@@bobababy6089 it actually makes me laugh so hard I pee when people say ridiculous stuff like she’s “the best ever” her technique is even worse than Anna cause at least Anna can do a combo without taking a 6 minute lunch break like kamila. Seriously that was almost a FULL turn on the ice. Her technique is the mist atrocious of all the eteri girls ever. Her sp should have never beaten aliona sp score of 85, that’s insulting really.
Two decades ago, NONE of Surya Bonaly's quads were ever accepted because they were under rotated! If I were Surya, I'd sue after seeing this hot mess!!!
that is what yuzu has proposed on his thesis in his university. He has also mentioned how jumps were positioned by coach or choreographer on the blind sight of the technical panel, that way most skater get away with edge call.
@@jazmereflores9749 unfortunately I doubt it. even if somehow Yuzuru's AI would come to life it still would not be a replacement for human judges. for example in tennis hawkeye was introduce like 20 years ago and just at AO 2021 it was in a "live" form- which means there was no line judges and no challenges, because hawkeye was controlling the match in live time. now, look at the financial differences between tennis and figure skating: Naomi Osaka literally became the highest paid female athlete of all time(with $57 mln in a year) while figure skaters get $50k for winning world championships. there is just not enough money in the whole body of figure skating to fuel such a technological revolution, not to mention the most influential federation-R*ssia is benefiting from basically corruption and AI system would nerf their athletes. but even if somehow we throw R*ssia away because of what they're doing and let's say Japan pushes that prototype technology- we may not see it applied to actual competitions in our lifetime.
ISU definitely needs to upgrade their rules! They need to be able to look at slow motion from multiple angles to judge jump takeoffs and landings. I think it would help in all areas of ice skating and maybe we can take some judgement aspect out of it. I don't want to see cheated jumps, I want clean jumps even if they are less difficult be rewarded and cheated jumps to be penalized. I also want more skating and less focus on jumping
Agreed! Reward good technique and good skating. Some skaters longer Rika or Liza have a textbook Lutz, but get marked lower than the Eteri students. Kaori she be marked higher than the Eteri students based on her skating skills
I hate when people say they’d rather see a clean triple instead of a bad quad, as if the female skaters that are not Russian actually land cleaner jumps. When the Russians didn’t participate sure they all did doubles and barely any triples, but guess what, they were literally all wobbling and falling. Forget technique, they couldn’t even make it look aesthetically pleasing they were struggling so much. In that case I’d rather see a pretty quad then a slippery double axel even if the technique is off. Another thing, you guys act as if the skaters make mistakes on purpose. Obviously they are aiming to execute it with the best technique possible and a lot of times kamila has great technique and other times she doesn’t. It’s human and unintentional. Just how other athletes perform better sometimes than at other times. Lebron doesn’t score every ball he throws but there’s no one dragging him for his missed shots.
@@Shophiamondar2 I never said anything about nationality of the skater. What I said goes for ALL skaters, from everywhere around the world. So Yes, my opinion still stands-clean jumps over difficult ones, the ISU needs to update the rules and they should be able to look at the slow motion camera's to determine if a jump is clean or not.
That wouldn’t be fair, imagine being able to do triples and being born with this technique just to relearn how to do singles all the way back up, just cause not smart ass decided to say something
@@aniawacht3882 So you're saying its fair to be able to cheat jumps and get a better score vs doing the jump correctly and getting a worse score?? How is learning to do the jumps correctly unfair?? You learn technique. It comes easier to some than to others, BUT they all learn it. And if you learn the proper technique from a young age, it would not put anyone at a disadvantage, but it might save back or other unnecessary injuries. Having the judges be able to view the jumps in slow motion to score actually evens out the playing field in my opinion because it would take some of the guess work out of if it was done cleanly or not. If you did the jump cleanly, great, you get full credit. If you cheated the jump you knocked down on your score.
Actually it should be like this in other elements, like spins, if you don't do 3 complete turns of certain position, the points of this element are cancelled, even if you do 2.8 turns, they don't give you a percentage, it's just as if you hadn't done it And in the 3Axel, if you don't enter the jump correctly, in a timely manner, the entire element is also invalidated even if you have completed it
She should’ve won but not by massive 20-30 points above the rest like now. Her programs, music, ultra flexibility, etc. are amazing. Eteri pushes all elements like spins, ssq to level 4.
Yeah I feel like even with all the downgrades she still could've been on top she's the only on doing both 3As and quads. But as Belinda Noonan said, she doesn't have the best speed and her ice coverage is not the best. Plus she doesn't have the deepest edge on stsq or a great acceleration and deceleration. So her pcs should als not have been able to beat Wakaba or Kaori imo
Her programs are garbage. If you would see her do a program made for her by a real choreographer that understands music & plays to her strengths, you would see the injustice done to her by this coaching team. She really doesn’t have natural musicality or performance ability but that can come with age & experience as she is only 15. Right now she mostly keeps a neutral face & robotically goes through the choreography she is given, which is perfectly normal for her age. Right now, her only really fantastic thing at this point are her spins. Those are perfection.
@@amethyst5512 she is young of course I know what you mean but she dances with her whole body and uses arm leg and hand extensions like no other as well besides incredible spins. Watch her dance routines off-ice. You can see she's better than even the other Russians
@@amethyst5512 say it what you want about her program, but Eteri pushes all elements to the highest level. My fave is actually Gubanova. But her program could’ve been improved to level 4. I’m sure she would’ve been able to skate it and get higher score instead
She managed to prerotate over 200° degrees (probably 230°) Prerotation and Russian skaters isnt new, but this??? I knew the situation was bad but this is the most cheated jump i have ever seen
It really isn’t that bad, she flicks her toe at the end. Unlike Anna, you full blades and swings it around unastheticly. I wish I had her technique cause I least I would have quads 🤷♀️
Kamila despite her technique manages to get a hold of positive GOE. But her technique is obviously not the reason why. She creates images, rippon air position, landing extensions, full rotations, and these aspects have nothing to do with technique. Not to mention that overall performance also plays a part. At this point the ISU does not care about technique at all and figure skating fans like you fail to accept this.
Her flip and lutz are atrocious but let’s be honest. Even if she swaps her flip and lutz with loops and salchows in the short and long she’d lose only about 5 points and still win by massive margins if she skates clean.
@@Jeremy-wp4yh she can do 3Lo, 3A, 3S+3T in the shortand not violate Zayak rule and lose just 2 points. She can do 4S, 4T + 3T, 4T +eu+3S, 3A, 3A+2T, 3Lo and 2A in her long and lose just 3 points. Point is she’s winning by 20 points or more she doesn’t need the complete arsenal of jumps to win.
@@jamesyu5212 she can't do any toe jumps either. So 3T or 4T shouldn't be there. She drops the blade after picking and rotates with the pick on the ice.
@@Jeremy-wp4yh that’s nitpicking to the extreme and you know it. Her pre-rotation is not as severe as medvedeva. Her quad toes and sal are more “legitimate” than any quad Sasha or Anna can muster.
@@jamesyu5212 Kamilla has the worst pre-rotation in the eteri camp. She does 1.5 rotations on the toe pick itself. Anna scherbakova uses the blade. She has a flutz and floop. The only person with less pre-rotation is trusova. Unfortauntely her time spent with eteri caused her to drop her blade as well.
probably not. I remember reading that Kamila said that if she didn't do her quads with the technique she uses, extreme pre-rotation and rippon arms, she would surely fall and not make it.
It‘s simple: if this is scored high, the other skaters should do it as well. But they cannot. They main question is, whether a dirty quad is more valuable than a clean triple. To say it‘s just worthless is also a bit strange.
Rigged judging quiz: How do you get maximum GOE for a quad lutz? Answer: A. do a 3/4 prerotation before takeoff B. use full blade instead of a toe pick C. Change to an inside edge before takeoff turning the jump into a Woopz jump. D. All of the above (correct answer: All of the above)
What even is that jump?? I know it supposed to be a flip but the entry is curved and the whole blade hits the ice. . . Love Kami but her coaches can go to hell
Pre rotations is not punish by ISU ... They doing a triple Lutz and get the points for a quad Lutz 11.50 instead of ( 5.90 ) + the GOE The skater won't change anything if they are not punished for that , even if it is a bad technique . The judging system most change..
ISU needs to enforce their rules or change them. Eteri needs to (be banned) stop teaching her girls prerotations before they permanently destroy their backs
Quick notice, this is not Beijing 2022 because the boards are not blue and there are ads which aren't allowed at the Olympics. This is prob rostelecon cup or some other competition.
@@anuniemoose2209 but let's be honest, Japanese top girls and Americans also hardly ever judjed by excessive prerotation. Also if we look in the men competition we'll see how many other countries athletes are judged the same way. High marks for not a high quality jump
Она занималась балетом и художественной гимнастикой, отлично тянет носок во вращениях, на выездах и спиралях, но почему на зубцовых прыжках отталкивается ребром? 😂 "Самая талантливая" фигуристка в истории 😂 Весь ее талант - феноменальная гибкость и растяжка
"Nobody gets judged for prerotation. There is no slow motion replay of takeoff when reviewing jumps in competition. Fans make a very big deal out of it because they live on the internet and can replay every jump at the slowest speeds and look at every angle, but the reality is that 1) no one looks at this in judging and 2) it's not the only thing that makes a jump. A looped three-second clip is not a whole story. This is not to say that there aren't flaws in her jumps, that she isn't overscored, or that all degrees of on-ice rotation are good technique, but "her jumps shouldn't even be fully counted" is a leap in logic when you're considering how the judging system works. There are many skaters who severely prerotate some jumps that should not have such a degree of on-ice rotation, it's not just her (and not just in the women's field)."
Kamila is a lovely skater but this doping scandal has absolutely tarnished her name and career. This whole case could take years in court, which she's not allowed to compete until its all over. I was surprised yet not surprised when I found out it was Kamila who tested positive. She grew and hit puberty way before the other skaters, plus had the huge leap in jumps and skills during just one off season. It was bizarre, she was barely landing triples then all the sudden had quads and a triple axel, which neither sasha or Anna have ever landed cleanly in competition. She maybe could've gotten passed it if she had the history of Sasha and Anna but she doesn't. She doesn't have the historical records that Sasha has and is continuing to make, or the absolutely massive fan base. She doesn't have a worlds titles or multiple Russian national titles like Anna.
exactly, she was like the prawn made by the rusfed, for their forsaken reason. Probably to turn media eyes on her, sooner or later she becomes disposable too just like Eteri girls.
Except she was allowed to compete with a positive doping result, and she likely would have been allowed to compete at Worlds had they not been banned because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine. The case could take years and she was still allowed to compete at the Olympics despite the positive test. Not okay.
@@jazmereflores9749 I’ve been researching some and apparently many countries have “pawns” so to speak for doping. They will have protected persons and non protected persons. So if a not protected tested positive they wouldn’t try to hide it but if a protected person did they would hide it. Rusada just got a new director general right before Russian nationals. Kamila was tested at all competitions except for rostelecom cup which was right before rusnats.
You clearly don’t watch skating at all, Kamila has been doing quads for the last 3 years. She did two quad toes at junior worlds two years ago. She also didn’t choose obviously to take the medication‘s that she’s been forced to take. Also none of the medication she’s taking suddenly make her superman or change her technique. Quads are a skill. And she didn’t suddenly develop them. I’m so sick of ignorant people commenting on this
@@usaskjock I obviously do watch skating, have for years since Anna and Sasha were juniors. Kamila was barely doing triples one season then came back the next doing quads. None of the things will make her jumps quads but they will certainly help her learn them. She can stay in the rink longer to practice them, increase her stamina so she can do more in practice and during competition. It’s not the point of them making her do quads, it’s how she achieved them. And she learnt them by getting help. Skating is not about using steroids, that won’t help, you need to be skinny. Skaters use medications that help your heart pump more blood and oxygen to make you be able to practice longer.
Every Eteri girl has the same atrocious toe jump technique and not even one of their "quads" is actually a quad since they leave one full rotation on the ice before taking off with their full blade, but these horrible jumps are not called
yes, of course. the whole world sees the cheating, just not the unskilled and well payed judges from all the different competitions and countries. its sooo obviously, isn't it...
"Not even one of their 'qauds' is actually a quad since they leave one full rotation on the ice before taking off" - Valieva's quad salchows and toe loops are legit. Up to 180 degrees prerotation is natural and normal for those jumps, and that's what she does. Saying she leaves a full rotation on the ice is farcical.
@@amethyst5512 there's nowhere in the rule book that talks about the degree of prerotation. She does not have a forward takeoff, and her quads are at most 180 degrees prerotated, which is fine technique for the types of quads she does. Examples of good quads and prerotation for each jump: ua-cam.com/video/5EIRcc_u8kE/v-deo.html A former competitive figure skater reviews her quads at around 14:30 in this vid, says that her quads have "perfect technique, nothing to ding her for technically": ua-cam.com/video/ngiibXj_6BE/v-deo.html "her jumps suck. they just do" - amazing comment. She gets insane height on her quads, her 3As are the best (height, distance, extension, speed, transitions in and out). She's the only female skater at the senior level to have landed 3 quads and 3A in the same FS.
if you listen to commentators, they all say sasha has some really hard transitions this season. her skating skills? could be much better. but she's improving each season. Anna is getting worse with each season, which is the typical eteri expiration date hitting her.
Serious question, because I have no idea. I know next to zero about figure skating. But if her technique is so poor on these, why do the judges seem to consistently grade her so high? Again I am asking seriously because because I genuinely don't know. I just always figured/assumed that these judges would be experts in seeing things like this. But then again I understand that judges in judge based sports/competitions can be notoriously inept. Or corrupt. Or both.
Nick please don’t take the comments on these UA-cam videos as the sole arbiter of fact in figure skating. The fact is most of the people commenting here have little to no idea what they are talking about. The pre-rotation seen in the video here is severe and indeed the technique on her flip jump is awful - The jump should be initiated from the toe pic rather than the full blade. However this problem is not present on the jump she actually does quads on which is a total loop and the salchow
Eteri students tends to be over scored. Dont get me wrong they are good and probably would’ve taken the podium anyways but they are over scored and it makes a difference between the russians. Its probably corruption. Ive seen it happened first hand. And olympics 2014 was an OBVIOUS one too
Because Eteri creates beautiful complete programs for her girls, their ultra flexibility, music, outfit etc. She maximizes all elements to the highest level, even the jumps with Rippon arms, etc. Thus, imo Eteri girls are amazing, but their quads are way pre-rotated that they are actually triples! However, when you count all the extra points outside the jumps, they still win. Maybe by 5 points max, not the inflated 20-30 points based on their pre-rotated quads
Kamila is a very beautiful skater artistically, but come on... this is embarrassingly horrible technique. When is the ISU going doc points for such excessive prerotation?🙄 This is seriously annoying as these quad queen girls are getting so much attention cheating jumps while everyone else is left in their shadows.
This is so awful! She almost does a full rotation ON the dang ice before even getting in the air!!! WTF!!! As a 14 yr elite competitive figure skater, this literally makes me SICK🤢🤮 THANK YOU FOR HIGHLIGHTING THIS, THERE IS ANOTHER THREAD OF A QUICK VIDEO OF HER AND PEOPLE ARE DROOLING ALL OVER THEMSELVES SAYING SHE IS THE BEST SKATER EVER AND BLAH BLAH BLAH…THE PROBLEM IS…THEY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT REALLY SOLID SKATING LOOKS LIKE! Please bring back PATCH!!! ♾ we’d have more technically solid and all around better quality skaters if they reinstated patch for testing levels again!!!!
I agree with that she has pre rotation problems, but I swear there is no full blade, just a low pick. Same with many other skaters. If you look at different angles you can see that they still use the toe pick.
@@callieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Her pick (jagged in the very front of shoes) never touch the ice... If you watch textbook skaters, you will know exactly what is "toe pick"
"isnt perfect" bro that prerotation is outrageous, and i wouldn't mind if the judges scored accordingly but they reward this absolut unffair of a thing
Her jumps are atrocious. Every combo should be negative GOE with that lurch she does in between. And it’s a shame because they would look so much more impressive if done with good technique.
@@karupe9982 I agree, I think her jumps need to be scored correctly for the issues she has. But as someone who isn't a figure skating technical judge, I still enjoy her performances because of her expressive, balletic skating style and her flexibility and speed in her spins.
@@amethyst5512 I agree, and I honestly think Kamila is one of those skaters who would have been stronger at turns and artistry, but unfortunately now if you want to podium or even be considered for competitions in Russia it's basically "quads or nothing." If she hadn't been so rushed and pushed to do such difficult jumps consistently, and had more time to learn a better technique, her skating probably would be much better, but I still enjoy many aspects of her skating.
@@toxic-low-key-ghost7934 her flexibility is amazing and she should be rewarded for that, as part of the artistry too. Girls from other countries can’t or won’t train to do it, it’s their choice. But give her the credits, where the credit’s due. I’m a fan of Hanyu, Uno, Chen etc too, but it doesn’t mean that Valieva isn’t a good skater
@@Yasmin-su4ff really? couldn't find anything about pre-rotation, but i think PRs lead to switching blade's side and that is a mistake, so i guess doing PRs means having a bad technic
It is in the rules in that a true toe-pick jump cannot possibly result in that much prerotation. So the basics of the jump are wrong in Kamila's case and that should always lead to a deduction of points. Toe-pick jumps require toe PICK on the FRONT only of the skate to PROPEL the skater in the air, and not full blade nor twisting of the blade on the ice before jumping up as that would result in an edge jump like loop or salchow.
Kamila&Anna have terrible jumping technique. There're no quads at all, no F, no Lz, no S, no T - all of them Anna&Kami makes like mixed type jumps with wrong blades/pins (Floops, Flutzoops, Saloops, Tulhofs)!!! But they are rated higher than Trusova, who has an almost perfect jumping technique!!! How it's possible?! Judging system discredits itself AT ALL !!! У Камилы и Анны чудовищная техника прыжков. У них фактически нет Квадов, нет Флипов, Луцей, Сальховов и Тулупов. Все прыжки у них идут в смешанной технике и с неправильными зубцами/рёбрами (Флупы, Флуцупы, Салупы, Тулховы)!!! Но, при этом, их оценивают выше Трусовой, у которой практически идеальная техника прыжков!!! Как такое возможно вообще? Судейская система ПОЛНОСТЬЮ дискредитировала себя!!!
II think prerotation is a very common thing these days. almost every skater spins almost 180 degrees on the ice, not only Russians. (there are exceptions, but they are in the minority) but this is not good. Prerotation in quads can be forgiven, because quads for women are still new, only Russians jump more or less, so the technique has not yet been perfected for women by other coaches. but it's awful to see skaters outperform triple jumps by almost 3/4. This is a fraud. Judges should not encourage this technique because it is dangerous to the back, dangerous to health and unfair to other figures with correct technique. Because of the giant goе, they don't even think to fix it
It’s a bit easy to always blame the same persons, just because Russians are the only ones to attend quads (this was short program btw so it was a triple flip, so nothing to do with quads in particular). It’s just a bad technique, and she isn’t at fault on all her jumps. But a lot of athletes out there have a bad technique, and they’re not Russians, but since they don’t attract the media’s attention no one blame them. Come on kids, Russians are not the only skaters in the world. Take a look at other skaters mistakes too.
full blade, prerotation, highest record score. RIP judges
And this is suppose to be the best female figure skater ever 🤡
😂 ikr
@@bobababy6089 it actually makes me laugh so hard I pee when people say ridiculous stuff like she’s “the best ever” her technique is even worse than Anna cause at least Anna can do a combo without taking a 6 minute lunch break like kamila. Seriously that was almost a FULL turn on the ice. Her technique is the mist atrocious of all the eteri girls ever. Her sp should have never beaten aliona sp score of 85, that’s insulting really.
Full bitterness, tears of envy, RIP all other international skaters
Pre rotation is legal, but Doing it on toe jumps like that is definitely a lot harder to do so.
Tell the ISU we need IE and replays to judge pre-rotation, edges, and landings. Most quads are cheated and we as fans are being cheated.
@JET MECH yes, it’s called as cheated take-off
Two decades ago, NONE of Surya Bonaly's quads were ever accepted because they were under rotated! If I were Surya, I'd sue after seeing this hot mess!!!
@@fredrika27 what do you think about Mao’s 3A which were also downgraded to 2A?
@@smurfiennes well Mao isnt russian, is she?
And this is suppose to be the best female figure skater ever 🤡 I dont feel sorry for these athletes tbh.
Should've been a downgrade for >1/2 turn prerotation and a -2 GOE for poor take-off according to the current ruleset.
Cosmos that’s not how it works. 3f
@@emishala11 and it’s terrible
@@cosmos9688 IIRC the solo jump can be a double or a triple but not a quad.
@@ppnexus2000 No, the solo jump has to be a triple (it can be a quad factor the men).
@@ChristineTheHippie Regardless a 3F
Coach of the year ladies and gentlemen
Well i don’t see koari having the best jumps, spins , or skating now do I?
@@aniawacht3882d you don’t see the Eteri girls having a healthy weight or a career after their seventeenth birthday now do you?
She almost made 1 full rotation while still on the ice before the jump and then it became a triple loop O.O
I think theh should develop a AI who will grade all jumps to avoid bias.
that is what yuzu has proposed on his thesis in his university. He has also mentioned how jumps were positioned by coach or choreographer on the blind sight of the technical panel, that way most skater get away with edge call.
ISU has no money for that
@@hannibaljustincase9985 weren't the money they were getting from years of corruption, still not enough 😭
@@jazmereflores9749 yuzu the king
@@jazmereflores9749 unfortunately I doubt it. even if somehow Yuzuru's AI would come to life it still would not be a replacement for human judges. for example in tennis hawkeye was introduce like 20 years ago and just at AO 2021 it was in a "live" form- which means there was no line judges and no challenges, because hawkeye was controlling the match in live time. now, look at the financial differences between tennis and figure skating: Naomi Osaka literally became the highest paid female athlete of all time(with $57 mln in a year) while figure skaters get $50k for winning world championships. there is just not enough money in the whole body of figure skating to fuel such a technological revolution, not to mention the most influential federation-R*ssia is benefiting from basically corruption and AI system would nerf their athletes. but even if somehow we throw R*ssia away because of what they're doing and let's say Japan pushes that prototype technology- we may not see it applied to actual competitions in our lifetime.
I miss Yuna's jumps😔😔😔
And her era
I miss all things Yuna-Mao-Caro 😭
Totally miss Yuna 😔
If this girl has +4 GOE
Yuna jump should be +10 GOE
Yuna, Mao and Caro are the golden standard. Ladies singles ended with them
ISU definitely needs to upgrade their rules! They need to be able to look at slow motion from multiple angles to judge jump takeoffs and landings. I think it would help in all areas of ice skating and maybe we can take some judgement aspect out of it. I don't want to see cheated jumps, I want clean jumps even if they are less difficult be rewarded and cheated jumps to be penalized. I also want more skating and less focus on jumping
Agreed! Reward good technique and good skating. Some skaters longer Rika or Liza have a textbook Lutz, but get marked lower than the Eteri students. Kaori she be marked higher than the Eteri students based on her skating skills
I hate when people say they’d rather see a clean triple instead of a bad quad, as if the female skaters that are not Russian actually land cleaner jumps. When the Russians didn’t participate sure they all did doubles and barely any triples, but guess what, they were literally all wobbling and falling. Forget technique, they couldn’t even make it look aesthetically pleasing they were struggling so much. In that case I’d rather see a pretty quad then a slippery double axel even if the technique is off. Another thing, you guys act as if the skaters make mistakes on purpose. Obviously they are aiming to execute it with the best technique possible and a lot of times kamila has great technique and other times she doesn’t. It’s human and unintentional. Just how other athletes perform better sometimes than at other times. Lebron doesn’t score every ball he throws but there’s no one dragging him for his missed shots.
@@Shophiamondar2 I never said anything about nationality of the skater. What I said goes for ALL skaters, from everywhere around the world. So Yes, my opinion still stands-clean jumps over difficult ones, the ISU needs to update the rules and they should be able to look at the slow motion camera's to determine if a jump is clean or not.
That wouldn’t be fair, imagine being able to do triples and being born with this technique just to relearn how to do singles all the way back up, just cause not smart ass decided to say something
@@aniawacht3882 So you're saying its fair to be able to cheat jumps and get a better score vs doing the jump correctly and getting a worse score?? How is learning to do the jumps correctly unfair?? You learn technique. It comes easier to some than to others, BUT they all learn it. And if you learn the proper technique from a young age, it would not put anyone at a disadvantage, but it might save back or other unnecessary injuries. Having the judges be able to view the jumps in slow motion to score actually evens out the playing field in my opinion because it would take some of the guess work out of if it was done cleanly or not. If you did the jump cleanly, great, you get full credit. If you cheated the jump you knocked down on your score.
So a prerotated quad flip turns into a tripple loop, right?
😂 yes, you can see it cleverly that way
😂
Actually it should be like this in other elements, like spins, if you don't do 3 complete turns of certain position, the points of this element are cancelled, even if you do 2.8 turns, they don't give you a percentage, it's just as if you hadn't done it
And in the 3Axel, if you don't enter the jump correctly, in a timely manner, the entire element is also invalidated even if you have completed it
Not as far as the points and GOE were concerned!
If I'm correct it's her SP dress. So it supposed to be a "triple" jump 😂
Yuna's jump: textbook jump
And people are mesmerized by this girl. Slow motion only evidences what we all know. Lack of this and that.
Russians are allowed to pre-rotate and still get maximum GOE.
She should’ve won but not by massive 20-30 points above the rest like now. Her programs, music, ultra flexibility, etc. are amazing. Eteri pushes all elements like spins, ssq to level 4.
Yeah I feel like even with all the downgrades she still could've been on top she's the only on doing both 3As and quads. But as Belinda Noonan said, she doesn't have the best speed and her ice coverage is not the best. Plus she doesn't have the deepest edge on stsq or a great acceleration and deceleration. So her pcs should als not have been able to beat Wakaba or Kaori imo
Her programs are garbage. If you would see her do a program made for her by a real choreographer that understands music & plays to her strengths, you would see the injustice done to her by this coaching team. She really doesn’t have natural musicality or performance ability but that can come with age & experience as she is only 15. Right now she mostly keeps a neutral face & robotically goes through the choreography she is given, which is perfectly normal for her age. Right now, her only really fantastic thing at this point are her spins. Those are perfection.
We wait till she advances to age 18, hopefully she is not like the rest. Upon 18, most quads got problem.
@@amethyst5512 she is young of course I know what you mean but she dances with her whole body and uses arm leg and hand extensions like no other as well besides incredible spins. Watch her dance routines off-ice. You can see she's better than even the other Russians
@@amethyst5512 say it what you want about her program, but Eteri pushes all elements to the highest level. My fave is actually Gubanova. But her program could’ve been improved to level 4. I’m sure she would’ve been able to skate it and get higher score instead
Akatyeva does it too, along with many Eteri girls. Its the judges fault.
why she did one whole rotation on ice 💀
so this was basically a double flip
Her lutzes and flips have been so her whole career.
It's actually a double loop if it goes off the full blade and not the toe pick.
loop*
Which is better then you’ll ever do 😊
Yes, it's quite obvious.
She managed to prerotate over 200° degrees (probably 230°)
Prerotation and Russian skaters isnt new, but this??? I knew the situation was bad but this is the most cheated jump i have ever seen
It really isn’t that bad, she flicks her toe at the end. Unlike Anna, you full blades and swings it around unastheticly. I wish I had her technique cause I least I would have quads 🤷♀️
Kamila despite her technique manages to get a hold of positive GOE. But her technique is obviously not the reason why. She creates images, rippon air position, landing extensions, full rotations, and these aspects have nothing to do with technique. Not to mention that overall performance also plays a part. At this point the ISU does not care about technique at all and figure skating fans like you fail to accept this.
Her flip and lutz are atrocious but let’s be honest. Even if she swaps her flip and lutz with loops and salchows in the short and long she’d lose only about 5 points and still win by massive margins if she skates clean.
no she wouldnt win. you cannot repeat a jump more than twice. also you need a jump in combination. so without the variety she wouldnt even make podium
@@Jeremy-wp4yh she can do 3Lo, 3A, 3S+3T in the shortand not violate Zayak rule and lose just 2 points.
She can do 4S, 4T + 3T, 4T +eu+3S, 3A, 3A+2T, 3Lo and 2A in her long and lose just 3 points.
Point is she’s winning by 20 points or more she doesn’t need the complete arsenal of jumps to win.
@@jamesyu5212 she can't do any toe jumps either. So 3T or 4T shouldn't be there. She drops the blade after picking and rotates with the pick on the ice.
@@Jeremy-wp4yh that’s nitpicking to the extreme and you know it. Her pre-rotation is not as severe as medvedeva. Her quad toes and sal are more “legitimate” than any quad Sasha or Anna can muster.
@@jamesyu5212 Kamilla has the worst pre-rotation in the eteri camp. She does 1.5 rotations on the toe pick itself. Anna scherbakova uses the blade. She has a flutz and floop. The only person with less pre-rotation is trusova. Unfortauntely her time spent with eteri caused her to drop her blade as well.
It's literally flipaxel with 2.5 rotations
If someone taught Eteri's skaters correct technique, would they even be able to jump quads?
Valieva's quads are legit; this is not a quad attempt.
@@armoda1057 her edge jump quads (sachow, loop) are more valid, but her quad toe loop is not, far too much rotation on the blade
@@ad.hockery4663 her quad toe loop is fine in terms of prerotation, it doesn't exceed 180 degrees.
probably not. I remember reading that Kamila said that if she didn't do her quads with the technique she uses, extreme pre-rotation and rippon arms, she would surely fall and not make it.
No they wouldnt. Theres a reason why powerful skaters like Surya Bonaly cannot even do quad jumps consistently.
Her weakness are the jumps with right leg takeoff aka Flip and Lutz, its very noticeable in comparison.
It‘s simple: if this is scored high, the other skaters should do it as well. But they cannot. They main question is, whether a dirty quad is more valuable than a clean triple. To say it‘s just worthless is also a bit strange.
The answer is judge bias
never seen a comment ive agreed with more!
It should be considered a triple.
@@aquawoelfly Maybe it should be considered a new jump?
I honestly think a quad with this much pre-rotation should just be downgraded to a triple and then evaluated as such.
Rigged judging quiz: How do you get maximum GOE for a quad lutz? Answer: A. do a 3/4 prerotation before takeoff B. use full blade instead of a toe pick C. Change to an inside edge before takeoff turning the jump into a Woopz jump. D. All of the above (correct answer: All of the above)
You forgot raise the free leg over the head on landing
@@aliyaamanzholova Damn. E. Kick leg up unnaturally upon landing to make it look like you had elegant landing position.
Wow! Thanks for the slow motion. I had heard they do this but had a hard time seeing it in real time.
That's one of the reasons why Sasha ia my favourite
trusova has pre rot a lot of
sashas flip prerot 1/2 lutz 1/4
This is what we call a text book quad floop
Shameful cheaters. Shameful judges
No surprise there, all Eteri girls have massively prerotated jumps
not Sasha. Sasha's prerotation is usually within the allowed margin
I mean, prerotated jumps are such usual and common thing now in figure skating, not only eteri girls do it.
that was like more than half a turn's worth before she took off HASLDKFJAKLJFDLK;SJAFHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
It’s true she had a full rotation on the ice, it was a running triple toe loop.
Raise age limit and more importantly create checks and balances and real punishments for judges with incorrect calls.
Real punishment should be prison sentences
2014 sochi judges should still be behind bars
What even is that jump?? I know it supposed to be a flip but the entry is curved and the whole blade hits the ice. . . Love Kami but her coaches can go to hell
It’s a double loop… just atrocious
It’s the jump invented at Sambo: the Flootz!
So sad to see how she has been coached incorrectly and exploited. Wish her safety and good health.
Pre rotations is not punish by ISU ...
They doing a triple Lutz and get the points for a quad Lutz 11.50 instead of ( 5.90 ) + the GOE
The skater won't change anything if they are not punished for that , even if it is a bad technique .
The judging system most change..
Jesus...and that's her short program so it's not even a quad.
ISU needs to enforce their rules or change them. Eteri needs to (be banned) stop teaching her girls prerotations before they permanently destroy their backs
you need to be banned
And I don't know why this program surpassed Kostornaia's Departure......
Too much drugs results in maximum prerotation.
Quick notice, this is not Beijing 2022 because the boards are not blue and there are ads which aren't allowed at the Olympics. This is prob rostelecon cup or some other competition.
+10 GOE !!!!
So now the question is: Has any of these so-called Russian quad queens actually landed a fully-rotated quad of any type? Hmmm.
Trusova had 2 clean quads in her FS, out of 5.
Well, in fact yeah
Kamila has fully rotated quad toe. Sahsa has fully rotated quad toe and quad salchow
They do this on their Lutz and Flip 😪 A"legal" way of cheating since it's not in the rulebook.
@@anuniemoose2209 but let's be honest, Japanese top girls and Americans also hardly ever judjed by excessive prerotation. Also if we look in the men competition we'll see how many other countries athletes are judged the same way. High marks for not a high quality jump
@@Vladi0310 Right, but the media keeps saying she "landed five quads".
worst technique i’ve ever seen
Она занималась балетом и художественной гимнастикой, отлично тянет носок во вращениях, на выездах и спиралях, но почему на зубцовых прыжках отталкивается ребром? 😂 "Самая талантливая" фигуристка в истории 😂 Весь ее талант - феноменальная гибкость и растяжка
"Nobody gets judged for prerotation. There is no slow motion replay of takeoff when reviewing jumps in competition. Fans make a very big deal out of it because they live on the internet and can replay every jump at the slowest speeds and look at every angle, but the reality is that 1) no one looks at this in judging and 2) it's not the only thing that makes a jump. A looped three-second clip is not a whole story.
This is not to say that there aren't flaws in her jumps, that she isn't overscored, or that all degrees of on-ice rotation are good technique, but "her jumps shouldn't even be fully counted" is a leap in logic when you're considering how the judging system works. There are many skaters who severely prerotate some jumps that should not have such a degree of on-ice rotation, it's not just her (and not just in the women's field)."
Yeah even doping can’t stop tgat
Michelle kwan.....Please come back.
She did a complete turn on the ice before she even took off
Kamila is a lovely skater but this doping scandal has absolutely tarnished her name and career. This whole case could take years in court, which she's not allowed to compete until its all over. I was surprised yet not surprised when I found out it was Kamila who tested positive. She grew and hit puberty way before the other skaters, plus had the huge leap in jumps and skills during just one off season. It was bizarre, she was barely landing triples then all the sudden had quads and a triple axel, which neither sasha or Anna have ever landed cleanly in competition.
She maybe could've gotten passed it if she had the history of Sasha and Anna but she doesn't. She doesn't have the historical records that Sasha has and is continuing to make, or the absolutely massive fan base. She doesn't have a worlds titles or multiple Russian national titles like Anna.
exactly, she was like the prawn made by the rusfed, for their forsaken reason. Probably to turn media eyes on her, sooner or later she becomes disposable too just like Eteri girls.
Except she was allowed to compete with a positive doping result, and she likely would have been allowed to compete at Worlds had they not been banned because of Russia's invasion of Ukraine. The case could take years and she was still allowed to compete at the Olympics despite the positive test. Not okay.
@@jazmereflores9749 I’ve been researching some and apparently many countries have “pawns” so to speak for doping. They will have protected persons and non protected persons. So if a not protected tested positive they wouldn’t try to hide it but if a protected person did they would hide it. Rusada just got a new director general right before Russian nationals. Kamila was tested at all competitions except for rostelecom cup which was right before rusnats.
You clearly don’t watch skating at all, Kamila has been doing quads for the last 3 years. She did two quad toes at junior worlds two years ago. She also didn’t choose obviously to take the medication‘s that she’s been forced to take. Also none of the medication she’s taking suddenly make her superman or change her technique. Quads are a skill. And she didn’t suddenly develop them. I’m so sick of ignorant people commenting on this
@@usaskjock I obviously do watch skating, have for years since Anna and Sasha were juniors. Kamila was barely doing triples one season then came back the next doing quads.
None of the things will make her jumps quads but they will certainly help her learn them. She can stay in the rink longer to practice them, increase her stamina so she can do more in practice and during competition. It’s not the point of them making her do quads, it’s how she achieved them. And she learnt them by getting help. Skating is not about using steroids, that won’t help, you need to be skinny. Skaters use medications that help your heart pump more blood and oxygen to make you be able to practice longer.
I just can't stop watching this!
this is 3V (triple valieva)
Fake Quad Jumper
Amazing 18 upvotes. It wasn't a quad attempt - she wears the purple dress for the short program, and quads aren't permitted in SP.
you can't even reach your butt for wiping off, so what.
Her quads are pretty and unlike her triple lutz/flip.
Basically a DOUBLE LOOP. Yike
PLS ISU KAMILA NEVER GET CALLED BY THAT
THIS WAS MORE WORSE THAN ANNA’S TECHNIQUE SHE SHOULD RECEIVE THAT HIGH MARK 💀
Every Eteri girl has the same atrocious toe jump technique and not even one of their "quads" is actually a quad since they leave one full rotation on the ice before taking off with their full blade, but these horrible jumps are not called
yes, of course. the whole world sees the cheating, just not the unskilled and well payed judges from all the different competitions and countries. its sooo obviously, isn't it...
"Not even one of their 'qauds' is actually a quad since they leave one full rotation on the ice before taking off" - Valieva's quad salchows and toe loops are legit. Up to 180 degrees prerotation is natural and normal for those jumps, and that's what she does. Saying she leaves a full rotation on the ice is farcical.
@@armoda1057 that’s just not true. I don’t know who told you this ridiculous 180 BS you keep spouting, but her jumps suck. They just do.
@@amethyst5512 there's nowhere in the rule book that talks about the degree of prerotation. She does not have a forward takeoff, and her quads are at most 180 degrees prerotated, which is fine technique for the types of quads she does. Examples of good quads and prerotation for each jump: ua-cam.com/video/5EIRcc_u8kE/v-deo.html
A former competitive figure skater reviews her quads at around 14:30 in this vid, says that her quads have "perfect technique, nothing to ding her for technically": ua-cam.com/video/ngiibXj_6BE/v-deo.html
"her jumps suck. they just do" - amazing comment. She gets insane height on her quads, her 3As are the best (height, distance, extension, speed, transitions in and out). She's the only female skater at the senior level to have landed 3 quads and 3A in the same FS.
if you listen to commentators, they all say sasha has some really hard transitions this season. her skating skills? could be much better. but she's improving each season. Anna is getting worse with each season, which is the typical eteri expiration date hitting her.
she's given so many heart medications, steriods, puberty blocker/ early menopause and still cant perfect the jump?
Actually I think it supposed to be a lutz, but the edge….
So she does alot of doubles.
Also, that's not a jump it's a spin.
You can’t even jump off the ice and your judging her triples? I swear it’s always the shit cans who judge the best of the best
that’s a jump
@@Yanik2002 what would you call this jump?
@@Jeremy-wp4yh a 3 flip, jealous that you’re stuck on singles?
@@aniawacht3882 a flip with no toe?
Anna's too... our olympics champ.
She has much more better jumps compared to Valieva
Phantastic Kamila 🌹
first of all, it's not from Beijing 2022... ;//
Serious question, because I have no idea. I know next to zero about figure skating.
But if her technique is so poor on these, why do the judges seem to consistently grade her so high? Again I am asking seriously because because I genuinely don't know.
I just always figured/assumed that these judges would be experts in seeing things like this. But then again I understand that judges in judge based sports/competitions can be notoriously inept. Or corrupt. Or both.
Bias, human tend to do that. That's why I prefer robot as judges
There are two things in fs that judges can inflate: PCS scores and GOE. Judges can do whatever they want to these scores without punishment.
Nick please don’t take the comments on these UA-cam videos as the sole arbiter of fact in figure skating. The fact is most of the people commenting here have little to no idea what they are talking about. The pre-rotation seen in the video here is severe and indeed the technique on her flip jump is awful - The jump should be initiated from the toe pic rather than the full blade. However this problem is not present on the jump she actually does quads on which is a total loop and the salchow
Eteri students tends to be over scored. Dont get me wrong they are good and probably would’ve taken the podium anyways but they are over scored and it makes a difference between the russians. Its probably corruption. Ive seen it happened first hand. And olympics 2014 was an OBVIOUS one too
Because Eteri creates beautiful complete programs for her girls, their ultra flexibility, music, outfit etc. She maximizes all elements to the highest level, even the jumps with Rippon arms, etc. Thus, imo Eteri girls are amazing, but their quads are way pre-rotated that they are actually triples! However, when you count all the extra points outside the jumps, they still win. Maybe by 5 points max, not the inflated 20-30 points based on their pre-rotated quads
Also, like Morisi, it's a loop
Kamila is a very beautiful skater artistically, but come on... this is embarrassingly horrible technique. When is the ISU going doc points for such excessive prerotation?🙄 This is seriously annoying as these quad queen girls are getting so much attention cheating jumps while everyone else is left in their shadows.
She might just rotate 4 times on ice and call it a jump as well. 😡
RIP ISU!
Figure Skatings future is gonna be full of Russian cheated jumps and questionable GOE…
This is obviously not from the Beijing 2022 Olympics. The boards are a different color. Which event is this and why did you say it's Beijing?
Мен ұялатын едім мынадай техникамен 90, 180 ұпай алуға 😊
This is so awful! She almost does a full rotation ON the dang ice before even getting in the air!!! WTF!!! As a 14 yr elite competitive figure skater, this literally makes me SICK🤢🤮 THANK YOU FOR HIGHLIGHTING THIS, THERE IS ANOTHER THREAD OF A QUICK VIDEO OF HER AND PEOPLE ARE DROOLING ALL OVER THEMSELVES SAYING SHE IS THE BEST SKATER EVER AND BLAH BLAH BLAH…THE PROBLEM IS…THEY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT REALLY SOLID SKATING LOOKS LIKE!
Please bring back PATCH!!! ♾ we’d have more technically solid and all around better quality skaters if they reinstated patch for testing levels again!!!!
これオリンピックじゃなく、ロステレコム杯の映像ですよね？
それにしてもびっくり！
i agree that her jump technique is horrible but this clip is not from Beijing, this is from Russian Nationals 2021
You can't change your techniqe overnight tho. She pre rotates just as worse at Beijing.
God that technique makes me sick
I wonder why it looks effortless....
Cheater
This is a joke. Scores mean nothing. We can just go back to "whatever... 4.6!"
Lol, almost a full rotation. The day this cheating is punished will the day I watch figure skating again.
No wonder she got the WRs...
She got deductions for that. Anyway she improved it
Too much rotation Her jump always seems like double jump
I agree with that she has pre rotation problems, but I swear there is no full blade, just a low pick. Same with many other skaters. If you look at different angles you can see that they still use the toe pick.
Half-blade, not toe pick
@@yachuchuang3651 no, the weight is on the toe pick.
@@callieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Her pick (jagged in the very front of shoes) never touch the ice... If you watch textbook skaters, you will know exactly what is "toe pick"
@@callieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
ua-cam.com/video/cpNIxHKoKrA/v-deo.html
1:29 How Nika did "toe pick" for her triple Lutz is it supposed to be like.
@@callieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
ua-cam.com/video/oAt1egywlys/v-deo.html
Here you can see clearer!!!
This is not at beijing …
Like they change technique per competition? 😂
Lol...that's still her at 2021 season same routine she brought to Beijing
These are her triple jumps?
Well her spins and artistry are beautiful, even if her jump technique isn't perfect.
"isnt perfect" bro that prerotation is outrageous, and i wouldn't mind if the judges scored accordingly but they reward this absolut unffair of a thing
Her jumps are atrocious. Every combo should be negative GOE with that lurch she does in between. And it’s a shame because they would look so much more impressive if done with good technique.
@@karupe9982 I agree, I think her jumps need to be scored correctly for the issues she has. But as someone who isn't a figure skating technical judge, I still enjoy her performances because of her expressive, balletic skating style and her flexibility and speed in her spins.
@@amethyst5512 I agree, and I honestly think Kamila is one of those skaters who would have been stronger at turns and artistry, but unfortunately now if you want to podium or even be considered for competitions in Russia it's basically "quads or nothing." If she hadn't been so rushed and pushed to do such difficult jumps consistently, and had more time to learn a better technique, her skating probably would be much better, but I still enjoy many aspects of her skating.
@@toxic-low-key-ghost7934 her flexibility is amazing and she should be rewarded for that, as part of the artistry too. Girls from other countries can’t or won’t train to do it, it’s their choice. But give her the credits, where the credit’s due. I’m a fan of Hanyu, Uno, Chen etc too, but it doesn’t mean that Valieva isn’t a good skater
Thats loop
Rip ice skating if that shit of a jump is an example
Poor technique - yet the audiences cheer. People are easily fooled as to what constitutes excellence.
Cheater.
Is pre-rotation in the rules?
Yes
@@Yasmin-su4ff really? couldn't find anything about pre-rotation, but i think PRs lead to switching blade's side and that is a mistake, so i guess doing PRs means having a bad technic
@@arina1677 it is called cheated take off.
It is in the rules in that a true toe-pick jump cannot possibly result in that much prerotation. So the basics of the jump are wrong in Kamila's case and that should always lead to a deduction of points. Toe-pick jumps require toe PICK on the FRONT only of the skate to PROPEL the skater in the air, and not full blade nor twisting of the blade on the ice before jumping up as that would result in an edge jump like loop or salchow.
It is not the OG
Kamila&Anna have terrible jumping technique. There're no quads at all, no F, no Lz, no S, no T - all of them Anna&Kami makes like mixed type jumps with wrong blades/pins (Floops, Flutzoops, Saloops, Tulhofs)!!! But they are rated higher than Trusova, who has an almost perfect jumping technique!!! How it's possible?! Judging system discredits itself AT ALL !!!
У Камилы и Анны чудовищная техника прыжков. У них фактически нет Квадов, нет Флипов, Луцей, Сальховов и Тулупов. Все прыжки у них идут в смешанной технике и с неправильными зубцами/рёбрами (Флупы, Флуцупы, Салупы, Тулховы)!!! Но, при этом, их оценивают выше Трусовой, у которой практически идеальная техника прыжков!!! Как такое возможно вообще? Судейская система ПОЛНОСТЬЮ дискредитировала себя!!!
This is not in Beijing
and to think she’s only 15 yrs old
Fakemila Dopalieva
Does that make you feel good to bad mouth a 15 year old girl who has was humiliated, and traumitized in front of the world? Shame on you!
@@Rachel-fp3vdникто не был уничтожен, в шоколаде живёт Камила
Is this supposed to be a lutz? It looks like a loop takeoff, lol.
With although drugs, gurl still can't jump correctly. Lol.
II think prerotation is a very common thing these days. almost every skater spins almost 180 degrees on the ice, not only Russians. (there are exceptions, but they are in the minority) but this is not good. Prerotation in quads can be forgiven, because quads for women are still new, only Russians jump more or less, so the technique has not yet been perfected for women by other coaches. but it's awful to see skaters outperform triple jumps by almost 3/4. This is a fraud. Judges should not encourage this technique because it is dangerous to the back, dangerous to health and unfair to other figures with correct technique. Because of the giant goе, they don't even think to fix it
It’s a bit easy to always blame the same persons, just because Russians are the only ones to attend quads (this was short program btw so it was a triple flip, so nothing to do with quads in particular). It’s just a bad technique, and she isn’t at fault on all her jumps. But a lot of athletes out there have a bad technique, and they’re not Russians, but since they don’t attract the media’s attention no one blame them. Come on kids, Russians are not the only skaters in the world. Take a look at other skaters mistakes too.
That's shocking !