Played and collected Zildjians for decades. That "hi-fi" analogy is spot on and is the main reason why I primarily only buy Paiste these days. The 22" vintage 602 in my collection is hands down the best all around cymbal I have ever played.
It's apparent that with Masters they use a Turkish alloy. I had a whole set, but moved them on. They didn't do it for me, not Paiste enough. Today I use 602, 602 ME (darker) 2002 Big Beat ( B8, thinner 602 ME hammering) and PSTX. Paiste has so much to offer.
You are %100 percent correct! Not only do they use Turkish B20, but they are also hand hammered in Turkey. I also assume lathed, finished and tested int Switzerland!
I am now the proud owner of a pre serial 602 20" and also 14" hats, and WOW!! I love them!! They are so very different from my 1950s As, but so very tasty! I am officially hooked and cant wait to get more!!!!!!🥁❤️🥁
I always just thought it was the difference between sheets or plates of the bronzes, but it makes sense how some Turkish made can have more impurities in the metals.
Do you believe that the reason for the difference in sound is because 2002's a are cast individually and to a very strict quality control...where as other cymbal manufactures cymbals are cut from a sheet of B8 bronze and pressed into the shape of a cymbal before lathing?
All B8 is made the same: "continuous casting" down a chute formed into a thick plank, then cut in large sections, those large sections are cold rolled into a very long sheet and wound up into a spool. Discs are then cut out of it and sent to the cymbal company, this is where Paiste makes all the difference in huge amount handwork that goes into each cymbal. The biggest factor is the massive amount of machine hammering they do to shape the cymbal and create the basic tone or "temperament" of the cymbal! Paiste has also had the the most strict quality control of any cymbal company!
@@thetype85 @thetype85 Intersting, thank you for explaining. Playing for years but just now learning about the alloys. Amazing what Paiste does with B8. I purchased a 20" 2002 black label ride new back in 78'. I was surprised to find out it's B8...love that ride. All my other cymbals are B20 Zildjians from the 60's, great cymbals. Recently purchased a 20" Zildjian ride off FB for cheap, thought I was getting a good deal, labels were polished off and turned out to be ZBT Plus. First I'd heard of em...That's when I learned there's B8 and B20. That B8 sounds pretty zingy, worlds different from the 2002. Maybe Zildjian gave up too easily on B8. Thinking of turning the ZBT Plus into a wall clock. : )
@@thomasherbert9970 Zildjian and Sabian stamp their cymbals in a press to shape them, both B8 and B20! As far as B8 goes. both companies cut corners and do the bare minimum amount of laber to cut costs, this is why they sound like crap! Robert Paiste started experimenting with B8 in 1963 and released their 1st B8 series in 1965: the "Stambul 65" So they have been working with B8 for 60 years! www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Stambul65#Stambul65
Played and collected Zildjians for decades. That "hi-fi" analogy is spot on and is the main reason why I primarily only buy Paiste these days. The 22" vintage 602 in my collection is hands down the best all around cymbal I have ever played.
Thanks so much for watching!
It's apparent that with Masters they use a Turkish alloy. I had a whole set, but moved them on. They didn't do it for me, not Paiste enough. Today I use 602, 602 ME (darker) 2002 Big Beat ( B8, thinner 602 ME hammering) and PSTX. Paiste has so much to offer.
You are %100 percent correct! Not only do they use Turkish B20, but they are also hand hammered in Turkey. I also assume lathed, finished and tested int Switzerland!
That's just about what I heard. Shaped in Turkey, finished in Switzerland.@@thetype85
Fascinating, and illuminating
I am now the proud owner of a pre serial 602 20" and also 14" hats, and WOW!! I love them!! They are so very different from my 1950s As, but so very tasty! I am officially hooked and cant wait to get more!!!!!!🥁❤️🥁
I hope you plan on going to the Chicago Drum Show this year, I'd love to run into you and talk Paiste!!!
@@brent3760Unfortunately, I live in Los Angeles, so the trip is just too far. You can contact me on Facebook or email me: type85@gmail.com
Vintage 602's and super formula 602's are the LAST undiscovered gems still at reasonable prices!
I always just thought it was the difference between sheets or plates of the bronzes, but it makes sense how some Turkish made can have more impurities in the metals.
I gotta say, im a vintage Zildjian guy, specifically 1950s, bur i really want to try a vintage 602 thanks to you! 😁
Very cool! I'm glad I exposed you to something new!
@@thetype85Yes! Me too!!
I love zildjian i like Paiste. Zildjian for individual sound. Paiste for consistent purpose
Do you believe that the reason for the difference in sound is because 2002's a are cast individually and to a very strict quality control...where as other cymbal manufactures cymbals are cut from a sheet of B8 bronze and pressed into the shape of a cymbal before lathing?
All B8 is made the same: "continuous casting" down a chute formed into a thick plank, then cut in large sections, those large sections are cold rolled into a very long sheet and wound up into a spool. Discs are then cut out of it and sent to the cymbal company, this is where Paiste makes all the difference in huge amount handwork that goes into each cymbal. The biggest factor is the massive amount of machine hammering they do to shape the cymbal and create the basic tone or "temperament" of the cymbal! Paiste has also had the the most strict quality control of any cymbal company!
@@thetype85 @thetype85 Intersting, thank you for explaining. Playing for years but just now learning about the alloys. Amazing what Paiste does with B8. I purchased a 20" 2002 black label ride new back in 78'. I was surprised to find out it's B8...love that ride. All my other cymbals are B20 Zildjians from the 60's, great cymbals. Recently purchased a 20" Zildjian ride off FB for cheap, thought I was getting a good deal, labels were polished off and turned out to be ZBT Plus. First I'd heard of em...That's when I learned there's B8 and B20. That B8 sounds pretty zingy, worlds different from the 2002. Maybe Zildjian gave up too easily on B8. Thinking of turning the ZBT Plus into a wall clock. : )
@@thomasherbert9970 Zildjian and Sabian stamp their cymbals in a press to shape them, both B8 and B20!
As far as B8 goes. both companies cut corners and do the bare minimum amount of laber to cut costs, this is why they sound like crap!
Robert Paiste started experimenting with B8 in 1963 and released their 1st B8 series in 1965: the "Stambul 65"
So they have been working with B8 for 60 years!
www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/Paiste_Stambul65#Stambul65
U collect only Paiste?
Yes, that is correct!