I think stihl went with the simplest way possible to get a sharp chain. 9/10 people can barely file a chain so skipping the 10 degree tilt is simply one less thing to screw up.
It's definitely done on an angle from new. There's a line that goes across from the bottom of the top plate across towards the corner that's sloping up and if you hold it up in the sunlight the grinding marks all slope up towards the corner across the side and top plate. Clearly, they don't believe we can hold a file that way. Could be worse, Oregon says to file EXL at 25 degrees but put the witness marks on the top plate at 30 degrees.
I set my FG2 file guide up with 10,° if the bottom was flat it would offiles the inside of the gullet first. It didn't file the inside first so it's ground with tilt. I will do video on FG2 with 10°
It definitely looks like the top plate cutting angle decreases with the distance from the cutting corner. Of course, it does not have to be used exactly 10° of tilt, and some other value. 10 is simply a "round" number that is accepted to be given. That the recommendations will vary is rather normal, as there will also always be some difference between sharpening with different tools, such as a round file or a grinder with a round wheel that uses an arm that moves in a circle. Here at least Stihl maintains some consistency by recommending rounding the wheel to the size of the recommended file. In the case of Tecomec/Oregon, there are only two wheels for common pitches, which correspond roughly to 3.2 and 4.8 mm files. In addition, some of their manuals allow the use of a 3.2 mm wheel for sharpening everything from 1/4 to 3/8. Of course, we can order grinding wheels of any size/thickness from manufacturers, as I think Maciej does, and create our own matching profiles for dressing them.
@elpolaco7654 I hear what you are saying but I think it's really bad when a manufacturer that makes a tooth profile and sells it as a premium chain and offers a round file that will destroy the pointy profile. That's why I like Stihls Hexa so much because easy to profile the grinding wheel. Stihl chains have some tilt from new on full chisel. I will show that tomorrow with my FG2 file guide with 10° tilt. If you buy a brand new full chisel chain now it most likely will have a 1mm to 1.5mm point with straight edge then curve down. You get I shot at using that chain profile then a file of chainsaw grinder will destroy the original profile unless you copy that profile on your grinder. That may go over the heads of many people. There are people who are very good with files, the drawback is that you are limited to the C shape only. Grinders are the next level providing you how to be good and wheel profiling.
@@ChainsawUsers I agree with you regarding the differences between grinders and files. You can get almost anything you want on a grinder. On the other hand, it seems to me that manufacturers have to compromise and maintain (never full) compatibility with the sharpening capabilities of files. That's why we have two available "systems" for mortals at the moment: rounded wheels/round files and Hexa. This compromise between grinder and files probably also applies to the hardness of the steel from which the chains are made. If there was no need to sharpen them with a file, they could be quite a bit harder. Of course, there is also Stihl Duro, where by design there is no file sharpening. For your experiment on the FG2, I would try to adjust the tilt angle to match the profile of the factory cutter. Because, as I wrote, it doesn't have to be 10° at all, but of course it is possible that this is exactly the case.
Humm. Sure might be the way they initially cut it for the fastest way to remove metal fast..... I bet they do it with two diff. Wheels. One cut does the tooth and the next cuts the gullet... That would explain the 10° down.... It's just matches the cutting wheel size they used in the gullet... Just a guess......
I was thinking the same 2 wheels. It's more of a learning curve for me. The more knowledge you gain in this area help you better better at sharpening any chain
@@ChainsawUsers If you see this comment, here is a video from a Chinese factory where they use a "USA automatic grinder machine" to sharpen the cutters. You can see one disk moving linearly and lots of liquid used for cooling. Of course, it is not impossible that sharpening can be done in several stages and more machines are used. ua-cam.com/video/zQGl4bef1X0/v-deo.html
I think stihl went with the simplest way possible to get a sharp chain.
9/10 people can barely file a chain so skipping the 10 degree tilt is simply one less thing to screw up.
Yes think that about sums it up
As you say 10 degrees is hard to replicate by hand but interesting to know.
Interesting. Thanks.
Yes you can see the inside of the gullet is on a downward slope
It's definitely done on an angle from new. There's a line that goes across from the bottom of the top plate across towards the corner that's sloping up and if you hold it up in the sunlight the grinding marks all slope up towards the corner across the side and top plate. Clearly, they don't believe we can hold a file that way.
Could be worse, Oregon says to file EXL at 25 degrees but put the witness marks on the top plate at 30 degrees.
I set my FG2 file guide up with 10,° if the bottom was flat it would offiles the inside of the gullet first. It didn't file the inside first so it's ground with tilt.
I will do video on FG2 with 10°
It definitely looks like the top plate cutting angle decreases with the distance from the cutting corner.
Of course, it does not have to be used exactly 10° of tilt, and some other value. 10 is simply a "round" number that is accepted to be given.
That the recommendations will vary is rather normal, as there will also always be some difference between sharpening with different tools, such as a round file or a grinder with a round wheel that uses an arm that moves in a circle.
Here at least Stihl maintains some consistency by recommending rounding the wheel to the size of the recommended file.
In the case of Tecomec/Oregon, there are only two wheels for common pitches, which correspond roughly to 3.2 and 4.8 mm files.
In addition, some of their manuals allow the use of a 3.2 mm wheel for sharpening everything from 1/4 to 3/8.
Of course, we can order grinding wheels of any size/thickness from manufacturers, as I think Maciej does, and create our own matching profiles for dressing them.
Be good to get a close up picture of those lines slopping up
@elpolaco7654 I hear what you are saying but I think it's really bad when a manufacturer that makes a tooth profile and sells it as a premium chain and offers a round file that will destroy the pointy profile. That's why I like Stihls Hexa so much because easy to profile the grinding wheel. Stihl chains have some tilt from new on full chisel. I will show that tomorrow with my FG2 file guide with 10° tilt.
If you buy a brand new full chisel chain now it most likely will have a 1mm to 1.5mm point with straight edge then curve down. You get I shot at using that chain profile then a file of chainsaw grinder will destroy the original profile unless you copy that profile on your grinder.
That may go over the heads of many people.
There are people who are very good with files, the drawback is that you are limited to the C shape only. Grinders are the next level providing you how to be good and wheel profiling.
@@ChainsawUsers I agree with you regarding the differences between grinders and files. You can get almost anything you want on a grinder. On the other hand, it seems to me that manufacturers have to compromise and maintain (never full) compatibility with the sharpening capabilities of files. That's why we have two available "systems" for mortals at the moment: rounded wheels/round files and Hexa.
This compromise between grinder and files probably also applies to the hardness of the steel from which the chains are made. If there was no need to sharpen them with a file, they could be quite a bit harder. Of course, there is also Stihl Duro, where by design there is no file sharpening.
For your experiment on the FG2, I would try to adjust the tilt angle to match the profile of the factory cutter. Because, as I wrote, it doesn't have to be 10° at all, but of course it is possible that this is exactly the case.
Stihl used to recommended a down tilt on full chisel chain . I have been doing that to good effect longer than you lot have been breathing .
I am 67
@@ChainsawUsers Correction WE have been doing this shiet longer than MOST of you have been breathing .
Humm. Sure might be the way they initially cut it for the fastest way to remove metal fast..... I bet they do it with two diff. Wheels. One cut does the tooth and the next cuts the gullet... That would explain the 10° down.... It's just matches the cutting wheel size they used in the gullet... Just a guess......
I was thinking the same 2 wheels.
It's more of a learning curve for me.
The more knowledge you gain in this area help you better better at sharpening any chain
@@ChainsawUsers lol we're no dummies. May be someone will let us know if two is the magic number here?
@@ChainsawUsers Can you check how it looks with the Chinese chain (Hurricane) you are using?
@elpolaco7654 yes will do that
@@ChainsawUsers If you see this comment, here is a video from a Chinese factory where they use a "USA automatic grinder machine" to sharpen the cutters. You can see one disk moving linearly and lots of liquid used for cooling.
Of course, it is not impossible that sharpening can be done in several stages and more machines are used.
ua-cam.com/video/zQGl4bef1X0/v-deo.html