I thought hard about whether to upload this video or not. Because the build failed. But there were viewers who were curious, and it was a waste to film and edit the video, and I finally decided to upload it because I thought some of you might have something to gain from this video. No matter how high-rotation RC motors are, the motors are expected to be possible due to their large output, but this result came out. But I think the Ubox V2 I used this time was good enough. I'll try again soon. 이번 비디오는 업로드를 할지말지 고민이 많았습니다. 왜냐면 빌드를 실패했기 때문입니다. 하지만 궁금해했던 시청자들도 있었고 비디오를 찍고 편집한것도 아까웠고 또 이 비디오 안에서라도 얻을것이 있는분들이 있을것같아서 최종적으로 업로드 하기로 결정했습니다. 아무리 고회전 RC모터라고해도 모터가 갖은출력이 커서 가능할것으로 예상했는데 결국 이런결과가 나왔습니다. 하지만 이번에 사용한 Ubox V2는 괜찮은 ESC라고 생각됩니다. 조만간 다시 시도할것입니다.
Try using HFI setting in VESC, it offers hall sensor/encoder level accuracy for motors that does not have hall sensor. If it works fine with no load, but does not spin up properly when there is load, you will need sensor/encoder/HFI.
That beginning motion is normal for a sensorless motor because the observer in the VESC software doesn't know the position of the rotor so it cogs and goes back and forth like that. This motion is emphasized because you are using a high kv motor that doesn't have a whole lot of torque. You can solve this by trying to setup and use HFI or VSS (VSS is in 5.3 only) or you could also give it a little push in the beginning so that the VESC knows the rotor position and can spin the motor normally.
One of the biggest reasons I've decided it's a failure is the brake. The start could be done by pushing, but I couldn't help it when I couldn't get the brakes. I could understand more with your comment. Thanks a lot :)
I like that you uploaded this even though it was unsuccessful. It shows not every project will go smoothly even though you are an experienced builder. It's very honest of you to show us that something went wrong. Keep up the good work!
*A true builder, who isn't afraid of unsuccessful builds* 👏🏼👏🏼 ⚡🤙🏼🤙🏼⚡ Thank you for sharing this, I still like the build, really like the design with the "dual" deck! I hope to see it again soon
@@KAMiJUINs I love that you embraced this "failure" and made a video for us to see. It is important for people to see that even super builders sometimes have a build that has a problem, so thank you bro!!
Even though the build failed electrically it's still an awesome concept board and can easily be made to work with a different set of motors or something obviously. The whole thing is a win still due to the unique idea of using a deck under a deck for an enclosure. That's cool af. And I love how you keep updating this street build. The first one I liked, the second one I loved, and now I want to build a diy using a skateboard deck and skin it and theme it to a skateboard company I grew up skating, like black label, hook ups, toy machine, or world industries. It'd be pretty cool I think if it was all skinned and glass fritt and done right. Your build already proves that
Certainly the Electrical engineering was something I had never known until I came across the E-board. Maybe that's why there are still many parts that I don't understand even when I look up the data and study. But I uploaded the video because I thought viewers would have something to gain in terms of structure. Thank you for understanding and accepting it. :)
@@KAMiJUINs I'm working on my first diy. I need an adapter for my stormcore. I had a flipsky 4 plus laying around,it took me two days to realize I needed to rewire my uart port wires for the vx2 then when I finally do and it pairs and goes. I unplug everything to mount it and prep it, plug it all in and boom fried the vesc. Now it only powers the remote reciever. My adapter comes today for the xt60 to 90 and I'll be able to finally program and ride my first build today
Looks like typical sensorless motor spin-up cog. try using HFI setting in VESC, it offers hall sensor/encoder level accuracy for motors that does not have hall sensor. If it works fine with no load, but does not spin up properly when there is load, you will need sensor/encoder/HFI.
@@KAMiJUINs maybe, but that depends on a lot of factors. If you want you can join the esk8 news forums, we have a very active community and I'm sure there's someone that can help you.
Definitely use HFI. Also if you are getting abs_over_current faults you should try changing the slow ABS current limit from False to True. Usually you should have a 30% or so margin between the abs current limit and motor current.
Hello from Ukraine! I'm pretty sure you tried kickpush and then throttle. But if not - that has to be the problem. I had similar problem with my first hub motors. Moreover, i noticed that problem-solving is way more interesting then watching regular builds. So i really enjoyed vid. Keep it rolling!
Since those are high kV motors they will need the current limit set very high because the applied motor voltage at low speeds will be very low, so only way they are going to provide enough power is with high current. If you haven't done it already and the motors support it, definitely enable hall sensors, VESC will auto find very easily, and increase the current limit way higher, higher than you might think you need to, but be careful if you run for a while might overheat motors
Woaaaaa , quel monstre!!! Le style F1 est absolument superbe !!!! Moi j'ai mis un aileron de hpi baja 1/5 sur mon evolve GT carbon. Je pense que sur le tiens, le résultat serait encore mieux. 😉😉
i am surprise how well built and well looking it came out this project. You were in every detail. You need sensored brushless motors as they can offer hight torque at the lowest rpm because, due to hall sensors, they detect the exact position of the rotor knowing which pole power to start the rotation. It is not a problem of power but a problem of motor selection, in fact i believe 10kW is way too much for a skateoard. I strongly believe that with powerful sensored brushless motors this will end in a very high quality and custom electric skateboard
Yes, I agree with you. 10K is too much. In fact, this project wanted to see if the high-rotation RC motor could be used for E-boards. However, there are no sensors and four-pole high-rotation motors found that they needed much more current than I thought when starting, Thank you for your comment and watching :)
had the same issue but with sensored motors when the sensor cables weren't connected properly, maybe theres some extra setting in the vesc tool for unsensored motors. really cool board design.
An electric longskate. Nice. I came up with that spaced out design like 15 years ago for a low light board you could use for bombing. Making it an eskate out of it would be hella cool.
how are you charging the batteries? individually by pulling them out of the enclosure or do you use a BMS to directly charge them without a balance connector to each battery
When I saw the threaded inserts going into there, with epoxy, I said "nooo! that's not going to hold your weight, those are going to come right out of there!" I was relieved to see that the trucks (are they still trucks when they're that crazy?) were going to be mounted properly to the board elsewhere.
would it be possible to make a portable setup? since there are two motors, it could be possible to make the weels fold in, kinda like a dji drone, and maybe a backback that can carry it would very extra but also very cool
The build looks proper and very professional, other than the board being maybe a little too thin because you are putting the mounting on the sides and not directly under the main load how it is usually done with traditional skate boards, adding the layer below does help but I do not think it solves the problem if there even is one.
In ESC, there was no problem with the setup. However, the problem was my greed to use RC motors with too high rotational speed only by trusting the huge output. lol~ And a push start was possible, but there was a phenomenon in which the brakes were easily released. This could be a bigger problem...
Looks like normal clogging fro. Sensorless motors. Use HFI, it's going to make some weird noice at first, "low RPM" but then it will ride normal, it's what I use. Also should consider using way smaller motor pulleys for that hight Kv. Thanks for sharing g the build process, there is no Fails, just a step towards Perfections!
even though this wasnt succdessfull im happy you still uploaded it and everything, in my experience in working with brushless power systems is if typically if the motor has an issue it will cog but i feel like you should test each motor independently as i think the esc is the problem here
I’d love to hear more about your braking issues - they sound like they might be separate to the starting problems with the sensor less motors. I’ve only built one board and it was using the Spintend ubox, I noticed the bakes came off too early, but only at low (almost stopped) speed. I figured this might be how all boards work. But I’d love to know if it’s just a Spintend thing.
I think in braking, the motor with too high a rotation speed releases the braking power quickly due to its weak torque. For reference, these motors are RC motors that have about three times more rotational speed than generally used E-board motors.
와 이런 영상을 보게 되다니 너무 좋네요 일단 저같은경우 데저트버기를 4셀 병렬로 배터리 4개를 4셀로 운행하고 있습니다 고카트프로 트레일러 연결해서 끌고있는데 약간의 경사도까지는 거의 문제없이힘있게 끌어 주더라구요 평지에서는 뭐 말할 것도 없구요 4셀이니까 7.4v인데 이정도에서도 20kg데저트버기와 20kg트레일러 80kg의 저를 쉽게 끌 수있는데 저 조합에서 움직이질 못한다는게 저로서는 그냥 이해 불가네요 .... 잘 봤습니다 ^^
HFI + kickpush to start as a next step for sure. Stooge boards run similar motors with an 8s battery config in HFI/squarewave (I think, don’t quote me on that if I’m wrong) with boatloads of torque but need to be kickpushed to start.
I think your stators are saturated. This happens when sensorless motors have high amps and volts at low speeds it causes cogging because it's difficult for it to track it's position. Did u try lower amps?
@@KAMiJUINs this is how it's said in the app: while using high currents the stator can get saturated, this will change the motor peramters making it hard for the sensorless observer to track the rotor position. The effect is most noticeable at high currents and low speeds. It will get stuck and then "cog" when open loop operation tries to restart the motor. If you notice this you can try to increase the perameter to attempt to compensate for the affect of the saturated stator making it possible to run high currents at low speed. Reasonable values for this perameter are 15% or less. If going higher than this gives good results something else is likely wrong. I saw this and it reminded me of your build so I thought you may like to know and possibly figure this out.
Does the build work propperly if you manually push it once? Stand on the board and give it a good push, if the motor starts to kick in after that then the issue lies in how the motor is build, some electric motors can not operate without a sensor or something being triggered, not an expert on that matter
Yeah, the high-rotation RC motor was capable of push start, but the brakes are released quickly due to the weak torque of the motors with too high a rotation speed. I think, this can be more problem. ㅜ_ㅜ' Anyway, thanks for your comment~
You may need to give the board (motors) a push to get it started (the esc is trying to determine which direction the motors are turning but can't because too much current is required (high KV motor and too large current needed).
I have confirmed that it is possible. However, the motor with too high a rotation speed to be used on the E-board had the problem of losing braking power quickly due to weak torque even when braking. I think I'll have to do it all over again. Thank you for the comment :)
@@KAMiJUINs I've been looking at decks now lol biggest park deck I found was 9x34 so I think that's a good size to put one on lol I'll have to try building the enclosure like yourself the first time out of the sheet you cut n glued. Get some custom vinyle prints n bam
С самого начала было понятно, что эта система будет работать только после движения. Как только разгонишься - тогда можно включать моторы. Потому-что такие моторы.
I will point out that while a motor may be rated for a certain voltage you can run it at a higher voltage with no issues (up to a certain point) This is commonly done in the ebike modding community. It will cause the motor to simply run at a higher RPM. Due to the brushless nature of the motors used you don't have to worry about higher voltages wearing your brushes down. In conclusion you should be just fine running the 13S rated motors with the Spintend VESC at the full 16S voltage. For the record I don't believe this was a failed build at all and love the concept of the double deck deisgn :)
If what other people suggested doesn't work, I recommend running it at a lower series and higher parallel configuration since the motors have very high kv. Combined with high voltage from 12-16s battery, it would spin too fast for a set voltage, that's why maybe 4s or 6s is better with such high kv motors
@@makex_se To be fair stooge boards run 8s with large high kv inrunners and have a boatload more torque than most boards so I wouldn’t entirely rule out the above suggestion
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 don't mean to laugh but that's really funny ..I done same thing with a rc car I built a custom heavy duty body but evidently it was to heavy duty 🤣🤣
Need higher c rating on the battery's 60c to 80c would allow for higher amp discharge. I personally am running 4x 6000mah 100c 6s Graphine, 2x series then parallel = 12s 12000mah. BTW your videos inspired me to get into esk8ing, and I built myself 2 custom boards.
This looks a lot like a square wave problem I had a long time ago in college where the peak of the wave wasn’t wide enough to allow a servo motor to actuate for long enough and it would just wiggle in place. It’s gotta be the settings.
High KV motors generally have less pole pairs/magnets and without hall sensors they have hard time accelerating from 0 For an electric skateboard you want at least 7 pole pairs.
Looks really cool But in my experience, just too short for high speeds I built an old school Santa Cruise and got horrible wobble around 22mph no matter what I tried
I use the ubox on many of my builds including the 100v v2 for a 18s board. so the esc shouldn't be the issue. I'm surprised you still had a problem when switching back to normal motors. Would love to see detection run to try and diagnose. Making sure it's setup for 16s.
I had to tweak inertia settings to a point that were insane to get bigger motors to run with my fat ass on them. Try upping it past 15 and see how you go then!
I've known what you're meaning. That's why I tried. The torque was expected to be weak. However, it was expected that it would be possible because the motor had a large maximum output and increased the number of bolts and discharge rate accordingly. But the result was a failure. ㅜ_ㅜ''
Thank you so much :) ua-cam.com/video/dEED8037tKk/v-deo.html It's a video of the boosted board battery extension. Wouldn't it be possible if you design a new enclosure after referring to this?
I think it's not working because those motors aren't sensored. Sensored motors will start from a complete stop smoothly, but motors like this need a push. Also, you might want to add more batteries because I doubt that those lipos will be able to handle the currents that you would want to use for motors that big, and if they do you definitely won't have much range
I have confirmed that it is possible to push start. However, the motor with too high a rotation speed to be used on the E-board had the problem of losing braking power quickly due to weak torque even when braking also. And the battery was not increased because the discharge rate of the battery already exceeded the maximum output power of the ESC. So I only connected to the right configuration for performance testing. I think I'll have to do it all over again. Thank you for the comment :)
I've never heard of such a problem. The Vesctool detects the voltage and automatically sets the cutoff voltage according to the number of cells. Click on the general of VESCtool to check it out... Still, I understand that if over-discharge occurs, the battery should be disassembled and checked.
tl:dr : 320A sensorless motors powered by a 200A ESC wont work well. especially at the start where sensorless motor can draw way more current than rated to get going (really short spike) looks to me like your ESC is trying not to fry itself up ^^ sensorless motor under load will have struggle starting if they don't recieve enough current. the ESC being limited to 200A is your issue here I think. I see you're ESC telling the motors to go, the motors asking for a lot of juice to get going and the ESC saying "NOPE" can't do. 200A max boys :D In drone racing, setups this would be a dead esc (really cheap little and light esc don't have good current protection) I ussually imagine the power chain as a river : battery is the lake atop the montain, ESC is the canyon guiding the water to the valley and the motors are the farmers watering their crops. For the crops to grow the lake has to be big enough, the canyon as to let more water thru than the famers are using. Here I see a small lake and a very tight canyon... the crops are dying before spring. You know the motors can draw 320A to produce their advertised 10kW, You're ESC should be able to deliver this AT LEAST and your batteries should be rated for 320A continuous draw too otherwise you'll never get 10kW out of these motors and you'll probably burn something. Giving these motors are sensorless I would go for 500A burst rated ESC and batteries and 320-350A continuous esc and batteries but this is gonna get expensive very quick... using smaller motors is a better idea, go find some 3000 W motors at the same voltage (6000W with 2 so approx ~ 190A) But as I read here in the comments, going the sensored way might work : with the feedback from the motor the ESC can make them go as efficiently as it can (with less current depending on your settings :) ) I've also read you have breaking issues wich to me sounds like current limitation again. Good esc you have tho! didn't blew up! :D I'm used to drone and plane stuff that goes in flames way more easily XD and whan you showed the components I instantly expected to see flames ^^'... Also : I love the look of that board! really hope you can make it work :D
Wow~ Thank you so x 1000 much for your comments. I also think the motor selection was wrong from the beginning. I started this project out of curiosity to use the high-rotation RC motor, also I had an ESC that supported up to 16s. It seems to be a very different mechanism from the 14 pole outrunner motor used for ordinary E-Boards. The 14 pole-sensored motor operates accordingly even if the maximum current is not used. But the 4-pole inner RC motor(Sensorless) seems to require a huge amount of current when starting. As you said, I think I have to use an ESC's output and battery discharge rate above that if I want to use the motors. Maybe I'll change the motor and try again someday. Thank you again for your sincere comments :)
some thoughts. you may realize that All of the mass is supported at two 'points'; at an Angle; via a bunch of Rather small and long screws.!!!! it is probable that low-pole-count motors should not be used, for this application. such motors produce have a limited ability to 'start-up', when fully loaded. because the the load occurs at a 'large' radius/the tires, the actual amount of reduction-MA present at the load, is reduced; by maybe eighty percent.! googletranslate
I thought hard about whether to upload this video or not. Because the build failed. But there were viewers who were curious, and it was a waste to film and edit the video, and I finally decided to upload it because I thought some of you might have something to gain from this video. No matter how high-rotation RC motors are, the motors are expected to be possible due to their large output, but this result came out. But I think the Ubox V2 I used this time was good enough. I'll try again soon.
이번 비디오는 업로드를 할지말지 고민이 많았습니다. 왜냐면 빌드를 실패했기 때문입니다. 하지만 궁금해했던 시청자들도 있었고 비디오를 찍고 편집한것도 아까웠고 또 이 비디오 안에서라도 얻을것이 있는분들이 있을것같아서 최종적으로 업로드 하기로 결정했습니다. 아무리 고회전 RC모터라고해도 모터가 갖은출력이 커서 가능할것으로 예상했는데 결국 이런결과가 나왔습니다. 하지만 이번에 사용한 Ubox V2는 괜찮은 ESC라고 생각됩니다. 조만간 다시 시도할것입니다.
Try using HFI setting in VESC, it offers hall sensor/encoder level accuracy for motors that does not have hall sensor.
If it works fine with no load, but does not spin up properly when there is load, you will need sensor/encoder/HFI.
That beginning motion is normal for a sensorless motor because the observer in the VESC software doesn't know the position of the rotor so it cogs and goes back and forth like that. This motion is emphasized because you are using a high kv motor that doesn't have a whole lot of torque. You can solve this by trying to setup and use HFI or VSS (VSS is in 5.3 only) or you could also give it a little push in the beginning so that the VESC knows the rotor position and can spin the motor normally.
Thank you for letting me know. I'll try to do that :)
One of the biggest reasons I've decided it's a failure is the brake. The start could be done by pushing, but I couldn't help it when I couldn't get the brakes. I could understand more with your comment. Thanks a lot :)
Thank you for thinking that and watching :)
I like that you uploaded this even though it was unsuccessful. It shows not every project will go smoothly even though you are an experienced builder. It's very honest of you to show us that something went wrong. Keep up the good work!
Thank you for saying that and watching :) Really~
It didn't fail because a build is really about the friends you made along the way. 👍🏽💯
Thank you for saying that and watching~ REALLY :)
*A true builder, who isn't afraid of unsuccessful builds* 👏🏼👏🏼
⚡🤙🏼🤙🏼⚡
Thank you for sharing this, I still like the build, really like the design with the "dual" deck!
I hope to see it again soon
As a matter of fact, I fear of failure lol :) And I like the double-deck structure same like you!
@@KAMiJUINs I love that you embraced this "failure" and made a video for us to see. It is important for people to see that even super builders sometimes have a build that has a problem, so thank you bro!!
Even though the build failed electrically it's still an awesome concept board and can easily be made to work with a different set of motors or something obviously. The whole thing is a win still due to the unique idea of using a deck under a deck for an enclosure. That's cool af. And I love how you keep updating this street build. The first one I liked, the second one I loved, and now I want to build a diy using a skateboard deck and skin it and theme it to a skateboard company I grew up skating, like black label, hook ups, toy machine, or world industries. It'd be pretty cool I think if it was all skinned and glass fritt and done right. Your build already proves that
Certainly the Electrical engineering was something I had never known until I came across the E-board. Maybe that's why there are still many parts that I don't understand even when I look up the data and study. But I uploaded the video because I thought viewers would have something to gain in terms of structure. Thank you for understanding and accepting it. :)
@@KAMiJUINs I'm working on my first diy. I need an adapter for my stormcore. I had a flipsky 4 plus laying around,it took me two days to realize I needed to rewire my uart port wires for the vx2 then when I finally do and it pairs and goes. I unplug everything to mount it and prep it, plug it all in and boom fried the vesc. Now it only powers the remote reciever. My adapter comes today for the xt60 to 90 and I'll be able to finally program and ride my first build today
@@KAMiJUINsyeah.. building an eskateboard is NOT engineering of any kind.
I thought the number of subscribers is 33 million, you deserve it
Thank you for watching :)
Looks like typical sensorless motor spin-up cog.
try using HFI setting in VESC, it offers hall sensor/encoder level accuracy for motors that does not have hall sensor.
If it works fine with no load, but does not spin up properly when there is load, you will need sensor/encoder/HFI.
Yep, try using HFI if you haven't already. That looks like normal cogging to me, probably because the bigger motors need more starting amperage.
@@Jack-tx6ei yes, very typical sensorless startup cog
Thank you for letting me know~ and Is it possible to solve a brake that immediately loses braking power too?
@@KAMiJUINs maybe, but that depends on a lot of factors. If you want you can join the esk8 news forums, we have a very active community and I'm sure there's someone that can help you.
Definitely use HFI. Also if you are getting abs_over_current faults you should try changing the slow ABS current limit from False to True. Usually you should have a 30% or so margin between the abs current limit and motor current.
Hello from Ukraine!
I'm pretty sure you tried kickpush and then throttle. But if not - that has to be the problem. I had similar problem with my first hub motors.
Moreover, i noticed that problem-solving is way more interesting then watching regular builds.
So i really enjoyed vid. Keep it rolling!
Приємно знаходити на іншомовних канал земляків. Тим паче на таких вузькоспеціалізованих))
Thank you for watching~
Here here
you just gave me a perfect way to make an enclosure. thank u very much.
That alone makes me happy, HAHA~ Thanks :)
Since those are high kV motors they will need the current limit set very high because the applied motor voltage at low speeds will be very low, so only way they are going to provide enough power is with high current.
If you haven't done it already and the motors support it, definitely enable hall sensors, VESC will auto find very easily, and increase the current limit way higher, higher than you might think you need to, but be careful if you run for a while might overheat motors
Yes, this setting was too much from the beginning. Thank you for your professional comment.~ :)
Woaaaaa , quel monstre!!!
Le style F1 est absolument superbe !!!!
Moi j'ai mis un aileron de hpi baja 1/5 sur mon evolve GT carbon.
Je pense que sur le tiens, le résultat serait encore mieux. 😉😉
You are an incredible artist. very impressed
Thank you for saying that and watching :)
i am surprise how well built and well looking it came out this project. You were in every detail. You need sensored brushless motors as they can offer hight torque at the lowest rpm because, due to hall sensors, they detect the exact position of the rotor knowing which pole power to start the rotation. It is not a problem of power but a problem of motor selection, in fact i believe 10kW is way too much for a skateoard. I strongly believe that with powerful sensored brushless motors this will end in a very high quality and custom electric skateboard
Yes, I agree with you. 10K is too much. In fact, this project wanted to see if the high-rotation RC motor could be used for E-boards. However, there are no sensors and four-pole high-rotation motors found that they needed much more current than I thought when starting,
Thank you for your comment and watching :)
Great video hope to see that thing ripping soon
Thank you coming and watching :)
had the same issue but with sensored motors when the sensor cables weren't connected properly, maybe theres some extra setting in the vesc tool for unsensored motors. really cool board design.
Thank you for watching and your comment~ :)
@@KAMiJUINs you're welcome love your board designs and builds.
Try the castle creations 1717 motor its the same size but sensored
I think, that is one of the very good alternatives. Thanks for letting me know :)
@@KAMiJUINs or you could go bigger with a castle creations 2028
As always gorgeous bro looks amazing
Thank you so much as always, bro :)
we have to forget this boomer thing that being scared of failed projects. im glad u uploaded it! cheers dude
Thank you for watching ~ :)
An electric longskate. Nice. I came up with that spaced out design like 15 years ago for a low light board you could use for bombing. Making it an eskate out of it would be hella cool.
Thank you for watching ~ :)
What sleeves are you using on those wheels? I tried the bound motor urethane but did not have good luck with it.
how are you charging the batteries? individually by pulling them out of the enclosure or do you use a BMS to directly charge them without a balance connector to each battery
These are Lipo batteries that do not include BMS. To charge, have to use a balance charger.
It looks very nice !!
Look good only on the outside lol :) Thanks~~~
When I saw the threaded inserts going into there, with epoxy, I said "nooo! that's not going to hold your weight, those are going to come right out of there!" I was relieved to see that the trucks (are they still trucks when they're that crazy?) were going to be mounted properly to the board elsewhere.
HaHa :) Thanks you for watching ~
awesome video my brother!
Thank you for coming and watching, brother :)
Kick push to start. The good old days.
There was a problem not only with the start but also with the braking, so I think I need to do it again completely. Thank you for the comment~
@@KAMiJUINs were your batteries fully charged? This affects braking by a large margin.
would it be possible to make a portable setup? since there are two motors, it could be possible to make the weels fold in, kinda like a dji drone, and maybe a backback that can carry it would very extra but also very cool
Well... I think this will be too heavy to fold and it will be hard to guarantee durability.
Thanks~
The build looks proper and very professional, other than the board being maybe a little too thin because you are putting the mounting on the sides and not directly under the main load how it is usually done with traditional skate boards, adding the layer below does help but I do not think it solves the problem if there even is one.
Did you try changing the motor style settings? You chose Inrunner , may have to choose alternate
What kind of range can a set of lipo batteries like that get you?? Im guessing that'd be considered a 16s1p??
fighting !!!! sure you get it bro!!!!! 😊👍
Sure ~ Thank you so much as always bro :)
What happened with the 16s/Ubox setup when you kick-started the board?
In ESC, there was no problem with the setup. However, the problem was my greed to use RC motors with too high rotational speed only by trusting the huge output. lol~ And a push start was possible, but there was a phenomenon in which the brakes were easily released. This could be a bigger problem...
Looks like normal clogging fro. Sensorless motors. Use HFI, it's going to make some weird noice at first, "low RPM" but then it will ride normal, it's what I use. Also should consider using way smaller motor pulleys for that hight Kv. Thanks for sharing g the build process, there is no Fails, just a step towards Perfections!
Thank you for saying and watching, bro :) I'll refer to your comment too~
Ne pas faire de tests c'est ne pas apprendre et ne pas progresser 👍
Toujours aussi cool les vidéos 👍
oaui enfin utiliser des moteur en 480kv sur des énormes roues c'est pas faire un test, c'est juste être stupide.
Merci d'avoir dit cela et de regarder ma vidéo comme toujours :)
Hi. What deck angle do you like best?
Normally 30%~ Thanks :)
It’s normal if u don’t have hall, u need to setup hfi to have smooth start
Thank you for letting me know~ and Is it possible to solve a brake that immediately loses braking power too?
@@KAMiJUINs iam no expert in vesc, but it could be the setting for how many amp going back to battery
I didn't think you could do the lipos that way won't the 4s pack die way before the 6s paks. I'm so confused now lol
Because the capacity per pack is the same and the discharge rate is the same, it will not happen in a serial connection~
even though this wasnt succdessfull im happy you still uploaded it and everything, in my experience in working with brushless power systems is if typically if the motor has an issue it will cog but i feel like you should test each motor independently as i think the esc is the problem here
Thank you for saying that :) And I've already checked the ESC, but there was no problem~
I’d love to hear more about your braking issues - they sound like they might be separate to the starting problems with the sensor less motors.
I’ve only built one board and it was using the Spintend ubox, I noticed the bakes came off too early, but only at low (almost stopped) speed. I figured this might be how all boards work. But I’d love to know if it’s just a Spintend thing.
I think in braking, the motor with too high a rotation speed releases the braking power quickly due to its weak torque.
For reference, these motors are RC motors that have about three times more rotational speed than generally used E-board motors.
와 이런 영상을 보게 되다니 너무 좋네요
일단 저같은경우 데저트버기를 4셀 병렬로 배터리 4개를 4셀로 운행하고 있습니다
고카트프로 트레일러 연결해서 끌고있는데
약간의 경사도까지는 거의 문제없이힘있게 끌어 주더라구요
평지에서는 뭐 말할 것도 없구요
4셀이니까 7.4v인데
이정도에서도
20kg데저트버기와 20kg트레일러 80kg의 저를 쉽게 끌 수있는데
저 조합에서 움직이질 못한다는게 저로서는 그냥 이해 불가네요 ....
잘 봤습니다 ^^
시청감사합니다. 한가지원인이아닌 여러가지 문제가 복합적으로 발생한 조합이였던것같습니다.
고회전 RC용 모터(센서리스, 4 폴)를 전동보드용으로 적용해보려고 했는데 맞지 않는 조합으로 보입니다.
HFI + kickpush to start as a next step for sure. Stooge boards run similar motors with an 8s battery config in HFI/squarewave (I think, don’t quote me on that if I’m wrong) with boatloads of torque but need to be kickpushed to start.
Thank you for your comment. I'll keep that in mind, but another problem is the brakes. The brake's power loses off too quickly. ㅜ_ㅜ
good luck my friend. I couldn't find the engine, can you post the link?
Check this out~
fr.aliexpress.com/item/33038799136.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef5e5bACaJTo&gatewayAdapt=glo2fra
Thank you for watching~
I think your stators are saturated. This happens when sensorless motors have high amps and volts at low speeds it causes cogging because it's difficult for it to track it's position. Did u try lower amps?
Thank you for the comments. I'll try as you say and I'll let you know~ :)
@@KAMiJUINs this is how it's said in the app: while using high currents the stator can get saturated, this will change the motor peramters making it hard for the sensorless observer to track the rotor position. The effect is most noticeable at high currents and low speeds. It will get stuck and then "cog" when open loop operation tries to restart the motor. If you notice this you can try to increase the perameter to attempt to compensate for the affect of the saturated stator making it possible to run high currents at low speed. Reasonable values for this perameter are 15% or less. If going higher than this gives good results something else is likely wrong.
I saw this and it reminded me of your build so I thought you may like to know and possibly figure this out.
Does the build work propperly if you manually push it once?
Stand on the board and give it a good push, if the motor starts to kick in after that then the issue lies in how the motor is build, some electric motors can not operate without a sensor or something being triggered, not an expert on that matter
Yeah, I already did what you said. But there was also a problem with braking :(
Thank you for your comment~
@@KAMiJUINs
Can you give me the link to the website where you bought the motor from?
fr.aliexpress.com/item/33038799136.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.0.0.21ef5e5bq8eevX&gatewayAdapt=glo2fra
이런거 보면 진짜 너무 신기하네요 ㅋㅋ 실패했다쳐도 이렇게 만드는걸 보면 역시 일반인으로써는 신기 그자체
시청감사합니다~ :)
I know others have said this but the one board I have without sensors always needs a kick start… kind of annoying but it makes it work
Yeah, the high-rotation RC motor was capable of push start, but the brakes are released quickly due to the weak torque of the motors with too high a rotation speed. I think, this can be more problem. ㅜ_ㅜ' Anyway, thanks for your comment~
@@KAMiJUINs vesc tool settings and check again. But the ubox sometimes has issues.
You may need to give the board (motors) a push to get it started (the esc is trying to determine which direction the motors are turning but can't because too much current is required (high KV motor and too large current needed).
I have confirmed that it is possible. However, the motor with too high a rotation speed to be used on the E-board had the problem of losing braking power quickly due to weak torque even when braking. I think I'll have to do it all over again. Thank you for the comment :)
How wide is that deck
7, 3/4'' - 19.5cm
@@KAMiJUINs I've been looking at decks now lol biggest park deck I found was 9x34 so I think that's a good size to put one on lol I'll have to try building the enclosure like yourself the first time out of the sheet you cut n glued. Get some custom vinyle prints n bam
Try increasing the amp when doing the motor calibration sensing.
thank you for your comment :)
아쉽네요 엄청 이쁘게 잘 만드셨는데 문제점 찾으셔서 고치실수있을거에요!
네 ~ 말씀감사합니다 :)
You are so cool 👍👍👍👍 always 🐶👏👏👏👏
Thank you so much as always~ :)
This is a curious one. It's good to show lessons learnt during and after building. Kami took a look at it too right?
He turned a blind eye to me. lol :) Thank you for watching as always, bro~
Is it possessed?
No way~ lol , Attempts to use a high-rotation RC motor on the E-board led to this result.
С самого начала было понятно, что эта система будет работать только после движения. Как только разгонишься - тогда можно включать моторы. Потому-что такие моторы.
Спасибо за комментарий~
Best regards from Indonesia 🇮🇩🇮🇩🇮🇩
Thank you for watching
Best regards too :)
I will point out that while a motor may be rated for a certain voltage you can run it at a higher voltage with no issues (up to a certain point) This is commonly done in the ebike modding community.
It will cause the motor to simply run at a higher RPM. Due to the brushless nature of the motors used you don't have to worry about higher voltages wearing your brushes down.
In conclusion you should be just fine running the 13S rated motors with the Spintend VESC at the full 16S voltage.
For the record I don't believe this was a failed build at all and love the concept of the double deck deisgn :)
thank you so much for your comment :)
If what other people suggested doesn't work, I recommend running it at a lower series and higher parallel configuration since the motors have very high kv. Combined with high voltage from 12-16s battery, it would spin too fast for a set voltage, that's why maybe 4s or 6s is better with such high kv motors
Lower voltage means lower amps meaning less torque so your suggestion wont work.
@@makex_se To be fair stooge boards run 8s with large high kv inrunners and have a boatload more torque than most boards so I wouldn’t entirely rule out the above suggestion
@@ajplant96 but nothing in the universe suggest lowering voltage would increase torque. thats just not how electricity works...
I'll refer to all your comments ~
@@makex_se You’d have to talk to Moe Stooge about how their boards work but yeah, heaps of torque on them
아무래도 높은kv모터[고회전]에 센서리스[출발코킹] 그리고 낮은 기어비가 문제인듯합니다 kv에 맞게 기어비를 많이 높여주셔야 할듯합니다 센서드지원을 하지 않으면 높은kv때문에 출발이 힘들것 같습니다 푸쉬오프하시면 아마 출발 가능하겠습니다^^ 잘 해결되길 빕니다~~
문제가 생각보다 복잡했어요. 기어비를 키우는것도 한계가 있었고 푸쉬 스타트를하면 가능하긴하나 브레이크역시도 약한 토크를 견디지 못하고 바로 풀려버리는 현상이 생기더라구요.
고회전 RC 모터를 출력만 믿고 활용해보려했던 욕심이 컸던것 같습니다.ㅋ
I think you need sensored motors and sensored esc's.
The ESC was sensored, but the motors were not... maybe that is one of the ways~
@@KAMiJUINs Yeah, you need both of them to be sensored.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 don't mean to laugh but that's really funny ..I done same thing with a rc car I built a custom heavy duty body but evidently it was to heavy duty 🤣🤣
Need higher c rating on the battery's 60c to 80c would allow for higher amp discharge. I personally am running 4x 6000mah 100c 6s Graphine, 2x series then parallel = 12s 12000mah.
BTW your videos inspired me to get into esk8ing, and I built myself 2 custom boards.
Thank you for your comment, I'll refer to it :) And I'm glad my video inspired you.
This looks a lot like a square wave problem I had a long time ago in college where the peak of the wave wasn’t wide enough to allow a servo motor to actuate for long enough and it would just wiggle in place. It’s gotta be the settings.
Thanks for your comment~
Hook up the sensor cables..
8:54 Cute dog content
Thank you for watching, friend :)
For a moment i thought one motor was spinning one way and the other motor was spinning the other way haha
HaHa :) I tried to use motors for RC with high rotational speed, and there were complicated problems.
Thank you for watching ~
High KV motors generally have less pole pairs/magnets and without hall sensors they have hard time accelerating from 0
For an electric skateboard you want at least 7 pole pairs.
Thank you for your comment, I didn't know the exact relationship between the number of poles and rotation but thank you for letting me know~
You dont want to feel the motors full performance. It would be an instant crash/backflip.
죄송 하지만 저 보드데크 구입링크좀 알려주세요..
답변 드렸습니다. (죄송할 일은 아닙니다) :)
Looks really cool
But in my experience, just too short for high speeds
I built an old school Santa Cruise and got horrible wobble around 22mph no matter what I tried
I agree with you a little bit. The wheelbase(32'' / 82cm) is rather short for high-speed riding.
Thanks~
Get some good ol sensored brushless motors
That is one of the ways~
I use the ubox on many of my builds including the 100v v2 for a 18s board. so the esc shouldn't be the issue. I'm surprised you still had a problem when switching back to normal motors. Would love to see detection run to try and diagnose. Making sure it's setup for 16s.
No!!! There was no problem when I changed to normal E-board motors. I personally like the Ubox V2... was good enough.~
Los errores te hicieron mas sabio 👌🤟👍🔩🔧🤟
Gracias por decir eso :)
I had to tweak inertia settings to a point that were insane to get bigger motors to run with my fat ass on them. Try upping it past 15 and see how you go then!
Thank you for leaving a comment~ :)
@@KAMiJUINs Thanks for uploading the video!
We like seeing success and failures, its how we learn most! :)
모터가 흐느끼노ㅠㅠ
실패 영상이라 하셨지만, 저는 빌드 과정에서 여러가지 배웠습니다. 결코 실패하지 않으셨음을 말씀드려요!
감사합니다^^
그렇게 봐주셨다니 감사합니다 ㅎㅎ
If you tripple the Motor KV you are 3 times faster but have 3 times less torque. Unless you have like a 10:1 reduction those motors are stupid.
I've known what you're meaning. That's why I tried. The torque was expected to be weak.
However, it was expected that it would be possible because the motor had a large maximum output and increased the number of bolts and discharge rate accordingly. But the result was a failure. ㅜ_ㅜ''
@@KAMiJUINs yes it’s Stange that it did not work at all. If it uses 100A it should still behave like a 30A motor
Nice
Thank you for watching :)
Always love to see your builds and follow you on instagram … is there a way to make a bigger battery for the boosted board!?
Thank you so much :)
ua-cam.com/video/dEED8037tKk/v-deo.html
It's a video of the boosted board battery extension. Wouldn't it be possible if you design a new enclosure after referring to this?
I think it's not working because those motors aren't sensored. Sensored motors will start from a complete stop smoothly, but motors like this need a push.
Also, you might want to add more batteries because I doubt that those lipos will be able to handle the currents that you would want to use for motors that big, and if they do you definitely won't have much range
I have confirmed that it is possible to push start. However, the motor with too high a rotation speed to be used on the E-board had the problem of losing braking power quickly due to weak torque even when braking also. And the battery was not increased because the discharge rate of the battery already exceeded the maximum output power of the ESC. So I only connected to the right configuration for performance testing.
I think I'll have to do it all over again. Thank you for the comment :)
Maybe if you started from a roll it would work.
Yes, I did. But there was also a problem of losing power quickly when braking. ㅜ_ㅜ''
@@KAMiJUINs ya that could get pretty bad. Quick question what do you set your cut off voltage for 12s. I keep having issues over discharging
I've never heard of such a problem. The Vesctool detects the voltage and automatically sets the cutoff voltage according to the number of cells.
Click on the general of VESCtool to check it out... Still, I understand that if over-discharge occurs, the battery should be disassembled and checked.
This is super dope👍👍👍👍💪💪🦾🦾😎😎
Thank you for watching~ :)
tl:dr : 320A sensorless motors powered by a 200A ESC wont work well. especially at the start where sensorless motor can draw way more current than rated to get going (really short spike)
looks to me like your ESC is trying not to fry itself up ^^ sensorless motor under load will have struggle starting if they don't recieve enough current. the ESC being limited to 200A is your issue here I think.
I see you're ESC telling the motors to go, the motors asking for a lot of juice to get going and the ESC saying "NOPE" can't do. 200A max boys :D
In drone racing, setups this would be a dead esc (really cheap little and light esc don't have good current protection)
I ussually imagine the power chain as a river : battery is the lake atop the montain, ESC is the canyon guiding the water to the valley and the motors are the farmers watering their crops. For the crops to grow the lake has to be big enough, the canyon as to let more water thru than the famers are using.
Here I see a small lake and a very tight canyon... the crops are dying before spring.
You know the motors can draw 320A to produce their advertised 10kW, You're ESC should be able to deliver this AT LEAST and your batteries should be rated for 320A continuous draw too otherwise you'll never get 10kW out of these motors and you'll probably burn something.
Giving these motors are sensorless I would go for 500A burst rated ESC and batteries and 320-350A continuous esc and batteries but this is gonna get expensive very quick... using smaller motors is a better idea, go find some 3000 W motors at the same voltage (6000W with 2 so approx ~ 190A)
But as I read here in the comments, going the sensored way might work : with the feedback from the motor the ESC can make them go as efficiently as it can (with less current depending on your settings :) )
I've also read you have breaking issues wich to me sounds like current limitation again.
Good esc you have tho! didn't blew up! :D I'm used to drone and plane stuff that goes in flames way more easily XD and whan you showed the components I instantly expected to see flames ^^'...
Also : I love the look of that board! really hope you can make it work :D
Wow~ Thank you so x 1000 much for your comments.
I also think the motor selection was wrong from the beginning. I started this project out of curiosity to use the high-rotation RC motor, also I had an ESC that supported up to 16s.
It seems to be a very different mechanism from the 14 pole outrunner motor used for ordinary E-Boards. The 14 pole-sensored motor operates accordingly even if the maximum current is not used. But the 4-pole inner RC motor(Sensorless) seems to require a huge amount of current when starting.
As you said, I think I have to use an ESC's output and battery discharge rate above that if I want to use the motors.
Maybe I'll change the motor and try again someday.
Thank you again for your sincere comments :)
Yes try HFI
Yes, i will~ Thanks :)
Did you fail or learn something?
I've learned that there's a reason why people don'.... lol :)
Thanks~
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
Thanks :)
Try one day you can fly
I'm going to die before I fly lol ~ Thank you for watching :)
some thoughts. you may realize that All of the mass is supported at two 'points'; at an Angle; via a bunch of Rather small and long screws.!!!! it is probable that low-pole-count motors should not be used, for this application. such motors produce have a limited ability to 'start-up', when fully loaded. because the the load occurs at a 'large' radius/the tires, the actual amount of reduction-MA present at the load, is reduced; by maybe eighty percent.! googletranslate
I understand. Thank you for the comments~ :)
Türkiye’de kimde öyle bişey yok
???
High performance custom board. High end parts. Sensorless motor operation??? WHY.
Batman longboard
Do you think so? HaHa, Thank you for watching :)
I would have push start it
I did that but didn't work
Thanks
@@KAMiJUINs did you push hard enough
@@KAMiJUINs did you put the esc to senoreless mode
I don't remember for sure because it's been so long, but I tried all the things I could do after listening to various advice.
Anyway thanks bro :)
@@KAMiJUINs do you have any brushless rc cars maybe you can connect it to those escs
Si
Gracias por verla~
Name song
error 404: torque not found
Increase the quality of your thought if you wish to engage with people outside of your usual circles,,,,,,, its not brain science is it,, KMT