I'm grateful to KQED for inviting me to be part of this experience. This video is incredibly well done, especially some of the video transitions between modern and vintage footage. Thank you so much. I see how this is been a labor of love for our whole community.
Thank you Tyedric for collaborating with the team on this episode! We all have so much respect for your artistry and deeper practice to learn about and teach the tradition and history of this art form.
So many folks to shout out who also helped with this : Bobby White and Cynthia Millman for helping securing photos we can use in this piece, Brett Dahlenberg and the incredible video team at ILHC for shooting such great footage and letting KQED use it, and the amazing Tena Morales for her support for this project. And gotta shout out the video editing team for those SICK transitions between the vintage footage and modern dance footage, showing the linkages between the dance as it was done back in the day and today!
Ha! so good... took me back... Hello from Australia! I travelled all over the USA, driving... mostly to find and jam blues music in 2017... but when i couldn't find a blues jam, I could find a lindy dance or lesson somewhere! Swing dancer since 2011... and it was heaps of fun just digging in under the surface when you travel, and lindy (and the blues) give you an straight -in beneath the surface to communities that were always fun and welcoming, and local! you found out about places and cities way faster, and found things that were not touristy.. ha! And you are so right, swing dance across the USA is so different from place to place.. New Orleans, Austin, Memphis, St Louis, Chicago, (Toronto, Montreal), and New York!... it was so great for my style to dance in all of those places :) and every place has something different, and it's own scene too, so great to meet people at that level
This is such a cool informative video! I was always familiar with Swing but hearing the history behind the Lindy Hop and the culture it came from makes me appreciate more. The same goes for Blues and Rock. They came from Black American communities and they grew into global phenomenons.
Thank you so much I loved this! I've just started learning the Lindy Hop in India and I am fascinated by this video and the history and journey of this dance form. These are stories and histories that need to be told!
I would love to learn Zydeco It came from Louisiana. My family is from Louisiana but I never learned zydeco because I was born in New York City. If you can show more videos on the Zydeco dance. I would greatly appreciate this. Thank you. 💃🏽🕺🏼
This is Miss Zebra,just started liking zydeco,and I love it,saw your video,and wanted to know,do you have any videos that teach you how to zydeco dance,I have absolutely no rhythm what do ever?
Please visit Durham or Hillsborough NC! I looked up this video because I'm listening to Malcolm X's autobiography, and I couldn't picture the Lindy Hop in my mind. I think he was describing around 1940 Boston.
I found this site because I was watching the Baltic Swing competitions and thought..these people need to see what this dance was really all about..google sent me to you!
I would be interested to hear someone elaborate in more detail on how Lindy Hop was "erased, homogenized, and repackaged" and how (re: Latasha's comment) the people who might have been implicated in this homogenization (and erasure and repackaging?) have changed what they were doing. To me it seems like an odd claim because Frankie Manning was a big part of shaping the modern Lindy community with his values in the 80s and during the 90s revival, and he was a major leader in the community until he died in 2008. Surely this video isn't implying that Frankie was a big part of the erasing and homogenizing and repackaging for white people. Or have massive changes occurred between 2008 and now that needed addressing, and that's when the erasing and homogenizing took place? Or did the erasure happen back in the day? But if it was back in the day, how do we even know when watching an old video, from our vantage point today, what was the culture being erased, and what is the product of the repackaging? That seems like a huge problem for local dancers and teachers and everybody all over the world trying to study this dance form if there isn't any kind of centralized authority on defining what is Lindy culture and separating out what isn't. Additionally, isn't some "repackaging" in the community necessary due to changes in circumstance over time? For example, people back in the day didn't have professional dance teachers the way we do now - but it's necessary now to have teachers because swing isn't a ubiquitous music, nor Lindy a ubiquitous dance, in pop culture anymore. This means that top dancers today usually travel and teach, whereas top dancers back in the day would come up mostly dancing primarily in one city and even with only one partner in some cases, so styles of Lindy that we see would be localized and specialized towards performance, and dance styles would vary wildly by city or even by ballroom (as we saw in New York). The modern circumstance, where dancers travel all over to events even as beginners and then also travel when they become teachers, inevitably leads to homogenization, since the same teachers are traveling around teaching all over the world and putting lesson content on the internet that everybody is learning from. It seems to me that the primary focus of the dancing community being to teach and pass on its values, rather than simply to feature dancers as a visual accompaniment to the entertainment provided by a big band, necessarily changes a lot of things about the dance, including homogenizing it so everyone is learning the same thing (Lindy, not some regionalized swing variation), and repackaging it so that you can learn it easily from classes in person and online and from teachers who are devoted to the subject. And if it's the case that this change is necessary (since we don't have big bands and ballrooms and Lindy Hop performers and swing isn't the popular music anymore), is this homogenization and repackaging so nefarious as is being implied? These are genuine questions - I would be interested to hear anybody speak on it who has some insight. Thanks.
Hey James - I can't say for sure what exact thing Latasha is referring to, since she is the only one who can do that. However there are many discussions happening in the scene that I could infer she may be referring to. One is exmaple is the idea/phrasing that the Swedes "revived" Lindy Hop - which isn't true, there were tons of Lindy Hoppers in NYC (and other cities too) when the Swedes started bringing them to Sweden. Or the fact that often times classes are taught in a way that disconnects the dance from its culture and history, or losses some of the visual learning, immersive or I go You go types of learning that is more prominent in Black culture. I would also guess that the idea of walking into a room of only or mostly white people dancing would lead people to believe it was a white dance, especially when the values being displayed match that culture more than Black culture. Again, these are just some ideas, and there are many more that could be referred to here. I would also say it is possible to have "the primary focus of the dancing community being to teach and pass on its values" and still not homogenize the dance itself. I hope this helps answer some of your questions :)
Hey great questions! As a practitioner and organizer in the scene, I'm sure you've seen a lot of the efforts to recenter the Black experience in the dance, including the video here and work done by the Black Lindy Hoppers Fund, Hella Black Lindy Hop, and Collective Voices for Change. So I'd recommend some of those folks, who I think you probably know, for continued dialogue about this. Let me know if you want any introductions. Perhaps a conversation among your local scene would be warranted on this, including Black dancers and their experiences?
Hey James A) I don't understand where it was claimed that this process was inherently nefarious. The consequences of cultural surrogacy aren't all negative. Some are necessary, as you say. When I first mentioned white people, I was talking specifically about being the only black person in the room at the very first dance that I went to. If there was no editing, you would have heard me go on to say that I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, but it could point to the fact that: B) the community has not been centered on Black cultural values (in spite of Frankie's influence) and as a result, what is popular and spread about the dance is not centered on Black cultural values. That could be a reason why there aren't as many Black people in the room. Lastly, historically, the moment that Black art comes into the mainstream, it is usually commodified and begins to be removed from its core cultural values. This is, in part, is what I believe Dr. Barnes was referring to when she used the terms "homogenized, erased, and repackaged". With Lindy Hop, it has always been the case. If you want to know more about what I'm talking about I would invite you to read Langston Hughes's essays "When the Negro Was in Vogue" and "The Negro Artist and the Racial Mountain". The former essay has some direct commentary about the Lindy Hop community, and Hughes responding to what he calls the white gaze, and how it affects young black artists. And if what Hughes is saying is to be taken seriously, then it doesn't take a fool to see that Frankie led and performed the dance in his younger years, in the context of performing for white people, (he himself claims that he didn't feel that he made it until he was dancing at the Cotton Club, a white only venue) in a racist society that had no interest in honoring him beyond what he could offer for entertainment. That would oddly reflect his work a couple decades later. Frankie was teaching and performing for a large white majority. While I don't mean to imply that these people were as nefarious as the clientele at the Cotton Club, it is fact that he catered his approach for them. The hyper focus on counts, the hyper focus on details in establishing connection, the lack of folks striving to find a personal voice. Some of these additions aren't bad. But some are blatantly antithetical to what the core of any culture coming out of a black heritage should look like. Frankie was just one person. You seem to posit that his presence in the community would mean that the community is bereft of any consequences that have to do with cultural surrogacy. I think that you overestimate his impact. I fundamentally disagree that he had a huge part in shaping the community. I do agree that he was a charismatic and lovely person that shared what he knew about the dance. There are a few things that we know solely because we listened to Frankie. Some of this is good. However, I would argue that elevating and focusing on Frankie allowed him to be who he is, but it also shut out other black voices. And for me, I think that I see white people tokenize Frankie quite often. They allowed him to have all this clout, but they utilized their relational proximity with him for their own means, nefarious or not. When it comes to how cultural values are proliferated, organizers play a much bigger role than teachers. Organizers decide who gets to be learned from(whose ideas about the dance are correct), organizers decide what aesthetic is pursued, organizers decide what music is listened to. They decide where and when we dance. They decide how we dance. We see Frankie because organizers put Frankie out to be seen. People look at the stages that organizers point them too. With that being said, how many organizers do you think were present back in the 70s, 80s and 90s to make sure that black cultural values stayed transmitted in the community? Could you explain that process and what amount of those values that are present in our community? Do you know what those values are? I would actually argue that we have less understanding of those values because the scene chose to focus so heavily on Frankie, instead of finding and encouraging all of the other voices that are out there, that people like myself and Dr. Barnes have sought out and learned from. For the record, the core values I am talking about are authenticity, wit, improvisation, release, and excellence. You can learn about Lindy Hop in more than just the old videos. For the sake of brevity, the editing team cut out a lot of how I construct my process in understanding the dance. I do way more than just watching old videos. I seek out mentorship, I read, I search for the clips you can't find on UA-cam, I learn from the tap dancer, the musician, and the scholar. I synthesize with my lived experience, and I draw abstracts. You have to understand that Lindy Hop is a part of a long history of black dances. Our core cultural values are consistent in each one, typically because when the gaze of mainstream culture popularizes, tries to commodify, and then replace the aesthetic in our art, we simply just start doing something else. As someone who does many different styles, and as someone who is among other dancers who have learned from the likes of Frankie Manning and Norma Miller, but also from Sugar Sullivan, Barbara Billups, Ryan Francois, and students of the late Jimmy Slyde and Maurice Hines. As someone who has learned about Lindy Hop from many perspectives, I believe that I'm amongst people who have the exact right to sort out what Lindy Hop culture should be about and shouldn't be about. I think that my lived experience, and my pursuit of more knowledge in this dance culture has been saturated with these cultural elements. And I continue to learn. I don't think that we need a central authority, but we do need authenticity. I am just one person, but those are my ideas.
@@tyedrichill8097 I see where are you coming from and all your points are valid, though you only see this from the perspective of an American (obviously) - and again, it's not wrong or something, just different. Me, personally, started Lindy Hop and Tap in '98 as a white kid in a 99.99% white country in Europe. That doesn't mean I wasn't aware of the black roots of the dance, I saw all the clips you mentioned in the video on VHS, far before youtube existed. Now I can't speak for everyone, as some are more interested in the historical aspects of their chosen dance(s), but I always looking for more info and thinking about how it was and how things might be happening. I had the opportunity to learn from Frankie (and tap from Chazz, his son), also had a couple of courses with the-one-you-don't-speak-of (his classes were top notch btw), and ventured into other dances to learn more about concepts of dance in general (dominantly jazz and hip hop). Now am I less qualified to see Lindy as it is because I'm white? The cultural/historical aspect in terms of '30s racism and the impact on black dancers, yes, obviously I can only have a slight understanding how it was back then but that's almost all that we can do now. But the dance as a form of movement and how it should be danced? I don't think so. In fact, I don't think anyone has the right to say what it should be about. For me, it was something I can do better than anyone else, and I became one of the best dancers around. It was quite a leap for a poor kid growing up in a small town who was always an introvert and never ever thought of performing. everyone else's story is different and can't be undervalued. This was true back then and it is true now. Personally, I was so poor I wasn't able to attend any of the workshops here in Europe, only 3 times later in my dancing journey, when I was earning enough to do so - but I have to have a 9-5 job because there is no other options here if you're dancing a niche dance in a small country. Additionally, I think the '80s and '90s revival of swing dances were not trying to alienate Black people. I think it was much simpler than that. They just moved on. They weren't interested in it really. If no one from the Black community is dancing Lindy, how would you represent them? I mentioned someone above who became a bad person in recent years, who told me that even they didn't know what Lindy Hop was being part of the Black community. He and his partner had to look for living members of those groups if they want to teach, and there were only a few. We can't literally blame anyone in this, they just took up the mantle, and carried on with Lindy Hop. It obviously wasn't like in the '30s, but no dances are like they were even 20 years ago. I watched a lot of stuff like "x championship from 1980-20xx" and the difference is vast. No one can do the same as they did, we can either trying to copy them, or invent new things.
@@MiklosHajma You're assuming lines of thinking I am not positing, my friend. I am speaking about cultural systems and how they interact, and how those interactions have framed our present condition in the the world of authentic jazz. It seems to me that you are concerned with individual actors.
Great work with the community and continuing the legacy. The only thing I don't understand is why the anomosity towards "white people?" I was born brown and cannot help that anymore than someone of all spectrums of the rainbow.
I didn't get animosity from the piece. More a sense that we all need to do better to recognize the roots of this artform and reframe it so that Black folk don't feel excluded from it.
In general, I hoped to offer an analysis about cultural values and was trying to explain what I see to be a shift away from Black cultural values. There is no animosity towards white people.
I'm grateful to KQED for inviting me to be part of this experience. This video is incredibly well done, especially some of the video transitions between modern and vintage footage. Thank you so much. I see how this is been a labor of love for our whole community.
Thank you Tyedric for collaborating with the team on this episode! We all have so much respect for your artistry and deeper practice to learn about and teach the tradition and history of this art form.
So many folks to shout out who also helped with this : Bobby White and Cynthia Millman for helping securing photos we can use in this piece, Brett Dahlenberg and the incredible video team at ILHC for shooting such great footage and letting KQED use it, and the amazing Tena Morales for her support for this project.
And gotta shout out the video editing team for those SICK transitions between the vintage footage and modern dance footage, showing the linkages between the dance as it was done back in the day and today!
And in the shout outs, don't forget yourself Rik! Thank you for your story advising, connecting and writing!
This was SO well done! Awesome stuff KQED, Tye, Shannon, LaTasha, and everyone else that contributed!
Ha! so good... took me back... Hello from Australia! I travelled all over the USA, driving... mostly to find and jam blues music in 2017... but when i couldn't find a blues jam, I could find a lindy dance or lesson somewhere! Swing dancer since 2011... and it was heaps of fun just digging in under the surface when you travel, and lindy (and the blues) give you an straight -in beneath the surface to communities that were always fun and welcoming, and local! you found out about places and cities way faster, and found things that were not touristy.. ha!
And you are so right, swing dance across the USA is so different from place to place.. New Orleans, Austin, Memphis, St Louis, Chicago, (Toronto, Montreal), and New York!... it was so great for my style to dance in all of those places :) and every place has something different, and it's own scene too, so great to meet people at that level
This video is so 🔥. Love how you bring out the Sankofa spirit in this dance and in your storytelling.
Thank you ATN! Dancers Tyedric Hill and LaTasha Barnes and our Columbus film director Selena Burks-Rentschler were the inspiration there!
NICE! Thank you! Just shared this in our local Swing & Blues dancing school's email-mailing in Brooklyn, NY.
Thanks for sharing this out! Much appreciated.
Thanks to everyone who was a part of this production!
This is such a cool informative video! I was always familiar with Swing but hearing the history behind the Lindy Hop and the culture it came from makes me appreciate more. The same goes for Blues and Rock. They came from Black American communities and they grew into global phenomenons.
This was so beautifully well done. Excellent job, everyone!
I'm so glad you enjoyed it!
The dance of the young generation is a take on this sort of dancing - what a beautiful recycling
Go Lindy Hop! Love this so much!
Love love love this video! Shannon is a long time client of mine and she is amazing! ❤️
Ty is such a great dancer and person!! Love the storytelling here.
Thanks Annaliese. We loved getting to know and working with Tyedric.
Thank you so much I loved this! I've just started learning the Lindy Hop in India and I am fascinated by this video and the history and journey of this dance form. These are stories and histories that need to be told!
I would love to learn Zydeco
It came from Louisiana. My family is from Louisiana but I never learned zydeco because I was born in New York City. If you can show more videos on the Zydeco dance. I would greatly appreciate this. Thank you.
💃🏽🕺🏼
This is Miss Zebra,just started liking zydeco,and I love it,saw your video,and wanted to know,do you have any videos that teach you how to zydeco dance,I have absolutely no rhythm what do ever?
Love this and you all SO much!!! ❤❤❤
Great and great effort.
I barely knew anything about this dance prior to watching this video. Very inspiring and catchy! Makes me wanna try it
Great video! Excellent work from everyone involved.
Awesome channel and clip 💟
Awesome video. Thank you!
Please visit Durham or Hillsborough NC! I looked up this video because I'm listening to Malcolm X's autobiography, and I couldn't picture the Lindy Hop in my mind. I think he was describing around 1940 Boston.
Thanks for this great piece!
Wonderful
very very interresting and I enjoyed every single minute of it. Thank you.
Please come to Houston Texas 💜💯💯💯 I love the Lidy Hop dance 🩰
Nicely done. Great work here
Thanks @swinginstyle for tuning in! We'd love to know more about the scene there!
@@kqedarts always happy to share
LaTasha Barnes: "Tradition bearing is heavy work" Yes! "That's why it's called 'bearing'."
Have you visit Baltimore
Lisbon! come to Lisbon!!
I found this site because I was watching the Baltic Swing competitions and thought..these people need to see what this dance was really all about..google sent me to you!
I would be interested to hear someone elaborate in more detail on how Lindy Hop was "erased, homogenized, and repackaged" and how (re: Latasha's comment) the people who might have been implicated in this homogenization (and erasure and repackaging?) have changed what they were doing.
To me it seems like an odd claim because Frankie Manning was a big part of shaping the modern Lindy community with his values in the 80s and during the 90s revival, and he was a major leader in the community until he died in 2008. Surely this video isn't implying that Frankie was a big part of the erasing and homogenizing and repackaging for white people. Or have massive changes occurred between 2008 and now that needed addressing, and that's when the erasing and homogenizing took place? Or did the erasure happen back in the day? But if it was back in the day, how do we even know when watching an old video, from our vantage point today, what was the culture being erased, and what is the product of the repackaging? That seems like a huge problem for local dancers and teachers and everybody all over the world trying to study this dance form if there isn't any kind of centralized authority on defining what is Lindy culture and separating out what isn't.
Additionally, isn't some "repackaging" in the community necessary due to changes in circumstance over time? For example, people back in the day didn't have professional dance teachers the way we do now - but it's necessary now to have teachers because swing isn't a ubiquitous music, nor Lindy a ubiquitous dance, in pop culture anymore. This means that top dancers today usually travel and teach, whereas top dancers back in the day would come up mostly dancing primarily in one city and even with only one partner in some cases, so styles of Lindy that we see would be localized and specialized towards performance, and dance styles would vary wildly by city or even by ballroom (as we saw in New York). The modern circumstance, where dancers travel all over to events even as beginners and then also travel when they become teachers, inevitably leads to homogenization, since the same teachers are traveling around teaching all over the world and putting lesson content on the internet that everybody is learning from.
It seems to me that the primary focus of the dancing community being to teach and pass on its values, rather than simply to feature dancers as a visual accompaniment to the entertainment provided by a big band, necessarily changes a lot of things about the dance, including homogenizing it so everyone is learning the same thing (Lindy, not some regionalized swing variation), and repackaging it so that you can learn it easily from classes in person and online and from teachers who are devoted to the subject. And if it's the case that this change is necessary (since we don't have big bands and ballrooms and Lindy Hop performers and swing isn't the popular music anymore), is this homogenization and repackaging so nefarious as is being implied?
These are genuine questions - I would be interested to hear anybody speak on it who has some insight. Thanks.
Hey James - I can't say for sure what exact thing Latasha is referring to, since she is the only one who can do that. However there are many discussions happening in the scene that I could infer she may be referring to.
One is exmaple is the idea/phrasing that the Swedes "revived" Lindy Hop - which isn't true, there were tons of Lindy Hoppers in NYC (and other cities too) when the Swedes started bringing them to Sweden. Or the fact that often times classes are taught in a way that disconnects the dance from its culture and history, or losses some of the visual learning, immersive or I go You go types of learning that is more prominent in Black culture. I would also guess that the idea of walking into a room of only or mostly white people dancing would lead people to believe it was a white dance, especially when the values being displayed match that culture more than Black culture.
Again, these are just some ideas, and there are many more that could be referred to here. I would also say it is possible to have "the primary focus of the dancing community being to teach and pass on its values" and still not homogenize the dance itself. I hope this helps answer some of your questions :)
Hey great questions! As a practitioner and organizer in the scene, I'm sure you've seen a lot of the efforts to recenter the Black experience in the dance, including the video here and work done by the Black Lindy Hoppers Fund, Hella Black Lindy Hop, and Collective Voices for Change. So I'd recommend some of those folks, who I think you probably know, for continued dialogue about this.
Let me know if you want any introductions. Perhaps a conversation among your local scene would be warranted on this, including Black dancers and their experiences?
Hey James
A) I don't understand where it was claimed that this process was inherently nefarious. The consequences of cultural surrogacy aren't all negative. Some are necessary, as you say. When I first mentioned white people, I was talking specifically about being the only black person in the room at the very first dance that I went to. If there was no editing, you would have heard me go on to say that I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, but it could point to the fact that:
B) the community has not been centered on Black cultural values (in spite of Frankie's influence) and as a result, what is popular and spread about the dance is not centered on Black cultural values. That could be a reason why there aren't as many Black people in the room.
Lastly, historically, the moment that Black art comes into the mainstream, it is usually commodified and begins to be removed from its core cultural values. This is, in part, is what I believe Dr. Barnes was referring to when she used the terms "homogenized, erased, and repackaged".
With Lindy Hop, it has always been the case. If you want to know more about what I'm talking about I would invite you to read Langston Hughes's essays "When the Negro Was in Vogue" and "The Negro Artist and the Racial Mountain". The former essay has some direct commentary about the Lindy Hop community, and Hughes responding to what he calls the white gaze, and how it affects young black artists.
And if what Hughes is saying is to be taken seriously, then it doesn't take a fool to see that Frankie led and performed the dance in his younger years, in the context of performing for white people, (he himself claims that he didn't feel that he made it until he was dancing at the Cotton Club, a white only venue) in a racist society that had no interest in honoring him beyond what he could offer for entertainment.
That would oddly reflect his work a couple decades later. Frankie was teaching and performing for a large white majority. While I don't mean to imply that these people were as nefarious as the clientele at the Cotton Club, it is fact that he catered his approach for them. The hyper focus on counts, the hyper focus on details in establishing connection, the lack of folks striving to find a personal voice. Some of these additions aren't bad. But some are blatantly antithetical to what the core of any culture coming out of a black heritage should look like.
Frankie was just one person. You seem to posit that his presence in the community would mean that the community is bereft of any consequences that have to do with cultural surrogacy. I think that you overestimate his impact. I fundamentally disagree that he had a huge part in shaping the community. I do agree that he was a charismatic and lovely person that shared what he knew about the dance. There are a few things that we know solely because we listened to Frankie. Some of this is good. However, I would argue that elevating and focusing on Frankie allowed him to be who he is, but it also shut out other black voices. And for me, I think that I see white people tokenize Frankie quite often. They allowed him to have all this clout, but they utilized their relational proximity with him for their own means, nefarious or not.
When it comes to how cultural values are proliferated, organizers play a much bigger role than teachers. Organizers decide who gets to be learned from(whose ideas about the dance are correct), organizers decide what aesthetic is pursued, organizers decide what music is listened to. They decide where and when we dance. They decide how we dance. We see Frankie because organizers put Frankie out to be seen. People look at the stages that organizers point them too. With that being said, how many organizers do you think were present back in the 70s, 80s and 90s to make sure that black cultural values stayed transmitted in the community? Could you explain that process and what amount of those values that are present in our community? Do you know what those values are? I would actually argue that we have less understanding of those values because the scene chose to focus so heavily on Frankie, instead of finding and encouraging all of the other voices that are out there, that people like myself and Dr. Barnes have sought out and learned from.
For the record, the core values I am talking about are authenticity, wit, improvisation, release, and excellence.
You can learn about Lindy Hop in more than just the old videos. For the sake of brevity, the editing team cut out a lot of how I construct my process in understanding the dance. I do way more than just watching old videos. I seek out mentorship, I read, I search for the clips you can't find on UA-cam, I learn from the tap dancer, the musician, and the scholar. I synthesize with my lived experience, and I draw abstracts.
You have to understand that Lindy Hop is a part of a long history of black dances. Our core cultural values are consistent in each one, typically because when the gaze of mainstream culture popularizes, tries to commodify, and then replace the aesthetic in our art, we simply just start doing something else. As someone who does many different styles, and as someone who is among other dancers who have learned from the likes of Frankie Manning and Norma Miller, but also from Sugar Sullivan, Barbara Billups, Ryan Francois, and students of the late Jimmy Slyde and Maurice Hines. As someone who has learned about Lindy Hop from many perspectives, I believe that I'm amongst people who have the exact right to sort out what Lindy Hop culture should be about and shouldn't be about. I think that my lived experience, and my pursuit of more knowledge in this dance culture has been saturated with these cultural elements.
And I continue to learn.
I don't think that we need a central authority, but we do need authenticity. I am just one person, but those are my ideas.
@@tyedrichill8097 I see where are you coming from and all your points are valid, though you only see this from the perspective of an American (obviously) - and again, it's not wrong or something, just different. Me, personally, started Lindy Hop and Tap in '98 as a white kid in a 99.99% white country in Europe. That doesn't mean I wasn't aware of the black roots of the dance, I saw all the clips you mentioned in the video on VHS, far before youtube existed. Now I can't speak for everyone, as some are more interested in the historical aspects of their chosen dance(s), but I always looking for more info and thinking about how it was and how things might be happening. I had the opportunity to learn from Frankie (and tap from Chazz, his son), also had a couple of courses with the-one-you-don't-speak-of (his classes were top notch btw), and ventured into other dances to learn more about concepts of dance in general (dominantly jazz and hip hop).
Now am I less qualified to see Lindy as it is because I'm white? The cultural/historical aspect in terms of '30s racism and the impact on black dancers, yes, obviously I can only have a slight understanding how it was back then but that's almost all that we can do now. But the dance as a form of movement and how it should be danced? I don't think so. In fact, I don't think anyone has the right to say what it should be about. For me, it was something I can do better than anyone else, and I became one of the best dancers around. It was quite a leap for a poor kid growing up in a small town who was always an introvert and never ever thought of performing. everyone else's story is different and can't be undervalued. This was true back then and it is true now. Personally, I was so poor I wasn't able to attend any of the workshops here in Europe, only 3 times later in my dancing journey, when I was earning enough to do so - but I have to have a 9-5 job because there is no other options here if you're dancing a niche dance in a small country.
Additionally, I think the '80s and '90s revival of swing dances were not trying to alienate Black people. I think it was much simpler than that. They just moved on. They weren't interested in it really. If no one from the Black community is dancing Lindy, how would you represent them? I mentioned someone above who became a bad person in recent years, who told me that even they didn't know what Lindy Hop was being part of the Black community. He and his partner had to look for living members of those groups if they want to teach, and there were only a few. We can't literally blame anyone in this, they just took up the mantle, and carried on with Lindy Hop. It obviously wasn't like in the '30s, but no dances are like they were even 20 years ago. I watched a lot of stuff like "x championship from 1980-20xx" and the difference is vast. No one can do the same as they did, we can either trying to copy them, or invent new things.
@@MiklosHajma You're assuming lines of thinking I am not positing, my friend. I am speaking about cultural systems and how they interact, and how those interactions have framed our present condition in the the world of authentic jazz. It seems to me that you are concerned with individual actors.
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Great work with the community and continuing the legacy. The only thing I don't understand is why the anomosity towards "white people?" I was born brown and cannot help that anymore than someone of all spectrums of the rainbow.
I didn't get animosity from the piece. More a sense that we all need to do better to recognize the roots of this artform and reframe it so that Black folk don't feel excluded from it.
Where do you process animosity? I would be happy to clarify my thoughts to you.
In general, I hoped to offer an analysis about cultural values and was trying to explain what I see to be a shift away from Black cultural values.
There is no animosity towards white people.
So where are Black folks dancing now to Lid Hop , I see mostly white faces????????
YES it's called Cultural appropriation... we create it and then you all copy it.. got it?