I'm getting a few weird comments on this old video made over a year ago, back when the Raptor wasn't even available yet and when I had just around 4,000 subscribers (and after I had made a video pointing out how similar it seemed to the 61). I think I'm very clear in the video about where I'm getting the info from and pointing out differences and similarities - I believe I was the first one to whom OPT officially said that this was effectively a clone of the 61, and thus got the information out via this video, along with all the information I got at the time - please also check the description. I'm looking at this as a very interesting case in how chronology can affect how people see old videos!
An upset german customer made a 1 hour review video recently, so it’s getting more attention. It’s not just that it’s a rebrand, it’s that there are so many provable lies surrounding this that came from both Trevor and OPT and they were edited into his video for everyone to see.
You are getti g the comments because a german uploader put up an hour long video, which actually is a great watch, regarding the bs marketing surrounding this scope.
I also suspect youve mever recieved the radian because OPT know you have the identical sharpstar which may not look good considering the price difference while charging extra for a visual back and not including a way to mount a finder/guide scope, relative to your Sharpstar
Hi! I just wanted to pop in and thank you for this followup video. I just completed a massive ebay sell off of a bunch of old stuff so I could buy my first high quality astrophotography camera. I've watched Trevor for a long time. And when I first saw the Raptor 61, and heard all the controversy, I thought "well, that's a let down." But your video really helped bring it home to me. I believe that, for me, the Raptor 61 is worth it. I don't mind paying for upgrades. But without knowing that there actually were upgraded items, I probably wouldn't have made the purchase. But when I coupled the fact that there are upgrades - AND THE FACT I COULD ACTUALLY GET ONE - instead of waiting a month or more for the Sharpstar version - well that just made the decision easy for me. Upgraded optics, better mounting, improved focuser, and immediate availability? Yes please. I know that there are still a lot of people who think "it's the same." And maybe they really believe that. But here's a free fact. There are only so many ways to build a telescope. So if a company who wants to build a better scope can repurpose on older tube design and spend more money on other components - well - that's just smart. But we live in a "cancel" society. It is apparently more fun to tear someone down than to stop and think, "Hmm. That looks familiar, but I wonder what is different?" It is apparently more fun to throw rocks, than ask clarifying questions. So thanks again for making this video and brining the clarity. It's nice to see that people can still provide clear and unbiased info. Thanks for doing it. Probably doesn't mean much, but you've earned a subscriber by doing it!
I think if it had FPL53 glass they would positively indicate this and the $995 price would not be an issue at all. It likely therefore uses the same glass as the standard Sharpstar EDPH 61 II.
There are a few channels I watch that are very helpful, and your channel is one of them. I am new to astrophotography and your instruction is easy for me to follow. Keep up the awesome videos.
Really wish they'd just tell us the type of glass. I feel like if it really was FPL-53 they'd be flexing it instead of using vague language that leaves us to guess what type of glass it is... Thank you for the in-depth explanation though! Very important for those who are weighing their options between the two scopes. EDIT: According to a recent note from Agena Astro, all 61EDPH II-based scopes use the same optics, and that Sharpstar won't actually say what type of glass is used. TS Optics says their version has an FPL-53 objective lens, probably because they tested the optics to find out what they could advertise. OPT apparently said to someone that the raptor does use FPL-53.. so basically it looks like every 61EDPH II has some FPL 53 in it. This is not entirely confirmed though.
@@987kestrel Yeah.. they'd brag about every selling point the thing has. I personally doubt the glass is anything better than the stock Sharpstar has, and if it is, it's probably not by much, so not FPL-53.
Hi Cuiv, it's very interesting and good that you are doing this quick response about the comparisons on this scope! I want to bring to your attention yet another angle/option to this, as you are aware, Sharpstar makes both the 61mm that you own and a 76mm. Are you aware of a new model that I now own which is from a division of Sharpstar. The Askar 72mm f/5.6 Quintuplet Petzval Flat-Field Astrograph FRA400. It can be used without a reducer or flattener at a focal length of 400mm or with a 0.7x reducer made for this model that makes it an f/3.9 with focal length of 280mm! The reducer does not need to be a flattener and you are free to image in either mode! Also, look at the dual support rings and longer dovetail and a quality 3" precision focuser and I think you may find a real competitor or option to either of the other two set ups. The price is closer to that of the Radian and more than your Sharpstar but offers the 400mm focal length. Check it out, I'm extremely happy with the quality, performance, design and convenient dual focal length, and 140mm backfocus capacity! I topped it off with the Primalucelab Sesto Senso 2 focuser which is only $100 more than the ZWO, but does not need a mounting bracket and has no backlash and achieves precision of just 0.7 microns! All this runs with the Eagle3 computer so very nicely. :-)
I saw that one recently! It does look quite amazing, and the specs are indeed very nice! I'm a bit too broke to buy one unfortunately but I wish I could!
I got a PLL Sesto Senso 2 for my TS76EDPH, but have only had a chance to test it through my windows through brief gaps in cloud thanks to the UK autumn weather. Great device mechanically, and the software seems good.
Those Radian rings look great. Very helpful for side-to-side balance to have mounting options all the way around. Stellarvue now makes their optics in-house, but used to re-brand Chinese optics with excellent QC and updated components like this. My SVQ86 quad was a few hundred dollar markup, but I think it was worth it. Looking forward to your comparison once you get the Raptor.
@@CuivTheLazyGeek They tend to open on themselfs. Not a safe system like screws. Just get caught on a cable or a t-shirt and they might open (or just when placing the raptor on a table, which happened to me). There is no implemented secure system to avoid this.
Yep I hope they expand more to more widely serving retailers like first light optics, optcorp etc. If more people buy into astrophotography it’s collective rewards that we reap. They can sell stuff a little cheaper.
It's affordable, but not really a good scope for a beginner owing to lack of aperture and being a tad overbuilt. Better for a novice to get a larger achromat refractor or Newtonian.
@@Rich-hy2ey I'm no expert, a beginner in fact, and you sound more experienced than me. Than being said, for astrophotography, a small, wide refractor is the most forgiving and best start to astrophotography for a beginner. An achromat for astrophotography is not ideal. A newtonian is harder due to collimation and it's longer focal length. On the other hand, for visual astronomy or planetary photography (maybe), a slow, wider aperture achromat or a newtonian. I agree with you on that side. But, for AP, nothing beats a little refractor.
Great follow up video! Clearly making parts in the US will be more expensive, and don’t forget that the cost of doing the design (non recurring engineering cost - NRE) has to be recovered through sales; those two things would ensure the overall cost of the package would be more than the foundation model they are basing things on. My guess is that the sales volumes is not likely to be large enough to warrant writing off the NRE cost. It sounds like the small detail changes which are not obvious at first glance will have created not insubstantial NRE to recover. As a beginner in this hobby (with an engineering background) still doing my research, I am voraciously consuming your videos as you create them, so your content on the Sharpstar telescope was very welcome. I will be very interested to see the comparison with the Raptor 61 when you get to it. In the end, this hobby does require a level of precision not present in the other hobbies, and to get that will require an investment in quality (design, materials, manufacturing) and that comes at a price - if poorer quality items escape, that hits reputation and probably warranty returns, so paying for something that has higher quality that will remain a precision instrument for a long time is worth it if your into the hobby for the long run. ‘Nuff said!
Thanks for your feedback and your insight in the NRE part of the cost! It's indeed what seems to be the play for this scope - I just hope it ends up being a fine instrument!
Hi Cuiv! Which telescope would you recommend for someone looking to get into DSO imaging. Redcat 51 or Radian 61? If it helps, I would be using a dslr and an iExos-100 mount to start, and then looking to upgrade.
Thanks for the very detailed follow up. I believe that Trevor is a very trustworthy and honest person, so I really doubt that he'd just advertise a rebrand like that. I'm pretty sure it'll actually be worth its money!
Cuiv, I think OPT will recognize your effort to explain main differences and so they will send you a sample of the new radian 61 to test of the field. Lucky guy you!
Congrats on getting the Radian... I can hardly wait for your side by side comparison. Just my opinion ...to bad OPT is not sending one as soon as possible, not after OPT sells a bunch of scopes. Great post!
Thanks Cuiv - good info - Seabrook Island is beautiful! I like the marketing done by Trevor and OPT but I would probably stick with the Sharpstar after watching the video.
Thanks John! Happy someone noticed the T-Shirt! I used to go there every year as my grandparents actually lived there... I absolutely love the place. Last time I was there was for the great solar eclipse! That's exactly what I wanted to do with this video: give the tools to at least understand the (stated) difference!
Still watching, but just wanted to note I have an Optec focuser on my Stellarvue scope. Pricey, but so well-designed, and rock-solid. After hundred of hours of using it, I've never had a single issue. I suspected the Radian focuser was an Optec looking at it, but cool to have it confirmed.
Great to hear that Nico! I'm really curious about how well the Radian-branded focuser will perform :-) But I got very positive vibes from it being an Optec.
Cuiv, The Lazy Geek The Optec ThirdLynx focuser “motor” is definitely one of the best focuser motors and an upgrade from EAF, which I believe is very capable, especially the load is not too heavy. I had used both. Optec is easier and more secure to install. Accurate and repeatable performance since day one. It serves different market for sure. However, it is not a “focuser”, it’s just a focuser step motor. Optec has focuser for refractors too but those are also premium upgrade. This Radian “focuser” is just the motor.
@@junluo4381 Hi Jun, I see what you are saying, sorry I misspoke by calling the Radian product a "focuser". Just to get even more precise: The ThirdLynx/Radian upgrade is not "just" a "motor". It's actually a motor and a controller in one, like the EAF. What I actually own from Optec is a motor that attaches securely to my focuser, and a separate black box that controls the motor (the controller, in my case a "FocusLynx Hub") All in one systems where the focuser, the motor, and the controller are all integrated are very sleek (e.g. Moonlite Nitecrawler, Optec Gemini) but are typically more expensive than the Raptor 61 itself!
Nebula Photos Yes the one you have sounds like the “motor” and “hub”. Optec ThirdLynx combines these two into an all in one unit, which I preferred. Don’t need to find place to secure the hub and less wires to worry about. The traditional “focuser” is the drawtube, which I don’t think the Radian optional upgrade includes. The focuser itself may still be the OEM draw tube and rack and pinion. The $499 tag is what Optec ThirdLynx costs, $495. It’s definitely not the Essato/NiteCrawler/Gemini kind of “focuser”. It’s a premium motor/controller.
Thanks Cuiv for the elaboration on the initial video, and insights into the design variations between both telescopes. new background on the videos are a nice touch too. CS!
Hi Cuiv, just to update you Moonlite now do High Res Stepper Motor V3 which has USB controller built into motor housing. No need for hand controller, just connect to PC with USB cable.
For use on a Sky Watcher Star Adventurer with a Fuji X-T2 would you recommend one of these scopes or something smaller like the Redcat51? I am looking to buy my first scope. I am tired of chromatic aberration on my camera lenses.
Thanks Cuiv, I LOOK forward in you findings of the 2 scopes. Right now you will keep your Sharpstar61! After watching your video, I will keep my order for the Sharpstar61! I don't think $350 more is worth it, since I will be using the Hot piece of garbage focuser...LOL.
Quiv this is unrelated but what pixel size are you shooting with on the Sharpstar 61 EDPHII, and why? Currently I'm running 3.71um at 275mm, but I'm wondering what your opinion is on pixel size for signal vs resolution.
This is not related to the Raptor but I would like to make a request for a future. Would you please discuss the differences between floating point, integer, rational image files in fits and tiff format and which would be most appropriate for the best quality image processing. Also are fits files better that tiff?
Agree with other commentors... great job on getting back and helping to define differences. Of course we all want to see a comparison from you, since YOU have the scope everyone is comparing it to. I suspect it will at least the same, maybe better, along with the little new niceties like the rings, dovetail...and the backpack case, which I don't think you mentioned. and camera packs can easily cost $100 depending on features, etc. There is a bonus of having everything ready to go, not needing to buy different dovetail, etc,,,in a pack, where you could also put your star adventurer....and be quickly portable.
With the Optec motor focuser, you won't be able to interface with ASiAir Pro. Thus for Air users, you will have to use a separate computer for that. I'm not seeing any resolution issues with my EAF have you? With the new autofocus routine in Air v1.5, stars are always pinpoint after the routine, at least for me, so far.
I'm not - but I know I have bad seeing, and the super rounded shape of the focus curve confirms this. I guess someone with good seeing may see a small, tiny difference (of the type that I don't care about), that they would be willing to pay for...
Cuiv…. Love your site. OPT contacting you is one hell of a red flag… OPT not specifying which glass is being used is omitting one of if not thee most important factors many astrophotographers have including myself. This is nothing new in astronomy and ultimately even if you are dead set that this is sacrilege then at least appreciate the fact that in the long run more good quality clone scopes should bring down the cost… competition ultimately will work for consumer benefit. Maybe… The OPT hype video that Mark did was embarrassing. They should have at least did a competent review by someone like you. An actual expert… For me it was poorly produced…way over hyped like a bad car salesman and specific important details glossed over. Conveniently not showing insertion and or removal of the filter, claiming the reducer was unique “ built into the scope”, and for me… stating this scope has everything you need except for these following expensive upgrades we think you should buy…a.visual back and an expensive focuser. Not documenting the optics used is not kosher. I’d love to see them address a guide scope as well.
Brilliant, love the insight, thanks for sharing. I wonder if Dustin had a chance to address the questions about their color choice. Critiques say the scope would be hard to see at night and it would collect a lot of heat at daytime.
That's a good point about the color, I hadn't thought of that. The scope at night is an easy fix with some reflective tape, but it's something additional to do
This is not the first black scope.... Many carbon fiber models already out there. As to the sun in the daytime, this is not a solar scope and most people I know don't leave their scope exposed during the day. Close the roof/dome or cover the scope during the day.
Hi Cuiv. Revisiting this video I’m wondering... did you actually heard back from Radian Telescope about the test sample of this Raptor 61? I’d love your field comparison to the Sharpstar version. I keep thinking about buying one of these cute scopes... 😬😬😬
as I feel "Proof's in the pudding", side by side results comparison would be appreciated, when possible. I personally feel Trevor went the extra mile to allow more enthusiasts getting started with the "all inclusive bundle". Trevor, Dylan and you have been my top mentors since I began astrophotography, and I feel our hobby and its champions deserve thumbs up for every one of their initiatives.
Is there Alpaca support for the Optec motor focuser? Also just to clarify, the it's only the motorised portion that's Optec right? Not the whole crayford focuser unit right? i.e. is the Crayford focuser SharpStar, or is that by Optec too (like this: www.optecinc.com/astronomy/catalog/focuslynx/19777.htm)?
I don't think so at this time - I assume Optec would add Alpaca support once it catches on...The focuser itself (crayford unit) is the Sharpstar focuser, as far as I understood.
I been doing some research and the #1 most popular glass used in China for telescopes glass is.... " The ED glass is called H-FK61" it cost less to make than FLP51 and it's a notch below FLP51 with it's refractive index. So now I can rest, that more then likely it's H-FK61 glass. Tonight I did an "Artificial Star" inside and I saw a bit of purple & light green when focused in and out, I don't think that's to bad and when in-focus it was much closer to white or neutral in color.
Again thank you Cuiv! FYI the Sharpstar61 is sold out world wide as of last week! I should be getting my Sharpstar61 in a day or 2. Update coming soon... To be used on my AZ-GTi mount.
As a newbie to AstroPhotography this makes me sad. I really can’t trust any YT information really on anything. Too much affiliate links influences. It was a good idea but went wrong. Follow the money. We are on our own to figure it all out I guess.
Thank you for your objectivity, you have pretty much summed up the features that I was looking for and that I had taken from Trevor's views on this product. I have one on order and am excited to put it to work and see how it fits in with my other scopes and expectations.
Hey Cuiv. Another wonderful video. I bet you did not imagine that the previous video on the raptor 61 would have caused such a stir. I agree with you that people need to make decisions that they feel comfortable with when purchasing their gears and that this is the point you were trying to make. People should just chill out. I could not help but notice a very rude comment that was made. Don't ever apologize to anyone about wrongly implying anything. That guy is the one who owes you an apology for being so rude and disrespectful and his comment was totally unjustified and unwarranted.. You have a big following and we all appreciate all that you do. He must be jealous that you are doing so well. Good things come to good people. Karma.
Thanks so much Salomon! Indeed, I had no idea there would be such a stir around the Raptor 61 video! I saw your answer to that, it's the kind of answer that a non-confrontational and introverted Cuiv could never, ever, ever write or dream of :) Thanks for jumping to my defense! And for your continuous support. Cheers & clear skies!
Are you using a dark frame as your background in this video? :) Love the background/green screen style in your last few uploads, very creative and great for talking head/discussion.
That's such a cool idea! I'm using a random background from the Internet (free to use with credit to the author which I have in the description), but using dark frames is pretty cool - I'll try it out next time! Thanks for the feedback!
Thank you for sharing your opinions on the Raptor 61. I'm curious how it will change after you'll have a chance to get your hands on it. Merci aussi pour toutes tes autres excellentes vidéos...
Just watched both of your videos on the Radian this AM. I have been strongly considering the Sharpstar as my first AP telescope. One other difference that should be pointed out is that the Radian is often (including currently) on backorder. But several vendors, at least here in the US and Canada have the Sharpstar in stock. Have also been considering the ASTRO-TECH AT60ED 60MM F/6 FPL-53ED
Nice job, I hope you did not get into trouble - doesn't sound like it, or maybe they are doing damage control. Anyway, maybe if they would say it is based off the Sharpstar in the first place but has all of these upgrades like you are doing it would make it easier for a person to decide to get it. As you said, the ring redesign makes a lot of sense and may be worth the higher price. - Cheers Kurt
Thanks Kurt! This is completely guesswork on my part, but I wouldn't be surprised that this whole thing was fully intentional - we see that a lot in tech.
I went back to the Chinese official website of RuiXing Optics (who produces Sharpstars), but I can still not able to find the glass type, they just said "we use top-level Extra-low Dispersion glasses imported from Japan", and that's it. I am a Chinese, my wife is American, we both consider this Radian as just a rebranding. But the problem is, this product is still not the best scope of RuiXing Optics for astrophotography. They have a line called Askar specifically designed for astrophotography. Why OPT is not rebranding this line... Askar line: www.askarlens.com/index.php?l=en We now buy things from Ali-Express or Taobao directly, although it takes a month to deliver...
Thanks so much for looking into this Di Lu! Yeah, Askar looks amazing! Their small lenses are super sexy (but helical focuser...), and that 400mm astrograph with reducer at F3.9... But expensive!
Ok all, I got my Sharpstar61 II today and it''s a well made wide field scope, the fit and finish is very good not a TAK quality, and a bit below WO (William Optics) quality, I own both brands. The sharpstar61 II is a really good valve for $700 w/ the 0.8 reducer and that's the way to use it, both optically and best image quality for full frame and APS-C. You really can't use the Sharpstar61 II without the 0.8 reducer because the 0.8 has a M48 male thread and the OTA only needs a M63 male to M48 (M42 nothing made) adapter and those are not easy to find. The focuser is nice and smooth and when using with the ZWO EAF has a nice smooth travel. So we WILL NOT KNOW 100% what the ED glass element is on the Sharpstar61 II and I am 99.9% sure the same for the Raptor61 (if in fact it's made from Sharpstar)! I feel the image quality to be very good w/reducer-flattner again NOT TAK quality but for the $700 very hard to beat. As for the Raptor61 that will be the same image quality. The Sharpstar61 ring is good enough since it's a wide field scope and for me I would not pay $350-$400 more for the Raptor61. Cuiv I expect when you get a Raptor61 you will keep your sharpstar61 II...BUT to use a M48mm filter in the Sharpstar61 II is near impossible without touching the filter glass itself. What OPT should have done (as a upgrade) is to have the 0.8 reducer unthread just below where the M48 female threads so it would be easy to screw on and off the filter. I may design a 3D print.
Thanks for this Christopher! Agree on the filter - although I have managed to put it in and out without touching the glass :) What I really don't like about the filter placement is that it's behind the glass (and thus affects backfocus) and not in front of it! But if it were in front of it, I guess the filter would have needed to be larger...
I’m excited to see this follow up video. That’s great to see OPT so transparent about their design. Also don’t forgot the cool backpack. Afterall it’s marketed as a complete compact telescope design so having a nice branded backpack to protect it and store your stuff is a great perk. I really think their price point it good for what they are offering. And also could you add the zwo EAF to the raptor? so people could still choose a budget option if desired (plus for asiair users, I think only the zwo eaf would work for them). Overall I’m looking forward to unboxing videos and first lights on the raptor. Currently I’m learning astrophotography on a canon 300mm f4 lens but later on if I decide to upgrade it will be nice to have another option for that.
I think it may have been better for OPT to be more transparent right out the door somehow, but then the whole blowback might have been part of their release strategy, I don't know! The Canon 300mm F4 is a great starting point :-) How is your sample?
Cuiv, The Lazy Geek it’s working great so far. I like how it’s a great overall telephoto lens for daytime photography but also gives me a starting point with astrophotography. This is my first attempt capturing and processing a DSO. M31 I’m happy with how it turned out instagram.com/p/CFj9mOZlhaM/?igshid=m6pux3jmt9ds
Hey Cuiv I just wondered if you had ever received this scope as I would kinda like to see a side by side. I'm pretty sceptical personally as I find it very strange to not list the glass type🤔. I admit it has some nice features though. Great video Cuiv, nice to see a counter balance to the marketing hype.
@@CuivTheLazyGeek Oh, so we can assume that the non documented claims you got from the salesman from Opt is BS then. Please don’t become a influencer that sell your name and reputation out for a few bucks Cuiv. We (the viewers) want real reviews, especially if the product is of inferior quality or overpriced junk. Keep it up!
I have two Sharpstar triplet telescopes (a 76mm and a 107mm) and I found this video very interesting. I would to draw a comparison between telescopes and record turntables (bear with me here); a $100 record turntable usually sounds pretty terrible and likewise the view through a $100 telescope is often very disappointing, but spend a little more money and your enjoyment can improve dramatically. Listen to music with a $1000 turntable or look at the heavens through a $1000 telescope and the improvement in quality can be quite staggering. Spend $2000 on your turntable or your telescope and your enjoyment may still be enhanced but I suspect the improvement in quality will not be nowhere near as revolutionary, in economics we call this phenomenon the Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility (or returns). I have found my Sharpstar triplet scopes to be very good and I suspect that to improve them significantly may require quite a lot of relative expense. I'm sure the Sharpstar 61EDPH II is already very good scope, whether the enhanced utility (usefulness) of the Radian is worth the extra expense is an individual choice. Of course for some people pride of ownership can be an important part of how much "utility" they obtain from their telescope (or watch or fountain pen or camera).
Honestly I'm not really sure why everyone has been up in arms about this telescope. If it's expensive and there's another option out there that is cheaper...won't the consumer decide which is better? As you said, more choice is good for the hobby, even if the choices only differ by small things like rings or a colour scheme. People say it's bad because a beginner will waste money, well in my opinion people need to do their research before buying and coming to a good decision. Also, getting upset about how Trevor said he "designed" the scope is pointless. It was clearly part of the marketing and not meant to be so greatly scrutinized. I believe you when you say this telescope is a good thing for astrophotography...I know those aren't just Dustin's words. OPT has a superb marketing team; everyone has heard and talked about this scope (albeit mostly negative discussions), it looks absolutely amazing, and they're sending you one to test. Have fun with it and make a comparison to your Sharpstar!
Yeah. Get a Williams Optics GT71 for $850. You get 35% more light capturing aperture. Far better scope than these 61mm expensive "see my new rings" scopes. Oh - and GT71 is an FPL-53 triplet.
Well I'm a late bloomer I had a GT71 on order but it's on backorder like many things so I jump the gun and ordered this Radian 61 thank you for this information.
@@CuivTheLazyGeek I do have a question I also purchase a zwo asi294mc camera do I need any filter for it for dso if so what do you recommend thank you again 😊
I have followed Trevor from almost the beginning, one of the most trust worthy astrophotographers on UA-cam, why would he risk all what he has created by promoting a pure copy of the Sharpstar? I’m puzzled why anyone would question his motives - he’s a star gazer like the rest of us, he has just taken it to the next level (what most of us can only dream of)
Thanks for your usual prompt and honest, balanced preview (pending your testing of the sample being sent to you). LOVE your videos and humanistic personality ! So,, the Radian IS the Sharpstar with a longer dovetail and rings replacing the clamshell, at a 50% markup. EXACTLY the value-added I would expect from both Trevor Jones and OPT.
I still think I stand my ground. It sounds good and it half explains the price jump, but I think results will show more. I think what I would like to see most is a head to head comparison of the raptor 61 vs its top in class competition the w.o redcat as they are very comparable in specs. So does this compare or outshine it? It is 300 more.
It's not! The Radian simply has the reducer integrated, while you can use the Sharpstar with (F4.5) or without (F5.5) the reducer. Sharpstar with the reducer is the same (in terms of specs) as Radian.
Much like microbrand watches in the US that use very high quality manufacturing from China mega factories, it is only a matter of time before chinese factories decide to use the designs they prepare for others, for their own models. This is happening a lot now for (very unrelated) microbrand watches. There are many chinese made scopes, a lot of them good, but there are many almost identical designs. William optics and TS optics have similar scopes such as TS-Optics 61EDPH, which I also really like.
For all those who think that quality control and mechanical design are minor points I started astrophotography with a Sky Watcher EVO72. It was dirt cheap, and I made some nice pictures, not great pictures: it's a semi apo, not really an apochromatic refractor, but this was not the major issue. The real problem is that it is very cheaply built: there is some lateral motion in the draw tube, leading to field inhomogeneity, no way to screw the optical train and after just a few months the Crayford focuser is dead, completely destroyed by the weight of the ASI1600MM camera and the filter wheel. So I decided eventually to bite the bullet and invest in a much higher end refractor, the TS Imaging Star 80 f4.4, not only because it is a real sextuplet apo but also because it has a much better mechanical design (CF Cuiv recent video on how much costs astrophotography 😂). It should arrive soon from Teleskop Service and I am really eager to put it to good work. So if Trevor and OPT spent a lot of time improving the mechanical design of an already good telescope yes, it really is critical and clearly worth the premium you are going to pay for it. Damien
He Cuiv, I need to make a comment about the Moonlite focusers. Ron has redesigned the stepper motor, The stepper motor (V3) now has the controller built in so there is no longer that cumbersome controller box with a serial cable. It's now a USB cable going to your mini pc or what ever you are using. Just wanted to let you know.
Hey Cuiv. Thanks for the video. Is there any direct comparison? You repeated the “facts” OPT want you to. Did they send a Raptor? I am look forward to a video in which you can make a real comparison.
I appreciate this thorough discussion. I think a filter drawer like the ZWO ones for use with Canon EOS mounts would have been a much better modification. It’s so difficult to screw a 48mm filter when it’s down in a “well” as on the Raptor. I would also suggest that for those seeking a fast, wide field astrograph, the Borg 55FL at f/3.6 is a superb choice. I decided to move from my dual William Optics RedCats, which I love, to the Borg. If I want an even wider FOV, I have a Sigma Art 135 , f/1.8 lens that is wonderful. Finally, William is offering a RedCat 71 this spring. I would favor that over the Radian. ...thanks, Stephen
Hi Cuiv, For Europeans are you going to have an affiliation? Because buying in the USA for us is not right at all. It's been a long time since I thought to ask you.
I just created an affiliate account at Astroshop.eu . I have however never shopped with them, so I don't know how good they are... Here is the link: www.astroshop.eu/?affiliate_id=cuivlazygeek
I think Trevor was treated unfairly by the community about this telescope. Maybe it's because I'm in the fabrication industry. I design and draw things for manufacturing. I saw his first video about the Radian and at no point did I think he was drawing and designing it as an engineer would. I believed was picking out the specs and details he wanted. He was basically a consultant for a design assist and was tasked with promoting the scope for the seller. I don't think he did anything wrong... maybe he could have qualified exactly what he did in the first video for people, but I don't think he expected negative feedback on it.
Sounds like Dustin did not want the negative review on a rebrand with new clamps and temped you with a sample..... Same scope, new bells and shiny things with a higher price.
That's a possibility - of course it's a loaner, so I'm not getting a free scope! But having the opportunity to test it is definitely something I'm looking forward to.
@@CuivTheLazyGeek I understand - I, like to many others, will be looking forward to your review for sure. To me, it also seems like Dustin is a great talker. Looking at your first review, and what I was able to find, it is almost the same scope. It has also pushed the price of the others in that line up a bit or they are simply unavailable at the moment. For me, I prefer a greater focal length - that has great specs, but a good flattener on a larger APO works better for me! I will be watching for your review.... and thank you for the reply!! 😁
The scope has several attractive features and I'm not saying it's not a good product. HOWEVER, if OPT wants to compare it to a Takahashi, then they need to play by the premier rules. William Optics does. Refusing to name the glass type and not providing laser interferometer data leaves them in the msrketing-speak (bull***) realm. You didn't stand your ground.
As is often the case the ‘last 10%’ of improvement on a product can cost as much as 30% of the base level price. Its the industrial design philosophy employed by Apple Computers. And we all know the debate about Macs v PCs.... lol
Long story and now short: the essentials, the optics, come from China. The rest are a few details that are nice but necessary to a limited extent. If the company RADIAN cannot build better optics itself but only has a few details adjusted / or makes them itself, it is called a rebranding. Other companies do it too ... the astromarket is Chinese, or very expensive ... not much is coming from the USA anymore.
1 more note: I agree 99% with you if this scope was a larger FL like a 102mm or 127mm and a $350-$400 more YES but on a low power scope ie: 275mm & 335mm Sharpstar61 FL. I personally feel that if the Radian Raptor61 has a the 53 glass or the better 101 glass, and with the rings & and the backpack I would pay the $350-($400 more with shipping total cost). But since OPT has not come out and SAID YES Hoya FLP53 glass, I think it will have less DOA or better change of QC that's why paying more and what's funny is Dustin said nothing about the warranty which would be faster sending it back to OPT for a free repair or replacement than Sharpstar.
Sorry, but this is ridiculous. Yes we all get that it has improved the rings. But I find the claims they are using better glass or any other upgrades to the Sharpstar dubious at best. OPT has extremely questionable customer service lately and alone with a number of others won't get burned with them again. Trevor claimed the image was perfectly flat and posted an image that proved otherwise. I get that they are a business and want to sell stuff, but the Raptor is simply a nice budget scope, it is certainly not a Borg or a Tak.
I'm getting a few weird comments on this old video made over a year ago, back when the Raptor wasn't even available yet and when I had just around 4,000 subscribers (and after I had made a video pointing out how similar it seemed to the 61). I think I'm very clear in the video about where I'm getting the info from and pointing out differences and similarities - I believe I was the first one to whom OPT officially said that this was effectively a clone of the 61, and thus got the information out via this video, along with all the information I got at the time - please also check the description.
I'm looking at this as a very interesting case in how chronology can affect how people see old videos!
Please view an honest review of the Radian, ua-cam.com/video/Pu34NGd_k10/v-deo.html
An upset german customer made a 1 hour review video recently, so it’s getting more attention. It’s not just that it’s a rebrand, it’s that there are so many provable lies surrounding this that came from both Trevor and OPT and they were edited into his video for everyone to see.
You are getti g the comments because a german uploader put up an hour long video, which actually is a great watch, regarding the bs marketing surrounding this scope.
I also suspect youve mever recieved the radian because OPT know you have the identical sharpstar which may not look good considering the price difference while charging extra for a visual back and not including a way to mount a finder/guide scope, relative to your Sharpstar
Hi! I just wanted to pop in and thank you for this followup video. I just completed a massive ebay sell off of a bunch of old stuff so I could buy my first high quality astrophotography camera. I've watched Trevor for a long time. And when I first saw the Raptor 61, and heard all the controversy, I thought "well, that's a let down." But your video really helped bring it home to me. I believe that, for me, the Raptor 61 is worth it. I don't mind paying for upgrades. But without knowing that there actually were upgraded items, I probably wouldn't have made the purchase. But when I coupled the fact that there are upgrades - AND THE FACT I COULD ACTUALLY GET ONE - instead of waiting a month or more for the Sharpstar version - well that just made the decision easy for me. Upgraded optics, better mounting, improved focuser, and immediate availability? Yes please. I know that there are still a lot of people who think "it's the same." And maybe they really believe that. But here's a free fact. There are only so many ways to build a telescope. So if a company who wants to build a better scope can repurpose on older tube design and spend more money on other components - well - that's just smart. But we live in a "cancel" society. It is apparently more fun to tear someone down than to stop and think, "Hmm. That looks familiar, but I wonder what is different?" It is apparently more fun to throw rocks, than ask clarifying questions. So thanks again for making this video and brining the clarity. It's nice to see that people can still provide clear and unbiased info. Thanks for doing it. Probably doesn't mean much, but you've earned a subscriber by doing it!
61edph received and set up today ! thank you for your help !
Woohoo!! I hope it will work great for you!
I think if it had FPL53 glass they would positively indicate this and the $995 price would not be an issue at all. It likely therefore uses the same glass as the standard Sharpstar EDPH 61 II.
Yep - I unfortunately can't say which it is...
Thanks Cuiv for another excellent video. As always, you’re straightforward and to the facts. Trevor may look like the Rock Star, but you’re the man!!
Thanks a lot Jose! I really wasn't expecting such a big stir after my initial video!
There are a few channels I watch that are very helpful, and your channel is one of them. I am new to astrophotography and your instruction is easy for me to follow. Keep up the awesome videos.
Thank you! I'll definitely keep it up!
Really wish they'd just tell us the type of glass. I feel like if it really was FPL-53 they'd be flexing it instead of using vague language that leaves us to guess what type of glass it is...
Thank you for the in-depth explanation though! Very important for those who are weighing their options between the two scopes.
EDIT: According to a recent note from Agena Astro, all 61EDPH II-based scopes use the same optics, and that Sharpstar won't actually say what type of glass is used. TS Optics says their version has an FPL-53 objective lens, probably because they tested the optics to find out what they could advertise. OPT apparently said to someone that the raptor does use FPL-53.. so basically it looks like every 61EDPH II has some FPL 53 in it. This is not entirely confirmed though.
Same here to be honest - it would put a lot of things to rest.
Hopefully I'll be able to do an actual comparison soon!
@@CuivTheLazyGeek That will be the moment of truth!
It's like selling a car and forgetting to mention that it gets 121 MPG.
@@987kestrel That made me laugh :D
@@987kestrel Yeah.. they'd brag about every selling point the thing has. I personally doubt the glass is anything better than the stock Sharpstar has, and if it is, it's probably not by much, so not FPL-53.
Hi Cuiv, it's very interesting and good that you are doing this quick response about the comparisons on this scope! I want to bring to your attention yet another angle/option to this, as you are aware, Sharpstar makes both the 61mm that you own and a 76mm. Are you aware of a new model that I now own which is from a division of Sharpstar. The Askar 72mm f/5.6 Quintuplet Petzval Flat-Field Astrograph FRA400. It can be used without a reducer or flattener at a focal length of 400mm or with a 0.7x reducer made for this model that makes it an f/3.9 with focal length of 280mm! The reducer does not need to be a flattener and you are free to image in either mode! Also, look at the dual support rings and longer dovetail and a quality 3" precision focuser and I think you may find a real competitor or option to either of the other two set ups. The price is closer to that of the Radian and more than your Sharpstar but offers the 400mm focal length. Check it out, I'm extremely happy with the quality, performance, design and convenient dual focal length, and 140mm backfocus capacity!
I topped it off with the Primalucelab Sesto Senso 2 focuser which is only $100 more than the ZWO, but does not need a mounting bracket and has no backlash and achieves precision of just 0.7 microns! All this runs with the Eagle3 computer so very nicely. :-)
Exactly ! Askar 400 is the one everyone should be looking at at this focal length
I’d like to see more review and results videos on this scope. Cuiv the broke geek, please add this one to your arsenal!
I saw that one recently! It does look quite amazing, and the specs are indeed very nice! I'm a bit too broke to buy one unfortunately but I wish I could!
I got a PLL Sesto Senso 2 for my TS76EDPH, but have only had a chance to test it through my windows through brief gaps in cloud thanks to the UK autumn weather. Great device mechanically, and the software seems good.
Cuiv, The Lazy Geek Is it time to set up a Patreon, Cuiv, to support your habit? :)
Those Radian rings look great. Very helpful for side-to-side balance to have mounting options all the way around. Stellarvue now makes their optics in-house, but used to re-brand Chinese optics with excellent QC and updated components like this. My SVQ86 quad was a few hundred dollar markup, but I think it was worth it. Looking forward to your comparison once you get the Raptor.
I agree on the rings! It will be good to see how well the scope performs in real life - can't wait to get my loaner / review sample :-)
@@CuivTheLazyGeek
They tend to open on themselfs. Not a safe system like screws. Just get caught on a cable or a t-shirt and they might open (or just when placing the raptor on a table, which happened to me). There is no implemented secure system to avoid this.
We need companies like sharpstar, ZWO etc to attract people to the hobby.
I agree :-)
They make AP much more accessible for sure.
Yep I hope they expand more to more widely serving retailers like first light optics, optcorp etc. If more people buy into astrophotography it’s collective rewards that we reap. They can sell stuff a little cheaper.
It's affordable, but not really a good scope for a beginner owing to lack of aperture and being a tad overbuilt. Better for a novice to get a larger achromat refractor or Newtonian.
@@Rich-hy2ey I'm no expert, a beginner in fact, and you sound more experienced than me. Than being said, for astrophotography, a small, wide refractor is the most forgiving and best start to astrophotography for a beginner. An achromat for astrophotography is not ideal. A newtonian is harder due to collimation and it's longer focal length.
On the other hand, for visual astronomy or planetary photography (maybe), a slow, wider aperture achromat or a newtonian. I agree with you on that side.
But, for AP, nothing beats a little refractor.
Great follow up video! Clearly making parts in the US will be more expensive, and don’t forget that the cost of doing the design (non recurring engineering cost - NRE) has to be recovered through sales; those two things would ensure the overall cost of the package would be more than the foundation model they are basing things on. My guess is that the sales volumes is not likely to be large enough to warrant writing off the NRE cost. It sounds like the small detail changes which are not obvious at first glance will have created not insubstantial NRE to recover. As a beginner in this hobby (with an engineering background) still doing my research, I am voraciously consuming your videos as you create them, so your content on the Sharpstar telescope was very welcome. I will be very interested to see the comparison with the Raptor 61 when you get to it. In the end, this hobby does require a level of precision not present in the other hobbies, and to get that will require an investment in quality (design, materials, manufacturing) and that comes at a price - if poorer quality items escape, that hits reputation and probably warranty returns, so paying for something that has higher quality that will remain a precision instrument for a long time is worth it if your into the hobby for the long run. ‘Nuff said!
Thanks for your feedback and your insight in the NRE part of the cost! It's indeed what seems to be the play for this scope - I just hope it ends up being a fine instrument!
I look forward to seeing your direct comparison between the two! Thanks for the great follow-up video, Cuiv!
You bet!
Both are nice scopes but at this price point the W.O. GT 71 is a better choice, more bang for the buck and already battle proven.
Also, the Borg 55FL has mounting holes on the rings like the Raptor rings.
Hi Cuiv! Which telescope would you recommend for someone looking to get into DSO imaging. Redcat 51 or Radian 61? If it helps, I would be using a dslr and an iExos-100 mount to start, and then looking to upgrade.
Thanks for the very detailed follow up. I believe that Trevor is a very trustworthy and honest person, so I really doubt that he'd just advertise a rebrand like that. I'm pretty sure it'll actually be worth its money!
In the end we'll need to see with the actual review unit! I'm looking forward to testing it :-)
@@CuivTheLazyGeek of course. But speculating a bit is always fun :>
Cuiv, I think OPT will recognize your effort to explain main differences and so they will send you a sample of the new radian 61 to test of the field. Lucky guy you!
Yeah, I'll get a loaner to play with! I'm going to be really interested in seeing how well it performs!
Congrats on getting the Radian... I can hardly wait for your side by side comparison. Just my opinion ...to bad OPT is not sending one as soon as possible, not after OPT sells a bunch of scopes. Great post!
Yep, I'm waiting to see when I get to make the comparison - I'm in no rush, but it certainly will be nice to do!
Thanks Cuiv - good info - Seabrook Island is beautiful! I like the marketing done by Trevor and OPT but I would probably stick with the Sharpstar after watching the video.
Thanks John! Happy someone noticed the T-Shirt! I used to go there every year as my grandparents actually lived there... I absolutely love the place. Last time I was there was for the great solar eclipse!
That's exactly what I wanted to do with this video: give the tools to at least understand the (stated) difference!
Still watching, but just wanted to note I have an Optec focuser on my Stellarvue scope. Pricey, but so well-designed, and rock-solid. After hundred of hours of using it, I've never had a single issue. I suspected the Radian focuser was an Optec looking at it, but cool to have it confirmed.
Great to hear that Nico! I'm really curious about how well the Radian-branded focuser will perform :-) But I got very positive vibes from it being an Optec.
Cuiv, The Lazy Geek The Optec ThirdLynx focuser “motor” is definitely one of the best focuser motors and an upgrade from EAF, which I believe is very capable, especially the load is not too heavy. I had used both. Optec is easier and more secure to install. Accurate and repeatable performance since day one. It serves different market for sure. However, it is not a “focuser”, it’s just a focuser step motor. Optec has focuser for refractors too but those are also premium upgrade. This Radian “focuser” is just the motor.
@@junluo4381 Hi Jun, I see what you are saying, sorry I misspoke by calling the Radian product a "focuser". Just to get even more precise: The ThirdLynx/Radian upgrade is not "just" a "motor". It's actually a motor and a controller in one, like the EAF. What I actually own from Optec is a motor that attaches securely to my focuser, and a separate black box that controls the motor (the controller, in my case a "FocusLynx Hub") All in one systems where the focuser, the motor, and the controller are all integrated are very sleek (e.g. Moonlite Nitecrawler, Optec Gemini) but are typically more expensive than the Raptor 61 itself!
Nebula Photos Yes the one you have sounds like the “motor” and “hub”. Optec ThirdLynx combines these two into an all in one unit, which I preferred. Don’t need to find place to secure the hub and less wires to worry about. The traditional “focuser” is the drawtube, which I don’t think the Radian optional upgrade includes. The focuser itself may still be the OEM draw tube and rack and pinion. The $499 tag is what Optec ThirdLynx costs, $495. It’s definitely not the Essato/NiteCrawler/Gemini kind of “focuser”. It’s a premium motor/controller.
Thanks Cuiv for the elaboration on the initial video, and insights into the design variations between both telescopes. new background on the videos are a nice touch too. CS!
Thanks Jason! Yes, I finally got a green screen so I can have a neutral background like that, which is nice!
Hi Cuiv, just to update you Moonlite now do High Res Stepper Motor V3 which has USB controller built into motor housing. No need for hand controller, just connect to PC with USB cable.
Oh WOW! That is awesome!! I had no idea, and should have done my due diligence. Thanks for pointing this out!
May i know what is that mount you are using in this video. I have not seen one like that.
For use on a Sky Watcher Star Adventurer with a Fuji X-T2 would you recommend one of these scopes or something smaller like the Redcat51? I am looking to buy my first scope. I am tired of chromatic aberration on my camera lenses.
Sorry that that it took you twice as long as you needed here Cuiv. Sounds like he was not only enthusiastic but heavily persuasive!........
Yeah, when rewatching it I can't disagree... meh, at least the info came across.
Thanks Cuiv, I LOOK forward in you findings of the 2 scopes. Right now you will keep your Sharpstar61! After watching your video, I will keep my order for the Sharpstar61! I don't think $350 more is worth it, since I will be using the Hot piece of garbage focuser...LOL.
Hot piece of garbage focusers are the best pieces of garbage! :-D
Quiv this is unrelated but what pixel size are you shooting with on the Sharpstar 61 EDPHII, and why? Currently I'm running 3.71um at 275mm, but I'm wondering what your opinion is on pixel size for signal vs resolution.
This is not related to the Raptor but I would like to make a request for a future.
Would you please discuss the differences between floating point, integer, rational image files in fits and tiff format and which would be most appropriate for the best quality image processing.
Also are fits files better that tiff?
Huh, that's a very interesting question! I actually don't know the answer, but now you make me want to research it! Thanks for the answer!
Cuiv, The Lazy Geek thank you so much...please do consider addressing this...we need your your technical savy😊🌈🔭
Agree with other commentors... great job on getting back and helping to define differences. Of course we all want to see a comparison from you, since YOU have the scope everyone is comparing it to. I suspect it will at least the same, maybe better, along with the little new niceties like the rings, dovetail...and the backpack case, which I don't think you mentioned. and camera packs can easily cost $100 depending on features, etc. There is a bonus of having everything ready to go, not needing to buy different dovetail, etc,,,in a pack, where you could also put your star adventurer....and be quickly portable.
Exactly - and really I want to get my hands on it to see how well it performs in comparison to the Sharpstar!
@@CuivTheLazyGeek OMG it is 6 a.m. in Japan, get off your computer, take a shower and get to work! :)
With the Optec motor focuser, you won't be able to interface with ASiAir Pro. Thus for Air users, you will have to use a separate computer for that. I'm not seeing any resolution issues with my EAF have you? With the new autofocus routine in Air v1.5, stars are always pinpoint after the routine, at least for me, so far.
I'm not - but I know I have bad seeing, and the super rounded shape of the focus curve confirms this. I guess someone with good seeing may see a small, tiny difference (of the type that I don't care about), that they would be willing to pay for...
Cuiv…. Love your site. OPT contacting you is one hell of a red flag… OPT not specifying which glass is being used is omitting one of if not thee most important factors many astrophotographers have including myself.
This is nothing new in astronomy and ultimately even if you are dead set that this is sacrilege then at least appreciate the fact that in the long run more good quality clone scopes should bring down the cost… competition ultimately will work for consumer benefit. Maybe…
The OPT hype video that Mark did was embarrassing. They should have at least did a competent review by someone like you. An actual expert…
For me it was poorly produced…way over hyped like a bad car salesman and specific important details glossed over. Conveniently not showing insertion and or removal of the filter, claiming the reducer was unique “ built into the scope”, and for me… stating this scope has everything you need except for these following expensive upgrades we think you should buy…a.visual back and an expensive focuser.
Not documenting the optics used is not kosher. I’d love to see them address a guide scope as well.
Brilliant, love the insight, thanks for sharing. I wonder if Dustin had a chance to address the questions about their color choice. Critiques say the scope would be hard to see at night and it would collect a lot of heat at daytime.
That's a good point about the color, I hadn't thought of that. The scope at night is an easy fix with some reflective tape, but it's something additional to do
This is not the first black scope.... Many carbon fiber models already out there. As to the sun in the daytime, this is not a solar scope and most people I know don't leave their scope exposed during the day. Close the roof/dome or cover the scope during the day.
Hi Cuiv. Revisiting this video I’m wondering... did you actually heard back from Radian Telescope about the test sample of this Raptor 61? I’d love your field comparison to the Sharpstar version. I keep thinking about buying one of these cute scopes... 😬😬😬
Nope! I haven't insisted either :-)
I know this is a old vied, just waiting for restock for SharpStar 61EDPH III FLO. keep up the good work.
as I feel "Proof's in the pudding", side by side results comparison would be appreciated, when possible. I personally feel Trevor went the extra mile to allow more enthusiasts getting started with the "all inclusive bundle". Trevor, Dylan and you have been my top mentors since I began astrophotography, and I feel our hobby and its champions deserve thumbs up for every one of their initiatives.
Is there Alpaca support for the Optec motor focuser? Also just to clarify, the it's only the motorised portion that's Optec right? Not the whole crayford focuser unit right? i.e. is the Crayford focuser SharpStar, or is that by Optec too (like this: www.optecinc.com/astronomy/catalog/focuslynx/19777.htm)?
I don't think so at this time - I assume Optec would add Alpaca support once it catches on...The focuser itself (crayford unit) is the Sharpstar focuser, as far as I understood.
I been doing some research and the #1 most popular glass used in China for telescopes glass is.... " The ED glass is called H-FK61" it cost less to make than FLP51 and it's a notch below FLP51 with it's refractive index. So now I can rest, that more then likely it's H-FK61 glass. Tonight I did an "Artificial Star" inside and I saw a bit of purple & light green when focused in and out, I don't think that's to bad and when in-focus it was much closer to white or neutral in color.
Again thank you Cuiv! FYI the Sharpstar61 is sold out world wide as of last week! I should be getting my Sharpstar61 in a day or 2. Update coming soon... To be used on my AZ-GTi mount.
Excellent! I hope you get clear skies delivered as well :)
What is the difference between askar and sharpstar brands?
As a newbie to AstroPhotography this makes me sad. I really can’t trust any YT information really on anything. Too much affiliate links influences. It was a good idea but went wrong. Follow the money. We are on our own to figure it all out I guess.
Thank you for your objectivity, you have pretty much summed up the features that I was looking for and that I had taken from Trevor's views on this product. I have one on order and am excited to put it to work and see how it fits in with my other scopes and expectations.
Hey Cuiv. Another wonderful video. I bet you did not imagine that the previous video on the raptor 61 would have caused such a stir. I agree with you that people need to make decisions that they feel comfortable with when purchasing their gears and that this is the point you were trying to make. People should just chill out. I could not help but notice a very rude comment that was made. Don't ever apologize to anyone about wrongly implying anything. That guy is the one who owes you an apology for being so rude and disrespectful and his comment was totally unjustified and unwarranted.. You have a big following and we all appreciate all that you do. He must be jealous that you are doing so well. Good things come to good people. Karma.
Thanks so much Salomon! Indeed, I had no idea there would be such a stir around the Raptor 61 video! I saw your answer to that, it's the kind of answer that a non-confrontational and introverted Cuiv could never, ever, ever write or dream of :) Thanks for jumping to my defense! And for your continuous support. Cheers & clear skies!
Thanks for passing along more details on the product!
My pleasure :-)
Fancy background :-) that gives your videos a whole new level.
Thanks Daniel!
Are you using a dark frame as your background in this video? :) Love the background/green screen style in your last few uploads, very creative and great for talking head/discussion.
That's such a cool idea! I'm using a random background from the Internet (free to use with credit to the author which I have in the description), but using dark frames is pretty cool - I'll try it out next time! Thanks for the feedback!
Thank you for sharing your opinions on the Raptor 61. I'm curious how it will change after you'll have a chance to get your hands on it. Merci aussi pour toutes tes autres excellentes vidéos...
Thank you! In the end I never got the Radian!...
Just watched both of your videos on the Radian this AM. I have been strongly considering the Sharpstar as my first AP telescope. One other difference that should be pointed out is that the Radian is often (including currently) on backorder. But several vendors, at least here in the US and Canada have the Sharpstar in stock.
Have also been considering the ASTRO-TECH AT60ED 60MM F/6 FPL-53ED
So the difference is like between toyota and lexus?
Cuiv, are they sending you the electronic focus motor to test as well?
I'm not sure actually! I'll check - I hope so!
Nice job, I hope you did not get into trouble - doesn't sound like it, or maybe they are doing damage control. Anyway, maybe if they would say it is based off the Sharpstar in the first place but has all of these upgrades like you are doing it would make it easier for a person to decide to get it. As you said, the ring redesign makes a lot of sense and may be worth the higher price. - Cheers Kurt
Thanks Kurt! This is completely guesswork on my part, but I wouldn't be surprised that this whole thing was fully intentional - we see that a lot in tech.
Did you ever get to test the Raptor?
I may have asked this of you on another video, sorry if I have but how will you control the focuss?
Not sure what you mean? With the electronic focuser, with USB+ASCOM, otherwise by hand...?
Can you send me the link to the sharpstar?
Yep - suddenly got $40 more expensive since the Radian was announced! www.cameraconcepts.com/copy-of-sharpstar-61mm-f-55-ed-triplet-ap-30090532.html
I already ordered the raptor anyway. Lol. I will keep you posted. If I don’t like it I will send it to you.
Hey Chivas any update on that Raptor?
I went back to the Chinese official website of RuiXing Optics (who produces Sharpstars), but I can still not able to find the glass type, they just said "we use top-level Extra-low Dispersion glasses imported from Japan", and that's it.
I am a Chinese, my wife is American, we both consider this Radian as just a rebranding. But the problem is, this product is still not the best scope of RuiXing Optics for astrophotography. They have a line called Askar specifically designed for astrophotography. Why OPT is not rebranding this line...
Askar line: www.askarlens.com/index.php?l=en
We now buy things from Ali-Express or Taobao directly, although it takes a month to deliver...
Thanks so much for looking into this Di Lu! Yeah, Askar looks amazing! Their small lenses are super sexy (but helical focuser...), and that 400mm astrograph with reducer at F3.9... But expensive!
Ok all, I got my Sharpstar61 II today and it''s a well made wide field scope, the fit and finish is very good not a TAK quality, and a bit below WO (William Optics) quality, I own both brands. The sharpstar61 II is a really good valve for $700 w/ the 0.8 reducer and that's the way to use it, both optically and best image quality for full frame and APS-C. You really can't use the Sharpstar61 II without the 0.8 reducer because the 0.8 has a M48 male thread and the OTA only needs a M63 male to M48 (M42 nothing made) adapter and those are not easy to find. The focuser is nice and smooth and when using with the ZWO EAF has a nice smooth travel. So we WILL NOT KNOW 100% what the ED glass element is on the Sharpstar61 II and I am 99.9% sure the same for the Raptor61 (if in fact it's made from Sharpstar)! I feel the image quality to be very good w/reducer-flattner again NOT TAK quality but for the $700 very hard to beat. As for the Raptor61 that will be the same image quality. The Sharpstar61 ring is good enough since it's a wide field scope and for me I would not pay $350-$400 more for the Raptor61. Cuiv I expect when you get a Raptor61 you will keep your sharpstar61 II...BUT to use a M48mm filter in the Sharpstar61 II is near impossible without touching the filter glass itself. What OPT should have done (as a upgrade) is to have the 0.8 reducer unthread just below where the M48 female threads so it would be easy to screw on and off the filter. I may design a 3D print.
Thanks for this Christopher! Agree on the filter - although I have managed to put it in and out without touching the glass :) What I really don't like about the filter placement is that it's behind the glass (and thus affects backfocus) and not in front of it! But if it were in front of it, I guess the filter would have needed to be larger...
Great video. Looking forward to the comparison.
Thank you Todd! Looking forward to actually doing that comparison!
I’m excited to see this follow up video. That’s great to see OPT so transparent about their design. Also don’t forgot the cool backpack. Afterall it’s marketed as a complete compact telescope design so having a nice branded backpack to protect it and store your stuff is a great perk. I really think their price point it good for what they are offering. And also could you add the zwo EAF to the raptor? so people could still choose a budget option if desired (plus for asiair users, I think only the zwo eaf would work for them). Overall I’m looking forward to unboxing videos and first lights on the raptor. Currently I’m learning astrophotography on a canon 300mm f4 lens but later on if I decide to upgrade it will be nice to have another option for that.
I think it may have been better for OPT to be more transparent right out the door somehow, but then the whole blowback might have been part of their release strategy, I don't know! The Canon 300mm F4 is a great starting point :-) How is your sample?
Cuiv, The Lazy Geek it’s working great so far. I like how it’s a great overall telephoto lens for daytime photography but also gives me a starting point with astrophotography. This is my first attempt capturing and processing a DSO. M31 I’m happy with how it turned out instagram.com/p/CFj9mOZlhaM/?igshid=m6pux3jmt9ds
Hey Cuiv I just wondered if you had ever received this scope as I would kinda like to see a side by side. I'm pretty sceptical personally as I find it very strange to not list the glass type🤔. I admit it has some nice features though. Great video Cuiv, nice to see a counter balance to the marketing hype.
Unfortunately no... I'm pretty sure in the end that it's basically the same thing
Hi Cuiv, it has now been over one year since this video. Is a Sharpstar vs Radian comparison video coming out?
Nope - I never got the Raptor...
@@CuivTheLazyGeek Oh, so we can assume that the non documented claims you got from the salesman from Opt is BS then. Please don’t become a influencer that sell your name and reputation out for a few bucks Cuiv. We (the viewers) want real reviews, especially if the product is of inferior quality or overpriced junk. Keep it up!
another great analysis of the new scope
Well done! Let's hide behind Telescopes!
Thanks Ray!! Haha, hiding being telescopes is always the best strategy :D
@@CuivTheLazyGeek ray has a 14 inch telescope to hide behind though
Really looking forward to the comparison...not in the market for a wide-field refractor at all but curious to see what's what. :)
Me too - I expect it will be several months though... We'll see!
I have two Sharpstar triplet telescopes (a 76mm and a 107mm) and I found this video very interesting. I would to draw a comparison between telescopes and record turntables (bear with me here); a $100 record turntable usually sounds pretty terrible and likewise the view through a $100 telescope is often very disappointing, but spend a little more money and your enjoyment can improve dramatically. Listen to music with a $1000 turntable or look at the heavens through a $1000 telescope and the improvement in quality can be quite staggering. Spend $2000 on your turntable or your telescope and your enjoyment may still be enhanced but I suspect the improvement in quality will not be nowhere near as revolutionary, in economics we call this phenomenon the Law of Diminishing Marginal Utility (or returns). I have found my Sharpstar triplet scopes to be very good and I suspect that to improve them significantly may require quite a lot of relative expense. I'm sure the Sharpstar 61EDPH II is already very good scope, whether the enhanced utility (usefulness) of the Radian is worth the extra expense is an individual choice. Of course for some people pride of ownership can be an important part of how much "utility" they obtain from their telescope (or watch or fountain pen or camera).
Exactly - another great summary. Thanks for that!
Lucky you, free sample of the scope!! I can't wait to see your texts with it!
I'll have to send scope back though, so I'm not getting a free free scope :-) Just something to play with for a while...
You should try DeepSkyDad focuser
I've heard a lot about them, mostly because they were one of the first to have a solution for the RedCat! Maybe at some point!
Honestly I'm not really sure why everyone has been up in arms about this telescope. If it's expensive and there's another option out there that is cheaper...won't the consumer decide which is better? As you said, more choice is good for the hobby, even if the choices only differ by small things like rings or a colour scheme. People say it's bad because a beginner will waste money, well in my opinion people need to do their research before buying and coming to a good decision. Also, getting upset about how Trevor said he "designed" the scope is pointless. It was clearly part of the marketing and not meant to be so greatly scrutinized.
I believe you when you say this telescope is a good thing for astrophotography...I know those aren't just Dustin's words. OPT has a superb marketing team; everyone has heard and talked about this scope (albeit mostly negative discussions), it looks absolutely amazing, and they're sending you one to test. Have fun with it and make a comparison to your Sharpstar!
Thanks for that Alex! That's pretty much the gist of it - looking forward to getting my sample!
Yeah. Get a Williams Optics GT71 for $850. You get 35% more light capturing aperture. Far better scope than these 61mm expensive "see my new rings" scopes. Oh - and GT71 is an FPL-53 triplet.
Thank you for the update!
My pleasure!
You will have one for test?... when it will be?
What ever happened to you reviewing the Radian?
Well I'm a late bloomer I had a GT71 on order but it's on backorder like many things so I jump the gun and ordered this Radian 61 thank you for this information.
I hope it works well for you!
@@CuivTheLazyGeek I do have a question I also purchase a zwo asi294mc camera do I need any filter for it for dso if so what do you recommend thank you again 😊
@@papabear2396 at mimimum a Luminance filter (aka UV/IR cut filter), or a light pollution filter (Baader Neodymium, Optolong L-Pro, etc)
I have followed Trevor from almost the beginning, one of the most trust worthy astrophotographers on UA-cam, why would he risk all what he has created by promoting a pure copy of the Sharpstar?
I’m puzzled why anyone would question his motives - he’s a star gazer like the rest of us, he has just taken it to the next level (what most of us can only dream of)
I think in the end it's all a question of viewpoints and what the definition of a new product is. It's an interesting situation for sure!
Thanks for your usual prompt and honest, balanced preview (pending your testing of the sample being sent to you). LOVE your videos and humanistic personality ! So,, the Radian IS the Sharpstar with a longer dovetail and rings replacing the clamshell, at a 50% markup. EXACTLY the value-added I would expect from both Trevor Jones and OPT.
Thanks for the feedback! I couldn't help but chuckle at the end of your comment :D
Cuiv, did you get your review sample?
Nope... I haven't really insisted either though
I still think I stand my ground. It sounds good and it half explains the price jump, but I think results will show more. I think what I would like to see most is a head to head comparison of the raptor 61 vs its top in class competition the w.o redcat as they are very comparable in specs. So does this compare or outshine it? It is 300 more.
Yes, I agree - in the end it's the results that count!
The Redcat and WO telescopes are far better
Nice feedback Cuiv
Thank you!
The Radian Raptor is also spec'd at a full F-stop faster than the Sharpstar... is one f-stop worth it?... some may think so :)
It's not! The Radian simply has the reducer integrated, while you can use the Sharpstar with (F4.5) or without (F5.5) the reducer. Sharpstar with the reducer is the same (in terms of specs) as Radian.
Much like microbrand watches in the US that use very high quality manufacturing from China mega factories, it is only a matter of time before chinese factories decide to use the designs they prepare for others, for their own models. This is happening a lot now for (very unrelated) microbrand watches. There are many chinese made scopes, a lot of them good, but there are many almost identical designs. William optics and TS optics have similar scopes such as TS-Optics 61EDPH, which I also really like.
For all those who think that quality control and mechanical design are minor points
I started astrophotography with a Sky Watcher EVO72. It was dirt cheap, and I made some nice pictures, not great pictures: it's a semi apo, not really an apochromatic refractor, but this was not the major issue. The real problem is that it is very cheaply built: there is some lateral motion in the draw tube, leading to field inhomogeneity, no way to screw the optical train and after just a few months the Crayford focuser is dead, completely destroyed by the weight of the ASI1600MM camera and the filter wheel. So I decided eventually to bite the bullet and invest in a much higher end refractor, the TS Imaging Star 80 f4.4, not only because it is a real sextuplet apo but also because it has a much better mechanical design (CF Cuiv recent video on how much costs astrophotography 😂). It should arrive soon from Teleskop Service and I am really eager to put it to good work. So if Trevor and OPT spent a lot of time improving the mechanical design of an already good telescope yes, it really is critical and clearly worth the premium you are going to pay for it.
Damien
Only time and user reviews will tell, but I agree - intangible things like better QA definitely have a price!
He Cuiv, I need to make a comment about the Moonlite focusers. Ron has redesigned the stepper motor, The stepper motor (V3) now has the controller built in so there is no longer that cumbersome controller box with a serial cable. It's now a USB cable going to your mini pc or what ever you are using. Just wanted to let you know.
w00t!!! This is excellent news! Oh that is awesome :) Thanks for letting me know!
I would very much like to see your (partnership/self) designed telescope. I think it will be a fun fully automated scope:)
I think I'd be too lazy to design anything or provide feedback :D Plus I wouldn't be able to make my mind about type of scope, FL, etc. :-)
@@CuivTheLazyGeek With customizable backlash adjustment ? ;)
Where is your review of the raptor 61
Thanks for this video.... it seems like Raptor 61 is made by Sharpstar... I almost order the Radian61mm....
My pleasure - I'm waiting to see how well the Radian will perform...
Hey Cuiv. Thanks for the video. Is there any direct comparison? You repeated the “facts” OPT want you to. Did they send a Raptor? I am look forward to a video in which you can make a real comparison.
I appreciate this thorough discussion. I think a filter drawer like the ZWO ones for use with Canon EOS mounts would have been a much better modification. It’s so difficult to screw a 48mm filter when it’s down in a “well” as on the Raptor.
I would also suggest that for those seeking a fast, wide field astrograph, the Borg 55FL at f/3.6 is a superb choice. I decided to move from my dual William Optics RedCats, which I love, to the Borg. If I want an even wider FOV, I have a Sigma Art 135 , f/1.8 lens that is wonderful. Finally, William is offering a RedCat 71 this spring. I would favor that over the Radian. ...thanks, Stephen
Hi Cuiv,
For Europeans are you going to have an affiliation?
Because buying in the USA for us is not right at all.
It's been a long time since I thought to ask you.
I just created an affiliate account at Astroshop.eu . I have however never shopped with them, so I don't know how good they are... Here is the link: www.astroshop.eu/?affiliate_id=cuivlazygeek
Try first light optics, they are what I might go with if I decide to order stuff
I think Trevor was treated unfairly by the community about this telescope. Maybe it's because I'm in the fabrication industry. I design and draw things for manufacturing. I saw his first video about the Radian and at no point did I think he was drawing and designing it as an engineer would. I believed was picking out the specs and details he wanted. He was basically a consultant for a design assist and was tasked with promoting the scope for the seller. I don't think he did anything wrong... maybe he could have qualified exactly what he did in the first video for people, but I don't think he expected negative feedback on it.
i like most of your videos but this one i felt is just opt asking u to promote this telescope
Trevor doesn't use the raptor any more. It isn't featured in his latest videos
from this video and the first video it's obvious to me that the right choice is the stock sharpstar telescope.
It's a shame that this happens now, I spent +/- 5000 € at astroshop.
2000 € at Pierro and 600 € at TS since September 2019 until now.
Oh well... missed opportunities... :( Thanks for your support anyway, as always!
Sounds like Dustin did not want the negative review on a rebrand with new clamps and temped you with a sample..... Same scope, new bells and shiny things with a higher price.
That's a possibility - of course it's a loaner, so I'm not getting a free scope! But having the opportunity to test it is definitely something I'm looking forward to.
@@CuivTheLazyGeek I understand - I, like to many others, will be looking forward to your review for sure. To me, it also seems like Dustin is a great talker. Looking at your first review, and what I was able to find, it is almost the same scope. It has also pushed the price of the others in that line up a bit or they are simply unavailable at the moment. For me, I prefer a greater focal length - that has great specs, but a good flattener on a larger APO works better for me! I will be watching for your review.... and thank you for the reply!! 😁
After a year, I take it you never received the Radian Rapture 61 sample to review...
The scope has several attractive features and I'm not saying it's not a good product. HOWEVER, if OPT wants to compare it to a Takahashi, then they need to play by the premier rules. William Optics does. Refusing to name the glass type and not providing laser interferometer data leaves them in the msrketing-speak (bull***) realm. You didn't stand your ground.
If you think about it. Their are 2 or 3 proven design for high quality telescopes. All high end telescopes are the same design.
So much for the Hawaii shoot out
Too bad...! I would love to do a Hawaii shoot out :D
As is often the case the ‘last 10%’ of improvement on a product can cost as much as 30% of the base level price. Its the industrial design philosophy employed by Apple Computers. And we all know the debate about Macs v PCs.... lol
Exactly! Hey, the Radian is cheaper than that Apple monitor stand! :D
Long story and now short: the essentials, the optics, come from China. The rest are a few details that are nice but necessary to a limited extent. If the company RADIAN cannot build better optics itself but only has a few details adjusted / or makes them itself, it is called a rebranding. Other companies do it too ... the astromarket is Chinese, or very expensive ... not much is coming from the USA anymore.
1 more note: I agree 99% with you if this scope was a larger FL like a 102mm or 127mm and a $350-$400 more YES but on a low power scope ie: 275mm & 335mm Sharpstar61 FL. I personally feel that if the Radian Raptor61 has a the 53 glass or the better 101 glass, and with the rings & and the backpack I would pay the $350-($400 more with shipping total cost). But since OPT has not come out and SAID YES Hoya FLP53 glass, I think it will have less DOA or better change of QC that's why paying more and what's funny is Dustin said nothing about the warranty which would be faster sending it back to OPT for a free repair or replacement than Sharpstar.
I should have asked Dustin about the warranty, I hadn't thought of it... Oh well. In the end at least we have more information on the scope now!
Sorry, but this is ridiculous. Yes we all get that it has improved the rings. But I find the claims they are using better glass or any other upgrades to the Sharpstar dubious at best. OPT has extremely questionable customer service lately and alone with a number of others won't get burned with them again. Trevor claimed the image was perfectly flat and posted an image that proved otherwise. I get that they are a business and want to sell stuff, but the Raptor is simply a nice budget scope, it is certainly not a Borg or a Tak.