Thank you for showing both versions. I looking forward more of these double/triple versions. I agree with you, comparing who is better, is beside the point. One can prefer a version to another, or artistic style to another, and that's fine. Like Tarja and Floor have different styles, Jukka and Kai have too. Tarja is elegant, almost majestic and mostly operatic (but not always) Floor is the storyteller that takes you (and the others thousands of people in the audience) to sit down around the fire to tell you a story (Marko does that too). Jukka is always ready to ride, even when not playing he's swaying in antipacition. Kai is like a human metronome, almost never miss a bit. Kai is really good at adapting his drum style to Nightwish - and he plays a different style with Wintersun. If you don't know Wintersun and want to see Kai exceed, then I suggest reacting or reviewing if you already know the song: Sons of Winter and Stars (TIME | Live Rehearsals) www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjIob3V1-XuAhUvzIUKHa0NDB8QyCkwAHoECAUQAw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DTl5T-glTdXw&usg=AOvVaw2XJ66xkM8Cnm7NFvpJMVJK
I have Wintersun on my list for if/when I get into reactions videos! And you sum it up beautifully... we can be fans of all of the members past and present. It's allowed. No need to take sides. They are all wonderful! So I have a couple more of these double, maybe triple features in mind!
First, i am Floored . Second i am a Tarja follower .my opinon, the different between Floor and Tarja, Floor is a Storyteller on Stage, like Freddie Mercury
Thanks for the informative and enlightening review. I actually never listened to the two versions in short succession, so I took it granted that they are almost identical except for the voice of the singer. You helped me notice that the later version is close to a full reinterpretation. Armed with this discovery, I came to realize that I feel differently about them: I now hear the Buenos Aires version as artistically more complete and clear, while the original version comes across for me as being more sincere. This song being, as you noted, perhaps the first major lyrical/emotional work of Tuomas telling about himself, I now prefer the older version. We might or might not agree upon this, but again as you said, UA-cam (the internet) should be large enough to afford different opinions. I just wish more people would take this view. (Sorry, my schedule today did not allow me to chat/meet you. Perhaps, some other time.)
I did not feel that the Buenos Aires version lacked sincerity. If anything the sincerity and emotion of the meaning is conveyed poignantly and beautifully. The BA version gave a fuller and greater level of depth to the interpretation of this very personal and deep, work of art from Tuomas.
I never was a part of the violent love one hate the other "Must cHoOse eiTheR Floor or Tarja" battle, they are both epic singers, but i PREFER Floor in most of the songs i hear that were done by both Tarja and Floor, cause she just brings so much emotion into it that Tarja just didnt. I love this live performance of Dead Boy's Poem, its beautiful.
In a similar situation, I was a fan of the band when Tarja was the singer, and a fan of Floor from After Forever and enjoy them both. However I find Floor seems to really convey the emotions of the songs and lyrics in way very few other singers do.
Just a question, could the 2018 version be a maturing of the composer and musicians, as they are now 18 years older and have a new singer. It sounds to me that it was re-imagined beautifully to suit the band in their new iteration. I really loved both versions.
That's certainly possible to some degree (of course, only Tuomas and Emppu are still there from the original line-up!) I feel Tuomas has diversified much more since the Wishmaster album, and every new member brings new influences. Marko's skills on that double-necked guitar, Troy's folk influence, Kai's less heavy-hitting, more technical style of playing, and pulling back a little leaves more space for Floor's vocals. So I guess a few things come together there! Both probably the most fitting versions for the line-ups at the time!
This was a really good review. Loved it. Very nice analysis of the changes, and nice too see ggevywo versions. Why have I not come across you before. Subscribed. More NW please. NWA UK Eastern signing out for now and off to check out your other videos. Did I hear you mention High Hopes? Yes, thought so...
mayby was the version with floor the version that tuomas had in mind and react only to floor or tarja but not both they are differend singers and i,m more than 20 years fan of floor
I quite like Elaine Young's idea (see comments here)! I'm guessing that Tuomas diversified more with time and with the numerous changes in line-up between 2000 and 2018 he was ready for a change in the arrangement. Both wonderful versions, I believe. And it's exactly because they are different singers with different styles that it's worth looking at both! Not as a comparison to find a winner but to appreciate both of them!
"If you read this line, remember not the hand the wrote it" Inspired by Shakespeare's Sonnet 71 "Nay, if you read this line, remember not The hand that writ it" "I live no more to shame, nor me, nor you" is from Sonnet 72. Floor spread her arms and the audience knows exactly what to do.
I like both and even Anette did a decent job. Master ofI love the fact that Flor and Tarja are friends.. They did an Instagram together , Tarja got a hold of Floor. I think that Floor looks regal just standing there with her arms spread out wide. She was still a little sick at the concert. You also have Troy in this also. I like that the fans are saying Floor's name. I just wondering if you think Marco has spread his vocal wings with Floor more than with Tarja
Yes, I remember reading (was it Elvenjig/Elvenpath?) that Floor was unwell that day. Unbelievable! Yes, I hope to do a video soon with more Troy in it :-) On Marko's vocals: I can't say that for sure. Since Floor stays on stage the whole time to provide Marko with backing vocals for the songs where he sings lead, which the previous voalists used to take a break, it leaves him less room to improvise because there are fixed backings. With High Hopes, for example, that was his to sing and no need to take Tarja into account. And as a backing vocalist, he ended up singing fewer parts with Floor (see my review of "Ever Dream") than he used to with the others. But did he have more fun with Floor? It's hard to say how he felt along the line!
Floor is not only a great singer, but also an awesome storyteller (which is hard in full opera, because Floor can do that) This version is more about the lyrics, than the full blown instruments.
Playing both versions is a commendable effort. Particulars are indeed significant for each listener and for me the second version is exquisite. The first was a much leaner and less sophisticated or expansive and shorter on storytelling. For me there was nothing uncertain in Floors early portion rather it expressed vulnerability and for good reason where the earlier take was pretty monochromatic and absent of the emotion and thereby enjoyment. The boys inflections are also quite different and huskier that the first, also an improvement for me. It’s completely understandable, the band has had many years to perfect the message and few singers have the acrobatic capabilities and the assured intuition that Floor brings to the table. It’s great that you plan to involve Annette as I see her style as pivotal to the bands growth.
Definitely! I have huge respect for all members past and present, so Anette has to be included! Just trying to decide which live performance of hers to look at first - any suggestions there?
Perhaps Poet and the Pendulum live 2008 is one of the better ones, there are not many strong clean videos I’ve ever found. She is a bit swallowed up but her style fits well enough as with Scaretale, Storytime and the more popular sounding styles.
@Skeptical I had considered a triple review of Storytime with Anette, Floor, Denver Debacle... we'll see whether I get that adventurous when the time comes :-D
Greetings to Canada, and thanks for the suggestion! Right now I'm focussing more on reviews of songs I'm familiar with rather than reactions to new material. But that may change once the channel has found its feet!
@@mariaelenasanchezyanez690 I personally prefer Tarja and think that Simone sings better than Floor, but that is just a personal opinion. And "out of this world" is an expression I am very careful with because there so much in this world that I haven't heard yet.
Maybe you also have to watch Floor with her first band ‘After Forever’ especially ‘Follow the Cry’ live at Pinkpop (2004) Because of the subject there are some dark parts with it. So I hope it will not scares you out. ua-cam.com/video/BNZvf0aur8o/v-deo.html Lyrics: I presume you to look deeply into the lyrics before watching the song.
I remember having heard a few of their songs about 15 years ago and liking them, but never really doing a deep dive. Could be good for reaction videos sometime soon!
One of my favorite songs by Nightwish. The 2008 performance is wonderful and so delicate and hauntingly beautiful. There is a very interesting theatrical element happening when Tarja is looking upward as if to be listening to a voice from above. I love and miss Jukka very much. However I do not care for the drum change in the build up. I think it is out of place in this song and takes away from the impact of the transition, making it too disjointed for the length of this section. I also prefer the dramatic ending of the 2018 arrangement. Too many songs live, have a crash and burn ending and this song does not need it. The 2018 version is so much better in my opinion. Perhaps it is partially due to the recording and video production? Floor's "uncertainty" as you call it in my opinion adds a vulnerability and beauty to the opening section. Once again I feel it helps to allow for the song to develop in a more logical sequence with more room to build to a powerful climax. I don't miss the pinched harmonic in this song. It is more of a aggressive metal technique and I don't think this song calls for that approach. I personally think that Emppu has matured in his approach to playing and is more song focused. I have even heard him express this in interviews. The arrangement on the 2018 version is far superior IMHO. It slowly progresses to a powerful and dramatic climax. Floor's belting technique at the end is so impressive and done with such dramatically emotional effect. Obviously, Tuomas has much more instrumental talent available for this arrangement. Marko is a superb finger style guitarist and brings this element to the front of the music and sustains it for all of the verses. His bass sound and playing in my opinion is also far superior to Sammy's. Sammy was solid, but average both bass sound wise and skill level. Then you add Troy to the mix. Yes, it does add a touch of folk to the song, but the strumming effect also keeps the forward movement and urgency within the song structure. In addition Tuomas' keyboard sounds and programs have come a long way since 2008. They are much more lush and realistic sounding. In regard to your opinion about backing tracks, I do not mind them. I even actually love them for the orchestral instruments, the sound effects, and the spoken parts. However, if there are backing vocals (outside of choirs), I personally do not like them to be to prominent in the mix. They need to be done very subtly in a supportive way and not be discernable as a second lead vocal. I paid to see great musicians perform, not to listen to studio recordings in an arena atmosphere. If you have ever heard Def Leppard live you will hear backing vocal tracks that are nauseatingly loud and amateurish. If you cannot pull it off well enough live, please don't do it on the record. Then there was Boston! Amazing vocally on studio recordings, but live they paled in comparison and it ruined the live experience. If a band wants to focus on a powerful harmonic vocal presence, please get the appropriate talent to pull it off live, at least somewhat like the recording. Many groups have accomplished this and it is great, but too much reliability on backing vocal tracks is like hearing a Madonna or Beyoncé performance or such. I wouldn't waste my time or money. Some of the backing vocal tracks on "End of an Era" are far too loud and sound tacky in my opinion. Once again Respect for Tarja. She was young at the time as was Tuomas. You can really hear how far Tuomas has come in his songwriting and arrangement skills since those first records. Don't get me wrong, I love some of those early songs like "Elvenpath", almost everything on "Ocean Born", half of Wishmaster", Bless the Child", "Ever Dream', & "The Phantom" off Century Child, and of course my favorite overall Tarja recording "Once". However, most of them sound much better live with slightly altered musical arrangements. As much as I love and respect Kai's talent and ability, I do miss Jukka's energy and the body driven swing style to his playing. Very unique and underrated in my opinion. I also will greatly miss Marko. His bass sound is monstrous and he is such a talented storyteller and master musician. I hope for the best, but fear the end of Nightwish is drawing nearer. Tuomas is branching out and maturing and I think he has other musical dreams to pursue. Floor is actively exploring a solo career for after Nightwish. Let us all hope for at least 2 more Nightwish records before old age sets in. Metal and rock music in general is for the young at heart with big dreams to pursue. With maturity comes children, responsibilities, and no love for the long road of touring. 🙏🙏🙏🎶🎶🎶😊😊😊🤘🤘🤘☝
So many great thoughts in here! I can't respond to all of them straight away but wanted to show appreciation for the time you took in writing all this down! I'll come back to you when I get a chance!
Do you not feel that the timbre of the boy's voice is different in the two videos? In the second, it sounds more like the boy in Beauty of the Beast. In the first one, it sounds slightly speeded up to raise it to a pre-pubescent pitch. I think the only thing that disappoints me about the 2000 performance is that it sounds really compressed, so the critical parts of the song lose a bit of the visceral impact that they have in the later video because the dynamics are not there. Anyway, keep it up. Enjoyable reactions and I look forward to more. PS please do Tarja singing Swanheart - that song gets ignored way too often.
I love Swanheart! It's going on the list! Yes, the quality just wasn't back the same 20 years ago... but still good enough to work with! Re. the boy: To me, he sounds like an older man in "Beauty of the Beast". Back when I first heard them, I thought it might have been the boy's father in BotB (because of the accent and speaking manner being so similar)! I don't think they can have sped up all those parts - it wouldn't have fit with the timing in the song in the same places as well any more. But perhaps it was a pitch shifter? That'd keep the timing the same but alter the timbre. Will perhaps investigate this more when I look at BotB (sadly no great quality live clips of this one, but can't leave it out)!
@@andyjonesofficial Yeah, pitch shift more likely. It just sounds different to me between the two videos. Check Guylain Prince's channel - he did BotB a couple of months back and found a lyric video (studio version) and a live version (not good quality). My only issue with live BotB is that it's one of the three songs that _have_ to fade out (or, rather, recede into the distance) and you can't really achieve that live. (The other two are Epitaph and Stargazer. In pretty much every other case, fading a song out is a cop-out - IMO)
@@AnOldGreyDog I keep meaning to look into him more! It's tough because I really should wait until I've reviewed a performance before I take in someone else's view! So maybe I'll do mine and then see what he thinks! I'm in agreement with you on fade-outs - although they found a reasonable enough way of solving it live. But I'm getting ahead of myself... ;-)
@@andyjonesofficial Excellent. I won't be able to get to it till later on or maybe tomorrow, but I'll definitely check it out. It's one of my favourite NW songs.
I really love Floor but i also love Tarja already since the late 90s and this song for me is just one of her signature songs (for me), the other are "Sleeping Sun" and "Walking in the air" and the were written or arranged for her and they are just perfect magic and beauty. I prefer Floor on GLS and Ever Dream for example .. but not on these ballads. But i can really understand that people who didn't knew Nightwish already from the beginning prefer Floor in general.
I did know Nightish from if not the beginning certainly the Tarja era but personally prefer Floor on pretty much everything she has done. For me I find her a better storyteller and really conveys the emotion of each song and lyrics better. I can understand someone familiar with Tarja distinctive style preferring that if that's what they got to know first. I have bands who changed the singer where I just really prefer the original not because the new singer is worse but I really liked the original singers distinctive sound and can totally see how a Nightwish fan could feel tahg way. I think the fighting amongst the fans is really a very tiny minority, most Nightwish fans I've interacted with a quire happy to accept other fans have different opinions and most enjoy stuff by all the singers.
@@101Mant "I think the fighting amongst the fans is really a very tiny minority" I couldn't agree with you more. Unfortunately, that tiny minority seems to be very loud on the internet.
@@MsCatstaff Totally agree with both of you here! So the more friendly comments come in to compensate for the haters, the better! So thank you all for the kind input!
@@101Mant Yeah, in the end i'm totally fine with Floor, find her better on a lot song and even the ones i prefer from Tarja are still great in Floors version. So its a total different thing like with Anette where most Tarja songs were really NOT good, or with a band like Marillion where i really was a big fan of Fish (saw them live twice with ish) and i just couldn't stand the new singer at all. I still really loved Steven Rotherys guitar, but that was not enough.
Because of the way Floor sings it she is much more connected to the song, she makes you feel it. Tarja has a great voice but the way she sings feels disconnected, at least for me you don't feel the emotion the way you do with Floor.
I was listening Nightwish 20 years ago, and Tarja is what makes Nightwish Nightwish. I can understand all the new fans that they like Floor and Nightwish can consider themselves lucky to have gotten such a great singer again, especially after the Anette era. But I am an old man who is in his 40s now and Tarja has always been the special factor that made Nightwish unique. And in direct comparison, I prefer Simone Simons over Floor Jansen, but that's not a matter of quality which is in both cases supreme, but a matter of personal taste. Btw., have you already heard of Epica, Andy?
I've not quite hit 40 yet, but I basically see it the same way! Nightwish have a fantastic vocalist now. And they had a fantastic vocalist then. We can appreciate both :-) I've heard Simone sing with Kamelot as well as the Sancta Terra duet with Floor and she was wonderful! I've not done a deep dive into Epica yet. Maybe it's time!
Hearing Tarja sing this reinforces my opinion of her singing. I really do not like he highly operatic style, the only one of her vocals that I do like is "Phantom of the Opera". I far prefer Floor singing the Nightwish songs.
Thank you for showing both versions. I looking forward more of these double/triple versions. I agree with you, comparing who is better, is beside the point. One can prefer a version to another, or artistic style to another, and that's fine. Like Tarja and Floor have different styles, Jukka and Kai have too. Tarja is elegant, almost majestic and mostly operatic (but not always) Floor is the storyteller that takes you (and the others thousands of people in the audience) to sit down around the fire to tell you a story (Marko does that too).
Jukka is always ready to ride, even when not playing he's swaying in antipacition. Kai is like a human metronome, almost never miss a bit. Kai is really good at adapting his drum style to Nightwish - and he plays a different style with Wintersun. If you don't know Wintersun and want to see Kai exceed, then I suggest reacting or reviewing if you already know the song: Sons of Winter and Stars (TIME | Live Rehearsals) www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwjIob3V1-XuAhUvzIUKHa0NDB8QyCkwAHoECAUQAw&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DTl5T-glTdXw&usg=AOvVaw2XJ66xkM8Cnm7NFvpJMVJK
I have Wintersun on my list for if/when I get into reactions videos! And you sum it up beautifully... we can be fans of all of the members past and present. It's allowed. No need to take sides. They are all wonderful! So I have a couple more of these double, maybe triple features in mind!
Guylain words 😉
@@dorodr1513 I've googled this but can't find out what it means :-D Help me out?
WannaBeDane wrote same words about Floor that used Guylain Prince in his analysis of Sleeping Sun
I'm new to review videos - is this the monk that I've heard about who analyses lyrics and performances in separate videos?
First, i am Floored . Second i am a Tarja follower .my opinon, the different between Floor and Tarja, Floor is a Storyteller on Stage, like Freddie Mercury
Thanks for the informative and enlightening review. I actually never listened to the two versions in short succession, so I took it granted that they are almost identical except for the voice of the singer. You helped me notice that the later version is close to a full reinterpretation. Armed with this discovery, I came to realize that I feel differently about them: I now hear the Buenos Aires version as artistically more complete and clear, while the original version comes across for me as being more sincere. This song being, as you noted, perhaps the first major lyrical/emotional work of Tuomas telling about himself, I now prefer the older version. We might or might not agree upon this, but again as you said, UA-cam (the internet) should be large enough to afford different opinions. I just wish more people would take this view. (Sorry, my schedule today did not allow me to chat/meet you. Perhaps, some other time.)
I did not feel that the Buenos Aires version lacked sincerity. If anything the sincerity and emotion of the meaning is conveyed poignantly and beautifully. The BA version gave a fuller and greater level of depth to the interpretation of this very personal and deep, work of art from Tuomas.
@@SuperMoofie I fully respect your impression of the BA version. "UA-cam (the internet) should be large enough ..."
good review again!
I never was a part of the violent love one hate the other "Must cHoOse eiTheR Floor or Tarja" battle, they are both epic singers, but i PREFER Floor in most of the songs i hear that were done by both Tarja and Floor, cause she just brings so much emotion into it that Tarja just didnt. I love this live performance of Dead Boy's Poem, its beautiful.
In a similar situation, I was a fan of the band when Tarja was the singer, and a fan of Floor from After Forever and enjoy them both. However I find Floor seems to really convey the emotions of the songs and lyrics in way very few other singers do.
Tarja is great but not really a part of Nightwish, Floor is a Nightwish member as the other great members all in service of the song.
Just a question, could the 2018 version be a maturing of the composer and musicians, as they are now 18 years older and have a new singer. It sounds to me that it was re-imagined beautifully to suit the band in their new iteration. I really loved both versions.
That's certainly possible to some degree (of course, only Tuomas and Emppu are still there from the original line-up!) I feel Tuomas has diversified much more since the Wishmaster album, and every new member brings new influences. Marko's skills on that double-necked guitar, Troy's folk influence, Kai's less heavy-hitting, more technical style of playing, and pulling back a little leaves more space for Floor's vocals. So I guess a few things come together there! Both probably the most fitting versions for the line-ups at the time!
Agree completely, Elaine, a 'better' version from a more mature band!
This was a really good review. Loved it.
Very nice analysis of the changes, and nice too see ggevywo versions.
Why have I not come across you before.
Subscribed.
More NW please.
NWA UK Eastern signing out for now and off to check out your other videos. Did I hear you mention High Hopes? Yes, thought so...
Great review! Thank you!
Now that’s what I believe qualifies for ambitious. Best of luck, lots of energy there.
mayby was the version with floor the version that tuomas had in mind and react only to floor or tarja but not both they are differend singers and i,m more than 20 years fan of floor
I quite like Elaine Young's idea (see comments here)! I'm guessing that Tuomas diversified more with time and with the numerous changes in line-up between 2000 and 2018 he was ready for a change in the arrangement. Both wonderful versions, I believe. And it's exactly because they are different singers with different styles that it's worth looking at both! Not as a comparison to find a winner but to appreciate both of them!
Wikipedia credits Emppu with "guitars" - which is plural. He could've been playing the acoustic guitar at the beginning of the Tarja version.
RIP dear Andy, we miss you.
Very interesting, thank you. I would love to see your review of "Bless the child"... hope you do it... Thanks again.
Should be on the way in the next couple of weeks!
"If you read this line, remember not the hand the wrote it" Inspired by Shakespeare's Sonnet 71 "Nay, if you read this line, remember not
The hand that writ it"
"I live no more to shame, nor me, nor you" is from Sonnet 72.
Floor spread her arms and the audience knows exactly what to do.
I like both and even Anette did a decent job. Master ofI love the fact that Flor and Tarja are friends.. They did an Instagram together , Tarja got a hold of Floor. I think that Floor looks regal just standing there with her arms spread out wide. She was still a little sick at the concert. You also have Troy in this also. I like that the fans are saying Floor's name. I just wondering if you think Marco has spread his vocal wings with Floor more than with Tarja
Yes, I remember reading (was it Elvenjig/Elvenpath?) that Floor was unwell that day. Unbelievable! Yes, I hope to do a video soon with more Troy in it :-) On Marko's vocals: I can't say that for sure. Since Floor stays on stage the whole time to provide Marko with backing vocals for the songs where he sings lead, which the previous voalists used to take a break, it leaves him less room to improvise because there are fixed backings. With High Hopes, for example, that was his to sing and no need to take Tarja into account. And as a backing vocalist, he ended up singing fewer parts with Floor (see my review of "Ever Dream") than he used to with the others. But did he have more fun with Floor? It's hard to say how he felt along the line!
Floor is not only a great singer, but also an awesome storyteller (which is hard in full opera, because Floor can do that)
This version is more about the lyrics, than the full blown instruments.
Playing both versions is a commendable effort.
Particulars are indeed significant for each listener and for me the second version is exquisite.
The first was a much leaner and less sophisticated or expansive and shorter on storytelling.
For me there was nothing uncertain in Floors early portion rather it expressed vulnerability and for good reason where the earlier take was pretty monochromatic and absent of the emotion and thereby enjoyment.
The boys inflections are also quite different and huskier that the first, also an improvement for me.
It’s completely understandable, the band has had many years to perfect the message and few singers have the acrobatic capabilities and the assured intuition that Floor brings to the table.
It’s great that you plan to involve Annette as I see her style as pivotal to the bands growth.
Definitely! I have huge respect for all members past and present, so Anette has to be included! Just trying to decide which live performance of hers to look at first - any suggestions there?
Perhaps Poet and the Pendulum live 2008 is one of the better ones, there are not many strong clean videos I’ve ever found. She is a bit swallowed up but her style fits well enough as with Scaretale, Storytime and the more popular sounding styles.
@Skeptical I had considered a triple review of Storytime with Anette, Floor, Denver Debacle... we'll see whether I get that adventurous when the time comes :-D
Greeting Sir! My today's suggestion is a brand new Industrial/Metal song called "We Died In 2012", by French Canadian artists named So-Fi.
Link: ua-cam.com/video/rFwZcGmzNY0/v-deo.html
Greetings to Canada, and thanks for the suggestion! Right now I'm focussing more on reviews of songs I'm familiar with rather than reactions to new material. But that may change once the channel has found its feet!
@@andyjonesofficial No problem!
Tarja is so good,but Floor is beautiful and powerful version
Have you heard Tarja lately? 😂
@@Nikioko yes i heard Tarja singing in Argentina, she is amazing but Floor is out the world .
@@mariaelenasanchezyanez690 I personally prefer Tarja and think that Simone sings better than Floor, but that is just a personal opinion. And "out of this world" is an expression I am very careful with because there so much in this world that I haven't heard yet.
@@Nikioko i respect you opinion,
Maybe you also have to watch Floor with her first band ‘After Forever’ especially ‘Follow the Cry’ live at Pinkpop (2004) Because of the subject there are some dark parts with it. So I hope it will not scares you out. ua-cam.com/video/BNZvf0aur8o/v-deo.html
Lyrics: I presume you to look deeply into the lyrics before watching the song.
I remember having heard a few of their songs about 15 years ago and liking them, but never really doing a deep dive. Could be good for reaction videos sometime soon!
One of my favorite songs by Nightwish. The 2008 performance is wonderful and so delicate and hauntingly beautiful. There is a very interesting theatrical element happening when Tarja is looking upward as if to be listening to a voice from above. I love and miss Jukka very much. However I do not care for the drum change in the build up. I think it is out of place in this song and takes away from the impact of the transition, making it too disjointed for the length of this section. I also prefer the dramatic ending of the 2018 arrangement. Too many songs live, have a crash and burn ending and this song does not need it.
The 2018 version is so much better in my opinion. Perhaps it is partially due to the recording and video production? Floor's "uncertainty" as you call it in my opinion adds a vulnerability and beauty to the opening section. Once again I feel it helps to allow for the song to develop in a more logical sequence with more room to build to a powerful climax. I don't miss the pinched harmonic in this song. It is more of a aggressive metal technique and I don't think this song calls for that approach. I personally think that Emppu has matured in his approach to playing and is more song focused. I have even heard him express this in interviews. The arrangement on the 2018 version is far superior IMHO. It slowly progresses to a powerful and dramatic climax. Floor's belting technique at the end is so impressive and done with such dramatically emotional effect. Obviously, Tuomas has much more instrumental talent available for this arrangement. Marko is a superb finger style guitarist and brings this element to the front of the music and sustains it for all of the verses. His bass sound and playing in my opinion is also far superior to Sammy's. Sammy was solid, but average both bass sound wise and skill level. Then you add Troy to the mix. Yes, it does add a touch of folk to the song, but the strumming effect also keeps the forward movement and urgency within the song structure. In addition Tuomas' keyboard sounds and programs have come a long way since 2008. They are much more lush and realistic sounding. In regard to your opinion about backing tracks, I do not mind them. I even actually love them for the orchestral instruments, the sound effects, and the spoken parts. However, if there are backing vocals (outside of choirs), I personally do not like them to be to prominent in the mix. They need to be done very subtly in a supportive way and not be discernable as a second lead vocal. I paid to see great musicians perform, not to listen to studio recordings in an arena atmosphere. If you have ever heard Def Leppard live you will hear backing vocal tracks that are nauseatingly loud and amateurish. If you cannot pull it off well enough live, please don't do it on the record. Then there was Boston! Amazing vocally on studio recordings, but live they paled in comparison and it ruined the live experience. If a band wants to focus on a powerful harmonic vocal presence, please get the appropriate talent to pull it off live, at least somewhat like the recording. Many groups have accomplished this and it is great, but too much reliability on backing vocal tracks is like hearing a Madonna or Beyoncé performance or such. I wouldn't waste my time or money.
Some of the backing vocal tracks on "End of an Era" are far too loud and sound tacky in my opinion. Once again Respect for Tarja. She was young at the time as was Tuomas. You can really hear how far Tuomas has come in his songwriting and arrangement skills since those first records. Don't get me wrong, I love some of those early songs like "Elvenpath", almost everything on "Ocean Born", half of Wishmaster", Bless the Child", "Ever Dream', & "The Phantom" off Century Child, and of course my favorite overall Tarja recording "Once". However, most of them sound much better live with slightly altered musical arrangements.
As much as I love and respect Kai's talent and ability, I do miss Jukka's energy and the body driven swing style to his playing. Very unique and underrated in my opinion. I also will greatly miss Marko. His bass sound is monstrous and he is such a talented storyteller and master musician. I hope for the best, but fear the end of Nightwish is drawing nearer. Tuomas is branching out and maturing and I think he has other musical dreams to pursue. Floor is actively exploring a solo career for after Nightwish. Let us all hope for at least 2 more Nightwish records before old age sets in. Metal and rock music in general is for the young at heart with big dreams to pursue. With maturity comes children, responsibilities, and no love for the long road of touring. 🙏🙏🙏🎶🎶🎶😊😊😊🤘🤘🤘☝
So many great thoughts in here! I can't respond to all of them straight away but wanted to show appreciation for the time you took in writing all this down! I'll come back to you when I get a chance!
That s why i am fearing that Marko won t come back...😞😩😢
2001 version forever
Why did Emppu did that finger thing towards the end of the solo, like saying "come on"? Was he disappointed with the sustain of the note?
I think he was just teasing a little more out of it... He was still smiling so I don't see him as being unhappy with it!
Do you not feel that the timbre of the boy's voice is different in the two videos? In the second, it sounds more like the boy in Beauty of the Beast. In the first one, it sounds slightly speeded up to raise it to a pre-pubescent pitch.
I think the only thing that disappoints me about the 2000 performance is that it sounds really compressed, so the critical parts of the song lose a bit of the visceral impact that they have in the later video because the dynamics are not there.
Anyway, keep it up. Enjoyable reactions and I look forward to more.
PS please do Tarja singing Swanheart - that song gets ignored way too often.
I love Swanheart! It's going on the list! Yes, the quality just wasn't back the same 20 years ago... but still good enough to work with!
Re. the boy: To me, he sounds like an older man in "Beauty of the Beast". Back when I first heard them, I thought it might have been the boy's father in BotB (because of the accent and speaking manner being so similar)! I don't think they can have sped up all those parts - it wouldn't have fit with the timing in the song in the same places as well any more. But perhaps it was a pitch shifter? That'd keep the timing the same but alter the timbre. Will perhaps investigate this more when I look at BotB (sadly no great quality live clips of this one, but can't leave it out)!
@@andyjonesofficial Yeah, pitch shift more likely. It just sounds different to me between the two videos.
Check Guylain Prince's channel - he did BotB a couple of months back and found a lyric video (studio version) and a live version (not good quality).
My only issue with live BotB is that it's one of the three songs that _have_ to fade out (or, rather, recede into the distance) and you can't really achieve that live.
(The other two are Epitaph and Stargazer. In pretty much every other case, fading a song out is a cop-out - IMO)
@@AnOldGreyDog I keep meaning to look into him more! It's tough because I really should wait until I've reviewed a performance before I take in someone else's view! So maybe I'll do mine and then see what he thinks! I'm in agreement with you on fade-outs - although they found a reasonable enough way of solving it live. But I'm getting ahead of myself... ;-)
My Beauty of the Beast review goes online tonight - interested to see what you think!
@@andyjonesofficial Excellent. I won't be able to get to it till later on or maybe tomorrow, but I'll definitely check it out. It's one of my favourite NW songs.
I really love Floor but i also love Tarja already since the late 90s and this song for me is just one of her signature songs (for me), the other are "Sleeping Sun" and "Walking in the air" and the were written or arranged for her and they are just perfect magic and beauty.
I prefer Floor on GLS and Ever Dream for example .. but not on these ballads. But i can really understand that people who didn't knew Nightwish already from the beginning prefer Floor in general.
I love both singers on Sleeping Sun! Had that in mind for another double reaction :-)
I did know Nightish from if not the beginning certainly the Tarja era but personally prefer Floor on pretty much everything she has done. For me I find her a better storyteller and really conveys the emotion of each song and lyrics better. I can understand someone familiar with Tarja distinctive style preferring that if that's what they got to know first. I have bands who changed the singer where I just really prefer the original not because the new singer is worse but I really liked the original singers distinctive sound and can totally see how a Nightwish fan could feel tahg way.
I think the fighting amongst the fans is really a very tiny minority, most Nightwish fans I've interacted with a quire happy to accept other fans have different opinions and most enjoy stuff by all the singers.
@@101Mant "I think the fighting amongst the fans is really a very tiny minority" I couldn't agree with you more. Unfortunately, that tiny minority seems to be very loud on the internet.
@@MsCatstaff Totally agree with both of you here! So the more friendly comments come in to compensate for the haters, the better! So thank you all for the kind input!
@@101Mant Yeah, in the end i'm totally fine with Floor, find her better on a lot song and even the ones i prefer from Tarja are still great in Floors version.
So its a total different thing like with Anette where most Tarja songs were really NOT good, or with a band like Marillion where i really was a big fan of Fish (saw them live twice with ish) and i just couldn't stand the new singer at all. I still really loved Steven Rotherys guitar, but that was not enough.
Because of the way Floor sings it she is much more connected to the song, she makes you feel it. Tarja has a great voice but the way she sings feels disconnected, at least for me you don't feel the emotion the way you do with Floor.
exactly how I feel
Now Floor version :) saludos
It's the second half of this video! ;-)
Floor Jansen is best singer
@@Super007Art yes , the best and most versatility singer on the planet
Rallentando?
Floor is at another level.
I was listening Nightwish 20 years ago, and Tarja is what makes Nightwish Nightwish. I can understand all the new fans that they like Floor and Nightwish can consider themselves lucky to have gotten such a great singer again, especially after the Anette era. But I am an old man who is in his 40s now and Tarja has always been the special factor that made Nightwish unique.
And in direct comparison, I prefer Simone Simons over Floor Jansen, but that's not a matter of quality which is in both cases supreme, but a matter of personal taste.
Btw., have you already heard of Epica, Andy?
I've not quite hit 40 yet, but I basically see it the same way! Nightwish have a fantastic vocalist now. And they had a fantastic vocalist then. We can appreciate both :-) I've heard Simone sing with Kamelot as well as the Sancta Terra duet with Floor and she was wonderful! I've not done a deep dive into Epica yet. Maybe it's time!
Sorry about the comparison but Floor really puts so much more power and emotion into this song. I love Tarja, but Floor is the Queen.
yelling louder does not mean better mate, this one is not a good one for Floor
Hearing Tarja sing this reinforces my opinion of her singing. I really do not like he highly operatic style, the only one of her vocals that I do like is "Phantom of the Opera". I far prefer Floor singing the Nightwish songs.
For me nightwish died when Tarja left
Sad to hear that!