If you can add a sheet of metal under the magnets to connect their bottom poles, the field will be much, much stronger. 5-6mm mild steel at a minimum should do it. Thicker is better.
Look into Halbach Arrays. By placing magnets in-between the alternating magnets you can move most of the magnetic flux lines to one side of the disk increasing the magnetic field on one side and weakening it on the other side. This will increase the flux density passing through the pan. I would also consider placing the magnets under the rim of the pan so that more metal passes through the flux lines instead of the far smaller amount passing through the base. Try imagining how the flux lines look, or you can use magnetic films to see how the fields are shaped. Then arrange all the pertinent parts accordingly. Remember, metal has a high thermal conductivity which means thermal energy will quickly equalize throughout the pan.
Hey the first thing that noticed is when the aluminum pan would get HOT but that plexiglass didn't warped or melt from the heat of the aluminum pan. Or is that that over glass? Aluminum pan, on. And I noticed there is a lot of editing??? On an induction stove the pan needs to be metallic where a magnet would stick to it for the induction to work.
The motor on a lot of treadmills is about 1 hp ~ 745 watts. Did you put a watt meter on the motor and see how much power it drew as compared to resistance heating with the same power?
Doesn't induction cooking require pots or pans that are magnetic? The first one you tried wasn't magnetic. I'm not sure the second one was either. There will be a transfer of heat with a pot/pan that isn't magnetic but it won't really cook very well -- sort of like what we saw here. Curious to know if the second pan was magnetic or not. Cool vid!
If the pan were magnetic, we wouldn't be able to hold it in place! It would be attracted to the magnets. You need a pan with a nice aluminum/copper base, these are good conductors, which induce the eddy currents. The first pan was aluminum, but was very thin. The second pan was thicker aluminum, which worked better.
impressive but i do have a question. The eddy currets originated a force on the pan, that's why u needed to use a glove to hold it in place. Well, how does a comercial intuction cooktop prevents that?
Id like to know more about the heating watts btus etc. How long does it take to heat water etc. How big are the magnets and what types pls. I loved the video.
Yes, though not like this... by charging a battery threw a charge controller powered by a dynamo turned by a stationary bike. Potatoes take too much power for too long so skip the hash browns or cycle you butt off or days and days charging up like 3 deep cycle marine cell batteries... personally I gave up, as I was happy with sausage and eggs.
Heavy Flywheel best bearings money can buy maybe geared for higher rpm and no drag clutched drive mechanism so when ur not pedaling the petals disengage. The Heavy Flywheel would have the biggest effect on my food actually getting done 🤣🤣
A couple of thoughts here. Rather than increasing the strength of magnets wouldn't you have done just as good or better if you had just put them closer together (adding more if needed)? It is the up and down of the field that creates the current, so a quicker flip from N to S would have done the trick, right? Second question... I wonder if this used significantly less electricity than a typical stove top? It would seem that rotating the magnets should use less electricity, but I don't know about how much resistance the motor had due to the proximity of the aluminum.
Good question! The alternating polarities is what induces the eddy currents, but a stronger magnetic field will create stronger currents. We are still in the process of figuring out how much energy we used to cook the egg...what the video doesn't show is that it actually took around 10 mins to cook the egg, once the pan reached temperature, which took another 5 mins or so. So my guess is that it wasn't really energy efficient. The induction stoves that you can buy for your kitchen are supposed to be much more energy efficient though.
@@KJMagnetics Look into Halbach Arrays. By placing magnets in-between the alternating magnets you can move most of the magnetic flux lines to one side of the disk increasing the magnetic field on one side and weakening it on the other side. This will increase the flux density passing through the pan. I would also consider placing the magnets under the rim of the pan so that more metal passes through the flux lines instead of the far smaller amount passing through the base. Try imagining how the flux lines look, or you can use magnetic films to see how the fields are shaped. Then arrange all the pertinent parts accordingly. Remember, metal has a high thermal conductivity which means thermal energy will quickly equalize throughout the pan.
Try a shaft version, make a long rotation shaft and place magnets around it, maybe connect a motor to it by belt or gears, then wrap copper pipe all around the shaft, i seen a guy do this just with a large diameter pipe, only issues might be heat and magnets
Loved the video 👍👍 You guys need some more time on the flywheel balancing tho ... Im wondering is there a point at wich increasing rpm,s doesnt provide any further advancements in current delivered ?
The question running through my head is whether this arrangement is optimal. What if the magnets were alternating in polaraity with the poles pointing same-poles at each other? Besides being much more difficult to make and put together, I wonder if more wicked field changes could translate to a hotter pan when spun. ... might be less, I really don't know.
Some of the turbine jet cars use a similar concept for braking. Magnets mounted on the car that can be servo moved close/far from the wheel that has a copper brake disk.
Yes. Although they have to rotate very quickly. I'm curious to know if the power consumption used in spinning the magnets would worth the hassle. I can see thus being a alternative method of a boiler system. Maybe wind power geared to rotate at the proper rpm
Why use aluminium? Is there a reason to not use a material with lower skin depth (steel, iron, etc.) which is what is normally used with induction cookers? _EDIT:_ I watched the rest of the video and it's pretty evident that the second pan is _not_ aluminium - why else would you need to hold it in place? That's why it heats up so quickly (and to higher temperatures too).
I tried to reproduce the experiment. I used a 775 dc motor and 40*40*10 N52 magnets same 8 magnets. But I found my motor is not powerful enough. The aluminium pan damps the motor too much. I can only achieve electro braking not baking.
Use glass instead of plexiglass and aluminium plate instead of wood, also remember that a commercially engineered one would be a 1000 times better .. It said that with a much higher rpm 3000 i think, you dont even need metal, at that frequency water will boil with rotating magnets..
Sorry guys but you will not reach significantly high temps with aluminium or copper due to their conductivity. That's why induction manufacturers advise not to use them. You need to use iron based pans for best results as eddy currents are best absorbed and dissipate heat..
Turn the wheel with a magnet facing the edge of the wheel, and you have unlimited power, or turn the wheel without using power. That's the trick to succeed.
Eddie Carlson's 1959 conception of a spinning building, introduced at the 1962 World's Fair, the Seattle Space Needle, turns via a simple sewing machine engine using myriad wheels and cogs [track & wheel]. It would seem that with a bit more thought, one so equipped could also conceive a model of today's K&J Magnetics demonstration which uses significantly less... is the word power/watts/volts/idk..source efforts to power..
Using this online tone generator, I guess the sound made by the device is about 160Hz (160 cycles per second, or 9600 RMP). www.szynalski.com/tone-generator/ Using this bike gear ratio calculator, I worked out that if the axle of this device had a 100mm circumference 'wheel' on it to interface with a bike tyre on a bike wheel of 630mm, every bike wheel rotation would = 6.3 rotations of the axle. To get 160 axle rotations per second, the wheel would have to rotate 25.4 times per second (16,000mm p/s = 57.6 km/h). With a peddling a 10 toothed cog driving a 75 toothed gear on the wheel - peddling at 60 cycles per minute (one per second), the wheel speed would be 58km/h. www.bikecalc.com/gear_speed/ It's doable manually (peddle) with standard bike gear - and even more easily with changes to gearing.
This was actually discussed as a possibility...but couldn't get any takers who wanted to exercise that much!! We were spinning the disc at around 1600 RPM
Very cool...er...HOT!! One more interesting way to cook an egg, right up there with using a high power blender in high for long enough (heating through mechanical agitation) 🦊
So…what if you scale this up to planetary scale and use the Sun’s magnetic field on the Earth’s iron core/magnetic field? I’ve tried a couple times to find any data on thermal effects on the Earth caused by the Sun’s magnetic field and solar prominences. The data is sorely lacking for some reason…
The Earth rotates around its axis once every 24 hours, the Sun's magnetic field flips once every 11 years. Both are such low frequencies that they have absolutely no effect on Earth's 5000+°C core.
@@computermaster360 😂 “Absolutely no effect…” I don’t see “climate scientists” using such short time scales to describe the impending doom that is about to befall us.
@@computermaster360 I love how you think that the Earth’s and Sun’s magnetic field are so simply explained in a couple sentences like they are simple bar magnets. Keep trying, though.
very big mistake. you musnt turn magnets very fast it can break the adhesive and can hit you as a bullet. why you dont use a hf ac induction coil with zvs.
What's the point in using magnets for heating if you still are using electricity to power the motor turning your magnets. Totally pointless experiment.
The idea of a hand cranked backpacking/camping stove is very intriguing
Can we use ferrous pan
If you can add a sheet of metal under the magnets to connect their bottom poles, the field will be much, much stronger. 5-6mm mild steel at a minimum should do it. Thicker is better.
Look into Halbach Arrays.
By placing magnets in-between the alternating magnets you can move most of the magnetic flux lines to one side of the disk increasing the magnetic field on one side and weakening it on the other side. This will increase the flux density passing through the pan.
I would also consider placing the magnets under the rim of the pan so that more metal passes through the flux lines instead of the far smaller amount passing through the base.
Try imagining how the flux lines look, or you can use magnetic films to see how the fields are shaped. Then arrange all the pertinent parts accordingly. Remember, metal has a high thermal conductivity which means thermal energy will quickly equalize throughout the pan.
Hey the first thing that noticed is when the aluminum pan would get HOT but that plexiglass didn't warped or melt from the heat of the aluminum pan. Or is that that over glass? Aluminum pan, on. And I noticed there is a lot of editing???
On an induction stove the pan needs to be metallic where a magnet would stick to it for the induction to work.
This is awesome! it would be great to see the same thing in a halbach array.
The motor on a lot of treadmills is about 1 hp ~ 745 watts. Did you put a watt meter on the motor and see how much power it drew as compared to resistance heating with the same power?
We didn't do that, but it would be interesting! There was definitely a lot of resistance holding the pan in place. It was very noticeable.
Doesn't induction cooking require pots or pans that are magnetic? The first one you tried wasn't magnetic. I'm not sure the second one was either. There will be a transfer of heat with a pot/pan that isn't magnetic but it won't really cook very well -- sort of like what we saw here. Curious to know if the second pan was magnetic or not. Cool vid!
If the pan were magnetic, we wouldn't be able to hold it in place! It would be attracted to the magnets. You need a pan with a nice aluminum/copper base, these are good conductors, which induce the eddy currents. The first pan was aluminum, but was very thin. The second pan was thicker aluminum, which worked better.
@@KJMagnetics did you have to hold the pan with two hands? curious
Were you using ludicrous speed ? Better be carful you don't hit plaid speed.
impressive but i do have a question. The eddy currets originated a force on the pan, that's why u needed to use a glove to hold it in place. Well, how does a comercial intuction cooktop prevents that?
Id like to know more about the heating watts btus etc. How long does it take to heat water etc. How big are the magnets and what types pls. I loved the video.
Could you try the double magnets on their side,
Interested to see if the extra flux points help.
Shouldn't a cast iron skillet heat up faster and much hotter than the Aluminum pan due to the higher magnetic attraction of iron?
Nope, it's the induction of eddy currents that heats up the pan. The better the conductor, the more eddy currents.
Question. How many watts did the engine use to rotate the magnets?
possible to get a human to run to spin the magnets fast enough to cook anything?
@@sabujpattanayek8799 doing so would decrease the current state of the diversity of human widths
I wonder if one could pedal a stationary bike fast enough to cook their Breakfast? Lol
Yes, though not like this... by charging a battery threw a charge controller powered by a dynamo turned by a stationary bike. Potatoes take too much power for too long so skip the hash browns or cycle you butt off or days and days charging up like 3 deep cycle marine cell batteries... personally I gave up, as I was happy with sausage and eggs.
Heavy Flywheel best bearings money can buy maybe geared for higher rpm and no drag clutched drive mechanism so when ur not pedaling the petals disengage. The Heavy Flywheel would have the biggest effect on my food actually getting done 🤣🤣
Great idea
Which can save energy magnet or induction heater?
what the speed / rpm of the motor ? great video thanks
A couple of thoughts here. Rather than increasing the strength of magnets wouldn't you have done just as good or better if you had just put them closer together (adding more if needed)? It is the up and down of the field that creates the current, so a quicker flip from N to S would have done the trick, right? Second question... I wonder if this used significantly less electricity than a typical stove top? It would seem that rotating the magnets should use less electricity, but I don't know about how much resistance the motor had due to the proximity of the aluminum.
Good question! The alternating polarities is what induces the eddy currents, but a stronger magnetic field will create stronger currents. We are still in the process of figuring out how much energy we used to cook the egg...what the video doesn't show is that it actually took around 10 mins to cook the egg, once the pan reached temperature, which took another 5 mins or so. So my guess is that it wasn't really energy efficient. The induction stoves that you can buy for your kitchen are supposed to be much more energy efficient though.
@@KJMagnetics Look into Halbach Arrays.
By placing magnets in-between the alternating magnets you can move most of the magnetic flux lines to one side of the disk increasing the magnetic field on one side and weakening it on the other side. This will increase the flux density passing through the pan.
I would also consider placing the magnets under the rim of the pan so that more metal passes through the flux lines instead of the far smaller amount passing through the base.
Try imagining how the flux lines look, or you can use magnetic films to see how the fields are shaped. Then arrange all the pertinent parts accordingly. Remember, metal has a high thermal conductivity which means thermal energy will quickly equalize throughout the pan.
@@josephcoon5809 you try
While watching this, I kept thinking: "How many engineers does it take to cook an egg?" lol
What's the magnets and the pan this be useful
how much energy would it be used cook ? since we have products like induction stove
Weird did you hear the motor decelerate once you removed the pan ??
Roughly how many rpm are needed pls ? Thank you.
It's a Great invention video. But I wanna know that how much rotation per minutes at least is needed for disc for that edy current? Sir
Ferris iron pot?
Could you guestimate the speed of the rotor? Thanks!
At its fastest, it was spinning around 1600 RPM
Try a shaft version, make a long rotation shaft
and place magnets around it, maybe connect a motor to it by belt or gears, then wrap copper pipe all around the shaft, i seen a guy do this just with a large diameter pipe, only issues might be heat and magnets
Loved the video 👍👍
You guys need some more time on the flywheel balancing tho ...
Im wondering is there a point at wich increasing rpm,s doesnt provide any further advancements in current delivered ?
What were the rpms??? Can you use a bike setup to do some cooking??? On second thought, you would need to switch the spin 90°, too much gearing...
will the magnets loose thier gauss at some point
Why did you have to hold it down? You don't have to hold down pots & pans on induction cook tops.
Halbach array would have been better utilization of the magnets. Also, the magnets could have been moved to a larger radius for higher velocity.
The question running through my head is whether this arrangement is optimal. What if the magnets were alternating in polaraity with the poles pointing same-poles at each other? Besides being much more difficult to make and put together, I wonder if more wicked field changes could translate to a hotter pan when spun. ... might be less, I really don't know.
This is awesome!
Do magnets also heat up?
Thanks
Only slightly!
Try the base of the pan like a magnetron slots matches on the magnets
Some of the turbine jet cars use a similar concept for braking. Magnets mounted on the car that can be servo moved close/far from the wheel that has a copper brake disk.
OMG, please add OIL to that pan!
Butter or ghee....! 😋😎👍
if i fry egg this way, my wife is gonna kill me
Dude, great video. I am just wondering if this could be turned into a hot water heater?
Yes. Although they have to rotate very quickly. I'm curious to know if the power consumption used in spinning the magnets would worth the hassle. I can see thus being a alternative method of a boiler system. Maybe wind power geared to rotate at the proper rpm
Why use aluminium? Is there a reason to not use a material with lower skin depth (steel, iron, etc.) which is what is normally used with induction cookers?
_EDIT:_ I watched the rest of the video and it's pretty evident that the second pan is _not_ aluminium - why else would you need to hold it in place? That's why it heats up so quickly (and to higher temperatures too).
the double fisted hold has my curiouslity
I tried to reproduce the experiment. I used a 775 dc motor and 40*40*10 N52 magnets same 8 magnets. But I found my motor is not powerful enough. The aluminium pan damps the motor too much. I can only achieve electro braking not baking.
I don't know much - just learning here but, wouldn't cast iron being a ferrous metal produce the better effect?
What if you replaced those magnets with neodymium magnets? How much amount of heat will be produced? Just curious.
Those are neodymium magnets!
have you tried with cans? gj btw
Cool experiment!
Hi interesting stuff, I'm aware that aluminium has an effect on magnets to slow down the travel, could this be affecting things??, Thom in Scotland.
I didn’t think induction cooking worked with ALUMINUM cookware. I thought it had to be reactive to magnets, which aluminum is not…correct?
Different use of magnets, caused the heating...
my thoughts as well - but?
Eddy currents are used in metal recycling to sort aluminum.
+1 for Spaceballs reference :D
What is earth magnetic force?
Use glass instead of plexiglass and aluminium plate instead of wood, also remember that a commercially engineered one would be a 1000 times better ..
It said that with a much higher rpm 3000 i think, you dont even need metal, at that frequency water will boil with rotating magnets..
interesting - show us
any one got the name of the first song that plays? please and thank you would you kindly tell me it?
Lol, the speed controls for the treadmill.
I have those on my fabrication grinder's motor control. The last speed setting after plaid is "F*ck you"
Expensive way to cook an egg. Cool
So saving massive amounts of electricity is expensive hey
Sorry guys but you will not reach significantly high temps with aluminium or copper due to their conductivity. That's why induction manufacturers advise not to use them.
You need to use iron based pans for best results as eddy currents are best absorbed and dissipate heat..
Lol copper is more coductive than iron by the way
Depends on the frequency. See shop.panasonic.com/support-only/KY-MK3500.html
Is it ised for lager scale heating
Is it used for large scale heating
Turn the wheel with a magnet facing the edge of the wheel, and you have unlimited power, or turn the wheel without using power. That's the trick to succeed.
If you place a bifilar pancake coil instead of pan, the coil will generate more watts than needed to rotate motor; you will achieve overunity.
No. You absolutely will not achieve over-unity. Over-unity is impossible in energy conversion. Try it yourself if you do not believe.
That seems much more efficient than anything else you can cook with a couple watts vs thousands you could probably boil water by pedaling
the peddle idea is interesting
Eddie Carlson's 1959 conception of a spinning building, introduced at the 1962 World's Fair, the Seattle Space Needle, turns via a simple sewing machine engine using myriad wheels and cogs [track & wheel]. It would seem that with a bit more thought, one so equipped could also conceive a model of today's K&J Magnetics demonstration which uses significantly less... is the word power/watts/volts/idk..source efforts to power..
Nerd level 9000 I approve
This is awesome...!! Love this channel
Why dont u use all south pole all or north pole at all..? Its more efective...
You need a changing magnetic field...using all one pole would not create a changing magnetic field.
You need a UNIVERSAL MOTOR.
Methinks some are capable beyond 5000rpm, with speed control.
Propane stove spider for the Skillet.
you guys are awesome :)
“This is bullshit, pan down - I want BUSH”
I am Italian, high gas prices and the need of pasta brought me here
LOL rocket stove made of old/used cans or a hillbilly fire hole in the ground fed by twigs/paper is cheap
Using this online tone generator, I guess the sound made by the device is about 160Hz (160 cycles per second, or 9600 RMP).
www.szynalski.com/tone-generator/
Using this bike gear ratio calculator, I worked out that if the axle of this device had a 100mm circumference 'wheel' on it to interface with a bike tyre on a bike wheel of 630mm, every bike wheel rotation would = 6.3 rotations of the axle. To get 160 axle rotations per second, the wheel would have to rotate 25.4 times per second (16,000mm p/s = 57.6 km/h). With a peddling a 10 toothed cog driving a 75 toothed gear on the wheel - peddling at 60 cycles per minute (one per second), the wheel speed would be 58km/h.
www.bikecalc.com/gear_speed/
It's doable manually (peddle) with standard bike gear - and even more easily with changes to gearing.
So we need more and stronger magnets,am I right?
Magnet power consumption vs induction heater
Modify by adding copper plate
It is my experience that the pans need to contain ferromagnetic materials so your aluminum pan won't work unless it has a magnetic layer in it.
looks like lexan to me and not acrylic.
Next test, set up a stationary bike and see if you can cook an egg with human power and magnets. What was the RPMs of the disk?
This was actually discussed as a possibility...but couldn't get any takers who wanted to exercise that much!! We were spinning the disc at around 1600 RPM
Watch this sprint bicycle champion trying to toast bread on human power alone: ua-cam.com/video/S4O5voOCqAQ/v-deo.html
Maybe the use of an old foot treadle sewing machine. Up the size of its fly wheel for more power then gear it down to spin the magnets faster maybe
this is how the ancients would cook
Yep the Egyptians had advanced induction cooking and heating
@@horus2779 imagine the slaves spinning a giant wooden wheel which is connected to a gearbox... Which spins a disc on the master's table
Treadmill motor speeds are amusing 0:40
Its is actually high in EMF, in short not good to your health
Very cool...er...HOT!! One more interesting way to cook an egg, right up there with using a high power blender in high for long enough (heating through mechanical agitation) 🦊
Drilled magnets, really?
Would you like to share this egg with me. Ha ha ha... amazing Lahore, Pakistan.
Next step- using air pressured motor.
Brilliant )
So…what if you scale this up to planetary scale and use the Sun’s magnetic field on the Earth’s iron core/magnetic field?
I’ve tried a couple times to find any data on thermal effects on the Earth caused by the Sun’s magnetic field and solar prominences. The data is sorely lacking for some reason…
The Earth rotates around its axis once every 24 hours, the Sun's magnetic field flips once every 11 years. Both are such low frequencies that they have absolutely no effect on Earth's 5000+°C core.
@@computermaster360 😂
“Absolutely no effect…”
I don’t see “climate scientists” using such short time scales to describe the impending doom that is about to befall us.
@@computermaster360 I love how you think that the Earth’s and Sun’s magnetic field are so simply explained in a couple sentences like they are simple bar magnets.
Keep trying, though.
very big mistake. you musnt turn magnets very fast it can break the adhesive and can hit you as a bullet. why you dont use a hf ac induction coil with zvs.
Jeny Thorium what adhesive? Magnets were screwed down.
Amazing mw
u kitchen plate in the kitchen works exactly the same nothing new
太陽の黒点か！
どうなってる？のだ
Very cool. Pretty HOT too.
What's the point in using magnets for heating if you still are using electricity to power the motor turning your magnets.
Totally pointless experiment.
With crazies trying to kill gas stoves this may become our only option. :-( .... until they try to ban magnets too just to be even more cruel.
Go Vegan. #GrillMoreFruit.
.
A Scientific Vegan
Don't eat fake meat!
Dumb. Boring. Waste of time...