A huge thanks to Ridge for sending me this wallet and supporting my channel! Here’s the site if you'd be interested in simplifying your pocket game ;) > www.ridge.com/SISYPHUS
Bought one using our bois link awhile back and all my friends are envious of my awesome new wallet. Plus I can't stand bulky stuff in my pockets, and this thin is thinner than my phone. 10/10, highly recommend.
@@steliostoulis1875 You don't know what this guy's belief system is though - could be incongruent with the joke's premise and he's implicitly voicing his opinion; but you could definitely be right.
I loved this man, thank you so much. I relate to so much of what you guys talked about especially when Nate talked about his breakdown as a kid. I had that around the start of this year and I can attest to him saying that he would be happier if he didn't look for things against his religion cause I sure wish I didn't. Being in a catholic school and family it was hard for me to even consider to stop praying and even until now its weird when I don't give thanks for a meal my mom made or something. It makes me feel a little better knowing that at least 2 other people went through this phase/experience and managed to get out of it. All the best man.
I hold a small contention with the blanked dismissal of "new age philosophy," there is just too much here to hold judgements on collectively. Anything from psychadelics to meditation, even transgressive art. Science is spreading the line thin between what is statistically quantifiable and what is 'woo.' Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
i used to smoke often, and yeah, i tend to sorta make the fuzzy edges feeling comfortable by thinking of the void as a weighted blanket? i don't think of it consciously much because of that, cause it's not unnerving. i liked the different perspective i got on things, but different from full on dissociation, which i know all too well. also i love nitw!! it's interesting to think of the world as detached and alien like that, but yeah schematics are pretty dry. and not that anyone really cares about this long comment, but my favorite emo band is mayday parade. unknowns are scary and at the same time captivating, which is maybe part of my clinical anxiety, so i have a lot of thoughts on what death could be, because i think about it so much. i like to think it's not nothing, that the void isn't empty, i guess. i have this shaky hold on maybe tricking myself into not thinking about being a "ticking time bomb of nothingness". that even in living on, that ends, the books disintegrate; and the sun swallows the earth, that we carve and paint on, whole. the good place has a nice caveat for the immortality problem, if you've seen it. my hope is that i go to hades, and get to take a pool net to the lost dreams in the styx and compile every lost thought in a library. even in death i'd have a purpose, and something to do, for eternity. i think sisyphus runs on spite, which is different from hope. and living purely for spite is pretty common these days, so fair enough. i neither pity nor admire sisyphus, i think i just relate to him. new age spiritualities are fun to me, they're repackaged psychology, but the ways it's put together is really interesting. i'm sad at 2am, how relatable lol. time to check out all of nate's vids now!
@@adolfomclovin7082 i haven't for a hot minute bc of a wisdom teeth removal yeah. honestly my crisis is still there, but i recommend testing it out on yourself bc everyone is different
Ooo, the conversation about dead computer programs is a nice one. Marvel comics actually did one where Vision (an android character) told the rest of the Avengers that when you turn off a machine, it essentially dies, even though you can turn it back on
20:55 That's what weirds me out about this argument: it's always an appeal to rationality. "Oh reason shows that our brains will just turn off." If our brains are just meat computers firing neurons, who's to say that the neurons in your brain are any more or less correct than mine? Why would we all have these rules of logic that exist completely outside of our brains that we all agree on, and how can you appeal to rationality as an argument for there being no God or afterlife if our brains are just products of evolution, since our brains are only made for making babies and killing predators rather than finding the answers to the deepest questions about life?
Duuude that thing with cannabis around the 12 min mark, when you talked about not experiencing others reality and perspective, its something I think about a lot when I'm high, so interesting, and sad too, but mostly interesting imo
An interesting thing about social constructs; different cultures have different numbers of what they consider a “basic color”. This is especially weird around the color blue because it was so rare in the natural world until we developed blue clothing dye that almost all (if not, all) people on the planet said that the sky was a shade of green. Some cultures still don’t have a word for “blue”, and on the flip side of this, Russians actually classify light blue, medium blue, and dark blue as three entirely different colors. Like this isn’t like when a pretentious color snob calls light blue “cyan” because they were taught that it’s a shade of blue as a kid, Russians legitimately would put cyan and navy blue in entirely separate color categories. It’s kinda weird to think about how social conditioning can cause you to think that one of the primary colors is just a specific shade of green
Can't put into words how much I love listening to Sisyphus talk in a long form discussion. Ngl, not a huge fan of Nate, but this was still very appreciated none the less!
11:14 To me, that feeling reminds me of being in the corner of a large empty room, looking into the room itself. Seeing every aspect of it but not being able to "touch" them all. Does that make sense? 58:51 There's a name for that. It's called the "Forer Effect".
Didn’t that Oregon cult also start researching biological weapons? Like the fbi eventually raided one of their houses and they were creating a version of salmonella that was linked to an outbreak in Oregon a month before. The fbi had a lot of reasons to investigate that cult, and yet some people defended biological warfare because a few of the residents of the nearby Oregon town didn’t want a cult near them, basically saying “well they tested their weaponry on racists so it’s fine”. Some people man
In my opinion there is a lot to learn from Buddhism. I do not believe in reincarnation or karma or anything of that matter. But I do believe that with meditation and enough self-discipline we can find peace within ourselves. I like to imagine Sisyphus has reached this state of enlightenment as well as holding on to that sense of hope that you spoke about. I try to appreciate every experience I encounter in my life good and bad, and learn as much as I can from them. Before birth we were one with everything when we die we will be the same. This mentality keeps me at ease. Also great podcast looking forward to the next one!
I think you should ask a singular question at the end of the podcast to close it out: "If you could put any lesson-yours or you've learned-what would it be?" This way you can signal the podcast is ending to the guest
I have seen some similar comments and don't want to flood you, but I would really appreciate it if you made your podcast available on more platforms (specifically Google Podcasts). loving the show so far, keep up the great work as always.
Why should I fear death? If I am, then death is not. If Death is, then I am not. Epicurus eased my mind over death. I have become an atheist (I guess this is what I am) at age 16 maybe? Since then dying and just ceasing to exist terrified me. I started think about the life without me, then I realised that I will not have the ability to do this when I am dead. I will just not be here, my consciousness will not be existing to worry about it. This type of thinking gives me peace regarding the matter.
I have never clicked something so fast (P.S. Nate have you ever seen the film It's Such A Beautiful Day? If not, it's a wonderful animated film about a stick figure suffering from an unknown memory loss. It's existential, darkly hilarious and I think you'd really be into it.)
Philip Larkin's poem Aubade captures beautifully the hollowness of the Twain (actually the sentiment comes from Lucretius) argument. No reassurance about death is going to be satisfying to most people because we are biologically programmed to crave existence more than anything else. Imagine carefully the idea of your home being hit by a bomb in the next 5 minutes, and you'll see exactly what I mean. This is why religions that feature afterlives have been so very popular and will continue to be. It's perfectly obvious what death is about. There's no mystery to it. In life brain processes generate every aspect of our mental lives. Our thoughts, sensations, cravings, emotions, feelings of there being a distinct self having these experiences, and consciousness of them itself. When the brain is deprived of blood and oxygen, these processes come to an end, and all those aforementioned aspects of mental life no longer exist. It's just such a great pity that evolution put into us a total horror of that simple fact. It exists because it encourages the proliferation of life. Getting genes into the next generation is what the process that put life on this planet is all about. And the being that doesn't fear death is not going to participate too well in that process. So our entire mental lives are the product of this process that urges us into having children and living as long as possible, and to cap it all off, to give us a profound bias towards optimism to prevent us from realising the unsatisfactoriness of the hell we truly live in. Welcome to life on earth.
@Gufter Fresh Most of it, soon after first hearing about antinatalism about 2 1/2 years ago. It was a bit too hardcore for me at the time (and I have terrible inattention that makes sticking with a text awfully difficult) but I think I agree with Ligotti on essentially everything. David Benatar, Arthur Schopenhauer and Thomas Metzinger are among my idols and I'm very interested in Buddhism and its anti-existence angle. I do think the truth might well be the very last thing we want it to be. I just damn well hope this isn't all on endless repeat and that universes of sentient, suffering beings don't get created only to be annihilated, and for the whole process to begin again, and again, forever. I've read a few interviews with Ligotti and was moved by them and his description of his wretched 'panic-anxiety disorder', because I too have chronic anxiety and know how hard it is to life with these beliefs. However others like @glynos don't seem to have any trouble. The subject of antinatalism came up briefly in this discussion at the end. Did you notice how the rejection was on emotional grounds? Not to knock Sisyphus and @NateIsLame, they're lovely bright guys and I wish I had people so intelligent and philosophically inclined to talk these things over with, especially when a bit younger. Much of this conversation dwelt on death, how dreadful it seems, and how unsatisfactory life seems in the face of it. And as somebody who's been plagued by fear of death in my life, I get that completely. There's only one way of avoiding death, and that's never to exist in the first place. If I hadn't been born, I wouldn't have to die. Having a child is condemning it to death, and a huge amount of suffering too, in their lives and that of the thousands of animals that will live miserable lives in order to keep them fed, and so on. Yes, there will be no joyful experiences for them to have, but they're not deprived of those experiences by not existing! This whole question is made infinitely more stark when you consider that something like 58% of Americans believe in a literal hell of eternal suffering. Christians don't ever think about this, but consider the implications. Most Americans don't think anything of the idea they will be exposing their children to the substantial risk (some think even the high probability!) of permanent, unspeakable misery, for billion year after billion year. When even they have no clue what the exact parameters for entry and disqualifying criteria that get you into the good place are...it's utterly grotesque. Especially in Catholic form, where they want to go as far as restricting contraception and abortion to force more people to exist and face eternal hellfire! Their religion is at least as despicable as any form of fundamentalist Islam, in my view.
@@igaraparana What if your human brain cant comprehend what ever else there is or if there is something? and that you are trying to solve a puzzle that wasnt made for you. In turn, creating misery and anxiety when you dont need to? If perhaps you were given this life as a gift and the power to make your own judgements so that no matter how awful your humanly experiences (which it seems you have had a few) you would be able to create happiness and live a life that you truly wanted deep down in your psychic subconscious therefore creating meaning and living a fulfilled life. The points you propose seem to me of someone who has no clear self esteem and really doesnt truly listen to themselves and what it is they want, as simply as on a daily basis and this absolutely could be due to your past experiences and upbringing but doesnt mean that your whole life is destined for misery. I think there is always a positive viewpoint on life as an opposite to your so negative antinatalism. As you are interested in buddhism you should look up a deep explanation of the yin and yang and how there is always an opposite force for each experience whether it is positive or negative. Basically showing that there is no definitive good or bad to life, but rather a rollercoaster of the two. Or you could see it like the stoics and that nothing outside your sphere of choice is good or bad but it is just a happening outside of your control which creates a profound peace.
@Gufter Fresh First of all, im not referring to self esteem in a buddhist sense. The buddhism was only related to the orignal posters interest in it and the definition of ying and yang that was interesting. Secondly you saying that creating your own happiness is not meaningful is very contradictory, meaning literally is created by pursuing your own happiness? Im not sure how you don't understand that. There are no people? what is the physical form you live and touch and feel through every day? the idea that there is nothing is delusional. Its like you are saying a word over and over in your mind and it loses its meaning and validity, but instead of a word of all life. Its simply ridiculous. It seems like you disassociate with everything.
@Gufter Fresh how does that explain suicide? or people that dont have the desire to have children? doesnt the will to live simply mean our innate desire to mate and continue on our genes?
2 hours of making pancakes while listening to your podcast is basically the dream life! Idk how you plan to top this episode, but I highly doubt you are going to succeed. Gtg spam everyone with a link to this
I always hated atheism for it's "matter of fact" opinion towards something that cannot and, most likely, will not ever prove. Just because you cannot see something doesnt mean that it does not exist. I like it to a lack of spiritual object permanence. Hating the institutions of religion and what not is fine but I really dont think anyone can truly understand what is ultimately outside the realm of our perception.
A chair is a chair because it is a place to sit. You look at that chair as an action. It is no longer the tree that has made it. There's a brain disease out there where if you walk past an Open Door. You will need walkthrough and forget why but you did it because you seen a doorway a doorway is designed to walk through. Please see this
Kinda irritating how ya’ll talk about and try to reframe spirituality without i dunno, asking someone why they follow whatever it is they follow. You make a conclusion based on your perspective and it is rather judgmental and one sided. Furthermore, though you say provides certainty to people, you also say it is “NFL for people with stinky houses” and that does not properly recognize the utility of it. Statistical models do not always reflect reality well, but they still help to understand it better. The utility of a tool is unchanged by your personal opinion. Felt like you were looking down on people for seeking certainty in something that you don’t view as real. Came off as arrogant and pretentious is all. Other than that segment I mostly enjoyed this content.
@@demacolapoo I would like to say goodbye to my family, reflect on the good times stuff like that. Also I don't think its morally right to withhold information that substantial, or any information for that matter.
I would want to know if a comet is hitting the earth and killing everyone . I would maximise my level of Euphorie if I know I died soon . I would try heroin and other hard and dangerous drugs. You could at least feel happy . The unknown death is for me personally way more scary, because I would have missed much . With knowledge you could at least try to be happy af .
A huge thanks to Ridge for sending me this wallet and supporting my channel! Here’s the site if you'd be interested in simplifying your pocket game ;) > www.ridge.com/SISYPHUS
Bought one using our bois link awhile back and all my friends are envious of my awesome new wallet. Plus I can't stand bulky stuff in my pockets, and this thin is thinner than my phone. 10/10, highly recommend.
Ppppp0ppppo
@@The_Captainn pppppppppppp0pppppppppppppppppppppl
@@The_Captainn 0pppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppplppppppppp
@@The_Captainn plppppppppppllllppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppppp
Try to get Exurb1a for the next podcast!
I think literslly everyone on the planet would love that
Talk with mystiverse but on your territory:)
I doubt youtube would be able to handle that gem
@@omarshahnawaz3659 but he has two channels
This
Hearing the last 3 minutes made me think about:
God created a discord (world): god was last online 2000 years ago.
The world isn't 2000 years old lol
@@Zen-vk2vl he meant Jesus idiot
@@steliostoulis1875 You don't know what this guy's belief system is though - could be incongruent with the joke's premise and he's implicitly voicing his opinion; but you could definitely be right.
You should add your podcast to the streaming platforms like spotify and apple podcasts
It's already on spotify I think
@@brownspice382 it is on spotify
@@brownspice382 nice :)
it's on apple podcasts
Always a good morning when the sad stick figure UA-camrs collab
Unrelated but I just realized Sisyphus' voice sounds like Corpse's but a couple octaves higher.
Okay back to the podcast.
Corpse in next podcast?
@@burner887 idk what they would discuss but it would still be epic probably
housecat is aaaaaalmost corpse level
Corpse but its softer and feels like a white light filter is over it
Ohh that's what his voice reminds me of
I loved this man, thank you so much. I relate to so much of what you guys talked about especially when Nate talked about his breakdown as a kid. I had that around the start of this year and I can attest to him saying that he would be happier if he didn't look for things against his religion cause I sure wish I didn't. Being in a catholic school and family it was hard for me to even consider to stop praying and even until now its weird when I don't give thanks for a meal my mom made or something. It makes me feel a little better knowing that at least 2 other people went through this phase/experience and managed to get out of it. All the best man.
Same man, I used to be a Christian and I relate with you too man.
I hold a small contention with the blanked dismissal of "new age philosophy," there is just too much here to hold judgements on collectively. Anything from psychadelics to meditation, even transgressive art. Science is spreading the line thin between what is statistically quantifiable and what is 'woo.' Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
i used to smoke often, and yeah, i tend to sorta make the fuzzy edges feeling comfortable by thinking of the void as a weighted blanket? i don't think of it consciously much because of that, cause it's not unnerving. i liked the different perspective i got on things, but different from full on dissociation, which i know all too well. also i love nitw!! it's interesting to think of the world as detached and alien like that, but yeah schematics are pretty dry. and not that anyone really cares about this long comment, but my favorite emo band is mayday parade. unknowns are scary and at the same time captivating, which is maybe part of my clinical anxiety, so i have a lot of thoughts on what death could be, because i think about it so much. i like to think it's not nothing, that the void isn't empty, i guess. i have this shaky hold on maybe tricking myself into not thinking about being a "ticking time bomb of nothingness". that even in living on, that ends, the books disintegrate; and the sun swallows the earth, that we carve and paint on, whole. the good place has a nice caveat for the immortality problem, if you've seen it. my hope is that i go to hades, and get to take a pool net to the lost dreams in the styx and compile every lost thought in a library. even in death i'd have a purpose, and something to do, for eternity. i think sisyphus runs on spite, which is different from hope. and living purely for spite is pretty common these days, so fair enough. i neither pity nor admire sisyphus, i think i just relate to him. new age spiritualities are fun to me, they're repackaged psychology, but the ways it's put together is really interesting. i'm sad at 2am, how relatable lol. time to check out all of nate's vids now!
@@adolfomclovin7082 i haven't for a hot minute bc of a wisdom teeth removal yeah. honestly my crisis is still there, but i recommend testing it out on yourself bc everyone is different
Helooo I’m really liking these podcasts. My existential daily dose.
What a cool guest, he should start a band.
No
@@NateIsLame fucking broke me
Ooo, the conversation about dead computer programs is a nice one. Marvel comics actually did one where Vision (an android character) told the rest of the Avengers that when you turn off a machine, it essentially dies, even though you can turn it back on
I’m hungry, I’m gunna watch this later.
Watch it in the meantime
@@David-in4ft Eat something...you'll feel better. Then get hungry again and roll the stone.
Haha gunna fat
These podcasts are a goldmine for new channels for me to checkout
Man I wish he had a fresh discord link up, I really love his content and listen to it before I sleep.
Definitely listening to this when I wake up later
20:55 That's what weirds me out about this argument: it's always an appeal to rationality. "Oh reason shows that our brains will just turn off." If our brains are just meat computers firing neurons, who's to say that the neurons in your brain are any more or less correct than mine? Why would we all have these rules of logic that exist completely outside of our brains that we all agree on, and how can you appeal to rationality as an argument for there being no God or afterlife if our brains are just products of evolution, since our brains are only made for making babies and killing predators rather than finding the answers to the deepest questions about life?
Sisyphus wants to roll the rock up the hill to beat his roll the rock up the hill any% speed run
I love the thumbnail being sisyphus holding ‘an empty bliss beyond this world’
I feel like I heard it, but I just can’t put my finger down on any of the songs. It’s all just a burning memory
Great for while I’m drawing for my portfolio pieces, gives me the dose of deep™️ that you need when drawing anything with meaning.
Absolutely love this episode! Lots of new and inspiring ideas, really gets my inner philosopher rolling.
This guy is so nice and funny lol, your conversation was really interesting to listen to.
Duuude that thing with cannabis around the 12 min mark, when you talked about not experiencing others reality and perspective, its something I think about a lot when I'm high, so interesting, and sad too, but mostly interesting imo
Sisyphus you always manage to say exactly what im thinking its crazy
Hype for this podcast to continue and grow, best of luck
Really like the podcast, I love philosophy shit like this and when you brought up wild wild country I smiled. I hope yoy keep this going
You should name your podcast "The Myths of Sisyphus 55"
Close your eyes for three seconds....that's how long eternity feels when you're dead" 23:40
I laughed harder than I should have 😂😂
Dude love this podcast. So down to earth and deep! Very unique. Hope you do more collabs !
An interesting thing about social constructs; different cultures have different numbers of what they consider a “basic color”. This is especially weird around the color blue because it was so rare in the natural world until we developed blue clothing dye that almost all (if not, all) people on the planet said that the sky was a shade of green. Some cultures still don’t have a word for “blue”, and on the flip side of this, Russians actually classify light blue, medium blue, and dark blue as three entirely different colors. Like this isn’t like when a pretentious color snob calls light blue “cyan” because they were taught that it’s a shade of blue as a kid, Russians legitimately would put cyan and navy blue in entirely separate color categories. It’s kinda weird to think about how social conditioning can cause you to think that one of the primary colors is just a specific shade of green
This has made me feel a bit bad for that kid I gave an existential crisis in 10th grade with the many worlds theory.
Can't put into words how much I love listening to Sisyphus talk in a long form discussion. Ngl, not a huge fan of Nate, but this was still very appreciated none the less!
Well I'm a huge fan of you ;n;
Political ideologies are treated with religious devotion nowadays
Theur the new religion
@@mclilzenthepoet2331 religion is essential to humans, people need convictions
this exact pattern is actually something Nietzsche warned humanity about in his philosophy
@@tunisianhacker7026 🤦♂️
43:33 That moment when Nate turns into a Villager
11:14 To me, that feeling reminds me of being in the corner of a large empty room, looking into the room itself. Seeing every aspect of it but not being able to "touch" them all. Does that make sense?
58:51 There's a name for that. It's called the "Forer Effect".
He misrepresented the server entirely. The active people created a different server because of how often he's not there and how he is off UA-cam.
That was a really good explanation of new age spirituality
These are great, keep it up man!
Didn’t that Oregon cult also start researching biological weapons? Like the fbi eventually raided one of their houses and they were creating a version of salmonella that was linked to an outbreak in Oregon a month before.
The fbi had a lot of reasons to investigate that cult, and yet some people defended biological warfare because a few of the residents of the nearby Oregon town didn’t want a cult near them, basically saying “well they tested their weaponry on racists so it’s fine”. Some people man
God damn
Holy shit
In my opinion there is a lot to learn from Buddhism. I do not believe in reincarnation or karma or anything of that matter. But I do believe that with meditation and enough self-discipline we can find peace within ourselves. I like to imagine Sisyphus has reached this state of enlightenment as well as holding on to that sense of hope that you spoke about. I try to appreciate every experience I encounter in my life good and bad, and learn as much as I can from them. Before birth we were one with everything when we die we will be the same. This mentality keeps me at ease. Also great podcast looking forward to the next one!
I listened to this ep playing LoL, it felt so simple. Just keep playing, and hope for the best after match.
I think you should ask a singular question at the end of the podcast to close it out: "If you could put any lesson-yours or you've learned-what would it be?"
This way you can signal the podcast is ending to the guest
ohmygod my twofav ppl together in a crossover episode
I have seen some similar comments and don't want to flood you, but I would really appreciate it if you made your podcast available on more platforms (specifically Google Podcasts). loving the show so far, keep up the great work as always.
Why should I fear death?
If I am, then death is not.
If Death is, then I am not.
Epicurus eased my mind over death. I have become an atheist (I guess this is what I am) at age 16 maybe? Since then dying and just ceasing to exist terrified me. I started think about the life without me, then I realised that I will not have the ability to do this when I am dead.
I will just not be here, my consciousness will not be existing to worry about it. This type of thinking gives me peace regarding the matter.
I absolutely love these podcasts... honestly I'm sad there's only 6 eps...
I liked the cut-off with his confused oh.
Loved it, man! Keep it going.
Lol i wasn't expecting this partnership with nateislame
"I uh, don't read anything. I just get sad at 1 in the morning." ... (currently 1:24 am)
great episode, loving this podcast!
26:00 I think Taoist type philosophies may lean into the acknowledgement of death.
20:26 this is the moment I remembered who nateislame is. Idk what that means for my relationship to nateislame.
Please make a video on why we feel the need to change our mental state with drugs, or alcohol. Feel like I’m going crazy
Definitely a fan of the Sisyphus podcast
I have never clicked something so fast (P.S. Nate have you ever seen the film It's Such A Beautiful Day? If not, it's a wonderful animated film about a stick figure suffering from an unknown memory loss. It's existential, darkly hilarious and I think you'd really be into it.)
I'm a huge fan of that movie!
@@NateIsLame oh goody! That's one of my favorite movies!
Philip Larkin's poem Aubade captures beautifully the hollowness of the Twain (actually the sentiment comes from Lucretius) argument. No reassurance about death is going to be satisfying to most people because we are biologically programmed to crave existence more than anything else. Imagine carefully the idea of your home being hit by a bomb in the next 5 minutes, and you'll see exactly what I mean. This is why religions that feature afterlives have been so very popular and will continue to be.
It's perfectly obvious what death is about. There's no mystery to it. In life brain processes generate every aspect of our mental lives. Our thoughts, sensations, cravings, emotions, feelings of there being a distinct self having these experiences, and consciousness of them itself. When the brain is deprived of blood and oxygen, these processes come to an end, and all those aforementioned aspects of mental life no longer exist. It's just such a great pity that evolution put into us a total horror of that simple fact. It exists because it encourages the proliferation of life. Getting genes into the next generation is what the process that put life on this planet is all about. And the being that doesn't fear death is not going to participate too well in that process. So our entire mental lives are the product of this process that urges us into having children and living as long as possible, and to cap it all off, to give us a profound bias towards optimism to prevent us from realising the unsatisfactoriness of the hell we truly live in. Welcome to life on earth.
@Gufter Fresh Most of it, soon after first hearing about antinatalism about 2 1/2 years ago. It was a bit too hardcore for me at the time (and I have terrible inattention that makes sticking with a text awfully difficult) but I think I agree with Ligotti on essentially everything. David Benatar, Arthur Schopenhauer and Thomas Metzinger are among my idols and I'm very interested in Buddhism and its anti-existence angle. I do think the truth might well be the very last thing we want it to be. I just damn well hope this isn't all on endless repeat and that universes of sentient, suffering beings don't get created only to be annihilated, and for the whole process to begin again, and again, forever.
I've read a few interviews with Ligotti and was moved by them and his description of his wretched 'panic-anxiety disorder', because I too have chronic anxiety and know how hard it is to life with these beliefs. However others like @glynos don't seem to have any trouble. The subject of antinatalism came up briefly in this discussion at the end. Did you notice how the rejection was on emotional grounds? Not to knock Sisyphus and @NateIsLame, they're lovely bright guys and I wish I had people so intelligent and philosophically inclined to talk these things over with, especially when a bit younger. Much of this conversation dwelt on death, how dreadful it seems, and how unsatisfactory life seems in the face of it. And as somebody who's been plagued by fear of death in my life, I get that completely.
There's only one way of avoiding death, and that's never to exist in the first place. If I hadn't been born, I wouldn't have to die. Having a child is condemning it to death, and a huge amount of suffering too, in their lives and that of the thousands of animals that will live miserable lives in order to keep them fed, and so on. Yes, there will be no joyful experiences for them to have, but they're not deprived of those experiences by not existing! This whole question is made infinitely more stark when you consider that something like 58% of Americans believe in a literal hell of eternal suffering. Christians don't ever think about this, but consider the implications. Most Americans don't think anything of the idea they will be exposing their children to the substantial risk (some think even the high probability!) of permanent, unspeakable misery, for billion year after billion year. When even they have no clue what the exact parameters for entry and disqualifying criteria that get you into the good place are...it's utterly grotesque. Especially in Catholic form, where they want to go as far as restricting contraception and abortion to force more people to exist and face eternal hellfire! Their religion is at least as despicable as any form of fundamentalist Islam, in my view.
@@igaraparana What if your human brain cant comprehend what ever else there is or if there is something? and that you are trying to solve a puzzle that wasnt made for you. In turn, creating misery and anxiety when you dont need to? If perhaps you were given this life as a gift and the power to make your own judgements so that no matter how awful your humanly experiences (which it seems you have had a few) you would be able to create happiness and live a life that you truly wanted deep down in your psychic subconscious therefore creating meaning and living a fulfilled life. The points you propose seem to me of someone who has no clear self esteem and really doesnt truly listen to themselves and what it is they want, as simply as on a daily basis and this absolutely could be due to your past experiences and upbringing but doesnt mean that your whole life is destined for misery. I think there is always a positive viewpoint on life as an opposite to your so negative antinatalism. As you are interested in buddhism you should look up a deep explanation of the yin and yang and how there is always an opposite force for each experience whether it is positive or negative. Basically showing that there is no definitive good or bad to life, but rather a rollercoaster of the two. Or you could see it like the stoics and that nothing outside your sphere of choice is good or bad but it is just a happening outside of your control which creates a profound peace.
@Gufter Fresh First of all, im not referring to self esteem in a buddhist sense. The buddhism was only related to the orignal posters interest in it and the definition of ying and yang that was interesting. Secondly you saying that creating your own happiness is not meaningful is very contradictory, meaning literally is created by pursuing your own happiness? Im not sure how you don't understand that. There are no people? what is the physical form you live and touch and feel through every day? the idea that there is nothing is delusional. Its like you are saying a word over and over in your mind and it loses its meaning and validity, but instead of a word of all life. Its simply ridiculous. It seems like you disassociate with everything.
@Gufter Fresh how does that explain suicide? or people that dont have the desire to have children? doesnt the will to live simply mean our innate desire to mate and continue on our genes?
@Gufter Fresh This will sounds an awful lot like a soul that is separate from our physical bodies, is that what youre saying?
really liked the podcast, good to keep it up
2 hours of making pancakes while listening to your podcast is basically the dream life! Idk how you plan to top this episode, but I highly doubt you are going to succeed. Gtg spam everyone with a link to this
Sativa
listening and playing cod zombies :)
Ohhh, can I join for one of these? I'm just an architecture student with an interest for philosophy but still, I'd love to come
My man sounds like a Minecraft villager every time he says "huh"
Could you get this up on soundcloud, spreaker or anywhere at all? ❤️
Interesting as always🙏🏾
Qxir might be a cool guest for the future
This was awesome you guys should talk again.
I take solace in that the universe will eventually join me in death
I'd love to hear you talk about transcendental meditation.
I love ur channel.
Very good, saying that we know any religion or belief pattern is wrong is ignorant but otherwise good listening
I gotcha.
Long live sad stick men!
More podcasts pls
have you got a reference for where you go that hannah arendt quote from?about dangerous ideology that justifies anger
Great episode:))
Very nice podcast
These podcast would be perfect with subs for us with shitty headphones
You should upload this to Spotify if at all possible
I’d like to hear your thoughts on the Modal Ontological argument for the existence of God
more more more podcast please
Home boy should contact the archetypes
YEASSS
I always hated atheism for it's "matter of fact" opinion towards something that cannot and, most likely, will not ever prove. Just because you cannot see something doesnt mean that it does not exist. I like it to a lack of spiritual object permanence. Hating the institutions of religion and what not is fine but I really dont think anyone can truly understand what is ultimately outside the realm of our perception.
being dead did not bother me i like it :)
How about panpsychism??? We could join the consciousness of a stone. In fact ask a stone tonight what it thinks.
what counts for a table counts for a body...
A chair is a chair because it is a place to sit. You look at that chair as an action. It is no longer the tree that has made it. There's a brain disease out there where if you walk past an Open Door. You will need walkthrough and forget why but you did it because you seen a doorway a doorway is designed to walk through. Please see this
this is fun
Kinda irritating how ya’ll talk about and try to reframe spirituality without i dunno, asking someone why they follow whatever it is they follow. You make a conclusion based on your perspective and it is rather judgmental and one sided. Furthermore, though you say provides certainty to people, you also say it is “NFL for people with stinky houses” and that does not properly recognize the utility of it. Statistical models do not always reflect reality well, but they still help to understand it better. The utility of a tool is unchanged by your personal opinion.
Felt like you were looking down on people for seeking certainty in something that you don’t view as real. Came off as arrogant and pretentious is all. Other than that segment I mostly enjoyed this content.
Where's his discord?
If there was an asteroid coming for earth I for one would want to know
Why
@@demacolapoo I would like to say goodbye to my family, reflect on the good times stuff like that. Also I don't think its morally right to withhold information that substantial, or any information for that matter.
Have You Heard of UG krishnamutri.!! idk??
what is the discord in order to join
Why isn’t this in the episode list in the podcast
It usually takes up to 24 hours to show up on Apple Music. It should be on Spotify rn
Consider someone like psychedsubstance for the podcast. For some altered States Of Consciousness and philosophy go hand-in-hand. I.E. Terence McKenna.
I would like to have a friend like sisyphus55 in my age
I would want to know if a comet is hitting the earth and killing everyone . I would maximise my level of Euphorie if I know I died soon . I would try heroin and other hard and dangerous drugs. You could at least feel happy .
The unknown death is for me personally way more scary, because I would have missed much . With knowledge you could at least try to be happy af .
But isn't the idea that all there is beyond life is a short nothingness more freeing than if you thought you served a purpose?
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