How Big A Tractor Do I Need To Pull Hay Equipment
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- Опубліковано 23 сер 2023
- If you're thinking about getting a tractor and later using it to pull hay equipment, you have a difficult choice ahead of you.
If all you'll ever do is pull a sickle mower, a hay rake and a small square baler, you might get by with a larger compact tractor. Because of the light weight of compacts, you'll feel all the vibration from the baler and that will be fatiguing. Also, the weight of a baler can push you down a hill if there's some dew on the ground. If you ever decide you want a disc mower, you won't have enough horsepower to pull it.
You'll probably be moving up to the utility tractor size for hay baling. Many manufacturers are building "economy" utility tractors and premium models. They tend to push the cheaper ones because they're the big sellers, it's a price-driven market. Dealers generally won't even stock the premium utility tractors because it takes so long to get them retailed. The premium utility tractors are designed for the customer who uses the tractor a lot, and will have many extra comfort features, like better seats and operator areas, better transmission options, and usually, bigger hydraulic pumps. The inexpensive tractors will have a lot of older technology and won't be as comfortable to operate and be as productive.
If the two tractors were parked side-by-side on a dealer's lot, the premium model might be priced $10,000 above the economy one and most people will take the lesser-priced one. Most dealers don't bother to talk about the premium tractor because they don't want to confuse you, or appear to be upselling. If you're baling hay, you may want the full-feature tractor.
If it were me and I could afford it, I'd go ahead and move up to a mid-range cab tractor, which is what most people buy when they're planning to put up hay. There will usually be several horsepower options in the 65-90 range, with the same frame and lift capacity. The lower end may have naturally aspirated engines, the higher end may be turbocharged and after cooled. Get the most horsepower you can because hay equipment takes a lot of horsepower and an air conditioner will suck about 8-10 hp out of an engine.
In the end, if I were thinking about putting up hay someday, I'd get a minimum of an 80 hp tractor with all the bells and whistles, air ride seat, buddy seat, the best transmission offered, a front end loader and probably 4wd and I'd be ready to add the baling equipment later on.
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They do make hay equipment for sub-compact and compact tractors...but those setups are for people who are hobby farmers, small scale stuff...you aren't going to want to cut and bale a field probably more than about 5-7 acres with a sub-compact tractor and those small hay attachments LOL. You could do it but you'd be out there for a week just doing 1 task.
People have been running balers with tractors less than 30HP for years, they do just fine, but those old tractors weigh a heck of a lot more than a lot of today's compact and utility tractors. Its the tractor weight that is more important with a regular square baler.
Two questions that need to be answered are (1) how many acres are you planning to hay and (2) what type of bales (square or round) are you planning to make?
With 18 acres here in Oregon, I use a Ibex TM67C drum cutter and a New Holland 565 small square baler. Both only requires PTOs of 35 hp. The 2 tractors I use are my Ford 4630 (65 hp with 55 hp at the PTO) and my Massey Ferguson 2607H (74 hp with 64 hp at the PTO).
When I was a kid we put up thousands of bales with nothing but a 35hp WD Allis Chalmers, pulling a 7' NH Haybine, side delivery rake, and NH square baler. We had bigger tractors but Granddad wouldn't use anything but the WD in the hay field.
Cab is a must not just for the dust but it;s also nice to keep you from having a heat stroke when you're doing field repairs on the baler. I personally have a Kubota M5-111 and I wouldn't want to try and stop my baler going down hill with a full bale inside it with a smaller tractor.. Also I'd keep that 3910 for two reasons 1 you can cut or rake with it and two it's reliable.
A cab is not an absolute requirement. Of course they are nice, but farmers baled hay for eons before tractors and decades after tractors without cabs or even an umbrella.
@@terrycastor8299 actually farmers haven’t baled hay for eons without cab tractors. your logic implies that one doesn’t even need a tractor just just go back to a scythe and tie the bundles with string.
@@bearkatljl , hardly. But hay was harvested well before tractors. Sure a cab is nice and if baling hay is going to be day in and day out for hours on end, sure go for it. But I baled hay for years and my operator had no cab or even an umbrella while I loaded. The mindset that no one is supposed to sweat whole they work these days is one of the big drivers for increased input and harvest costs.
What Mikes saying here is theirs no replacement for displacement! 100hp you won’t regret it
I think that your advice applies to all tractors, not just utility tractors. Get the most horsepower that you can, and I learned quickly here in Florida, get a cab with some A/C.
Good advice Mike
Thanks Mike. Very helpful!!
Good information. Thank you.
For probably over 80+ years equipment manufacturers have listed horsepower requirements to get you into the right class of tractor (size/weight) not necessarily the actual horsepower needed at the PTO. You don't want the tail wagging the dog.
For square bales, round bales, chopping silage, cutting hay, a 100 HP tractor can do that all day every day. Silage chopping to me always took way more power and weight than a 5x6 round baler.
Now tillage could require something different if you replant that field or other crops.
If you have a lot of acres to cut and bale I'd recommend a pull type disc mower conditioner over a 3pt mounted one.
Silage chopping takes a lot of HP.
Tractors used to always have their PTO HP listed and that was the HP rating of the tractor. Sometime in the early 2000's manufacturers started selling tractors by the engine HP, I think in an attempt to make the customer think they were getting a bigger tractor than they actually were. The fact is, it doesn't matter what the engine HP is, what matters is the HP to the ground or PTO shaft. A 90hp older tractor will have more actual HP than a new 105hp model.
Amen, Mike.
Agree Mike. My main hay tractor is a Kioti RX 7320 and does a good job with my Baler and haybine. Wouldn’t go any less horse power than that
Pulled a Vermeer 504G with a Farmall M for a couple years. Slow going, but it got done.
It’s much happier with square baler behind it now that I have a 656 to round bale with.
i love my 70 hp Kubota cab tractor and I added an air ride seat
as said below if you can keep the old tractor there will be uses for it ......lifting bales onto a truck, offloading at the farn, etc.
Right on Mike. I started with a good cab Case 2096 and never looked back with regret. If your doing round bales that size is good then you can use any baler behind it.
Depending on how much hay you want to make, I’d keep that 3910 and shop around for the right size equipment for it. Maybe think drum mower rather than disc
I've been using a 10-foot disc mower for 10 years on a 45 tractor horsepower Mahindra so PTO horsepower is a lot less
Could get a drum mower. That 3910 should run that with no problem.
I think you are right on target, Mike… pretty scary when a baler full of tightly-wrapped hay (1,000 lbs of spinning material) starts pushing the tractor as you turn downhill. It’s not that hard to jackknife under those circumstances. Plus, if you have to backup a bit to dump the bale-that requires lots of power… do not underestimate the power it takes to make even a 4’x5’ bale in hilly or soft ground. Manufacturer recommendations are there for a reason. Great video!
In my hay experience using a Haybine, Wheel Driven Rake, and Round Baler my tractor that I previously owned was rated at 73HP. It was PTO capable of driving both the Haybine and Baler. The Haybine was very difficult to pull, and moved the tractor when switching from side to side. I could not get a Diskbine because my tractor lacked the HP necessary to drive a reasonable sized one. Due to unforeseen circumstances I was in the market for another "utility" tractor. The one I found was a 106HP with a larger frame and heavier unit. My new tractor I bought used now runs everything with ease, and the air seat makes the ride much more comfortable.
I agree with Mike buy the most HP you can afford, with an enclosed cab, and the necessary remotes to run everything. Your comfort in the cab will pay off when it is hot and humid out.
I have a 40hp Massey 1740m, with 29 PTO hp. I use a NH 467 haybine, and a NH hayliner 68 baler. I haven't had any issues. I can only feel the baler plunger when I am stopped, I don't feel it while I'm baling (or afterwards) I also didn't notice any fatigue. I am happy with my setup for what I'm doing, but could see advantages to having a little bit bigger tractor, but I definitely wouldn't say it was necessary.
Tell him to look into the NewHolland Workmaster cab Tractors They make nice utility tractors with the rears loaded 12.500 lbs they make a 55,65,75 hp they are turbo intercooled they also make 95,105,120 hp also. we do hay with x2 of them a 65/75 hp power shuttle 24x trans, buddy seat, AC. radio. air seat etc.We run a new newholland discbine and a newholland round baler with the 75hp no problem!
I'm looking at the 75 myself.
I run a New Idea 5407 disc mower behind my JD 4044m. In first cutting it can bog down in thick hay, I just drop a gear and go on. In second cutting typically I can mow in B4 or C1. I round bale with a JD 457SS and use my dad's NH TT75A, which is also a little short on power at times. That being said, my tractor won't be less than 80hp and it WILL have a cab.
Agreed ! No such thing as too much HP, just too little traction! Quote from Carroll shelby
I have baled with a New Holland TC30 (25hp PTO) and a Hesston 5530. It ran well. I have 15 acres of hay field that has about 30 feet of elevation change and terraces and the small tractor still did well. I also used this tractor to cut. I have a FDM-165 drum mower. The 25hp was plenty of power for this cutter. All that said, I did upgrade to a TYM T654 67hp cab tractor. Now I can run this same hay equipment in "economy mode" and run much lower rpm and cut/bale in the AC.
I just recently purchased a Hesston 5530 baler without knowing how well my tractor, a Long 2360, would run it. I knew it would work, but it's good to know my 35 HP tractor will run it just fine.
@@FLPhotoCatcher your tractor will do great with the 5530. Just one bit of advice. When you are starting a new bale, start very slowly. You'll want to creep along and watch the bale chamber... and watch for the bale core to start spinning full speed. Once it's spinning you can run fairly fast and it'll pull everything in and make a great bale without jamming. But if you don't start slow, it will jam every time.
@@Goofy5o5o Thanks for that info.
depends on the size of equipment and terrain. I hay'd using a 12' haybine, 1968 vintage square baler, mostly level to rolling, various rakes/tedders. 35hp Kioti about 3400lb.
I'd not go smaller than that. TO run a square baler you need more HP.
Now i'd cut/rake our 12 acres and it took hours....we now share the land with a guy with 100hp deere...he's there 2 hours or so it seems!
The old time/money deal!
Buy the tractor loaded with weights is something to add. Enjoy your videos keep them coming
There are mini round balers that work with 18 Pto HP and make bales that weigh 40 to 60 pounds.
Your right with everything you sead but one thing you didn't touch on is 4fwd if you are gonna round bale you are more than likely gonna have to have a loader to move the bales to get full useige out of a tractor with a loader you need 4fwd
I have a JD 4044R and really get bounced around pulling my 328 square baler.
My opinion after 40 years of farming and owning equipment.
Hay is way cheaper to buy if it’s just for you.
Stay under 75 hp and stay away from DEF.
With the price and time it takes to grow , cut , and bail , it’s cheaper just to buy.
Yes, dollar per dollar. But it's the experience and heartache that your paying for. Haha!
Yes, it's cheaper to buy your hay but my problem is there is a lot of junk hay sold around here. My Dad bought some hay one year, and he wound up with weeds in his pasture that we never had on the farm before. I like to know where my hay comes from, if you're going to buy hay at least know the field it came off of, the stage of maturity when it was cut, and if it had been rained on after it was cut.
It's nowhere near cheaper to just buy. I can get a brand new Baler and disk, cultipack, drill, drag, and buy the seed & fertilizer cheaper. Then buying hay for 2 years.
For years my grandfather did 1000s of square bales every summer with two old farmalls, sickle style cutter, rake and Deere square baler with kicker, those couldn't of been more than 35-40hp? Eventually he upgraded to round bales and got a conditioner cutter and got a deere 4020 (I believe) and intentional harvester 584 (60hp) which I still have, that Deere was more hp but gas vs the diesel international that would out pull the Deere anyway. I got my skid steer stuck and my 4x4 3/4 ton truck wouldn't budge it, that 584 dragged it out like nothing, putting power to the ground is just as important as pro hp to me. That 584 with 60hp made easy work of pulling out the skid steer that my 300hp +/- truck couldn't budge. I know it's not haying but gotta be able to put horsepower to the ground in most cases, if not all. Some.new tractors are just far too light in weight to be able to use all their horsepower.
Mike is right……. My three haying tractors are two cab NH T6050’s @ 125hp each weighted to 18,500 lbs and a Massey Ferguson 5711 Dyna 4 @ 110hp. Weighted to 16,500 lbs All are power shift transmissions and I wouldn’t bale a single bale with out a power shift transmission period.
I'd ask lots of questions of the dealers, especially those who sell ag equipment, not just compact tractors. They know more about YOUR local conditions than we do, and have worked with lots of other people with similar needs as yours. They'd be good people to ask what size tractor you'd need to run the type of hay equipment you're thinking of. I would err on the side of getting a bigger machine, than one that technically has the power- but is just barely big enough. Better to not find out the hard way that you don't have enough tractor.
Utility doesn't mean lower quality. It's simply a) the next class up from the compacts, and b) designed to be worked hard in a variety of different applications. A lot of them are very good machines. Dealers tend to stock the bare bones models, to keep the price down- so they'll sell. The folks who buy them are usually looking for a work tractor that's reliable and not too expensive to own. All the extras- to them- are just extra expenses, more things to maintain, and more potential things to break.
If you have the $$, you could buy a premium utility every bit as tricked out as a top of the line compact. If this isn't a business expense, be prepared for the acute case of pucker when you see the price, lol.
Doug,
Using Mike’s advice on a Massey he is recommending a minimum 4708 or 4709 tractor. Your best best is probably a 4710 (100hp).
But you would need to talk to your MF rep on the specifics of your hay attachments. I know dudes who run hay with a 4707 (70hp), like what we have, but I think you can’t assume some things.
As for features on the Massey, you are probably going to look at the 4700 global series or the 5700 series.
The 4707,08,09,10 all actually offer quite a few higher end upgrades when compared to other brands. The 4700 is called the Global series because MF makes them exactly the same, across multiple international markets, thus keeping the price down.
The premium Massey above the 4700 & 5700 would be their 5s or 6s series.
They are like spaceships and probably beyond what you need or are willing to spend.
I say take a hard look at the 4700 Global MF’s. They are VERY full featured and popular. Coming from a small tractor, they will seem like Cadillacs.
What about those with not that much to do on larger jobs and using an old tractor like a JD 4020 or 3020 with a smaller round baler that will produce 4 foot bales or s square baler with an accumulator?
There are so many variables in this question that he asked that to give an accurate answer we need more information. Such as size of hay operation, round or square, flat land or hills. I can tell you I bale with a 4x4 or a 4x5 baler on hills and thats with a 63Hp Kubota, It does well for me. I also bale squares with a 30 Hp New Holland Compact and it does well for me. So there is a lot of In Betweens here, but one thing i think most of us would agree on. Unless it's just ratted out Keep that 3910....It will be the best raking tractor and Many farmers around my area do everything with their 3910,3930, and 4630 fords and they are dead reliable.....Heck he may even just need to size his equipment to the tractor he already has this is easier than you think. The New Massey Ferguson 1745D balers that produce 4x5 bales are only specing at 40 pto hp requirements.....and he has that already.
I have been thinking about this for when I buy land and for me I think an open station would make the most sense as I grew up around them cab tractors are generally bigger and weigh more something to consider too is can haul it in for repairs yourself? I know my f250 gas truck is too small to haul most tractors I would use for baling with 14k towing capacity. And that's in flat ground it struggles to pull my travel trailer in the mountains. I think you touched in subject okay but there's a lot more that goes into it than comfort.
Ford 3910 is plenty of tractor to do hay with; it will run a square baler and haybine no problem.
I’ve gat a 26075 massy furgson 2 x4 I run a 8 ft Kubota disk mower 9 ft hay bine new Holland 850 round baler and a 336 jd square baler I do farm a lot of hills and one thang I will say is I wish I gat 4x4 because on hills you can put it in 4x4 as. Have more help keeping the tractor steady and not push you or slide as bad with 4x4 other than the 2 wheel drive
If he only wanted to do small round bales, like a 4x4, 75 horsepower is plenty. That’s going to depend on if he’s selling hay, keeping it for his own use, or some of both. One good thing about the 75 horsepower range is post tractors at that power range don’t have DEF, and some don’t even have DPF now. Personally if I was looking to go bigger than a 3910 Ford, a compact tractor wouldn’t be on my radar. I’d be looking at something like a Deere 5075E for example. I’d think about keeping that 3910 as a second tractor to be a back up or raking tractor.
110 HP or more for running a modern haying operation.
Or you can go with the Cat 1 25 hp modern equipment (that costs almost as much as the big baler) to do half the work in 4 times as many hours.
Or you can semi "old school" do hay... rotary cut, let it dry, rake and fork it into piles called "haystacks"
People used to do the haystacks with hand tools.
No need to
There was a time when a 35 hp tractor was heavy enough to do almost any job that you needed on a small 300-acre farm. It baled, it chopped, and could run the combine. Now you need the 80-100 hp tractor in order to get the weight necessary to do those same chores. And at $1000/hp, it gets expensive real fast on the newer tractors.
Those old farmalls couldn't of been more than 35-40 hp? My grandfather had two farmalls for years and baled 1000s of square hay bales every summer, in my teens he eventually jumped to round bales and got a deere 4020 and IH 584(60hp) which I still have, I got my skid steer stuck and my 4wheel drive truck wouldn't budge it, that 584 dragged it out like nothing, putting power to the ground is just as important in most cases
My reference pointy was a Case 600(casamatic) and Case 700. They were ~35 and 37 Hp for the Gas versions. The 600 did bailing and corn chopping and the 700 was used to pull the chopped corn up the hill to the barn. Those tractors had sufficient weight to put that power into the ground. In the early 80s, the Case 600 was replaced with a Case 1200(diesel) which was a 65 HP version. That had a lot more power and the power shift worked great in place of the Caseamatic. The new tractors look nice and have the HP but if you don't have the weight, you are not going to move stuff. Those higher HP tractors are built with the weight like the older 35 hp tractors were built. @@chadbinette3201
Go big or go home. Don’t forget to add the weight of a hay wagon and a couple people stacking unless the baler has a kicker
Coming from a farmer if your going up and down hills better either load the tires or have it equipped with weights and have the front end weighted now that's just my opinion you give good information but weight is a worth it that's how a lot of these folks get hurt that's my opinion
A/c does not use 8-10 HP, more like 1-2
Modern tractors you'd want atleast 75 hp and good hydraulics for the tail gate on the round baler. Older tractors from the 50s,60s and 70s tend to have bigger motors (more torque aka real world pulling power) and more weight because they were built in for tillage so ya get away with less HP. Should be able to hay about 200 acres with a good 75-80hp tractor and a round baler. Big square bales ya want a tractor 8.5 liter (160 hp+) motor or bigger but that's probably not relevant in this discussion.
My wife won’t bale without a cab and air conditioning which allows her to do that while I am at work. Seems like a good investment to me.
Yep, as much HP as you can afford!
Best in biz korngrats what should I do if I spill diesel ⛽️ all over plastic hood of my mahindra emax 25
@@brianworley7705 Es macht mir nichts aus, dass du herkommst
Und meine ganze Zeit vertrödelst
Denn wenn du oh so nah bist
Verlier' ich irgendwie den Kopf
Es ist nicht das Parfüm, das du benutzt
Es sind nicht die Schleifen in deinem Haar
Es macht mir nichts aus, dass du herkommst
Und meine ganze Zeit vertrödelst
Es macht mir nichts aus, dass du
@@brianworley7705 Es macht mir nichts aus, dass du herkommst
Und meine ganze Zeit vertrödelst
Denn wenn du oh so nah bist
Verlier' ich irgendwie den Kopf
Es ist nicht das Parfüm, das du benutzt
Es sind nicht die Schleifen in deinem Haar
Es macht mir nichts aus, dass du herkommst
Und meine ganze Zeit vertrödelst
Es macht mir nichts aus, dass du herkommst Und meine ganze Zeit vertrödelst Denn wenn du arbeit.mavhtfrei
Does anyone make an inclinometer so one can know how close one is to rolling over?
add duals if your nervous
If you are wanting a meter to tell you that….. you probably don’t need to operate your tractor on slopes. A meter IS NOT A MAGIC BULLET…….
@genewilliams7497 it's built in to your body
It’s called the pucker factor!
If you think you are close to rolling over then it’s too steep. Doesn’t make any difference what an inclinometer says.
Not Mahindra. They don't weigh less. They are heavier than John Deere. And if he's got to ask those questions. Then he is a city farmer and you are too. There are so many compact tractors been being used at OSU and other farmers for over 25 years.
Buy a brand new top quality bailer. Breakdowns will cause you to ruin hay in a hurry.
How much hay does Doug want to do? Buying $100k worth of tractor and hay equipment to do a little hay is not worth it. He already has a Ford 3910 which is a fine tractor for doing hay. Save his 100k. When we did hay we baled 5000+ square bales a year with a Massey 135 diesel no problem.
"More Power"....Tim "the tool man" Taylor. No such thing as too much power or hydraulic output.
Get 400 hp and let that be the end of that
You sure sound like a tractor and equipment salesman. Not that your advise is wrong but you are going to have him spend a lot of money for a part time hay farmer.
I assume you a Tru.p supporter it matters whether like you or bot. I assume you are a hater