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Just some background on pectin and what's going on here. Pectin is a polysaccharide, which just means it's a complex carbohydrate. When heated with an acid and a high enough sugar content, it will form a gel -- which is how we make jam. Pectinase is an enzyme. Enzymes are chemicals that break apart other chemicals (either complex carbohydrates or proteins). Each enzyme is like a key for a different lock -- they will break apart other structures at a specific place, but only those structures and only at that place. So you can think about pectin as a complex chain with a whole bunch of locks holding it together. You can think of pectinase as a key that will open up one of the locks so that the chain can be taken apart. Some of the haze you are getting from the banana is from the pectin in the banana. The pectinase (in this case sold under the brand name Pectinx) breaks it down and so you are able to both clarify it and probably also give it a thinner mouth feel. Not all of the haze will be from the pectin, which is why it's not totally clear after you add it. Some will just be starch haze (starch being another complex carbohydrate). That's why you want the ripest bananas, as you said. So a couple of ideas. First, you probably know this, but you don't have to buy specifically Pectinx. You can use any pectinase -- it is sold by a lot of different brands. The easiest place to pick it up is a home wine making store because it tends to be used to calrify things like cider. Secondly, the off flavors you are getting over time are probably other enzymes in the banana breaking down other compounds. When you break down large carbohydrates and proteins, you are left with smaller pieces and each of these pieces has a specific flavor. Some of these flavors are very strong and also very bad. The way to fix this is to heat treat the final alcohol. This will "deactivate" the enzyme (basically break it down so that it can't work any more). So after you have filtered the alcohol and don't want anymore enzymatic action, losely put a lid on the jar (to stop the alcohol from evaporating too badly) and heat it up. Then cool it down. And, finally, I still want to try with a banana peel only. My reasoning is that the peel is probably virtually all pectin, while the banana has a lot of other starch in it. I know from making banana saccharum that there is more than enough banana flavor in the peel, so ... theoretically I think it should work fine. In fact, why am I sitting here typing this. I have a banana peel and some alcohol. Let's try it ;-) Anyway, thanks for this awesome video! You've quickly become my favorite cocktail channel. And holy heck you're organised! I remember you talking about doing this *months* ago. You have so many videos in your queue that you're only getting to it now. That's amazing!
awesome comment, was thinking about the heat treatment as a first, separate step to avoid losing any more alcohol: puree bananas, add pectinase, rest, heat in water, then blend with rum. will probably try this as a variation. on the peel idea, how did that work? I'd imagine scraping the insides of the peel would work well to get just the pectin
I've used the peels to make a banana saccharum and the taste that comes off it is not as good as using the banana meat, it has an off-putting taste. It also produces a waxy oil that will stain your nut milk bags and basically ruin them. I've gone back to just using the meat as a result.
@@makeanddrink Just an update on the banana peel in alcohol experiment: It does not work. I used 20% banana peel by weight in 25% alcohol sweet potato shochu (my norm lately). It's only been 6 days in 25% alcohol, but normally I would get very identifiable flavor extracted in that time (even though you want to go about 3-4 weeks to get optimal extraction). I can taste *something* in it. It's pleasant. It does *not* taste or smell like banana. Very interesting.
I have used the freezer technique to help break down bananas. You just freeeze them when they are ripe and then thaw when you want to use them. The water inside forms ice crystals which break down cell walls and make the bananas extra mushy which is good for cooling and perhaps this rum recipe. You might be able to skip the extra ingredient and have just rum and banana. Of course I just cleaned out the freezer last week and tossed a half dozen bananas since we barely bake currently.
I have tried these, I let them sit for a day or so to let the pectinex work. For the bananas i used a milk bag to squeeze all the liquids out and was left with the dry fibers, then i strained the the liquid thru a filter and got some very clear results with high yield. For strawberries I used vodka and freeze-dried strawberries so to counter the dilution. Worked really good with bright flavours. Storing it led to a bit more of a cooked taste, like jam or something but still really good.
Thank you Derek I have been watching your channel for a while now and i appreciate your experimentation, the relaxed style of your videos (i.e. no obnoxious ads, laidback conversational approach). You have done something really impressive with this channel, keep trying new things!
I would suggest filtering it through a nut milk bag first, then the coffee filters. If you do a seconf filtering of the coffee filters it will be clearer.
Thanks! I like this non- complicated approach. I just picked up some bananas yesterday, which means as I reach the end of the bunch, I can try this instead of making banana bread.
Always appreciate you sharing both the successes and failures in your experimentation! Surprised you didn't hop on the Spinzall when they offered the 2.0 recently--but good to know you don't need one for the Justino.
It would be cool to have one but at the same time I could make 1 video with it and people would probably find it interesting and then after that I'm just using a tool that 99.999% of people watching do not have and cannot get.
I really think that the fuge is a technique that not only separates solids from liquids but also extracts flavors from the solids that become part of the bananas that are separated. I've tried using just coffee filters next to the fuge method and the fuge method is a CLEARLY superior product in my honest opinion and you can risk the more expensive rums and know you are going to get a killer end product.
I did this same approach at some point, but used a graduated cylinder and let it sit for a day, may have been a couple days. I was left with a few inches of sludge at the bottom and poured very clear liquid off the top, like decanting wine basically. Yield wasn't as good as straining but clarity was excellent.
There's a (comparatively) really cheap yet really nice banana rum called Lang's Banana Rum and I definitely advise anyone who can get it, to do so. Made in Edinburgh of all places yet I'm in New Zealand and buying it
Well, commercial spirits at 40% ABV will set on a shelf forever, so it's likely that this product will also last pretty much forever or until you drink it all
I don't. I didn't measure out the yield. Also I'm guessing you can't get exact here as when you filter you'll have some banana solid left that still contains rum. My guess would be 30ish.
Great video! I don't have the Spinzall either, so I wonder if this technique will work for the TS Beachcomber Negroni. Thank you for the idea with Pectin X - I'll use your link when I order. Also wanted to try the Foam Magic for Monkeypod Mai Tai to see if it stabilizes the foam
I don’t know that exact answer but the technique is used in many instances in Liquid Intelligence and on Modernist Pantry’s UA-cam so I’d assume it has not issue with the alcohol.
Great video, and I’m excited to try this! Quick question: Liquid Intelligence recommends 2ml of SPL for every liter (1000ml) of juice (pg 244). It also notes that using too much more SPL than this can leave a fermented enzyme taste. Your Justino recipe uses 500 ml of rum + ~450 ml of banana purée, but treats the mixture w 10ml of SPL (5x the amount listed in the book). Did you find that using this much Pectinex had any perceptible impact on flavor? Thanks!
Thanks! I didn't find a difference in taste. I landed on the #'s from watching Modernist Pantry videos and the numbers on the bottle. I'm not positive, but I think Pectinex from Modernist Pantry is newer than the Liquid Intelligence book. Can't confirm, just pretty sure I heard that somewhere. So it's possible their Pectinex is the exact same as what's mentioned in Liquid Intelligence but it could also be different and require difference measurments. In a perfect world where I could justify the time, costs and rum, I'd test this with less pectinex, more pectinex, and no pectinex. I also estimated based on the video: ua-cam.com/video/qG8Y0pxmlfk/v-deo.html where my guess is at least 10ML bit that is also a full bottle he's using.
@@makeanddrink Appreciate the background, and glad to hear it didn’t impact flavor. I’m going to try a few different things w my bottle of rum and Modernist Pantry SPL: Approach 1 (your ratio, halved): 250ml rum, 1banana, 5ml SPL Blended Approach 2: 250 ml rum, 1 banana, 1ml SPL Blended Approach 3 250 ml rum, banana + peel, 0.5ml SPL Rapid infused w ISI whipper Will let you know how it turns out!
You mentioning trying strawberry makes me really want to try that. Do you think there’s a better way to make a strawberry daiquiri via infusing the rum with strawberries somehow, or should I just stick to a strawberry syrup or muddling a strawberry into the tin before shaking?
Try infusing the strawberries with grain alcohol or vodka for 1-4 weeks. Use a nut milk bag and then 1-2 passes thru a coffee filter. Great to use on Daiquiris w/rum.
There’s another factor at play here which is strawberry flavor + rum flavor leans heavily into the cheap, sugary, slushy daiquiris flavor to me. Reminded me of those awful ones you can get in New Orleans sold in the yard stick necklace glasses. Someone else mentioned this but a freeze dried or dehydrated strawberry would prob work well.
Probably. The book says “whoo” which doesn’t help much. Is that like “who” or like a sound your make on a roller coaster. Pretty sure I’ve heard him mention that name being a mistake and it should have been something else. Probably for this exact reason.
Strawberries probably aren't sweet enough for this technique. Almost all of their flavor is volatile aromatics. I wonder if the new and exciting "sous pression" technique would be superior at extracting strawberry flavor and aroma.
*Save $10 on your first Modernist Patry* order with the link below. The Make and Drink Patreon now has a Discord server! You can join in some conversation and can contribute your ideas, recipes, and cocktails. Who knows, maybe one day your cocktail will be featured here on UA-cam where dozens and dozens of people will view and criticize your recipe!
*Modernist Pantry* : prz.io/A0BpZ8QFE
Just some background on pectin and what's going on here. Pectin is a polysaccharide, which just means it's a complex carbohydrate. When heated with an acid and a high enough sugar content, it will form a gel -- which is how we make jam. Pectinase is an enzyme. Enzymes are chemicals that break apart other chemicals (either complex carbohydrates or proteins). Each enzyme is like a key for a different lock -- they will break apart other structures at a specific place, but only those structures and only at that place. So you can think about pectin as a complex chain with a whole bunch of locks holding it together. You can think of pectinase as a key that will open up one of the locks so that the chain can be taken apart.
Some of the haze you are getting from the banana is from the pectin in the banana. The pectinase (in this case sold under the brand name Pectinx) breaks it down and so you are able to both clarify it and probably also give it a thinner mouth feel. Not all of the haze will be from the pectin, which is why it's not totally clear after you add it. Some will just be starch haze (starch being another complex carbohydrate). That's why you want the ripest bananas, as you said.
So a couple of ideas. First, you probably know this, but you don't have to buy specifically Pectinx. You can use any pectinase -- it is sold by a lot of different brands. The easiest place to pick it up is a home wine making store because it tends to be used to calrify things like cider. Secondly, the off flavors you are getting over time are probably other enzymes in the banana breaking down other compounds. When you break down large carbohydrates and proteins, you are left with smaller pieces and each of these pieces has a specific flavor. Some of these flavors are very strong and also very bad. The way to fix this is to heat treat the final alcohol. This will "deactivate" the enzyme (basically break it down so that it can't work any more). So after you have filtered the alcohol and don't want anymore enzymatic action, losely put a lid on the jar (to stop the alcohol from evaporating too badly) and heat it up. Then cool it down.
And, finally, I still want to try with a banana peel only. My reasoning is that the peel is probably virtually all pectin, while the banana has a lot of other starch in it. I know from making banana saccharum that there is more than enough banana flavor in the peel, so ... theoretically I think it should work fine. In fact, why am I sitting here typing this. I have a banana peel and some alcohol. Let's try it ;-)
Anyway, thanks for this awesome video! You've quickly become my favorite cocktail channel. And holy heck you're organised! I remember you talking about doing this *months* ago. You have so many videos in your queue that you're only getting to it now. That's amazing!
awesome comment, was thinking about the heat treatment as a first, separate step to avoid losing any more alcohol: puree bananas, add pectinase, rest, heat in water, then blend with rum. will probably try this as a variation.
on the peel idea, how did that work? I'd imagine scraping the insides of the peel would work well to get just the pectin
I've used the peels to make a banana saccharum and the taste that comes off it is not as good as using the banana meat, it has an off-putting taste. It also produces a waxy oil that will stain your nut milk bags and basically ruin them. I've gone back to just using the meat as a result.
The channel Rob s Home Bar has a great banana rum video but it's more of a liqueur. I prefer to make it that way and would suggest you check it out
Thanks for the comment. All super insightful and helpful for people looking to learn more!
@@makeanddrink Just an update on the banana peel in alcohol experiment: It does not work. I used 20% banana peel by weight in 25% alcohol sweet potato shochu (my norm lately). It's only been 6 days in 25% alcohol, but normally I would get very identifiable flavor extracted in that time (even though you want to go about 3-4 weeks to get optimal extraction). I can taste *something* in it. It's pleasant. It does *not* taste or smell like banana. Very interesting.
I have used the freezer technique to help break down bananas. You just freeeze them when they are ripe and then thaw when you want to use them. The water inside forms ice crystals which break down cell walls and make the bananas extra mushy which is good for cooling and perhaps this rum recipe. You might be able to skip the extra ingredient and have just rum and banana. Of course I just cleaned out the freezer last week and tossed a half dozen bananas since we barely bake currently.
I have tried these, I let them sit for a day or so to let the pectinex work. For the bananas i used a milk bag to squeeze all the liquids out and was left with the dry fibers, then i strained the the liquid thru a filter and got some very clear results with high yield. For strawberries I used vodka and freeze-dried strawberries so to counter the dilution. Worked really good with bright flavours. Storing it led to a bit more of a cooked taste, like jam or something but still really good.
I do pretty much exactly the same as you describe. Making liqueurs and using them in Daquiris etc is great. Also over ice to sip on is fun as well.
Thank you Derek I have been watching your channel for a while now and i appreciate your experimentation, the relaxed style of your videos (i.e. no obnoxious ads, laidback conversational approach). You have done something really impressive with this channel, keep trying new things!
Thanks for that episode! I'm going to give this a shot.
I would suggest filtering it through a nut milk bag first, then the coffee filters. If you do a seconf filtering of the coffee filters it will be clearer.
With the strawberries, cryo distilling may work. It does mean more effort etc but it will concentrate the flavours and reduce dilution.
I do have a Spinzall, but thanks for doing the legwork to show that there's often ways to adapt some of the more complex processes. Well done!
Thanks! I like this non- complicated approach.
I just picked up some bananas yesterday, which means as I reach the end of the bunch, I can try this instead of making banana bread.
Very approachable technique well explain!!
Always appreciate you sharing both the successes and failures in your experimentation! Surprised you didn't hop on the Spinzall when they offered the 2.0 recently--but good to know you don't need one for the Justino.
It would be cool to have one but at the same time I could make 1 video with it and people would probably find it interesting and then after that I'm just using a tool that 99.999% of people watching do not have and cannot get.
I really think that the fuge is a technique that not only separates solids from liquids but also extracts flavors from the solids that become part of the bananas that are separated. I've tried using just coffee filters next to the fuge method and the fuge method is a CLEARLY superior product in my honest opinion and you can risk the more expensive rums and know you are going to get a killer end product.
Thanks 4 all the hard work.
Great information...again. Thanks for experimenting!
I did this same approach at some point, but used a graduated cylinder and let it sit for a day, may have been a couple days. I was left with a few inches of sludge at the bottom and poured very clear liquid off the top, like decanting wine basically. Yield wasn't as good as straining but clarity was excellent.
Interesting idea and thanks for showing us, but I think I will stick with Giffard Banane Du Bresil and Tempus Fugit Creme De Banane with my Rum.
I have pectinex, but I do't use it much, maybe I'll give this a go!
The only other thing I use it for is orange supremes, and I never do that.
There's a (comparatively) really cheap yet really nice banana rum called Lang's Banana Rum and I definitely advise anyone who can get it, to do so. Made in Edinburgh of all places yet I'm in New Zealand and buying it
🤤👍 THANK YOU
Can’t wait to try this. How long is it shelf stable? And should it be refrigerated?
Honestly don't know. Havent had it around long enough for it to turn bad.
Well, commercial spirits at 40% ABV will set on a shelf forever, so it's likely that this product will also last pretty much forever or until you drink it all
Curios. Did you trying freezing the strawberry rum? Jacking it? To remove any excess water increase the ABV?
I did not. But I used some Wray and Nephew to increase the ABV.
Awesome! Something I will try. Any idea what the ABV is?
I don't. I didn't measure out the yield. Also I'm guessing you can't get exact here as when you filter you'll have some banana solid left that still contains rum. My guess would be 30ish.
How could you store it and How long does it taste last ? Please advise!
Great video! I don't have the Spinzall either, so I wonder if this technique will work for the TS Beachcomber Negroni. Thank you for the idea with Pectin X - I'll use your link when I order. Also wanted to try the Foam Magic for Monkeypod Mai Tai to see if it stabilizes the foam
maybe you could try using freeze dried strawberrys, "rehydrated" in the rum :)
The book has several of justinos and maybe of them are dehydrated so it would definitely work better.
have you checked that the enzyme is active in ethanol ( 30% ish with the banana added)? just wondering
I don’t know that exact answer but the technique is used in many instances in Liquid Intelligence and on Modernist Pantry’s UA-cam so I’d assume it has not issue with the alcohol.
I wonder if freeze dried strawberries would work better than fresh strawberries?
Great video, and I’m excited to try this!
Quick question:
Liquid Intelligence recommends 2ml of SPL for every liter (1000ml) of juice (pg 244). It also notes that using too much more SPL than this can leave a fermented enzyme taste.
Your Justino recipe uses 500 ml of rum + ~450 ml of banana purée, but treats the mixture w 10ml of SPL (5x the amount listed in the book).
Did you find that using this much Pectinex had any perceptible impact on flavor?
Thanks!
Thanks!
I didn't find a difference in taste. I landed on the #'s from watching Modernist Pantry videos and the numbers on the bottle. I'm not positive, but I think Pectinex from Modernist Pantry is newer than the Liquid Intelligence book. Can't confirm, just pretty sure I heard that somewhere. So it's possible their Pectinex is the exact same as what's mentioned in Liquid Intelligence but it could also be different and require difference measurments.
In a perfect world where I could justify the time, costs and rum, I'd test this with less pectinex, more pectinex, and no pectinex.
I also estimated based on the video: ua-cam.com/video/qG8Y0pxmlfk/v-deo.html where my guess is at least 10ML bit that is also a full bottle he's using.
@@makeanddrink Appreciate the background, and glad to hear it didn’t impact flavor.
I’m going to try a few different things w my bottle of rum and Modernist Pantry SPL:
Approach 1 (your ratio, halved):
250ml rum, 1banana, 5ml SPL
Blended
Approach 2:
250 ml rum, 1 banana, 1ml SPL
Blended
Approach 3
250 ml rum, banana + peel, 0.5ml SPL
Rapid infused w ISI whipper
Will let you know how it turns out!
yumm.. I like that music, makes me feel like I’m at Aulani :)
music.apple.com/us/album/mele-from-auntys-beach-house-aulani-a-disney-resort-and-spa/1440629271
You mentioning trying strawberry makes me really want to try that. Do you think there’s a better way to make a strawberry daiquiri via infusing the rum with strawberries somehow, or should I just stick to a strawberry syrup or muddling a strawberry into the tin before shaking?
Try infusing the strawberries with grain alcohol or vodka for 1-4 weeks. Use a nut milk bag and then 1-2 passes thru a coffee filter. Great to use on Daiquiris w/rum.
I would also sweeten the infusion after filtering with a simple syrup to taste.
There’s another factor at play here which is strawberry flavor + rum flavor leans heavily into the cheap, sugary, slushy daiquiris flavor to me. Reminded me of those awful ones you can get in New Orleans sold in the yard stick necklace glasses.
Someone else mentioned this but a freeze dried or dehydrated strawberry would prob work well.
Can you use this technique for all kinds of fruits or eg nuts or seeds?
You can use the pectinex for any fruits that have pectin, but otherwise it would not be needed
maybe prejuicing the strawberries before using with the PX.
Isn’t it pronounced 0:43 , as I heard on cooking issues “hoo hoo hoo hoostino”
Probably. The book says “whoo” which doesn’t help much. Is that like “who” or like a sound your make on a roller coaster. Pretty sure I’ve heard him mention that name being a mistake and it should have been something else. Probably for this exact reason.
How bout dehydrade the strawberries first ... get rid of most of the water ..then Pectinex them
That would prob work well
Was going to recommend this also! I think this would work
How is the drink neat if you serve it with ice? 😅
Yeah so funny
Damn, this came out cloudy for me. Maybe I didn't let the pectinase do its job for long enough
Strawberries probably aren't sweet enough for this technique. Almost all of their flavor is volatile aromatics. I wonder if the new and exciting "sous pression" technique would be superior at extracting strawberry flavor and aroma.
Never been earlier omg