@@JeanPierreWhite Sure, that’s utopia, no one will build enough charging stations to satisfy everyone. As of July 2024, Tesla has over 60,000 charging stalls at 6500 stations. No other company is even close to them. And, look at how few chargers GM, Ford, Stellantis, Toyota, Honda, VW, BMW, MB, etc have install. We need much better home charging especially at HOA’s, condos, apartments, and other MDU’s. 45% of US lives in these locations, but only 1-2% of locations have EV charging.
@@johnpoldo8817 Networks like QA could at least try to build better stations. They aren't really trying. The results reveal the level of commitment they don't have.
@@JeanPierreWhite I influenced a 6-stall 350 kW Electrify America fast charger in my city. Undoubtedly, I will measure reliability and provide manufacturer feedback.
I disagree with Tom's rant on free charging... Here in Canada, my ID.4 came with 1400KwHr or I think 4 years... This is perfect for me as I charge at home when driving locally, but use the free charging when traveling. This way, I get the most bang for my $$$. I do agree that unlimited free charging is a bad idea for the reasons you identified.
Guys, a heat pump is a standard airconditioner, but with a diverter valve, so it can run in reverse. Compressed freon gets hot and makes heat for the vehicle.......It's not that expensive to do. Just has high pressure lines on both sides, of the pump. And a block heater on the compressor. I bet it's 50 bucks more than the air conditioner it already comes with....
4:15 - try not be so hung up on North Jersey Tommy Molo and just move your tests down to RURAL SOUTH JERSEY where there's still lots of Farms that haven't been overtaken by GINORMOUS Warehouse Construction (well not yet anyway) again i suggest RT 55 from RT 42 down to the RT 49 exit for Millville (NJMP). if you have to dodge anything on the road at worse it'll be a herd of Cow, or a Farmer moving a Combine from one field to another... (warning) while there's basically ZERO fast charging down at the Millville end, there is a fairly new/large 8 pump EA station located at the top end, up above RT 42 at the Walmart in Somerdale on the White Horse Pike, however BEFORE you even get to the Walmart, there are no less 3 other smaller EA stations in close vicinity to one another spread along busy RT 42, one at the Deptford Mall (4), the second at the Gloucester Premium Outlets (6), and a third at the Target Sicklerville (4)... can't say i've ever used any of these smaller ones as coming back from the racetrack i usually plan my refueling stop for the big Walmart (8) so i can then make the easy jump back on 295 N and head for home in PA, or stop and visit my daughter in Mt. Laurel.
I did a road trip recently with my Model Y LR AWD to Death Valley, and I really wish I had much more range. Range does matter. Death Valley currently isn't EV friendly. No level 3 charging in the National Park. They need a level 3 charger by Furnace Creek Visitor Center area badly. The park is so big and the sites are spread apart. I had to drive 40-100 miles out of the park to charge, then drive 40-100 miles back in to visit some of the sites. It made the day way longer than it should have. My advice for anyone visiting Death Valley National Park in CA is to use an ICE car until they get a Supercharger in there. There's gas stations inside the park.
I’ve loved the Ariya since I saw it… if it gets NACS, I’m sold. Currently driving a 2013 Murano handed down to me by my mom when my Rogue crapped out after 10 years. The Murano is just about the right size vehicle for my needs and the Ariya is a close comp.
We need all the range tests for the ID Buzz (LWB) asap! Bjørn Nyland tested the short wheel base (1,000km challenge) and it took him only 10 minutes longer to finish compared to the EV9 (with the EV9 tested at lower temperature/worse conditions). But the Buzz was significantly more efficient and this still might hold true for the LWB model.
I also got the email from Ford about recalling my Tesla NACS adapter, it says replacements should be arriving in a few weeks along with instructions to return the defective unit...
HI GUYS, GOOD SHOW!! ON THE ID BUZZ PRODUCTION HALT, TOM, I THINK SAID IT WAS SURPRISING THAT VW WAS TAKING SO LONG TO FIX THE DOOR HANDLES, WELL, REMEMBER HOW LONG IT TOOK TOYOTA TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO KEEP THE WHEELS FROM FALLING OFF THE BZ4XXX THINGIE??
Enel-X update: their assets will be auctioned off on Oct 29th to the highest bidder(s) so whomever wins can migrate installed base of chargers to their server. The bad news is winner could be a single vendor creating a monopoly with absurd annual fees and/or skimming profit from CPO. Enel had very attractive pricing for resellers and it’s gone now. The ideal scenario is a hardware vendor acquiring assets so charger profits subsidize software development.
I think Tom and Kyle should get together and work out a spec for a "quick" range test. It's still important to do a full one to make sure the manufacture isn't doing anything under the table and it's impossible to cheat on a 100% to 0% test. Start out at 50% and test efficiency by running down to 10%. Then drain it to 0% and charge to 100% in about an hour to establish usable battery size. You could een try just establishing efficiency over any 10% range from 70% to 30% to shorten it even more? This would allow testing many more wheel, trim and model year combinations; which is very much needed.
I was so interested in this vehicle from the minute. They started teasing it. But the low range combined with mediocre charging speeds has killed any desire to own one for me.
Oh! i'd been waiting for a B class update! I sat in a used one at my local used EV shop but didnt pull the trigger fast enough. I dont usually drive luxury brands and the interior of that was amazing! I'm very short (5'2 almost) with a very shallow ribcage and most head rests are awful for me but that was adjustable front-back, too
ID.4 stop sale - this is not the first door handle recall on that car. I was at a VW dealer looking at a 2023 Pro S with 18K miles for $21K when the sales manager came running out and said the stop sale applied to USED ID.4s as well. This is a serious safety issue.
Is it the frontal area that affects the range of the ID Buzz? Is it greater than the Model Y or EV9? I would think the Cd of the ID Buzz drives it's lower range at higher speeds.
Thanks for the podcast and the work you all do. Quick feedback - as a team you may need to work on being more succinct in your commentary - sometimes the same point is made 4 or 5 times, and it can be tedious listening to it. Some faster pacing would make this podcast even better. (Just my opinion!)
With how often one of the main four hosts is not available to be on (which is understandable, life happens), but it'd be nice to see more guest hosts on the podcast to get more perspectives on here.
Yes, I agree with Kyle: the fastback version of Audi Q6 EV is unnecessary design and extremely ugly. However ALL Tesla models are fastback-coupe rounded or wedge shaped with fastback rear. I hate their coupefied design but Kyle doesn't mind Tesla design. Lots of folks would prefer Tesla bringing noncoupefied boxier designs the way Audi and Volvo-Polestar has on the market.
Kyle sticking it to the man (at Nissan)!! Woohoo! Great way to shame Nissan in taking care of all the isolated battery faults, not just Kyle's. Hardcore shaming.
Earlier this year I bought an i3S with 25k miles at 40% of its new price and intend to keep it until I stop driving (I’m 65). I also bought a 20 month old Stallentis LWB van with 9 miles on the clock for just under £15k. Those avoided losses are a win regardless of how long you keep a vehicle. If I was rich, I’d care less about it though, but for me depreciation has always been my friend 👍
I dont see a problem of free charging because electricity is way over priced on the road compared to equal amount of energy when compared to gas. 1 gallon of gas is 33kwh or so and 1 gallon of gas is $5 on average in California and 33 kwh of electricity is about $16.50 so to balance it out charging should be free to some extent or at least subsidized to the point of neutrality. I think free charging should be limited to outside your area code so that it's only free on a road trip. Then it makes more sense because it has literally become highway robbery when charging on a road trip compared to gasoline.
@@M-rk8he You might not have an understanding of what energy is. there is 33.7 kwh of energy in 1 gallon of gas that is not up for debate it is known. What you are referring to is efficiency however when you are at the gas station or the charge station you are not buying efficiency you are buying energy. do you get it now or are you still confused?
Kyle. It's great that you had all of your issues fixed on your B class. And they quoted $5000 cost. My 2012 Leaf's heater failed. I was quoted $6,600 to replace the DC to DC converter by Nissan. So your low opinion of Nissan corporate is justified. They don't give a damn about their customers after the car is sold
Tom has a financial conflict of interest when it comes to home charging. He should disclose this and stop going on like a broken record about how great it is.
Kyle. It's great that you had all of your issues fixed on your B class. And they quoted $5000 cost. My 2012 Leaf's heater failed. I was quoted $6,600 to replace the DC to DC converter by Nissan. So your low opinion of Nissan corporate is justified. They don't give a damn about their customers after the car is sold
Tom is 100% correct about stopping free DC fast charging.
Disagree. How about building charging stations with enough ports and good reliability that it wouldn't matter?
@@JeanPierreWhite Sure, that’s utopia, no one will build enough charging stations to satisfy everyone. As of July 2024, Tesla has over 60,000 charging stalls at 6500 stations. No other company is even close to them. And, look at how few chargers GM, Ford, Stellantis, Toyota, Honda, VW, BMW, MB, etc have install.
We need much better home charging especially at HOA’s, condos, apartments, and other MDU’s. 45% of US lives in these locations, but only 1-2% of locations have EV charging.
@@johnpoldo8817 Networks like QA could at least try to build better stations. They aren't really trying. The results reveal the level of commitment they don't have.
@@JeanPierreWhite I influenced a 6-stall 350 kW Electrify America fast charger in my city. Undoubtedly, I will measure reliability and provide manufacturer feedback.
I disagree with Tom's rant on free charging... Here in Canada, my ID.4 came with 1400KwHr or I think 4 years... This is perfect for me as I charge at home when driving locally, but use the free charging when traveling. This way, I get the most bang for my $$$. I do agree that unlimited free charging is a bad idea for the reasons you identified.
Guys, a heat pump is a standard airconditioner, but with a diverter valve, so it can run in reverse. Compressed freon gets hot and makes heat for the vehicle.......It's not that expensive to do. Just has high pressure lines on both sides, of the pump. And a block heater on the compressor. I bet it's 50 bucks more than the air conditioner it already comes with....
Good show but I miss Martyn when he’s not there.
@@steveroper8733 So do we!
4:15 - try not be so hung up on North Jersey Tommy Molo and just move your tests down to RURAL SOUTH JERSEY where there's still lots of Farms that haven't been overtaken by GINORMOUS Warehouse Construction (well not yet anyway) again i suggest RT 55 from RT 42 down to the RT 49 exit for Millville (NJMP). if you have to dodge anything on the road at worse it'll be a herd of Cow, or a Farmer moving a Combine from one field to another...
(warning) while there's basically ZERO fast charging down at the Millville end, there is a fairly new/large 8 pump EA station located at the top end, up above RT 42 at the Walmart in Somerdale on the White Horse Pike, however BEFORE you even get to the Walmart, there are no less 3 other smaller EA stations in close vicinity to one another spread along busy RT 42, one at the Deptford Mall (4), the second at the Gloucester Premium Outlets (6), and a third at the Target Sicklerville (4)...
can't say i've ever used any of these smaller ones as coming back from the racetrack i usually plan my refueling stop for the big Walmart (8) so i can then make the easy jump back on 295 N and head for home in PA, or stop and visit my daughter in Mt. Laurel.
I did a road trip recently with my Model Y LR AWD to Death Valley, and I really wish I had much more range. Range does matter. Death Valley currently isn't EV friendly. No level 3 charging in the National Park. They need a level 3 charger by Furnace Creek Visitor Center area badly. The park is so big and the sites are spread apart. I had to drive 40-100 miles out of the park to charge, then drive 40-100 miles back in to visit some of the sites. It made the day way longer than it should have. My advice for anyone visiting Death Valley National Park in CA is to use an ICE car until they get a Supercharger in there. There's gas stations inside the park.
I’ve loved the Ariya since I saw it… if it gets NACS, I’m sold. Currently driving a 2013 Murano handed down to me by my mom when my Rogue crapped out after 10 years. The Murano is just about the right size vehicle for my needs and the Ariya is a close comp.
I love the look of the Q6 Sportback. It's the one for me.
Great job, Dom, and great show. Martin, I hope everyone's well asap.
We need all the range tests for the ID Buzz (LWB) asap! Bjørn Nyland tested the short wheel base (1,000km challenge) and it took him only 10 minutes longer to finish compared to the EV9 (with the EV9 tested at lower temperature/worse conditions). But the Buzz was significantly more efficient and this still might hold true for the LWB model.
I also got the email from Ford about recalling my Tesla NACS adapter, it says replacements should be arriving in a few weeks along with instructions to return the defective unit...
@@jennifercarr6451 Thanks for sharing!
Just had someone on the Hummer EV forum say they got an email from Ford for their Mach E that the Tesla NACS adapter is being recalled.
@@Nebula1701 Whoa. And also, yikes! - DY
And also, thanks for this, Nebula.
Absolutely the GMC is much better in my opinion. I am still tossed between getting a Gen 2 R1T and the GMC.
Are guys going to put out shirts and other merch with the logo?
Yes, Domenick may have dropped the ball on this. (thanks for the reminder) -DY
Love listening to you guys and always learn something 👍
HI GUYS, GOOD SHOW!! ON THE ID BUZZ PRODUCTION HALT, TOM, I THINK SAID IT WAS SURPRISING THAT VW WAS TAKING SO LONG TO FIX THE DOOR HANDLES, WELL, REMEMBER HOW LONG IT TOOK TOYOTA TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO KEEP THE WHEELS FROM FALLING OFF THE BZ4XXX THINGIE??
They must have better data that says the free charging works is all I can think.
The Buzz looks like a etron in the shape of a buss lol
Enel-X update: their assets will be auctioned off on Oct 29th to the highest bidder(s) so whomever wins can migrate installed base of chargers to their server.
The bad news is winner could be a single vendor creating a monopoly with absurd annual fees and/or skimming profit from CPO. Enel had very attractive pricing for resellers and it’s gone now.
The ideal scenario is a hardware vendor acquiring assets so charger profits subsidize software development.
I think Tom and Kyle should get together and work out a spec for a "quick" range test. It's still important to do a full one to make sure the manufacture isn't doing anything under the table and it's impossible to cheat on a 100% to 0% test.
Start out at 50% and test efficiency by running down to 10%. Then drain it to 0% and charge to 100% in about an hour to establish usable battery size. You could een try just establishing efficiency over any 10% range from 70% to 30% to shorten it even more? This would allow testing many more wheel, trim and model year combinations; which is very much needed.
If the Ford F150 came large pack base and charged faster it would be fantastic
my last ICE car i got a free full fuel tank lol
I was so interested in this vehicle from the minute. They started teasing it. But the low range combined with mediocre charging speeds has killed any desire to own one for me.
Oh! i'd been waiting for a B class update! I sat in a used one at my local used EV shop but didnt pull the trigger fast enough. I dont usually drive luxury brands and the interior of that was amazing! I'm very short (5'2 almost) with a very shallow ribcage and most head rests are awful for me but that was adjustable front-back, too
ID.4 stop sale - this is not the first door handle recall on that car. I was at a VW dealer looking at a 2023 Pro S with 18K miles for $21K when the sales manager came running out and said the stop sale applied to USED ID.4s as well. This is a serious safety issue.
Boulder Colorado is gonna be thick with old hippies driving ID.Buzz vans.
Is it the frontal area that affects the range of the ID Buzz? Is it greater than the Model Y or EV9? I would think the Cd of the ID Buzz drives it's lower range at higher speeds.
@PWN-E Yes. It's Cd is just a bit worse than EV9, but it's 6 inches taller. They about the same width.
Also got the email from Ford about the adapter recall. Just missed the stream. Would have asked in the stream.
@@reesemccarthy505 Thanks for the heads up.
just love this knowledge, good job guys
Thanks for the podcast and the work you all do.
Quick feedback - as a team you may need to work on being more succinct in your commentary - sometimes the same point is made 4 or 5 times, and it can be tedious listening to it. Some faster pacing would make this podcast even better. (Just my opinion!)
21:00 - BEHOLD BEHOLDERS...!!! the better "Robo-Taxi" by VW.
With how often one of the main four hosts is not available to be on (which is understandable, life happens), but it'd be nice to see more guest hosts on the podcast to get more perspectives on here.
@GridConnections True. If we know a day or so in advance, we can do this, but often it's last-minute issues.
Yes, I agree with Kyle: the fastback version of Audi Q6 EV is unnecessary design and extremely ugly. However ALL Tesla models are fastback-coupe rounded or wedge shaped with fastback rear. I hate their coupefied design but Kyle doesn't mind Tesla design. Lots of folks would prefer Tesla bringing noncoupefied boxier designs the way Audi and Volvo-Polestar has on the market.
Kyle sticking it to the man (at Nissan)!!
Woohoo!
Great way to shame Nissan in taking care of all the isolated battery faults, not just Kyle's. Hardcore shaming.
What is going on with the Out of Spec podcast?
Depreciation only matters if you don't keep your cars for a long time.
Earlier this year I bought an i3S with 25k miles at 40% of its new price and intend to keep it until I stop driving (I’m 65). I also bought a 20 month old Stallentis LWB van with 9 miles on the clock for just under £15k. Those avoided losses are a win regardless of how long you keep a vehicle. If I was rich, I’d care less about it though, but for me depreciation has always been my friend 👍
It is pathetic that Rivian and Hyundai have beaten Ford to bringing NACS.
I dont see a problem of free charging because electricity is way over priced on the road compared to equal amount of energy when compared to gas. 1 gallon of gas is 33kwh or so and 1 gallon of gas is $5 on average in California and 33 kwh of electricity is about $16.50 so to balance it out charging should be free to some extent or at least subsidized to the point of neutrality. I think free charging should be limited to outside your area code so that it's only free on a road trip. Then it makes more sense because it has literally become highway robbery when charging on a road trip compared to gasoline.
@@M-rk8he You might not have an understanding of what energy is. there is 33.7 kwh of energy in 1 gallon of gas that is not up for debate it is known. What you are referring to is efficiency however when you are at the gas station or the charge station you are not buying efficiency you are buying energy. do you get it now or are you still confused?
VW dog mode will come when they get Rivian technology into their vehicles.
I’d take Kyle enthusiasm with VW with quite a helping of salt, VW software even with software 5 is still very compromised
Here we have a millionaire saying he doesn't like free stuff.
Kyle. It's great that you had all of your issues fixed on your B class. And they quoted $5000 cost.
My 2012 Leaf's heater failed. I was quoted $6,600 to replace the DC to DC converter by Nissan. So your low opinion of Nissan corporate is justified. They don't give a damn about their customers after the car is sold
EVclinic warned people to not buy used leafs because of that
Tom has a financial conflict of interest when it comes to home charging. He should disclose this and stop going on like a broken record about how great it is.
Is just a drive by troll, or do you care to expand upon what you mean?
Incorrect. They have aligned sponsors with their personal views. You must not own an EV if you feel differently.
Kyle. It's great that you had all of your issues fixed on your B class. And they quoted $5000 cost.
My 2012 Leaf's heater failed. I was quoted $6,600 to replace the DC to DC converter by Nissan. So your low opinion of Nissan corporate is justified. They don't give a damn about their customers after the car is sold