Curly, Jimmy, and Mouthwashing's Message
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- Опубліковано 10 лют 2025
- what if instead of mouthwashing it was called freakywashing
Gameplay footage taken from @thegamearchivist
Fan animations taken from @JoetasticOfficial
Thumbnail was drawn by me
All the music is from the mouthwashing ost
Mouthwashing is made by Wrong Organ
Equipment:
Editing: CapCut
Audio: Shure sm57 + Audacity
Drawing program: Photoshop
Drawing Tablet: XP Pen Artist 15.6 Pro
Curly: Don't let kindness be blindness to wrongdoing.
Jimmy: Don't use 'responsibility' as a shield for accountability. 'Fixing' your wrongs doesn't make them right.
More like “Yes, you have to take responsibility. Yes, you need to make things right, the proper way. But you need to lower your expectations that ‘fixing’/ ‘making amends’ for your wrongs can make someone forgive you/ make things between you right.” Or TLDR: “You can be more than your mistakes. You can forgive yourself. But you shouldn’t expect someone to easily forgive you.”
@nataleynakata3687 Yeah, that's more what I meant. Jimmy used the mantra of 'taking responsibility' as a workaround to being held accountable. He had this idea that if he could 'fix' the harm he'd done, it somehow would absolve him into some net-neutral moral standing.
Curly did not turn a blind eye on jimbob for the sake of being kind, he's just taking things soft, too soft in fact
Messages of the game:
Don't be clueless.
Take responsibility for your mistakes.
Listen to your friends, they might need your help.
Don't act too late.
Finally someone puts it into words 😁👍 totally agree
I don't think that's it, just my personal opinion. I don't need anyone responding to me because I won't see it.
@@averagecoffeeaddict Alr👍
And don't be an enabler.
And that some people around us are just terrible people
Despite what people may say about Curly and his mistakes, Curly is the one burnt up on a hospital bed, after sacrificing himself to save his crew. He cared despite his flaws.
And through all that, Yimpy still hurts him...
he cared but his inaction is why he had to sacrifice himself
And did he save them..?
@andjelabozic2317 he tried and they were alive for a while
He was still a bystander. Maybe he didn't deserve to be burnt up but now he gets to be a permanent bystander. You can't be friends with everyone and I think that's a core flaw in Curlys personality.
Yesss someone else that agrees that Swansea chasing Jimmy with the axe was a hallucination. Swansea’s already accepted since they found the mouthwash that he was going to die on that ship. The only thing he cared about was getting Daisuke in the cryopod and he told Jimmy to get in there himself bc nothing mattered to him anymore. It’s only through Jimmy’s pov that we see his anxiety about Swansea with the axe and the only person with that concern was him.
You have a keen eye. Jimmy's emotionally intelligent, in spite of his apparent intellectual short-sightedness. Jimmy is capable of discerning right from wrong, but he falls victim to his own wounded pride.
Honestly I like curly as a character, but because I was like Anya and I have family like curly I can’t help but hate / love him. It’s conflicting in every way. The person who was Jimmy in my life got no repercussions and the Curly’s of my life rather keep peace than protect me even now. This game hurts me to my very core but I can’t help but love this game for that.
This is very much like me too.
I noticed their "friendship" dynamic early on when I watched people play. It reminded me a lot of what I went through with friends, with behavior that hurt me and that I now recognize.
And that it's difficult to stand up to these people, break off your friendship and realize what they've done to you. Not everyone does.
So many people immediately blame themselves and believe their abusers are right, their mental health declining until they can't get out. Or they start normalizing it - that it's only sometimes this way, not noticing that it shifted to often or always. "They are usually good people, it was difficult for them."
Excuses, pity and the Fixer attitude. Thinking that this is normal. And paying dearly for it.
Really glad to have finally come across a video pointing out and analyzing Jackass and Curly's messed up relationship. Not only is Jimbo manipulative af, but I always had the impression that Curly was even a bit afraid of him after seeing the scene where Anya can be found hiding in the empty Med Bay (like, super weird that the first thing he asks Anya is if Jimmy was upset after she confronted him about the baby, instead of even bothering to check if she was alright first).
The birthday cake scene is also a great example because despite the accusations that Jimmy was throwing out obviously being bullshit, Curly barely manages to stammer out any sort of defense despite clearly knowing he had absolutely nothing to do with Pony Express going under or everyone now effectively being jobless. And yet, all he does is just stay silent after a few clumsy words as Jimmy bashes him in front of everyone.
It really reads like these kinds of outbursts already happened a few times in the past, and at this point Curly's just been conditioned to simply take the blame in silence as Jimmy pins all their problems on him.
Combine this with his tendency to just avoid actually resolving any kind of conflict involving his crewmates, no matter how justified punishment would be (Swansea straight up constantly insults Daisuke right in front of him and Curly never even says a word about it, which is pretty telling imo), and it suddenly makes a bit more sense why he didn't try to immediately stop Jimbo after the stinklord himself started heading for the cockpit.
Curly always having to step in and be the hero for jimmy, could also be why he constantly neglects his own mental health. The only think jimmy valued in their "friendship" was Curly's support, and so that's the only thing Curly cared about.
It's very funny to me how many people will preach about the damage that a narcissist and gaslighter can do to a person only to completely ignore it in order to dog pile on Curly when they talk about this game. Curly has been a victim of both Jimmy's and his toxic corporate overseers for years yet they expect him to suddenly change his whole mentality after he finds out Jimmy did something terrible to one of his friends. Thanks for not being like them and understanding that at the end of the day he was just a broken person who didn't know how to cope with what unfolded. The way Curly is shown in the game makes it very obvious that he's a good person who made a terrible mistake, one that cost him absolutely everything.
In my opinion what we can learn from Curly is the following:
When the chance to act comes, no matter how afraid you might be, do it because for all you know it might be last chance you ever get to do anything.
Unconditional kindness is not a virtue but a curse. It attracts predators who will eat you(literally in the game) the moment they see an opportunity to do so.
If you let toxic people manipulate you they'll turn you into a bystander in your own life. Be very careful who you keep close.
As for Jimmy, many people think he did what he did to Anya because she was an easy target, I think it's for much more insidious reasons. Anya and Curly's are shown to be very close friends and to trust each other a lot in the game. Yet another example of Curly having something that Jimmy doesn't. I think Jimmy did it out of an envious desire to take something away from Curly, to ruin his close friendship, to make him sink deeper into despair because deep down Jimmy knew that after everything he's done to him that Curly wouldn't have it in him to lash out violently or do something drastic.
Anya said it in the game, "our worst moments don't define us". Curly's worst moment was his inaction but all his other moments show him to be a good person. Jimmy's worst moment is assumed to be what he did to Anya but that's not what defined him as monster. Jimmy is a monster because every single moment he's shown to have on that ship is terrible. The only thing we can from Jimmy is to not be like him and to avoid people like him like the plague.
Curly is just a guy in a crappy situation tbh. Not a hero or Jimmy's partner in crime, but just a guy who's trying to look out for others.
While Anya is my favorite character Curly is unfortunately relatable to me. I had some not great friends as well. I justified their actions towards myself, others, and themselves with their not great circumstances. My life wasn't as bad I should help and understand them. I found myself and my feelings being downplayed and eventually I had to distance myself for my own mental health. I hold a lot of rage for Curly because I see my younger self. Too afraid to be alone to say anything, to action and often frozen. This video does a great job of expressing my conflicting feelings towards the character perfectly. And the game does something I have very seldom seen in others- show a deeply toxic friendship and how it can be just as affecting as other toxic relationships
Honestly that wierd metallic sound that plays in the back ground during Jimmy's "I'll take care of it" scene makes so much more sense through the lens of dissociation, like the information was such a shock to his system that the world faded away for that moment.
Thank you!! You’re the first person I’ve seen who acknowledges that Curly is most likely gaslit as heck.
I’ve seen this sort of relationship irl and it really breaks you down as a person.
Thank you for making this video, people were quick to blame Curly for not stepping up but when it's your closet friend being accused of heinous crime can't forget to mention dealing with a bad job and personal issues all at the same time. Curly was doomed from the start and in my opinion got the worst punishment out of all the Tulpar crew members.
I will be completely honest when I first did the playthrough Anya talking about the screen completely went over my head it wasn't until she point blank said that she was pregnant that I realized what was happening and even then I was thinking it was between Jimmy and Swansea in the point of the game was to figure it out. Didn't even realize we were Jimmy until you're at the end. Wooosh 😅😂
Exactly, literally almost everyone I’ve been seeing has dunked on curly for not doing something without considering the circumstances he was in with himself and jimmy.
@@Davjose37 exactly what i thought! The situation was just too messy and complicated
All I’ve been seeing are people acting like they wouldn’t act the same way and it’s been making me unreasonably angry. Then you make that point and they call you an enabler, like BRO!!
Real
Superb video. Thank you so much for making it! Curly is a fascinating character and it makes me a bit sad to see people reduce him to "just as bad" - "just as responsible" I'll take, but c'mon. Yes, on the face of it he does have the means to get rid of him, but the power dynamics of their friendship aren't the same as the power dynamics of the ship. He might be captain to Jimmy's co-pilot, but he is also victim and host to Jimmy's abuser and parasite. Not to absolve him or anything, like I do wish Anya telling him would've triggered his fight instinct rather than fawn or freeze, but yeah.
I think the most interesting thing about Mouthwashing is how impactful Jimmy’s actions are. Even if you remove him from every chapter proceeding the crash Jimmy doomed the entire crew. I don’t see it talked about a lot but Jimmy especially killed everyone just to avoid responsibility for his actions.
It’s not even certain that the cryopod would save anyone put into it. Jimmy gets exactly what he wants and it destroys everyone around him including himself. The funny thing is there isn’t a plan of Jimmy’s that gets stopped but he is so blind to his incompetence he blames others like Anya when she has a reasonable breakdown. His control is so meaningless it only is there to serve his own ego. You could call it narcissistic but I think at its core Jimmy is heavily insecure about his importance and that’s why he forces hisself into positions of power.
An 'Inferiority Superiority Complex', as TV Tropes would say.
THANK YOU!! Seriously, I've seen too many analysis videos saying the only reason Curly didn't act in Anya's defense was because he's buddies with Jimmy... The characters and the game have so much more depth than that!! Especially thank you for mentioning the predatory capitalism that Pony Express utilizes to punish and control their employees. It's such a huge part of the story, but so many people don't even look past the surface level of the story to notice. Wonderful video, chef's kiss, 10/10, loved the silly blooper at the end!
Aaa thank you! :D
UGHH EXACTLY THISS. The entire game is SOOO deep but people just wanna put labels on whos the bad guy and whos the good guy. It completely takes away from how complex the game design is.
@@LiminaLuxHonestly your analysis is so good
11:42 this detail has been living in my head rent free. Jimmy always runs away even when responsibility is staring him in the face. Curly always forces himself to keep walking even when he has no idea where he’s heading and should he even keep going.
They have the opposite problem in a way. Jimmy keeps running away from responsibility and blames everyone except himself. Curly keeps taking more responsibility and blame, including things that aren’t even his fault like the company going bankrupt, so much that he’s blinded to the actual problem that ruins everything.
I relate to curly a lil to much. You cant process the shock until its WAY to late. Ive been in toxic friendships before. And ALL THE TIME. They act like jimmy. (Not referring to what he did to anya) they shift the blame by saying things like "if you don't "_____" iwont insult you. " and they also shift the blame to me making look like i did it.
from this game i learned not to go to space ever
Honestly, you have the best explanation for this. People just get so quick to criticism and hating. IT'S PURE MANIPULATION. (Not justifying his actions.)
THANK YOU for saying Curly wasn't a villain!! Secondary trauma is REAL, and it can affect ANYONE. Learning that your best friend of multiple years is a monster can and will SERIOUSLY mess with your ability to think critically.
Thank you for holding Jimmy accountable, instead of dumping all blame on Curly like most of the fandom does. Those guys just parrot this one take to each other in order to virtue signal.
I've not seen anyone not hating on Jimbo.
The only character I've seen people hate on is Jimmy.
This is great! Thanks so much for this analysis. Curly really doesn’t get covered well by other folks.
Thank you!! :D
Thank you for making this video
This game really hits close to home for
A few months back i had my own situation with my own "Jimmy" and "Anya" although, thankfully, she fended him off. It terrified me on how much Jimmy and Anya from the game reminded me of my "Jimmy" and "Anya", relationships and all, even similar personalities. I felt so shocked and aimless on what to do like Curly. Thankfully, i threw my "Jimmy" away from my life, and most of my friends have as well. I'm ashamed to admit this but it took me a while to see how to approach the situation because i was too worried of how my choice of action would shape every other relationship i have with my other friends. It took me breaking down my relationship with him in my head and seeing that its best that i shouldn't even associate myself someone like him.
I empathize with Curly in a lot of ways and i can't say I feel sorry about what happened to him since i wouldn't deny such consequences falling onto me if i had made the wrong choice.
Thank you for being able to dissect these two characters and the lessons that can be learned from them and sorry for dumping all of this in here.
I'm glad your situation has improved, wishing you the best and thanks for sharing!
Something that I think about is that Curly might have feared how unstable Jimmy is, as well. When Curly even slightly confronted Jimmy, Jimmy immediately crashed their ship. I'm a victim of SA and take "bystanders" very seriously, but it might be a different situation when you're stuck on a ship and need to confront an incredibly violent and manipulative person.
This video is awesome! I am someone who personally can relate to both Anya and Curly. People defending or being lenient with someone who has done terrible things isn’t comforting but I completely understand there isn’t much that can be done. While in Curly’s case I just know I wouldn’t really understand until it was too late and I have unfortunately had really bad people in my life like Jimmy. I hate watching people rag on Curly or acting like he was just as bad as Jimmy. He is flawed and even though my experience went similar to Anya’s. I relate with Curly a lot more. Definitely a great analyst!
Thank you for making this, i just discovered this game and i didn't understand how people were so quick to see curly as either only good or bad, for me he did the best that he could seeing the best in everyone and the situation they were stuck in dealing with his mental struggles and i think the complexity in that is what makes him such a likeable character for me even when his inactions led to so much. I do somewhat see myself in him too so i can sympathize.
I liked what you said about when Curly is walking to confront Jimmy and you point out how the music isn't rage but it's his anxiety, I never looked at it that way. When you mentioned Curly being able to put his foot down with Swansea but not with Jimmy I was thinking it's because how you mentioned Curly just thinks if he's functioning its enough, and that comes into play in the confrontation because when it comes to captain duties Curly knows exactly what to do but when it came to confronting Jimmy, Curly spiraled into his safe sentence "We will fix this".
This analysis video was honestly really refreshing and gave insights that I feel a lot of people have missed and helped explain things I was confused about that no one seemed to be talking about. And of course, I think the humanization of Curly as more than an abuser was essential to that. Curly certainly cared about his crewmates, and naturally believed it was his role to peacefully resolve everything, even if it meant letting his crew mates tolerate suffering. I have definitely played the role of Curly in my life and tolerated my own Jimmy that I knew was actively hurting me but just… let it happen. For the sake of not breaking the friendship. The point was brought up that Curly was an adult tolerating all of this and so was I, which just makes me believe there’s even more depth to his character and his decision to help Jimmy continuously.
There were definitely different nuances though, and I wonder if the “fix it” attitude and the fact that he tolerated nasty behavior for years, a sort of consistent dynamic between the two of them, has also to do with male friendships specifically?
I can't really comment on toxic *male* friendships since I don't know much about it yet but I did wonder if Curly tolerating Jimmy for so long was related to that.
@ I was close friends with someone who was very proud of his “masculinity” and he had the same sort of attitude of needing to fix things, or be “responsible” even when he was utterly unprepared for it. Even when it was unnecessary too. He also mentioned how his male friendships were long-lasting but sorta shallow (missing a lot of intellectual discussion which here would’ve prolly led to Curly calling Jimmy out at some point) so that’s sort of where I get this idea from
Bro I need to hug you for this video's existence. Finally someone understands Curly is not an "enabler" because he didn't get subtle messages at first glance, nor could he do anything about the Pony Express' environment and abuse culture.
Jimmy was unfortunately integral to the crew and couldn't be replaced by anyone. Daisuke doesn't have much experience in work in general, and both Swansea and Anya have none in Co-Piloting. Not to mention it's confirmed of how the Pony Express is trying so hard to minimize ANY complaints about the workforce as much as possible.
I could go on about this...
Thank god there is at least one person that actually characterizes Curly correctly and not make him out to be almost as bad as Jimbo.
FINALLY. someone who understood the dialogue the same way I did 😭🙏
this video is actually peak thank you so much you basically found the words to my opinion on curly character
Curly is tired, stressed, like you said maybe even depressed xyz and he GENUINELY sounds shocked when Anya told him that she was pregnant.
I have someone in my life in a leadership role who is a lot like Curly. It sucks just how wide a net a narcissist’s damage will reach. Turning good people into passive accomplices on top of the active damage they do to hurt people.
Great video. These are pretty much my identical thoughts.
As a feminist woman I find Curly’s lack of insight and action very infuriating, however, at times it feels like Jimmy also manipulated the audience. In real life, abusive and toxic people can and will be empathetic and charismatic, you can’t be a manipulator without those traits. Curly’s toxic friendship and the weird dynamic he had with Jimmy not being a consensus plot point made me realize that majority of the people would never recognize someone being stuck in an abusive relationship and reach out the victim. I think, as a coping mechanism, people want Curly to be as bad as Jimmy and this is why they come up with theories such as he knew the assault way before, or he was threatening Anya, or he stole and hid Anya’s ID to his locker so that she wouldn’t be able to file an HR report. I think Curly’s already very present flaws and failures are enough to dislike and even hate him, and demonizing him ruins the message of his character. At the end of the day, the pain he had to endure post-crash is not just some karmic punishment or justice. It is his very own pain. It is something horrifying and traumatizing to witness and I feel bad for him. He didn’t only fail everyone around him, he failed himself too, and involuntarily was a catalyst of his doomed fate. You are like the first person I’ve seen who stated this very vividly in an essay, so thank you.
As a woman who is always having a hard time when telling creepy men off and had to endure predatory and manipulative relationships or situations mostly because of my empathetic nature, despite his incompetence to help a woman in a very similar situation, I still found Curly insanely relatable (definitely my favorite character too) and that’s why what happened to him on the screen felt extra personal and terrifying. After watching the game, I wanted to turn this terror I felt into a force that would help me change my life and tendencies, even just for a bit. I think anyone can feel this with any character from Mouthwashing, so I hope this game helps everyone to break some patterns.
this is the revival of media literacy. probably the best and most concise video about mouth wash. im impressed
I think I mentioned in some other places that I felt that Curly was as much a victim of Jimmy as anyone else in the game. It's weird how a lot of fans seem to have gone from understanding that to hating the hell out of him. He made mistakes mainly in regard to his inaction but people act as though he's on par with Jimmy.
I always figured she DID directly tell Curly, and Curly didn't believe her until she had the pregnancy to prove it.
THANK YOU for talking about how Jimmy uses ‘we’. It stood out to me massively when i played (i knew the plot already) and the way he talks to Curly especially always got me.
When Jimmy is to blame, he finds a way to frame it as if they’re *both* to blame, like the ‘when WE get back, what’ll happen then?’ Like buddy. You’re the one getting arrested for assault, not Curly. And yet he shares the blame to try and get Curly on his side. Plus the way he’s unrelentingly mean to him, the ladder talk. The way he’s so envious and how he’s awful to post-crash Curly now he can’t fight back, though he never did in the first place.
The unbridled resentment dripping off Jimmy’s every word to Curly, its staggering that some people don’t immediately clock. All i could think was ‘that’s _not_ what friendship is supposed to look like’ in their conversations. Like he’s such a pisshead and its so obvious, but the manipulation he uses on Curly, the way he makes himself sound better than Anya, manipulates Daisuke, villainises Swansea, its effective on the people playing it too.
That’s the problem with writing a good manipulator, the audience gets manipulated as well.
Love me an awful and unreliable main character
Jimmy assaulting Anya is the dead pixel. Curly ignores it, he tries to focus on the bigger picture. Anya tries to drown it out, but it is always haunting her, and it affects her thoughts and actions.
Adding that blooper at the end was great. Subbed just for that and looking forward to more videos 😂
13:24 bro that line and that scene from the game? Knocked me down
waiitt.. youre goated the thumbnail really piqued my interest i love the art AND the video
Aaa thank you!!! 💖💖💖
Amazing analysis!
I have seen a lot of vids analyzing these two and I just gotta say that I love how abstract the game is, it doesn't give a proper answer, you can hate a character all you want but you don't know a character fully, you never will, just like with people, which gives so much to work with and have your own interpretations on them.
This video gave me some more perspective on them and made me reread and rethink each diaologue, there is so much thinking with this game and I love it.
this actually broke me this is amazing
Someone put my thoughts into words! i actually really love Jimmy as a character because he's so well written, and I love Curly as well. I found a really interesting analysis about Curly too, how his method of dealing with things, regarding Jimmy, isn't fight or flight. It's fawn, Him taking in the little rant before the ship is crashed with just... a relieved sigh. That stuck with me.
Really great analysis! It's good to see people actually thinking about the game. I also wanna add that as per Pony Express being the worst, any way of dealing with Jimmy would probably have given them pay cuts. Unauthorized used of the cryo pods (that they could have needed themselves) is probably against company policy, killing him too, and of course, there was no way of locking him up. And of course, even speaking out against something like that happening leads to collective pay cuts. I think that's an interesting part too, especially since Anya particularly needs this job because she's broke.
Not really, Curly WAS expected by the company to put someone down if he had to. He was given the gun. And another comment gave a very detailed answer on how the ship is engineered so that the crew can't run away from the Captain but the Captain remains well protected.
The fawn response was something I noticed too but I ended up cutting it from the script cause I was worried people would misinterpret is as me excusing Curly's actions, but I'm glad someone else saw that too!
Pony express docking payments was also in the script but I scrapped that too because let's say they finished their transport and Curly didn't shove Jimmy in the cryopod or something, Anya would've been visibly pregnant or already had the baby by the time they'd get off and I'm pretty sure the company wouldn't be happy about that-
Basically no matter what, if they survived they still would've gotten docked payment.
Wow that was an amazingly well put together video, I didn't know this game existed before but now I believe I will be looking into it more.
Thank you!! It’s a great game, highly recommend >:3
Incredible analysis
Thank you!!
Thank you for this video Finally someone who understands this art❤
The most pivotal moment of the whole game is Curly's confrontation of Jimmy before he crashes the ship. All of the deaths in the game could have been avoided if he had just taken action faster, but his hesitation in this moment is what allows Jimmy to crash the ship and seals the fates of the whole crew. Curly was never a bad person, just a man faced with a choice who chose wrong.
Such an amazing analysis to just sit with for a while. I've heard a lot about Jimmy's hallucinations and the Swansea chase scene but the way you put things almost made it seem like it was obvious all along and it clicked! Thanks so much for the time you took to make this and spell things out from your perspective, it made me love and appreciate the game more than I already had (which was already a LOT) :)
The best analysis video on mouthwashing I've seen yet. Really helped me to organize and put into order the narrative of the game in my head.
People out there trying to make Curly's lack of 4D chess level of decyphering skills into a gendered issue. Like his maleness is the reason why he couldn't get a clue from Anya (she's not at fault for not telling him the truth bluntly either).
As a woman, I found fans accusing Curly of ignorance very offensive. *I* didn't get the clue during my first playthrough and didn't grasp who Jimmy really was until Anya almost plainly stated it.
What, am *I* an "enabler" (like these fans love to say) now?
I am pretty sure that curly did get it after anya told him, he just didn't want to hurt jimmy. And i didn't get the hints too, don't worry you're not alone ;)
THANK YOU! I get this SA is a complicated subject matter, but this particular situation is way too complicated to simply blame on Curly being a guy. Part of the reason why the dead pixel scene is so good is because of how different it feels on replay. There is no way in hell anyone's convincing me that the player was MEANT to understand what that scene was about on their first playthrough. That's what makes it so scary to me. You know Curly messed up, but despite how much we tell ourselves we would figure out what Anya was really talking about if we were in Curly's shoes, we know from our first time seeing this scene that most of us probably WOULDN'T.
And as a woman i can tell you Curly IS in fact ignorant, while yes i agree it not just bc hes a man and friends with Jimmy, but his lack of action showed he didn’t understand the steaks of the situation at hand. It’s symbolic throughout out the entire games that Curly was in fact a bystander, and an accidental enabler. However he didn’t become ignorant nor an enabler out of malice, but more so not acting quick enough which is causing a lot of confusion for some.
Also joking about enabling r*pe.. yikes
It's pretty obvious he was ignorant. There's no arguing against that.
Amazing video. People view this game in such a black and white way, but your takes were very reasonable and would make a lot of things click for people who might only look at this game at face value. There were even some things you mentioned that I didn’t even think about-like Curly having a ‘fix it’ mentality as a sort of ‘trauma response.’
I’m also so glad you mentioned how much of a manipulator Jimmy is. People seem to conveniently forget this when pinning the blame on Curly for what happened on the Tulpar. Yes, of course, Curly is partially responsible, but Jimmy was the one pulling the strings even from the beginning, for lack of a better way of putting it.
This is a very interesting video and you put very well in words some thoughts i still had to elaborate after playing this game (it was just three days ago). Thank you!
Im glad you felt like curly and grew out of it as im 20 and feel the same.
I will never get over Curly hearing the question, "Why *don't* the sleeping quarters have locks?" and answering "for safety". He kind of hears what he wants to hear - the rest of the sentence is just adding detail but he takes it as the full question.
"Why do you think Pony Express put a lock on the medical room door but not in the sleeping quarters?" He answers as though he never heard anything from "but" onward. He just won't LISTEN.
I really appreciate this analysis video of Jimmy and Curly's abusive dynamic in the game. A lot of people don't seem to realize how manipulative and emotionally abusive Jimmy is towards Curly. Jimmy will guilt trip Curly for shit that Jimmy did throughout the game. I personally relate to both Anya and Curly because I have had people in my family who basically did nothing when it came to the abusive actions of my mother towards me. And I relate to Curly because I know that standing up to such people is NOT easy, especially when you've been conditioned to internalize the abusive person's manipulative words and blame yourself for how they treat you. I'm not trying to downplay what Anya went through at the hands of Jimmy. And I'm not excusing Curly's indecisiveness and inaction either. I'm just saying that someone doesn't have to be a mustache twirling villain to not stand up against someone who is abusive like jimmy.
people always jump to the term “morally grey”, and I guess that can be true, however, I interpreted it more so as he’s been jimmy’s friend for years, and probably has been manipulated by him + is scared of him, and imagine hearing that your long time friend (that you may be scared of) is a horrible person? it may be possible he’s seen jimmys bad behavior before, like outbursts etc., and maybe it’s just “normal” for him. curly has a lot going on, himself; he doesn’t get barely any sleep, he’s stressed about his own career, and stressed about his crew members; it’s his job to “fix” everything. i believe he truly didn’t know until anya explicitly stated jt, and he wants to talk to Jimmy and gets upset when she does so w/out him , maybe out of fear of jimmy’s reaction or a desire to keep the peace. even if he wasn’t scared of him, or didn’t care about him, etc. and actually did something, what would he have done? pony express obviously doesn’t care about the employees, it would probably be too expensive to send him back. it’s not like he could just throw him out into space either. his only option is to “fix it” and keep the peace. his kindness and fear to act unfortunately led to his decline. i see a lot of people picture him as evil or an angel and i just like to think he’s a perfect example of being human and having people like jimmy in your life.
You’re an amazing artist btw, I love the thumbnail
Aaa thank you!! ^w^
I'm so sad that this channel is underrated as hell
Agreed
^w^✨
When I first heard you say that you think the sequence of Swansea chasing Jimmy isnt real, I completely disagreed but then when you explained it I thought about it and I agree to some extent
Really grounded take. I am still a big curly hater, but I can totally understand your points. I just don't think I could ever be that relaxed about things.
That’s totally fair, I’d probably go ballistic too in that situation. Glad you were still able to enjoy the video! :D
@@LiminaLux Just to like clear up, I know that Curly was in shock with the Jambone in the cockpit instance, but it's much more then that. It's the blatant unawareness with Anya, it's the continuious inaction with Jambone. He is supposed to be this great leader, which is obviously due to just being a push over, but we see that he does cares about his crew.
It's one of those situations that feel could have gone differently if just a small thing had changed, which is why it feels so awful.
This game is the dead pixel. BTW FYI you can see the dead pixel in the upper right corner if you look. It's not just a dialogue detail, it is visually there too if you look
I do think that Curly could have and should have done more. He sees Jimmy as his friend, and if the game is meant to somewhat reflect our society in the way it seems to be, he's doing the whole, "Well he's my friend, he's not a bad guy, he can't be a bad person because he's my friend," the way far too many men do. I'm not saying that's entirely his fault, that's the way our society teaches and socializes men to be. He's not a villain, but he did make a substantial mistake, and I do think we should acknowledge that.
Yeah unfortunate the top comments are making it seem like Curly is being overly hated in the Fandom when I see fanart of him looking pretty and literal trigger warnings for Jimmy 😅.
Holy crap bro,really good video bro keep up the good work🤓☝️
The friendship curly and jimmy had HITS me HARD. Just like one i had, with an absolute glurnge.
Constantly, he’d upset my other friends, and i’d try to mediate and ‘fix’ things, until i realised i was putting his needs over my own, realised he was controlling me.
The same sitch curly’s going through, except he can’t get rid of jimmy. All he can do is try and mediate the damage,
And he fails..
Some time near the end of last month my friend group on discord had a little bit of an issue with someone in it. They did and said stuff that was often hurtful, disgusting, or uncomfortable to everyone (including myself) yet I simply saw them as flawed, despite the fact that I didn’t like them for it. I tried to give them a chance after they were banned to see through their side of things, to try to mend things because they weren’t all bad or it wasn’t just their fault or something like that. Regardless of if they were flawed or not they, like Jimmy, would never own up to anything as their fault, no matter what it wouldn’t get through to them. I’m glad I played Mouthwashing and I thank you for making this video because otherwise I probably would’ve continued to simply see them in the same manner and probably made the situation between the group bigger than it needed to be.
Omg THANK YOUUU for pointing out how unhealthy Jimbob's and Curly's friendship was. It reminded me soo much of an old friendship I had (obviously take away a few aspects) because of how selfish Jimmy is and how Curly lets it slide out of wanting to keep the peace.
I think it's really interesting aswell, that Curly's kind of character is actually really common in other media, but this is just written differently. There's so many shows and stories where there's a character who is too caring, struggling with mental health/insecurity, who always wants to keep the peace- but it's never shown how that impacts anyone else but that character. I think Curly shows how disregard for yourself doesn't just affect you, but the people around you.
I also think that Curly kind of reflects how guys try to defend eachother, even is one of them has done something wrong, by just not really looking at whats happened. Tbf I didn't get the pixel sequence at all, it went completely over my head, but I think its meant to show how Curly really kind of ignored what was happening, because if he didn't look hard enough, then it wasn't happening. It's sad, but it's true. Curly really valued his friendship with Jimmy, and because of how Jimmy treated him (disregarding his boundaries, feelings, always putting focus on himself/putting down Curly) I'd say Curly figured he was the worse of the two since he was always upsetting Jimmy.
Jimmy meanwhile was very insecure. You can see in how, like you said, he's always saying how everything thinks Curly is a great captain, but no one is saying that. Jimmy is jealous and regretful of how his life has gone, he sees Curly who has what he wants and it makes him angry. So Jimmy, despite being surprisingly emotionally intelligent (Manipulating Curly in the friendship, how he treats Anya to put her down, manipulating Daisuke to go into the vents), he projects his insecurities onto Curly and believes its his responsibility to help him. (Like how it's always gone in their friendship in how it's very much implied that Curly has helped Jimmy avoid law enforcement and saved his ass multiple times back on Earth).
Point is, I'm rambling. Curly shows the dangers of self-neglect, in how it affects other people and how keeping the peace isn't always the best option.
Jimmy shows how unresolved insecurities and the refusal to take accountability will literally ruin you and make you your worst self. Me and my homies still hate Jimmy tho he's a wonderfully written TWAT
(P.S. The corporate/capitalism aspect of Mouthwashing in the form of Pony Express definitely deserves to be talked about more, I'd say it will be once people (me) have wrapped their head around how amazing the characters are written)
Oh my god i never even thought about Swansea. He was totally untied during the monologue. It didnt make sense to me that he took the axe out if Daisukes face either!!
It's actually quite simple. It's not only Jimmy's fault, but also the environment that created him. Jimmy is mental because of his upbringing and the work conditions. What he was doing was one long suicidal impulse stemming from his lack of self worth created from bad conditions. In another situation, he could have done well and it's not his own choice that led him there. Hell, it was the best job he could possibly get in the society he lived in. How could any of this be his fault in his mind? Everyone else was different, had different coping methods, self destructive ones.
Swansea was an addict who gave his anger to everyone despite caring, Curly was a people pleaser, Anya retreated into shyness. They are not at fault for this. They still aren't. Jimmy's coping method was to get more, to be at the top. To take what he needs and wants.
And who enabled him? It was no one on the ship. Who made Jimmy? He was inevitable with the society they lived in.
People don't choose if they have no freedom. They scrape.
All curly was capable of doing is watching that’s why he ended up how he did after the crash just his eye sticking out watching that’s all he ever did. Didn’t have the mind of a captain to begin with
please let jimbo be the last of its kind
you, maam/sir, have done the BEST analysis so far on curly holy fuck
im so tired of people saying that he himself enabled this shit on purpose and is also in on the abuse like people HEAVILY misunderstood him and the fact that jimmy manipulated and abused him too even if its not in a sexual way. this is an amazing video and i hope it overshadows those videos that try to pain curly ONLY in a bad light and nothing else. curly is not perfect obviously he should've immediately just went at him when he saw him instead of always being a pacifist, trying to see the best in even the worst of people but instead froze up and have the ship crash AND also let himself be stepped on by someone as shitty as jimmy BUT STILL he is not an abuser like him. im so sick of those discussions
Another detail that makes it more obvious that swansea didn't chase jimmy or wanted to kill him is that jimmy always wanted his axe from him so he might have been just hallucinating about him trying to kill him with his axe and that might've been the reason he shot him in the first place
I want to marry this video
05:15 Also, if you cut a cake like that you can't devide it to 5 parts. And cuting a ccake like this into 10 equal parts would be really difficult.
You explained it perfectly
I think its really important to note for Curlys sake that when Anya made things clear, when he finally put 2&2 together, that they were still ~8 months out. Curly is a captain, but he cant be chugging along 24/7 for 8 months. Jimmy was co-captan, they guy who picks up the slack. In order to finish the trip Curly (mightve, I dont actually know what tech "future 60s" has) likely had to rely on Jimmy to fly the ship when he was sleeping or showering.
There's obviously a subtext to Mouthwashing, a mild jab at capitalism, who needs that much mouthwash out in space anyways? But its reflected in a sparse, understaffed crew. If one person goes under they all will, even without a crash. It's first and foremost an authors decision, less characters means less time meeting people means more intimate moments means a more involved story and richer characters. But assuming that the falling apart ship can't run without a pilot for long, who could Curly trust to be his second outside of Jimmy? Swansea would likely take to it best but hes already busy, he cant work miracles and the ship might fall into disrepair. Anya would likely wuss out or be too anxious, she tends to spook easy and its a big responsibility, esp in her shoes. And Daisuke... they'd crash 100%.
Curly in that moment had to try to keep the peace, both inside himself, grappling with the fact that a well known friend assaulted someone and hes going to lose him to the inevitable falling out, and outside, among the sparse and fragile crew.
Every cog in a machine needs to work in perfect time with the others, and Jimmy threw a wrench in that.
Mentally I am curly fr fr on Daisuke
I noticed you said "Captain" in how you said that
5:08 me learning other people dont do that normally??
What i can learn from them?
Hmmmm
Curly: wanting to make peace but when things are too far i will also go too far and not just slack around bc that someone is my friend
Jimbo: don't be a bit"ch like him and don't take lead instantly,bc i might not be in the right condition for it
Swansea: just be protective about things
Daisuke:(my boy) always have hopes for anything that make ppl happy no matter what
Anya:....... just.....alr soo this is a hard one to teach from...hmm....never give up and always dream and if depression gets the best of me just kick it out and try to be better
To me, Curly is a bad person but not an evil one as he was trying to keep the peace but chose to be peaceful in a situation where peace isn't an option. In my opinion, he isn't morally gray but morally complex as Morally gray people do bad things for good reasons, and Morally complex people do bad things due to an internal conflict. I didn't hate Curly at first but I felt that if someone other than Jimmy had raped Anya he would have been much more decisive which. Curly just couldn't be impartial which is what made me hate him. There is saying in business to never hire friends or family because when conflict arises such as harassment or you need to fire them it will be way harder to take disciplinary action against someone you know and love.
Join the cheese cult
Ik it's a nit pick, but the gun probably would cause damage to hull of the ship possibly causing a rapid decompression. I think it is possible that Curly didn't give Anya the gun because it could have missfired and caused damage to the hull.
YES
0:10 didn’t jimmy crash it???
He did crash it
yea but tats spoilers
Sorry-
@@hasdyi but the vid said it don’t care bout spoilers
@@efan7065 idk
I THINK HE KNEW ITS WHY HE DOESNT STOP JIMMY FROM GOING TO THE COCKPIT HE JUST SITS IN THE HALL IN A CORNER.
underrated youtuber?
"They've all known each other for years" ... No, actually. Daisuke is entirely new, and Curly and Jimmy are the only long-term companions, and Curly's thoughts on Jimmy in the team's other game suggests he knew hiring Jimmy on was a bad idea, but did it anyway, out of loyalty, and he expresses regret over it, too late. This game is commentary on r*pe culture, and yes, you're meant to feel bad for Curly--but it's so you can identify the same potential flaw in YOU. If you found out your friend was sexually harassing a woman in your life, routinely making comments that made her uncomfortable, would you try to stop them? And the answer, in Curly's case, was apparently "No." Yes, he did a psyche eval for Anya's sake, but literally tells him about the sketchy behavior way beforehand, and Curly just... brushes it off. "We're buddies, I'll handle him." That's the attitude he takes every time in regards to Jimmy, you see that throughout his scenes, and it's a MISTAKE every time. He doesn't hold Jimmy accountable, he doesn't act like his boss... Anya makes it even clearer that Curly WON'T hold Jimmy accountable or protect her from him by the conversation about the gun, and TELLINGLY, Curly does not deny that statement. He tries to placate her with words, and then resorts to inaction, and it doesn't help. It lets the situation keep going until it all boils over, and Jimmy, being the psycho that he is, lashes out and gets everyone killed accept Curly... his enabler.
They did say besides Daisuke though 😢
I did mention Daisuke being new, and it's stated that last haul they had Swansea's birthday. Since this transport was meant to last a year and Curly stating in their other game that he spends a long time away from home I'm inclined to believe that each transport lasts a year. So pre crash they definitely have known each other for at least a year and 4 months give or take. With how long Curly's been working for pony express I personally think he's been with the same crew for about a few years, but I could be wrong!
greate video and ngl i identify to curly a lot
9:52 Mostly unrelated, but this reminds of the opening line of an episode of The Transformers where Starscream says nearly the exact same thing, but in third person rather than second person about a character who isn't a leader, and as much as this is an important line in the game, it's so hard to take it completely seriously when all I can hear is Christopher Collins, aka Chris Latta, doing his shrieky, crackly Starscream voice.
Yes girl because I would say jimmy does have npd it crazy how their manipulation tactics can be covered by the guise of empathy it’s sickening but something I would fall for too if I didn’t keep up consistent boundaries
we need a mouthwashing without jimmy
I don't really agree that she didn't directly tell Curly. If she didn't directly tell him, how did Curly know it was Jimmy? Why would he assume it was his bestfriend of years and not someone else? The only evidence he would have that Jimmy did it would be his comments on the psych evaluations, comments that he took as jokes. Like, it makes more sense that she told him directly.
Swansea may seem a bit rough but anyone can tell he's well meaning and caring. It's also implied Daisuke and Anya are good friends. Curly already knew beforehand that Jimmy isn't the most friendliest person, to put it lightly, and in that reveal probably connected the dots and realized he shouldn't have taken that as a joke.