noctua fans
Great video and a great hack !!
Cheers!
I noted on my chinese stock 12VDC power supply that the fan seems to be regulated ( albeit it a simple high or low regulation) Its always on but runs audibly faster when i switch in a load. i,e and initial warm up of both heated bed and hotend cartridge. Im just wondering whether having the thermostat switch in series with the fan is the best solution in my case. At the same time i'm working on a arduino- nano/ mosfet fan speed solution as well. Just waiting for some silicone cement to arrive !
It is weird what different things bother us... for me it was very annoying to have it on and off.
By the way, I did not remove the thermostat, it is still there. Now the fan idles by being powered through a resistor all the time (quieter than the extruder fan) and would only kick in at full power if it gets too hot. However, it never reaches that point, even when doing ABS.
Where did you install the resistor, and what value did you use? I initially replaced the existing 22ohm resistor with a 39ohm resistor which worked great at idle, but as soon as you increase load from the supply the fan spins up and is noisy again. It seems the more load you pull the higher the voltage the fan receives.
The aux supply used for the fan is unregulated which is why it increases with loading, in a way it is good. It has the negative connected to the negative of the main output as well. I have connected the resistor between the V+ output and the fan positive (thermostat is switching the fan positive), but you can just as well connect it in parallel with the thermostat. I have settled for 68 ohm (if i remember correctly), but this is highly dependent on the fan type, which I changed.
56 ohm, I have just checked.
That explains it. I was considering connecting the fan to V+ as 12v is almost silent with this 14v fan. But I settled on solution in the video as that is how the fan was intended to work, and does work on my other identical power supply.
That coil is pretty much the only thing that gets hot in a circuit like this, that’s why the thermostat is on it.
On the noise topic I do suggest to swap that annoying E3D fan, they are terrible... I did replaced mine with ugliest thing ever - skin and turd colour Noctua but reduced noise level is fair trade off.
Mine sounds like a jet engine... It needs to go!
Yeah I bought another 30mm fan for the hotend. Much quieter. I'll install it this week.
Make sure you get one with enough airflow I have a couple that are really nice and quiet but don,t hack it as a replacement E3D fan
When my hotend fan got noisy, I discovered all I needed to do was to lubricate the sleeve bearing in the fan, and it became almost silent. All I had to do was take off the sticker on the back of the fan, and put some oil onto the exposed part of the bearing while spinning the fan blade.
Mach My original fan on my MPSM was quite noisy until I oiled it.
How about replacing the fan with a quieter one?
That's an option. It would need to be powered by the output 12v as the stock fan is 14v and I'd say it's given a tad more than that.
A 65c thermal switch next to the two mosfets and a bigger fan would be ideal. 45 is too low.
My jumper is on the negative side in my power supply but the thermostat should still work I bet.
2:51 Measuring the resistance of a heating element to estimate its power consumption is far from accurate. Actually, resistance usually increase with temperature. as soon as your bed tarts to heat up, the current will drop.
You'd rather use a cheap Clamp Meter to get accurate results
It is a small Internet. I was just on that web page about PSUs before I watched this video.
The best thing you can do is wire ATX connectors to your board so you can connect any properly engineered ATX power supply. Get one with a thermally controlled fan, and you'll probably never hear it. At least, I don't hear mine. It's really damn easy, and gets you away from these cheap pieces of crap that everyone's using. I have a 20 pin ATX connector on my controller case which provides 5v standby to power a Pi w/OctoPrint, PS_ON for ATX power control, 3.3v for OctoPrint PSU status, as well as a 6 pin PCI-E for incoming 12V to power the board with 12v and run the motors, fans, and hotend. I have an 8 pin CPU plug on my MOSFET case to power the 12v heatbed MOSFET. All you need to do it is the PSU, obviously, and a few molex connectors (or just buy ATX/PCI-E/CPU extension cables and cut the wires).
If there is no pwm ic, it is a linear power supply
Thanks for the video! I tested the PS that I have received and what I find odd is that with no load on the PS, the fan runs at a slow speed. As soon as I add a moderate load (I only tested with a 1-1.2A load) the fan kicks in at full speed. I will be looking for a quieter fan and I'll order the thermostat. I believe that this is the same type of thermal silicon goop that you have used: www.banggood.com/STARS-922-CPU-GPU-Thermal-Silicone-Grease-Compound-Glue-p-1136461.html.
7:05 I don’t understand the need for the thermal conductive adhesive. Won’t it work without that adhesive?
An adhesive that is not thermal conductive isolates the thermostat so that it might not turn on at the designated temperature on the hardware that is supposed to be cooled.
Or rather the relationsship between load and temperature in that coil.
The thermostat will switch on when it itself is 45 degrees (in this example) but if there is poor thermal conductivity in the adhesive, the coil (or other hardware) might get too hot before the fan turns on.
I bet you could do away with just mounting a high quality fan with a constant resistor to bring it down to barely audible speeds.
I'm not electrical enginnert, but how safe is to touch those cheap chinese psu s while they are working ?
So did you try and actual print, how much % is the fan ON/OFF ?
What are you safety measurea when leaving the print overnight ?
Do you have some automatic shut off system for the printer ?
Aren't you afraid of fire hazard ?
Every time he touched that case all I could think was, This guy is brave. Because if he'd actually read that page he was on he'd have read that those Chinese PSUs don't have proper minimum creepage distances in them.
My house is equipped with a Residual Current Device (RCD) circuit breaker on the mains power. If live and earth are shorted, or a very small resistance is detected, the breaker trips. The chassis of this power supply is connected to earth.
As with any 3D printer you buy, use with caution!
+Tech2C So, have you ever tested out your GFCI? A buddy of mine is an electrician, and he just had to try one out once himself. He said yeah, it tripped eventually, but I still got a hell of a shock before it did. I ah, took his word for it, and passed on trying it out for myself. Because Larry's idea of a hell of a shock I'm sure is a hell of a shock indeed. So yeah a GFCI will save your life, but it is still going to hurt like hell.
WTF we can't edit posts anymore? People get paid to administer this site? Anyhow that's not exactly how GFCIs work either. They sense current returning on the neutral, and if it does not add up to what the hot is delivering then they trip. Because if it does not add up then that means current is flowing where it shouldn't.
Nice and dubbed
I accidentally bought NC thermal switch and working opposite way lol (I know I'm idiot)
Be careful when you buy the switch...
At this point I would ensure I have a good power supply. A meanwell power supply is not much more expensive.
Jeffrey Drake Exactly! I just replaced a similar noisy 24V supply with a fanless Mean Well. I'm using mains voltage for my heater so 8A@24V was plenty. I'm very happy with the change, both from a noise and a "I don't want my house to burn down due to a $20 Chinese knockoff power supply" perspective...
Thats exactly it - with all the time and effort, would be just easier to use a Mean Well (even a fan one is very quiet and thermally operated)
I would go with noize just in case the fan chooched i dont burn the house from over heating and flaming, unfortinutly happened to me but no house fire thank god
That's a risk with any appliance. More so from China I guess...
Banggood is Bangbad. I recommend going to Aliexpress. Much faster. Choose e-packet delivery.
I replaced mine with a 92mm noctua fan
it looks like z banding but its not?
Sounds like temperature variation try a pid tuning to stabalize the temps
ok i shall try thank you
yup that has seemed to have fixed it thank you
No problems glad I could help ;-D
"Dirty deeds, done dirt cheap" nice
Friend Tech2c please make a remix of parts(hypercube) for 1515 aluminum profile! It would help a lot.
I found a easier way, why not just unplug the FAN and cut one of the leads and wire the sensor inline. No disassembly required. I just pulled the FAN connector wires, clipped the red wire and wired the switch inline, that was it, tested it and it worked, as the model I have do not have the jumper.
5:25 14 volts? What the hell? :)
Well the test showing that the fan doesn't kick in at 64°C on the heated bed shows me that I can safely disconnect the fan altogether :)
That would depend on the ambient temperature, the length of time the test runs and the other components that need to run, don't forget he only had the bed active, not the hotend, fans or stepper motors.