Really neat, congratulations on your new toy. I myself just bought a Atlas arbor press. Mine was made in 1912 and it still works perfect even though it’s over a hundred years
In my shop we had 3 presses. A ten ton press brake. A hydraulic press to 6 thousand psi on a five inch ram and an Arbor press. All used much. Our arbor press turntable started out at 3/4", up to 2 1/2. I have hung off the handle, till giving in and going to the hydraulic press. The pressure gauge on the hydraulic was directly visible, so you could push the handle for as much force as you needed, so you wouldn't destroy a 1" piece of metal.
Oddly enough, welding cast iron was one of the few topics covered in my single half-year of metal work at comprehensive school. I seem to remember that if you _do_ weld rather than braze you need to apply a heat treatment to the whole finished piece in an oven--or I think it was a 'ceramic chip forge' that was used. This is to take away some of the excessive hardness from the cast iron that welding introduces. That is what I *very* foggily remember anyway!
Yep, ya gotta get the whole thing just below critical, soak and let cool in place for 24 hours. ABOM79 covered this recently in a video where he had a cast piece made and it embrittled because it was removed too quickly.
That is a beautiful restoration. Thanks so much for sharing. I just purchased a Famco 3 1/2C model and the arm pivot slot had some similar wearing on it. It great to see how you repaired yours.
Dave Tarrant I just picked up a 3 1/2 non ratcheting press. Any chance you could share dimensions of the brake spacer on your press? I’m going to have to fabricate one.
@23:56 there looks to be room on the left and right of the ram to put some rectangular sections of oiled felt.. and also a piece inside the front cover above the insert plate.. perhaps 1/2" x 5/16 x 1.5" so three of the four sides get oil wick lubed every up and down stroke. might be an easy update..
Hey Keith for the slot that you just fixed I'd suggest 5th wheel grease. Years ago I bought a spray can of Amsoil synthetic 5th wheel grease. What made me think of it for this is the stuff sprays on but then becomes real tacky and is designed for low motion high pressure applications; like this. Just line the new slot and the stuff will stay put for years, and likely eliminate most of the wear. Lookin good!
Thanks to your work on this press, I was able to correct the placement of the over arm on a "DAKE" 5 ton arbor press and now it works as it should... Thanks again...
i worked at a fab shop that did cast iron repair they would do the milling as you have done then they would dowel pin brazing rods in a hundred different angles seems like any way then heat the part to melt the brazing rod then boarx the part for flux so it was i repair from inside out very strong joint i was young working there today no one would take that much time to weld something. great repair thaks for showing us how you do it
Great video Keith. It must be fantastic to get hold of machines/tools like that, over the pond here in England everything is very rare and so gets top dollars which is just way out of my league. The care and attention you put into your restorations is inspiring, perhaps one day I will drop lucky and be able to do the same. Keep the videos coming...
5 років тому+1
Maybe a trip to Poland and/or Czechoslovakia (combined for convenience....?) with trailer in tow.....before the effects of Brexit take hold. Maybe the same dynamics would apply to Spain, Italy, and Portugal....??? What about Ireland?
@ It's a good idea but I'm unable to travel very far due to a back condition (Osteoporosis has gifted me 5 vertebrae compression fractures). Thanks anyway for the help.
Get creative. Search for stuff in countries with a large machining/manufacturing industry, and maybe even use a VPN to get access to that country's buy/sell/trade pages. Then find someone to pick it up for you. Or have it shipped. It's only 1000 miles, and not separated by water. (Not including the English channel.
@@xenonram Thank you for that, it would be great if I could but unfortunately, my funds don't stretch to the large shipping costs plus the cost of the machine and I would be buying something unseen with no way of knowing just how bad it is. Machines do come up from time to time on eBay but I never had the cash to buy them, I'm slowly building up funds and will soon be able to bid for a half decent mill, (I don't have one yet) and I think my money would be better spent on an old British/American mill rather than a brand new chinesium one so I'll keep looking. Again thank's for the advice.
Hi Keith, you sure are right that is really worn in from the pin. This is a nice fix and repairing the only visual wear part of this press is likely to bring you a like new press to last 100 years or more, This came out really nice, see it with the handle and table in the end. Thank you for the sharing, Lance & Patrick.
Hi Keith, how about using a pouring of Thermite to fill in the wear space and then machined the part. A top and bottom mould would would have to be made with a separate overfill chamber. What are your thoughts on this idea, for one there are many machines out there that need repairs such as this, and parts for them are not available.
There was a young man from Hoeing, who wanted to get going. But he didn't fly Boeing because it's going, going....... lol Great job on the Famco Keith.
Keith, any idea what that thing weighs, there is one of them in my uncles shop that I can have but wonder if it can come home in the bed of my F150. also has a bunch of broach sets that i would love to learn to use.Love the channel.
Great job Sir. I love watching all these restorations. you make old stuff great again.. ..... when do you think you friend ABOM79 starts working on some machine projects again?
Sure is purty, nice job . That's an arbor press , best way to do the area pair too. Do you think a rub of grease in that slot would help deflect wear there? I think since its a wear point it would be a good thing to do. My poor ole press would look good to if I can ever get my body out of pain . But guess I didn't help it horseing around super heavy steel and iron from my wheelchair . Please keep using your engine lift I ruined myself , three years doctoring and no better . Thanks for helping me keep hope. Gary
I have a daisy wheel that might just fit your machine. It came with my 7ton greenard ratching less but is too large in diameter. Its 2" thick and 12.250" od. Let me know if you think it'll work
Nice job, Keith. I wonder how some alternatives would have worked out: Would silver solder have produced a stronger joint than bronze? Would it have been better to braze a thin layer of filler material onto the joining surfaces? The theory I'm playing with is that this would have guaranteed that every part of the joint was chemically bonded to the filler material. Then the subsequent filling of the joint would have capillary action to help pull liquid filler deep into the joint... guaranteeing no voids?
The brazing is plenty strong enough for this as the repair part is under compression. A good braze joint on cast iron can be very strong, but the work has got to be chemically clean to get a good joint. Cast iron is porous and getting all the oil and other contaminates out is really important for a good outcome. Silver is very strong (often stronger than the parent material).. if done correctly. If you look at a graph of the strength of a silver solder joint you will see that the highest strength is attained when the gap between the parts to be joined is about 0.003" - 0.005 inches. Then you have to heat the work up very quickly. If you use a propane torch, silver soldering even small parts is a pain. You end up cooking off the flux trying to get the work hot enough and then the silver won't flow worth a crap. Oxy-acetylene or an acetylene plumbers torch is the ticket for a good job. When done correctly, the silver solder flows when it touches the work and is drawn to the flame. If you have to put it in the flame to flow, the work is too cold.
How do they rate these presses? I would guess they use a specific weight on the end of the lever then measure the compression at the ram/base to say it is 5 ton, 10 ton or whatever. That would mean any weight in excess of that would generate higher pressures. So little Tommy at 90 pounds is going to have a tough time while BIG Bill at 325 pounds is going to break parts ??
Can someone tell me what stopes the ram from spinning the hand wheel and sliding to the bottom you would think the weight of the ram would over come hand wheel easily every time but It doesn’t matter what size press they all don’t do it and I cannot work out why there doesn’t seem to be enough friction when you turn the wheel they always turn freely please tell me if you know thanks guys
It is not solder, which is soft and weak. It is flux-coated brazing rod, available from any local welding supply company. The material is a bronze alloy that is approximately the same strength and wear resistance as cast iron, making it the perfect material for repairing cast iron.
Other than the fact that you’re a Master at this already; is there any reason you didn’t do some kind of work holding on that piece as You brazed it in place???
I think it broke first, rather than being worn through from the start. Either way, it will be fixed now, kind of annoying when people know there's a flaw but they don't address it, leading to the failure of the machine, leading to them throwing it out in the garbage, when it wasn't the machine's fault in the first place. In the mid two thousands, junkyards were full of stuff like that here in Europe. So much history lost.
......also there SHOULD/IS a way to use such presses to break the bead on tyres....altho KR would likely to prefer the "trip-to-the-shop" method....!??!
@@ericcorse I'm still puzzled by the extreme amount of wear on that slot, considering that cast iron is fairly wear-resistant. I suppose it's possible after many decades of daily use, with no one thinking to lubricate the pin.
1st. Woohoo. Actually i could care less about 1st but I do care about a well presented video. Well done Kieth. Yet again. I didn't learn so much but I do enjoy watching and find your style quite relaxing.and entertaining. At least for an old fart like me.
The added strength of welding compared to braising would be a consideration if the parts were under a strong pulling or twisting load. Here the load is essentially pure compression, with a small sideways shearing factor, so the braising is merely there to hold the parts firmly in place and let them take up the forces, therefore the internal braising bond strength is of minor importance.
The brass has a higher uts and ductility than the cast iron especially if using the correct alloy. In this application you really want the added ductility of the brass over a welded repair. Brazing is the superior procedure here.
If you use that press enough that you need to braze in another block, you'll either be rich from all the money you've made off it, or you'll be 183 years old. :D
Keith I got nothing but love for ya buddy but if you tap the cast block you grazed in there its gonna fall right off. That rod will melt way colder than what the cast iron needs to be for the braze to wet to that iron. You need to get that cast iron hot enough that the filler melts just from touching it to the iron. You held the rod over the iron and let the torch melt the rod onto the iron. Not gonna work my friend.
Caleb Welte I kinda wondered that too... ideally you’d want enough heat in that whole area that the brazing rod would flow all the way in between the two parts, right? Just like when soldering big parts with lots of thermal mass.
For the press lever repair, I think it would have looked nicer to use a bandsaw to remove most of the oval shaped embossed part, then milled it with a nice radius, then machine the matching part from the scrap cast iron, put the hole back in ... maybe even add space for a brass bushing to take the wear away from the cast iron and have the bushing wear ...
It's all Open If you oil it dirt will stick to it and make the wear 10x faster Common mistake to oil the scrap out of everything Wouldn't be surprised if people trying to grease the slot that caused the wear
![The Biggest Arbor Press Restoration on Youtube [Official Video]](/img/n.gif)
Really neat, congratulations on your new toy. I myself just bought a Atlas arbor press. Mine was made in 1912 and it still works perfect even though it’s over a hundred years
In my shop we had 3 presses. A ten ton press brake. A hydraulic press to 6 thousand psi on a five inch ram and an Arbor press. All used much. Our arbor press turntable started out at 3/4", up to 2 1/2. I have hung off the handle, till giving in and going to the hydraulic press. The pressure gauge on the hydraulic was directly visible, so you could push the handle for as much force as you needed, so you wouldn't destroy a 1" piece of metal.
Probably took a shop decades to wear the hinge out and now its as good as new again. Amazing.
Oddly enough, welding cast iron was one of the few topics covered in my single half-year of metal work at comprehensive school. I seem to remember that if you _do_ weld rather than braze you need to apply a heat treatment to the whole finished piece in an oven--or I think it was a 'ceramic chip forge' that was used. This is to take away some of the excessive hardness from the cast iron that welding introduces. That is what I *very* foggily remember anyway!
Yep, ya gotta get the whole thing just below critical, soak and let cool in place for 24 hours. ABOM79 covered this recently in a video where he had a cast piece made and it embrittled because it was removed too quickly.
That is a beautiful restoration. Thanks so much for sharing. I just purchased a Famco 3 1/2C model and the arm pivot slot had some similar wearing on it. It great to see how you repaired yours.
Dave Tarrant I just picked up a 3 1/2 non ratcheting press. Any chance you could share dimensions of the brake spacer on your press? I’m going to have to fabricate one.
Chris GrayI always love your restoration jobs. I like the paint job as well probably better than when it was new.
Very nice looking restoration.
@23:56 there looks to be room on the left and right of the ram to put some rectangular sections of oiled felt.. and also a piece inside the front cover above the insert plate.. perhaps 1/2" x 5/16 x 1.5" so three of the four sides get oil wick lubed every up and down stroke. might be an easy update..
Nice job on that. I have the Famco 3R and might have to use your color combo when I restore it.
Great repair...the brazing will be plenty strong. Thanks for sharing!
That turn out very very nice. Love to see old tools have a new life!!!
Hey Keith for the slot that you just fixed I'd suggest 5th wheel grease. Years ago I bought a spray can of Amsoil synthetic 5th wheel grease. What made me think of it for this is the stuff sprays on but then becomes real tacky and is designed for low motion high pressure applications; like this. Just line the new slot and the stuff will stay put for years, and likely eliminate most of the wear. Lookin good!
Trying to grease it probably caused the wear
Grease and dirt makes grinding paste
@@fowletm1992 Hum?
You make all your old tools in the shop look like new. I love it.
Thanks to your work on this press, I was able to correct the placement of the over arm on a "DAKE" 5 ton arbor press and now it works as it should... Thanks again...
Excellent work sir
Great job...its ready for another 200 years...what a monster.
i worked at a fab shop that did cast iron repair they would do the milling as you have done then they would dowel pin brazing rods in a hundred different angles seems like any way then heat the part to melt the brazing rod then boarx the part for flux so it was i repair from inside out very strong joint i was young working there today no one would take that much time to weld something. great repair thaks for showing us how you do it
You really do have some great followers Keith, always trying to help.
Nicely done!
Great video Keith. It must be fantastic to get hold of machines/tools like that, over the pond here in England everything is very rare and so gets top dollars which is just way out of my league. The care and attention you put into your restorations is inspiring, perhaps one day I will drop lucky and be able to do the same.
Keep the videos coming...
Maybe a trip to Poland and/or Czechoslovakia (combined for convenience....?) with trailer in tow.....before the effects of Brexit take hold. Maybe the same dynamics would apply to Spain, Italy, and Portugal....??? What about Ireland?
@ It's a good idea but I'm unable to travel very far due to a back condition (Osteoporosis has gifted me 5 vertebrae compression fractures).
Thanks anyway for the help.
Get creative. Search for stuff in countries with a large machining/manufacturing industry, and maybe even use a VPN to get access to that country's buy/sell/trade pages. Then find someone to pick it up for you. Or have it shipped. It's only 1000 miles, and not separated by water. (Not including the English channel.
@@xenonram Thank you for that, it would be great if I could but unfortunately, my funds don't stretch to the large shipping costs plus the cost of the machine and I would be buying something unseen with no way of knowing just how bad it is.
Machines do come up from time to time on eBay but I never had the cash to buy them, I'm slowly building up funds and will soon be able to bid for a half decent mill, (I don't have one yet) and I think my money would be better spent on an old British/American mill rather than a brand new chinesium one so I'll keep looking. Again thank's for the advice.
Hi Keith, you sure are right that is really worn in from the pin. This is a nice fix and repairing the only visual wear part of this press is likely to bring you a like new press to last 100 years or more, This came out really nice, see it with the handle and table in the end. Thank you for the sharing, Lance & Patrick.
Excellent repair. 100% confident that it will last. Looks like it was factory delivered today. Great job as usual.
I think I would have widened the slot a bit and added a roller to the pin. It would make the action smoother and reduce wear.
...well, "ya can't please EVERYBODY!!"
Looks just very nice!
Great restoration Keith.
Looks awesome!
She turned out beautiful!
Lovely work Keith, very nice.
Thank you Kieth for another great video.
Nicely done. I love the looks (and strength) of brazing.
Thanks.
Excellent repair as always. I guess you may need to start calling these the "getter back in" videos.
Great job Keith looks good as new.
Congratulations on completing a very nice restoration. It looks great.
Made in Wisconsin! We also used to make Cleereman drill presses, just saw one sell at auction for below scrap value. Had to be 3-4 tons of steel.
10:53 - Yes, pretty darned close, Keith - good choice
Good job mister
Nice job Keith , would be a wonderful asset to my shop !
Looks great.
Very well done.
Excellent!
As usual Keith, you do great restorations. Looking forward to the next video. Keep up the great work!
THANK YOU...for sharing.
Great repair and restoration.
Hi Keith, how about using a pouring of Thermite to fill in the wear space and then machined the part. A top and bottom mould would would have to be made with a separate overfill chamber. What are your thoughts on this idea, for one there are many machines out there that need repairs such as this, and parts for them are not available.
Great job Keith, now if you only could start selling mugs with the original Vintage Machinery logo, I would be so happy. 😊
Can’t wait till the handle gets made
Do you ever place more flux on the welding surfaces beyond to flux already on the rod?
Another job well done, well it's done.
Well done....good as new
Nice work Keith it's looks good
Great job’ You might have 4 or 5 guys to do it their own way but at the end of the day you get the same results with the same longevity of the repair.
Hi Keith, I see the piviting point is worn too.
Those z-squares look awesome but good god are they spendy!!
There was a young man from Hoeing, who wanted to get going. But he didn't fly Boeing because it's going, going....... lol Great job on the Famco Keith.
Looks nice!
It looks great!
Super awesome .. Great job Keith ! .. I so ENJOYED .. Thanks man
She's a beauty.
Love it, wish it was in my shop
Keith, any idea what that thing weighs, there is one of them in my uncles shop that I can have but wonder if it can come home in the bed of my F150. also has a bunch of broach sets that i would love to learn to use.Love the channel.
Abom79 just got a Drake that looks very similar to this. He has the carousel plate if you need measurements.
Dake*
Great job Sir. I love watching all these restorations. you make old stuff great again.. ..... when do you think you friend ABOM79 starts working on some machine projects again?
Sure is purty, nice job . That's an arbor press , best way to do the area pair too. Do you think a rub of grease in that slot would help deflect wear there? I think since its a wear point it would be a good thing to do. My poor ole press would look good to if I can ever get my body out of pain . But guess I didn't help it horseing around super heavy steel and iron from my wheelchair . Please keep using your engine lift I ruined myself , three years doctoring and no better . Thanks for helping me keep hope. Gary
👍👍👍
Watching in Alabama
Where do you get that Z Square?
Nice!
Thanks for the video.
Question - could you have silver brazed It?
Awesome sauce.
I vote that Keith gets is casting furnace running, and he casts a new handle for this, then he can drill it straight!
I have a daisy wheel that might just fit your machine. It came with my 7ton greenard ratching less but is too large in diameter. Its 2" thick and 12.250" od. Let me know if you think it'll work
...what happened?
Excellent....!
Nice job, Keith. I wonder how some alternatives would have worked out:
Would silver solder have produced a stronger joint than bronze?
Would it have been better to braze a thin layer of filler material onto the joining surfaces? The theory I'm playing with is that this would have guaranteed that every part of the joint was chemically bonded to the filler material. Then the subsequent filling of the joint would have capillary action to help pull liquid filler deep into the joint... guaranteeing no voids?
The brazing is plenty strong enough for this as the repair part is under compression. A good braze joint on cast iron can be very strong, but the work has got to be chemically clean to get a good joint. Cast iron is porous and getting all the oil and other contaminates out is really important for a good outcome.
Silver is very strong (often stronger than the parent material).. if done correctly. If you look at a graph of the strength of a silver solder joint you will see that the highest strength is attained when the gap between the parts to be joined is about 0.003" - 0.005 inches. Then you have to heat the work up very quickly. If you use a propane torch, silver soldering even small parts is a pain. You end up cooking off the flux trying to get the work hot enough and then the silver won't flow worth a crap. Oxy-acetylene or an acetylene plumbers torch is the ticket for a good job. When done correctly, the silver solder flows when it touches the work and is drawn to the flame. If you have to put it in the flame to flow, the work is too cold.
He could have stuck it on with some elmers white glue and it would have held fine. Lol.
How do they rate these presses? I would guess they use a specific weight on the end of the lever then measure the compression at the ram/base to say it is 5 ton, 10 ton or whatever. That would mean any weight in excess of that would generate higher pressures. So little Tommy at 90 pounds is going to have a tough time while BIG Bill at 325 pounds is going to break parts ??
Is it a 2 speed ratchet?
nice repair. Do you have plans for a oil hole to prevent future wear?
...an oil hole would invite breaking-(!)
Keith, what paint have you been using?
Can someone tell me what stopes the ram from spinning the hand wheel and sliding to the bottom you would think the weight of the ram would over come hand wheel easily every time but It doesn’t matter what size press they all don’t do it and I cannot work out why there doesn’t seem to be enough friction when you turn the wheel they always turn freely please tell me if you know thanks guys
Over all friction, and the piece at 23:38 that jams that taper against the shaft.
If you can fix my joints like you did the Arbor, I'll be there.
Hi Keith, any idea of the force it can apply with a 'sensible' handle? BobUK
It is a 12T machine. (24k lbs/11 tonnes)
Wow, can't even imagine what you would put in that monster to press things in or out. Don't get any body part caught in it or it is gone... lol
What solder is that? Can I get the brand and part number please?
Thanks!
It is not solder, which is soft and weak. It is flux-coated brazing rod, available from any local welding supply company. The material is a bronze alloy that is approximately the same strength and wear resistance as cast iron, making it the perfect material for repairing cast iron.
@@kensherwin4544 It is soldering.
Looks like your cat had it’s way with your left arm. lol. Nice repair
Other than the fact that you’re a Master at this already; is there any reason you didn’t do some kind of work holding on that piece as You brazed it in place???
There was no forces acting on it. That's like asking if you need to clamp a part being laser engraved.
I think it broke first, rather than being worn through from the start. Either way, it will be fixed now, kind of annoying when people know there's a flaw but they don't address it, leading to the failure of the machine, leading to them throwing it out in the garbage, when it wasn't the machine's fault in the first place. In the mid two thousands, junkyards were full of stuff like that here in Europe. So much history lost.
A break in that spot would be very unlikely. (Unless the whole past broke off, but that obviously didn't happen.)
did you break wind
at 19:14 lol
Lol.
......also there SHOULD/IS a way to use such presses to break the bead on tyres....altho KR would likely to prefer the "trip-to-the-shop" method....!??!
And... What's the point? You can use any press to break a tire bead.
Why not oil the pin that wore the slot?
My thoughts exactly a little lube goes a long way.
@@ericcorse I'm still puzzled by the extreme amount of wear on that slot, considering that cast iron is fairly wear-resistant. I suppose it's possible after many decades of daily use, with no one thinking to lubricate the pin.
...apparently, FAMCO still makes the 5C arbor press-(!)
1st. Woohoo. Actually i could care less about 1st but I do care about a well presented video. Well done Kieth. Yet again. I didn't learn so much but I do enjoy watching and find your style quite relaxing.and entertaining. At least for an old fart like me.
Keith, That handle for moving the table up and down looks a bit anemic to me. It needs something more appropriate.
The added strength of welding compared to braising would be a consideration if the parts were under a strong pulling or twisting load. Here the load is essentially pure compression, with a small sideways shearing factor, so the braising is merely there to hold the parts firmly in place and let them take up the forces, therefore the internal braising bond strength is of minor importance.
The brass has a higher uts and ductility than the cast iron especially if using the correct alloy. In this application you really want the added ductility of the brass over a welded repair. Brazing is the superior procedure here.
If you use that press enough that you need to braze in another block, you'll either be rich from all the money you've made off it, or you'll be 183 years old. :D
...OR BOTH-(?)
Why is it called 5C?
I spy with my little what looks like a universal table, cast repair blank on the table ...
Keith I got nothing but love for ya buddy but if you tap the cast block you grazed in there its gonna fall right off. That rod will melt way colder than what the cast iron needs to be for the braze to wet to that iron. You need to get that cast iron hot enough that the filler melts just from touching it to the iron. You held the rod over the iron and let the torch melt the rod onto the iron. Not gonna work my friend.
Caleb Welte I kinda wondered that too... ideally you’d want enough heat in that whole area that the brazing rod would flow all the way in between the two parts, right? Just like when soldering big parts with lots of thermal mass.
It got plenty hot. You can see it's red hot when he pulls his torch away. It'll be fine. Especially since there is a net zero force on the part.
Mechanical Keith.... I've seen your brazing lol
How about you show us your brazing. It must be amazing. We would love to see when you brazed your Famco 5C.
For the press lever repair, I think it would have looked nicer to use a bandsaw to remove most of the oval shaped embossed part, then milled it with a nice radius, then machine the matching part from the scrap cast iron, put the hole back in ... maybe even add space for a brass bushing to take the wear away from the cast iron and have the bushing wear ...
Forgive me Kieth, but so many dry ratchet shaft areas - im an oil finatic--lol
It'll be fine for the 2x a year it is cycled one time.
It's all Open
If you oil it dirt will stick to it and make the wear 10x faster
Common mistake to oil the scrap out of everything
Wouldn't be surprised if people trying to grease the slot that caused the wear