I worked for Ford from 1988 till 2011. right around 2010 I had 14,000 saved up and I was going to surprise my daughter with a new focus or fiesta. thank God that deal didn't go through, I ended up buying a Corolla with a blown up motor for $500 and we rebuilt the engine together had a great time, and she's been driving it for the last 7 years!
I grew up in the 1960-70's with a father who would ONLY buy Ford; nobody in our family was allowed to even consider buying anything else (my first car was a 1970 Ford Maverick). He now drives a 2008 Toyota with NO plans to ever buy a Ford!
I'm a Ford guy but I have no faith in their ethics anymore. I saw them sell F150s with the 3V 5.4 V8 with defective cam phasers for 6 years and leaky rear brake light seals for the same timeframe. You could buy replacement parts that weren't defective while they still put the defective ones in production. Then they had the Explorers and Flex wagons that leaked exhaust into the cabin for years. There were the Ecoboost limp mode issues due to water condensation in the intercooler for several years and they still have leaky oil pans. They never gave customers any consideration for these defective vehicles until they were forced. I will never buy a new Ford again. If I do buy a Ford, it will be 3 years old so I will be able to check the forums to see if it has any major defects before I get stuck with one. They claim they stopped making cars because SUVs and trucks are in demand, but the truth is that they lost the car market to Korean and Japanese brands, which are seemingly doing just fine. They offer better warranties and in many cases, much better quality. The MBAs running our car companies are only looking at quarterly numbers and sacrificing the long term viability of the company for short term sales. Why else would you ship cars you know will break, probably before the warranty runs out?
I have a 2014 Ford Focus SE sedan that I bought used in February 2018 here in Virgina. When I bought it, it had 60,000 miles on it (i.e. end of warranty period). At the time of purchase it was noted that there was an outstanding service bulletin related to the Transmission Control Module (TCM) so I stopped by the local Ford dealership's service department to find out what the story was. The service bulletin apparently only extended the warranty period for TCM-related problems beyond the standard warranty. I had been noticing what Steve described - the shudder when accelerating from a stop sign/light but it was nothing jarring. Additionally there was tapping if I tried to accelerate fast. The way the service manager described it, my Focus had a "manual transmission with the TCM replacing the operator's clutch and shifter" and that the TCM was what caused the shifting to go squirrely. After taking the car out for a test drive, the Service Manager said words to the effect of the tapping was the "Cam Phasers" (I'm still looking for the Photon Torpedo Tubes) and that, while the TCM in the Focus vehicles was a noted problem, my particular car was "the sweetest-shifting 2014 Focus he's ever driven." TL;DR He didn't do anything and the car still has the shudder as I'm approaching 100,000 miles.
FoMoCo had the same response with the Pinto. They knew full well that the fuel tank was dangerous and also that a 7 dollar part could have reduced the risk but they decided to let it go and save 7 dollars per car! FoMoCo has a nasty history of this behavior.
had a fiesta with this transmission and it was a nightmare. almost got rear ended once when i started accelerating at a light and car dropped into neutral after 2 seconds. another time it dropped to neutral on a 12 lane highway with no shoulder. luckily traffic was light enough for me to stop in the right lane, shutdown and restart the car. went through weeks where the car would randomly not crank, so i had to sit and wait 10, 15, 20 minutes until it started working again. that almost got me ticketed once. catalytic converter went bad at 20k miles. capless fuel filler malfunctioned which made it almost impossible to pump gas into it. and the last straw was it began to overheat when driven for more than an hour. dealership couldn't replicate it because they couldn't test drive it for an hour, so they finally told me to drive around on my own until i triggered it, and bring it right to them. they diagnosed it as a bad water pump. didn't solve the problem. i gave up and took 3k under blue book as a trade-in just to get rid of it ASAP. that was the first ford i had owned, and as you can guess i'll never buy another one
I was doing some contract work at a the Ford facility in Livonia, It was the ATNPC test facility (Automatic Transmission New Product Center). Behind the facility is a test track. I was looking at the yet to be released Ford Focus. I began a conversation with one of the test engineers and asked him about the vehicle and how I'd be interested in purchasing one. His reply was *"just get one with a manual. We're have all sort of issues with this damn automatic. It's junk. Ford will be in for all kind of trouble is they stick with this POS"*
Frantic call to 911 operator from Ford dealership: "Help! This guy's been on a rampage at the dealership for three hours! He's wrecked half our cars! We've called you eight times already, where are the cops!?" Operator: "They're getting there as fast as they can but you've got to be patient, they're all in Fords!"
They treat the 6th to 1st gear F150 random downshift at highway speeds the same way (also happened for years prior, which were supposedly addressed). I'll never own another Ford again after their unwillingness to repair a truck that could easily have gotten me killed on the highway. Nothing is quite as unsettling as going 70mph only to have the transmission downshift unexpectedly to first with an 18 wheeler behind you on a brand new 2014 F150.
I read that same article - pretty amazing how these companies nonchalantly dismiss problems, even when it's likely to get someone killed. For the Ford guy who said that a car going into neutral at 75mph isn't a safety issue, did he volunteer to put each of his own family members in one of those cars on the highway and trigger that even as proof it's not a safety issue? I'm guessing that would be a no. The other sad part about this is, not only did the buyers get shafted by a defective (non-fixable) product, but as the buying public became more aware of this issue, the car's resale value would have also taken a nose dive further screwing the customer. Great job Ford.
I'm stuck doing Uber with one of these defective cars while living in my dads kitchen and going insane with depression due to not havinging any personal space or privacy. I struggle to even make the payments. I hate my life.
Had a 13 Focus 5 speed. While not as fun as the 13 Accord I had before or the 15 Fit I have now (both 6 speeds), it was still a fun little car. Great chassis, it really didn't feel like the 3,100 pound car that it was (mine was an SE with the appearance and technology package). Probably why the MPG was about the same as my 3,400 pound Accord despite it being a larger car with a larger engine though (2.4/6 speed manual vs 2.0/5 speed manual).
First off most people do not understand that this is a Manual transmission that is shifted automatically. It will not shift like a regular automatic transmission. There are 2 problems with the dps6 transmission. The first is the clutch material being inferior causing a shutter when shifting gears. This issue was for the most part addressed in 2015 when Ford released an updated clutch pack. The second issue for this transmission is the Transmission Control Module failing which can cause it to shift into neutral.
I had a F150 blow a sparkplug out. Dealer claimed they never heard of that happening but lots of forums show it was common. Apparently so common that Ford developed special tool to repair the issue. Seems like the "never heard of that" issue is a pretty common response.
Meanwhile I'm stuck doing Uber in one of these defective cars, while living in my dad's kitchen, going insane with depression due to not having any personal space or privacy, and struggling to make the payments on the damn car.
Hi Steve. I enjoy your videos. I bought a 2012 Ford Focus with the bad transmission. I test drove a manual transmission and an automatic. The manual transmission felt good, but I naively went with the strange automatic because it got slightly better gas mileage and because the salesman assured me the computer-controlled automatic transmission would learn my driving habits and smooth out after I drove it a while. Ford also not only lied to me, but to everyone who bought a Focus or Festiva. It's outrageous that service advisors told owners that they weren't driving properly, and that was why the transmission had problems. Ford spun a web of lies and deceit to sell cars Ford employees knew had defective transmissions even before the car was put into production. I'm a retired State Trooper and found the car too dangerous to keep, after it slipped out of gear on the freeway several different times while my wife and I drove it. Make no mistake, cars with that transmission are DANGEROUS and shouldn't be on the road. Don't believe their lies. I won't buy another Ford vehicle...
I bought a used 2012 focus with 90,000 miles from a Honda dealer...tranny went out at 108,000 miles...took it to Ford dealership who gave me a runaround and said their diagnostic tech won't be back for 2 weeks...took it to the next Ford dealership (Auto Nation?) Which did diagnose it and said it was the clutch and would fix for $3000 but would do the TCM for free since it was still under extended warranty...I left fuming...after watching your video and researching I will never buy a Ford again and tell everyone else the same because of management...they should have stood by their product instead of hiding behind it
Remember the Ford Triton 5.4 engine? Same story 2004 to 2010 as I recall. You'd think these fools had never built a vehicle before. Somehow 110 years of experience doesn't teach these executives anything except to personally drive a foreign car! It would be a different story if their personal wealth was penalized for these crappy products. Paid to make crap. Take care. Doug
I probably should add that maybe we aren't seeing the forest for the trees? Big money has no loyalty to any country. History shows clearly. Big money also makes money whether the country prospers or not, whether the stocks go up or down. Perhaps these Detroit 'fools' know what they are doing? As in the seventies when they ran the auto industry into the ground while buying mega shares in foreign car companies. They did well the general population suffered as always. In addition government gifts of billions added to their take. Keep in mind the theft on a grand scale of that caused the recent depression. See any wealthy people behind bars? The government just gave them more! On and on it goes. Take care. Doug
Douglas Thompson well said Doug, I had a 5.4 triton, cam phaser, spark plug, pass side exhaust manifold, starting to rust out at a very early age, etc. I drive a Toyota now.
Had a car once that started making a loud pop from the back right corner after about 10-15K miles. Took it to the dealership and was told that it was a "normal" noise. I ask the service tech if he really was telling me that the engineers of this particular manufacturer intended for it to make that sound. He sort of stared at me a minute and said "fine, we will replace the strut mounts, they have a known defect." Absolutely unbelievable.
We got our daughter a used 2012 Focus SFE used in 2014. It was still under original warranty and initially seemed like a good car. We later found it had already had multiple visits to the dealer for these issues. In the 3 yrs we had it we had the control module replaced 4 times, reprogrammed almost as often as oil changes and the whole clutch replaced twice. This was all done under warranty but eventually we sold the car for 1/4 what we paid for it because we felt we had to be upfront to the people buying it. When it worked it was a great little car, drove and handled well and the gas mileage was phenomenal. But this issue and the fact that the dealer never said word one about it ticks me off to this day. Now its pretty public knowledge about this issue but back in 2014 they were trying really hard to cover this up and kept a tight lid on it. Usually I’m pretty diligent about car buying but I let my guard slip on this one and now will never buy a Ford again.
The problem cannot be fixed. There are too few clutch discs within the dual clutch assembly. With the workload of the clutch being spread over too few discs, they heat up rapidly and the clutch material starts to peel and get sticky. They need to add 2 more clutches and steels within the assembly per clutch pack. That's an additional 8 parts. While this is possible, that would make the whole assembly larger, thus it will no longer fit within the provided space between the engine and transmission. This could be mitigate with a spacer plate, longer bolts, new CV shafts, and a longer input shaft. Ford will not spend the money to retool this assembly.
Now this is a car guys comment! I have a channel which covers repairs on cars and sometimes motorcycles and upgrades. I'd be happy to see you there. I'm grateful to know what the issue is with the car.
@@DENicholsAutoBravado I used to do a lot of 4x4 work. Weld on lift kits, custom designed power train assemblies. Pretty much anything you could dream up. I am not a very good welder or fabricator but the mechanical engineering side of things always gets me giddy like a school girl. Only I don't wear dresses. Well... Mostly. LOL! I like to get to root cause. Prevent issues. When I fix something I want it to be right the first time.
Alan Mulally - headed Ford when the dual clutch problem was "generated". Prior to that he was "interim CEO" of Boeing where he had been Chief Engineering Officer and led the 777 project AND the 737 MAX mess - both now costing Boeing more than money (at the time of his release from Boeing and transfer to Ford - with Ford buying the remainder of his Boeing contract - people wondered why Boeing let him go). Could THIS be the common piece? Just asking. But the timelines match as do the resultant patterns of deny, cover up and pray (prey, actually). BTW - you do a wonderful job of informing us of important stuff while also teaching us WTF is happening. Thank you so much for sharing...
Wow! Didn't know there was a connection with Boeing! Doesn't surprise me though! I unfortunately have a 2016 Focus. I have a couple videos on my channel of it malfunctioning.
We bought a 2011 Ford focus used from the dealership. I can go on to talk about the issues we’ve had with it. It almost killed my life she was at a stop sign pulled out because she knew she had enough of time but then she had no power. She threw it in reverse but there was no reverse it just sit there. Thank God the tractor trailer truck was able to stop in time. We had it fixed one time but if I knew then what I know now we would have not got the vehicle. And because we bought it used we can’t file a lawsuit or do different things that we can do. We are stuck with this vehicle until we buy another one. We don’t live paycheck by paycheck but it’s damn close so we’re kind of stuck in this situation
I have a 2012 Focus Titanium with the DPS6 transmission and although I had the occasional shudder it wasn't a big deal and as a long time manual transmission driver you know that on occasion you get a little shudder. Yes, it was worse than a typical manual clutch but not hugely so. Earlier this year I took the car in for some warranty items I'd neglected and they asked about the transmission so I told them I get the occasional shudder and they said they'd test drive it. They came back and informed me the transmission needed to be redone so I told them to go ahead and do it. The called an Uber to get me home and it took a couple days to complete the work. As is typical they managed to find a few items they could charge me for that were not covered by the warranty and I wound up paying about $650 for all of those items but I had a new transmission at 80K miles so I should, fingers crossed, be good for another 60K+. If the car lasts 140K miles I'll just figure it to be a right off at that point as the resale will be near zero anyway. On the upside, my net average mileage after over 82K miles is over 38mpg and the car is still fun to drive. The Titanium has a bit firmer suspension and a few other upgrades over the lower models that make it quite a fun car to drive while still averaging over 38mpg. My best tank was over 50mpg and over 600 miles range.
@@STho205 -- I can believe that people with stick experience have fewer problems with the DCT boxes, but some driving conditions are not ideal for DCT or stick for that matter. If you're stuck in stop-and-go traffic several hours a week a manual box of either type is not ideal and an automatic is much better. Even better for this type of driving are hybrids and better still all electric. The biggest problem with DCT boxes is that the car makers want them cheap and make them cheap which always works out more expensive.
2020 corvette is coming with a dual clutch transmission. I have driven a ford dual clutch transmission vehicle. it had 190,000 miles on it, with the first transmission. I asked the owner why his had no problems. it's simple it should not been installed for the general public. you don't drive it like a regular automatic. it's a semiautomatic transmission. when driving them you have to think standard transmission (witch most people haven't even driven). probably the worst case is stop and go traffic, where the car is barely moving you'll kill the transmission in minutes, yes minutes the clutch plates are grinding themselves to death in this scenario . the 2020 corvette isn't going to be sold to the average person, and that it where the transmission belongs. it's a racing transmission, it only advantage is extremely quick shifting. in a daily driver it would be horrible to drive. it sounds like marketing needed something for their brochure. the people in ford who put this into motion should be paying out of their pocket. that would make future idots think twice about trying a stunt like this.
@dave rolleman - Difference is the 2020 Vette's transmission is made by Tremec, same company who provides basically bulletproof trannys for Mustangs, Camaros and Challengers.
To a far lesser degree, this problem occurred with all manufacturers at some point with certain models. For cost reasons, most of the time manufacturers will knowingly continue to build vehicles with minor defects and resolve the issues later under warranties and with Technical Service Bulletins. Common problems with any particular vehicle are common. Yet the manufacturers don’t address them during the production process. GM’s ignition switch fiasco was one of the worst examples.
When you think for a moment about the person who says, "We've never heard of this issue. You're the first." when you know that's not true, this is the person who was hired. The person who would not/will not mislead the customer was not hired. These things happen because customers allow them to happen. Start supporting businesses that hire people who do not mislead customers.
I have a Volvo v60 2013 which uses the same gearbox, and I experienced everything like the choking on start/stop, lost power on highway, cant engage to proper gear etc. When I go to Volvo to service the car, they ask me 100k (HKD) including labour to replace the gearbox. This whole thing is a scam. Everything works well apart from the gearbox which is a shame because I love that car. The gearbox problem alone totaled the car. The repair cost can buy me another car. Long story short, recently I trade in the car $20k (HKD) for a Mazda cx30 (proper regular automatic, not CVT/DCT or any of that crap). Do gearbox research on your own before buying any car, especially automatic. Good luck.
Certain CVTs are actually pretty robust in my experience as a mechanic. Namely Hondas and I've heard some decent things about Toyota's as well. That being said, my personal cars all have manual transmissions. Most robust type there is save for a direct drive.
Ford has had numerous serious engineering, design, and quality flaws the last several years. The Focus RS engines suffered from serious failures Ford tried to ignore until there was massive negative public outcry. Way too many of their Ecoboost V6 engines had catastrophic failures such as blown head gaskets, failed timing chains, and even bad rod bearings, requiring massively expensive repairs on even low mileage relatively new vehicles. Again, Ford did everything they could to avoid taking any responsibility for as long as they could. It seems Ford sells known defective products, then puts their head in the sand pretending there’s no problem, then they go on the defensive telling dealers to deny warranty work, and only when they’re forced to by massive external pressure, do they ever do anything and even then it’s often not enough. I know a guy who buys the vehicles for the state highway patrol and they’ve had so many massive problems with Ford vehicles, and Ford’s refusal or inability to make things right, they’ve given up on Ford entirely. Ford doesn’t seem to get it. I hope they lose all the lawsuits and have to pay out massive damages. Perhaps then they’ll realize they need to make better vehicles.
I heard this new thing coming out called a "Manual Transmission". It uses a driver operated lever, supposedly located within reach of the drivers right hand, and a foot pedal thingy, to the left of the brake pedal. It sounds CRAZY I know, I guess you would need 3 legs to operate this futuristic piece of equipment. Also probably not very reliable, since it's such an untested design. Better stick with the German DCT, that Volkswagen couldn't even get to work properly, I'm sure they'll work the bugs out in a couple weeks.
I drive a manual car and always have but IC cars are mostly last century tech, the simplicity, reliability and cheaper to run EVs will take over pretty soon (for most people) especially when price parity happens.
All the more reason to go manual transmission. It's funny how front-drive automatics have worked for years, but suddenly the need to reengineer it emerges, and in this case with disastrous results. Always go with a technology that has been proven over many years... go with a car (new or used) that you see has been shown to go 200k miles plus. As always Steve, thanks for covering this. It's great to hear from an attorney who also understands cars.
I once test drove a Fiesta. That car was bright yellow, fun looking, and I really wanted it. When I drove it I immediately did not like the way the transmission felt. I do not know much about cars, but I could tell something was wrong and I did not buy the car.
I had a 2012 focus with all these problems. I got rid of it after I tried to merge in traffic and it just rolled forward very slowly with the engine revving at 3k when my foot was in the gas. It finally moved after 5 seconds but by then everyone had to slam on their brakes to avoid hitting me. These are dangerous. Dealer told me it was normal and they couldn't replicate the problem. Don't buy these cars.
I wish I had known about this case a year ago my son bought a used one, nothing but trouble Absolutely No One wants to work on it! I wish he could get rid of it but owes to much on it as of now I’m sure there is nothing that can be done now sadly!!!
I bought a 2013 fiesta a few weeks ago and with 13,800 miles and the transmission started to slip when driving in town and go out of gear when I was on the interstate. I called ford and they put me on a 2 to 3 month wait list to get a new transmission. I had a bad taste with ford a few years ago and that experience just put a never ending shit after taste forever.
Steve, I've owned mostly Fords since the early 70's , but I have to agree wholeheartedly that Ford has yet again, screwed the pooch. There IS a highly reliable, pleasant driving Focus, but IT HAS THREE PEDALS!! My 2014 Focus 5 speed manual has been a champ and at 100K miles, given me zero issues. I purchased it from a small dealer in NE Ohio who, strangely enough, had a lot full of manual transmission equipped Focus's when everyone else chuckled at the question. Now having said that, I have driven 6 speed dual clutch Focus's ranging from 2012 to 2018 as long distance rentals. The 2012 lurched, bucked, upshifted and downshifted as if it were on meth. I took a 2016 Focus rental on a trip and while it was improved overall, it still could have caused me to have an accident. I was coming down an off ramp and had slowed almost to a stop. The car abruptly shifted forcefully and lurched against the brake. I once thought Mullaly was a strong CEO, but I no longer have any respect for him or his former company, Boeing. Let's not forget to give a specvial call out to Bill Ford, who learned NOTHING from the Ford Explorer/Firestone fiasco. While you are at it, take a look at GM's lack of responsibility regarding Chevrolet Silverado pickup brake line failures.
This is not a new lawsuit. I'm part of two of the lawsuits, one of which I've been a part of for over FOUR years closer to FIVE (transmission) and another for 2-3 years for consumer fraud. The car doesn't just slip into neutral, it will go from 5th gear to 1st. My rotors at 40K miles were completely warped. This was not covered by Ford. I took it to my private mechanic to go the rotors changed, I didn't want any crap from Ford. Here's what's sad about this; my dad is the retired vice president of Ford Motor Companies finance department. My mom drives a Mercedes, he has an Acura. He hasn't owned a Ford since 1999. Ford wants a resolution as much as the Clinton's want to be investigated.
@4:00 Brought my car to the dealer with a problem. Dealer said they'd never seen this before and weren't sure what to do. They were willing to try replacing computers etc. They called me a couple months later and said they'd found what it was. Replaced a switch and the seemingly unrelated problem went away. Good dealers of any kind are hard to find. Thanks Toyota.
I have a 2018 F150 with the 10 speed transmission and in my opinion it is an equal POS. It slips into gear changes, slams into some gears and has a random gear change schedule. Some days it will use all 10 gears and others it will go from 1-3-5-6 to 1-3-4-6 on the same road and acceleration. In addition the integrated wheel end (IWE) for the 4wd system grinds on a regular basis and of course Ford can never duplicate the problem although it is well known issue and has been for years.
Yeah, he's right. I've driven many a performance and other cars over many decades. My girlfriend's Focus had the shit transmission. It had this dead spot where - when you step on it, the transmission creates this flat spot. Kinda comparable to the old problems with turbo lag in the mid-late eighties. We took it back to the dealer. They knew all about it. There was a back log on the replacement parts. Yup, they knew about it, but probably thought it better to just address each customer, rather than doing a general recall. I could have easily been killed in that car a few times. Happily, because I have been driving for a long time, I was able to compensate for the problem by anticipating the transmissions defect as it would occur. And so, we got rid of the car, but it WAS a shit transmission. ;)
There is a secondary cost to Fords decision to ignore this transmission problem - their reputation is taking a hit - again. This damage is very hard to repair - I struck Ford off my list of possible cars after the Pinto fiasco - remember that one. Not impressed with Ford management.
Thanks everyone cuz this one that I was going to buy only has an implied warranty! Bringing it back tomorrow unfortunately too get the money from my insurance they have to take my car! I need to find a cheap car yesterday 😢
Currently dealing with this now with a focus. On my 3rd clutch repair. When it happens again Ford told me to call their corporate office to request a buy back.
We have a 2015 Fovus and dealer stated exactly what you said (no idea about this issue). We were once told that it was normal and in Europe they're use to this condition but in America it's new and we're not use to it yet! Ford did replace the seal between the trans and the engine. Presumably an oil leak into the dry clutch would cause the jitter. After 15k miles the trans is still working well. Which is 6k more than we use to experience when they said they fixed it. We'll see...but it's the last Ford we'll ever purchase.
I'm an owner of a 2017 Ford Focus and I have to say that I made with worst decision buying a Ford. The torque-less engine, a jerky transmission, and shitty legroom, and overall crappy design really made me regret my decision. All this would've been avoided if car companies weren't over-engineering their cars. Ford should've gone with a classic, tried, and true 6-speed automatic. Dual-clutch transmissions are for sports cars and race cars, NOT for shitty econoboxes. I remember the old days of 4-speeds and 6-speeds. Kudos to Mazda for ending their relationship with Ford and choosing to use simple 6-speed Automatics in their cars.
If Ford REALLY felt that they needed to boost their fuel economy and didn’t want to use a traditional gearbox, they could have gone with a CVT, like they did on the Ford Five Hundred. The CVTs on those are reliable, from what I’ve heard.
The Fiesta was developed in coordination with Mazda, who sold their version as the Mazda 2. The Mazda 2 had a standard automatic transmission and is a reliable and safe car. Evan today as most competitors install a CVT transmission in many small cars, Mazda has stuck with the standard automatic. Mazda has stuck with the tried and true. Why would I ever buy from a company the knowingly sells defective cars?
Mazda engines are trash these days and they don't make reliable regular automatic transmissions. They are known to be weak. However, The manual transmissions are bullet proof.
This whole thing sounds like S.O.P. for Ford.😜 The last Ford I owned was a 1962 1/2 ton pickup back in the late 1970's. Even then, they had their issues with the 360 V8 not only being a gas-sucking gutless hog that leaked anti-freeze into the bottom end on a regular basis, but the 3-on-the-tree shifters were garbage and would rip out the pot metal shifter sleeve on a regular basis, usually when you went from 1st to 2nd quickly while accelerating up an entrance ramp to the freeway, effectively having the shifter come out in your hand and punching the windshield.😐 Ford's problems that they refused to address, didn't start just yesterday, and after I got rid of that pickup, I never bought another one. The exploding Pintos were so bad, they even made fun of them in the Blues Brothers movie (remember the N^^i's that had the Pinto in that movie, and they finally got rid of them by barely tapping the back of the car with the brother's Plymouth Fury, I believe, and it went up in a huge fireball?)😆 Anyway, I switched to mainly GM and Toyota, and now exclusively Toyota. Granted, no vehicle is trouble-free, but at least out of all the Toyota's I've had, *NOT ONE* ever left me sitting on the side of the road with anything more serious than a flat tire or a bad water pump. Not too shabby!😉
I discovered your videos several years back when my 2014 Ford Focus had issues. Went around and around with the dealer as you mention but finally just traded it in for a Honda Civic. It's a shame because I had respect for Ford not taking a government bailout during the financial crisis but issues such as this leaves such a foul taste in my mouth that I'm one of those that will unlikely ever consider a Ford again (I know silly but it doesn't no matter what type of vehicle). Sure I'm only a single person but wonder how many other people are like me where they won't even consider a Ford again because that "Fix Or Repair Daily" statement just holds too true in some minds. Thanks for the videos!
Had 2 bad vehicles from FoMoCo. New 77 Mustang II that died 1/4 mile from the dealer. 13 tows in the 1st year. Got rid of it at a loss. 2nd was a 93 Mercury Tracer. Transmission failed at 60,000. Friend owned a transmission shop. Told me he could rebuild it, but it would fail again. Sound familiar ? No more Fords in my family.
I used to work for Ford dealership and the stupidity of management not only exists at the factory but at the dealership level as well. These people have no concept of good management. As long as today I look good on paper, we will continue to be the way we are.
We had a Focus as a rental one year and I thought it was messed up, it would lug the engine terribly. Rental people said it's supposed to be that way. It served it's purpose for three days and that was that. Ford's been figuring it's cheaper to sell faulty cars since at least the days of the Pinto, so this is nothing new.
Gotta count myself lucky. 100,000 trouble free miles on my 2012 Focus.Except one day of practising parallel parking with my teenage daughter, it got a little "Jerky"(?) so I sent her to the dealership to let her have that experience. She came home with a form letter explaining that this transmission had, unique operating qualities, or words to that effect. No explanation of the cause or concern for the behaviour that day. Clearly they had had to explain similar issues, as Steve intimated, to other people, but were not prepared to be forthcoming about general concerns. Situation never repeated itself, nor did we ever practise repeated parallel parking attempts again.
I have been a viewer of your channel only recently but look forward to each release. I appreciate your input and viewpoints on a variety of topics - not to mention seeing the MOPAR behind you. The reason I am commenting on this video is because of the C8 Corvette reveal which occurred last night. One of the features mentioned for the C8 is an 8-Speed Dual Clutch transmission and I remembered the earlier video you had regarding the problems with the Ford Dual Clutch transmission - decided to review that video and, lo and behold, found your update video today. Although I consider my self a "car guy" (of advanced years!) I am by no means an authority on any transmission - believing that the folks at Corvette would fully wring out any transmission going into the Corvette (especially the C8 with all the advance publicity coming with that car); based on your videos, it appears that the issue with the Ford transmission is for a specific model from a specific supplier and does not reflect on the technology of a Dual Clutch itself. I also looked at "Wiki" and that pretty much confirmed what I thought. I certainly appreciate the level of detail you provided on this subject; so much so that I also "Subscribed" and rang the bell. Thanks from another Steve!
Network126 the biggest problem I had was the dealership was backed up 5 months on repairs. But I live in Michigan if you have a three consecutive repairs in one year they have to buy the car back. I also got my down payment and 11 months worth of payments. Check your state there may already be class action lawsuits you just jump aboard.
Jeep did the same thing to me with my 2015 Cherokee trailhawk. It wouldn’t down shift out of 3rd unless you came to a complete stop. You could tell the had memorized a script when responding to the problem. Everybody online was saying the same thing.
Gearbox suppliers offer off the shelf components, Getrag, ZF, Jatco and to a certain extent Tremeco. The cars are designed around the components, not the other way around. OT and ironic note: I owned an 80's Opel Manta GT/E featuring a Getrag gearbox. Beautifully slick gear change. I tried the equivalent lower 1.8 model with the GM transmission and it was slack and notchy.
6:06 my thinking as a auto mechanic of over 26 years and my observations of how young drivers are used to newer vehicles that mostly take care of a lot of the task automatically performed by the vehicle that used to require input from the drivers such as pumping the brakes to prevent lock up that is now performed by the antilock brake system. Traction control, stability control etc. is that the newest generation of drivers are befuddled by even the smallest of issues and can become easily distracted or become overwhelmed. What I'm saying is maybe this isn't the end of the world problem for a experienced driver who grew up driving old cars . But for someone young or new to driving going into neutral on the freeway are lurching unexpectedly into traffic may be very dangerous
VW has the same problem with the first generation DSG - 2005-2010. My car was taken into the dealer on the last day of extended warranty this spring and the dealer went with the typical "Can't reproduce the problem" excuse. I hate these car companies. The only way to make them pay is never buy their vehicles again.
I guess they don’t consider the clutch not applying when you go to cross traffic at an intersection a safety issue. It’s disgusting how these auto manufacturers try to squirm their way out of issues that they knew about before they even rolled a car off of the line. I’m an automotive diagnostic technician at an independent shop and I’ve seen quite a few of these ford vehicles with the dual clutch having issues. Almost every one I’ve driven has a judder at launch.
Ya that whole "we never heard of that before seems very common in all industries. I contacted Microsoft about and issue and was told they had never heard of that before. I said hold on. Then I asked the rep to check his email and follow the link. It was to the forum on the Microsoft web site that had nearly 400 post from people experiencing the same issue. Then I requested to have a word with his supervisor.
I wonder how they can argue going in to neutral on the freeway isn't a potential safety issue. Imagine being stuck in the middle lane in heavy traffic and unable to pull over to a shoulder before coasting to a stop. Also, haven't heard the whole video yet, but hasn't there been claimed injuries from this? edit: So yep, injuries and of course Ford would say you can just pull over. They seem to underestimate how much of an asshole people can be on the roads and perceive someone trying to merge over as someone trying to get ahead of them and slow them down or something. I had a transmission seal break on a car a long time ago and dumped fluid on to the exhaust leaving a huge trail of smoke behind me. Tried pulling over, but people kept speeding up to block me.
Ford's scared to own up, so it's corporate lawyers insist that they can sweep the problem under the rug by mis classifying it as a " non- safety issue". That doesn't fix the broken cars ,compensate the owners. It in fact maybe a deliberate attempt to delay matters past the statue of limitations to avoid an extremely expensive recall. Is this fraudulent,or criminal ? Why would you buy a focus now ? There's also another major issue with thier focus ST turbo engines. They love to blow out head gaskets/ radiators..
If that were me, I'd just change lanes anyway and let the car behind ram into me, then blame it all on Ford and sue the living shit out of them for damages.
I had a 2012 Focus. I was in the fast lane on day in rush hour traffic. I was going about 10 mph and it just stopped in it’s track. There was no coasting to the side. I was able to restart it 3 minutes later and pull to the right shoulder. I was worried it would stall again but it worked fine. I was able to drive back roads home with no problem. I did bring it to my dealer and they said it was a known issue and fixed it for me. Never had the problem happen again. This happened in year 4 of ownership. That was the only issue with my Focus I’ve ever had. I’ve since traded it into a ford dealer to buy another vehicle. They actually never took it as a trade in by them but had a 3rd party buy it from me for the trade in (they did all that trade in work for me) - now I know why they didn’t even want my car on their lot!
Buddy of mine worked for a car manufacturer (not going to name any) and said they would roll cars off the line with known issues because stopping production is more costly than just dealing with the issue later on. I think the practice of pushing cars off the line with known defects is not uncommon in the industry, but a defect in a large part like the power-train is not acceptable.
We have a 2017 Focus with this transmission. We bought it new knowing these transmissions were problematic. Aside from the shudder at take off it's not given us any trouble in almost 60k miles.
Automatic transmissions were perfected in the late 1930's, and strong enough to be used in 1940's Army tanks. Why is the reliability of automatic transmissions an issue in 2019?
it's not an "automatic" transmition per se, it has no Torque Converter. It's basically a manual drivetrain with a robotic clutch assembly and computer controlled shifting. So, like a student learner trying to figure out how to work the clutch to avoid slipping and stalling, the computer has to understand it itself without the benefit of knowing what the driver intends in acceleration or deceleration. 5 years ago I drove a rented a Toyota Auris for 2 weeks, which had a single clutch system - Absolutely garbage. The car kept lurching and changing gears inconsistently and without syncing RPM appropriately when engaging the clutch suddenly. On the highway it was bad but manageable, unless you wanted a quick overtake and it refused to shift down. On tight Greek village centers, it was downright appalling - juddering in slow speeds, slipping, throwing the clutch suddenly without warning. a real nightmare. The Dual Clutch systems are much much better, the VW DSG feels almost like an automatic and only shows its weakness when crawling in a traffic jam - but of course the long term reliability is godawful.
I wonder if it can be proven that Ford knew of this problem before production started and chose to proceed forward as it appears to be, that Ford could be liable for criminal negligence or malice and forethought? In addition to whatever else they may be on the hook for. If malice or criminal negligence can be proven, I'd think that should nullify any time or mileage constraints Ford has to fix or provide compensation to 'victims'. Or at the least extend the period consumers have to get restitution. It's more than frustrating knowing that the decisions to put out defective products come down to dollars and cents and a cost / benefit analysis. Since moral obligations take a back seat, the penalties companies incur for knowingly putting out defective products should be increased or changed such that they will really think long and hard before putting out junk.
Actually was able to Lemon Law my brothers 2012 Focus for this. Transmission replacement at 500 mils, 1700 miles, 7000 miles, finally lemon'd out at 11000 miles. Owned the car 10 months, 4 in the shop.
Wow! You all convinced me, I bought it to my guy and he said it's already got a repair, since I didn't buy it yet I'm bringing it back tomorrow! Guess they didn't think my guy would find anything! He even found how many times the history was deleted 😮
I was a Fix Operations Director for two Ford franchises over 20 years. Ford, like all manufacturers including Japanese, maintain deniability for any major defect. They seriously concern themselves primarily when a Lemon Law complaint is filed. Our dealership policy was a bit different. We refused to alibi for any manufacturers product failure and got the manufacturers district rep involved in all cases we deemed a seriously problem.
Thanks for reporting on Ford. Too bad I couldn’t see this before I bought a new 2012 Focus. When I brought it to dealership with the exact problems you talked about. Their answer was “ you are not driving it correctly”. Even though I have been a professional truck driver for 34 years. Also the power steering would stop working without warning while driving. I would have to pullover and restart the car to get it to reset. The dealer response to that was “we can’t fix it unless it is not working when you bring it in”. My response was put that you want me to drive it to your shop without power steering in writing. I ended up trading out of that car. I lost $5000 on that car. It’s a shame I can’t recoup some of my losses. Can I? Thanks Dan. Joliet Il.
My niece still has a 13 Fiesta with dual clutch and lots of problems. The dealers don't help and just tow the line... flash new hardware and wait, etc. It has had clutches and actuators replaced, etc. My brother works next door and walked over to talk to the tech., he said there was a pile several feet high of old clutches sitting on the floor. My lady had a 14 with dual clutch, she got so sick of it that she traded it before it lost value since the dealer wasn't fixing the issue. I had a manual 15 Fiesta, and we liked that car a lot until a drunk hit us and crushed it! Didn't buy another because Ford is stopping their cars in the USA and I didn't want to get stuck with an orfan that the dealers really don't want to fix. You can't tell me that Ford couldn't find a way to change the dual clutch to a "conventional" hydraulic transmission as a retrofit. I just can not believe this. The dimensions are very similar inside the engine bay, and the bell housing is the same shape, it would have worked. All that said, some people got more than 150,000 miles out of their DPS6 before they traded for something else, and that was with no problems. Lots of talk on the Fiesta Forums. Getrag builds a HUGE number of transmissions for many different companies and they are very good at this job. Rumor has it that Getrag did not suggest the dry dual clutch to Ford, Ford required them to make it this way ($$$). Rumor goes on that they should have used an oil bathed system like BMW and Mercedes had done in their dual clutch systems.
None of this would be happening were it not for CAFE. The mfgs need to squeeze every ounce of gas mileage out of the cheapest cars so they can still sell cars americans want. Its just the way it is. Or we can go back to cars that can barely get out of their own way. Take your pick. You cant have it both ways. IMHO of course.
At 70 MPH on the MASS Pike my Focus suddenly downshifted to 1st gear I nearly crashed. Dealer said the TCM (transmission control module) failed & it could be 4 months before the part arrives, meanwhile I am without transportation. My Ford Taurus & Mercury Sable gave me 300,000 reliable miles each so I had every reason to feel confident buying a 2014 Ford Focus. WRONG! Less than 70K miles & the clutch assembly has had to be changed 3 times & now the TCM failure. - Made in Mexico cr@p.
I have a friend who has a job driving cars off the assembly line and runs them through a short test course before staging them for shipping.... Even those guys have complained about the operation of those transmissions to Ford motor company.
I am sorry to report we were not smart enough to avoid buying a 2014 Focus. After having the clutch replaced under warranty, it was beginning to display the same symptoms again after several months of careful driving and by then we had learned more about the problem. We traded the automobile and lost several thousand dollars in the process but that was our lesson learned. Ford has lost a customer for life.
I had a 2012. Worked perfectly for 25k miles. Then it went south. 3 or 4 clutch packs, then an entire transmission, another clutch pack in the new trans. I took a loss and traded the car in. You can't fix this thing, its a failure of a design. They should've never left the drawing board. Its a shame too because the rest of the car was nice. I'll tell you how to fix it, throw the thing away and put a 6 speed automatic in there, a TRADITIONAL TRANSMISSION not a DCT.
I had a '94 T-bird V8. Trans went bad, dealer put in a new one under warranty but after that if the tachometer touched the yellow part it would kick into neutral until the tach was at idle for about 10 seconds. Many times this feature almost caused wrecks because you counted on it pulling into traffic. Dealer denied any wrong doing and it was never corrected. So yeah going into neutral can be VERY dangerous.
Thanks for the info. I will NEVER buy a Ford because of this. They obviously have no regard for their customers. Also, I know a lady with one of these problems in a Focus. She is an elderly lady who cannot afford to have these constant issues fixed...and yes...the dealership denies it's a common issue
Hyundai/Kia figured out DCT's. Smooth as butter. :) An automatic transmission that is actually just a manual transmission with an actuator to that presses the clutch and another that changes the gear.
As a professional Toyota auto technician, Steve was very well spoken describing these issues in terms that the average owner can understand. These type of situations happen much more often than people know, and than they should.
Transmission built for Ford Motor company for the low price they wanted to pay to maximise profit on the whole car. Suppliers are being pressured more than ever to supply components cheaper and cheaper by the OEM. Toyota and Honda seem to be the only exceptions who would rather their products sold at a higher segment price point , to ensure customers were given a quality long lasting defect free product.
I guess Getrag building it was less than the cost of Ford building the torque converter automatic (of Ford-GM design) themselves and putting that in the Focus...
I had an '11 Fiesta, but with the manual. It had issues requiring a rebuild, under warrantee. The rest of the car was junk too. 17 problems and 42 trips to the dealer in 4 years and 80,000 miles. Replaced with a Honda, we now have bought three Hondas. Never any unscheduled repairs on them. One has 213.000 miles. Never will I own a Ford again.
I worked for Ford from 1988 till 2011. right around 2010 I had 14,000 saved up and I was going to surprise my daughter with a new focus or fiesta. thank God that deal didn't go through, I ended up buying a Corolla with a blown up motor for $500 and we rebuilt the engine together had a great time, and she's been driving it for the last 7 years!
I grew up in the 1960-70's with a father who would ONLY buy Ford; nobody in our family was allowed to even consider buying anything else (my first car was a 1970 Ford Maverick). He now drives a 2008 Toyota with NO plans to ever buy a Ford!
I'm a Ford guy but I have no faith in their ethics anymore. I saw them sell F150s with the 3V 5.4 V8 with defective cam phasers for 6 years and leaky rear brake light seals for the same timeframe. You could buy replacement parts that weren't defective while they still put the defective ones in production. Then they had the Explorers and Flex wagons that leaked exhaust into the cabin for years. There were the Ecoboost limp mode issues due to water condensation in the intercooler for several years and they still have leaky oil pans. They never gave customers any consideration for these defective vehicles until they were forced. I will never buy a new Ford again. If I do buy a Ford, it will be 3 years old so I will be able to check the forums to see if it has any major defects before I get stuck with one. They claim they stopped making cars because SUVs and trucks are in demand, but the truth is that they lost the car market to Korean and Japanese brands, which are seemingly doing just fine. They offer better warranties and in many cases, much better quality. The MBAs running our car companies are only looking at quarterly numbers and sacrificing the long term viability of the company for short term sales. Why else would you ship cars you know will break, probably before the warranty runs out?
'GROSSE POINTE MYOPIA'
Ever heard of Ford' infamous 6.0 and 6.4 Power Chokes? How they survived that fiasco is beyond me!
I have a 2014 Ford Focus SE sedan that I bought used in February 2018 here in Virgina. When I bought it, it had 60,000 miles on it (i.e. end of warranty period). At the time of purchase it was noted that there was an outstanding service bulletin related to the Transmission Control Module (TCM) so I stopped by the local Ford dealership's service department to find out what the story was. The service bulletin apparently only extended the warranty period for TCM-related problems beyond the standard warranty. I had been noticing what Steve described - the shudder when accelerating from a stop sign/light but it was nothing jarring. Additionally there was tapping if I tried to accelerate fast.
The way the service manager described it, my Focus had a "manual transmission with the TCM replacing the operator's clutch and shifter" and that the TCM was what caused the shifting to go squirrely. After taking the car out for a test drive, the Service Manager said words to the effect of the tapping was the "Cam Phasers" (I'm still looking for the Photon Torpedo Tubes) and that, while the TCM in the Focus vehicles was a noted problem, my particular car was "the sweetest-shifting 2014 Focus he's ever driven." TL;DR He didn't do anything and the car still has the shudder as I'm approaching 100,000 miles.
FoMoCo had the same response with the Pinto. They knew full well that the fuel tank was dangerous and also that a 7 dollar part could have reduced the risk but they decided to let it go and save 7 dollars per car! FoMoCo has a nasty history of this behavior.
had a fiesta with this transmission and it was a nightmare. almost got rear ended once when i started accelerating at a light and car dropped into neutral after 2 seconds. another time it dropped to neutral on a 12 lane highway with no shoulder. luckily traffic was light enough for me to stop in the right lane, shutdown and restart the car. went through weeks where the car would randomly not crank, so i had to sit and wait 10, 15, 20 minutes until it started working again. that almost got me ticketed once. catalytic converter went bad at 20k miles. capless fuel filler malfunctioned which made it almost impossible to pump gas into it. and the last straw was it began to overheat when driven for more than an hour. dealership couldn't replicate it because they couldn't test drive it for an hour, so they finally told me to drive around on my own until i triggered it, and bring it right to them. they diagnosed it as a bad water pump. didn't solve the problem. i gave up and took 3k under blue book as a trade-in just to get rid of it ASAP. that was the first ford i had owned, and as you can guess i'll never buy another one
I was doing some contract work at a the Ford facility in Livonia, It was the ATNPC test facility (Automatic Transmission New Product Center). Behind the facility is a test track. I was looking at the yet to be released Ford Focus. I began a conversation with one of the test engineers and asked him about the vehicle and how I'd be interested in purchasing one. His reply was *"just get one with a manual. We're have all sort of issues with this damn automatic. It's junk. Ford will be in for all kind of trouble is they stick with this POS"*
Frantic call to 911 operator from Ford dealership: "Help! This guy's been on a rampage at the dealership for three hours! He's wrecked half our cars! We've called you eight times already, where are the cops!?" Operator: "They're getting there as fast as they can but you've got to be patient, they're all in Fords!"
LMAO!
They treat the 6th to 1st gear F150 random downshift at highway speeds the same way (also happened for years prior, which were supposedly addressed). I'll never own another Ford again after their unwillingness to repair a truck that could easily have gotten me killed on the highway. Nothing is quite as unsettling as going 70mph only to have the transmission downshift unexpectedly to first with an 18 wheeler behind you on a brand new 2014 F150.
My dad has a 2013 that's been in twice for software updates for the trans.
I read that same article - pretty amazing how these companies nonchalantly dismiss problems, even when it's likely to get someone killed. For the Ford guy who said that a car going into neutral at 75mph isn't a safety issue, did he volunteer to put each of his own family members in one of those cars on the highway and trigger that even as proof it's not a safety issue? I'm guessing that would be a no.
The other sad part about this is, not only did the buyers get shafted by a defective (non-fixable) product, but as the buying public became more aware of this issue, the car's resale value would have also taken a nose dive further screwing the customer. Great job Ford.
I'm stuck doing Uber with one of these defective cars while living in my dads kitchen and going insane with depression due to not havinging any personal space or privacy. I struggle to even make the payments. I hate my life.
The irony is the Ford Focus with the manual transmission (particularly the ST) is a joy to drive.
Had a 13 Focus 5 speed. While not as fun as the 13 Accord I had before or the 15 Fit I have now (both 6 speeds), it was still a fun little car. Great chassis, it really didn't feel like the 3,100 pound car that it was (mine was an SE with the appearance and technology package). Probably why the MPG was about the same as my 3,400 pound Accord despite it being a larger car with a larger engine though (2.4/6 speed manual vs 2.0/5 speed manual).
First off most people do not understand that this is a Manual transmission that is shifted automatically. It will not shift like a regular automatic transmission. There are 2 problems with the dps6 transmission. The first is the clutch material being inferior causing a shutter when shifting gears. This issue was for the most part addressed in 2015 when Ford released an updated clutch pack. The second issue for this transmission is the Transmission Control Module failing which can cause it to shift into neutral.
I had a F150 blow a sparkplug out. Dealer claimed they never heard of that happening but lots of forums show it was common. Apparently so common that Ford developed special tool to repair the issue. Seems like the "never heard of that" issue is a pretty common response.
Haha I've never even owned a Ford and I know about the infamous Triton spark plugs issues
Steve C Even Honda pulls that shit too. fuel dilution in the new 1.5T is met with utter, dismay
I love those! I'm a semi-retired Ford mechanic and I charge $350 parts on labor to repair those I can do them in under an hour!
Meanwhile the people responsible for this decision will get a golden parachute.
Meanwhile I'm stuck doing Uber in one of these defective cars, while living in my dad's kitchen, going insane with depression due to not having any personal space or privacy, and struggling to make the payments on the damn car.
Hi Steve. I enjoy your videos. I bought a 2012 Ford Focus with the bad transmission. I test drove a manual transmission and an automatic. The manual transmission felt good, but I naively went with the strange automatic because it got slightly better gas mileage and because the salesman assured me the computer-controlled automatic transmission would learn my driving habits and smooth out after I drove it a while. Ford also not only lied to me, but to everyone who bought a Focus or Festiva. It's outrageous that service advisors told owners that they weren't driving properly, and that was why the transmission had problems. Ford spun a web of lies and deceit to sell cars Ford employees knew had defective transmissions even before the car was put into production. I'm a retired State Trooper and found the car too dangerous to keep, after it slipped out of gear on the freeway several different times while my wife and I drove it. Make no mistake, cars with that transmission are DANGEROUS and shouldn't be on the road. Don't believe their lies. I won't buy another Ford vehicle...
I'm stuck with a 2016 Focus myself. Worthington Ford refused to take it back.
I bought a used 2012 focus with 90,000 miles from a Honda dealer...tranny went out at 108,000 miles...took it to Ford dealership who gave me a runaround and said their diagnostic tech won't be back for 2 weeks...took it to the next Ford dealership (Auto Nation?) Which did diagnose it and said it was the clutch and would fix for $3000 but would do the TCM for free since it was still under extended warranty...I left fuming...after watching your video and researching I will never buy a Ford again and tell everyone else the same because of management...they should have stood by their product instead of hiding behind it
That's it exactly. Management.
Now that explains the add I seen from a local Ford dealer “Wanted Service receptionist with Alzheimer”
Out of sight out of mind.
Remember the Ford Triton 5.4 engine? Same story 2004 to 2010 as I recall. You'd think these fools had never built a vehicle before. Somehow 110 years of experience doesn't teach these executives anything except to personally drive a foreign car! It would be a different story if their personal wealth was penalized for these crappy products. Paid to make crap. Take care. Doug
I probably should add that maybe we aren't seeing the forest for the trees? Big money has no loyalty to any country. History shows clearly. Big money also makes money whether the country prospers or not, whether the stocks go up or down. Perhaps these Detroit 'fools' know what they are doing? As in the seventies when they ran the auto industry into the ground while buying mega shares in foreign car companies. They did well the general population suffered as always. In addition government gifts of billions added to their take. Keep in mind the theft on a grand scale of that caused the recent depression. See any wealthy people behind bars? The government just gave them more! On and on it goes. Take care. Doug
Douglas Thompson well said Doug, I had a 5.4 triton, cam phaser, spark plug, pass side exhaust manifold, starting to rust out at a very early age, etc. I drive a Toyota now.
Had a car once that started making a loud pop from the back right corner after about 10-15K miles. Took it to the dealership and was told that it was a "normal" noise. I ask the service tech if he really was telling me that the engineers of this particular manufacturer intended for it to make that sound. He sort of stared at me a minute and said "fine, we will replace the strut mounts, they have a known defect." Absolutely unbelievable.
Wow
We got our daughter a used 2012 Focus SFE used in 2014. It was still under original warranty and initially seemed like a good car. We later found it had already had multiple visits to the dealer for these issues. In the 3 yrs we had it we had the control module replaced 4 times, reprogrammed almost as often as oil changes and the whole clutch replaced twice. This was all done under warranty but eventually we sold the car for 1/4 what we paid for it because we felt we had to be upfront to the people buying it. When it worked it was a great little car, drove and handled well and the gas mileage was phenomenal. But this issue and the fact that the dealer never said word one about it ticks me off to this day. Now its pretty public knowledge about this issue but back in 2014 they were trying really hard to cover this up and kept a tight lid on it. Usually I’m pretty diligent about car buying but I let my guard slip on this one and now will never buy a Ford again.
The problem cannot be fixed. There are too few clutch discs within the dual clutch assembly. With the workload of the clutch being spread over too few discs, they heat up rapidly and the clutch material starts to peel and get sticky. They need to add 2 more clutches and steels within the assembly per clutch pack. That's an additional 8 parts. While this is possible, that would make the whole assembly larger, thus it will no longer fit within the provided space between the engine and transmission. This could be mitigate with a spacer plate, longer bolts, new CV shafts, and a longer input shaft. Ford will not spend the money to retool this assembly.
Now this is a car guys comment! I have a channel which covers repairs on cars and sometimes motorcycles and upgrades. I'd be happy to see you there.
I'm grateful to know what the issue is with the car.
@@DENicholsAutoBravado I used to do a lot of 4x4 work. Weld on lift kits, custom designed power train assemblies. Pretty much anything you could dream up. I am not a very good welder or fabricator but the mechanical engineering side of things always gets me giddy like a school girl. Only I don't wear dresses. Well... Mostly. LOL! I like to get to root cause. Prevent issues. When I fix something I want it to be right the first time.
Joseph Wotell I like your stuff! We need more people like you and even a bunch of schoolgirls that think like you! Outstanding thank you for the info!
Alan Mulally - headed Ford when the dual clutch problem was "generated". Prior to that he was "interim CEO" of Boeing where he had been Chief Engineering Officer and led the 777 project AND the 737 MAX mess - both now costing Boeing more than money (at the time of his release from Boeing and transfer to Ford - with Ford buying the remainder of his Boeing contract - people wondered why Boeing let him go). Could THIS be the common piece? Just asking. But the timelines match as do the resultant patterns of deny, cover up and pray (prey, actually).
BTW - you do a wonderful job of informing us of important stuff while also teaching us WTF is happening.
Thank you so much for sharing...
Wow! Didn't know there was a connection with Boeing! Doesn't surprise me though! I unfortunately have a 2016 Focus. I have a couple videos on my channel of it malfunctioning.
We bought a 2011 Ford focus used from the dealership. I can go on to talk about the issues we’ve had with it. It almost killed my life she was at a stop sign pulled out because she knew she had enough of time but then she had no power. She threw it in reverse but there was no reverse it just sit there. Thank God the tractor trailer truck was able to stop in time. We had it fixed one time but if I knew then what I know now we would have not got the vehicle. And because we bought it used we can’t file a lawsuit or do different things that we can do. We are stuck with this vehicle until we buy another one. We don’t live paycheck by paycheck but it’s damn close so we’re kind of stuck in this situation
I have a 2012 Focus Titanium with the DPS6 transmission and although I had the occasional shudder it wasn't a big deal and as a long time manual transmission driver you know that on occasion you get a little shudder. Yes, it was worse than a typical manual clutch but not hugely so. Earlier this year I took the car in for some warranty items I'd neglected and they asked about the transmission so I told them I get the occasional shudder and they said they'd test drive it. They came back and informed me the transmission needed to be redone so I told them to go ahead and do it. The called an Uber to get me home and it took a couple days to complete the work.
As is typical they managed to find a few items they could charge me for that were not covered by the warranty and I wound up paying about $650 for all of those items but I had a new transmission at 80K miles so I should, fingers crossed, be good for another 60K+. If the car lasts 140K miles I'll just figure it to be a right off at that point as the resale will be near zero anyway. On the upside, my net average mileage after over 82K miles is over 38mpg and the car is still fun to drive. The Titanium has a bit firmer suspension and a few other upgrades over the lower models that make it quite a fun car to drive while still averaging over 38mpg. My best tank was over 50mpg and over 600 miles range.
@@STho205 -- I can believe that people with stick experience have fewer problems with the DCT boxes, but some driving conditions are not ideal for DCT or stick for that matter. If you're stuck in stop-and-go traffic several hours a week a manual box of either type is not ideal and an automatic is much better. Even better for this type of driving are hybrids and better still all electric.
The biggest problem with DCT boxes is that the car makers want them cheap and make them cheap which always works out more expensive.
2020 corvette is coming with a dual clutch transmission.
I have driven a ford dual clutch transmission vehicle. it had 190,000 miles on it, with the first transmission. I asked the owner why his had no problems. it's simple it should not been installed for the general public. you don't drive it like a regular automatic. it's a semiautomatic transmission. when driving them you have to think standard transmission (witch most people haven't even driven). probably the worst case is stop and go traffic, where the car is barely moving you'll kill the transmission in minutes, yes minutes the clutch plates are grinding themselves to death in this scenario . the 2020 corvette isn't going to be sold to the average person, and that it where the transmission belongs. it's a racing transmission, it only advantage is extremely quick shifting. in a daily driver it would be horrible to drive. it sounds like marketing needed something for their brochure. the people in ford who put this into motion should be paying out of their pocket. that would make future idots think twice about trying a stunt like this.
@dave rolleman - Difference is the 2020 Vette's transmission is made by Tremec, same company who provides basically bulletproof trannys for Mustangs, Camaros and Challengers.
@@glareswitch Ironic that Tremec is a Mexican owned subsidiary (not that there's anything wrong with that) while Getrag is German.
To a far lesser degree, this problem occurred with all manufacturers at some point with certain models. For cost reasons, most of the time manufacturers will knowingly continue to build vehicles with minor defects and resolve the issues later under warranties and with Technical Service Bulletins. Common problems with any particular vehicle are common. Yet the manufacturers don’t address them during the production process.
GM’s ignition switch fiasco was one of the worst examples.
The new 10 speed transmission also sucks. Constantly shifting gears, skipping gears, always caught in limbo.
Isn't it supposed to skip gears since... Well it has 10 of them?
When you think for a moment about the person who says, "We've never heard of this issue. You're the first." when you know that's not true, this is the person who was hired. The person who would not/will not mislead the customer was not hired. These things happen because customers allow them to happen. Start supporting businesses that hire people who do not mislead customers.
I have a Volvo v60 2013 which uses the same gearbox, and I experienced everything like the choking on start/stop, lost power on highway, cant engage to proper gear etc. When I go to Volvo to service the car, they ask me 100k (HKD) including labour to replace the gearbox. This whole thing is a scam. Everything works well apart from the gearbox which is a shame because I love that car. The gearbox problem alone totaled the car. The repair cost can buy me another car. Long story short, recently I trade in the car $20k (HKD) for a Mazda cx30 (proper regular automatic, not CVT/DCT or any of that crap). Do gearbox research on your own before buying any car, especially automatic. Good luck.
Certain CVTs are actually pretty robust in my experience as a mechanic. Namely Hondas and I've heard some decent things about Toyota's as well. That being said, my personal cars all have manual transmissions. Most robust type there is save for a direct drive.
Ford has had numerous serious engineering, design, and quality flaws the last several years. The Focus RS engines suffered from serious failures Ford tried to ignore until there was massive negative public outcry. Way too many of their Ecoboost V6 engines had catastrophic failures such as blown head gaskets, failed timing chains, and even bad rod bearings, requiring massively expensive repairs on even low mileage relatively new vehicles. Again, Ford did everything they could to avoid taking any responsibility for as long as they could. It seems Ford sells known defective products, then puts their head in the sand pretending there’s no problem, then they go on the defensive telling dealers to deny warranty work, and only when they’re forced to by massive external pressure, do they ever do anything and even then it’s often not enough. I know a guy who buys the vehicles for the state highway patrol and they’ve had so many massive problems with Ford vehicles, and Ford’s refusal or inability to make things right, they’ve given up on Ford entirely. Ford doesn’t seem to get it. I hope they lose all the lawsuits and have to pay out massive damages. Perhaps then they’ll realize they need to make better vehicles.
the soft timing chain failure speaks volume to their commitment. Just like the skinny brake rotors on heavy vehicles...
love 'n hate customer milking
I heard this new thing coming out called a "Manual Transmission". It uses a driver operated lever, supposedly located within reach of the drivers right hand, and a foot pedal thingy, to the left of the brake pedal. It sounds CRAZY I know, I guess you would need 3 legs to operate this futuristic piece of equipment. Also probably not very reliable, since it's such an untested design. Better stick with the German DCT, that Volkswagen couldn't even get to work properly, I'm sure they'll work the bugs out in a couple weeks.
I drive a manual car and always have but IC cars are mostly last century tech, the simplicity, reliability and cheaper to run EVs will take over pretty soon (for most people) especially when price parity happens.
All the more reason to go manual transmission. It's funny how front-drive automatics have worked for years, but suddenly the need to reengineer it emerges, and in this case with disastrous results. Always go with a technology that has been proven over many years... go with a car (new or used) that you see has been shown to go 200k miles plus.
As always Steve, thanks for covering this. It's great to hear from an attorney who also understands cars.
I once test drove a Fiesta. That car was bright yellow, fun looking, and I really wanted it. When I drove it I immediately did not like the way the transmission felt. I do not know much about cars, but I could tell something was wrong and I did not buy the car.
I had a 2012 focus with all these problems. I got rid of it after I tried to merge in traffic and it just rolled forward very slowly with the engine revving at 3k when my foot was in the gas. It finally moved after 5 seconds but by then everyone had to slam on their brakes to avoid hitting me. These are dangerous. Dealer told me it was normal and they couldn't replicate the problem. Don't buy these cars.
I wish I had known about this case a year ago my son bought a used one, nothing but trouble Absolutely No One wants to work on it! I wish he could get rid of it but owes to much on it as of now I’m sure there is nothing that can be done now sadly!!!
I bought a 2013 fiesta a few weeks ago and with 13,800 miles and the transmission started to slip when driving in town and go out of gear when I was on the interstate. I called ford and they put me on a 2 to 3 month wait list to get a new transmission. I had a bad taste with ford a few years ago and that experience just put a never ending shit after taste forever.
Steve, I've owned mostly Fords since the early 70's , but I have to agree wholeheartedly that Ford has yet again, screwed the pooch. There IS a highly reliable, pleasant driving Focus, but IT HAS THREE PEDALS!! My 2014 Focus 5 speed manual has been a champ and at 100K miles, given me zero issues. I purchased it from a small dealer in NE Ohio who, strangely enough, had a lot full of manual transmission equipped Focus's when everyone else chuckled at the question. Now having said that, I have driven 6 speed dual clutch Focus's ranging from 2012 to 2018 as long distance rentals. The 2012 lurched, bucked, upshifted and downshifted as if it were on meth. I took a 2016 Focus rental on a trip and while it was improved overall, it still could have caused me to have an accident. I was coming down an off ramp and had slowed almost to a stop. The car abruptly shifted forcefully and lurched against the brake. I once thought Mullaly was a strong CEO, but I no longer have any respect for him or his former company, Boeing. Let's not forget to give a specvial call out to Bill Ford, who learned NOTHING from the Ford Explorer/Firestone fiasco.
While you are at it, take a look at GM's lack of responsibility regarding Chevrolet Silverado pickup brake line failures.
This is not a new lawsuit. I'm part of two of the lawsuits, one of which I've been a part of for over FOUR years closer to FIVE (transmission) and another for 2-3 years for consumer fraud. The car doesn't just slip into neutral, it will go from 5th gear to 1st. My rotors at 40K miles were completely warped. This was not covered by Ford. I took it to my private mechanic to go the rotors changed, I didn't want any crap from Ford. Here's what's sad about this; my dad is the retired vice president of Ford Motor Companies finance department. My mom drives a Mercedes, he has an Acura. He hasn't owned a Ford since 1999. Ford wants a resolution as much as the Clinton's want to be investigated.
@4:00 Brought my car to the dealer with a problem. Dealer said they'd never seen this before and weren't sure what to do. They were willing to try replacing computers etc. They called me a couple months later and said they'd found what it was. Replaced a switch and the seemingly unrelated problem went away. Good dealers of any kind are hard to find. Thanks Toyota.
I have a 2018 F150 with the 10 speed transmission and in my opinion it is an equal POS. It slips into gear changes, slams into some gears and has a random gear change schedule. Some days it will use all 10 gears and others it will go from 1-3-5-6 to 1-3-4-6 on the same road and acceleration. In addition the integrated wheel end (IWE) for the 4wd system grinds on a regular basis and of course Ford can never duplicate the problem although it is well known issue and has been for years.
Yeah, he's right. I've driven many a performance and other cars over many decades. My girlfriend's Focus had the shit transmission. It had this dead spot where - when you step on it, the transmission creates this flat spot. Kinda comparable to the old problems with turbo lag in the mid-late eighties. We took it back to the dealer. They knew all about it. There was a back log on the replacement parts. Yup, they knew about it, but probably thought it better to just address each customer, rather than doing a general recall. I could have easily been killed in that car a few times. Happily, because I have been driving for a long time, I was able to compensate for the problem by anticipating the transmissions defect as it would occur. And so, we got rid of the car, but it WAS a shit transmission. ;)
There is a secondary cost to Fords decision to ignore this transmission problem - their reputation is taking a hit - again. This damage is very hard to repair - I struck Ford off my list of possible cars after the Pinto fiasco - remember that one. Not impressed with Ford management.
People are so loyal to Ford, they just buy another. Read Joel Doxtator
comment above.
I rented a DCT FORD Focus a long time ago and I remember how that thing bucked and jumped all the time.
It seems like car companies are no longer automakers, but simply auto assemblers buying various components from who knows where.
i was never notified about the class action its 2022 and it ran out in 2020. im pissed
mine did too. i'm so irritated, they said well its up to the NHSTA to let you know, not us.
Thanks everyone cuz this one that I was going to buy only has an implied warranty! Bringing it back tomorrow unfortunately too get the money from my insurance they have to take my car! I need to find a cheap car yesterday 😢
Currently dealing with this now with a focus. On my 3rd clutch repair. When it happens again Ford told me to call their corporate office to request a buy back.
I wonder how hard it is to get Ford corporate to buy back a defective car? I'm stuck with a 2016 Focus myself.
Have to say, I love my Focus ST. Nothing like a 6 speed manual.
Yes, I could wish to have the standard shift. The Focus drives real nice, just this stupid automatic takes that fun away, sometimes.
I took my 2013 ford focus back to the dealership and switch it out. I wasn't gonna deal with all the drama Ford made me go through..
We have a 2015 Fovus and dealer stated exactly what you said (no idea about this issue). We were once told that it was normal and in Europe they're use to this condition but in America it's new and we're not use to it yet! Ford did replace the seal between the trans and the engine. Presumably an oil leak into the dry clutch would cause the jitter. After 15k miles the trans is still working well. Which is 6k more than we use to experience when they said they fixed it. We'll see...but it's the last Ford we'll ever purchase.
I'm an owner of a 2017 Ford Focus and I have to say that I made with worst decision buying a Ford. The torque-less engine, a jerky transmission, and shitty legroom, and overall crappy design really made me regret my decision. All this would've been avoided if car companies weren't over-engineering their cars. Ford should've gone with a classic, tried, and true 6-speed automatic. Dual-clutch transmissions are for sports cars and race cars, NOT for shitty econoboxes. I remember the old days of 4-speeds and 6-speeds. Kudos to Mazda for ending their relationship with Ford and choosing to use simple 6-speed Automatics in their cars.
If Ford REALLY felt that they needed to boost their fuel economy and didn’t want to use a traditional gearbox, they could have gone with a CVT, like they did on the Ford Five Hundred. The CVTs on those are reliable, from what I’ve heard.
The Fiesta was developed in coordination with Mazda, who sold their version as the Mazda 2. The Mazda 2 had a standard automatic transmission and is a reliable and safe car. Evan today as most competitors install a CVT transmission in many small cars, Mazda has stuck with the standard automatic. Mazda has stuck with the tried and true. Why would I ever buy from a company the knowingly sells defective cars?
Mazda engines are trash these days and they don't make reliable regular automatic transmissions. They are known to be weak. However, The manual transmissions are bullet proof.
This whole thing sounds like S.O.P. for Ford.😜 The last Ford I owned was a 1962 1/2 ton pickup back in the late 1970's. Even then, they had their issues with the 360 V8 not only being a gas-sucking gutless hog that leaked anti-freeze into the bottom end on a regular basis, but the 3-on-the-tree shifters were garbage and would rip out the pot metal shifter sleeve on a regular basis, usually when you went from 1st to 2nd quickly while accelerating up an entrance ramp to the freeway, effectively having the shifter come out in your hand and punching the windshield.😐 Ford's problems that they refused to address, didn't start just yesterday, and after I got rid of that pickup, I never bought another one. The exploding Pintos were so bad, they even made fun of them in the Blues Brothers movie (remember the N^^i's that had the Pinto in that movie, and they finally got rid of them by barely tapping the back of the car with the brother's Plymouth Fury, I believe, and it went up in a huge fireball?)😆 Anyway, I switched to mainly GM and Toyota, and now exclusively Toyota. Granted, no vehicle is trouble-free, but at least out of all the Toyota's I've had, *NOT ONE* ever left me sitting on the side of the road with anything more serious than a flat tire or a bad water pump. Not too shabby!😉
I discovered your videos several years back when my 2014 Ford Focus had issues. Went around and around with the dealer as you mention but finally just traded it in for a Honda Civic. It's a shame because I had respect for Ford not taking a government bailout during the financial crisis but issues such as this leaves such a foul taste in my mouth that I'm one of those that will unlikely ever consider a Ford again (I know silly but it doesn't no matter what type of vehicle). Sure I'm only a single person but wonder how many other people are like me where they won't even consider a Ford again because that "Fix Or Repair Daily" statement just holds too true in some minds. Thanks for the videos!
Russ Neal Ford did take a bailout. They participated in cash-for-clunkers just like everyone else.
Had 2 bad vehicles from FoMoCo. New 77 Mustang II that died 1/4 mile from the dealer. 13 tows in the 1st year. Got rid of it at a loss. 2nd was a 93 Mercury Tracer. Transmission failed at 60,000. Friend owned a transmission shop. Told me he could rebuild it, but it would fail again. Sound familiar ? No more Fords in my family.
I used to work for Ford dealership and the stupidity of management not only exists at the factory but at the dealership level as well. These people have no concept of good management. As long as today I look good on paper, we will continue to be the way we are.
There is a big difference between honest incompetence and deliberate dishonesty.
We had a Focus as a rental one year and I thought it was messed up, it would lug the engine terribly. Rental people said it's supposed to be that way. It served it's purpose for three days and that was that.
Ford's been figuring it's cheaper to sell faulty cars since at least the days of the Pinto, so this is nothing new.
Gotta count myself lucky. 100,000 trouble free miles on my 2012 Focus.Except one day of practising parallel parking with my teenage daughter, it got a little "Jerky"(?) so I sent her to the dealership to let her have that experience. She came home with a form letter explaining that this transmission had, unique operating qualities, or words to that effect. No explanation of the cause or concern for the behaviour that day. Clearly they had had to explain similar issues, as Steve intimated, to other people, but were not prepared to be forthcoming about general concerns. Situation never repeated itself, nor did we ever practise repeated parallel parking attempts again.
You can fix it by putting a manual transmission in it problem solved.
The best idea I've seen in years! Solves multiple problems!
I wonder if that's possible. Sure would be a cool way to get a nice car cheap.
catsspat and it’s more fun to drive!
I have been a viewer of your channel only recently but look forward to each release. I appreciate your input and viewpoints on a variety of topics - not to mention seeing the MOPAR behind you. The reason I am commenting on this video is because of the C8 Corvette reveal which occurred last night. One of the features mentioned for the C8 is an 8-Speed Dual Clutch transmission and I remembered the earlier video you had regarding the problems with the Ford Dual Clutch transmission - decided to review that video and, lo and behold, found your update video today. Although I consider my self a "car guy" (of advanced years!) I am by no means an authority on any transmission - believing that the folks at Corvette would fully wring out any transmission going into the Corvette (especially the C8 with all the advance publicity coming with that car); based on your videos, it appears that the issue with the Ford transmission is for a specific model from a specific supplier and does not reflect on the technology of a Dual Clutch itself. I also looked at "Wiki" and that pretty much confirmed what I thought. I certainly appreciate the level of detail you provided on this subject; so much so that I also "Subscribed" and rang the bell. Thanks from another Steve!
_Unintended Neutral Event_ now filming on location with Tom Cruise starring as 'Buddy'
Now we know why Ford is getting out of the small car manufacturing
My 2015 Ford Focus went back under the Lemon Law for bad transmission. I drive a Toyota now.
How'd you do that? Just keep getting it repaired and then submit the paperwork? I have a 2016 Focus.
Network126 the biggest problem I had was the dealership was backed up 5 months on repairs. But I live in Michigan if you have a three consecutive repairs in one year they have to buy the car back. I also got my down payment and 11 months worth of payments. Check your state there may already be class action lawsuits you just jump aboard.
Jeep did the same thing to me with my 2015 Cherokee trailhawk. It wouldn’t down shift out of 3rd unless you came to a complete stop. You could tell the had memorized a script when responding to the problem. Everybody online was saying the same thing.
Gearbox suppliers offer off the shelf components, Getrag, ZF, Jatco and to a certain extent Tremeco.
The cars are designed around the components, not the other way around.
OT and ironic note: I owned an 80's Opel Manta GT/E featuring a Getrag gearbox. Beautifully slick gear change. I tried the equivalent lower 1.8 model with the GM transmission and it was slack and notchy.
The quintessential rally car! Wow I used to love the Opel Manta's in their rallying years!
6:06 my thinking as a auto mechanic of over 26 years and my observations of how young drivers are used to newer vehicles that mostly take care of a lot of the task automatically performed by the vehicle that used to require input from the drivers such as pumping the brakes to prevent lock up that is now performed by the antilock brake system. Traction control, stability control etc. is that the newest generation of drivers are befuddled by even the smallest of issues and can become easily distracted or become overwhelmed. What I'm saying is maybe this isn't the end of the world problem for a experienced driver who grew up driving old cars . But for someone young or new to driving going into neutral on the freeway are lurching unexpectedly into traffic may be very dangerous
VW has the same problem with the first generation DSG - 2005-2010. My car was taken into the dealer on the last day of extended warranty this spring and the dealer went with the typical "Can't reproduce the problem" excuse. I hate these car companies. The only way to make them pay is never buy their vehicles again.
The sad part is that the execs will not be held personally responsible.
I guess they don’t consider the clutch not applying when you go to cross traffic at an intersection a safety issue. It’s disgusting how these auto manufacturers try to squirm their way out of issues that they knew about before they even rolled a car off of the line. I’m an automotive diagnostic technician at an independent shop and I’ve seen quite a few of these ford vehicles with the dual clutch having issues. Almost every one I’ve driven has a judder at launch.
is designed borderline ok for high maintenance milking
Ya that whole "we never heard of that before seems very common in all industries. I contacted Microsoft about and issue and was told they had never heard of that before. I said hold on. Then I asked the rep to check his email and follow the link. It was to the forum on the Microsoft web site that had nearly 400 post from people experiencing the same issue. Then I requested to have a word with his supervisor.
I joked that Ford hired the guy who developed the Samsung Galaxy Notes that caught on fire
DeBoss Garage talked about the dual clutch recall in Canada. They have some tough consumer protection laws. Ford really messed up on engineering.
I wonder how they can argue going in to neutral on the freeway isn't a potential safety issue. Imagine being stuck in the middle lane in heavy traffic and unable to pull over to a shoulder before coasting to a stop.
Also, haven't heard the whole video yet, but hasn't there been claimed injuries from this?
edit: So yep, injuries and of course Ford would say you can just pull over. They seem to underestimate how much of an asshole people can be on the roads and perceive someone trying to merge over as someone trying to get ahead of them and slow them down or something. I had a transmission seal break on a car a long time ago and dumped fluid on to the exhaust leaving a huge trail of smoke behind me. Tried pulling over, but people kept speeding up to block me.
Ford's scared to own up, so it's corporate lawyers insist that they can sweep the problem under the rug by mis classifying it as a " non- safety issue". That doesn't fix the broken cars ,compensate the owners. It in fact maybe a deliberate attempt to delay matters past the statue of limitations to avoid an extremely expensive recall. Is this fraudulent,or criminal ? Why would you buy a focus now ? There's also another major issue with thier focus ST turbo engines. They love to blow out head gaskets/ radiators..
If that were me, I'd just change lanes anyway and let the car behind ram into me, then blame it all on Ford and sue the living shit out of them for damages.
I had a 2012 Focus. I was in the fast lane on day in rush hour traffic. I was going about 10 mph and it just stopped in it’s track. There was no coasting to the side. I was able to restart it 3 minutes later and pull to the right shoulder. I was worried it would stall again but it worked fine. I was able to drive back roads home with no problem. I did bring it to my dealer and they said it was a known issue and fixed it for me. Never had the problem happen again. This happened in year 4 of ownership. That was the only issue with my Focus I’ve ever had. I’ve since traded it into a ford dealer to buy another vehicle. They actually never took it as a trade in by them but had a 3rd party buy it from me for the trade in (they did all that trade in work for me) - now I know why they didn’t even want my car on their lot!
Automatic transmissions have been in production cars since 1940. Ford probably needs a couple more decades to get it right.
it was made by Getrag....nice try.
Buddy of mine worked for a car manufacturer (not going to name any) and said they would roll cars off the line with known issues because stopping production is more costly than just dealing with the issue later on.
I think the practice of pushing cars off the line with known defects is not uncommon in the industry, but a defect in a large part like the power-train is not acceptable.
We have a 2017 Focus with this transmission. We bought it new knowing these transmissions were problematic. Aside from the shudder at take off it's not given us any trouble in almost 60k miles.
@efficiency Gemsound the deal was too good to pass up, it's still under warranty and we're going to replace it in the near future
Omni Charger. I had one, but a 4-speed stick. A great car actually, at least as far as reliability.
Automatic transmissions were perfected in the late 1930's, and strong enough to be used in 1940's Army tanks. Why is the reliability of automatic transmissions an issue in 2019?
it's not an "automatic" transmition per se, it has no Torque Converter. It's basically a manual drivetrain with a robotic clutch assembly and computer controlled shifting. So, like a student learner trying to figure out how to work the clutch to avoid slipping and stalling, the computer has to understand it itself without the benefit of knowing what the driver intends in acceleration or deceleration. 5 years ago I drove a rented a Toyota Auris for 2 weeks, which had a single clutch system - Absolutely garbage. The car kept lurching and changing gears inconsistently and without syncing RPM appropriately when engaging the clutch suddenly. On the highway it was bad but manageable, unless you wanted a quick overtake and it refused to shift down. On tight Greek village centers, it was downright appalling - juddering in slow speeds, slipping, throwing the clutch suddenly without warning. a real nightmare. The Dual Clutch systems are much much better, the VW DSG feels almost like an automatic and only shows its weakness when crawling in a traffic jam - but of course the long term reliability is godawful.
Dual clutches are automatic manuals essentially.
I wonder if it can be proven that Ford knew of this problem before production started and chose to proceed forward as it appears to be, that Ford could be liable for criminal negligence or malice and forethought? In addition to whatever else they may be on the hook for. If malice or criminal negligence can be proven, I'd think that should nullify any time or mileage constraints Ford has to fix or provide compensation to 'victims'. Or at the least extend the period consumers have to get restitution. It's more than frustrating knowing that the decisions to put out defective products come down to dollars and cents and a cost / benefit analysis. Since moral obligations take a back seat, the penalties companies incur for knowingly putting out defective products should be increased or changed such that they will really think long and hard before putting out junk.
Actually was able to Lemon Law my brothers 2012 Focus for this. Transmission replacement at 500 mils, 1700 miles, 7000 miles, finally lemon'd out at 11000 miles. Owned the car 10 months, 4 in the shop.
Wow! You all convinced me, I bought it to my guy and he said it's already got a repair, since I didn't buy it yet I'm bringing it back tomorrow! Guess they didn't think my guy would find anything! He even found how many times the history was deleted 😮
I was a Fix Operations Director for two Ford franchises over 20 years. Ford, like all manufacturers including Japanese, maintain deniability for any major defect. They seriously concern themselves primarily when a Lemon Law complaint is filed. Our dealership policy was a bit different. We refused to alibi for any manufacturers product failure and got the manufacturers district rep involved in all cases we deemed a seriously problem.
How is suddenly shifting into neutral not a safety concern?
Thanks for reporting on Ford. Too bad I couldn’t see this before I bought a new 2012 Focus. When I brought it to dealership with the exact problems you talked about. Their answer was “ you are not driving it correctly”. Even though I have been a professional truck driver for 34 years. Also the power steering would stop working without warning while driving. I would have to pullover and restart the car to get it to reset. The dealer response to that was “we can’t fix it unless it is not working when you bring it in”. My response was put that you want me to drive it to your shop without power steering in writing. I ended up trading out of that car. I lost $5000 on that car. It’s a shame I can’t recoup some of my losses. Can I?
Thanks
Dan. Joliet Il.
Snag-a-Job: Service Adviser- skills needed; Memory of a goldfish, Charges like an electric eel, Lies like rug... Compensation DOE
My niece still has a 13 Fiesta with dual clutch and lots of problems. The dealers don't help and just tow the line... flash new hardware and wait, etc. It has had clutches and actuators replaced, etc. My brother works next door and walked over to talk to the tech., he said there was a pile several feet high of old clutches sitting on the floor. My lady had a 14 with dual clutch, she got so sick of it that she traded it before it lost value since the dealer wasn't fixing the issue. I had a manual 15 Fiesta, and we liked that car a lot until a drunk hit us and crushed it! Didn't buy another because Ford is stopping their cars in the USA and I didn't want to get stuck with an orfan that the dealers really don't want to fix.
You can't tell me that Ford couldn't find a way to change the dual clutch to a "conventional" hydraulic transmission as a retrofit. I just can not believe this. The dimensions are very similar inside the engine bay, and the bell housing is the same shape, it would have worked.
All that said, some people got more than 150,000 miles out of their DPS6 before they traded for something else, and that was with no problems. Lots of talk on the Fiesta Forums. Getrag builds a HUGE number of transmissions for many different companies and they are very good at this job. Rumor has it that Getrag did not suggest the dry dual clutch to Ford, Ford required them to make it this way ($$$). Rumor goes on that they should have used an oil bathed system like BMW and Mercedes had done in their dual clutch systems.
None of this would be happening were it not for CAFE. The mfgs need to squeeze every ounce of gas mileage out of the cheapest cars so they can still sell cars americans want. Its just the way it is. Or we can go back to cars that can barely get out of their own way. Take your pick. You cant have it both ways. IMHO of course.
Had a 2014 focus. TCM went out on me in a busy intersection. It also had that shudder behavior denoting transmission issues.
At 70 MPH on the MASS Pike my Focus suddenly downshifted to 1st gear I nearly crashed. Dealer said the TCM (transmission control module) failed & it could be 4 months before the part arrives, meanwhile I am without transportation. My Ford Taurus & Mercury Sable gave me 300,000 reliable miles each so I had every reason to feel confident buying a 2014 Ford Focus. WRONG! Less than 70K miles & the clutch assembly has had to be changed 3 times & now the TCM failure. - Made in Mexico cr@p.
So glad I purchased the focus ST with the manual transmission. It’s been a really fun reliable car. Almost 130k now daily driver
I have a friend who has a job driving cars off the assembly line and runs them through a short test course before staging them for shipping....
Even those guys have complained about the operation of those transmissions to Ford motor company.
I am sorry to report we were not smart enough to avoid buying a 2014 Focus. After having the clutch replaced under warranty, it was beginning to display the same symptoms again after several months of careful driving and by then we had learned more about the problem. We traded the automobile and lost several thousand dollars in the process but that was our lesson learned. Ford has lost a customer for life.
I had a 2012. Worked perfectly for 25k miles. Then it went south. 3 or 4 clutch packs, then an entire transmission, another clutch pack in the new trans. I took a loss and traded the car in. You can't fix this thing, its a failure of a design. They should've never left the drawing board. Its a shame too because the rest of the car was nice. I'll tell you how to fix it, throw the thing away and put a 6 speed automatic in there, a TRADITIONAL TRANSMISSION not a DCT.
Like to see you talk about the ls7 (Corvette z06) motor and the bad heads produced by the Canadian company.
Great channel.
Froggy
I had a '94 T-bird V8. Trans went bad, dealer put in a new one under warranty but after that if the tachometer touched the yellow part it would kick into neutral until the tach was at idle for about 10 seconds. Many times this feature almost caused wrecks because you counted on it pulling into traffic. Dealer denied any wrong doing and it was never corrected. So yeah going into neutral can be VERY dangerous.
Thanks for the info. I will NEVER buy a Ford because of this. They obviously have no regard for their customers.
Also, I know a lady with one of these problems in a Focus. She is an elderly lady who cannot afford to have these constant issues fixed...and yes...the dealership denies it's a common issue
Someone should tell Ford to check the springs. I hear people have been cutting corners on those lately.
Hyundai/Kia figured out DCT's. Smooth as butter. :)
An automatic transmission that is actually just a manual transmission with an actuator to that presses the clutch and another that changes the gear.
I don't care for Ford. I was a GM guy but they have gone down the tubes as well. My wife drives a Nissan that she is happy with.
According to Scotty Kilmer, you've gone straight from the frying pan into the fire (CVT issues)
As a professional Toyota auto technician, Steve was very well spoken describing these issues in terms that the average owner can understand. These type of situations happen much more often than people know, and than they should.
Transmission built for Ford Motor company for the low price they wanted to pay to maximise profit on the whole car. Suppliers are being pressured more than ever to supply components cheaper and cheaper by the OEM. Toyota and Honda seem to be the only exceptions who would rather their products sold at a higher segment price point , to ensure customers were given a quality long lasting defect free product.
I guess Getrag building it was less than the cost of Ford building the torque converter automatic (of Ford-GM design) themselves and putting that in the Focus...
I had an '11 Fiesta, but with the manual. It had issues requiring a rebuild, under warrantee. The rest of the car was junk too. 17 problems and 42 trips to the dealer in 4 years and 80,000 miles. Replaced with a Honda, we now have bought three Hondas. Never any unscheduled repairs on them. One has 213.000 miles. Never will I own a Ford again.