AC Coupled PowerWall PROTOTYPE
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- Опубліковано 20 вер 2024
- List of Products used in this project kit.co/jehu/ac...
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8) Why not use Supercapacitors?
A. Batteries work better at this time, caps are rare and expensive devices that are very good at doing things not needed for storage systems typically.
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Im amazed at how you build your systems. I always enjoy your videos.
Thank you
Dude, that is awesome!!! So you can charge your powerwall when energy is cheap and use battery power when the energy is expensive. That is so cool congratulations Jehu. You are the best!!!
Seriously Jehu I am absolutely amazed at the level of complexity and sophistication of the systems you create. Really impressive. Really impressive.
BTW I'm an Electrical Engineer and I've designed backup power systems for large telecommunications installations and it always amazed me that the technology is so simple BUT UNNECESSARILY EXPENSIVE. Just out-of-the-sky exorbitant, vulgar expense.
I really hope you and your fellow "Tinkerers/Makers" start a full on revolution. Personal control of your energy / lifestyle / cost of living though personal energy systems has to be the first step.
PERSONAL POWER is a must for freedom in most senses. For poor, not so poor and well off.
And I'm NOT talking about those time-warped doo-doo Preppers who want to bring back "the good old days" (whatever the **** that shit is). They want to return to a time long past, that should NEVER have happened BUT WITH ALL THE MODERN TECH. They are soo lost in w**** p********. Those days a'int NEVER coming back. The clowns they vote (on both sides) for have seen to it and will continue to do so if left unchecked. You seriously mean to tell me that an american, from a population of 300 million, MUST HAVE ONLY TWO CHOICES ?!?!?!?! Just like the stupid Brits. (I'm also British :( How can a country that claims to offer limitless "freedom to choose" offer it's populace only TWO SERIOUS CHOICES ?!?!?! Any attempt a third or other party is crushed hard.
You and many others like you are living proof that the people that have the world in this awful, abused, unequal, exploitive, decrepit state; have been LYING TO US FOR THE LAST FOUR HUNDRED YEARS !
You and your friends like Rich Rebuilds and the guys at EV West and the other guy that lives in an RV (can't recall his name), CONTINUALLY DEBUNK, DEMYSTIFY AND SIMPLIFY solutions to modern living that are not only DUPLICABLE BY ALMOST ANYONE, but AFFORDABLE !!!
GOD BLESS YOU JEHU GARCIA. I add all you videos to my UA-cam playlist for reference.
I could go on and on; but keep doing amazing work Jehu.
Cheers
Hey Jehu....you say this is a "prototype"....did you ever get to a final design? Thanx.....you are my hero!!
I work for Taylor Press Products in Jarrell Texas, we have laser, bending, and full production presses to suit high volume needs for very low price per part costs. We'd love to hear from you and GREAT JOB ON YOUR POWERWALL! I've been a long follower of your work and video, it's great seeing it come together finally!
This is incredible. I can't believe we're almost to the point where you can build a powerwall kit that's almost ready to go with very little effort!
I love this powerwall...it may take me some time but I will build these for my home.
Having the backup for the charging is a great idea...always good to have a secondary safety mechanism.
My rule of thumb for SOC/SOD is up 80% charged & down to 20% discharged...it seems to be the best levels for usage verses longevity for the batteries.
At 11:09PM there is 2604 watts being used in my home...but this does include a window A/C & a coffee pot...without those devices the usage is 612 watts.
Great video! what's also relavant is that PG&E shifted the peak and off-peak windows away from peak solar times. This is mainly what led to so many solar homes gradually start to see their NetZero Solutions have a larger true up bills. The powerwall allows you to follow the changes in peak times so that you always sell at the best time.
Thanks for this Jehu, I have a grid-tied solar panel system and I was trying to wrap my head around how you would tell it to charge during the day then discharge at night. I have PG&E and with their current financial status all customers are about to get hosed with major price hikes. I run all major appliances during the day, one at a time so that I don't pull from the grid. At night there isn't much going on except a couple of computer UPS and maybe a whole house fan. I need to see what my grid pull and push are. I'm looking forward to building one and slapping it on a 20A dedicated garage circuit in the next year or so.
Thank you for all you do, this is great work and information!
You can get a normally open switch hook it up to one of those light-sensing relays as soon as the Sun hits it in the morning your batteries can begin charging.
@@bvisel4558 Thanks Bob, but all my relays are built into the panels. Each one has an inverter. In hindsight I regret that. Not only for a battery, but also as an amateur radio operator. Those things are super noisy RF wise.
Jehu's approach makes it real easy for me to interconnect the system.
Please ensure that the grid tie inverter is certified for your location to be used according to electrical code. Otherwise it can maloperate and can create safety issues for electrical repairmen in your area
Here in the UK, some energy suppliers give you a forecast of the cost of energy over the next 24h. It is possible to chose when you will buy electricity and when you will use or sell the electricity.
In the UK, the most expensive time is 5pm to 8pm. The cheapest is around 4am. There are several peaks and dips. An ESP8266 or similar will let you read the costs and then charge or use as appropriate.
I’ve been waiting eagerly for your Powerwalls progress to reach this point. For me personally, this is something I can now work toward and duplicate. Thank you for all the long hard work and research you do to improve and make viable systems that you show as a DIY project. Your education and instruction is very valuable and necessary to improve our way of living.
The battery boards should be changed to card slide in a backplane type. It would cut your assembly time down greatly and battery maintenance would be a snap. You would not need ribbon cables either. The battery cards would be hot swap and super easy.
That is very neat - especially in respect of the BMS. All other systems which I have seen, have a network of fine wires going everywhere. You have managed to bring order to the situation.
Good description of Tariff Shifting. I have no solar and would consider this as a possible approach
I love your work and mostly your DIY Product, You are an awesome inventor, you are in my list of my role model.
You and your video inspired me to start up a UA-cam channel, and I hope to be great in the near future.
I like your setup the way you have your power wall
Mr jehugarcia. All the way From Namibia. In a nutshell i gota say. I appreciate your work. If u can doit, theres alot of hope for me. Keep the inspiration flowing
I like the construction with those brass spacers/posts, looks neat 👍
You mention the talk about the further development of this. Is that in a public forum somewhere? I'm not savvy enough to understand it but I find this type of stuff super fascinating and maybe one day build one.
Thermal switches are junk I have try to use it on solar thermal...to switch on pump and first failed also second and third.... 55 °c is sometimes switch on 65° 80° or never.....
Good luck with thermal switches.....
Grear video.....
Jehu why dont you use grid tie inverter with limiter....excellent features they have.....👍😎🖖
Will you be setting up to recharge the powerwall via solar panels some time in the future, Jehu? How about a parts list for this setup? What 24vdc power supply are you using? I've only seen 480w largest size on Ebay and Amazon, so far. Do you have a fan or two for pulling heat out of the entire box? It's cool to see your box almost finished. Have you ordered your JehuWall decal from Caveman yet? LOL
Hi Jehu, I've enjoyed watching your channel for a few years now and always loved it!
I'm finally planning on applying what you preach! I'm about to do a conversion of a 16 passenger (short) school bus to be my Recreational Vehicle.
I want to put an array of 260W PVs on the roof - enough power for heating, cooling, lighting and cooking with only electric and totally avoid propane use. I already have 2 AC powered 1500W induction cookers. Lighting, refrigerator, heating and A/C should be no problem. I would also like it to plug into external AC when I am at a RV park. I will have plenty of hot water since when my 18650 batteries are full, they will switch to heat the water. I'm learning from you every day!
Jehu, awesome video, that is a sexy powerwall for sure. I think I would leave the State Of Charge board on the front of the enclosure, you can see it from across the room while walking by vs. having to go to the side to see it. I have 8 modules built so far. I ordered 15 boards. Having a blast.
Can you share your build plan?
You’ve made some great progress on this. Great job
This is a great idea. I look forward to you selling a complete dyi kit, maybe less batteries. The off grid kit will be good for me. I have a grid tied solar system, but when Mr Hurricane comes around we are SOL . I could use this system with a pure sine wave inverter and a manual grid disconnect to at least keep a few circuits on. Most of the battery backup systems on the market cost many times more than this one would and you can't repair them.
Go all the way: install automatic transfer switch to disconnect grid when grid down, run home from powerwall into pure sine inverter into breaker panel. Intelligently recharge from dc solar, ac grid or auto start generator.
I think this is definitely the way to go, but why not also just do this with any solar installation? Power off in the middle of the day? Cutt off the grid and run off the solar, add a batt for even more stability/non daylight hours. I know they definitely didn't do anything like this on my solar install and the same with the rest of the folks I know that have it.
Great work!
I'm thinking of adding a B-type venting chimney system with isolated submodules that vent the fire from one submodule at a time to the chimney in the event of a fire. I don't know if those cells would melt right through metal; they would have to be substantial fire vents. That way we could put different types of batteries in each little submodule from a lot of recycled sources, and we wouldn't care if sometimes there was a fire. That would make the BMS harder, so I suppose it would have to be one BMS per submodule to make sense.
Great video Jehu!one thing I'd change in your system though for safety, don't trust those little PCB mounted relays at switching any sort of current, rather use that to switch another (rated and reliable name brand) relay. I've had these relays get scary hot even at currents they are rated for!
Hi Jehu have you looked at the Imasbean grid tie inverters with limiter. This would make sure that you don't send power back to the grid. I have also used micro inverters similar to enphase. They have a wide operating voltage and don't overheat at maximum output. No cooling required. Also they are small and easy to stack in parallel. Thanks for your time and effort. Mike from Jamaica.
You mentioned that in this prototype you installed more BMS units than needed. I think you mentioned 1 BMS for 10 PCB’s. Since all boards are connected through the standoffs, how do you assign a BMS with only 10 PCB”s? It seems that if one BMS fail the others may carry a higher load, thus if only one BMS is operational it would be overloaded in a fully populated power wall.
For your lid you should include provisions for slim fans and lower/upper vent ducts with some sort of standard air filter(s)
I was thinking the same thing he needs some venting in there if he is putting a lid on it!
This is the 'a juevo' proof that Mr. Garcia's videos dictate. Great job!
Great job Jehu!
Why do you not use solar panels to charge your power walls instead of using mains electricity? If you lost power for a few days you would be stuck.
If I can suggest. I like the overcharge circuit board the way it is except maybe if there could be red lights on the top and yellow lights on the bottom with green in the optimum middle area.
Thank you for sharing Jehu. Looking great.!
While watching your and others folks videos concerning power walls began to wonder how the DC power wall takes over for your AC power when power fails?
Did you ever publish a final design plan for your power wall? I’d like to recreate your design but the videos don’t seem to capture the final working design.
I got the same plan. I have a grid tied solar setup and this would me a great option. I can't find the designs either.
Suggestion: get someone to use a ESP32 or smaller to send you a text and/or email when it is at overcharge voltage, and for other events. It can also handle Alexa/Google home interface. It might be able to do your data logging too.
nice....a parts list with links would be sweet...
Being Somewhat financially Strapped I'm attempting to peace meal a system here. Currently working on Small Solar array ( 500W ) supplemented with a 500W Chines Wind Turbine. Normal winds were only realizing like 100 -200W from the turbine when running. Plug and Play Grid Tie ( Same Unit Your Using ) set up for daily use. Goal simpley reduce our already lower then most power bill. Averages around $100.00 a month. Really need to buy some of the 18650 PCB kits ASAP. Again were Broke ! Current storage is so limited it's like not even having one. Just enough battery to interface and Buffer the Two sources to the Plug and Play Grid tie. Other then the Crappy Fan Issue have you had any other problems with those Gid Tie inverters ? Your a Pipeline of Information Sir !
this is impressive design. Love the modules
Hey hi, Congratulations on your first successful power wall, and all the best for the next version, I seriously wish to come there and help you do these they are a hell lot of work if done alone which i think you do, God bless, keep the great work going.
Hi, great job here. I'm looking forward to make some DIY powerwall too, but basically I was wondering does it worth it?
Your baterries can on average cost 150€/$ per kWh. (battery only !)
1. A kWh cost between 0.10 to 0.30€/$
2. The cycle life of batteries can barrely goes higher than 2000 Cycles
=> 1 kWh of batteries can store the equivalent of max 200-600$ of energy in his whole life right?
Spending/storing 300€ per kwh of free electricity coming from my solar panel cost the same as buiyng it from my local supllier.
For now, I think it's only affordable for second hand batteries you may get almost free, isn't it?
i'd like to see those battery modules "rack mounted" and "hot swappable" just like computer hard drives you'd see in an enterprise server room. those battery modules look to be similar in size to hard drives, i'm sure the same racks can be modded to hold those modules.
Cool but kinda a lot of relatively low tech solutions you could have an arduino do the timing and temperature sensing
OMG How did he not get shocked touching everything?
This there a wiring diagram to go along with the parts list? cheers
did you ever find one?
I thought the BMS boards can only hold so much current, so why do you only have 2? You also mentioned that you were only going to use one originally. Now I am confused as to how to guage how many BMS's you need in a power wall.
they can do 1200w each board
Have you found a way to sell back to the grid? That would be amazing
Great video, just like always .
Do you have a schematic of your system drawn up you can post?
Hey Jehu awesome build man i can't wait to see the second one done. Only problem i would have is when you need to change a cell that is in the middle of it all. It will be a SOB job i tell ya. But other then that awesome job man. What is the name of the case?
jehu how you attach the timer relay to the inverter can you give me a link and you know the name please help i am going to building one let me know befor i make my order thank you
Whats the difference from packs and this PCB make a video.jehu musk
When do you think you'll have an update on this project? Any way you can share a complete wiring diagram of this setup? thanks for all you do!
This is really cool but for longevity really need an easier way to remove specific cells and to service the wall. Looks like a nightmare to take that stack of batteries apart
Depending if the thermal switch is NC or NO, wire a led series with the thermal switch and it will illuminate exactly where it's getting too hot so you know where to look at
If you can I would like a a breakdown of how much you would cost if I had you build me one of these boxes I need it for a 30 amp trailer I have a fifth wheel and that would fit right in a compartment that I have in this camper I've been watching you a long time and I am just so fascinated with how good you are at this stuff thank you for what you were doing I would love to buy one of your power walls over a Tesla any day
Umm, am I missing something here? $3,800 for 10 kwh seems like a good deal, however you can already get an LG 10 kwh unit for about $5,500 with a warranty.
I did build the audio-alarm/load shedding accessory board for those PZEM-021 meters. Retro-fit inside the meter package.....
jehu do you use super capacitors? if not what about using multiple led acid 12v in series that could take a super charge from some temporary super capacitors before sunset that could take a quick charge drain them into the led acid then the led acid would be able to drain slower into the lithiums, have you ever looked into how solar panels are made maybe you could improve it with your talent, you earned your talent, has the history channel ever contacted you for a documentary it's about your understanding
I'm curious what the overall efficiency of this prototype. If you were to charge 6kW of offpeak from the grid you'd still have some loss, also loss during the discharge cycle as it converts back to your AC service. I'm sure it'll still be cheaper than paying peak TOU prices, though.
Just sticking your hands and fingers everywhere....then you are like, 'mostly safe'....sigh. LOL.
This looks very professional.....as replacement for a tesla wall perhaps?
Your list of products link doesn’t work. Can I get a list for this build.
Fixed
Where are you on this setup? Would like to get the schematics and drawings and set this up for myself.
me too i hope he would share some drawing design to setup
such a cool project!
I know this video is a bit old. I've been following your videos but, although they are informative, I haven't seen one that gives a clear outline of your design. I'd like to follow your example and I have bought about 10 of your kits but I would do much better if I had a good schematic of your design. I'm still not clear on how the packs are wired in the final design and how much power a fully populated panel will produce. You may have said it in one of your videos and I missed it but I have heard several figures but nothing for sure. Another question is why? Why do you have a power supply, inverter, CCCV, etc. Couldn't you just fill the enclosure with batteries and connect it to a MTTP/solar Inverter?
08:57 that's a bug, not a feature. Charge controllers need to know what to do when an overcharge occurs, not just scream until a human intervenes...
He's only had one battery catch fire, destroying someones home. Oh wait....
Love the dogs. I Expect to see more of them.
YOU SHOULD design the cover like the front of your samba
Why do you have an unpopulated BMS board on top of the right hand stack?
How are you synchronize the phase with grid power? Assume you are plugging in to a standard outlet in the house. Doesn't the "sine wave" of your power output need to match up with the "since wave" of the phase of grid power you are connecting too? Otherwise, don't they cancel each other out or decrease the amplitude of the "since wave"?
here in Georgia, we can sell back power but at a fraction of the price, and can be done once a year ..it is a scam
Hi!
I thin is too complicated.
Thx!
Termsl Paste.
Maybe use "termal Paste" on this heat switches. Like they use it on CPU when the put a cooler in a Computer. It transfer heat alot better. So Termal Pste on the cobtact area and then Glue around the edges maybe.
Hope it makes sense :)
Greatings from Germany
Arctic Alumina Thermal Adhesive is best for these, I use it all the time to attach heatsinks to chips where mounts aren't available.
You'll also need a rapid disconnect, outside so utility can shut off the interface when they want too. It's in NEC 2014 and NEC 2017 national electric code.
Remember he said is a DIY PROTOTYPE. It's not complete . Give him time.
Doesn't the grid tie inverter have that functionality already?
the grid tie inverter has a rapid disconnect
@@MiniLuv-1984 it has to be outside and labled and inside the plan approved with the permit. It needs to be compliant with NEC 2014 690.12.
@@sydmushas these cheap grid the boxes are only legal with a private power grid. The public grid is a protected network you can't legally use these.
This is great for no soldering and neatness, price wise though you can beat the old eBay cell holders for making 80 cell packs. But this has interested me for smaller portable packs, camping and such.
In typical off-grid scenario charge time should be 4 hours, discharge more than 20 hours. So this is charging where the batteries should be stressed more. Because in those 4 sun hours you should put in bank more than you will need over the next day. So the sizing of the solar and batteries need to be done for this max power of the charging cycle. Except if you have short duration very big loads on the output, then that would be for those instead. For a house I would size the battery as 3 days of power use. then size solar to be able to charge up the battery in 8 sun hours. (calculate 2 worst winter days charging and available power for 3 bad days with no sun). Then size fuses for that.
All of your kit.com links in the description are broken
5:00 you could cool the battery stack with (solar powered) water cooling loop
oh wow brother please do your first UK installation at mine please. Loving your videos on how you build things. God Bless
A question: how could I ever run like a welder station that takes for example 300 AMPERS?
Would it hurt the batterys if I drawed power directly from the inverter?
This is a grid tied system, your connection to the grid would supply the extra power needed. You cannot run items directly off of this inverter, isolated from the grid.
Being connected to the grid is not worth it and only a hastle,the point of having a solar system is to invest in it and use it's power
Also,,why not?
I still don't understand about using a BMS with each S-channel monitoring a bunch of batteries in parallel. Is that really effective at protecting the whole bank if one cell among many in parallel gets out of balance?
I didn’t see how it hooks in to house power, looked like it was just plugged in wall socket? Or was there some other panel? Thanks I want to build a power wall but it seems like there is some missing steps. But I dig the concept and your channel’s info.
if you could sense when your solar panels are exporting more power than it takes to charge your batteries and at that point turn your charger on, would you be charging your batteries indirectly from solar?
Could you use Dow Corning MS4 heatsink paste with the temperature probes?
Has there been any mention of a hotswap back pane? It would make replacing cells in the middle of a stack much easier. It would require a redesign (and be more costly), but depending where people are sourcing their batteries, it might not be a bad option.
I Killeen TX. I pay .08 cents a kwatt.. lol my monthly bill 25-30 bucks.. the actual cost be like 16 bucks and delivery charge 17. Lol
Jehu ese inverter chino no tiene más del 85% de eficiencia, creo. Así que aunque las pilas tuvieran por ejemplo 1 kWh, no ibas a poder sacar más que 850 Wh, o, si es de 9 kWh, solo 7.65 kWh, el resto (1.35 kWh) se perderá en forma de calor en los inversores.
At that price it would be worth engineering a grid tie inverter directly into a eu2200 inverter generator to feed the grid that is if your fuel priced weren't so high. I bet the way the honda inverters work it could totaly be doable
Great work Jehu, but what is the lifespan of the power wall if well maintained?
Awesome this is what i looking for
Hey man, let me know if you wanna integrate an arduino into that system. You can reduce the cost even more and have more features and more stats logging. Hola from Costa Rica!
Yes it’s open source project, you are encouraged to develop any module you see fit
Have a Question.....
If batteries are powering the grid tied inverter (that couples with the grid)
and the Grid is powering the Battery Charger....
WTF is going on here ???
Yea it is great but yet u can't buy any thing to do it. cuz every thing is sold out or shipping is more then price of what u are buying & it will only be 6 months be4 it gets to you.
*Perfection* 👌
Apart from this being very marginally legal (since using non-certified hardware), there's also the issue of what happens when your house total consumption is lower than the production of your powerwall: you would be pushing energy INTO the grid, which is also not legal and the power company wouldn't be happy if the found out. So, you have to add some extra hardware to limit production, which I don't think it's possible with those kinds of grid-tie inverters.
So very true - none of that meets code, but keep in mind the purpose of these videos is not to "save" any money, but to promote selling the kits and all the surplus batteries on ebay from jehu's friends. Note that whenever they need to move inventory, jehu magically decides to build something that uses what's on sale this week. If you work out the longevity of this hardware to depreciate the equipment, you'll soon find that it's more expensive to build and operate one of these powerwalls than to just buy the power at whatever rate is being used with conservation in mind. I.e. do laundry at night. The jehu vids are just kinda-sorta-sponsored advertising for his business partners who sell that stuff.
@@infotech4990although I would agree that Jehu might be slightly into what you're describing lately, I believe it's only to a very slight degree, he's got to live out of something. I also believe that we shouldn't bash him over this, since he's done so much for the DIY community, and I don't think there's lots of people who think otherwise. There's also great new info, knowledge and content in all of his videos.
@@infotech4990 Cynical much?