I'm curious what you all think about the 120FPS camera capture (but then UA-cam obviously degrades it to 60FPS when you watch it). There really is no good way to show what the actual experience is like in a UA-cam video, but I thought I'd try this out for this one and see how it went.
@@teddyholiday8038correct, but it is disabled in game menus, and works with gsync. Whereas fsr 3 uses vsync in game and at least appears to disable freesync given what my monitor is reporting.
You are in your personal spring from the looks of it, Daniel. A growing channel, a father and husband, a school teacher… You are killin’ it man. I need to get on mine. I have been slacking.
It’s so cool to see someone growing as a video producer at such record pace. Seriously, the amount that Daniel has improved in such little time is nothing short of astounding. Doing all of this WHILE being a full-time teacher and having a family with children is honestly so commendable and gives me so much hope for the future.
Yeah those jumps aren’t from the framerate. Played plenty of games at 60fps and never had those stutters or jumps. Is a sync/response time issue I think.
@@codymadison9993definitely. FSR 3 needs to work in VRR mode for this to be solved IMO. Turning off Freesync on my 144 Hz monitor gives the same kind of frame pacing issues observed with FSR 3, so I bet once that is done, FSR 3 FG will looks nice and smooth.
Quick tip Daniel, when you hold the "0" button down, you get access to the short cut menu. You can then bind HDMI input to button 1, and hdmi input 2 to button 2, that way you can swtich betwen inputs by just holding 1 or 2 for a few seconds, instead of going back and forth between the menu bar.
Thanks to Mr. Daniel for his analysis, I would like to add the key points of my personal use these days. The correct way to use fsr3 is to select vertical synchronization for the display card driver, and select the monitor refresh rate minus 3 for the highest frame rate (144-3=141, 60-3=57). At the same time, it is very important to turn off vertical synchronization in the game.
If the kids aren’t having fun in the background, then it’s just not an Iconic Daniel Owen Production. Thanks for the testing Daniel. You’ve been the best source for FSR3 analysis by far. Appreciate you, mate. Cheers
Daniel, your content has grown by leaps and bounds! I still remember watching your content when you started during the GPU apocalypse and you have leveled up with every video! Congrats on your success!
Daniel on the left has a few more jaggies than the one on the right, but Daniel on the right is tearing. Seriously though I like this Off-screen capture. Feels more real than direct capture. Thanks for all the day 1 FSR 3 info! Not many creators felt like working over the weekend for this lol.
Pro tip: you can SHOW THE 120FPS difference by slowing down the clip by 2x this gives us the ability to see the difference in FPS when we view it at 60 FPS on UA-cam
Even using 2x on UA-cam then on the viewer side, it's just not how 120 fps would look like. You might see ghosting there that you'd never see natively.
@@TraktorTarzan Yes. But FSR has different features. It has upscaling, frame generation and something called "native AA mode", wich reduces latency. Upscaling and native AA will be available to all, even older GPUS. Frame generation will only be usable on GPUs with RT cores. And even tho nvidia can use the FSR 3 frame generation, the users will most likely use the DLSS, since it is better supported for their GPUs, while using FSR 3.0 upscaling.
I can't imagine 5-10 years from now how much these kinds of technologies will contribute to making graphics realistic. It's going to get better and better.
a higher-up from Nvidia has said that in the future something like DLSS 10 is expected to render the whole game solely with AI and completely eliminates complex algorithyms, I mean just take a look at DLSS 3.5 RR, that AI completely replaced multiple denoising algorythyms while doing a better job at it and gives more performance
As long as Nvidia keeps coming up with these technologies, and AMD to copy them, all will be good. If Nvidia drops out to do AI, I'd be worried the only thing close to technology coming afterward for GPUs would be small raster increases and price to performance ratios.
Maybe I'm being picky here, but I still don't like these technologies. Even DLSS. There's still too many artifacts and black smudging that's going on when I have it enabled, even on quality. Native still superior.
Once again, Daniel needs to be reminded that Reflex works with vsync to auto-cap the max FPS below the monitor refresh, so you get optimal frame delivery and no added latency. Shocked he still doesn’t understand
Hey Daniel. I have tested FSR3 Frame Gen in Forspoken myself and from my testing I found out that you 1. NEED to cap your FPS with RTSS or any other frame cap software to 1-3 FPS below your monitors max refresh rate. 2. You NEED to maintain the FPS framecap at all times while at the same time having a few % headroom. Meaning, make sure you dont max your GPU utilization at 100%. Try it again in Forspoken and you will notice the difference. Its way more responsive and smooth if you follow my suggestions. Example: 1. Your monitors refresh rate = 120Hz 2. Set up a FPS cap between 116 and 119 FPS 3. Change your graphic settings so that you can easily maintain the FPS cap which you set up in Step 2. 4. Make sure your GPU is BELOW 100% utilization AT ALL TIMES while reaching your FPS cap you set up in Step 2. 5. If your FPS drops below your FPS cap you set up in Step 2, it introduces higher latency and it doesnt feel smooth anymore 6. Specifically in Forspoken, change the refresh rate in the display settings menu to 120, not 240 7. Use the ingame Vsync AND force Vsync via driver to fix frame pacing issues 8. Now you can enjoy buttery smooth and super responsive gameplay There is a problem with Frame Gen / Vsync if you hit your monitors max refresh rate without the FPS limit. I dont know why it happens. Try it out and report back if you want and tell us if you can confirm my observation. PS: Nice video as usual :)
@@fervargraider5274 That was actually a typo. I edited my post and corrected it. You are right, Vsync has to be enabled in the game settings too. If you only use driver level vsync it doesnt feel smooth.
Hmm this can't be right. Since G-Sync isn't supported when FSG FG is enabled, limiting 1-3 fps below the monitor's max refresh rate would result in some frames being displayed twice to fill up the gap between the limit and the refresh rate. With an Nvidia GPU I got the best results when setting the in-game frame limiter to my monitors 120, then everything was super-smooth.
@@NeovanGoth I know its weird. I also tried a 120 FPS cap but that felt worse. It might have something to do with my TV/Monitor. I am using an LG C1 which has a 120Hz panel but in reality its more like 119 Hz. At least thats what the display says when enabling game mode. Pretty sure a lot of monitors actual refresh rate is a bit lower than the one its advertised with.
good job first time i subscribed to a channel in forever lol u just that good. I'm a techie and ur channel is a dream come true. I can't watch other testing channels they don't do it right and chill setup like u do. I bet ur a nice teacher.
Despite being a one-man army, a dad and full-time teacher, Daniel is giving Digital Foundry a run for their money. He's of the most hardworking youtubers that I've seen. Seriously, congratulations and thank you for your awesome content! 👏
I had same experience in Forspoken with FSR 3 on Saturday looking at it. The visual motion fluidity didnt feel like 100+ fps. The native 60 felt smoother actually so am glad you and Ancient Gameplays experienced the same thing. Immortals of Aveum however felt much better.
I have tested FSR3 Frame Gen in Forspoken myself and from my testing I found out that you 1. NEED to cap your FPS with RTSS or any other frame cap software to 1-3 FPS below your monitors max refresh rate. 2. You NEED to maintain the FPS framecap at all times while at the same time having a few % headroom. Meaning, make sure you dont max your GPU utilization at 100%. Try it again in Forspoken and you will notice the difference. Its way more responsive and smooth if you follow my suggestions. Example: 1. Your monitors refresh rate = 120Hz 2. Set up a FPS cap between 116 and 119 FPS 3. Change your graphic settings so that you can easily maintain the FPS cap which you set up in Step 2. 4. Make sure your GPU is BELOW 100% utilization AT ALL TIMES while reaching your FPS cap you set up in Step 2. 5. If your FPS drops below your FPS cap you set up in Step 2, it introduces higher latency and it doesnt feel smooth anymore 6. Specifically in Forspoken, change the refresh rate in the display settings menu to 120, not 240 7. Dont use the ingame Vsync, force Vsync via driver or use the tool Special K to fix frame pacing issues 8. Now you can enjoy buttery smooth and super responsive gameplay There is a problem with Frame Gen / Vsync if you hit your monitors max refresh rate without the FPS limit. I dont know why it happens. Try it out and report back if you want and tell us if you can confirm my observation.
@@samirfa5300 I'll look into it and maybe make a follow-up vid. I tried capping it with the new driver AMD fps cap feature, frame target control I think its called, it was a stutters mess. I'll look into what you suggested though.
I really appreciate the qualitative data that you put out. Few people do this, but its so important. Everyone else wants to only provide quantitative data, which ends up looking like frame rate drag races. But what's the experience like? I see the frame rate results, but are those experiences otherwise comparable? The answer is often "no," and few people except for Daniel and Digital Foundry actually bother to notice the player experience.
I don’t know how I feel about these FSR 3 reviews, I know a lot of these opinions are subjective, but as someone who owns a 6700XT, when I used FSR 3 for the first time, it blew my mind how forespoken immediately went from 50-55 FPS maxed at 1440p, ugly & jittery to 120 FPS much improved image quality, & responsiveness, it was like magic, I thought I was cheating. It really felt like life changing technology after living with this gpu for 6 months, that’s just my input. Looking forward to your full review Daniel. 🙏🏽🙏🏽
Bud, are you capping the frame rate with riva tuner? Or are you just doing it native? The comments seem to make it sounds like riva tuner fixes the issue he was having
Most reviews use the top-end GPU's so when they use FSR 3 the difference isn't that noticeable compared to your more mid-range GPU you are seeing a more substantial performance difference.
@@rage8010 use riva tuner itest forspoken fsr3 with my rx 6650xt setting max resolution 3440x1440 i got 25-30 native then i use fsr3 with fg i got 60fps + but i lock with rivatuner at 60 when i move camera its smoth than native resolution or fsr3 quality without fg but prob is i feel different while playing but when i record with obs the video nothing different or idk how to make it work to see what differen in video
Same, I have an RTX 3050 laptop that can barely play Forspoken at all, even the lowest settings possible with DLSS Ultra Performance couldn't get me over 50 FPS. The game actually crashed multiple times when I tried out running it at higher settings. Imagine how surprised I was when I was able to tinker out a semi-consistent 60 FPS with Medium settings out of it, thanks to FSR 3. Even the input latency didn't seem that big of a deal when the alternative was the game barely chugging along at an ugly and broken 30 FPS.
In forspoken, deactivate Vsync and activate 120hz cap in AMD software. You can do that outside of "radeon chill" It is in the same page, but for global gaming experience, where you chose between hypr rx, quality, hypr rx eco, default.... It removes the stutters. But if you only have 120fps, you will see more artifacts.
In my tests with Forspoken on a 4090 it _only_ was smooth when forcing Vsync (which I did via Nvidia Control Panel), setting the in-game frame limiter to 120 (with is my display's maximum), _and_ actually hitting 120 fps. Below 120 the incompatibility with G-Sync introduced bad frame pacing on the presentation side (forcing the screen to display some frames twice in order to somehow squeeze the 80 or 90 fps into is 120 Hz refresh), while with the in-game frame limiter set to 240 (it tends to reset itself after switching to DLSS and back to FSR) RTSS still reported stable 120 fps, but movement in the game became super choppy.
What also fixed it for me, on a RTX 2070 Super, was turning on V-sync in game and disabling the variable refresh rate through my monitors controls. I kind of think VRR is not disabled automatically or it still causes issues if not forced off in my monitor settings.
I appreciate the time and effort you put in to testing both team green and red. Very helpful for people who are not as aware of the technical specs. I'm on a 3080 but as this new gen tech keeps evolving it's nice that you take the time to delve into the intricacies of both. Thank you!
Very rarely do I come across people as enthusiastic and as informative as Daniel and having watched his channel for about 4 months now, I’m now certain that my school experience would have been so much better if I had Daniel teaching me. He just has this enthusiasm that pours through the video and really makes it that much more interesting to watch. I usually wouldn’t really care what the difference between FSR FG and DLSS FG is, but if it’s Daniel explaining it? I’m all in.
Hi Daniel, let me just tell you how much I appreciate the hard work you're going to in order to show us the REAL implications of exciting new tech. As a fellow busy dad I get the struggle and am really grateful for this.
I'd love to see frame generation used for emulators like PCSX2. You can force games to run over 60fps, but it breaks a lot of them some way or another. Thanks for the video!
lol at the kid running past at 19:22. As a dad myself, I love it. Don't be too self-conscious about them randomly making their mark on your videos. You're a full time teacher, a dad, and you're (quite wonderfully I must say) running a UA-cam channel on the side, trying to see if it can expand past the point of just being a side thing. We all get it. Not too many viewers are going to be turned off by your kids being kids.
Hey brother, i fixed the FSR 3 Stutter in Forspoken. The maximum framerate must be set to 120, Vsync on, and To get the most stability and smooth gameplay , Performance mode and frame gen should be used to keep framerate at 120 even during intense fights. Graphics settings can also be lowered to maintain 120 fps throughout the game. ua-cam.com/video/sOTAIxwWv5w/v-deo.html
That jittery behavior you saw in Forespoken, I've gotten that a lot with dlss3, in dying light 2 and in Hogwarts at 144hz. Both games if I lock to 120 it doesn't do it, no idea the cause, but it seems common to frame gen at this point.
Regarding Forspoken frame pacing: It looked as if the pacing smoothed out with FSR3 Frame Generation on when the framerate fell under vsync. Once you hit vsync seemed to be when the jutter occurred, notably in the camera panning examples you gave
I did a lot of testing and I found that the in game Vsync is the issue. When I turned in game Vsync off and used the vsync in the AMD software the jutters went away and it was100% smooth. Try that if you're having issues and lock your FPS in Rivatuner.
Hey brother, i fixed the FSR 3 Stutter in Forspoken. The maximum framerate must be set to 120, Vsync on, and To get the most stability and smooth gameplay , Performance mode and frame gen should be used to keep framerate at 120 even during intense fights. Graphics settings can also be lowered to maintain 120 fps throughout the game. ua-cam.com/video/sOTAIxwWv5w/v-deo.html
@@stangamer1151 this is false. driver frame rate limiters sucks ass when it comes to framepacing compared to RTSS. They do have better input latency but for single player games framepacing matters more. While RTSS is good, SpecialK's latent sync frame rate limiter is JUST Better!
just found your channel. mega thumps up. u seem to be exactly as nitpicky with image quality as me. and thats a good thing (for me at least). i often talk to people, that do not even "see" the issues i see in games. Your videos will be my go to in the future!!
Your Forspoken experience mirrors mine. Initially I'm not sure whether it was just my setup using 60Hz display that cause it (especially since the game doesn't have 60FPS cap when FG is on) but maybe it wasn't my setup. What I felt was that the smoothness was similar to when FG is off, so in this case I think there is something wrong with the frame pacing and hopefully they can fix it soon.
You need 60fps as your base when using Frame Generation. If you enable FG below that threshold you'll experience excessive lag, artifacts a lot more than you normally would.
@@jotunheim5302 I know about that, but that is not the point. The point is that it doesn't feel smoother. For example, when I ran Forspoken without FG, I can get around 40FPS. When I enable FG, because there is a bit of overhead, it doesn't do 40FPS to 80FPS but to 60FPS, which is fine and expected. What is not expected is that 40FPS looks smoother than 60FPS, so there is an issue there. Personally I just want to test it simply because I want to know how bad it is when targeting 60FPS using FG. Yes, I know the potential image artifact can be more easily spotted, which is why I actually want to do it. I want to see how much I can spot the artifact and how low I can go with the base frame rate before the artifact becomes really bad. If it ended up still actually looks fine for 60FPS end result, I might actually use FSR3 depending on the game. A game that doesn't require fast reaction should be fine. Again, it hinges on whether I can actually spot the artifact, which right now I can't do because I don't think it work correctly in Forspoken, at least on my PC and it seems Daniel also experiencing something similar in Forspoken even on a high frame rate display.
Just a tip to switch mouse and keyboard, rather than having 2 sets, get a USB switch device. The Ugreen one works like a charm. I have my setup for Gaming and Office. I just hit a button on that Ugreen switch and voila, all my devices switches between work laptop and personal system
Yup, I believe they're called KVM Switches. I left a comment about it. Some monitors actually have one built in so you can just plug your USB device in there. I do wonder how that will affect latency though...
@@technologicalelite8076 I did not notice any increase in latency, its a USB 3.0 well built switch so no issues. Specially with a wireless mouse and I play fast shooter games. Did not notice any noticeable latency increase
So from what I've seen, FSR frame gen is actually surprisingly good considering it's not using dedicated hardware there are some issues to iron out with the vsync thing but it seems really nice. Haven't tried it myself though.
I have been enjoying your videos lately (thoughts), the very first videos I saw from you didn't really land it for me. Regardless the topics you talk about are interesting to me. A couple of months later, here I am curious about your opinion. You are doing a great job, and I am another one of bunch who thinks the same.
I feel like an FSR 3.1 would be able to smooth out the edges with the current version of FSR 3, much like the upgrade from FSR 2 to 2.1/2.2. Hopefully, 10 series / RX 500 series GPUs can see support with this correction: pardon my poor technical knowledge, but hopefully they find a way with 10 series / RX 500 series
It requires Asynchronous Compute. GTX 10 series supports it on paper but Ashes of the Singularity (which uses AC when available) runs like crap on Pascal. Polaris does not support AC as far as I'm concerned. I think GCN didn't support it until Vega, but I could be wrong.
@@MrSandvich03 I just looked it up. GCN 4 strictly speaking doesn't support the full AC spec as it doesn't have the dispatch controllers (meaning the driver has to manually poll to see if it's done and get it going on the next wave if it is) but if you're right then it supports enough of it to make it work.
Heads up, Daniel: The judder in the Forspoken footage relative to the Immortals of Aveum footage may be related to the fact that your GPU was fully utilized in Forspoken but not in Immortals of Aveum. If you can control for that (perhaps by testing at 1080p), then it should produce better results.
I've got a 3080, watched some other of your videos on FSR 3.0. Without knowing too much i tried FSR 2.1 on CoD MW2. NGL that experience is great, can't even imagine how 3.0 improves things. DLSS was a** when i tried it a while back.
Would be interested to see if an RX7600 has sufficient free bandwidth @1080p to actually benefit from frame interpolation, or whether it's only a workable trick for higher end GPUs? Great video and keep up the good work 👍
People are saying that if you activate the frame limiter within Rivia Tuner, the frame time and fluidity within the game will be back to normal, smooth. Just set about 10 fps less than the average after you have configured it the way you like. So for example if in the native it was giving 40 fps and with the fsr3 and frame generator it goes to 120, you go to Rivia Tuner and limits it to 100 or 110, or to your monitor fps, which will cancel out this lack of fluidity that you are feeling.
I did the same thing .... my monitor is 165hz andI O have a 6adeon 800 so capping frames is the only solution, I can't reach 165 FPS. just used Rivatuner
@danielowentech For those not able to reach monitor hz fps limit, just enable Fps limiter and set it to somewhat lower fps than what is achieved with frame gen, for example if achieve 125 fps average with frame gen, set fps limiter to 110~. Also, my Gsync compatible is working with the game as long as im able to easily achieve the frame gen fps (for example limiting as i mentioned), but as soon its on the limit of achieving a steady fps or withuot a limiter, it wont work. This should also make your gameplay in forspoken not as jittery, should try a fps limit of 95-110~. You can kinda see when it starts jitter if using gsync, when getting "overloaded" or on the limit of achieving steady fps, the gsync will just lock on the max monitor hz and it will feel very unsmooth. But as soon the frames get stable within a limit/lock, the smoothness is back and gsync will start follow the fps of the game again
Not sure what model of TV/Monitor that is specifically but on my C1 it is possible to hotkey inputs to the number buttons. I think they call it "Quick Access". I have my remote setup so I can long-press the 2 to switch to my daily pc and I can long-press 4 to switch to my gaming pc. It is quicker and less finicky than using the OSD menu for input switching.
great content, a lot of info. wish you have a spread sheet at the end of each video to summarize all your work, because it's very easy for viewers to get lost in different types of scenarios. thanks and keep up the good work. cheers
Did you try frame limiting Forspoken to 120 fps instead of 240 fps? That's why I did and it felt great. Though I wasn't usually hitting the frame cap so perhaps that's the issue
I found that the in game Vsync is the issue. When I turned in game Vsync off and used the vsync in the AMD software the jutters went away and it was100% smooth. Try that if you're having issues and lock your FPS in Rivatuner.
Too bad AFMF isn’t available in the two games FSR 3 is. It’s 12 games and not one of the 12 has FSR 3. Also already widely reported AFMF is a “dumbed down” version of FSR 3 Frame Gen
I have a RX 7800 XT and used Riva Tuner to lock my fps to 165hz and used Native AA with frame gen and had no jutters even during heavy combat in Forspoken.
I think you should turn off g-sync manually on forespoken, i got that same jitter until i turned of freesync, in IOA it turns off when you turn frame generation
Daniel, you're always here for us! Question: how to we enable AFMF if we are using an Nvidia card and there is no toggle in the game's option menu.... can we somehow use adrenaline software to load the game, even tho running nvidia gear? 🎉
to use fsr3 in forspoken with correct frame pacing you must turn on nvidia's vsync in nvidia control panel for forpspoken, then in game turn off vsync and set frame rate to 120hz (it's extremely important), then frame gen with work perfectly even with gsync P.S. please like this comment for daniel to see
Guess Forespoken camera pan showed here that effectiveness/performance/feel of FG can vary by the game, no surprise. Gonna need more samples than two to draw conclusions. I think you handle the 120 fps reality vs 60fps youtube very well. No good solution there. You explained very well.
I was able to fix Forspoken's judder on my system (R7 5800x3D + RTX 3080 12GB) with in-game V-Sync On + RTSS Frame Limiter set to just below what frame FSR3 FG gave me. So Frame Generation was giving me around 90-100FPS with FSR3 Quality I locked that to 90FPS on RTSS and the judder was gone. FYI NVCP Frame Limiter doesn't fix the judder on Forspoken.
Yeah it seems that’s what you’d wanna do, I was getting 90-98fps with FG on so I turned on V sync and capped it to around 90 and it became way smoother
It should be noted that Forspoken generally has framepacing problems, regardless of the upscaling technology used. Therefore, the results there should be evaluated with caution.
I don't have Immortals of Aveum, but I do have Forspoken. In Forspoken, I use a mouse and keyboard; when I pan around, things look normal to me, not any more jerky when frame generation is off. I tried the preview drivers and Cyberpunk 2077, but that was not a good experience. I didn't particularly appreciate that I had to turn HDR off for that. Games with AMD FSR 3 frame generation built into the game work well, and you can use HDR. I will only use AMD FSR 3 frame generation built into games. I won't use frame generation for games that don't have frame generation built into it. Hopefully, they can fix them in the future.
As a math professor, you can appreciate this question: if without generation you are already near vsync, say 100 fps, and with generation you get 120, which is 60 doubled, which do you prefer ? Because I would say 100 real fps is better.
Forspoken on the 6700XT with Frame Gen off you were at 95% GPU load, with FG on you were at 99%. Try capping your frames to 120 instead of 240. Once I got the GPU load to ~90% and enabled FG the GPU load dropped further and responsiveness improved massively. Not sure if I can stand using DLSS2 by comparison. I think in your case your base settings didn't leave enough GPU for FG to run. I'm running a 3060 so it could be that it actually runs better on Nvidia but I think your slowdowns are related to base settings. Also saw significantly *lower* CPU usage on FSR 3 + FG vs DLSS 2. It's like a system upgrade or going back to UE4 or maybe even UE3.
@danielowentech One thing I just noticed is that forspoken's Fullscreen and borderless screen mods actually make the FG look even worse than native as you mentioned. I tried switching the screen mode to Windowed option in the display settings and then revert back to borderless and it smoothed the game. Jutters occur far less than before. I couldn't feel 60fps before but somehow by switching between screen mods the smoothness of the game and frames seem to change. So I guess the developers can easily address this issue. Hope you see my comment.
First of all, thank you for the work with the many videos directly for the release of FSR3 😌👍🏻 And thanks again because someone finally seems to have understood what this feature is actually intended for ❗It's actually just supposed to close the gap to the maximum refresh rate of the monitor. If the existing hardware already provides a relatively high FPS number, but it is still not quite enough. FSR 3 with FG is then used to convey the smoothest possible gaming experience 😌 it is just used incorrectly in marketing 😉 in the case of DLSS 3 and above to emphasize the purchase argument of the particular company with a green logo. Basically to convince the mentally weak to spend more on something than it's worth 😋 hello Ngreedia 😏 Jen Hsun Huang 's real slogan is not "buy more save more" it's " give them less and sell it to them for way more" 🤷♂️ and they follow anyway 🤦♂️btw i didnt notice the thing you mentioned with Forspoken i tried it with my RX 6950XT on a LG34GN850P-B Ultrawide and FSR3 worked as it should 🤔 i will go back today an try it out again.
i think you are absolutly right about that. in therms of marketing, amd did a fare better job to market this tech for what it is, FLUID MOTION FRAMES. where as nvidia is marketing FG as performance tech and how faster your 40 series gpu now is and how big the performance uplift from gen to gen was this time
fsr 3 really seems to help out apus i have a lenovo lefion 5 with a rtx 3070 an a ryzen 5800h. i dsabled the rtx 3070 an tested just the apu graphics and i was able to play Immortals of Aveum with out it being dreadful
I feel like FSR3 works quite well in Forspoken as long as it runs under the max refresh rate. On my 120hz panel, running the game at 90-100 fps I think feels pretty good. When jumping to 120 (I am forcing vsync in control panel) it feels juddery
I was so excited for frame generation. I actually really like that "soap opera effect" that people complain about in TV's and i expected frame generation to be something like that, but when i got a capable Nvidia card i realized that i wasn't missing out on much and the game looks and feels smother when frame generation is off, even if the counter says that I'm like 10 fps lower.
I think a hybrid approach to capture would be best. A camera has a softer and more natural feel, where the frames naturally blend a little bit more together, but capturing clean gameplay at 120 Hz and then slowing it down to 60 Hz would show us the imperfections more clearly. Even if it's not really representative of the real experience, it should work when comparing FSR to DLSS, because they're both equally disadvantaged.
I'm curious what you all think about the 120FPS camera capture (but then UA-cam obviously degrades it to 60FPS when you watch it). There really is no good way to show what the actual experience is like in a UA-cam video, but I thought I'd try this out for this one and see how it went.
Thanks for your amazing testing
In the first example it did seem slightly smoother
Vsync should be forced on in NVCP with frame Gen. Nvidia has said this numerous times.
@@teddyholiday8038correct, but it is disabled in game menus, and works with gsync. Whereas fsr 3 uses vsync in game and at least appears to disable freesync given what my monitor is reporting.
"Garbling is the technical term" sarcastically lol
My guy Daniel going hard and delivering us some great videos and information while being a teacher full time
Yes this! While big tech sites with large staffs ignore fsr 3.
And father! The man is a beast. Nobody is putting out the type of FSR3 content that he is.
@@ToddandRaquiForrest To be fair, FSR3 is just in 3 games and AMD is notorious for having bad drivers early but becoming better over time.
You took the words right out of my head dude!
You can look in his eyes that he looked really tired
You are in your personal spring from the looks of it, Daniel. A growing channel, a father and husband, a school teacher… You are killin’ it man. I need to get on mine. I have been slacking.
It’s so cool to see someone growing as a video producer at such record pace.
Seriously, the amount that Daniel has improved in such little time is nothing short of astounding. Doing all of this WHILE being a full-time teacher and having a family with children is honestly so commendable and gives me so much hope for the future.
Who says shit like this to another man
@@19deltascout43fragile masculinity
@@19deltascout43 Better, more confident men than you
@@amoonhead 😆 🤣
Surprised that even with the video being 60fps, the difference is easy to spot between 70-120 fps with the 120fps capture card. Nice one, Daniel.
Yeah those jumps aren’t from the framerate. Played plenty of games at 60fps and never had those stutters or jumps. Is a sync/response time issue I think.
@@codymadison9993definitely. FSR 3 needs to work in VRR mode for this to be solved IMO. Turning off Freesync on my 144 Hz monitor gives the same kind of frame pacing issues observed with FSR 3, so I bet once that is done, FSR 3 FG will looks nice and smooth.
Quick tip Daniel, when you hold the "0" button down, you get access to the short cut menu. You can then bind HDMI input to button 1, and hdmi input 2 to button 2, that way you can swtich betwen inputs by just holding 1 or 2 for a few seconds, instead of going back and forth between the menu bar.
thanks for the tip, didn't know about this short cut. Any other LG tv tips that you would like to share?
@@OgoidReiif you hold the gear button you'll go straight to the full settings menu.
Oooh, thank you! It works! :D
@@OgoidReiNot sure about the C2. But on the LG C1, you can hit the button combination 1113111 for a secret menu.
I've also done this on my LG phone.
Thanks to Mr. Daniel for his analysis, I would like to add the key points of my personal use these days. The correct way to use fsr3 is to select vertical synchronization for the display card driver, and select the monitor refresh rate minus 3 for the highest frame rate (144-3=141, 60-3=57). At the same time, it is very important to turn off vertical synchronization in the game.
If the kids aren’t having fun in the background, then it’s just not an Iconic Daniel Owen Production. Thanks for the testing Daniel. You’ve been the best source for FSR3 analysis by far. Appreciate you, mate. Cheers
Daniel, your content has grown by leaps and bounds! I still remember watching your content when you started during the GPU apocalypse and you have leveled up with every video! Congrats on your success!
Daniel on the left has a few more jaggies than the one on the right, but Daniel on the right is tearing. Seriously though I like this Off-screen capture. Feels more real than direct capture. Thanks for all the day 1 FSR 3 info! Not many creators felt like working over the weekend for this lol.
120fps capture definitely helps to see the difference in smoothness.
Pro tip: you can SHOW THE 120FPS difference by slowing down the clip by 2x this gives us the ability to see the difference in FPS when we view it at 60 FPS on UA-cam
Even using 2x on UA-cam then on the viewer side, it's just not how 120 fps would look like. You might see ghosting there that you'd never see natively.
@@HiImBQ you can change the video speed to 2x to test it, but still youtube's compression is really bad for this stuff.
@@HiImBQ It's not about having a perfect impression of how 120 actually looks, but to allow comparing it with 60 easily.
We appreciate your hard work with testing all of this, as well as balancing your work and parenting life! 👏
It's good that both teams now have some sort of "frame generation" 👍
isnt dlss only for the 40 series? and the FSR is for everyone?
@@TraktorTarzan Yes. But FSR has different features. It has upscaling, frame generation and something called "native AA mode", wich reduces latency. Upscaling and native AA will be available to all, even older GPUS. Frame generation will only be usable on GPUs with RT cores. And even tho nvidia can use the FSR 3 frame generation, the users will most likely use the DLSS, since it is better supported for their GPUs, while using FSR 3.0 upscaling.
@@TraktorTarzanseries 40 has ddls 3 and frame gen other series has DLLs 1 and 2 if I didn't mistake anything
I can't imagine 5-10 years from now how much these kinds of technologies will contribute to making graphics realistic. It's going to get better and better.
a higher-up from Nvidia has said that in the future something like DLSS 10 is expected to render the whole game solely with AI and completely eliminates complex algorithyms, I mean just take a look at DLSS 3.5 RR, that AI completely replaced multiple denoising algorythyms while doing a better job at it and gives more performance
As long as Nvidia keeps coming up with these technologies, and AMD to copy them, all will be good. If Nvidia drops out to do AI, I'd be worried the only thing close to technology coming afterward for GPUs would be small raster increases and price to performance ratios.
@@cks2020693that was just fake news lol
except AMD aint copying anything as both their upscaling processes are very different from on another....@@Mcnooblet
Maybe I'm being picky here, but I still don't like these technologies. Even DLSS. There's still too many artifacts and black smudging that's going on when I have it enabled, even on quality. Native still superior.
Thanks! Love your passion; it shows in the quality of your vids
Well done to you. Im still waiting for hardware unboxed, Digital foundry, and Gamer Nexus to even mention Fsr 3.
You're doing a great job.
My man doing what no other channel or outlet is doing and in insane pace
Once again, Daniel needs to be reminded that Reflex works with vsync to auto-cap the max FPS below the monitor refresh, so you get optimal frame delivery and no added latency. Shocked he still doesn’t understand
oh thats why i was getting 116fps
But you can’t use reflex when using FSR frame Gen I don’t think
@emma6648 Man I must be late to the party🤦♂️.. . . what is reflex?
@@105rogueNvidia's version of Anti Lag
@@prajwals2793 Partially wrong. "Reflex" is Nvidia's version of "Anti-Lag+". Nvidia's version of "Anti-Lag" is called "Low Latency Mode".
Hey Daniel. I have tested FSR3 Frame Gen in Forspoken myself and from my testing I found out that you 1. NEED to cap your FPS with RTSS or any other frame cap software to 1-3 FPS below your monitors max refresh rate. 2. You NEED to maintain the FPS framecap at all times while at the same time having a few % headroom. Meaning, make sure you dont max your GPU utilization at 100%. Try it again in Forspoken and you will notice the difference. Its way more responsive and smooth if you follow my suggestions.
Example: 1. Your monitors refresh rate = 120Hz
2. Set up a FPS cap between 116 and 119 FPS
3. Change your graphic settings so that you can easily maintain the FPS cap which you set up in Step 2.
4. Make sure your GPU is BELOW 100% utilization AT ALL TIMES while reaching your FPS cap you set up in Step 2.
5. If your FPS drops below your FPS cap you set up in Step 2, it introduces higher latency and it doesnt feel smooth anymore
6. Specifically in Forspoken, change the refresh rate in the display settings menu to 120, not 240
7. Use the ingame Vsync AND force Vsync via driver to fix frame pacing issues
8. Now you can enjoy buttery smooth and super responsive gameplay
There is a problem with Frame Gen / Vsync if you hit your monitors max refresh rate without the FPS limit. I dont know why it happens.
Try it out and report back if you want and tell us if you can confirm my observation.
PS: Nice video as usual :)
in my case, in-game Vsync solved and fixed my smoothess
@@fervargraider5274 That was actually a typo. I edited my post and corrected it. You are right, Vsync has to be enabled in the game settings too. If you only use driver level vsync it doesnt feel smooth.
Hmm this can't be right. Since G-Sync isn't supported when FSG FG is enabled, limiting 1-3 fps below the monitor's max refresh rate would result in some frames being displayed twice to fill up the gap between the limit and the refresh rate. With an Nvidia GPU I got the best results when setting the in-game frame limiter to my monitors 120, then everything was super-smooth.
@@NeovanGoth I know its weird. I also tried a 120 FPS cap but that felt worse. It might have something to do with my TV/Monitor. I am using an LG C1 which has a 120Hz panel but in reality its more like 119 Hz. At least thats what the display says when enabling game mode. Pretty sure a lot of monitors actual refresh rate is a bit lower than the one its advertised with.
@@samirfa5300 Same here. I'm using an LG G3 and the game optimizer overlay always shows 119 instead of 120, I guess that's just how it works.
good job first time i subscribed to a channel in forever lol u just that good. I'm a techie and ur channel is a dream come true. I can't watch other testing channels they don't do it right and chill setup like u do. I bet ur a nice teacher.
Despite being a one-man army, a dad and full-time teacher, Daniel is giving Digital Foundry a run for their money. He's of the most hardworking youtubers that I've seen. Seriously, congratulations and thank you for your awesome content! 👏
I had same experience in Forspoken with FSR 3 on Saturday looking at it. The visual motion fluidity didnt feel like 100+ fps. The native 60 felt smoother actually so am glad you and Ancient Gameplays experienced the same thing. Immortals of Aveum however felt much better.
I have tested FSR3 Frame Gen in Forspoken myself and from my testing I found out that you 1. NEED to cap your FPS with RTSS or any other frame cap software to 1-3 FPS below your monitors max refresh rate. 2. You NEED to maintain the FPS framecap at all times while at the same time having a few % headroom. Meaning, make sure you dont max your GPU utilization at 100%. Try it again in Forspoken and you will notice the difference. Its way more responsive and smooth if you follow my suggestions.
Example: 1. Your monitors refresh rate = 120Hz
2. Set up a FPS cap between 116 and 119 FPS
3. Change your graphic settings so that you can easily maintain the FPS cap which you set up in Step 2.
4. Make sure your GPU is BELOW 100% utilization AT ALL TIMES while reaching your FPS cap you set up in Step 2.
5. If your FPS drops below your FPS cap you set up in Step 2, it introduces higher latency and it doesnt feel smooth anymore
6. Specifically in Forspoken, change the refresh rate in the display settings menu to 120, not 240
7. Dont use the ingame Vsync, force Vsync via driver or use the tool Special K to fix frame pacing issues
8. Now you can enjoy buttery smooth and super responsive gameplay
There is a problem with Frame Gen / Vsync if you hit your monitors max refresh rate without the FPS limit. I dont know why it happens.
Try it out and report back if you want and tell us if you can confirm my observation.
@@samirfa5300 I'll look into it and maybe make a follow-up vid. I tried capping it with the new driver AMD fps cap feature, frame target control I think its called, it was a stutters mess.
I'll look into what you suggested though.
I really appreciate the qualitative data that you put out. Few people do this, but its so important. Everyone else wants to only provide quantitative data, which ends up looking like frame rate drag races.
But what's the experience like? I see the frame rate results, but are those experiences otherwise comparable? The answer is often "no," and few people except for Daniel and Digital Foundry actually bother to notice the player experience.
You and Hardware Unboxed are my fave channels for this stuff. So much hard work and very much appreciated. My 3080 and 6950 thank you.
I don’t know how I feel about these FSR 3 reviews, I know a lot of these opinions are subjective, but as someone who owns a 6700XT, when I used FSR 3 for the first time, it blew my mind how forespoken immediately went from 50-55 FPS maxed at 1440p, ugly & jittery to 120 FPS much improved image quality, & responsiveness, it was like magic, I thought I was cheating. It really felt like life changing technology after living with this gpu for 6 months, that’s just my input. Looking forward to your full review Daniel. 🙏🏽🙏🏽
Bud, are you capping the frame rate with riva tuner? Or are you just doing it native? The comments seem to make it sounds like riva tuner fixes the issue he was having
Most reviews use the top-end GPU's so when they use FSR 3 the difference isn't that noticeable compared to your more mid-range GPU you are seeing a more substantial performance difference.
@@rage8010 use riva tuner itest forspoken fsr3 with my rx 6650xt setting max resolution 3440x1440
i got 25-30 native
then i use fsr3 with fg i got 60fps + but i lock with rivatuner at 60
when i move camera its smoth than native resolution or fsr3 quality without fg
but prob is i feel different while playing but when i record with obs the video nothing different or idk how to make it work to see what differen in video
Same, I have an RTX 3050 laptop that can barely play Forspoken at all, even the lowest settings possible with DLSS Ultra Performance couldn't get me over 50 FPS. The game actually crashed multiple times when I tried out running it at higher settings.
Imagine how surprised I was when I was able to tinker out a semi-consistent 60 FPS with Medium settings out of it, thanks to FSR 3. Even the input latency didn't seem that big of a deal when the alternative was the game barely chugging along at an ugly and broken 30 FPS.
@@rage8010 no I didn’t use Rivia tuner lil bro. I only used what I said, FSR 3 Frame Gen & Vsync on in-game like AMD recommended
In forspoken, deactivate Vsync and activate 120hz cap in AMD software. You can do that outside of "radeon chill" It is in the same page, but for global gaming experience, where you chose between hypr rx, quality, hypr rx eco, default.... It removes the stutters. But if you only have 120fps, you will see more artifacts.
it is just too much for casuals like me. I hope pc gaming simplify things like console does.
Yeah my hope one day is you press a 'I want 120fps' button and it just does it.
In Forspoken, turning Vsync off in-game and forcing it through the driver or Special K fixed the frame pacing issues for me.
Yeah. In-game V-Sync just does not work in this case when Frame Gen is enabled.
In my case I had to turn it on through the driver AND ingame setting.
AMD or Nvidia GPU?
In my tests with Forspoken on a 4090 it _only_ was smooth when forcing Vsync (which I did via Nvidia Control Panel), setting the in-game frame limiter to 120 (with is my display's maximum), _and_ actually hitting 120 fps. Below 120 the incompatibility with G-Sync introduced bad frame pacing on the presentation side (forcing the screen to display some frames twice in order to somehow squeeze the 80 or 90 fps into is 120 Hz refresh), while with the in-game frame limiter set to 240 (it tends to reset itself after switching to DLSS and back to FSR) RTSS still reported stable 120 fps, but movement in the game became super choppy.
What also fixed it for me, on a RTX 2070 Super, was turning on V-sync in game and disabling the variable refresh rate through my monitors controls. I kind of think VRR is not disabled automatically or it still causes issues if not forced off in my monitor settings.
Daniel got a horror movie sound effect with the kids running upstairs lol. Hilarious!!!
This is a the best fair comparison, I am glad you didn't use the 4090. Interesting how fsr3 started with the right foot... let's see how it improves
I appreciate the time and effort you put in to testing both team green and red. Very helpful for people who are not as aware of the technical specs. I'm on a 3080 but as this new gen tech keeps evolving it's nice that you take the time to delve into the intricacies of both. Thank you!
This video is great, and always is good to hear your opinion and impressions!
Alex from digital foundry gave you a shoutout a few days back. Keep up the good work Daniel!
Awesome video thank you ! I have learned more from your videos than any big channel. Your teacher skills are showing
Very in depth review.
Thanks for including 6700xt 😊
Very rarely do I come across people as enthusiastic and as informative as Daniel and having watched his channel for about 4 months now, I’m now certain that my school experience would have been so much better if I had Daniel teaching me.
He just has this enthusiasm that pours through the video and really makes it that much more interesting to watch.
I usually wouldn’t really care what the difference between FSR FG and DLSS FG is, but if it’s Daniel explaining it? I’m all in.
Camera capture helped I can easily notice the difference in smoothness
Hi Daniel, let me just tell you how much I appreciate the hard work you're going to in order to show us the REAL implications of exciting new tech. As a fellow busy dad I get the struggle and am really grateful for this.
I'd love to see frame generation used for emulators like PCSX2. You can force games to run over 60fps, but it breaks a lot of them some way or another. Thanks for the video!
Frame generation would actually be awesome with emulators that run games at up to 60 FPS, for sure.
lol at the kid running past at 19:22.
As a dad myself, I love it. Don't be too self-conscious about them randomly making their mark on your videos. You're a full time teacher, a dad, and you're (quite wonderfully I must say) running a UA-cam channel on the side, trying to see if it can expand past the point of just being a side thing. We all get it. Not too many viewers are going to be turned off by your kids being kids.
I can indeed see the jittering frame pacing at 11:23 as you point out, thanks to how to filmed this video! Thanks for the FS3 deep dives! :)
Hey brother, i fixed the FSR 3 Stutter in Forspoken. The maximum framerate must be set to 120, Vsync on, and To get the most stability and smooth gameplay , Performance mode and frame gen should be used to keep framerate at 120 even during intense fights. Graphics settings can also be lowered to maintain 120 fps throughout the game.
ua-cam.com/video/sOTAIxwWv5w/v-deo.html
That jittery behavior you saw in Forespoken, I've gotten that a lot with dlss3, in dying light 2 and in Hogwarts at 144hz. Both games if I lock to 120 it doesn't do it, no idea the cause, but it seems common to frame gen at this point.
Regarding Forspoken frame pacing: It looked as if the pacing smoothed out with FSR3 Frame Generation on when the framerate fell under vsync. Once you hit vsync seemed to be when the jutter occurred, notably in the camera panning examples you gave
I did a lot of testing and I found that the in game Vsync is the issue. When I turned in game Vsync off and used the vsync in the AMD software the jutters went away and it was100% smooth. Try that if you're having issues and lock your FPS in Rivatuner.
Good point. I think you're right.
11:15 THANK YOU! I thought I was going insane, people were saying that it felt good but to my eyes it really didn't.
This man convinced me to get the 7800xt and I’m so glad
You 're delivering excellent content! Thanks for every detail you 're sharing with us!
Best channel. Everyone just appreciate what Daniel is doing !
Forspoken's frame pacing issue could be solved by capping the fps using Riva tuner.
I'd suggest to use in-driver frame limiter, as this is the best way to lock your framerate correctly.
Hey brother, i fixed the FSR 3 Stutter in Forspoken. The maximum framerate must be set to 120, Vsync on, and To get the most stability and smooth gameplay , Performance mode and frame gen should be used to keep framerate at 120 even during intense fights. Graphics settings can also be lowered to maintain 120 fps throughout the game.
ua-cam.com/video/sOTAIxwWv5w/v-deo.html
@@stangamer1151wrong, at least generally, in game caps are usually shit
@@stangamer1151 this is false. driver frame rate limiters sucks ass when it comes to framepacing compared to RTSS. They do have better input latency but for single player games framepacing matters more. While RTSS is good, SpecialK's latent sync frame rate limiter is JUST Better!
@@stangamer1151 you can't use AMD''s own frame limiter when frame gen is enabled
I respect on all accounts that you left your kids running in the background in the video. You can always tell you’re getting raw takes from you.
Nice work capturing the smoothness on an OLED
just found your channel. mega thumps up. u seem to be exactly as nitpicky with image quality as me. and thats a good thing (for me at least). i often talk to people, that do not even "see" the issues i see in games. Your videos will be my go to in the future!!
Every time I see you have a new video I yell “OWENNN” like the old lady in Throw Mamma From the Train.
Your Forspoken experience mirrors mine. Initially I'm not sure whether it was just my setup using 60Hz display that cause it (especially since the game doesn't have 60FPS cap when FG is on) but maybe it wasn't my setup. What I felt was that the smoothness was similar to when FG is off, so in this case I think there is something wrong with the frame pacing and hopefully they can fix it soon.
Yes same, I thought it was because of my 60hz display. 40fps feels smoother than 60fps.
You need 60fps as your base when using Frame Generation. If you enable FG below that threshold you'll experience excessive lag, artifacts a lot more than you normally would.
@@jotunheim5302 I know about that, but that is not the point. The point is that it doesn't feel smoother. For example, when I ran Forspoken without FG, I can get around 40FPS. When I enable FG, because there is a bit of overhead, it doesn't do 40FPS to 80FPS but to 60FPS, which is fine and expected. What is not expected is that 40FPS looks smoother than 60FPS, so there is an issue there.
Personally I just want to test it simply because I want to know how bad it is when targeting 60FPS using FG. Yes, I know the potential image artifact can be more easily spotted, which is why I actually want to do it. I want to see how much I can spot the artifact and how low I can go with the base frame rate before the artifact becomes really bad. If it ended up still actually looks fine for 60FPS end result, I might actually use FSR3 depending on the game. A game that doesn't require fast reaction should be fine. Again, it hinges on whether I can actually spot the artifact, which right now I can't do because I don't think it work correctly in Forspoken, at least on my PC and it seems Daniel also experiencing something similar in Forspoken even on a high frame rate display.
Just a tip to switch mouse and keyboard, rather than having 2 sets, get a USB switch device. The Ugreen one works like a charm.
I have my setup for Gaming and Office. I just hit a button on that Ugreen switch and voila, all my devices switches between work laptop and personal system
oh damn that's neat, gonna get one
Yup, I believe they're called KVM Switches. I left a comment about it. Some monitors actually have one built in so you can just plug your USB device in there. I do wonder how that will affect latency though...
@@technologicalelite8076 I did not notice any increase in latency, its a USB 3.0 well built switch so no issues.
Specially with a wireless mouse and I play fast shooter games. Did not notice any noticeable latency increase
"That's how we roll over here" - Love it. Keep it real.
So from what I've seen, FSR frame gen is actually surprisingly good considering it's not using dedicated hardware
there are some issues to iron out with the vsync thing but it seems really nice. Haven't tried it myself though.
Nice work as always Daniel. Keep it up. Cheers!
I have been enjoying your videos lately (thoughts), the very first videos I saw from you didn't really land it for me. Regardless the topics you talk about are interesting to me.
A couple of months later, here I am curious about your opinion.
You are doing a great job, and I am another one of bunch who thinks the same.
I feel like an FSR 3.1 would be able to smooth out the edges with the current version of FSR 3, much like the upgrade from FSR 2 to 2.1/2.2. Hopefully, 10 series / RX 500 series GPUs can see support with this
correction: pardon my poor technical knowledge, but hopefully they find a way with 10 series / RX 500 series
It requires Asynchronous Compute. GTX 10 series supports it on paper but Ashes of the Singularity (which uses AC when available) runs like crap on Pascal. Polaris does not support AC as far as I'm concerned. I think GCN didn't support it until Vega, but I could be wrong.
@@andersjjensen I thought the same, but it seems that it can run on GCN 4, someone tested it on a RX 580
@@MrSandvich03 I just looked it up. GCN 4 strictly speaking doesn't support the full AC spec as it doesn't have the dispatch controllers (meaning the driver has to manually poll to see if it's done and get it going on the next wave if it is) but if you're right then it supports enough of it to make it work.
Great video! I hope you reach the million subscribers soon.
Heads up, Daniel: The judder in the Forspoken footage relative to the Immortals of Aveum footage may be related to the fact that your GPU was fully utilized in Forspoken but not in Immortals of Aveum. If you can control for that (perhaps by testing at 1080p), then it should produce better results.
I've got a 3080, watched some other of your videos on FSR 3.0. Without knowing too much i tried FSR 2.1 on CoD MW2. NGL that experience is great, can't even imagine how 3.0 improves things. DLSS was a** when i tried it a while back.
3:09 Daniel getting nervous because the zombie hordes outside his house are getting more rabid.
*Finally, good to see that 5000 series cards are also supported!*
Love the qualitative analysis
Would be interested to see if an RX7600 has sufficient free bandwidth @1080p to actually benefit from frame interpolation, or whether it's only a workable trick for higher end GPUs? Great video and keep up the good work 👍
excited to see where this goes
Great video! I would suggest to look into a kvm for your testing purposes and hot-keying the input on the TV.
People are saying that if you activate the frame limiter within Rivia Tuner, the frame time and fluidity within the game will be back to normal, smooth. Just set about 10 fps less than the average after you have configured it the way you like. So for example if in the native it was giving 40 fps and with the fsr3 and frame generator it goes to 120, you go to Rivia Tuner and limits it to 100 or 110, or to your monitor fps, which will cancel out this lack of fluidity that you are feeling.
I locked forspoken to 90fps with Fsr frame generation and vsync on. After that, the jitters stopped
I did the same thing .... my monitor is 165hz andI O have a 6adeon 800 so capping frames is the only solution, I can't reach 165 FPS. just used Rivatuner
As an RX 6600 user, I was happy that FSR 3 and FG were coming.
@danielowentech For those not able to reach monitor hz fps limit, just enable Fps limiter and set it to somewhat lower fps than what is achieved with frame gen, for example if achieve 125 fps average with frame gen, set fps limiter to 110~. Also, my Gsync compatible is working with the game as long as im able to easily achieve the frame gen fps (for example limiting as i mentioned), but as soon its on the limit of achieving a steady fps or withuot a limiter, it wont work. This should also make your gameplay in forspoken not as jittery, should try a fps limit of 95-110~. You can kinda see when it starts jitter if using gsync, when getting "overloaded" or on the limit of achieving steady fps, the gsync will just lock on the max monitor hz and it will feel very unsmooth. But as soon the frames get stable within a limit/lock, the smoothness is back and gsync will start follow the fps of the game again
Nvm, I misread. Disregard my comment.
Not sure what model of TV/Monitor that is specifically but on my C1 it is possible to hotkey inputs to the number buttons. I think they call it "Quick Access". I have my remote setup so I can long-press the 2 to switch to my daily pc and I can long-press 4 to switch to my gaming pc. It is quicker and less finicky than using the OSD menu for input switching.
great content, a lot of info. wish you have a spread sheet at the end of each video to summarize all your work, because it's very easy for viewers to get lost in different types of scenarios. thanks and keep up the good work. cheers
Great content! Love your dedication to graphics!
Holy cow, you're doing great work!
Did you try frame limiting Forspoken to 120 fps instead of 240 fps? That's why I did and it felt great. Though I wasn't usually hitting the frame cap so perhaps that's the issue
I found that the in game Vsync is the issue. When I turned in game Vsync off and used the vsync in the AMD software the jutters went away and it was100% smooth. Try that if you're having issues and lock your FPS in Rivatuner.
Now you should do a comparison between FSR3 and AFMF in the same game and see what the differences are :)
Bro
Too bad AFMF isn’t available in the two games FSR 3 is. It’s 12 games and not one of the 12 has FSR 3. Also already widely reported AFMF is a “dumbed down” version of FSR 3 Frame Gen
@@SolidBoss7isn't AFMF supposed to work on all DX11/12 games? I think the 12 games list is just an example.
@@SolidBoss7The list is non-exhaustive, it simply mentions those games as examples because they have Anti-Lag+ implemented iirc.
I have a RX 7800 XT and used Riva Tuner to lock my fps to 165hz and used Native AA with frame gen and had no jutters even during heavy combat in Forspoken.
Did you enable Anti lag+ ?
I think you should turn off g-sync manually on forespoken, i got that same jitter until i turned of freesync, in IOA it turns off when you turn frame generation
Thank you for your videos.
I wish there was a Frame Generation feature for video playback using FSR tech
Daniel, you're always here for us!
Question: how to we enable AFMF if we are using an Nvidia card and there is no toggle in the game's option menu.... can we somehow use adrenaline software to load the game, even tho running nvidia gear? 🎉
to use fsr3 in forspoken with correct frame pacing you must turn on nvidia's vsync in nvidia control panel for forpspoken, then in game turn off vsync and set frame rate to 120hz (it's extremely important), then frame gen with work perfectly even with gsync P.S. please like this comment for daniel to see
Forspoken doesn't work with external v-sync for some reason. If you have it off in game but in in control panel it wont work for some reason
Guess Forespoken camera pan showed here that effectiveness/performance/feel of FG can vary by the game, no surprise. Gonna need more samples than two to draw conclusions.
I think you handle the 120 fps reality vs 60fps youtube very well. No good solution there. You explained very well.
I was able to fix Forspoken's judder on my system (R7 5800x3D + RTX 3080 12GB) with in-game V-Sync On + RTSS Frame Limiter set to just below what frame FSR3 FG gave me. So Frame Generation was giving me around 90-100FPS with FSR3 Quality I locked that to 90FPS on RTSS and the judder was gone. FYI NVCP Frame Limiter doesn't fix the judder on Forspoken.
Yeah it seems that’s what you’d wanna do, I was getting 90-98fps with FG on so I turned on V sync and capped it to around 90 and it became way smoother
but in this way you will see tearing
It's about time UA-cam had an 120fps option.
In Forspoken, try switching to Borderless mode. And try to use the Radeon driver frame limiter. It might be enough to smooth it out.
It should be noted that Forspoken generally has framepacing problems, regardless of the upscaling technology used. Therefore, the results there should be evaluated with caution.
I don't have Immortals of Aveum, but I do have Forspoken. In Forspoken, I use a mouse and keyboard; when I pan around, things look normal to me, not any more jerky when frame generation is off. I tried the preview drivers and Cyberpunk 2077, but that was not a good experience. I didn't particularly appreciate that I had to turn HDR off for that. Games with AMD FSR 3 frame generation built into the game work well, and you can use HDR. I will only use AMD FSR 3 frame generation built into games. I won't use frame generation for games that don't have frame generation built into it. Hopefully, they can fix them in the future.
As a math professor, you can appreciate this question: if without generation you are already near vsync, say 100 fps, and with generation you get 120, which is 60 doubled, which do you prefer ?
Because I would say 100 real fps is better.
Hey Dan, good video, thanks! So what are your overall thoughts on fsr 3 versus dlss 3.5? Also do you think the 4080 is better than the 7900xt or xtx?
I'm interested in seeing a side-by-side comparison comparing things like stutter (which is probably difficult given different hardware) and ghosting.
Forspoken on the 6700XT with Frame Gen off you were at 95% GPU load, with FG on you were at 99%.
Try capping your frames to 120 instead of 240. Once I got the GPU load to ~90% and enabled FG the GPU load dropped further and responsiveness improved massively. Not sure if I can stand using DLSS2 by comparison.
I think in your case your base settings didn't leave enough GPU for FG to run. I'm running a 3060 so it could be that it actually runs better on Nvidia but I think your slowdowns are related to base settings.
Also saw significantly *lower* CPU usage on FSR 3 + FG vs DLSS 2. It's like a system upgrade or going back to UE4 or maybe even UE3.
Good point!
@danielowentech
One thing I just noticed is that forspoken's Fullscreen and borderless screen mods actually make the FG look even worse than native as you mentioned.
I tried switching the screen mode to Windowed option in the display settings and then revert back to borderless and it smoothed the game. Jutters occur far less than before. I couldn't feel 60fps before but somehow by switching between screen mods the smoothness of the game and frames seem to change.
So I guess the developers can easily address this issue.
Hope you see my comment.
That run animation on Forspoken is wild lol
First of all, thank you for the work with the many videos directly for the release of FSR3 😌👍🏻 And thanks again because someone finally seems to have understood what this feature is actually intended for ❗It's actually just supposed to close the gap to the maximum refresh rate of the monitor. If the existing hardware already provides a relatively high FPS number, but it is still not quite enough. FSR 3 with FG is then used to convey the smoothest possible gaming experience 😌 it is just used incorrectly in marketing 😉 in the case of DLSS 3 and above to emphasize the purchase argument of the particular company with a green logo. Basically to convince the mentally weak to spend more on something than it's worth 😋 hello Ngreedia 😏 Jen Hsun Huang 's real slogan is not "buy more save more" it's " give them less and sell it to them for way more" 🤷♂️ and they follow anyway 🤦♂️btw i didnt notice the thing you mentioned with Forspoken i tried it with my RX 6950XT on a LG34GN850P-B Ultrawide and FSR3 worked as it should 🤔 i will go back today an try it out again.
i think you are absolutly right about that. in therms of marketing, amd did a fare better job to market this tech for what it is, FLUID MOTION FRAMES. where as nvidia is marketing FG as performance tech and how faster your 40 series gpu now is and how big the performance uplift from gen to gen was this time
fsr 3 really seems to help out apus i have a lenovo lefion 5 with a rtx 3070 an a ryzen 5800h. i dsabled the rtx 3070 an tested just the apu graphics and i was able to play Immortals of Aveum with out it being dreadful
I feel like FSR3 works quite well in Forspoken as long as it runs under the max refresh rate. On my 120hz panel, running the game at 90-100 fps I think feels pretty good. When jumping to 120 (I am forcing vsync in control panel) it feels juddery
I was so excited for frame generation. I actually really like that "soap opera effect" that people complain about in TV's and i expected frame generation to be something like that, but when i got a capable Nvidia card i realized that i wasn't missing out on much and the game looks and feels smother when frame generation is off, even if the counter says that I'm like 10 fps lower.
I think a hybrid approach to capture would be best. A camera has a softer and more natural feel, where the frames naturally blend a little bit more together, but capturing clean gameplay at 120 Hz and then slowing it down to 60 Hz would show us the imperfections more clearly. Even if it's not really representative of the real experience, it should work when comparing FSR to DLSS, because they're both equally disadvantaged.