So it's actually just a visual error with the textures used in DSR (I'm not sure of the exact technical issue). When I was making the video, I'd completely forgotten that if I'd modded PtDE to load these maps that they'd look "normal" again. Thankfully, their normal appearance is really basic and placeholder-looking as well, so nothing was really lost by seeing them this weird way instead. Plus I kind of like the psychedelic rainbow nightmare they turned into, it's just such a strong contrast to the final image and it's fun to look at. :p When it switches to blue, it's the exact same map loaded, but brightness, saturation and hue is cranked using debug lighting settings, and contrast on red is bumped to remove reds. The other issue with these proto maps in debug is that they're very dark. It's not a problem when I'm controlling the player in a more narrow space, since the light cast from the player character makes things visible enough. But for any of those more distant, wider shots of the environment? They'd be too dark by default, so that blue appearance is something I came up with to fix the visibility. I have to give a shout out to Meowmaritus for reminding me that they're not supposed to be so dark and rainbow-y, and they even offered me to help get them working in PtDE, which was cool as hell of them. But I was far enough into the video that I figured I'd just stick with it. Plus there are conveniences to recording from DSR over PtDE. :)
@@illusorywall could it just be that when they increased the texture resolution for the remake the file names changed or something, and the prototype map now called different or missing textures? total guesswork tbh
The colors are supposed to represent the directions the geometry's surface is facing, like Normal Maps (search it up for reference) where each color represents Up/Down, Forward/Back and Left/Right and there is a gradient between the colors for the inbetween. Though the UV mapping on this geometry is super rough so it has a few inaccuracies. The colors help testers visualize what direction an untextured surface is facing, instead of looking at solid colors with little to no lighting to help give it depth. Someone can probably explain it better, but I hope this helps give you an idea of what the colors are probably for!
Tbh I could totally see that being the reason that area is so unpolished; once they turned his Swamp City into Generic Lava Demon Hell, he simply had no love for it anymore.
@@PRO100Dreik Now you mention it, the bit where there are a lot of chaos eaters (where we meet Siegmeyer again) is kinda swamp like. Guess Miyazaki couldn't help himself in the end.
Yes. Those human models are often used to perfect area scale and predict where players would likely stand for the cinematic shot of the next area. Source: Game Dev.
Elden Ring was actually designed in a similar way. According to some early interviews the open world originally started as simple, flat planes, and the designers added elements of verticality later as they went. Early maps of Elden Ring would probably also have pretty basic connections compared to what came later.
Back when I studied game development I had a teacher who used to be a level designer at Grin until the studio shut down and he said that this is more or less how it is done. Specifically, he would start with a very simple path with just 2 or three turns and then add in obstacles and geometry that resulted in the player taking a far more indirect path which obscured how simple the map was from a birds eye view. The exact same approach used by FromSoft
@@meh.5645In fact, this technique goes even outside FromSoft games. In BotW, they made a prototipe of the open world very defined ways to traverse, yet the beta testers weren't convinced by this level design, saying that It was somewhat boring and really didn't have any incentive to explore more than another linear game. Thats why they decided to add a lot of terrain changes like mountains, lakes , branches and more in order to complicate the path and actually encourage exploration by not having a real "correct" way to go to the desired place. That turned out to work very well.
@@blitzburn2871 As someone who is trying to make a platformer game, this is often the best method of how you do level design. First you make the idea and the setting of the level, then you make a general idea of how the level is gonna look and play, then you make the geometry of the level taking the mechanics you are gonna put in mind, so at the end you put the obstacles and the enemies ,finally finishing with the decoration. This is the best order in my experience. In preference I draw the maps and improve it when I do them.
Looking back on the game, the one piece of interconnectivity I really wish was there was a way from the Tomb of the Giants into the Demon Ruins so you aren't forced into backtracking if you go down there early, and because that section felt rather disconnected from the rest of the game level design wise. If they had angled the room with Quelaag's sister towards those areas instead of towards Firelink, it could've housed an elevator up there. It would've been such a cool alternate route to go down into the catacombs to ring the second bell, and then to have to kill Quelaag to ascend back up to Firelink
I really wish we could see the Tomb of the Gs from the Demon Ruins. The view from the Tomb is so cool, and not having the view from the opposite perspective is *such* a missed opportunity. If only Remastered wasn't so rushed and cheap.
Considering that we have to defeat Ceaseless to get into the Demon Ruins from Quelaag's Domain that would imply a different location to fight with him, perhaps from those balconies if we want to enter QD from the Tomb of the Giants.
Having Quelanas domain potentially having a more direct route to firelink shrine and being considered during other areas development may be the reason one of the starting items is the witches ring. Quelaags cut dialogue could also imply a more involved or important role for that space, such as the bonfire in Anor Londo with the Darkmoon Knightess in the brass armour. She and Quelana are both firekeepers after all.
Really cool how the prototype map unintentionally shows blighttown before being bligttown. The natural cliff paths and sewer systems built by lordran were there but the shanty town scaffolding wasn't present. Its like seeing those 19th century pictures of famous cities before all the roads and skyscrapers
@@Douge11 Right on, there's no reason to think it couldn't or shouldn't have been a swamp in the lore, earlier in its history. All the branches running throughout the area, doesn't feel natural to a lavascape. And it would bring some green back to the area, which meshes well with the Angkor Wat inspiration.
there something so eerie about exploring these maps in game, in a map viewer it feels more clinical but in game its like exploring something dead and mysterious. Seeing something that wasn't meant to be seen
Yeah, something dead that will be consumed by the Langoliers sooner or later. Same with out of bounds stuff no one should ever be able to see. We can be happy to not be able to see the same from our world :)
19:10 - Professional game dev here, it's pretty common for level designers to put characters like that to keep a sense of scale, yeah. I don't personally know how From Software's development process works, but this wouldn't surprise me due to how large and open this area is - it can be difficult to keep track of the scale of things on levels like these. It could also double as a placeholder for where important NPCs would be. Rickert's cell isn't present, so maybe he was meant to be overlooking the water on that cliff instead?
@@ZeroNoWingAh k, wasn't too sure if they might be pilotable assets to save having to load the prototype player model each time the level designer tweaked geometry.
thats the answer i wanted and didnt get from the other comment. they could be markers for scale, important character locations, enemy spawn locations, or even viewing positions. just up to what the mapper felt
5:25 when I first played Dark Souls I always wondered if there was a secret area below the gaping dragon's room, of course I died but I curious about the giant waterfall
An interesting fringe benefit of the way FromSoftware approached assembling the interconnected world is that it left a lot of those bricked-up/blocked-off pathways in places the level design seems to be leading - which isn't a bad thing! It actually creates a really cool effect - the design language is telling you this Goes Somewhere, and that helps to create a really strong sense that Lordran, as a world, is larger than "just" the parts you see - that those closed doors and bricked-up hallways once *led* somewhere, and if you could move past them there'd be something there. Building levels to connect to each other in lots of ways and then paring extraneous pathways down later reinforces that illusion - the level design has a certain sincerity to it; those dead ends aren't exactly lying, even if the pathways they suggest were ultimately culled!
that bit about the dead end hallway in quelana's lair reminded me the first time I played the game and I had sacrificed so many humanities to her for the shortcut and getting incredibly miffed that the hallway wouldn't "open" took me a fat minute to learn the shortcut opened somewhere else
I know it's just cut dialogue from Queelag, but in my head it immediately makes it clear that the Butchers cutting the undead and throwing it down the sewers are doing so to send food back to Blighttown and Izalith somehow. I always thought it was weird for them to be feeding the Gaping Dragon or rats if anything; but it immediately makes sense on why trading it would grant a demon's hammer.
@@jpcsdutra They may not need it but dung pies exist. A lot of implications of humans eating humans. (Phone won’t let me spell the real word for no apparent reason…)
@@mimicrymwot I didn't think the Capra demon boss variant had any lore in writing, dialogue or even implication. Now that we're questioning it, why would the butcher even be doing what they doing when Undead don't require food. Demons born from Lost Izalith presumably also don't need physical food, either. From the madness of going hollow, repeating the job of their former life? Then, why trap an undead in a barrel presumably to cut up for consumption?
When I was exploring these maps with the debug menu, I didn't understand what most of them were supposed to be. It's nice to see the context explained.
I just played what might be the silliest sounding line, but here's everything there was: It is not totally clear who is speaking. It is probably Quelaag, assuming she would speak about herself in third person. If not, it may be another Daughter of Chaos partnered with her in Quelaag's domain: -Go back. Forbidden be, these parts. The realm of the creatures of chaos. They accept their banished fate. -Go back. Lest the flames devour all, and the children of chaos feed upon your charred ashes. Those who defy the pact… Those who trespass Quelaag's domain… May you feel the depth of our wrath! -Ahh, a precious new sacrifice! Forbidden be, these parts. The realm of the creatures of chaos. -Go on, go on ahead… -Welcome, bringer of meat. The children of chaos are hungry; give yourself to Quelaag's flame! It's hard not to read that as something like a covenant you could join with an optional fight, maybe comparable to Gwyndolin (or even Priscilla, since it sounds like they might just let you by), but I don't know if there's any more specific evidence beyond this unused dialog itself.
Imagine having the Master Key and skipping the Depths entirely, sitting down at the swamp bonfire in Blighttown, going over to the top of the ramp and finding the Gaping Dragon there, asleep, and able to one-shot you with a tail swipe or something if you wake it up. That would have been incredible.
Good stuff! Only thing I have to mention is the map at 36:11 is, in fact, a prototype of Chasm of the Abyss. There's another one for Oolacile Township lying around too.
I cannot express how happy it makes me to see Illusory wall: - dropped a new video -the new video is about dark souls 1… - THE NEW VIDEO IS !!!40 MINUTES!!! LONG! Bravo Sir and thank you. Please feel free to keep making content about my favourite game of all time.
The figures are almost certainly there to help with scale. When I used to do mapping for Team Fortress 2, it was pretty standard practice to place one of the player characters (usually the engineer) in the map editor to give an idea of scale and help everything feel "natural" to what the player character will look like. I think this is pretty much confirmed to be the case here since the John Dark Souls fella is the exact height of the player character. The reason they're pretty haphazardly placed is likely because the map designers would move them around as needed, sometimes placing a brand new one when they were too lazy to go to another part of the map to grab an old one to move to a new place (at least, that's what I did...)
I personally like those fake doors and dead ends. It shows the world was alive at some point, before you were around. Much like the paths were in use during development, they needed to be in use in-setting for people to get around. As for the area with the Dragon Scale at the bottom of Blighttown, I seem to recall an interview where the developers mentioned that it used to be the arena for the dragon covenant.
Everything you post is somehow interesting and has at least one thing I don't know about dark souls 1. Which is absurd to me, as I spent a decade following this franchise. A testimony of your prowess.
I had hypothesized the blight town room with the missing lever and Fire dogs was originally a way to get between the Gaping dragon boss room and BT. Never expected it to lead to Quelaag
19:10 You’re absolutely right that these are just for scale. The map geometry here was likely built in a separate DCC tool (Maya or Max or whatever) without any way to see it in-engine until it was run though some sort of build process. Despite the likes of Unreal and Unity nowadays allowing a designer to jump straight into gameplay while editing level layout, this kind of block-in reference geometry is still very widely used early in development. Getting the scale wrong has a massive impact on everything, and would likely require major rework if not caught early! Source: been in AAA game dev for well over a decade.
12:59 speaking of the bridge to Ceaseless. That bridge always piqued my curiosity, because it looks less like a bridge and more like an aqueduct. And the circle area at its end looks like it used to have a lever once. When I played first time, before defeating Ceasless Discharge, I figured I need to find a way to activate this bridge mechanism to drain the lava. Or something. The knob in the middle might even be the same asset as the leftover of the the RTSR floodgate lever.
I feel like I'm watching an academic dissertation in video form whenever one of the dissection videos is released. I'm working on a quilt to this. Two types of visual design at once.
It's interesting how evocative the prototype for New Londo is, knowing that their concept was based on Mont Saint-Michel. It's a little hard to see with what we ended up getting, but you can see how the shape of the place, the long narrow staircase, the colonnaded walkways, everything might've worked as this cathedral structure rising out of the waterline.
Nearly 400 hours in this game and I have never kicked down that ladder in New Londo Ruins, made that gap jump down the staircase outside of the ghost house, or used that drop-path to Four Kings. I love this game
Weirdly the layout of the unrecognizable Demon Ruins 15:00 gives me heavy Shulva Sanctum City from DS2 vibes. I know FromSoft likes using unused concepts in future games. What you've put together is a cool insight into some early thoughts in the development process
I think it's pretty likely that they use those placeholder human models mostly for scale. "A person is this tall, so this object is this big in comparison." That sort of thing. It can help to make sure things are the size you intend them to be so you're not just guessing.
Maybe the John Darksoul placement is where the devs wanted the name of the area to appear, or rather at which place they wanted to drop the card with the name of the area. Also, that music choice is stunning.
Ohhh, rewatching this and it only just hit me that the unused path in Quelaags Domain is probably the reason for the structure surrounding what would become the Bell of awakening using the same architecture as firelink itself. Yeah theyre still geographically close but they used to literally be connected. I think that also ties back round to the unused paths to the kiln and points to a firelink that would extend much deeper down as an explorable structure than what we eventually got in the final game, perhaps it was more similar to the nexus? Less in function than in its eerily expansive construction.
Quelaag domains is literally a church grounds if you remove all the webs, eggs etc. Go take a look in game and imagine that place without any of these and in perfect condition. Amazing job from the devs really
As a level designer by trade, I feel like all your observations and theories are pretty spot-on. Random observations: - The scaffolding in Blighttown could be missing because it's all static meshes instead of level/landscape geometry? - The star shaped signpost thingy likely just means "lever". My best guess is that this was so early in development that they didn't even have placeholder levers yet, so one designer just slapped together "replace_this_with_lever_later.fbx" for illustrative purposes, and the levels it shows up in are the levels that designer worked on. - John Darksouls definitely seems like he's placed there for scale. Either that, or he's a very early placeholder for like, a statue or a suit of armor or something, but then his locations in the map wouldn't really make sense. - Your comments on Valley of Drakes are very accurate. Caves are lifesavers in those "crap, we could risk causing like three thousand bugs if we move that whole section at this point" moments. Interestingly, they're often also used as loading zones where parts of the world are loaded/unloaded, and it wouldn't be completely impossible that the valley was placed there as a giant interactive loading screen, seeing as they would've needed to have a lot of different areas loaded at once if there wasn't a buffer zone between them. The valley is very curvy, which is very useful for breaking the player's line of sight to an area before unloading it from memory. - I love all your editing! The whole video is great, but I especially appreciate all the comparison shots and outlines, the maps and other images, the captions, the fading effect when showing different versions of the map, etc. And of course all the gameplay recording. So, so much walking.
The original demon ruins reminds me of the catacombs, how you're traveling along bridges to enter nooks carved into a sheer cliff face, only to eventually reach the bottom
From the cut dialog of Quelaag I almost feel like she was meant to be the face of a covenant, based around bringing "meat" to her which included humanity for her sister, who we would later discover during parts of a quest line.
It sounds more to me like intro dialogue for her boss fight, probably the part where they close up on her face. The implication that you forfeit your meat (body) and humanity upon entering her domain
Potentially for a secondary channel you could call it mimics chest, to keep with the theme, these videos are always really interesting but i can only imagine the work you have to put in to make them, so invested in seeing what kind of content youll make in a more relaxed setting
As an architect, I work with BIM software a ton. These programs are intended to design structures, but they follow a lot of the rules of what is being shown in this video. It’s super cool to see how similar my work is to a beloved game. Regarding the human figures, that is undoubtedly meant to help preserve human scale. When designing these spaces, the developers aren’t actually walking through them very much. They are working from a very zoomed out perspective and can rapidly move the camera and rotate the objects in view. It’s easy to lose scale, so copying a standard human asset helps keep everything grounded. Anor Londo took this concept to the extreme by making the architecture serve both human-sized users and giants. Just a demonstration of fantastic art design and direction.
I realize this is common practice, but its always cool to see how developers start with really simple geometry to figure out the level design, and then refine it down into the final product. Its almost like IRL sculpting: starting out with a slab of blank marble, then slowly roughing out the basic shape, before really working on the details. Developers/directors rarely actually have exactly what the level will look like down even while working on it.
My absolute favorite type of video on this channel is exploring the worlds of Dark Souls and speculating how they fit together and how they were developed, it's why I've been itching to see you talk about the world design (and lack thereof) of DS2. But this is also great! I love learning all these new things about a game that's dear to me. Makes me wonder what kind of gordian knot kudzu vine of a game could exist had they tried to connect all these insane paths anyway.
I'm glad King's Field is getting love. I grew up with that series before Demon's Souls and Dark Souls. Hearing people talk about it and hearing videos that use it's music like you did makes me happy.
13:52 This immediately reminds me of Blighttown's thin walkways, or better yet, Tower of Latria and Shrine of Storms. Specifically: the areas in 3-2 and 4-1 where you climb around a tower/mountain without interacting with the internals until much later, relying on stairs and platforms/walkways built into the side of a larger structure. Maybe a bit of the 'outdoors' of the Catacombs before the Tomb of the Giants, and the Stonefang Tunnels bits where you meet Patches and fight Rockworms.
The valley of the drakes is probably the most important piece of the map in dark souls- without it you wouldn't be able to travel to so many different areas in whichever order you wanted. I think it's nice they didn't skimp out on the details even if it was added late in development
Game and Level Desiger here. At 19:40, your guess is completely right. We´re using humanoid placeholders to get a feel for the size ratio and roomspace for the playable character. That's a very common process before testing out the blockout in-game. In third-person games, it is also very common to add an extra amount of space to a room, especially for the camera.
I woud like to see you cover that unused map you mention around 36:50. I think its worth noting that the unused prototype map and the prototype darkroot geometry both have giant gears in them, which in the final game are only found near the dukes archives. Seath and darkroot are connected in the final game via the moonlight butterfly, so I think there used to be more of a connection between the two originally. Also, I noticed that unnamed town you see in the far off distance from firelink is actually a prototype layout of lower undead burg (And the rest of undead burg copy pasted a bunch of times). Not sure if thats known but I don't think that was mentioned here.
this early demon ruins concept with the bridges and drop-downs and columned nooks with chambers behind them reminds me a lot of dark souls ii's dragon's sanctum area, the one with all the drakeblood knights leading down to elana's boss fight. i don't think there's a likely connection but it was the first thing that struck me when seeing it for the first time
With the voice lines and the placeholder enemies, I can't help but think Quelaag used to have an army of more archnified Eingys fight you at some point.
The definitive series for those interested in the quirks and charms of Dark Souls. Thanks for everything you have done over the years, both on yt, but more notably with the DS community in general.
For some reason I love unused content, most of all seeing things that could have been different maps and the likes, because it invokes in me that feeling I had as a kid, not knowing anything about the games I played and without easy access to internet having only friends testimonies and my own explorations to rely on. It's a sense of wonder and exploration I dearly miss.
It's a fun little perspective thing. Even though I knew it was above the boss room, having dropped back down into it before, I still thought "oh huh this is neat to see from this angle, with the boss still alive", so I was hoping it'd bring some extra clarity to some viewers exactly like this. :)
I always loved the mystique of the Valley of Drakes, the (for me as a newbie) tough enemies, the scary dragon, a backdoor to a very hard place (Blighttown), it really feels like someplace you shouldnt be
4:50 I thought the whole point of the Blighttown shallow pit was for PvP duels. No enemy interruptions, right near a bonfire. There's even a Dragon Scale in the chest - the reward for winning a duel as a dragon-bro.
That’s nuts! I was genuinely binge watching your dsd on dark souls 2 last night and when I saw this video just now I just said “let’s go!” out loud in a room full of strangers
Will never stop loving these videos. Few games are as interesting as the Souls games and your videos are some of the best not just regarding Souls but in general. Will definitely be checking out that second channel when it's ready.
You can't imagine how excited we are about these videos! Thank you! Good news-I took a game design course at my university. Now, I am working on creating my own soul game.
Strangely enough, these prototypes look more forbidden and mysterious than Lordran's final form itself (especially the strangeness and different layout of the Demon Ruins).
The early prototype of the lever room past Quelaag reminds me a lot of the Dragon God's arena in Stonefang Tunnel, with the thinner maybe more ornate pillars gridding up the view into the Demon Ruins and collapsed rubble blocking a pathway
Illusory wall, I dig how your mind works. No one makes deep-dive, behind-the-scenes Souls content quite like you do. This is fantastic work. Btw, I watched your Gimmick! video quite a while ago. I randomly searched for it on the PS store a few days ago and a remastered version is actually available! I’m excited to check it out. I wish you nothing but the absolute best. I look forward to your work and it is always compelling stuff. Big Ups!
I'll preface this by saying I'm naught but a rookie in game design, but I can almost assure you that the blocky characters placed around the map are for scale of the actual map itself. Having a reference of how tall the character is versus how large the environment is on hand like that is very useful!
Man, I love seeing stuff like this! I will definitely check out those other videos in the description! Maybe the Izalith Swamp framework actually lines up with swamps in other From Soft games, since we all know Miyazaki loves his swamps.
It makes a degree of sense, having an elevator from Firelink to the second Bell of Awakening, since there's one that goes to the first one. It's better the way it is though
Dark Souls, illusory wall and Zullie the witch are truly the gifts that keep on giving. To me one of the most impressive aspects of the world design is how, at least up to and including anor londo, it really feels like an ancient, mythical world you're discovering, rather than something constructed and cobbled together. Even with the knowledge of all the little secrets and examinations of the souls community.
I end up enjoying little details like the closed lever and gate at 3:10. Having extra directions closed off creates the feeling of a bigger world outside that of our game space. Edit: Ah, your suggestion right after that would be perfect 😄
Those long straight paths remind me of the ones still in the release version that are used for preloading zones that you may warp to. Maybe they knew about that early, and intended there to be a kind of cutscene travel than a physical realtime walking travel. Also I'll be on the lookout for that weird not-kiln. Fun to see the "conclusion" of the Andre statue move.
I am replaying Dark Souls for about the thirtieth time or so and I was just wondering what could be beyond some of these walled off paths. A few playthroughs ago, I remember stumbling into an area I had never been before. It even had an item (just a soul consumable). It was the little side cave in The Valley of the Drakes if you're on the narrow little pass that goes down to the big undead dragon and the Blight Town exit (or entrance) and the New Londo Ruins entrance. It had me thinking that there could be other little areas I've just never noticed in the game. It took me fifteen or so playthroughs before I knew the covetous silver serpent ring (I think it is the silver and not the gold) was down in the Tomb of the Giants on that little area you have to jump to past patches and the first couple giant skeleton dog things. I also found two lootable corpses in the Demon Ruins near all the weird walking dragon asses. They both just had a couple of divine blessings, but I wondered if I had missed any more corpses out in the lava. Even after so many playthroughs, I still find new stuff or a new way of playing each time.
I think "weak" areas like the valley of the drakes kinda add a bit of realism to the interconnected design. All these places are built and designed (in world) by different people at different times. They may be really well designed in themselves but don't necessarily fit into the designs of others. Valley of the drakes has that kind of feel, it feels like it became a path out of necessity and ease rather than design. Although side note I've also often wondered if before new Londo was sealed that water used to flow into and fill that valley, allowing trade by river
how have i only just now learned of the dev message with guidance at 27:00 like are there more of these I've just never heard of? love how i still get to learn things about this game
It's pretty cool, right? Unfortunately the later games really scaled this back. Dark Souls 2 still has hidden developer messages, but instead of having customized messages, there's just one stock one that's placed in front of every illusory wall. It's helpful for finding them so it's arguably more functional as a utility, but once you realize it's perfectly 1:1 with all of the illusory walls, it loses some magic because they never have anything interesting to say. The developer messages in Dark Souls 1 are lot more interesting because there aren't any repeats, I made a list of them here: darksouls.wikidot.com/seek-guidance Dark Souls 3 has some as well, just a lot less IIRC.
what do the colours mean on the prototype map? the greens blues and pinks
So it's actually just a visual error with the textures used in DSR (I'm not sure of the exact technical issue).
When I was making the video, I'd completely forgotten that if I'd modded PtDE to load these maps that they'd look "normal" again. Thankfully, their normal appearance is really basic and placeholder-looking as well, so nothing was really lost by seeing them this weird way instead.
Plus I kind of like the psychedelic rainbow nightmare they turned into, it's just such a strong contrast to the final image and it's fun to look at. :p
When it switches to blue, it's the exact same map loaded, but brightness, saturation and hue is cranked using debug lighting settings, and contrast on red is bumped to remove reds.
The other issue with these proto maps in debug is that they're very dark. It's not a problem when I'm controlling the player in a more narrow space, since the light cast from the player character makes things visible enough. But for any of those more distant, wider shots of the environment? They'd be too dark by default, so that blue appearance is something I came up with to fix the visibility.
I have to give a shout out to Meowmaritus for reminding me that they're not supposed to be so dark and rainbow-y, and they even offered me to help get them working in PtDE, which was cool as hell of them. But I was far enough into the video that I figured I'd just stick with it. Plus there are conveniences to recording from DSR over PtDE. :)
@@illusorywallI've always thought it was a way to visualise a normalmap or something
@@illusorywall could it just be that when they increased the texture resolution for the remake the file names changed or something, and the prototype map now called different or missing textures? total guesswork tbh
The colors are supposed to represent the directions the geometry's surface is facing, like Normal Maps (search it up for reference) where each color represents Up/Down, Forward/Back and Left/Right and there is a gradient between the colors for the inbetween. Though the UV mapping on this geometry is super rough so it has a few inaccuracies. The colors help testers visualize what direction an untextured surface is facing, instead of looking at solid colors with little to no lighting to help give it depth. Someone can probably explain it better, but I hope this helps give you an idea of what the colors are probably for!
@@illusorywall I like the color ngl 👍
Im surprised that they managed to stop Miyazaki from building a second swamp
Tbh I could totally see that being the reason that area is so unpolished; once they turned his Swamp City into Generic Lava Demon Hell, he simply had no love for it anymore.
@@cupriferouscatalyst3708 makes so much sense why it's infested with chaos eaters if you think about Lost Izalith as a swamp
They didn't stop him, they just let him set it on FIRE.
Man needs to make a game that's nothing BUT swamp, just get it all out of his system once and for all.
@@PRO100Dreik Now you mention it, the bit where there are a lot of chaos eaters (where we meet Siegmeyer again) is kinda swamp like. Guess Miyazaki couldn't help himself in the end.
Yes. Those human models are often used to perfect area scale and predict where players would likely stand for the cinematic shot of the next area. Source: Game Dev.
It’s interesting seeing how they start with simple straight line from Point A to Point B then refine and complicate it.
Elden Ring was actually designed in a similar way. According to some early interviews the open world originally started as simple, flat planes, and the designers added elements of verticality later as they went. Early maps of Elden Ring would probably also have pretty basic connections compared to what came later.
Back when I studied game development I had a teacher who used to be a level designer at Grin until the studio shut down and he said that this is more or less how it is done.
Specifically, he would start with a very simple path with just 2 or three turns and then add in obstacles and geometry that resulted in the player taking a far more indirect path which obscured how simple the map was from a birds eye view.
The exact same approach used by FromSoft
it's like a drawing, first you make the rough shapes, then outlines, then basic shading, textures and little details :-)
@@meh.5645In fact, this technique goes even outside FromSoft games.
In BotW, they made a prototipe of the open world very defined ways to traverse, yet the beta testers weren't convinced by this level design, saying that It was somewhat boring and really didn't have any incentive to explore more than another linear game.
Thats why they decided to add a lot of terrain changes like mountains, lakes , branches and more in order to complicate the path and actually encourage exploration by not having a real "correct" way to go to the desired place.
That turned out to work very well.
@@blitzburn2871 As someone who is trying to make a platformer game, this is often the best method of how you do level design.
First you make the idea and the setting of the level, then you make a general idea of how the level is gonna look and play, then you make the geometry of the level taking the mechanics you are gonna put in mind, so at the end you put the obstacles and the enemies ,finally finishing with the decoration. This is the best order in my experience.
In preference I draw the maps and improve it when I do them.
Looking back on the game, the one piece of interconnectivity I really wish was there was a way from the Tomb of the Giants into the Demon Ruins so you aren't forced into backtracking if you go down there early, and because that section felt rather disconnected from the rest of the game level design wise. If they had angled the room with Quelaag's sister towards those areas instead of towards Firelink, it could've housed an elevator up there. It would've been such a cool alternate route to go down into the catacombs to ring the second bell, and then to have to kill Quelaag to ascend back up to Firelink
I really wish we could see the Tomb of the Gs from the Demon Ruins. The view from the Tomb is so cool, and not having the view from the opposite perspective is *such* a missed opportunity. If only Remastered wasn't so rushed and cheap.
@@Neuvostat least it’s better than the GTA definitive edition remasters
every remaster should be better than the gta definitive editions. that was unacceptable. @@noamias4897
The one piece ?
*To The Grand Line OST playing in the background*
Considering that we have to defeat Ceaseless to get into the Demon Ruins from Quelaag's Domain that would imply a different location to fight with him, perhaps from those balconies if we want to enter QD from the Tomb of the Giants.
Having Quelanas domain potentially having a more direct route to firelink shrine and being considered during other areas development may be the reason one of the starting items is the witches ring. Quelaags cut dialogue could also imply a more involved or important role for that space, such as the bonfire in Anor Londo with the Darkmoon Knightess in the brass armour. She and Quelana are both firekeepers after all.
Also wonder how the pale lady became a fire keeper
Quelana is the Pyromancy teacher in Blighttown. We don't know the Fair Lady's name.
Really cool how the prototype map unintentionally shows blighttown before being bligttown. The natural cliff paths and sewer systems built by lordran were there but the shanty town scaffolding wasn't present. Its like seeing those 19th century pictures of famous cities before all the roads and skyscrapers
Interesting thought and very true. Now I think of the poor FS devs working on it like the blighttown inhabitants
This same concept is my head canon for izalith. It was indeed a swamp before it was flooded with lava, both in development and lore
@@Douge11 Right on, there's no reason to think it couldn't or shouldn't have been a swamp in the lore, earlier in its history. All the branches running throughout the area, doesn't feel natural to a lavascape. And it would bring some green back to the area, which meshes well with the Angkor Wat inspiration.
Seyana
@@illusorywallit would also help explain why Pyromancers live in swamps, like every pyromancer besides the woman in ds2 is from a swamp
there something so eerie about exploring these maps in game, in a map viewer it feels more clinical but in game its like exploring something dead and mysterious. Seeing something that wasn't meant to be seen
The ash lake of game development
Wonder if it was there Miyazaki fought the ancient dragons
Yeah, something dead that will be consumed by the Langoliers sooner or later. Same with out of bounds stuff no one should ever be able to see.
We can be happy to not be able to see the same from our world :)
19:10 - Professional game dev here, it's pretty common for level designers to put characters like that to keep a sense of scale, yeah. I don't personally know how From Software's development process works, but this wouldn't surprise me due to how large and open this area is - it can be difficult to keep track of the scale of things on levels like these. It could also double as a placeholder for where important NPCs would be. Rickert's cell isn't present, so maybe he was meant to be overlooking the water on that cliff instead?
Can those placeholders for NPCs be used as a player character model to run around the map?
No they are definitely static@@whiskeyhound
@@ZeroNoWingAh k, wasn't too sure if they might be pilotable assets to save having to load the prototype player model each time the level designer tweaked geometry.
What are your works
thats the answer i wanted and didnt get from the other comment. they could be markers for scale, important character locations, enemy spawn locations, or even viewing positions. just up to what the mapper felt
I'm glad we finally found Mr John Dark Souls! I always loved his quote "?PlayerMsg?"
5:25 when I first played Dark Souls I always wondered if there was a secret area below the gaping dragon's room, of course I died but I curious about the giant waterfall
An interesting fringe benefit of the way FromSoftware approached assembling the interconnected world is that it left a lot of those bricked-up/blocked-off pathways in places the level design seems to be leading - which isn't a bad thing! It actually creates a really cool effect - the design language is telling you this Goes Somewhere, and that helps to create a really strong sense that Lordran, as a world, is larger than "just" the parts you see - that those closed doors and bricked-up hallways once *led* somewhere, and if you could move past them there'd be something there. Building levels to connect to each other in lots of ways and then paring extraneous pathways down later reinforces that illusion - the level design has a certain sincerity to it; those dead ends aren't exactly lying, even if the pathways they suggest were ultimately culled!
Adding slide whistle @22:50 for the ladder made me smile for some reason. :D
Gotta love another 40 minute deep dive into one of my favorite games.
You bet!
Actually, it's 39 minutes. 🤓
I can go months without thinking about it much but the DS trilogy and BB always feel like home whenever I do.
It´s sad DS ended with the third game. If From Software made a fourth game, it would be on my wishlist straight away.
@@SeeharaI mean elden ring is kinda a sequel
that bit about the dead end hallway in quelana's lair reminded me the first time I played the game and I had sacrificed so many humanities to her for the shortcut and getting incredibly miffed that the hallway wouldn't "open"
took me a fat minute to learn the shortcut opened somewhere else
It took me days🤭
same, then i thought "wait, solaire aint there" and went back towards the actual one
Out of all of the youtubers I subscribe to, you are one of a handful that I instantly click on when I see a new video. Love this series!
Illusory Wall, Hawkshaw, and The Backlogs are an instant click for me!
doe
I came THIS close to stopping this from coming out today.
I was good and actually finished this after our Satisfactory session, lol.
I know it's just cut dialogue from Queelag, but in my head it immediately makes it clear that the Butchers cutting the undead and throwing it down the sewers are doing so to send food back to Blighttown and Izalith somehow. I always thought it was weird for them to be feeding the Gaping Dragon or rats if anything; but it immediately makes sense on why trading it would grant a demon's hammer.
I figured the man eating hollows and dogs were chowing down. Maybe both?
@@Zanemob In the final version it is anyone's guess. Hollows and the soul starved shouldn't have a need for food anyway, but I guess.
@@jpcsdutra They may not need it but dung pies exist. A lot of implications of humans eating humans. (Phone won’t let me spell the real word for no apparent reason…)
I always assumed they serve the Capta Demon. I vaguely remember some text mentioning it, but i'm not sure.
@@mimicrymwot I didn't think the Capra demon boss variant had any lore in writing, dialogue or even implication. Now that we're questioning it, why would the butcher even be doing what they doing when Undead don't require food. Demons born from Lost Izalith presumably also don't need physical food, either.
From the madness of going hollow, repeating the job of their former life? Then, why trap an undead in a barrel presumably to cut up for consumption?
38:05 Shout out to the ominous, floating orb of darkness. Has to be one of my favourite Dark Souls characters of all time.
I absolutely love the use of the retro synth version of the music when running around the unfinished map. So perfect.
When I was exploring these maps with the debug menu, I didn't understand what most of them were supposed to be. It's nice to see the context explained.
Omg I didn't realize Quelaag had dialogue, nice voice that was unused!
I just played what might be the silliest sounding line, but here's everything there was:
It is not totally clear who is speaking. It is probably Quelaag, assuming she would speak about herself in third person. If not, it may be another Daughter of Chaos partnered with her in Quelaag's domain:
-Go back. Forbidden be, these parts. The realm of the creatures of chaos. They accept their banished fate.
-Go back. Lest the flames devour all, and the children of chaos feed upon your charred ashes. Those who defy the pact… Those who trespass Quelaag's domain… May you feel the depth of our wrath!
-Ahh, a precious new sacrifice! Forbidden be, these parts. The realm of the creatures of chaos.
-Go on, go on ahead…
-Welcome, bringer of meat. The children of chaos are hungry; give yourself to Quelaag's flame!
It's hard not to read that as something like a covenant you could join with an optional fight, maybe comparable to Gwyndolin (or even Priscilla, since it sounds like they might just let you by), but I don't know if there's any more specific evidence beyond this unused dialog itself.
I’m the bringer of meat alright
Such interesting voice lines!! Thanks for sharing
@@reinesschnitzelp9120"Heck yeah, she wants to have me for dinner! OH GOD, SHE'S HAVING ME FOR DINNER!"
@@illusorywall Is the audio someplace you could link to? I'd love to hear it! Do we know who the voice actress is?
Imagine having the Master Key and skipping the Depths entirely, sitting down at the swamp bonfire in Blighttown, going over to the top of the ramp and finding the Gaping Dragon there, asleep, and able to one-shot you with a tail swipe or something if you wake it up. That would have been incredible.
Me getting one shot by tail swipes anyways because I always run a glass cannon build until I start dying
Good stuff! Only thing I have to mention is the map at 36:11 is, in fact, a prototype of Chasm of the Abyss. There's another one for Oolacile Township lying around too.
That's good to know, thanks! I thought it reminded me of the Chasm so I'm glad my hunch was correct.
The not-so-broken pillar and the different platform to reach it are pretty recognizable
I cannot express how happy it makes me to see Illusory wall:
- dropped a new video
-the new video is about dark souls 1…
- THE NEW VIDEO IS !!!40 MINUTES!!! LONG!
Bravo Sir and thank you. Please feel free to keep making content about my favourite game of all time.
The worst part is that 40 minutes go by in an instant when I watch his videos. They're far too interesting. :(
YES, FINALLY A NEW DISSECTED VIDEO!!
The figures are almost certainly there to help with scale. When I used to do mapping for Team Fortress 2, it was pretty standard practice to place one of the player characters (usually the engineer) in the map editor to give an idea of scale and help everything feel "natural" to what the player character will look like.
I think this is pretty much confirmed to be the case here since the John Dark Souls fella is the exact height of the player character. The reason they're pretty haphazardly placed is likely because the map designers would move them around as needed, sometimes placing a brand new one when they were too lazy to go to another part of the map to grab an old one to move to a new place (at least, that's what I did...)
I personally like those fake doors and dead ends. It shows the world was alive at some point, before you were around. Much like the paths were in use during development, they needed to be in use in-setting for people to get around.
As for the area with the Dragon Scale at the bottom of Blighttown, I seem to recall an interview where the developers mentioned that it used to be the arena for the dragon covenant.
X-Men jumpscare almost cost me my life I was laughing so hard, please wield your power more responsibly.
I'm in favor of more irresponsible wielding of power like this 😤
It's just to test your Regenerative Healing Factor. ;)
Everything you post is somehow interesting and has at least one thing I don't know about dark souls 1. Which is absurd to me, as I spent a decade following this franchise. A testimony of your prowess.
I had hypothesized the blight town room with the missing lever and Fire dogs was originally a way to get between the Gaping dragon boss room and BT.
Never expected it to lead to Quelaag
Also I think it would make a great shortcut if the round tunnel was actually connected to the boss room somehow.
19:10 You’re absolutely right that these are just for scale. The map geometry here was likely built in a separate DCC tool (Maya or Max or whatever) without any way to see it in-engine until it was run though some sort of build process. Despite the likes of Unreal and Unity nowadays allowing a designer to jump straight into gameplay while editing level layout, this kind of block-in reference geometry is still very widely used early in development. Getting the scale wrong has a massive impact on everything, and would likely require major rework if not caught early! Source: been in AAA game dev for well over a decade.
Source: trust me bro.
So tired of LARPers in comments sections lol. Keep quiet and do food stamps, wagie.
12:59 speaking of the bridge to Ceaseless. That bridge always piqued my curiosity, because it looks less like a bridge and more like an aqueduct. And the circle area at its end looks like it used to have a lever once. When I played first time, before defeating Ceasless Discharge, I figured I need to find a way to activate this bridge mechanism to drain the lava. Or something. The knob in the middle might even be the same asset as the leftover of the the RTSR floodgate lever.
This is the absolute best possible video topic for my taste, so thanks for making it 40min and so excellently-presented.
Unsure how new this is but I've been waiting for like a decade to see what that area around 2:45 was for. Finally!
As a game developer, I can confirm that the body dummies found around are 100% there to provide a scale reference while building the level.
I feel like I'm watching an academic dissertation in video form whenever one of the dissection videos is released.
I'm working on a quilt to this. Two types of visual design at once.
It's interesting how evocative the prototype for New Londo is, knowing that their concept was based on Mont Saint-Michel. It's a little hard to see with what we ended up getting, but you can see how the shape of the place, the long narrow staircase, the colonnaded walkways, everything might've worked as this cathedral structure rising out of the waterline.
Nearly 400 hours in this game and I have never kicked down that ladder in New Londo Ruins, made that gap jump down the staircase outside of the ghost house, or used that drop-path to Four Kings. I love this game
These Dissected vids are always super fun. Thanks for also shouting out other creators doing this stuff. I got 2 new great channels to follow!
Weirdly the layout of the unrecognizable Demon Ruins 15:00 gives me heavy Shulva Sanctum City from DS2 vibes. I know FromSoft likes using unused concepts in future games. What you've put together is a cool insight into some early thoughts in the development process
I think it's pretty likely that they use those placeholder human models mostly for scale. "A person is this tall, so this object is this big in comparison." That sort of thing. It can help to make sure things are the size you intend them to be so you're not just guessing.
Maybe the John Darksoul placement is where the devs wanted the name of the area to appear, or rather at which place they wanted to drop the card with the name of the area.
Also, that music choice is stunning.
Ohhh, rewatching this and it only just hit me that the unused path in Quelaags Domain is probably the reason for the structure surrounding what would become the Bell of awakening using the same architecture as firelink itself. Yeah theyre still geographically close but they used to literally be connected. I think that also ties back round to the unused paths to the kiln and points to a firelink that would extend much deeper down as an explorable structure than what we eventually got in the final game, perhaps it was more similar to the nexus? Less in function than in its eerily expansive construction.
Quelaag domains is literally a church grounds if you remove all the webs, eggs etc. Go take a look in game and imagine that place without any of these and in perfect condition. Amazing job from the devs really
As a level designer by trade, I feel like all your observations and theories are pretty spot-on. Random observations:
- The scaffolding in Blighttown could be missing because it's all static meshes instead of level/landscape geometry?
- The star shaped signpost thingy likely just means "lever". My best guess is that this was so early in development that they didn't even have placeholder levers yet, so one designer just slapped together "replace_this_with_lever_later.fbx" for illustrative purposes, and the levels it shows up in are the levels that designer worked on.
- John Darksouls definitely seems like he's placed there for scale. Either that, or he's a very early placeholder for like, a statue or a suit of armor or something, but then his locations in the map wouldn't really make sense.
- Your comments on Valley of Drakes are very accurate. Caves are lifesavers in those "crap, we could risk causing like three thousand bugs if we move that whole section at this point" moments. Interestingly, they're often also used as loading zones where parts of the world are loaded/unloaded, and it wouldn't be completely impossible that the valley was placed there as a giant interactive loading screen, seeing as they would've needed to have a lot of different areas loaded at once if there wasn't a buffer zone between them. The valley is very curvy, which is very useful for breaking the player's line of sight to an area before unloading it from memory.
- I love all your editing! The whole video is great, but I especially appreciate all the comparison shots and outlines, the maps and other images, the captions, the fading effect when showing different versions of the map, etc. And of course all the gameplay recording. So, so much walking.
The original demon ruins reminds me of the catacombs, how you're traveling along bridges to enter nooks carved into a sheer cliff face, only to eventually reach the bottom
Those fake doors always bothered me but I was always curious about them! So this is really nice to see
From the cut dialog of Quelaag I almost feel like she was meant to be the face of a covenant, based around bringing "meat" to her which included humanity for her sister, who we would later discover during parts of a quest line.
It sounds more to me like intro dialogue for her boss fight, probably the part where they close up on her face. The implication that you forfeit your meat (body) and humanity upon entering her domain
@@LinkinMark1994 a brave soul to dare apply Occam's Razor to Dark Souls lore
I'd gladly give Queelag some meat.
man dark souls is my favourite thing ever, i cant get enough of seeing it in early stages
Potentially for a secondary channel you could call it mimics chest, to keep with the theme, these videos are always really interesting but i can only imagine the work you have to put in to make them, so invested in seeing what kind of content youll make in a more relaxed setting
As an architect, I work with BIM software a ton. These programs are intended to design structures, but they follow a lot of the rules of what is being shown in this video. It’s super cool to see how similar my work is to a beloved game.
Regarding the human figures, that is undoubtedly meant to help preserve human scale. When designing these spaces, the developers aren’t actually walking through them very much. They are working from a very zoomed out perspective and can rapidly move the camera and rotate the objects in view. It’s easy to lose scale, so copying a standard human asset helps keep everything grounded.
Anor Londo took this concept to the extreme by making the architecture serve both human-sized users and giants. Just a demonstration of fantastic art design and direction.
I realize this is common practice, but its always cool to see how developers start with really simple geometry to figure out the level design, and then refine it down into the final product.
Its almost like IRL sculpting: starting out with a slab of blank marble, then slowly roughing out the basic shape, before really working on the details. Developers/directors rarely actually have exactly what the level will look like down even while working on it.
My absolute favorite type of video on this channel is exploring the worlds of Dark Souls and speculating how they fit together and how they were developed, it's why I've been itching to see you talk about the world design (and lack thereof) of DS2. But this is also great! I love learning all these new things about a game that's dear to me. Makes me wonder what kind of gordian knot kudzu vine of a game could exist had they tried to connect all these insane paths anyway.
I'm glad King's Field is getting love. I grew up with that series before Demon's Souls and Dark Souls. Hearing people talk about it and hearing videos that use it's music like you did makes me happy.
I never knew it was that easy to get to the four kings. Thanks, I learned something about the final game.
13:52 This immediately reminds me of Blighttown's thin walkways, or better yet, Tower of Latria and Shrine of Storms. Specifically: the areas in 3-2 and 4-1 where you climb around a tower/mountain without interacting with the internals until much later, relying on stairs and platforms/walkways built into the side of a larger structure. Maybe a bit of the 'outdoors' of the Catacombs before the Tomb of the Giants, and the Stonefang Tunnels bits where you meet Patches and fight Rockworms.
I absolutely adore your Dark Souls dissection videos!!!
I'm so thankful you still make this series. It's just fantastic.
The valley of the drakes is probably the most important piece of the map in dark souls- without it you wouldn't be able to travel to so many different areas in whichever order you wanted. I think it's nice they didn't skimp out on the details even if it was added late in development
The King's field music out of nowhere shot me like a bullet of love.
Game and Level Desiger here. At 19:40, your guess is completely right. We´re using humanoid placeholders to get a feel for the size ratio and roomspace for the playable character. That's a very common process before testing out the blockout in-game. In third-person games, it is also very common to add an extra amount of space to a room, especially for the camera.
I woud like to see you cover that unused map you mention around 36:50. I think its worth noting that the unused prototype map and the prototype darkroot geometry both have giant gears in them, which in the final game are only found near the dukes archives. Seath and darkroot are connected in the final game via the moonlight butterfly, so I think there used to be more of a connection between the two originally.
Also, I noticed that unnamed town you see in the far off distance from firelink is actually a prototype layout of lower undead burg (And the rest of undead burg copy pasted a bunch of times). Not sure if thats known but I don't think that was mentioned here.
do you happen to know where i can find more info on this map?
so stoked! this is gonna be a great watch, thanks for your hard work and dedication to your craft as always Sir Wall!
this early demon ruins concept with the bridges and drop-downs and columned nooks with chambers behind them reminds me a lot of dark souls ii's dragon's sanctum area, the one with all the drakeblood knights leading down to elana's boss fight. i don't think there's a likely connection but it was the first thing that struck me when seeing it for the first time
Half-naked Quelaag saying "Welcome, Bringer of Meat" has some interesting implications.
With the voice lines and the placeholder enemies, I can't help but think Quelaag used to have an army of more archnified Eingys fight you at some point.
It makes me very happy that you are still making this series. Discovering cut content are always a treat.
The definitive series for those interested in the quirks and charms of Dark Souls.
Thanks for everything you have done over the years, both on yt, but more notably with the DS community in general.
Great video from start to finish. Illusory wall does it again
I'm so happy that you've got enough new DS content to make more of these.
For some reason I love unused content, most of all seeing things that could have been different maps and the likes, because it invokes in me that feeling I had as a kid, not knowing anything about the games I played and without easy access to internet having only friends testimonies and my own explorations to rely on. It's a sense of wonder and exploration I dearly miss.
Your commitment to this series is commendable, to say the least. Keep up the good work!
26:42 I never knew the boss room was right under the broken stairs, I really have to take in my surroundings a bit more from time to time.
It's a fun little perspective thing. Even though I knew it was above the boss room, having dropped back down into it before, I still thought "oh huh this is neat to see from this angle, with the boss still alive", so I was hoping it'd bring some extra clarity to some viewers exactly like this. :)
I always loved the mystique of the Valley of Drakes, the (for me as a newbie) tough enemies, the scary dragon, a backdoor to a very hard place (Blighttown), it really feels like someplace you shouldnt be
4:50 I thought the whole point of the Blighttown shallow pit was for PvP duels. No enemy interruptions, right near a bonfire. There's even a Dragon Scale in the chest - the reward for winning a duel as a dragon-bro.
That’s nuts! I was genuinely binge watching your dsd on dark souls 2 last night and when I saw this video just now I just said “let’s go!” out loud in a room full of strangers
Will never stop loving these videos. Few games are as interesting as the Souls games and your videos are some of the best not just regarding Souls but in general. Will definitely be checking out that second channel when it's ready.
You can't imagine how excited we are about these videos! Thank you! Good news-I took a game design course at my university. Now, I am working on creating my own soul game.
I really need to play Dark Souls again... feels like an eternity since the last time... 🔥
Amazing, one of the best videos I've ever seen on YT. Love how well the prototype worked in creating one of the best maps a video game has ever had.
Strangely enough, these prototypes look more forbidden and mysterious than Lordran's final form itself (especially the strangeness and different layout of the Demon Ruins).
The early prototype of the lever room past Quelaag reminds me a lot of the Dragon God's arena in Stonefang Tunnel, with the thinner maybe more ornate pillars gridding up the view into the Demon Ruins and collapsed rubble blocking a pathway
Literally jumping up and down I LOVE THIS SERIES SO MUCH
Illusory wall, I dig how your mind works. No one makes deep-dive, behind-the-scenes Souls content quite like you do. This is fantastic work.
Btw, I watched your Gimmick! video quite a while ago. I randomly searched for it on the PS store a few days ago and a remastered version is actually available! I’m excited to check it out.
I wish you nothing but the absolute best. I look forward to your work and it is always compelling stuff. Big Ups!
Proto-Demon Ruins reminds me of the final section of Shulva, with all the staircases and Drakeblood knights.
36:14 this feels like tomb of the giants to me, just with the paths jutting out of the cliff and the ramps. it reminds me a lot of that.
I'll preface this by saying I'm naught but a rookie in game design, but I can almost assure you that the blocky characters placed around the map are for scale of the actual map itself. Having a reference of how tall the character is versus how large the environment is on hand like that is very useful!
Always happy to see these Dark Souls deep dives. Looking forward to the next one
Those colors and all the unfinished-ness feel like it could make an interesting lategame area w/ some meta elements.
Man, I love seeing stuff like this!
I will definitely check out those other videos in the description!
Maybe the Izalith Swamp framework actually lines up with swamps in other From Soft games, since we all know Miyazaki loves his swamps.
It makes a degree of sense, having an elevator from Firelink to the second Bell of Awakening, since there's one that goes to the first one. It's better the way it is though
It is always a treat to wake up to an illusory wall video, great job keep going
Dark Souls, illusory wall and Zullie the witch are truly the gifts that keep on giving.
To me one of the most impressive aspects of the world design is how, at least up to and including anor londo, it really feels like an ancient, mythical world you're discovering, rather than something constructed and cobbled together. Even with the knowledge of all the little secrets and examinations of the souls community.
Incredibly fascinating in-depth look at early dev and decision making!
I end up enjoying little details like the closed lever and gate at 3:10.
Having extra directions closed off creates the feeling of a bigger world outside that of our game space.
Edit: Ah, your suggestion right after that would be perfect 😄
Those long straight paths remind me of the ones still in the release version that are used for preloading zones that you may warp to. Maybe they knew about that early, and intended there to be a kind of cutscene travel than a physical realtime walking travel.
Also I'll be on the lookout for that weird not-kiln. Fun to see the "conclusion" of the Andre statue move.
I am replaying Dark Souls for about the thirtieth time or so and I was just wondering what could be beyond some of these walled off paths. A few playthroughs ago, I remember stumbling into an area I had never been before. It even had an item (just a soul consumable). It was the little side cave in The Valley of the Drakes if you're on the narrow little pass that goes down to the big undead dragon and the Blight Town exit (or entrance) and the New Londo Ruins entrance. It had me thinking that there could be other little areas I've just never noticed in the game. It took me fifteen or so playthroughs before I knew the covetous silver serpent ring (I think it is the silver and not the gold) was down in the Tomb of the Giants on that little area you have to jump to past patches and the first couple giant skeleton dog things. I also found two lootable corpses in the Demon Ruins near all the weird walking dragon asses. They both just had a couple of divine blessings, but I wondered if I had missed any more corpses out in the lava. Even after so many playthroughs, I still find new stuff or a new way of playing each time.
its been 3 years since the first and last "Retro Games Dissected" video... i loved that video about Gimmick!
I think "weak" areas like the valley of the drakes kinda add a bit of realism to the interconnected design. All these places are built and designed (in world) by different people at different times. They may be really well designed in themselves but don't necessarily fit into the designs of others.
Valley of the drakes has that kind of feel, it feels like it became a path out of necessity and ease rather than design.
Although side note I've also often wondered if before new Londo was sealed that water used to flow into and fill that valley, allowing trade by river
how have i only just now learned of the dev message with guidance at 27:00 like are there more of these I've just never heard of? love how i still get to learn things about this game
It's pretty cool, right? Unfortunately the later games really scaled this back. Dark Souls 2 still has hidden developer messages, but instead of having customized messages, there's just one stock one that's placed in front of every illusory wall. It's helpful for finding them so it's arguably more functional as a utility, but once you realize it's perfectly 1:1 with all of the illusory walls, it loses some magic because they never have anything interesting to say. The developer messages in Dark Souls 1 are lot more interesting because there aren't any repeats, I made a list of them here:
darksouls.wikidot.com/seek-guidance
Dark Souls 3 has some as well, just a lot less IIRC.