I'm always going to be Clan Lasombra ride or die. Close second are my Nosferatu... but Tremere hold a special place in my heart. Two of my favorite gamers used to live action Tremere characters, and watching two complete sweetheart people play two of the dirtiest, most soul rotten backstabbing bastards was such an amazing experience, I came to love that clan.
@@TheMapleTable Would it be possible to post material to run games solo or with friends? everytime i look things up im unsure what im looking for : $ , maybe thats a good idea on a new video, how to get started with world of darkness in general.
If I may, jump in. Don’t worry about what people think. And enjoy the process. It’s supposed to be fun and rewarding so have fun and know that all narrative requires conflict. A story has a beginning a middle and an end. Go in and out with a bang.
@@TheMapleTable do they still promote Preludes, those are my favorite... I run them all at the same time and enjoy the 🤹🏻I can do it all day because one way or another you will end up accountable to someone and the harder they try and be loners the more sadistic the connective device. Always a way to bring a narrative together. Malkavian walks into a bar... what’s the joke? That a description of player Characters walk into a bar and if this prophecy doesn’t come to pass... good... he’s a Diablarist... doesn’t know jokes just mad you didn’t respond. Now he’s gotta try harder and that’s going to suck for everyone. Even him... he’s actually pretty casual about this, but seriously... 🪞
I think the Order of Hermes could act as antagonists or possibly as uneasy allies, especially if another threat is growing and they need to work with the devil they know. Shadow Lords seem like another group of backstabbing bastards who could try and manipulate Tremere for favors while expecting them to screw over the vampires while the Tremere see the same opportunities to use and abuse the Shadow Lords. Due to their time spent in cities, likely locations of Tremere chantries, the Glass Walkers seem like a likely candidate as well. You've got a clan who burry themselves into magical node locations in the cities. Walkers could do what they could to try and oust them, especially if they're coveting a particularly strong point they could access the umbra. They could also see the strong influence by the Weaver on places where the Tremere have setup their chantries.
Playing them in Bloodlines is playing the game on easy mode. Stealing blood from afar and their bloodsplotion discipline, forgot what it's actually called but I like bloodsplotion.
This ability is called Blood Boil, but Bloodsplotion also sounds pretty good. By the way, it was directly taken from the tabletop game. Although in V5 it is now called Cauldron of Blood.
In old school World of Darkness, Tremere found a torpid Saulot and performed a ritual to steal his vampirism. Tremere's disciples followed suit and they decimated the Salubri. Saulot and Tremere wrestle in Tremere's head for control, and he cannot truly rest lest Saulot take control. At one point the elders of the clan had to imprison Tremere in a mirror because Saulot managed to overpower him. I believe in one of the end times novels Saulot was able to free himself from the mirror and began to ravage Clan Tremere.
I have two ideas on what other WoD influence to put close to the Tremere. -Pentex: A young up and comming Pentex junior executive learns that his boss is a Vampire, and gets the Vampire 101. And sees in the Tremere power hungry mages with unknnown powers. So they try to get the Tremere to work with them as a kind of ace up their sleeve. Maybe sending even an Enticer. Maybe younger Tremere would try this for power? Maybe older Tremere would see deamons and pull out the putchforks? Maybe the Tremere tricks the Pentex member and get them to dance towards a bloody flute? -Of course Mages from the order of Hermes: While the older mages may ignore the vampires, because they are way stronger and don't have to care, again the younger mages may be interested in vampires ability to do crazy stuff without causing a paradox? Or seeing themself as so supperior to Tremere that they start hunts, like old english Lords, waking the ire of the Camarilla?
Hey! I have an example that could help. I play a Tremere in a mixed V20 + V5 setting (V20 rules) and she was tasked to solve a problem with the blood trade in NYC. Turns out blood was being bought en masse by a garou pack just outside city limits. They needed it because they were letting a mage dabble in blood magic in the hopes of finding a way to lift an ancient Tremere curse that left them without the ability to transform into their Crinos form. My blood mage negotiated a cease to their disruption of the blood trade and the mage's dabbling in exchange for her help dealing with the curse. The alpha of that pack was a skin dancer who just wanted to find an alternative so his people didn't have to resort to such a terrible thing. She found a way around the curse and, through careful use of blood magic, lifted he curse from around 10 garou. Even though she has her moral objections to some things the pack has done in the past, she supports the alpha's openness to trying better, more ethical alternatives. For her service in restoring his people and the good will they formed along the way, she was given a necklace with an Ahroun symbol and welcomed as part of the pack by the alpha. She works as the garou's informant inside the Vampire community in NYC and they help her by taking out strategic targets she needs removed or providing discrete protection should the need arise. I love this part of my chronic. They are still learning to accept a "Night walker" - as they call her - and she is learning about their culture and structure so she can be a better friend and ally.
Honestly, kind of hard to think of a werewolf/shapechanger group that could work with the Tremere since they tend to be low humanity vamps with a lot of occult rituals. I think the one group that could/would consider it would be the Kitsune Doshi, as they do believe in the whole concept of fighting fire with fire, as well as enslaving the servants of the wyrm for the greater good. Plus it helps significantly that a. the doshi are basically warlocks too b. Kitsune are fascinated by magic. Does not mean it would not be a shaky marriage though.
Low humanity? Low humanity is when Vampires start stinking off the Wyrm. As for the kitsune, they like /stealing/ magic, and since what they use tends to be hedge magic. Iirc, the Tremere in Chicago do actually have a fairly open relationship with Garou(and a Mummy) as of Under a Blood Red Moon, as it’s mentioned that they fought Thaumaturgy there?
@@____________838 Eeeh, if going off the oWoD rules, it's some where around Humanity 6 and lower that they wreak of the Wyrm when a werewolf attempts to sense it (Werewolf the Apocalypse 20th Ann. Ed. pg 156). They heavily wreak of it if they're on an alternative path/road. I personally disagree with what they have for that in the books, but yeah. [Note, this was before the first edit, it originally was pointing towards 7 and lower; 6 is still eh territory for me, but it works. I personally think 5 and lower is more appropriate, as that's when the beast is starting to win the tug of war.] The reason I looked towards the Kitsune for it, is technically the wording of their task is a bit different. Based on how the Kitsune's Laws of Heaven read, it's more like they're not specifically targeting the wyrm, but instead anyone that might destroy the world (which the weaver and wyld could try to do so, or do so on accident), the Wyrm is just the most prone to do it. Also, didn't know that about the Chicago game, haven't gotten to read that one just yet. Edit: Slightly off, 6 and lower humanity. Not 7 and lower.
Apparently I misread the first statement, I’m sorry. Also in rereading UaBRM, it’s not the college but the Caern… “During the reconstruction of Chicago, the Fanum became a temple where humans could study spiritualism . The Uktena kept their presence outside the temple to a minimum, since their Homid forms appeared as Native Americans . Good relations soon developed with the Gangrel, who were led by Inyanga, the ally of Menele. Many Gangrel used the temple to study Thaumaturgy and the ways of the Garou . Many human mages also used the temple.”
I've always had mixed feelings about this clan. On the one hand, they are usurpers who did things even more cruel than the deeds of the Tzimisce whose blood they used. On the other hand, they are very interesting and have great potential. Magic flows in their veins and this makes them one of the most entertaining vampire clans. However, my negativity is mainly directed only at the main part of the clan and their founder. I have a liking for some of the clan variants, such as House Carna and House Goratrix. If we talk about which creatures from other settings can be integrated into the game with the Tremere, the Mages first pop up, but it will be too simple. Among the Changing Breeds, Bubasti, the Egyptian werecats, would be a good option in my opinion, as they are among the most knowledgeable in magic. Balam werejaguars would also look nice, as they hold valuable magical secrets and rituals in their claws. They could turn out to be both powerful antagonists and powerful allies, if we are talking about the more cunning and crafty Balam (someone like Ichtaca, who made a deal with the dark forces to get the secret of turning from kinfolk into a full-fledged Changing Breed). I also think it would be interesting to use Changelings, since they have their own specific magical powers and even one of the houses of the Order of Hermes and also part of the Cult of Ecstasy cooperates with Fae.
I think that by definition the occult is hidden from view. If I were a practitioner of occult sciences I would prefer nobody know and not believe in such things. Also sometimes it’s not what you know, or your affinity, natural talent. It’s your will. How far will you go? What will you sacrifice? If I were born with lucky charms I’d throw them away. They’re an unknown quantity coming from a place nobody ever anticipated and not talking about how that happened to the characters in game. How would anyone know exactly what they’re dealing with aside from some cool customers.
YO just been binging your series on vampies and had to say, hope the move went smooth and that things are well and you're enjoying the UK! I made the trip in the reverse so I know how stressful all that can be xD
The Salubri? Those demonic monsters who where destroyed to save kindred kind? Not sure what that has to do with the Tremere, other than thank the clan we… err I mean they were able to save us all.
Hey! I just wanted to let you know that I appreciate you being objective in these videos. Some other creators have been very politically biased and it's refreshing to see that not all the WoD creators are like that. Cheers!
Goratrix's ritual used caitiff Tzim and wasnt an embrace or sorcerey, but real magic and could be said to have created a clean and seperate clan from the Tzim.
The source book Time of Judgment Gehenna proves that isn't the case. Tzimisce is very much technically the first of 3 Antideluvians of Clan Tremere. That is something Tzimisce is actually banking on, thanks to Meerlina's research into the true name of Humanity using DNA mapping projects.
@@ssjjshawn I thought that book was just an offering of possible scenarios. I have heard this though and I do admit that if cannon one has to concede real magic or not the Tzimisce blood ran true. But who was the 3rd ant? I know Saulot is "the stars above". Also tell me more about the DNA research.
@@Houston810 It was a list of Scenarios yes, but the throughlines for where each of the Antideluvians were existed before and, and this was the last canon book published by OG White Wolf. It was Onyx that did V20 (which didn't even hard retcon ToJ, just more took place just before/during) and then Paradox with V5. So since this was the official end to the OG line, they did release a lot of the old notes and even had a list of the 9 still alive Antideluvians, and revealed a lot of the "back rooms notes" that were considered canon even before then. But in each of the Scenarios where consistent with one another and prior lore, and in some cases is the only existing proof of some lore (like Saulot being the actual Father of the Baali) or pick up prior plot points and reconfirm them (like Meerlina looking for the True name of Humanity using DNA research in Dallas Texas) The 3 Antideluvians for Tremere are: Tremere (really only in name), Tzimisce (the actual Blood to the point that Tremere start to develop Vissiccitude and the Tzimisce clan Bane in the final nights when Vampires get more epowerful) and Saulot (Who for really unlucky Tremere, they still get the prior Skin melting, but now also have a 3rd Eye beaming Spirit UV Ray's into their skulls. Also its implied Saulot is the basis of the Tremere Thaumaturgy, as once he takes control of Tremere's body Thaumaturgy starts to fail like Magic did back for House Tremere). Also V20 Dark Ages, the only difference between Old Clan Tzimisce (aka the Tzimisce during the Dark Ages when the Tremere first appeared) and the Tremere was Animalisim/Thaumaturgy. They share Aupex and Dominate, even share a sorcery theme just replacing Kodlunic Sorcery with Hedge Magic.
@@ssjjshawn I agree with everything you've said, I do. But the fact is that it is ONLY in this book that there is any hard statement that the Tzimisce seed ran threw to the Tremere. And there has always been a very "hey the company's kinda goin under heres everything we were thinkin about, do what you want with it" feel to ToJ.
@@Houston810 To be fair, its also only here that: Saulot is explictly mentioned as having taken over Tremere as well (only hinted elsewhere iirc), Saulot was mentioned as the Antideluvian of the Baali (which is still treated as canon, Cappadocius was a Red Hearing even for Paradox still it seems), That Tzimisce had not 1 but 2 ready to go bodies (and can even come back in Thin Bloods decended from him) and a bunch of other things, etc. Yes it had the perfect "companies going under, here is everything we had in the back as the actual metaplot notes for 20 years" feel. So a lot of those ideas stick around when Onyx and Paradox revived it with V20/V5 respectively. Add this in with what we know actually happened at the Ritual of Usurpation, that after 7 days and nights of chanting, the Council of Seven devoured Goratrix's two Tzimisce Apprentices completely. (The biggest mystery is why the 7th Generation Apprentices made the Council all 5th Generation Tzimisce, and Tremere a 4th Generation one). It wasnt until the Council of Seven each diablorised a Selibri Methusalah, and Tremere Saulot himself that they were really seen as a full Clan. Also lol Saulot, dude is Antideluvian to 3 Clans that could not hate eachother more, or be anymore different from one another. And Ennoia is supposed to be the promiscuous one.
I love the Origin of the Tremere, the thread count on their loin clothes must be bulletproof. Wouldn’t want to RP one but respect that which is most dangerous. I don’t know why Any sect would let them in unless it’s pure intimidation.
@@TheMapleTable they really are, I don’t think kindred would make it if they didn’t have guile cunning and predatory instincts... silent hunter. Betrayer.
No sect let them in, so they had to create their own sect. Now even while broken and fragmented, the Tremere are still considered a cornerstone and High Clan in the Camarilla. It was Meerlina and Hardestadt the Elder who came up with the idea of the Camarilla, and Mistress Fanchon and the Younger both act as the 2 of the 7 Founders. The Camarilla is just as much a creation of the Tremere as it is of the Ventrue.
Sorry, but the Tremere aren't a vampire clan, they are a vampire pyramid scheme. But beyond the joke, they are good to be applied as antagonists in any games that focus on arcane mysteries.
I'm here as review as I've heard that Tremiere is created through so called ritual in fact Diablerie which is the Capital Crime in Vampire. Can you elaborate in your version of Diablerie?
As yes the Tremere, when becoming an immortal superhuman, capable of incredible feats of strength and speed, and riddled with supernatural powers is actually a *HUGE* downgrade.
i know i use blood magic too I do blood way I learned and very easy I love blood magic because in blueberry and ginger kombucha i know what im looking for because i create before i get like webmd
the tremere work well with bubasti and uktena imo. none of those parties are interested in a greater wyrm creature escaping it's bindings and any of them in theory could contribute to weakening or subduing it. imo they DON'T work well with BSDs since the tremere consider bargaining with beings that can corrupt your mind and soul to be not worth the risk and will censure anyone who doesn't agree with that position.
So to add onto what Maple said, that's a yes and a No, in previous additions they were but weren't. The way a Baali is created normally is by corrupted another Kindred into Infernalism IIRC, basically they Vampires that re-embrace into the "clan" Baali.
I have a crazy idea for a character. As a mortal, he couldn't get something he wanted by normal means so he turned to magic. He had talent, Tremere noticed him and embraced him. This made things significantly worse in terms of his original goal but he did learn of Vicissitude and went on a "quest" to diablerise a Tzim to learn Vicissitude. I wonder if this piece of work of a Kindred would be kicked out of the clan for his "unorthodox methods" or gain respect for his ambition.
had enough sleep I get get past being depressed and I was going but when i got back I had my case manager call me and I was yes they got right my case manager coming so i cant go to work but im hoping my workers went to work today and make me money
i know sense they brought me medicine and made me feel better knew was cold because i learned can catch cold we get over a cold fast and back to normal fast not like normal human cold tremere need black magic and magic treme today i had clean blood to feel better rose choclate are the best .......................... i have my case manager coming in today im washing clothes and cleaning sanatizing everything
sense someone got me medicine my stuff i got him pepsi all that stuff got yesterday I shared ....................... i didnt keep it all i shared with the other patinets being there for me
because the council sent my tremere to me saying that kjing can not rule without partner and I said I know so they have sent tremere into play I usuality only date rose but i was married to tremere in the beining how i got the power and where magic comes from this use to be goddess hecate what she was in but she goes into vessel gets killed
why condemn the virus and find the virus guilty this game is heroes the other government is no good and condemn evil find evil guilty and shame on evil
I'm always going to be Clan Lasombra ride or die. Close second are my Nosferatu... but Tremere hold a special place in my heart. Two of my favorite gamers used to live action Tremere characters, and watching two complete sweetheart people play two of the dirtiest, most soul rotten backstabbing bastards was such an amazing experience, I came to love that clan.
It's always nice when someone leaves an impact on you
Yes the Tremere are one of the best clans and do look at the pyramid and pay no mind to the eyes of the serpent within that pyramid.
I've never played VtM but I really want to (dont really know where to start!), love the lore videos, keep up the good work
My favorite is still the v20 edition. Its user friendly and most of the rules are streamline.
@@TheMapleTable Would it be possible to post material to run games solo or with friends? everytime i look things up im unsure what im looking for : $ , maybe thats a good idea on a new video, how to get started with world of darkness in general.
If I may, jump in. Don’t worry about what people think. And enjoy the process. It’s supposed to be fun and rewarding so have fun and know that all narrative requires conflict. A story has a beginning a middle and an end. Go in and out with a bang.
@@TheMapleTable do they still promote Preludes, those are my favorite... I run them all at the same time and enjoy the 🤹🏻I can do it all day because one way or another you will end up accountable to someone and the harder they try and be loners the more sadistic the connective device. Always a way to bring a narrative together. Malkavian walks into a bar... what’s the joke? That a description of player Characters walk into a bar and if this prophecy doesn’t come to pass... good... he’s a Diablarist... doesn’t know jokes just mad you didn’t respond. Now he’s gotta try harder and that’s going to suck for everyone. Even him... he’s actually pretty casual about this, but seriously... 🪞
I think the Order of Hermes could act as antagonists or possibly as uneasy allies, especially if another threat is growing and they need to work with the devil they know.
Shadow Lords seem like another group of backstabbing bastards who could try and manipulate Tremere for favors while expecting them to screw over the vampires while the Tremere see the same opportunities to use and abuse the Shadow Lords.
Due to their time spent in cities, likely locations of Tremere chantries, the Glass Walkers seem like a likely candidate as well. You've got a clan who burry themselves into magical node locations in the cities. Walkers could do what they could to try and oust them, especially if they're coveting a particularly strong point they could access the umbra. They could also see the strong influence by the Weaver on places where the Tremere have setup their chantries.
Playing them in Bloodlines is playing the game on easy mode. Stealing blood from afar and their bloodsplotion discipline, forgot what it's actually called but I like bloodsplotion.
This ability is called Blood Boil, but Bloodsplotion also sounds pretty good. By the way, it was directly taken from the tabletop game. Although in V5 it is now called Cauldron of Blood.
We all like bloodsplosion better :p
Yeah Thaumaturgy plus Dominate is so OP but I love it lolol
In old school World of Darkness, Tremere found a torpid Saulot and performed a ritual to steal his vampirism. Tremere's disciples followed suit and they decimated the Salubri. Saulot and Tremere wrestle in Tremere's head for control, and he cannot truly rest lest Saulot take control. At one point the elders of the clan had to imprison Tremere in a mirror because Saulot managed to overpower him. I believe in one of the end times novels Saulot was able to free himself from the mirror and began to ravage Clan Tremere.
I have two ideas on what other WoD influence to put close to the Tremere.
-Pentex: A young up and comming Pentex junior executive learns that his boss is a Vampire, and gets the Vampire 101. And sees in the Tremere power hungry mages with unknnown powers. So they try to get the Tremere to work with them as a kind of ace up their sleeve. Maybe sending even an Enticer. Maybe younger Tremere would try this for power? Maybe older Tremere would see deamons and pull out the putchforks? Maybe the Tremere tricks the Pentex member and get them to dance towards a bloody flute?
-Of course Mages from the order of Hermes: While the older mages may ignore the vampires, because they are way stronger and don't have to care, again the younger mages may be interested in vampires ability to do crazy stuff without causing a paradox? Or seeing themself as so supperior to Tremere that they start hunts, like old english Lords, waking the ire of the Camarilla?
Hey! I have an example that could help. I play a Tremere in a mixed V20 + V5 setting (V20 rules) and she was tasked to solve a problem with the blood trade in NYC. Turns out blood was being bought en masse by a garou pack just outside city limits. They needed it because they were letting a mage dabble in blood magic in the hopes of finding a way to lift an ancient Tremere curse that left them without the ability to transform into their Crinos form.
My blood mage negotiated a cease to their disruption of the blood trade and the mage's dabbling in exchange for her help dealing with the curse. The alpha of that pack was a skin dancer who just wanted to find an alternative so his people didn't have to resort to such a terrible thing. She found a way around the curse and, through careful use of blood magic, lifted he curse from around 10 garou. Even though she has her moral objections to some things the pack has done in the past, she supports the alpha's openness to trying better, more ethical alternatives.
For her service in restoring his people and the good will they formed along the way, she was given a necklace with an Ahroun symbol and welcomed as part of the pack by the alpha. She works as the garou's informant inside the Vampire community in NYC and they help her by taking out strategic targets she needs removed or providing discrete protection should the need arise.
I love this part of my chronic. They are still learning to accept a "Night walker" - as they call her - and she is learning about their culture and structure so she can be a better friend and ally.
Honestly, kind of hard to think of a werewolf/shapechanger group that could work with the Tremere since they tend to be low humanity vamps with a lot of occult rituals.
I think the one group that could/would consider it would be the Kitsune Doshi, as they do believe in the whole concept of fighting fire with fire, as well as enslaving the servants of the wyrm for the greater good. Plus it helps significantly that a. the doshi are basically warlocks too b. Kitsune are fascinated by magic.
Does not mean it would not be a shaky marriage though.
Low humanity? Low humanity is when Vampires start stinking off the Wyrm.
As for the kitsune, they like /stealing/ magic, and since what they use tends to be hedge magic.
Iirc, the Tremere in Chicago do actually have a fairly open relationship with Garou(and a Mummy) as of Under a Blood Red Moon, as it’s mentioned that they fought Thaumaturgy there?
@@____________838
Eeeh, if going off the oWoD rules, it's some where around Humanity 6 and lower that they wreak of the Wyrm when a werewolf attempts to sense it (Werewolf the Apocalypse 20th Ann. Ed. pg 156). They heavily wreak of it if they're on an alternative path/road. I personally disagree with what they have for that in the books, but yeah. [Note, this was before the first edit, it originally was pointing towards 7 and lower; 6 is still eh territory for me, but it works. I personally think 5 and lower is more appropriate, as that's when the beast is starting to win the tug of war.]
The reason I looked towards the Kitsune for it, is technically the wording of their task is a bit different. Based on how the Kitsune's Laws of Heaven read, it's more like they're not specifically targeting the wyrm, but instead anyone that might destroy the world (which the weaver and wyld could try to do so, or do so on accident), the Wyrm is just the most prone to do it.
Also, didn't know that about the Chicago game, haven't gotten to read that one just yet.
Edit: Slightly off, 6 and lower humanity. Not 7 and lower.
Apparently I misread the first statement, I’m sorry.
Also in rereading UaBRM, it’s not the college but the Caern…
“During the reconstruction of Chicago, the Fanum became a temple where humans could study spiritualism . The Uktena kept their presence outside the temple to a minimum, since their Homid forms appeared as Native Americans . Good relations soon developed with the Gangrel, who were led by Inyanga, the ally of Menele. Many Gangrel used the temple to study Thaumaturgy and the ways of the Garou . Many human mages also used the temple.”
@@____________838
Very cool.
The Uktena could work, so could the Qualmi maybe? Any fera with more magical leanings could work I think…
I've always had mixed feelings about this clan. On the one hand, they are usurpers who did things even more cruel than the deeds of the Tzimisce whose blood they used. On the other hand, they are very interesting and have great potential. Magic flows in their veins and this makes them one of the most entertaining vampire clans.
However, my negativity is mainly directed only at the main part of the clan and their founder. I have a liking for some of the clan variants, such as House Carna and House Goratrix.
If we talk about which creatures from other settings can be integrated into the game with the Tremere, the Mages first pop up, but it will be too simple.
Among the Changing Breeds, Bubasti, the Egyptian werecats, would be a good option in my opinion, as they are among the most knowledgeable in magic.
Balam werejaguars would also look nice, as they hold valuable magical secrets and rituals in their claws. They could turn out to be both powerful antagonists and powerful allies, if we are talking about the more cunning and crafty Balam (someone like Ichtaca, who made a deal with the dark forces to get the secret of turning from kinfolk into a full-fledged Changing Breed).
I also think it would be interesting to use Changelings, since they have their own specific magical powers and even one of the houses of the Order of Hermes and also part of the Cult of Ecstasy cooperates with Fae.
The houses i thought were pretty neat. I would like to look into those in the future.
I think that by definition the occult is hidden from view. If I were a practitioner of occult sciences I would prefer nobody know and not believe in such things. Also sometimes it’s not what you know, or your affinity, natural talent. It’s your will. How far will you go? What will you sacrifice? If I were born with lucky charms I’d throw them away. They’re an unknown quantity coming from a place nobody ever anticipated and not talking about how that happened to the characters in game. How would anyone know exactly what they’re dealing with aside from some cool customers.
YO just been binging your series on vampies and had to say, hope the move went smooth and that things are well and you're enjoying the UK! I made the trip in the reverse so I know how stressful all that can be xD
Thanks for that, the move went well
´Not a single mention to the Salubri Masacre?? Great video. Make one of the Salubri too.
They are next on my list
@@TheMapleTable I forget will you do video on kysib the half changeling half vampire the lasombra bloodline?
@@jamesisaacson6379 i can put it on the list to do
@@TheMapleTable ok cool is it long list just wondering?
The Salubri? Those demonic monsters who where destroyed to save kindred kind? Not sure what that has to do with the Tremere, other than thank the clan we… err I mean they were able to save us all.
Hey! I just wanted to let you know that I appreciate you being objective in these videos. Some other creators have been very politically biased and it's refreshing to see that not all the WoD creators are like that. Cheers!
Thanks for the comment! I try not to bring politics into it.
Goratrix's ritual used caitiff Tzim and wasnt an embrace or sorcerey, but real magic and could be said to have created a clean and seperate clan from the Tzim.
The source book Time of Judgment Gehenna proves that isn't the case.
Tzimisce is very much technically the first of 3 Antideluvians of Clan Tremere. That is something Tzimisce is actually banking on, thanks to Meerlina's research into the true name of Humanity using DNA mapping projects.
@@ssjjshawn I thought that book was just an offering of possible scenarios. I have heard this though and I do admit that if cannon one has to concede real magic or not the Tzimisce blood ran true.
But who was the 3rd ant? I know Saulot is "the stars above". Also tell me more about the DNA research.
@@Houston810 It was a list of Scenarios yes, but the throughlines for where each of the Antideluvians were existed before and, and this was the last canon book published by OG White Wolf. It was Onyx that did V20 (which didn't even hard retcon ToJ, just more took place just before/during) and then Paradox with V5.
So since this was the official end to the OG line, they did release a lot of the old notes and even had a list of the 9 still alive Antideluvians, and revealed a lot of the "back rooms notes" that were considered canon even before then.
But in each of the Scenarios where consistent with one another and prior lore, and in some cases is the only existing proof of some lore (like Saulot being the actual Father of the Baali) or pick up prior plot points and reconfirm them (like Meerlina looking for the True name of Humanity using DNA research in Dallas Texas)
The 3 Antideluvians for Tremere are: Tremere (really only in name), Tzimisce (the actual Blood to the point that Tremere start to develop Vissiccitude and the Tzimisce clan Bane in the final nights when Vampires get more epowerful) and Saulot (Who for really unlucky Tremere, they still get the prior Skin melting, but now also have a 3rd Eye beaming Spirit UV Ray's into their skulls. Also its implied Saulot is the basis of the Tremere Thaumaturgy, as once he takes control of Tremere's body Thaumaturgy starts to fail like Magic did back for House Tremere).
Also V20 Dark Ages, the only difference between Old Clan Tzimisce (aka the Tzimisce during the Dark Ages when the Tremere first appeared) and the Tremere was Animalisim/Thaumaturgy. They share Aupex and Dominate, even share a sorcery theme just replacing Kodlunic Sorcery with Hedge Magic.
@@ssjjshawn I agree with everything you've said, I do. But the fact is that it is ONLY in this book that there is any hard statement that the Tzimisce seed ran threw to the Tremere. And there has always been a very "hey the company's kinda goin under heres everything we were thinkin about, do what you want with it" feel to ToJ.
@@Houston810 To be fair, its also only here that: Saulot is explictly mentioned as having taken over Tremere as well (only hinted elsewhere iirc), Saulot was mentioned as the Antideluvian of the Baali (which is still treated as canon, Cappadocius was a Red Hearing even for Paradox still it seems), That Tzimisce had not 1 but 2 ready to go bodies (and can even come back in Thin Bloods decended from him) and a bunch of other things, etc.
Yes it had the perfect "companies going under, here is everything we had in the back as the actual metaplot notes for 20 years" feel.
So a lot of those ideas stick around when Onyx and Paradox revived it with V20/V5 respectively. Add this in with what we know actually happened at the Ritual of Usurpation, that after 7 days and nights of chanting, the Council of Seven devoured Goratrix's two Tzimisce Apprentices completely. (The biggest mystery is why the 7th Generation Apprentices made the Council all 5th Generation Tzimisce, and Tremere a 4th Generation one). It wasnt until the Council of Seven each diablorised a Selibri Methusalah, and Tremere Saulot himself that they were really seen as a full Clan.
Also lol Saulot, dude is Antideluvian to 3 Clans that could not hate eachother more, or be anymore different from one another. And Ennoia is supposed to be the promiscuous one.
I love the Origin of the Tremere, the thread count on their loin clothes must be bulletproof. Wouldn’t want to RP one but respect that which is most dangerous. I don’t know why Any sect would let them in unless it’s pure intimidation.
They are pretty good at intimidation
@@TheMapleTable they really are, I don’t think kindred would make it if they didn’t have guile cunning and predatory instincts... silent hunter. Betrayer.
No sect let them in, so they had to create their own sect.
Now even while broken and fragmented, the Tremere are still considered a cornerstone and High Clan in the Camarilla.
It was Meerlina and Hardestadt the Elder who came up with the idea of the Camarilla, and Mistress Fanchon and the Younger both act as the 2 of the 7 Founders.
The Camarilla is just as much a creation of the Tremere as it is of the Ventrue.
Good 👍 video thanks 😊.
Glad you enjoyed it
Am going to join the tremere clan in the new vampire Masquerade bloodlines 2 game it's going to be awesome
Sorry, but the Tremere aren't a vampire clan, they are a vampire pyramid scheme.
But beyond the joke, they are good to be applied as antagonists in any games that focus on arcane mysteries.
I'm here as review as I've heard that Tremiere is created through so called ritual in fact Diablerie which is the Capital Crime in Vampire. Can you elaborate in your version of Diablerie?
As yes the Tremere, when becoming an immortal superhuman, capable of incredible feats of strength and speed, and riddled with supernatural powers is actually a *HUGE* downgrade.
I thought that the Tremere had ''diablerized'' Saulot. The anti-deluvian of the Salubri.
Thaaaaaaanks
The Celestia Chorus and Kitsune would work best and maybe progenitors
i know i use blood magic too I do blood way I learned and very easy I love blood magic because in blueberry and ginger kombucha i know what im looking for because i create before i get like webmd
i use to be married to tremere and that was not so bad
the tremere work well with bubasti and uktena imo. none of those parties are interested in a greater wyrm creature escaping it's bindings and any of them in theory could contribute to weakening or subduing it. imo they DON'T work well with BSDs since the tremere consider bargaining with beings that can corrupt your mind and soul to be not worth the risk and will censure anyone who doesn't agree with that position.
is the baali a clan ? and what of the dauthers of cacophony ?
The Baali are more of a bloodline than a single clan, at least in V5. In other editions they have been a full clan.
So to add onto what Maple said, that's a yes and a No, in previous additions they were but weren't. The way a Baali is created normally is by corrupted another Kindred into Infernalism IIRC, basically they Vampires that re-embrace into the "clan" Baali.
clan tremere was a Husband of mine ..........................
I have a crazy idea for a character. As a mortal, he couldn't get something he wanted by normal means so he turned to magic. He had talent, Tremere noticed him and embraced him. This made things significantly worse in terms of his original goal but he did learn of Vicissitude and went on a "quest" to diablerise a Tzim to learn Vicissitude. I wonder if this piece of work of a Kindred would be kicked out of the clan for his "unorthodox methods" or gain respect for his ambition.
Neat concept, I don't know what the clans would think. Diablerie is frowned upon in the kindred world but power moves can be respected
@@TheMapleTable So it would depend on the ST. Thanks for the reply!
Tremere did nothing wrong.
With that stated this clan could have fascinating interactions with Mages
had enough sleep I get get past being depressed and I was going but when i got back I had my case manager call me and I was yes they got right my case manager coming so i cant go to work but im hoping my workers went to work today and make me money
i know sense they brought me medicine and made me feel better knew was cold because i learned can catch cold we get over a cold fast and back to normal fast not like normal human cold tremere need black magic and magic treme today i had clean blood to feel better rose choclate are the best .......................... i have my case manager coming in today im washing clothes and cleaning sanatizing everything
sense someone got me medicine my stuff i got him pepsi all that stuff got yesterday I shared ....................... i didnt keep it all i shared with the other patinets being there for me
because the council sent my tremere to me saying that kjing can not rule without partner and I said I know so they have sent tremere into play I usuality only date rose but i was married to tremere in the beining how i got the power and where magic comes from this use to be goddess hecate what she was in but she goes into vessel gets killed
i know im over politics and over relgion in the masqurade the only way is you keep the vampires close by and you help them change you
doesnt even talk about House Carna! smh
why condemn the virus and find the virus guilty this game is heroes the other government is no good and condemn evil find evil guilty and shame on evil
why say no politics we need break free from politics and religions elders