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something odd i noticed is Aeriths position changes so she was never in the radius of where Sephiroth was stabbing. the camera panned to then show Aerith was behind Cloud or at least Cloud thought she was.
We need to look more closely at the function of psychic links between worlds and what they tell us: The lifestream rejects Aliens because they aren’t bound by its rules. Sephiroth is born of the planet and slipped into the lifestream, with his mother’s alien abilities intact. The lifestream encompasses all time. Sephiroth can telepathically communicate through the lifestream to other worlds and times and communicate with other versions of himself. His mother’s alien abilities allow him to do this. Aerith proves that those born of the planet can’t do this at will. She requires the planets blessing to communicate with past/ dream world versions of herself via the White Materia. Using it like a time phone. Cloud and Zack both have S cells which allowed Cloud to see from Zack’s POV from time to time. It also allowed them to Synchronise between worlds in “together as one”. One other commonality is that all of them seem to require a “living” host to broadcast and act through whether in the real world or dream world. None of them can just manifest without a connected vector. Also, if Cloud falls into the lifestream, he could potentially broadcast his consciousness through time as well. Not sure if it will be relevant to the plot though.
Sephiroth executed a very specific plan to gain leverage over Cloud in this end scene. He set Cloud up to parry his blade, smiling and observing with twitching eyes, anticipating, hoping that Cloud can pull it off. He enhanced Clouds strength, making him strong enough to kill the MidgarSormer, in preparation for this moment. The black whispers led us here, the white whispers tried to stop us. He needed Cloud to be strong enough to fracture off a new dream world. A dream of a living Aerith. (A Aerith who wasn’t supposed to have the white materia) This will be leverage next time he asks for Clouds help. “Help me merge the worlds, it will bring back your friend” Cloud will say yes. Nothing new happened here by accident. The theme of the game is accepting death. In part 3 we will be aligned with Cloud in saying yes at the mid game, rejecting death. We will then come around for the endgame, rejecting Sephiroths plan and accepting death on a ludonarrtive level by beating the game. We will then get our “tearful farewell”
You're actually making a very convincing argument that this isn't a sequel. In fact, I've just realised they've done this before. A few years after Advent Children, they released Advent Children Complete, which is basically a more coherent and 'complete' version of the existing movie.
This is more of the kind of analysis we need from people, instead of them just blindly dismissing this ending because it's either too different or too confusing. Let the team cook. We still have one more game in the remake trilogy.
It's crazy how much even the hardcore theory crafters overlooked so much of this stuff. There are big ff channels that said "The ending has so many issues" because they didn't understand things. The ending didn't have issues, the ppl who thought they were hardcore ff theorists did. Rebirth is a Masterpiece.
I don't think this means it doesn't have issues. I just think it means they prioritized hinting at things to come (which again we have yet to see if it pays off) over just giving us the trauma we expected. I think they could have played the Aerith death scene straight like in the original and then show a sequence of Cloud rewriting it in his own head after the fact. That way people wouldn't have been so confused, and I wouldn't spend so much energy trying to comprehend what was happening instead of just feeling the events that were unfolding the first time I played the game. Having said that I enjoy the story a lot more for these elements and mysteries. I enjoy interpreting and watching other peoples interpretations. But I think it could have been executed a little bit better.
@@Blag_Cog They dont show her death sequence with the water, because they want to convey the whole "is seeing her all in clouds head or is she really there in some sense" narrative. They say this all leads to advent children, so him seeing her is his guilt over her death. But they want to make you wonder still whats going on. It adds new elements to the game rather than "lets just do it exact" They want to make the emotions and breakdown of cloud bigger Is what i think in part 3. He is going to absolutely lose it.
A shame how people tend to skip over the Glenn part. It think it's important in that it supports the eeriness of what we saw in the previous scene, as in we see a dead person talking to someone who thinks they're alive. Even the color scheme is the same. Don't think it's a coincidence at all.
Exactly this! When I was playing I was irritated about this scenes placement until I realized the relevance. They literally show cloud seeing someone that no one else can see and cut to a scene with a reveal of using someone's old death and new presence to haunt a character into a provocation that starts a war. Feels pretty intentional when you know cloud's next move 😅
I just love how Cid's comment isn't just a good gag. Barrett says that Cloud had better be able to carry the weight, and immediately after Cid says "no more heavy loads, we're at capacity as it is" and it's just a wonderful comment on Cloud's mental state; Cloud is 100% at capacity and cannot take any more "heavy loads". I do truly believe that Aerith is trying to keep Cloud together by making him think she's ok as a desperate attempt to stop him breaking and going full black cloak clone. He's so much further gone in this game than he was in og. I wonder how much Aerith divulged to Tifa. They have quite obviously talked about Cloud's mental state and they both echo that he won't become a degraded clone. I doubt she told Tifa she was going to die, but I'm certain there's a plan that Tifa is going to try to see through on her own, which is why she's hesitant to say or do anything to jeopardise Cloud's dwindling sanity (as well as her own grief obviously).
You get it bud! Nice one!! Not many people are getting it. Leads into another comment I seen, "its like a second home" she's telling cloud she's gotta go back to the altar to finish her prayer since sephiroth "interrupted it." She's keeping him sweet, but still keeping tabs on him, making sure he doesn't completely lose it. Clouds not in the right mind to accept her death just yet, and aeirth knows that. Also i 100% think tifa told aerith that cloud somehow knew every single move zack made during the nibelheim mission, even quoting sephiroth word for word! That's one thing I really wanted more of in rebirth. I wanted to hear the conversations aerith and tifa were having in private about zack and cloud. What does tifa think about cloud knowing all of that stuff?
The blood splatter was such a good touch. On a basic level I think a lot of people can see the shrinking away and denial in Cloud's movements when Sephiroth splatters the blood in his face but one of the ways it's so great is it mirrors how traumatic it was for Cloud to see all the blood on Tifa in Nibelhiem. He literally says "I saw all the blood" when he's talking to Tifa on the rooftop and the thing is that is true, that's one of the things that really happened and affected Cloud so strongly that even though he's influenced by Jenova he still possesses that true memory. In the flashback the camera zooms in on Cloud's hand with Tifa's blood on it showing how much of core memory it is. In his eyes he failed Tifa in Nibelheim and now he's protecting himself having now failed Aerith, the blood is too much for him to see.
Watching your take in the ending scene, I noticed two things, when the fight against Sephiroth ends, Cloud ignores the entire party and goes towards Aerith, but they don't show the group's reaction, they simply disappear and my impression is of that they saw Cloud pick Aerith up and say "Aerith, wake up". Man... that must have been the most disturbing thing for them, because the second thing I was going to say is that Barret and Tifa, before they get into Tiny Bronco, they act like they saw "THIS" during the scene in forgotten capital. They know cloud is completely lost because of that.
This part of the interview might be interesting to some. Interviewer: That's another thing I was curious about. In the original game, Cloud has that memorable line: "My fingertips are tingling. My mouth is dry. My eyes are burning!" However, it would seem those lines aren't spoken this time... Nojima: For my part, I felt that things like "tingling" and "burning" could be conveyed purely through the visual elements of the production, and that there was no need for them to be expressed through dialogue. I figured that even if the lines were absent, people familiar with the original game would be able to hear Cloud's voice clearly in their head. Toriyama: I can't say much about that sequence of scenes, as I want to encourage a variety of interpretations from those who see them. However, I will say that after consulting with Nomura, we settled on an approach where we inserted a sort of flashback scene where you can see Cloud shouting those lines from the original game. My interpretation for now : The part where we see Cloud speaking the og lines could be Cloud experiencing the OG memories instead of just blocking it out.
I hope they include them - Nojima's comment reads as a bit short-sighted. Those lines are very powerful to hear, and imo EASILY are not the kind of thing we would just feel naturally from seeing him look distraught. The vocalizing is the point, because for Cloud it is seemingly a new sensation, one that just completely wrecks him in the moment. That they went for a different direction for the scene/impact this time is fine, but I just hope we hear that scene in part 3, its really really powerful. That being said, I think a lot of people feel very confident about what we may see in part 3 as the resolution to this open-ended scene, but I wil personally just be happy if it is directly referenced and we get at least some part of if not the entire water burial scene. (I really would like to see Aerith stabbed like in the original, to see all of the party members react to her dead body, and THEN the water burial, but i'll accept just the burial because its important thematically/narratively)
Underrated channel. You should have way more subscribers and views. This is just as educational in terms of videography and cinematography as it is an FF7 analysis. Awesome content.
This was excellent. I never saw him placing her in the water. That was a great spot. Something i wish a lot of people talked about is when he places the Black Materia in the Buster Sword. The evil in Cloud is apparent when walking and talking to Barret. He is In a constant shadow.
What people miss, when barret mentions, it's a heavy load, and he best be ready to carry it. He's saying to Cloud, when you're a leader, you'll lose people as he lost Biggs, Wedge, and Jessie. So when cloud responds quickly with essentially "Yeah im fine with that" hes essentially saying hes okay losing them. Its so dark.
I loved this breakdown! As a long time FFVII lore man myself this was awesome to watch! One thing not mentioned, was how in the JENOVA LIFE fight, reflective of everyone's emotions, every party member enters with an automatically full limit break. Except Cloud, whose limit bar is empty.
Very insightful dude, kept my attention for the duration. And appreciate the optimism rather than "they're screwing it up" lol. Helps me be a bit more satisfied with what's happened. All I can add is those shots toward the end with aerith watching the bronco fly away are reminiscent of the old ps1 disc change / key art, where shes gazing up at the Highwind. Also equipping black materia maybe = meteorain skill for cloud in part 3? Kinda the one cool thing we've yet to see from OG.
"Also equipping black materia maybe = meteorain skill for cloud in part 3? Kinda the one cool thing we've yet to see from OG." Oh shit, good call! I didn't think about that. I would say you're 99.99% correct with that one.
i agree with most of the comment, but meteorain is definitely not the "one cool thing" we haven't seen yet. there's knights of the round, the golden chocobo, omnislash, ruby, sapphire, ultimate, diamond and emerald weapons, and etc
I think the depth that comes from the fact that yes he's not completely himself and is in denial, is so profound because he's also really being interacted with by aerith in the lifestream. Like the party's perspective is that he's in denial, and they are not wrong, but what he's actually interacting with when he's talking to aerith is not made up either. Just something that unfortunately makes it harder for him to face the truth. It's crazy the levels of this and can set up for some very cool potential party/friend dynamics in the story going forward. Really good takes on a lot of this breakdown. I'm glad I felt the same about a lot of this stuff and I'm not alone haha
I agree completely. I think the developers were going for a "yes, and" style of implication. Everything we're seeing is true in a sense, except Cloud's fractured existence makes it hard to reconcile. I particularly dislike the framing that "Cloud must have failed and is simply deluded" because we're given visual confirmation of the rainbow effect while it happens. Cloud is confused partly because, in his truth, he really did stop masamune. But from the outside where it literally didn't appear to happen, he must be crazy. Both can be true if there are two worlds superimposed.
41:15 Alex Moukala did sent a video to maxdood weeks ago. Basically he puts the melody with the jenova theme chords in the background. AND IT FITS PERFECTLY. LIKE WHAT?
@@tatsuma0503 You can see a clip of the discussion here: clips.twitch.tv/BashfulEnthusiasticFloofPanicBasket-BCjfnp0r0OQo8sBe I think it could be coincidence, but it certainly seems convenient how well Jenova's melody fits on top of that creepy arpeggio.
@@tatsuma0503 I think UA-cam didn’t let me post a link, so 40:39 I’ll try to disguise it: m_twitch_tv/clip/BashfulEnthusiasticFloofPanicBasket-BCjfnp0r0OQo8sBe Just replace the underscores with periods for the link.
47:13 I think Zack is in the main party’s world too. Especially since the flowers are alive at the church. They were gray, but one, in the dream world Zack was originally in.
I don't get it, Zack is dead in our world. Can 2 Zack exist in the same world, is there need to be worry about paradox. One more question if Zack is in our world and if Cloud saved Aerith in one of the dream worlds like where supposedly Zack survived at the end of remake, what's stopping in bringing back Aerith the same way to the party's world?
@@sujithg6902 well if Zack is dead in our world there wouldn’t be 2 Zack’s, there would only be one if the Zack that’s alive is currently in our world. Also, I don’t think Aerith lived in any world. I think either Cloud is imagining it, or Aerith is making him imagine it to try and protect him. She’s able to operate still in the lifestream after death since she’s an ancient
I want to see a Zack resolution scene where he visits Gongaga one last time to give his parents some closure and to witness Cissnei's reaction. That'll be quite emotional I reckon...
@@BLa-lq2bs Based on your interpretation, wouldn't that also apply to Aerith. She died so if she was to come back to the main world just like Zack, there would now be only one Aerith. Hell why stop just with Zack & Aerith, they could bring back the whole of Avalanche as well.
Thank you for making this, so cool Also, “No promises await at journey’s end” is reminding me a lot of “Even if the morrow is barren of promises, nothing shall forestall my return” (Genesis/Loveless) Too much of a long shot?
Hear me out guys, when we arrive at the forgotten capital we are blocked by a wall of whispers, same as remake before the fight with fate. Cloud says “aerith” and three whispers from behind him open a portal, which im sure we can agree are the whispers sephiroth controls. When cloud goes through the portal i believe he ends up in a different world and he actually does save a different world aerith, but our main timeline aerith ends up dying, After she is stabbed we see the rest of the party rushing in because the whisper wall vanished, not through a portal like cloud did. I think thats something important. So i believe there is still a chance she is out there in a world waiting for cloud to find her. I can be totally wrong after all this is just my theory. 😁
Even befire thag, when Seph is explaining to Cloud the nature of reality, Seph baits Cloud into striking him. And he does so, right in front a portal which Cloud passes through upon striking Seph, "I give you, my blessing"... 🤓
It very much looks like Cloud is the one in control of those 3 black whispers. He walks towards it very calmly and commands them to open a rift. This is either Sephiroth's "blessing" (presumably this is when he receives the black materia) or the empty white materia bestowing him this power.
Yea I wouldn't surprised if its seph that made him do all this cuz it does seem like he is also the reason for zack being alive. There are theories that seph is purposely creating alt worlds as each world draws from the same lifestream thus weakening it all together. There is only so much lifestream energy to go around and weakening it to control it makes sense. Aerith was actively tryna stop cloud with the white whispers I believe but cloud ultimately does the unthinkable and breaks fate, kinda. I think he can't really affect the fate of the real world but only create an alt one in which she lives. So yeah, I do think there is now an alt version of aerith created via cloud but she will likely fade away after defeating sephiroth cuz I dont think the alt worlds are really meant to exist. I do think the theme is a bit nihilistic in that its basically saying her fate is predetermined and there's nothing cloud could do bout it which ultimately is in opposition to the tagline of defy fate but idk. I personally want cloud to find a way to save her but I understand the want to keep her dead.
Sephiroth executed a very specific plan to gain leverage over Cloud in this end scene. He set Cloud up to parry his blade, smiling and observing with twitching eyes, anticipating, hoping that Cloud can pull it off. He enhanced Clouds strength, making him strong enough to kill the MidgarSormer, in preparation for this moment. He needed Cloud to be strong enough to fracture off a new dream world. A dream of a living Aerith. (A Aerith who wasn’t supposed to have the white materia) This will be leverage next time he asks for Clouds help. “Help me merge the worlds, it will bring back your friend” Cloud will say yes. Nothing new happened here by accident..
I personally think aerith is gone gone but i’m not completely sure yet. Before watching all the theories I was thinking along the same lines as you. I was fairly confident even before finishing rebirth that part 3 would culminate in some kind of ultimatum from sephiroth. From a story telling perspective it seems like the obvious route. Help me and i will save her. A palpatine/anakin situation if you will. And thus at the climax of the story having cloud choose to let her go completing his arc. But then I wonder what is all of aerith’s scheming for?
@@Kitth3n I think I see it along the same lines as you originally saw it. I see Omni-Aeriths scheming as necessary counter play to maintain the natural order. There seems to be an internal logic & Rules to how characters communicate across Time and Dream Worlds. Sephiroths Alien life force allows him to transmit telepathically through the lifestream once he’s in it (the reason the lifestream rejects alien life, they aren’t bound by its rules). Aerith can’t do that at will, but the planet allows her to use the white materia as a line through time and worlds. Clouds S cells are what allow him to transmit through worlds the same as Sephiroth. Aerith used Sephiroths own technique against him by passing Cloud the information of her white material and transmitting it back to his world. Because of this the Aerith in the dream world will still be in play, she will be informed of the chess moves necessary to stop Sephiroth. She wasn’t supposed to have this knowledge. In addition to this it provides an answere to the clear Materia issue. What will fill it and why? In Cosmo canyon the game states “if the lifestream is memories, what about hopes and dreams? We remember those don’t we” “The black material was once the purest materia made black by spite” - implying it was once white transformed. It is formed of the Gi’s hopes and dreams of Oblivion, suggesting that black and white material are born of hopes and dreams instead of regular memories. I predict that as we play the game we will jump back and forth from Aeriths dream and it will eventually fill out that empty materia and serve some key purpose. It’s also a meta narrative. In the late 90’s thousands of people signed the petition to bring Aerith back to life. The devs are not re-writing history but giving us an in cannon manifestation of these hopes and dreams. A dream of what would happen if Aerith was still alive. This will help win the day on the surface world where the plot will play out almost beat for beat. But as you say, Cloud and the player will have to let go by the end of the game.
@@mettatonneoex is the soul sovereign in the FF7 world….? Dang… that’s a good question. I lean towards yes. Though the nature of Jenova & Sephiroths manipulation of spiritual energy does sometimes seem near instantaneous. I think the “good” ending will be very similar to the old ending. But with knowledge of more possibilities, a richer understanding of the experience of life & our hopes.
I agree with Sleepezi regarding TIfa with the thought that Cloud killed Aerith. Sephiroth throws the blood onto Cloud, The party runs in and sees Cloud with Blood … But sephiroth turned away with “no” blood .. In the next game, cloud under the impression that aerith is alive while fighting with Tifa that you did it. And later on Sephiroth telling cloud the same story that he killed aerith; which would help break him down along with showing him the truth of nibelheim
Very awesome analysis! However, at 8:59, you talk about Cloud thinking he’s Zack when that just isn’t true. He took on Zack’s heroic stories to form his SOLDIER/hero persona, yes, but Cloud himself doesn’t think he’s Zack. If he did, he would’ve called Gongaga his home, he would’ve immediately recognized Aerith, he’d call himself Zack. This is an important detail that is sadly misconstrued by the fan base.
If Cloud didn't think he was Zack then we would have played as Zack during the entire 1st chapter of Nibelheim flashback. Edit: Oh I understand. Essentially Cloud doesn't think that "he is" Zack but thinks that he was in the moments that Zack was originally, he barely started remembering Zack on the return to Nibelheim.
@themadgamer4571 replying to your edit: Yaya, Cloud inserted himself as Zack in his own memories to make himself seem like a first class soldier, when he never was.
@@themadgamer4571 To your edit: Yes, Cloud simply believes he was the SOLDIER in Nibelheim, not Zack. That's why he believes himself to be a First-Class SOLDIER.
25:46 also lowkey the way he looks crazy and weird swaying his head like that- I cannot lie he looks insane from tifa’s view 😭 and knowing tifa is scared of cloud falling apart it must’ve been terrifying
also, to me at least, his eyes look more dead in her perspective then in his imaginative dream, there’s not a single light casted in them, they are slightly red snd tired, st least dark and there’s a shadow casted on them
48:34 You talk about how neither Aerith nor her dress react to the gust created by the Tiny Bronco. But look here 57:15 where they do. Developer oversight? Or two Aeriths in the final cut-scene?
In the credits roll. They show every single scene in rebirth. But for some reason the scene at the water where they put aerith to rest is "missing" until the scene at the end where aerith said goodbye. The dev is cooking on this one for sure. That last one is the real aerith while everything else before that is just hallucinations
Yeah its bugging me too, i think cloud that seen aerith was jenova or his delusional mind playing. Meanwhile aerith that say goodbye and telling cloud to look up are the real one. Remember the dev love red herring clue in the last game.
There are two Aerith in the game atm: Remake Aerith and Future/ Advent Children/ Original's Aerith. The one fighting against Sephiroth at the end of game and control White Whisper is Future Aerith. Remake Aerith has told Cloud about Future Aerith in Costa Del SOl's beach. (Chapter 6)
@@putrahardjono4409 I dont think so cuz its implied that future aerith is in fact the one cloud went on a date with. By the end of the date, it seems seph kills her which makes sense as an aerith from the future is probably sephiroths biggest obstacle in all this. He even says something bout how he's been lookin for her in this scene implying she has been hiding. Her line delivery of "its been fun", also seems very final, almost like a final goodbye which to me means she knew the moment she sees cloud again, seph would find her but she needed to do this to give him the materia and also that she wanted to spend her final moments with him. This has precedent in the On The Way To A Smile novel in which aerith can sense seph in the lifestream but doesn't outright confront him. Instead it seems she just tries to meddle in his plan thus leading to Advent Children instead of fighting him directly as she says it dangerous. Anyways, to me, the two possibilities are it was a spirit of the remake aerith fighting or it was an alt version just created by cloud. I don't know how to grasp the 3rd person delivery cuz I think its possible that either version of aerith could speak this way. The spirit can say it as she literally saw it happen with her own eyes but knows it failed. The alt version can be sayin it in a way that she saw him succeed but she is not "his" aerith. The tone of the line also seems like a "thanks for trying" kinda thing as I do believe alt aerith will likely be fated to die anyway, most likely due to the alt worlds being erased by the end of the game similar to what happened in the dream dates world. The way I see it, I think alt aerith will be present but is tryna help cloud from an alt world. By the final fight, the worlds will merge and she will join the party for one last final battle. After the defeat, she will have one last talk with cloud bout how everything isnt his fault and that this is what she wants or smt. I think the end goal of aerith was to stop seph but to also avoid Advent Children and the death of humans which is the implied ending. Personally, I hope we can save her and that cloud and the other really can change fate on their own but I understand if OG fans want to keep it the same.
@@Pringlessingles The one on the date with Cloud is indeed Future/OG Aerith. As it is "Her Dream" to have a date or conversation with Cloud as from On The Way To Smile. That's why Cloud said to her "You're weird". Because she is not behave like Remake Aerith. Sephiroth kill Future/OG Aerith? I guess you underestimated her too much. She is a Survivor type. She has been fighting Sephiroth using White Whisper for the entire Rebirth story. That's why at the beginning of final Battle between Cloud + Future Aerith VS Sephiroth. Sephiroth said to her "I must admit. I underestimated you". Plus, during the battle she said to cloud “Cloud, I saw what you done for me (Remake Aerith) back there. Thank you”. She is the one controlling White Whisper, of course, she saw what happened there. As the one talking to Cloud at the very end of the ending and said "Good Bye" is Remake Aerith. They like to banter each other.
@@putrahardjono4409 that makes sense though I guess which version of her appeared is really up in the air till the next game. I personally still believe it’s remake aerith with the memories of the Future aerith as she gained them through the white materia. The glow when receiving seemed to signify something happened and to me it means memories are transferred. In costa del sol, we know aerith lost some memories and her materia is clear. To me it means that during remake, she had all her memories of the future aerith but seph attacks her with the black whispers and thus she loses them. Future aerith gets wind of this and must transfer her materia to cloud and is where shes killed. In a sense future aerith is alive cuz you are your memories, but i think even with the memories shes still somewhat different. Anyways this is all speculation and i do think either situation can be plausible. I think I said before but I just want aerith to live, open up a flower shop and hangout in tifas bar with everyone. I’m a bit tired of bittersweet ending especially with how depressing the world seems to be right now. Thanks for havin the conversation, it’s always fun to theorize.
'The Rainbow Light' So I think of the game like this: Time and destiny are moving in a straight line, like a tree. OG FF7 is the trunk of the tree. Everytime someone now messes with time and the planet's destiny a branch is born, and this is visualized by this rainbow light. We see that when Zack has to make a choice in the subway tunnel: Help Cloud or Help Biggs?When ever a new branch is born, a new worlds are created, also evidenced by the Zack scene since he ends up going to Shinra HQ and by Biggs. Two branches. Every branch and every twig are a little different. And so that rainbow light is clearly Aerith's doing. Proof of this would be when she shoves Cloud into a portal in the flowerbed and ends up where what Sephiroth calls "the true nature of reality," there is a Rainbow around the flowerbed portal. That Aerith is clearly the Aerith from the OG game, hiding in a world that has execpted its fate, but I digress. Basically the Rainbow Light to me seems to be Aerith creating new worlds that are sure to end but then be recycled, and Sephiroth is all out there cutting down trees and gathering them up so he can rule over them, as a God, for eternity. I believe he wants never ending suffering and that's his end game. Gosh, once you try to one small things with this story you end up with a tangled mess in your lap.
The part in the ending when Aerith said, it's okay "it's like a second home". In Japanese she said "it's okay this is a Cetra's place". Therefore the double meaning "the lifestream OR the City of Ancients" is unlikely (unless if we extend the argument to also say that the lifestream too is a Cetra's place??) Interestingly, there is one line not in the ending that Aerith said that may feel like a double meaning in Japanese, but not in English. The line when in Temple of Ancients before handing the Black Materia (fake) to Cloud, Aerith said "no matter what happens, I'm here for you" in English, but in Japanese she said "何があっても 一緒だよ” the part 一緒 (issho) usually means together, as in we're in this together/i'm with you; but the same phrase could also be read/meant as "it is the same". So, it can be either means: whatever happens, we're together OR whatever happens, it's the same.... now what's the same? no matter what we do here, the outcome will always be the same?? That is the real question :D
@Philip A real blink and you miss it moment at the end when Rufus is flying back over Midgar...the sector 6 plate is back- Dream Pheonix has a good cook on this and I was wondering what other content creators think about it. Great video as always.
Excellent analysis! Notice that at 37:30 where Cloud “wakes” Aerith up, the music playing is a part of CLOUD’s theme, not Aerith’s. I think that’s significant.
I was surprised that you pointed to the OG at 52:16. There was a scene earlier with Zack and Elmyra where they looked up and saw the tear in the sky. I’m not convinced these other worlds are “dream worlds”. I believe these are remanifestations of the Lifestream and the people in it, and that Sephiroth is building things up to give Cloud an ultimatum that if he kills him, he kills all the Lifestream manifestations.
As a fellow student of film, I want to thank you for making this video. The amount of wild, uninformed videos about this ending is almost maddening. I'm glad someone came to almost the exact same conclusions I had upon my second viewing of the ending.
omg am so happy to finally find your video. Your point of view and approach answer every questions that merged in my head since i finished the story of rebirth. Thks you for sharing this with everyone. I think you are totaly understand the pure art and details of this amazing work for this entire remake of FFVII Man, really thks youuuuuuu
What made me surprised is when the whispers were forcing cloud to ready his buster sword, the tapping icon is trying to tell the player to resist the whispers, but a lot of players mistook it as an indication to strike down Aerith. 37:44 suddenly plays the FF7 main theme for some reason. “It’s like a second home” in JP was “this is where the Cetras used to live”.
That translation makes it much more plain - Cloud thinks Aerith didnt die and him asking if she 'needs help getting back' is not to the lifestream but him knowing he saved a different world version of her or whatever, it is because she is telling him a story (either literally or in his head)- that she is going to remain at the forgotten capital and keep praying to stop Meteor. That explains why that conversation reads to some as a bit uncanny - beacuse its not true. The last time Aerith we know really spoke to him, she told him to focus on himself so SHE could defeat Sephiroth, and when he says He will defeat Sephiroth she asks him to promise, and reverts to her overly cheery self. That also lends some credibility to the idea that Aerith is trying to spare him from completely emotionally collapsing in this moment. He literally thinks they just flew off and left her there to do her cetra business. It's actually kind of simple, but a lot of people are overlooking/overthinking this I feel.
We need to look more closely at the function of psychic links between worlds and what they tell us: The lifestream rejects Aliens because they aren’t bound by its rules. Omni Sephiroth is born of the planet and slipped into the lifestream, with his mother’s alien abilities intact. The lifestream encompasses all time. Omni Sephiroth can telepathically communicate through the lifestream to other worlds and times and communicate with other versions of himself. His mother’s alien abilities allow him to do this. He is evidence of why the planet rejects all alien life. Omni Aerith proves that those born of the planet can’t do this at will. She requires the planets blessing to communicate with past/ dream world versions of herself via the White Materia. Using it like a time phone. Cloud and Zack both have S cells which allowed Cloud to see from Zack’s POV from time to time. It also allowed them to Synchronise between worlds in “together as one”. One other commonality is that all of them seem to require a “living” host to broadcast and act through whether in the real world or dream world. None of them can just manifest without a connected vector. Also, if Cloud falls into the lifestream, he could potentially broadcast his consciousness through time as well. Not sure if it will be relevant to the plot though.
I find the scene where Cloud says ‘Aerith, wake up’ the most interesting. He is calm, no tears and the way he says it is almost like an order. I think that’s why she stayed with him and the group until the tiny bronco took off.
I think when Aerith says "its like a second home" she's referring to the forgoten capital. She goes there to pray for stoping meteor but Sephiroth interrupt her. So Cloud craft this in his head to explain himself why aerith is no longer in the party.
Duuuude. Damn I've been trying to figure that one out... makes so such sense... clouds totally OK with aerith "not being in the party anymore" because she's gotta go back to the altar to finish her prayer... sick that you noticed that. Not many people have touched on that line. Good job!
@@CAeuJohno123 and I think Clouds gotta rationalise it too. He is susceptible to believe whatever as long as he doesnt have to be reminded of the truth. If he challenges it logically, he will start to break down but his denial mechanism will kick in and he will try to rationalise it.
Incredible work! 🙌🏾 Just to add, in the OG, it is Jenova who says "You're just a puppet" rather than Sephiroth. I wonder whether that means it is Jenova's will over Sephiroth in Rebirth 👀
In all the frames where Aerith is definitely dead, there is no rainbow effect and blood is visible on Cloud’s hand. There is no blood in all the rainbow shots. I think that Cloud, having repelled Sephiroth's blow, was able to create a reality in which Aerith is alive. And Cloud is in a kind of superposition, being able to observe several realities at the same time. The rest of the group sees only one reality (except for Tifa, something is definitely wrong with her after the Lifestream) in which Aerith is definitely dead. I also have an idea that since Cloud's psyche is divided into several persons, then in this scene we see several different mental states of Cloud. It is possible that in part 3 of the game we will see all these reunions.
But even in the scenes where rainbows surrounds them, Aerith is still acting like she was killed by Sephiroth -- In Cloud's arms and laying on the ground. If she was saved in another timeline, then why is she not standing/kneeling or being more lifelike?
@@HXXXXWXXN Sephiroth answer on this question: Confluence of world's. This is exactly the same as Sephiroth being simultaneously in several worlds during the battle with him. In one world Aerith must die for cast Holy so she die :D
@@thebrigade7684 Yeah, I'm in the "She's dead" camp. I'm sure there's way to interpret the scenes to make it seem like she was saved, but I think the arguments against her being alive are way stronger.
The sword wasn't moved at all. They are 2 different visions: 1 like the original game when it stabs through Aerith's back and planted to the ground. The blood running below it is from Aerith body - still in kneeling position, held by the sword. 1 as the whisper-created vision / reality where Cloud successfully deflected the sword, sending it flying away. The whisper-created vision might be how Aerith fight against Sephiroth's manipulation over Cloud's mentality. She created such vision to safe-guard Cloud's mentality. It's important for the final 7 seconds. And yeah, true Aerith is possibly not killed either in the Church nor the altar. She's always with Cloud. It might be the trick she plays out using the white / transparent materia.
Thanks for uploading this. I had a lot of questions with the ending and was very conflicted with it at first, but thanks to your video I feel a lot better about the ending and the direction they took!
Aerith’s clothing doesn’t react to the puff of smoke from the Bronco but does react to the wind as it takes off. This makes me wonder whether the Aerith Cloud is talking to at the end is another hallucination, especially since her dialogue is mostly things she’s said before. However, in the scenes where she isn’t talking to Cloud I think we can still infer that she does have an actual spiritual presence.
Not a hallucination. The timelines split, creating a world where Aerith lived and one where she died. Cloud sees both worlds at once. So he sees Aerith and no one else does.
My personal theory about the white whispers is that they are controlled not by Aerith, but by the planet/lifestream. I think in the Forgotten Capital, the white whispers wanted Aerith to die by Sephiroth’s sword, as that lead to the planet’s safety in the original continuity. This aligns with how the white whispers surround Cloud as he lays Aerith on the floor to begin fighting, as it mimics the original scene of Aerith being laid to rest in the original continuity, which again, allowed her to protect the planet from the lifestream. Sephiroth and the black whispers (which he controls), conversely, want Aerith to die by Cloud’s hand to more thoroughly break him, similar to his attempt to get Cloud to turn on Tifa. Sephiroth’s grin when the screen flickers and he pulls his sword from Aerith is him acknowledging that even though Cloud defied both fates, Sephiroth still got what he needed and knows there’s much more to come. To me, that slight grin is a moment of surprise, as if it’s not quite what he expected, but he’s still pleased with the outcome.
I cant wait for all the "hardcore" ff 7 fans to come out with a "i was wrong about the 7 remake trilogy" after the third one comes out. Your video was spot on with my interpretation.
Absolutely loved the ending. Was trying to wrap my head around what was happening on my first time, but over a short amount of time this became was of my favorite endings to a game with a TON of things to decrypt and think about. This scene was way more impactful to me than the original scene (i played the OG in 2005 after seeing Advent Children, so it had a different impact). But this has become my favourite game of all time. Rebirth gives me a feeling i havent felt since Kingdom Hearts 2 & FFX ❤️ Thanks for you videos! 😁
Amazing breakdown, Phillip. FYI I don't think the final cinematic takes place in Rocket Town, but on the Northern Continent: it's to the west of the Temple if you look at the map. (The Northern Continent doesn't turn snowy until the very edge of the map we get in Rebirth.)
At 22:08 there is pink lifestream flowing behind Sephiroth. At the end of OG after the Omnislash Sephiroth dissolves into pink lifestream. Some of which flows into Cloud and doesn't exit. The moment in Lifestream Black where Sephiroth made Cloud his core.
So just to point out as when Aerith mentions its like a second home, if you read : The maiden that travels the planet is a story about Aerith the moment she passes away, her experiences her feelings her connection to the planet, actually the Lifestream or how her connection towards it, she even references that being the promised land, a place full of energy/life pretty much everything Shinra wants, I wonder if technically in order to use Holy, would a Ancient need to sacrifice themselves in order to use this? because in the actual read she needed to be in the lifestream in order to be able to achieve the grand success of stopping Meteor. - Have a read I for 1 had put a massive connection with Rebirth and its just perfect but I must admit, amazing theory and broken down info on your videos, I love how you view things as its so similar to mine :) keep it up! looking forward to the next video! hopefully u bring up the read! haha
48:27 Aerith turning towards Cid is the same shot used in Advent Children when she and Zack are walking off into the light at the end. I think that Aerith really does talk to Cloud when he's cradling her the first time. I think this is "Omni-Aerith" trying to keep Cloud from breaking in that moment. Sephiroth needs him to break and give in to despair so Sephiroth can control him. During this time, you see the lifestream energy emanating from her. After the battle, though, you don't see that. So she's definitely dead when he tells her to open her eyes. Deep down, I think Cloud knows Aerith is dead. He never speaks to her when anyone else is around. Subconsciously, he doesn't want anyone challenging his version of reality. I have a problem with the idea that Aerith had to die to defeat Sephiroth. In the original game they wanted to avoid the "heroic sacrifice" cliché. The whole idea was that death is something that can come out of nowhere and is very rarely dramatic. This point was reinforced by the party pointing out that Aerith didn't seem to plan on dying when she left the party. It would be odd to backtrack on that point if they're keeping this project in line with the OG. There's also no Jenova Aerith. Yes, Jenova can assume those forms but she needs a host for that. We see this clearly with Glen and Sephiroth. Anytime there's an interaction, there's someone infected with Jenova nearby. There are times when only Cloud can see Sephiroth without a black cloak but there are black Whispers involved. I don't have a problem with Aerith being dead. It's the way the story happened but it really makes me question the reason for the way Remake ends. I'm hoping Part 3 answers that but as things currently stand, it strikes me as a cynical and manipulative decision. There's other things I'd love to discuss (mostly positive or questions) but I think this comment is long enough.
What a great analysis! Im definitely gonna subscribe to your channel. Your theories definitely hit my same points of my theories. It makes me more excited for Part 3 and im still thinking about this game. And I've only finished this game 2 weeks ago at the time commenting.
Small little music note, at 24:10 you get that synth sound that overrides the piano doing the jenova notes. The moment it switches from Sephiroth to Jenova being in control. Cool little moment.
I'd like to note something prior to this and mainly noticed it when I saw another playthrough. But the wall of whispers that prevents the party from going to where Aeris is also broken open by other black whispers to give the opportunity for Cloud to enter. Effectively, the black whispers wanted only Cloud to enter. And a further previous sequence where the lifestream coming from a crack in the sky and turning into black whispers further cements the idea that they are the will of a planet that have chosen to side with or are being manipulated/corrupted by Sephiroth.
Yes, thanks for noticing the small details that a lot of people miss, I thought the ending was well done and loved how they tied it together with hints and specific framing instead of telling/spoon-feeding everything to the player. There is a lot of information throughout the game and even NPCs can hint at things early on. Still crazy love this game.
This video was fantastic man I hope one day maxmillion dood watches this video bc I thought I knew most of the ending but u opened it up even more for me!
This is the greatest deep dive of the ending I’ve seen. Absolutely incredible eye for seeing what most of us were couldn’t. We were seeing through such clouded eyes… until now.
Thanks a lot for your detailed explanation. If I remember correctly, someone already confirmed that this is some kind of multiverse but I think it is not the same kind of multiverse than the Mavel multiverse. I like the comparison to dreams and I hope that is more along those lines. Since the rest of the game is a lot like the original, I think the third part will be like the original as well and only add new perspectives and a new lore that explains what happens rather than to alternate the events that happen. I would add some things. 1. If Arith decides to change the event that sword was deflected, than Sephiroth would most likely not be that convinced that he won, which is shown by his smile. So he did this himself or the planet changed this and Arith is not in control over the white whispers (at least not until she actually died) but they decide to "help" her. The explanation of Sephiroth stabbing Arith in the church feels of timewise and would rather result in just her bleeding or being dead rather than changing the position of the sword. 2. Why does Arith in the end does say that she will stop meteor? Sephiroth did not cast it yet and even can't since he has not the black materia. Cloud says he will stop him so even if she is only his imagination, than he would not imagine her thinking that he will give the black Materia to Sephiroth. Or he does think that he will give it to him because he is controlled by Jenova but than is the question why he would imagine that Arith will stop meteor. This feels off and must feel even more so for people not knowing what happens in the original. Either way I appreciate the hard work that you put into that and the amount of details you point out while we se the scenes. I was looking for that but only find people talking how shit this is (even after they played 100h of a game that hit nearly every note and improved so much) or people that talked about how good this is and what crazy thinks happened but not showing prove of it. Shure the scenes are no prove of it either, but your explanation is very understandable. THANK YOU!
Love the analysis. My ‘97, middle school self desperately wants Aerith and Cloud to end up with a happy ending together. But my mind knows that a major part of what made OG FF7 so impactful was the real sense of loss at Aerith’s death. What can I say, I love her character so much. I’m extremely thankful for Briana and Cody’s performances, brilliant stuff. Love your theories. I agree that things are far simpler than many YT theorists supposing. I subbed and I will catch you for sure when Part 3 drops.
I LOVE how you broke these shots down and what you said at 7:36 I so agree with you know that i think Aerith was the one that moved the Masamune. I think she knows that the White Materia is still important and that in order for her to be the last contingency plan if the White Materia fails to counter act Meteor like in the OG game when it was too late to stop it. She has to die to ensure that. Sephiroth I think is just trying to mess with the timeline in anyway possible now to make it change in any way. Much like when people go back in time in the cartoons and sneeze and kill off all the butterflies in the future. He’s trying to make ANY changes. But I think he wanted Cloud to save Aerith cause would he give Cloud that clue at the end of Remake? Seph laughing is kinda funny. I think he might be laughing due to the irony of the death. I wonder if the reason he tells Aerith before that final battle “I underestimated you” was because he didn’t think she would go through dying again. Yeah. This could be a video in and of itself. Sorry I’m rabbling about this but I LOVE this shot analysis and what it could mean. Added: I had a feeling that Bizzaro Seph was going to be in this game but yes I was SHOCKED as well. In the Japanese, Bizzaro Seph’s name is Reborn or Rebirth Sephiroth so yeah was t entirely surprised by it. That’s why I think the last games is going to break from then R naming and be named Seraphim or Seraph to reference Seph’s Safer Seph form (Safer was the bad localization translation and it should be Seraph or Seraphim. So that’s why I think it’s going to go that route. Just waiting til they announce the game now.
Has anyone ever looked at scene of Cloud laying Aerith back down at 22:11 in reverse? The movements of him laying her down look off, i wonder if it's just the scene of him picking her up to hold her hand to his face in reverse.
I gotta hand it to you Phillip, you nailed a lot of lores that I wasn't quite familiar with but couldn't put my finger on, Excellent astute observations. Some I caught but others I did not and that was because there was so much going prior to the final battle and afterwards. I cannot wait to see which of your theories comes to fruition in the final installment of this trilogy. Either way, we are gong to have some great character building. Even though the storyline is in the perspective of cloud, I agree that he has become an unreliable narrator and thus we get a more clearer storyline through Tifa which I think works great in a literary standpoint for the storyline. The ending definitely broke me when we see the party fly off and we see Aeris seeing them off and uttering goodbye. Developers did it again for me just as they did for OG and more.
I'm not sure if anyone else has pointed this out, but the mosaic design on the altar is very tentacle-like which is a motif usually associated with Jenova. And in every shot of Aerith, she's directly in the center, making it look like tentacles are spreading from her. I keep thinking about this, unsure if it means anything but a really neat detail regardless! As always, love your breakdowns ❤
The White whisper was in Masamune sword is because Omni Aerith is trying to `Shield` it from Cloud eye where it actually thrust through Aerith body. When the sword landed into ground, the white whisper is leaving the sword , that is when we player see the blood. N white wishper continue to surround Cloud Eye here n there. That is when we see the Aerith alive in a second and then dying in another second
Hey Phil, I want to know your opinion: I've been thinking that one of the new elements they could add to the plot is that Sephiroth makes Cloud see that he was actually the one who killed Aerith. By the way, we agree that Cloud places Aerith's hand on his face because she is simply dead and couldn't do it herself. Great video!
I wonder if there is any significance to the visuals of the floor under Aerith. The pattern on the floor makes it look like tentacles are coming out from that spot under Aerith. Probably a few ways that could be interpreted.
This was probably the best breakdown of FF7 rebirth cutscene from a cinematic standpoint. I liked how you touched on the points of AC and how Cloud is existing between two worlds, not that he is just merely being controlled by Jenova the entire time, which I think is a weak theory. What I noticed at the 34:28 mark where you skipped the gameplay. At the very start of that fight Aerith says: "I saw what you did for me Cloud, Thank you". I assumed she is referring to when Cloud stopped Seph from killing her; there's no way she didn't see the whole thing. The vibes are the same when Aerith thanks Cloud for his "choices" during their date, despite fate, Aerith wants to see where Cloud stands, even though ultimately Aerith is deciding her own fate. That seems to be one of the biggest differences from the OG, instead of Seph outright killing Aerith, the producers want to give Aerith more agency and have her be a sacrificial salvation figure like Jesus Christ and die on her own terms.
Philip You are right about the multiple worlds being similar to FFX but its even more developed for FF7. They are worlds constructed in the lifestream out of thoughts and memories so in this sense it is very similar to FFX's Zanarkand except instead of using an altered copy of a soul (Tidus for example) they involve actual souls that can appear there and have some self awareness within them. In a way its more realistic than FFX and they fit the lifestream model. The fact that they depict the future also has to do with how the lifestream works. In this model we see that souls are able to crossover (as we have seen with multiple characters.) IMO this is the only way the multiple worlds actually make sense
Before getting to this scene I had heard peoples saying this scene was mishandled but watching it myself I understood what they were going for. They really want to make clear how broken and in denial Cloud is. In a way that they likely couldn't have conveyed in the original. It's gonna be cool to see how they play this out in the 3rd game. On a side note, I hope we get some kind of true Advent Children scene in the next game.
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Didn’t she tell cloud to not worry about Sephiroth… but at the end of the game she encourages him to fight him. Maybe this isn’t Aerith at all?
something odd i noticed is Aeriths position changes so she was never in the radius of where Sephiroth was stabbing.
the camera panned to then show Aerith was behind Cloud or at least Cloud thought she was.
We need to look more closely at the function of psychic links between worlds and what they tell us:
The lifestream rejects Aliens because they aren’t bound by its rules.
Sephiroth is born of the planet and slipped into the lifestream, with his mother’s alien abilities intact.
The lifestream encompasses all time.
Sephiroth can telepathically communicate through the lifestream to other worlds and times and communicate with other versions of himself.
His mother’s alien abilities allow him to do this.
Aerith proves that those born of the planet can’t do this at will. She requires the planets blessing to communicate with past/ dream world versions of herself via the White Materia. Using it like a time phone.
Cloud and Zack both have S cells which allowed Cloud to see from Zack’s POV from time to time. It also allowed them to Synchronise between worlds in “together as one”.
One other commonality is that all of them seem to require a “living” host to broadcast and act through whether in the real world or dream world. None of them can just manifest without a connected vector.
Also, if Cloud falls into the lifestream, he could potentially broadcast his consciousness through time as well. Not sure if it will be relevant to the plot though.
Sephiroth executed a very specific plan to gain leverage over Cloud in this end scene.
He set Cloud up to parry his blade, smiling and observing with twitching eyes, anticipating, hoping that Cloud can pull it off.
He enhanced Clouds strength, making him strong enough to kill the MidgarSormer, in preparation for this moment.
The black whispers led us here, the white whispers tried to stop us.
He needed Cloud to be strong enough to fracture off a new dream world.
A dream of a living Aerith.
(A Aerith who wasn’t supposed to have the white materia)
This will be leverage next time he asks for Clouds help.
“Help me merge the worlds, it will bring back your friend”
Cloud will say yes.
Nothing new happened here by accident.
The theme of the game is accepting death.
In part 3 we will be aligned with Cloud in saying yes at the mid game, rejecting death.
We will then come around for the endgame, rejecting Sephiroths plan and accepting death on a ludonarrtive level by beating the game.
We will then get our “tearful farewell”
You're actually making a very convincing argument that this isn't a sequel. In fact, I've just realised they've done this before. A few years after Advent Children, they released Advent Children Complete, which is basically a more coherent and 'complete' version of the existing movie.
This is more of the kind of analysis we need from people, instead of them just blindly dismissing this ending because it's either too different or too confusing. Let the team cook. We still have one more game in the remake trilogy.
It's crazy how much even the hardcore theory crafters overlooked so much of this stuff.
There are big ff channels that said "The ending has so many issues" because they didn't understand things. The ending didn't have issues, the ppl who thought they were hardcore ff theorists did.
Rebirth is a Masterpiece.
WIthout love, it cannot be seen.
Exactly!
It's too bad that everyone who hated it is like Cloud since he's not facing the truth with clouded eyes
I don't think this means it doesn't have issues. I just think it means they prioritized hinting at things to come (which again we have yet to see if it pays off) over just giving us the trauma we expected.
I think they could have played the Aerith death scene straight like in the original and then show a sequence of Cloud rewriting it in his own head after the fact. That way people wouldn't have been so confused, and I wouldn't spend so much energy trying to comprehend what was happening instead of just feeling the events that were unfolding the first time I played the game.
Having said that I enjoy the story a lot more for these elements and mysteries. I enjoy interpreting and watching other peoples interpretations. But I think it could have been executed a little bit better.
@@Blag_Cog They dont show her death sequence with the water, because they want to convey the whole "is seeing her all in clouds head or is she really there in some sense" narrative. They say this all leads to advent children, so him seeing her is his guilt over her death. But they want to make you wonder still whats going on. It adds new elements to the game rather than "lets just do it exact" They want to make the emotions and breakdown of cloud bigger Is what i think in part 3. He is going to absolutely lose it.
A shame how people tend to skip over the Glenn part. It think it's important in that it supports the eeriness of what we saw in the previous scene, as in we see a dead person talking to someone who thinks they're alive. Even the color scheme is the same. Don't think it's a coincidence at all.
Plus they were hinting all game long about Jenova’s ability to impersonate people.
Exactly this! When I was playing I was irritated about this scenes placement until I realized the relevance.
They literally show cloud seeing someone that no one else can see and cut to a scene with a reveal of using someone's old death and new presence to haunt a character into a provocation that starts a war.
Feels pretty intentional when you know cloud's next move 😅
Glennova…
I just love how Cid's comment isn't just a good gag. Barrett says that Cloud had better be able to carry the weight, and immediately after Cid says "no more heavy loads, we're at capacity as it is" and it's just a wonderful comment on Cloud's mental state; Cloud is 100% at capacity and cannot take any more "heavy loads".
I do truly believe that Aerith is trying to keep Cloud together by making him think she's ok as a desperate attempt to stop him breaking and going full black cloak clone. He's so much further gone in this game than he was in og.
I wonder how much Aerith divulged to Tifa. They have quite obviously talked about Cloud's mental state and they both echo that he won't become a degraded clone. I doubt she told Tifa she was going to die, but I'm certain there's a plan that Tifa is going to try to see through on her own, which is why she's hesitant to say or do anything to jeopardise Cloud's dwindling sanity (as well as her own grief obviously).
You get it bud! Nice one!! Not many people are getting it. Leads into another comment I seen, "its like a second home" she's telling cloud she's gotta go back to the altar to finish her prayer since sephiroth "interrupted it." She's keeping him sweet, but still keeping tabs on him, making sure he doesn't completely lose it. Clouds not in the right mind to accept her death just yet, and aeirth knows that.
Also i 100% think tifa told aerith that cloud somehow knew every single move zack made during the nibelheim mission, even quoting sephiroth word for word! That's one thing I really wanted more of in rebirth. I wanted to hear the conversations aerith and tifa were having in private about zack and cloud. What does tifa think about cloud knowing all of that stuff?
@@CAeuJohno123I’d love to get some Tifa and Aerith flashback scenes in part 3.
The Skytear though definitely Tifa should be the second character to see that or maybe Barret
The blood splatter was such a good touch. On a basic level I think a lot of people can see the shrinking away and denial in Cloud's movements when Sephiroth splatters the blood in his face but one of the ways it's so great is it mirrors how traumatic it was for Cloud to see all the blood on Tifa in Nibelhiem. He literally says "I saw all the blood" when he's talking to Tifa on the rooftop and the thing is that is true, that's one of the things that really happened and affected Cloud so strongly that even though he's influenced by Jenova he still possesses that true memory. In the flashback the camera zooms in on Cloud's hand with Tifa's blood on it showing how much of core memory it is. In his eyes he failed Tifa in Nibelheim and now he's protecting himself having now failed Aerith, the blood is too much for him to see.
Watching your take in the ending scene, I noticed two things, when the fight against Sephiroth ends, Cloud ignores the entire party and goes towards Aerith, but they don't show the group's reaction, they simply disappear and my impression is of that they saw Cloud pick Aerith up and say "Aerith, wake up". Man... that must have been the most disturbing thing for them, because the second thing I was going to say is that Barret and Tifa, before they get into Tiny Bronco, they act like they saw "THIS" during the scene in forgotten capital. They know cloud is completely lost because of that.
I absolutely loved this video! Starting to watch some of your other ones now. Amazing insight! Thank you so much for sharing 😊
Thank you so much!!!! I put a lot of work into this video so that means the world 🙏🏻 I hope you enjoy the rest of them!
This part of the interview might be interesting to some.
Interviewer: That's another thing I was curious about. In the original game, Cloud has that memorable line: "My fingertips are tingling. My mouth is dry. My eyes are burning!" However, it would seem those lines aren't spoken this time...
Nojima: For my part, I felt that things like "tingling" and "burning" could be conveyed purely through the visual elements of the production, and that there was no need for them to be expressed through dialogue. I figured that even if the lines were absent, people familiar with the original game would be able to hear Cloud's voice clearly in their head.
Toriyama: I can't say much about that sequence of scenes, as I want to encourage a variety of interpretations from those who see them. However, I will say that after consulting with Nomura, we settled on an approach where we inserted a sort of flashback scene where you can see Cloud shouting those lines from the original game.
My interpretation for now : The part where we see Cloud speaking the og lines could be Cloud experiencing the OG memories instead of just blocking it out.
glad to hear someone else have the same theory! im not the only one!
The VA said he had recorded those lines. So they might come up in part 3.
I hope they include them - Nojima's comment reads as a bit short-sighted. Those lines are very powerful to hear, and imo EASILY are not the kind of thing we would just feel naturally from seeing him look distraught. The vocalizing is the point, because for Cloud it is seemingly a new sensation, one that just completely wrecks him in the moment. That they went for a different direction for the scene/impact this time is fine, but I just hope we hear that scene in part 3, its really really powerful. That being said, I think a lot of people feel very confident about what we may see in part 3 as the resolution to this open-ended scene, but I wil personally just be happy if it is directly referenced and we get at least some part of if not the entire water burial scene. (I really would like to see Aerith stabbed like in the original, to see all of the party members react to her dead body, and THEN the water burial, but i'll accept just the burial because its important thematically/narratively)
Underrated channel. You should have way more subscribers and views. This is just as educational in terms of videography and cinematography as it is an FF7 analysis. Awesome content.
Nice little detail about the white whispers being agents of Aerith:
They cast wards on the ground.
This was excellent. I never saw him placing her in the water. That was a great spot.
Something i wish a lot of people talked about is when he places the Black Materia in the Buster Sword. The evil in Cloud is apparent when walking and talking to Barret. He is In a constant shadow.
What people miss, when barret mentions, it's a heavy load, and he best be ready to carry it. He's saying to Cloud, when you're a leader, you'll lose people as he lost Biggs, Wedge, and Jessie. So when cloud responds quickly with essentially "Yeah im fine with that" hes essentially saying hes okay losing them. Its so dark.
Holy shit you explained this so well and broke down so many details that I haven't heard anyone else mention. So glad I found your page
I loved this breakdown! As a long time FFVII lore man myself this was awesome to watch! One thing not mentioned, was how in the JENOVA LIFE fight, reflective of everyone's emotions, every party member enters with an automatically full limit break. Except Cloud, whose limit bar is empty.
48:35 interesting theory, except that in 57:20 her hair, dress, is clearly moving/reacting to her environment
HOW DID I NOT CATCH THAT DAMN.
I think there's an image that Sephiroth made to fill Cloud's delusions, but there is an Aerith alive in another world too, and Life Stream Aerith.
Very insightful dude, kept my attention for the duration. And appreciate the optimism rather than "they're screwing it up" lol.
Helps me be a bit more satisfied with what's happened.
All I can add is those shots toward the end with aerith watching the bronco fly away are reminiscent of the old ps1 disc change / key art, where shes gazing up at the Highwind.
Also equipping black materia maybe = meteorain skill for cloud in part 3? Kinda the one cool thing we've yet to see from OG.
"Also equipping black materia maybe = meteorain skill for cloud in part 3? Kinda the one cool thing we've yet to see from OG."
Oh shit, good call! I didn't think about that. I would say you're 99.99% correct with that one.
i agree with most of the comment, but meteorain is definitely not the "one cool thing" we haven't seen yet. there's knights of the round, the golden chocobo, omnislash, ruby, sapphire, ultimate, diamond and emerald weapons, and etc
I think the depth that comes from the fact that yes he's not completely himself and is in denial, is so profound because he's also really being interacted with by aerith in the lifestream. Like the party's perspective is that he's in denial, and they are not wrong, but what he's actually interacting with when he's talking to aerith is not made up either. Just something that unfortunately makes it harder for him to face the truth. It's crazy the levels of this and can set up for some very cool potential party/friend dynamics in the story going forward.
Really good takes on a lot of this breakdown. I'm glad I felt the same about a lot of this stuff and I'm not alone haha
I agree completely. I think the developers were going for a "yes, and" style of implication. Everything we're seeing is true in a sense, except Cloud's fractured existence makes it hard to reconcile.
I particularly dislike the framing that "Cloud must have failed and is simply deluded" because we're given visual confirmation of the rainbow effect while it happens. Cloud is confused partly because, in his truth, he really did stop masamune. But from the outside where it literally didn't appear to happen, he must be crazy. Both can be true if there are two worlds superimposed.
@@AdamCYounisas one person said Schrodinger's Aerith.
41:15 Alex Moukala did sent a video to maxdood weeks ago. Basically he puts the melody with the jenova theme chords in the background. AND IT FITS PERFECTLY. LIKE WHAT?
where do i find this?
I think it most likely resembles the track "Who am I" - which would make sense, since Cloud is (once again or now even more) in an identity crisis.
You also get the Opening theme notes briefly shortly after as well (three brassy notes)
@@tatsuma0503 You can see a clip of the discussion here: clips.twitch.tv/BashfulEnthusiasticFloofPanicBasket-BCjfnp0r0OQo8sBe
I think it could be coincidence, but it certainly seems convenient how well Jenova's melody fits on top of that creepy arpeggio.
@@tatsuma0503 I think UA-cam didn’t let me post a link, so 40:39 I’ll try to disguise it: m_twitch_tv/clip/BashfulEnthusiasticFloofPanicBasket-BCjfnp0r0OQo8sBe
Just replace the underscores with periods for the link.
47:13 I think Zack is in the main party’s world too. Especially since the flowers are alive at the church. They were gray, but one, in the dream world Zack was originally in.
I don't get it, Zack is dead in our world. Can 2 Zack exist in the same world, is there need to be worry about paradox. One more question if Zack is in our world and if Cloud saved Aerith in one of the dream worlds like where supposedly Zack survived at the end of remake, what's stopping in bringing back Aerith the same way to the party's world?
@@sujithg6902 well if Zack is dead in our world there wouldn’t be 2 Zack’s, there would only be one if the Zack that’s alive is currently in our world. Also, I don’t think Aerith lived in any world. I think either Cloud is imagining it, or Aerith is making him imagine it to try and protect him. She’s able to operate still in the lifestream after death since she’s an ancient
I want to see a Zack resolution scene where he visits Gongaga one last time to give his parents some closure and to witness Cissnei's reaction. That'll be quite emotional I reckon...
@@BLa-lq2bs Based on your interpretation, wouldn't that also apply to Aerith. She died so if she was to come back to the main world just like Zack, there would now be only one Aerith. Hell why stop just with Zack & Aerith, they could bring back the whole of Avalanche as well.
@@sujithg6902 You misunderstood what happened. Zack was brought to the other world from the main world, so there are not two of him, just one.
Thank you for making this, so cool
Also, “No promises await at journey’s end” is reminding me a lot of “Even if the morrow is barren of promises, nothing shall forestall my return” (Genesis/Loveless)
Too much of a long shot?
Nothing Shall Forestall my Return. Of the one so desperate to cling to a doomed fate. Time and time again the beg for "release"
Hear me out guys, when we arrive at the forgotten capital we are blocked by a wall of whispers, same as remake before the fight with fate. Cloud says “aerith” and three whispers from behind him open a portal, which im sure we can agree are the whispers sephiroth controls. When cloud goes through the portal i believe he ends up in a different world and he actually does save a different world aerith, but our main timeline aerith ends up dying, After she is stabbed we see the rest of the party rushing in because the whisper wall vanished, not through a portal like cloud did. I think thats something important.
So i believe there is still a chance she is out there in a world waiting for cloud to find her. I can be totally wrong after all this is just my theory. 😁
Even befire thag, when Seph is explaining to Cloud the nature of reality, Seph baits Cloud into striking him. And he does so, right in front a portal which Cloud passes through upon striking Seph, "I give you, my blessing"... 🤓
Yeah, the portal is important.
It very much looks like Cloud is the one in control of those 3 black whispers. He walks towards it very calmly and commands them to open a rift. This is either Sephiroth's "blessing" (presumably this is when he receives the black materia) or the empty white materia bestowing him this power.
Yea I wouldn't surprised if its seph that made him do all this cuz it does seem like he is also the reason for zack being alive. There are theories that seph is purposely creating alt worlds as each world draws from the same lifestream thus weakening it all together. There is only so much lifestream energy to go around and weakening it to control it makes sense. Aerith was actively tryna stop cloud with the white whispers I believe but cloud ultimately does the unthinkable and breaks fate, kinda. I think he can't really affect the fate of the real world but only create an alt one in which she lives.
So yeah, I do think there is now an alt version of aerith created via cloud but she will likely fade away after defeating sephiroth cuz I dont think the alt worlds are really meant to exist. I do think the theme is a bit nihilistic in that its basically saying her fate is predetermined and there's nothing cloud could do bout it which ultimately is in opposition to the tagline of defy fate but idk. I personally want cloud to find a way to save her but I understand the want to keep her dead.
Sephiroth executed a very specific plan to gain leverage over Cloud in this end scene.
He set Cloud up to parry his blade, smiling and observing with twitching eyes, anticipating, hoping that Cloud can pull it off.
He enhanced Clouds strength, making him strong enough to kill the MidgarSormer, in preparation for this moment.
He needed Cloud to be strong enough to fracture off a new dream world.
A dream of a living Aerith.
(A Aerith who wasn’t supposed to have the white materia)
This will be leverage next time he asks for Clouds help.
“Help me merge the worlds, it will bring back your friend”
Cloud will say yes.
Nothing new happened here by accident..
I personally think aerith is gone gone but i’m not completely sure yet. Before watching all the theories I was thinking along the same lines as you. I was fairly confident even before finishing rebirth that part 3 would culminate in some kind of ultimatum from sephiroth. From a story telling perspective it seems like the obvious route. Help me and i will save her. A palpatine/anakin situation if you will. And thus at the climax of the story having cloud choose to let her go completing his arc.
But then I wonder what is all of aerith’s scheming for?
@@Kitth3n I think I see it along the same lines as you originally saw it.
I see Omni-Aeriths scheming as necessary counter play to maintain the natural order.
There seems to be an internal logic & Rules to how characters communicate across Time and Dream Worlds.
Sephiroths Alien life force allows him to transmit telepathically through the lifestream once he’s in it (the reason the lifestream rejects alien life, they aren’t bound by its rules).
Aerith can’t do that at will, but the planet allows her to use the white materia as a line through time and worlds.
Clouds S cells are what allow him to transmit through worlds the same as Sephiroth. Aerith used Sephiroths own technique against him by passing Cloud the information of her white material and transmitting it back to his world.
Because of this the Aerith in the dream world will still be in play, she will be informed of the chess moves necessary to stop Sephiroth. She wasn’t supposed to have this knowledge.
In addition to this it provides an answere to the clear Materia issue. What will fill it and why?
In Cosmo canyon the game states “if the lifestream is memories, what about hopes and dreams? We remember those don’t we”
“The black material was once the purest materia made black by spite” - implying it was once white transformed.
It is formed of the Gi’s hopes and dreams of Oblivion, suggesting that black and white material are born of hopes and dreams instead of regular memories.
I predict that as we play the game we will jump back and forth from Aeriths dream and it will eventually fill out that empty materia and serve some key purpose.
It’s also a meta narrative.
In the late 90’s thousands of people signed the petition to bring Aerith back to life. The devs are not re-writing history but giving us an in cannon manifestation of these hopes and dreams. A dream of what would happen if Aerith was still alive. This will help win the day on the surface world where the plot will play out almost beat for beat.
But as you say, Cloud and the player will have to let go by the end of the game.
@@Kean_Beanlet go of Aerith or let go of the OG World. That entire version of reality makes the "good" ending. Is the soul sovereign in FF7R Trilogy?
@@mettatonneoex is the soul sovereign in the FF7 world….?
Dang… that’s a good question. I lean towards yes. Though the nature of Jenova & Sephiroths manipulation of spiritual energy does sometimes seem near instantaneous.
I think the “good” ending will be very similar to the old ending. But with knowledge of more possibilities, a richer understanding of the experience of life & our hopes.
I agree with Sleepezi regarding TIfa with the thought that Cloud killed Aerith. Sephiroth throws the blood onto Cloud, The party runs in and sees Cloud with Blood … But sephiroth turned away with “no” blood .. In the next game, cloud under the impression that aerith is alive while fighting with Tifa that you did it. And later on Sephiroth telling cloud the same story that he killed aerith; which would help break him down along with showing him the truth of nibelheim
Very awesome analysis! However, at 8:59, you talk about Cloud thinking he’s Zack when that just isn’t true. He took on Zack’s heroic stories to form his SOLDIER/hero persona, yes, but Cloud himself doesn’t think he’s Zack. If he did, he would’ve called Gongaga his home, he would’ve immediately recognized Aerith, he’d call himself Zack. This is an important detail that is sadly misconstrued by the fan base.
If Cloud didn't think he was Zack then we would have played as Zack during the entire 1st chapter of Nibelheim flashback.
Edit: Oh I understand. Essentially Cloud doesn't think that "he is" Zack but thinks that he was in the moments that Zack was originally, he barely started remembering Zack on the return to Nibelheim.
@themadgamer4571 replying to your edit: Yaya, Cloud inserted himself as Zack in his own memories to make himself seem like a first class soldier, when he never was.
@@themadgamer4571 To your edit: Yes, Cloud simply believes he was the SOLDIER in Nibelheim, not Zack. That's why he believes himself to be a First-Class SOLDIER.
25:46 also lowkey the way he looks crazy and weird swaying his head like that- I cannot lie he looks insane from tifa’s view 😭 and knowing tifa is scared of cloud falling apart it must’ve been terrifying
also, to me at least, his eyes look more dead in her perspective then in his imaginative dream, there’s not a single light casted in them, they are slightly red snd tired, st least dark and there’s a shadow casted on them
48:34 You talk about how neither Aerith nor her dress react to the gust created by the Tiny Bronco. But look here 57:15 where they do.
Developer oversight? Or two Aeriths in the final cut-scene?
In the credits roll. They show every single scene in rebirth. But for some reason the scene at the water where they put aerith to rest is "missing" until the scene at the end where aerith said goodbye. The dev is cooking on this one for sure. That last one is the real aerith while everything else before that is just hallucinations
@@phrofile3613 All the lake scene is missing. The last time we have a screen of the party's member is during the boss fight ...
Yeah its bugging me too, i think cloud that seen aerith was jenova or his delusional mind playing. Meanwhile aerith that say goodbye and telling cloud to look up are the real one.
Remember the dev love red herring clue in the last game.
Also, when Aerith and Cloud are fighting Sep. she says, “Cloud I saw what you done for me back there. Thank you”. Your thoughts on that?
I noticed that, too. "I saw what you did back there. Thank you." It implies that Aerith was a witness and not a participant of that event.
There are two Aerith in the game atm: Remake Aerith and Future/ Advent Children/ Original's Aerith.
The one fighting against Sephiroth at the end of game and control White Whisper is Future Aerith.
Remake Aerith has told Cloud about Future Aerith in Costa Del SOl's beach. (Chapter 6)
@@putrahardjono4409 I dont think so cuz its implied that future aerith is in fact the one cloud went on a date with. By the end of the date, it seems seph kills her which makes sense as an aerith from the future is probably sephiroths biggest obstacle in all this. He even says something bout how he's been lookin for her in this scene implying she has been hiding. Her line delivery of "its been fun", also seems very final, almost like a final goodbye which to me means she knew the moment she sees cloud again, seph would find her but she needed to do this to give him the materia and also that she wanted to spend her final moments with him. This has precedent in the On The Way To A Smile novel in which aerith can sense seph in the lifestream but doesn't outright confront him. Instead it seems she just tries to meddle in his plan thus leading to Advent Children instead of fighting him directly as she says it dangerous. Anyways, to me, the two possibilities are it was a spirit of the remake aerith fighting or it was an alt version just created by cloud. I don't know how to grasp the 3rd person delivery cuz I think its possible that either version of aerith could speak this way. The spirit can say it as she literally saw it happen with her own eyes but knows it failed. The alt version can be sayin it in a way that she saw him succeed but she is not "his" aerith. The tone of the line also seems like a "thanks for trying" kinda thing as I do believe alt aerith will likely be fated to die anyway, most likely due to the alt worlds being erased by the end of the game similar to what happened in the dream dates world.
The way I see it, I think alt aerith will be present but is tryna help cloud from an alt world. By the final fight, the worlds will merge and she will join the party for one last final battle. After the defeat, she will have one last talk with cloud bout how everything isnt his fault and that this is what she wants or smt. I think the end goal of aerith was to stop seph but to also avoid Advent Children and the death of humans which is the implied ending. Personally, I hope we can save her and that cloud and the other really can change fate on their own but I understand if OG fans want to keep it the same.
@@Pringlessingles The one on the date with Cloud is indeed Future/OG Aerith. As it is "Her Dream" to have a date or conversation with Cloud as from On The Way To Smile. That's why Cloud said to her "You're weird". Because she is not behave like Remake Aerith.
Sephiroth kill Future/OG Aerith? I guess you underestimated her too much. She is a Survivor type. She has been fighting Sephiroth using White Whisper for the entire Rebirth story. That's why at the beginning of final Battle between Cloud + Future Aerith VS Sephiroth. Sephiroth said to her "I must admit. I underestimated you". Plus, during the battle she said to cloud “Cloud, I saw what you done for me (Remake Aerith) back there. Thank you”. She is the one controlling White Whisper, of course, she saw what happened there.
As the one talking to Cloud at the very end of the ending and said "Good Bye" is Remake Aerith. They like to banter each other.
@@putrahardjono4409 that makes sense though I guess which version of her appeared is really up in the air till the next game. I personally still believe it’s remake aerith with the memories of the Future aerith as she gained them through the white materia. The glow when receiving seemed to signify something happened and to me it means memories are transferred. In costa del sol, we know aerith lost some memories and her materia is clear. To me it means that during remake, she had all her memories of the future aerith but seph attacks her with the black whispers and thus she loses them. Future aerith gets wind of this and must transfer her materia to cloud and is where shes killed. In a sense future aerith is alive cuz you are your memories, but i think even with the memories shes still somewhat different. Anyways this is all speculation and i do think either situation can be plausible. I think I said before but I just want aerith to live, open up a flower shop and hangout in tifas bar with everyone. I’m a bit tired of bittersweet ending especially with how depressing the world seems to be right now. Thanks for havin the conversation, it’s always fun to theorize.
'The Rainbow Light'
So I think of the game like this: Time and destiny are moving in a straight line, like a tree. OG FF7 is the trunk of the tree. Everytime someone now messes with time and the planet's destiny a branch is born, and this is visualized by this rainbow light. We see that when Zack has to make a choice in the subway tunnel: Help Cloud or Help Biggs?When ever a new branch is born, a new worlds are created, also evidenced by the Zack scene since he ends up going to Shinra HQ and by Biggs. Two branches. Every branch and every twig are a little different. And so that rainbow light is clearly Aerith's doing. Proof of this would be when she shoves Cloud into a portal in the flowerbed and ends up where what Sephiroth calls "the true nature of reality," there is a Rainbow around the flowerbed portal. That Aerith is clearly the Aerith from the OG game, hiding in a world that has execpted its fate, but I digress. Basically the Rainbow Light to me seems to be Aerith creating new worlds that are sure to end but then be recycled, and Sephiroth is all out there cutting down trees and gathering them up so he can rule over them, as a God, for eternity. I believe he wants never ending suffering and that's his end game.
Gosh, once you try to one small things with this story you end up with a tangled mess in your lap.
aww man....Nanaki saying aerith name in questioning always get tears to my eyes :(
if they had put a little piano rift of Hollow when Cloud was standing there all alone after lifestream Aerith dissipated... wouldve been peak
Which song is hollow? I looked at the original OST and didn’t see a song with that name
@@StephenOwen it's from FF7 Remake. the lyrics are about what aerith meant to cloud, and now that she's gone, he feels hollow inside
The part in the ending when Aerith said, it's okay "it's like a second home". In Japanese she said "it's okay this is a Cetra's place".
Therefore the double meaning "the lifestream OR the City of Ancients" is unlikely (unless if we extend the argument to also say that the lifestream too is a Cetra's place??)
Interestingly, there is one line not in the ending that Aerith said that may feel like a double meaning in Japanese, but not in English.
The line when in Temple of Ancients before handing the Black Materia (fake) to Cloud, Aerith said "no matter what happens, I'm here for you" in English, but in Japanese she said "何があっても 一緒だよ” the part 一緒 (issho) usually means together, as in we're in this together/i'm with you; but the same phrase could also be read/meant as "it is the same".
So, it can be either means: whatever happens, we're together OR whatever happens, it's the same.... now what's the same? no matter what we do here, the outcome will always be the same?? That is the real question :D
@Philip A real blink and you miss it moment at the end when Rufus is flying back over Midgar...the sector 6 plate is back- Dream Pheonix has a good cook on this and I was wondering what other content creators think about it. Great video as always.
Interesting
Excellent analysis! Notice that at 37:30 where Cloud “wakes” Aerith up, the music playing is a part of CLOUD’s theme, not Aerith’s. I think that’s significant.
I was surprised that you pointed to the OG at 52:16. There was a scene earlier with Zack and Elmyra where they looked up and saw the tear in the sky. I’m not convinced these other worlds are “dream worlds”. I believe these are remanifestations of the Lifestream and the people in it, and that Sephiroth is building things up to give Cloud an ultimatum that if he kills him, he kills all the Lifestream manifestations.
This was the best breakdown I’ve seen on the internet. Well done
Best breakdown I've seen on the internet. Period. FF7 or not.
Love listening to your takes and analysis of these games. Unfortunate they don't pick up more steam. Liked and shared, can't wait for part 3!
As a fellow student of film, I want to thank you for making this video. The amount of wild, uninformed videos about this ending is almost maddening. I'm glad someone came to almost the exact same conclusions I had upon my second viewing of the ending.
omg am so happy to finally find your video. Your point of view and approach answer every questions that merged in my head since i finished the story of rebirth. Thks you for sharing this with everyone. I think you are totaly understand the pure art and details of this amazing work for this entire remake of FFVII
Man, really thks youuuuuuu
What made me surprised is when the whispers were forcing cloud to ready his buster sword, the tapping icon is trying to tell the player to resist the whispers, but a lot of players mistook it as an indication to strike down Aerith. 37:44 suddenly plays the FF7 main theme for some reason. “It’s like a second home” in JP was “this is where the Cetras used to live”.
That translation makes it much more plain - Cloud thinks Aerith didnt die and him asking if she 'needs help getting back' is not to the lifestream but him knowing he saved a different world version of her or whatever, it is because she is telling him a story (either literally or in his head)- that she is going to remain at the forgotten capital and keep praying to stop Meteor. That explains why that conversation reads to some as a bit uncanny - beacuse its not true. The last time Aerith we know really spoke to him, she told him to focus on himself so SHE could defeat Sephiroth, and when he says He will defeat Sephiroth she asks him to promise, and reverts to her overly cheery self. That also lends some credibility to the idea that Aerith is trying to spare him from completely emotionally collapsing in this moment. He literally thinks they just flew off and left her there to do her cetra business. It's actually kind of simple, but a lot of people are overlooking/overthinking this I feel.
We need to look more closely at the function of psychic links between worlds and what they tell us:
The lifestream rejects Aliens because they aren’t bound by its rules.
Omni Sephiroth is born of the planet and slipped into the lifestream, with his mother’s alien abilities intact.
The lifestream encompasses all time.
Omni Sephiroth can telepathically communicate through the lifestream to other worlds and times and communicate with other versions of himself.
His mother’s alien abilities allow him to do this.
He is evidence of why the planet rejects all alien life.
Omni Aerith proves that those born of the planet can’t do this at will. She requires the planets blessing to communicate with past/ dream world versions of herself via the White Materia. Using it like a time phone.
Cloud and Zack both have S cells which allowed Cloud to see from Zack’s POV from time to time. It also allowed them to Synchronise between worlds in “together as one”.
One other commonality is that all of them seem to require a “living” host to broadcast and act through whether in the real world or dream world. None of them can just manifest without a connected vector.
Also, if Cloud falls into the lifestream, he could potentially broadcast his consciousness through time as well. Not sure if it will be relevant to the plot though.
I find the scene where Cloud says ‘Aerith, wake up’ the most interesting. He is calm, no tears and the way he says it is almost like an order. I think that’s why she stayed with him and the group until the tiny bronco took off.
I think when Aerith says "its like a second home" she's referring to the forgoten capital. She goes there to pray for stoping meteor but Sephiroth interrupt her.
So Cloud craft this in his head to explain himself why aerith is no longer in the party.
That’s 100% my read too
Duuuude. Damn I've been trying to figure that one out... makes so such sense... clouds totally OK with aerith "not being in the party anymore" because she's gotta go back to the altar to finish her prayer... sick that you noticed that. Not many people have touched on that line. Good job!
@@CAeuJohno123 and I think Clouds gotta rationalise it too. He is susceptible to believe whatever as long as he doesnt have to be reminded of the truth. If he challenges it logically, he will start to break down but his denial mechanism will kick in and he will try to rationalise it.
@@pandaeyezHe's been through a lot so yeah.
Incredible work! 🙌🏾 Just to add, in the OG, it is Jenova who says "You're just a puppet" rather than Sephiroth. I wonder whether that means it is Jenova's will over Sephiroth in Rebirth 👀
Hey man, I appreciate your points of view as I am also a filmmaker and is amazing to have this type of conversations. Keep up the good work man!
Thank you for this. It was magical seeing it again through your eyes.
Great video! I can't wait for part 3. It's gonna be an emotional roller coaster for sure.
The passion for production alone is insane, great content.
In all the frames where Aerith is definitely dead, there is no rainbow effect and blood is visible on Cloud’s hand. There is no blood in all the rainbow shots. I think that Cloud, having repelled Sephiroth's blow, was able to create a reality in which Aerith is alive. And Cloud is in a kind of superposition, being able to observe several realities at the same time. The rest of the group sees only one reality (except for Tifa, something is definitely wrong with her after the Lifestream) in which Aerith is definitely dead. I also have an idea that since Cloud's psyche is divided into several persons, then in this scene we see several different mental states of Cloud. It is possible that in part 3 of the game we will see all these reunions.
But even in the scenes where rainbows surrounds them, Aerith is still acting like she was killed by Sephiroth -- In Cloud's arms and laying on the ground. If she was saved in another timeline, then why is she not standing/kneeling or being more lifelike?
@@HXXXXWXXN Sephiroth answer on this question: Confluence of world's. This is exactly the same as Sephiroth being simultaneously in several worlds during the battle with him. In one world Aerith must die for cast Holy so she die :D
Cope
How to resurrect Aerith: The Guide... Y'all being played by the devs
@@thebrigade7684 Yeah, I'm in the "She's dead" camp. I'm sure there's way to interpret the scenes to make it seem like she was saved, but I think the arguments against her being alive are way stronger.
The sword wasn't moved at all. They are 2 different visions:
1 like the original game when it stabs through Aerith's back and planted to the ground. The blood running below it is from Aerith body - still in kneeling position, held by the sword.
1 as the whisper-created vision / reality where Cloud successfully deflected the sword, sending it flying away.
The whisper-created vision might be how Aerith fight against Sephiroth's manipulation over Cloud's mentality. She created such vision to safe-guard Cloud's mentality. It's important for the final 7 seconds.
And yeah, true Aerith is possibly not killed either in the Church nor the altar. She's always with Cloud. It might be the trick she plays out using the white / transparent materia.
Thanks for uploading this. I had a lot of questions with the ending and was very conflicted with it at first, but thanks to your video I feel a lot better about the ending and the direction they took!
This has been an absolute joy to watch. Thank you, Phil.
Aerith’s clothing doesn’t react to the puff of smoke from the Bronco but does react to the wind as it takes off. This makes me wonder whether the Aerith Cloud is talking to at the end is another hallucination, especially since her dialogue is mostly things she’s said before. However, in the scenes where she isn’t talking to Cloud I think we can still infer that she does have an actual spiritual presence.
Not a hallucination. The timelines split, creating a world where Aerith lived and one where she died. Cloud sees both worlds at once. So he sees Aerith and no one else does.
My personal theory about the white whispers is that they are controlled not by Aerith, but by the planet/lifestream. I think in the Forgotten Capital, the white whispers wanted Aerith to die by Sephiroth’s sword, as that lead to the planet’s safety in the original continuity. This aligns with how the white whispers surround Cloud as he lays Aerith on the floor to begin fighting, as it mimics the original scene of Aerith being laid to rest in the original continuity, which again, allowed her to protect the planet from the lifestream.
Sephiroth and the black whispers (which he controls), conversely, want Aerith to die by Cloud’s hand to more thoroughly break him, similar to his attempt to get Cloud to turn on Tifa.
Sephiroth’s grin when the screen flickers and he pulls his sword from Aerith is him acknowledging that even though Cloud defied both fates, Sephiroth still got what he needed and knows there’s much more to come. To me, that slight grin is a moment of surprise, as if it’s not quite what he expected, but he’s still pleased with the outcome.
I was wondering where this was when you mentioned it in your Sleepezi video!
Spot on! Thank you for sharing this analysis with us.
Fantastic analysis and exposition. Thank you!
I cant wait for all the "hardcore" ff 7 fans to come out with a "i was wrong about the 7 remake trilogy" after the third one comes out. Your video was spot on with my interpretation.
Absolutely loved the ending.
Was trying to wrap my head around what was happening on my first time, but over a short amount of time this became was of my favorite endings to a game with a TON of things to decrypt and think about. This scene was way more impactful to me than the original scene (i played the OG in 2005 after seeing Advent Children, so it had a different impact).
But this has become my favourite game of all time. Rebirth gives me a feeling i havent felt since Kingdom Hearts 2 & FFX ❤️
Thanks for you videos! 😁
48:02. The white materia turns black when we change angles 👀👀👀
Amazing breakdown, Phillip. FYI I don't think the final cinematic takes place in Rocket Town, but on the Northern Continent: it's to the west of the Temple if you look at the map. (The Northern Continent doesn't turn snowy until the very edge of the map we get in Rebirth.)
This is the BEST! Breakdown Ive seen, not too complicated compare to others who stray too much from what the cutscenes are telling us.
Really looking forward to this. Get in my eyes!
Thank you man, we have to chat soon!
At 22:08 there is pink lifestream flowing behind Sephiroth. At the end of OG after the Omnislash Sephiroth dissolves into pink lifestream. Some of which flows into Cloud and doesn't exit. The moment in Lifestream Black where Sephiroth made Cloud his core.
So just to point out as when Aerith mentions its like a second home, if you read : The maiden that travels the planet is a story about Aerith the moment she passes away, her experiences her feelings her connection to the planet, actually the Lifestream or how her connection towards it, she even references that being the promised land, a place full of energy/life pretty much everything Shinra wants, I wonder if technically in order to use Holy, would a Ancient need to sacrifice themselves in order to use this? because in the actual read she needed to be in the lifestream in order to be able to achieve the grand success of stopping Meteor. - Have a read I for 1 had put a massive connection with Rebirth and its just perfect
but I must admit, amazing theory and broken down info on your videos, I love how you view things as its so similar to mine :)
keep it up! looking forward to the next video! hopefully u bring up the read! haha
48:27 Aerith turning towards Cid is the same shot used in Advent Children when she and Zack are walking off into the light at the end.
I think that Aerith really does talk to Cloud when he's cradling her the first time. I think this is "Omni-Aerith" trying to keep Cloud from breaking in that moment. Sephiroth needs him to break and give in to despair so Sephiroth can control him. During this time, you see the lifestream energy emanating from her. After the battle, though, you don't see that. So she's definitely dead when he tells her to open her eyes.
Deep down, I think Cloud knows Aerith is dead. He never speaks to her when anyone else is around. Subconsciously, he doesn't want anyone challenging his version of reality.
I have a problem with the idea that Aerith had to die to defeat Sephiroth. In the original game they wanted to avoid the "heroic sacrifice" cliché. The whole idea was that death is something that can come out of nowhere and is very rarely dramatic. This point was reinforced by the party pointing out that Aerith didn't seem to plan on dying when she left the party. It would be odd to backtrack on that point if they're keeping this project in line with the OG.
There's also no Jenova Aerith. Yes, Jenova can assume those forms but she needs a host for that. We see this clearly with Glen and Sephiroth. Anytime there's an interaction, there's someone infected with Jenova nearby. There are times when only Cloud can see Sephiroth without a black cloak but there are black Whispers involved.
I don't have a problem with Aerith being dead. It's the way the story happened but it really makes me question the reason for the way Remake ends. I'm hoping Part 3 answers that but as things currently stand, it strikes me as a cynical and manipulative decision.
There's other things I'd love to discuss (mostly positive or questions) but I think this comment is long enough.
What a great analysis!
Im definitely gonna subscribe to your channel. Your theories definitely hit my same points of my theories. It makes me more excited for Part 3 and im still thinking about this game. And I've only finished this game 2 weeks ago at the time commenting.
Small little music note, at 24:10 you get that synth sound that overrides the piano doing the jenova notes. The moment it switches from Sephiroth to Jenova being in control. Cool little moment.
I'd like to note something prior to this and mainly noticed it when I saw another playthrough. But the wall of whispers that prevents the party from going to where Aeris is also broken open by other black whispers to give the opportunity for Cloud to enter. Effectively, the black whispers wanted only Cloud to enter. And a further previous sequence where the lifestream coming from a crack in the sky and turning into black whispers further cements the idea that they are the will of a planet that have chosen to side with or are being manipulated/corrupted by Sephiroth.
I’ve watched so many videos explaining the ending and this is by far the best and most thorough.
Yes, thanks for noticing the small details that a lot of people miss, I thought the ending was well done and loved how they tied it together with hints and specific framing instead of telling/spoon-feeding everything to the player. There is a lot of information throughout the game and even NPCs can hint at things early on. Still crazy love this game.
This video was fantastic man I hope one day maxmillion dood watches this video bc I thought I knew most of the ending but u opened it up even more for me!
This is the greatest deep dive of the ending I’ve seen. Absolutely incredible eye for seeing what most of us were couldn’t. We were seeing through such clouded eyes… until now.
Positively brilliant. Thank you for making this!
Thanks a lot for your detailed explanation. If I remember correctly, someone already confirmed that this is some kind of multiverse but I think it is not the same kind of multiverse than the Mavel multiverse. I like the comparison to dreams and I hope that is more along those lines. Since the rest of the game is a lot like the original, I think the third part will be like the original as well and only add new perspectives and a new lore that explains what happens rather than to alternate the events that happen.
I would add some things.
1. If Arith decides to change the event that sword was deflected, than Sephiroth would most likely not be that convinced that he won, which is shown by his smile. So he did this himself or the planet changed this and Arith is not in control over the white whispers (at least not until she actually died) but they decide to "help" her. The explanation of Sephiroth stabbing Arith in the church feels of timewise and would rather result in just her bleeding or being dead rather than changing the position of the sword.
2. Why does Arith in the end does say that she will stop meteor? Sephiroth did not cast it yet and even can't since he has not the black materia. Cloud says he will stop him so even if she is only his imagination, than he would not imagine her thinking that he will give the black Materia to Sephiroth. Or he does think that he will give it to him because he is controlled by Jenova but than is the question why he would imagine that Arith will stop meteor. This feels off and must feel even more so for people not knowing what happens in the original.
Either way I appreciate the hard work that you put into that and the amount of details you point out while we se the scenes. I was looking for that but only find people talking how shit this is (even after they played 100h of a game that hit nearly every note and improved so much) or people that talked about how good this is and what crazy thinks happened but not showing prove of it. Shure the scenes are no prove of it either, but your explanation is very understandable.
THANK YOU!
Love the analysis. My ‘97, middle school self desperately wants Aerith and Cloud to end up with a happy ending together. But my mind knows that a major part of what made OG FF7 so impactful was the real sense of loss at Aerith’s death. What can I say, I love her character so much. I’m extremely thankful for Briana and Cody’s performances, brilliant stuff.
Love your theories. I agree that things are far simpler than many YT theorists supposing.
I subbed and I will catch you for sure when Part 3 drops.
Just love to hear the way you break down the artistic signs of the game.
I LOVE how you broke these shots down and what you said at 7:36 I so agree with you know that i think Aerith was the one that moved the Masamune. I think she knows that the White Materia is still important and that in order for her to be the last contingency plan if the White Materia fails to counter act Meteor like in the OG game when it was too late to stop it. She has to die to ensure that. Sephiroth I think is just trying to mess with the timeline in anyway possible now to make it change in any way. Much like when people go back in time in the cartoons and sneeze and kill off all the butterflies in the future. He’s trying to make ANY changes. But I think he wanted Cloud to save Aerith cause would he give Cloud that clue at the end of Remake?
Seph laughing is kinda funny. I think he might be laughing due to the irony of the death. I wonder if the reason he tells Aerith before that final battle “I underestimated you” was because he didn’t think she would go through dying again. Yeah. This could be a video in and of itself. Sorry I’m rabbling about this but I LOVE this shot analysis and what it could mean.
Added: I had a feeling that Bizzaro Seph was going to be in this game but yes I was SHOCKED as well. In the Japanese, Bizzaro Seph’s name is Reborn or Rebirth Sephiroth so yeah was t entirely surprised by it. That’s why I think the last games is going to break from then R naming and be named Seraphim or Seraph to reference Seph’s Safer Seph form (Safer was the bad localization translation and it should be Seraph or Seraphim. So that’s why I think it’s going to go that route. Just waiting til they announce the game now.
3:55 there is a single white feather falling on the right hand side of the screen. What do we make of this? @PhilipHarts
Beautifully done. Best explanation I've seen. I wanted Areith to live..
Has anyone ever looked at scene of Cloud laying Aerith back down at 22:11 in reverse? The movements of him laying her down look off, i wonder if it's just the scene of him picking her up to hold her hand to his face in reverse.
You sell your thoughts very well. It's certainly interesting to consider.
Ridiculously cool idea to do this breakdown
Yo! Great work! Crazy how Aerith died was the very first thing u said in the video and the spoiler warning after the highlights intro lol 😅
The whole game is a masterpiece! thanks for the play by play man❤
I gotta hand it to you Phillip, you nailed a lot of lores that I wasn't quite familiar with but couldn't put my finger on, Excellent astute observations. Some I caught but others I did not and that was because there was so much going prior to the final battle and afterwards. I cannot wait to see which of your theories comes to fruition in the final installment of this trilogy. Either way, we are gong to have some great character building. Even though the storyline is in the perspective of cloud, I agree that he has become an unreliable narrator and thus we get a more clearer storyline through Tifa which I think works great in a literary standpoint for the storyline. The ending definitely broke me when we see the party fly off and we see Aeris seeing them off and uttering goodbye. Developers did it again for me just as they did for OG and more.
I like the how they did the flowers at 58:23. You see a bunch of flowers, but the flower Aerith gave to Cloud became the "center of attention".
Shout out to my family who immediately started screaming “DADDY DADDY DADDY” as soon as i beat the game! Thanks for the recap my friend!
When Aerith says she will stop meteor, how did she know about that???
Maybe I missed it but did Sephiroth already reveal that???
Right after Cloud said promise, the song plays. Awesome transitions and hints.
I'm not sure if anyone else has pointed this out, but the mosaic design on the altar is very tentacle-like which is a motif usually associated with Jenova. And in every shot of Aerith, she's directly in the center, making it look like tentacles are spreading from her. I keep thinking about this, unsure if it means anything but a really neat detail regardless! As always, love your breakdowns ❤
The White whisper was in Masamune sword is because Omni Aerith is trying to `Shield` it from Cloud eye where it actually thrust through Aerith body.
When the sword landed into ground, the white whisper is leaving the sword , that is when we player see the blood. N white wishper continue to surround Cloud Eye here n there. That is when we see the Aerith alive in a second and then dying in another second
Hey Phil, I want to know your opinion: I've been thinking that one of the new elements they could add to the plot is that Sephiroth makes Cloud see that he was actually the one who killed Aerith. By the way, we agree that Cloud places Aerith's hand on his face because she is simply dead and couldn't do it herself. Great video!
oh, nvm, you already talked about that in the video lol
I wonder if there is any significance to the visuals of the floor under Aerith. The pattern on the floor makes it look like tentacles are coming out from that spot under Aerith. Probably a few ways that could be interpreted.
9:31 I get goosebumps and chills everytime I see Sephiroth open the doors here
This was probably the best breakdown of FF7 rebirth cutscene from a cinematic standpoint. I liked how you touched on the points of AC and how Cloud is existing between two worlds, not that he is just merely being controlled by Jenova the entire time, which I think is a weak theory.
What I noticed at the 34:28 mark where you skipped the gameplay. At the very start of that fight Aerith says: "I saw what you did for me Cloud, Thank you".
I assumed she is referring to when Cloud stopped Seph from killing her; there's no way she didn't see the whole thing. The vibes are the same when Aerith thanks Cloud for his "choices" during their date, despite fate, Aerith wants to see where Cloud stands, even though ultimately Aerith is deciding her own fate.
That seems to be one of the biggest differences from the OG, instead of Seph outright killing Aerith, the producers want to give Aerith more agency and have her be a sacrificial salvation figure like Jesus Christ and die on her own terms.
Philip You are right about the multiple worlds being similar to FFX but its even more developed for FF7. They are worlds constructed in the lifestream out of thoughts and memories so in this sense it is very similar to FFX's Zanarkand except instead of using an altered copy of a soul (Tidus for example) they involve actual souls that can appear there and have some self awareness within them. In a way its more realistic than FFX and they fit the lifestream model. The fact that they depict the future also has to do with how the lifestream works. In this model we see that souls are able to crossover (as we have seen with multiple characters.) IMO this is the only way the multiple worlds actually make sense
56:37 in the Japanese version, she says something along the lines of “this is the Cetra’s place.” I’m curious to know people’s thoughts on this is.
47:00 do you mean that Zack was placed in the real actual world? Or pulled out of his denial loop pocket within the lifestream?
Before getting to this scene I had heard peoples saying this scene was mishandled but watching it myself I understood what they were going for.
They really want to make clear how broken and in denial Cloud is. In a way that they likely couldn't have conveyed in the original. It's gonna be cool to see how they play this out in the 3rd game.
On a side note, I hope we get some kind of true Advent Children scene in the next game.