As someone who likes Foggy, I hate to admit it, everything you stated sounds right and exact. As much as I'd hate to see him go, Foggy's death would immediately establish the real world stakes in the series. This is going to be good.
That seems super likely tbh. Foggy dying immediately sets the stakes and tone, is serious enough to warrant Matt quitting the Daredevil life for a good few years, and kind of lets him be “Born Again” into a new man/character with a new supporting cast (plus Karen) when he comes back, right at the most current point in the timeline. It also allows Marvel to not really need to explain too much of the old show since it won’t be really pertinent to the current story (basically a reboot with some elements carried over, keeping things pretty clean overall). I also like the idea of Fisk’s ascendancy to mayor being the reason most of the street-level heroes start showing back up (Frank, Jessica, Luke, etc..). It works from a story perspective and lets Marvel easily time jump all of the Netflix characters into the current point in the timeline (at least whoever they actually want to use).
The devil's in the details. The glasses Matt wears in the scenes with him, Karen, and Foggy are different to the ones he wears throughout the rest of the series. They're the OG Netflix shades, they're thinner with silver trim. I'm certain this is a flashback. There's also a production still with Karen and Matt sitting outside the courtroom, where he's wearing the thicker glasses with black trim. This is in present day, Foggy is absent. Might be reading into it a bit much but yeah, I'm sure Foggy's getting murked.
I'd argue it will be Karen, now remember bullseye kills her in guardian devil, I feel that Karen's death is what set Matt over the edge. Also in She hulk, Matt reveals him and his business "partner" run a law firm in New York. So I don't think it will be Foggy who dies. Also that scene of Karen in the courtroom could be a bait and switch.
Karen should have died in season 3, that scene was from the comics but they spared her. If you know you know, it's the internet, it's Foggy at least at the hands of Bullseye. There's evidence to support it. I think Karen will either leave after that or be killed also by Muse. Matt talks about retribution in the trailer which means vengeance. He screams in the trailer while fighting, he's angry.
If it ends up being Foggy, I'm going to be so pissed. He's done nothing wrong since season 1 and it should be Karen that dies. Bullseye killing Karen is already comic accurate, Karen hasn't been a real "love interest" for Matt since season 2, Matt can clearly get around with women quite easily, and Fisk has a reason to want Karen dead since she already confessed to killing James Wesley in season 3. Yes, I know that Bullseye already tried to kill Karen in season 3, but if he completes it here, that still lines up.
Okay, this is going to sound really random, but I think the person who dies is Maggie, Matt’s mom. Mostly because I don't want Foggy or Karen to die, but also because I think she is a strong option because she helped raise Matt even before he knew she was his mom. They got close during season 3, so she could also be a good contender
I'm starting to feel more and more like they're gonna kill him off at some point, I'd be highly disappointed if the only scene we to see Bullseye (especially in the suit) is the scene where he Dies. But let's hope for the best.
prepare for disappointment, he wasn't brought back for the long haul. neither were Karen and Foggy. This was not originally going to be a continuation of season 3. They were going to kill Karen and Foggy off screen. Matt is going to kill Bullseye. Muse is the main villain in the show.
@kicknowledgesmith8608 I mean it makes sense, however disappointed I am, the fact we still got another season AND they fixed the story to be a continuation of the original show we all loved, will most likely outweigh my disappointment that I may probably only feel for about a day or two edit: or not at all
Is it a spoiler for leaks when this whole thing is based on those set photo leaks? Fuck it. Dex doesn't die during the fight at Josie's in episode one, because the call sheets for episode seven got leaked and he's in them attacking a formal event that Fisk and Matt's new girlfriend Heather is at.
Whatever happened to put Murdock’s Daredevil career on hiatus before the events of Daredevil: Born Again seems tragic, with Murdock telling Fisk “a line was crossed” before the trailer cuts to a scene where his mask slowly falls to a street crawling with police. What line could be crossed with such a heartbreaking effect that it drove Murdock from heroism?
I think it's a fakeout meant to stir online controversy and discussion and market the show. There was practically no secrecy to filming the scene at Josie's when there was for several others. To the point that there were even professional photographers on scene that were allowed to share those photos they took on their portfolios and list them on online photo industry marketplaces without ANY sort of the ruthless DMCA takedowns that Disney/Marvel is practically infamous for. That's not even to mention the fact that in the comics "Foggy faking his death and Vanessa helping him to set up a new life elsewhere" was the plotline that happened only a handful of issues after the "Trial of the White Tiger" arc in Brubaker's run that this season is mainly focused on + we know Vanessa has a big role this season. Add to that, Elden and Deborah (Foggy and Karen) weren't even going to be in the show AT ALL until Fiege fired the old showrunners, ordered the overhaul and canonized the Netflix shows -- but rather than tearing everything from the ground up when more than half the show had already been filmed, they kept what worked and now have to retroactively explain Karen and Foggy's (almost certainly temporary) absence during those mid-season episodes.
I think what you’re saying is logically accurate, hence that’s why Feige mainly focused on the Brubaker’s comic run which they are using for this series. Marvel openly allowing people to film Foggy’s death would be too predictable. Why would they even bring him back if he’d killed in the first few seconds of the intro?
My theory is this… Karen will die, Foggy will be in ICU. Karen Paige can be important in the right plots, but she’s not THAT strong of a character all in all. Like you could conceivably write a script for Daredevil without Karen. Lots of you might say Foggy is in the same boat, but I don’t think that at all. I think both route can be right. Either way, it’ll be a ballsy decision. I just hope they don’t kill off Dex.
@@kicknowledgesmith8608 Well, is Foggy working with Matt at that point? That’s the question. During Season 3, Matt and Foggy are doing their own thing. Did they get back together? They didn’t at the end of Season 3. It’s a good question, but I don’t see anything contradictory there. The writers can come up with an explanation for that.
@ season 3 ended with them on good terms saying Nelson Murdock and Page alluding to them starting a business together but I'm sure there's an explanation.
It could also be a reason that frank is back too, frank cared a lot for Karen in the punisher series and daredevil season 2 and if she bites the dust from someone else, it’ll send frank on a revenge mission
I’ve got a feeling that they’re gonna kill off both Foggy and Karen, just feel like they’re wanting Daredevil in more MCU projects and I feel like that’s the easiest way to write him leaving Hell’s Kitchen to fight a bigger battle
I've seen the BTS photos and yeah, Foggy definitely dies, he only contributed being Matt's best friend in the series and nothing else, at least Karen had a thing with the Punisher
I'm not a fan of this. Killing one of them off feels like a slap in the face to old Daredevil fans. And it feels like they're doing this so they can get rid of them - not because it's right for the story.
If it’s Karen, Foggy or Bullseye, ima be seriously upset. Cuz then Bullseye will have been a nostalgia device and We cant afford to move forward without Karen and Foggy.
yea because Karen is so important to the story, meanwhile Matt has been hooking up with different women since he met her. They had her trying to get with Frank also, they have nothing for her to do, she was brought back out of respect to not just kill her off screen. They show Matt with Heather Glenn in the trailer.
@ Karen has been given so much to do stfu. She found out the truth about Frank’s family. She stood up to all the pricks; The Hand, Fisk, Bullseye, lowlifes and thugs. She made statements to the press. She’s one hell of an investigator. So shut your mouth about her not having anything to do boy
@@DC-Supreme But knowing Marvel Studios who killed off Karen and Foggy in the original scripts when they had 18 episodes. Someone dies. But no one notices that Karen and Foggy aren’t in the trailer too much. Fight scenes and Matt and Fisk having a conversation
2 theories is either foggy or that white tiger dies and bc he’s directly inspired by the devil of hell’s kitchen, matt quits because someone else died technically because of his actions being a vigilante in general
You can see in the courtroom shot with Karen that Bullseye is the closet person to the camera/front of the courthouse. This could be his trial after killing fogg. Hopefully this means bullseye lives
Look, Foggy would not be with Karen at Frank Castle appearances. That would clearly justify her being standing there alone. Foggy never liked Castle. And if Matt’s there, he’s likely council. But that’s a big if. This doesn’t discount Foggy’s untimely demise; but that’s scene doesn’t prove anything about Foggy based on his absence.
Bullseye is going to kill Foggy and DD will cross that line and kill Bullseye and I think Muse is going to kill Karen. I think Foggy death will be a flashback scene. Something that happened off screen. Fans wanted dark and violent, death usually happens. Can't have it both ways.
@ Bringing characters back doesn't make them immune to death, If you don't think one or both will die, you are going to be disappointed. He can't be out for retribution if they are still living. I think Karen dies for sure and Foggy gets badly hurt. Many want dark and violent and Marvel listened, dark and violent brings death, why would they be immune to death?! The show is called Daredevil not Karen, not Foggy, not Bullseye. Villains die all the time in Netflix shows and so do others. There are set photos online. Tragedy strikes.
I think Bullseye will, unfortunately, kill Foggy instead of Karen. Matt will kill Bullseye because of that and that’s what he’s referencing when he says “a line was crossed” in the trailer. I mean, if Matt would EVER break his code it would be because of Foggy. After that he guits being Daredevil because he broke his code.
I believe it, there's tons of evidence to support it. I think Bullseye kills him and I think Muse will kill Karen. and I think DD will kill Bullseye. I doubt there will be 2 main villains. They just brought them back per fan request, there's really not much left for Karen to do, she should have died in season 3.
yeah not suiting up is dumb FOR 4 episodes You need him As daredevil Not as matt murddock Yes he is daredevil But As Matt murddock is never fullly daredevil only when he puts on the suit Matt ends and the demon begins
@@CamCamGeez10 There's nothing wrong with that they're just mad because non of the Avengers or Captain Marvel was in that show just Nick Fury and Skrull Rhodey
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
As someone who likes Foggy, I hate to admit it, everything you stated sounds right and exact. As much as I'd hate to see him go, Foggy's death would immediately establish the real world stakes in the series.
This is going to be good.
Bullseye uses the missing horn to kill Foggy.
Damn
That seems super likely tbh. Foggy dying immediately sets the stakes and tone, is serious enough to warrant Matt quitting the Daredevil life for a good few years, and kind of lets him be “Born Again” into a new man/character with a new supporting cast (plus Karen) when he comes back, right at the most current point in the timeline. It also allows Marvel to not really need to explain too much of the old show since it won’t be really pertinent to the current story (basically a reboot with some elements carried over, keeping things pretty clean overall).
I also like the idea of Fisk’s ascendancy to mayor being the reason most of the street-level heroes start showing back up (Frank, Jessica, Luke, etc..). It works from a story perspective and lets Marvel easily time jump all of the Netflix characters into the current point in the timeline (at least whoever they actually want to use).
The devil's in the details. The glasses Matt wears in the scenes with him, Karen, and Foggy are different to the ones he wears throughout the rest of the series. They're the OG Netflix shades, they're thinner with silver trim. I'm certain this is a flashback.
There's also a production still with Karen and Matt sitting outside the courtroom, where he's wearing the thicker glasses with black trim. This is in present day, Foggy is absent.
Might be reading into it a bit much but yeah, I'm sure Foggy's getting murked.
I'd argue it will be Karen, now remember bullseye kills her in guardian devil, I feel that Karen's death is what set Matt over the edge.
Also in She hulk, Matt reveals him and his business "partner" run a law firm in New York. So I don't think it will be Foggy who dies.
Also that scene of Karen in the courtroom could be a bait and switch.
Karen should have died in season 3, that scene was from the comics but they spared her. If you know you know, it's the internet, it's Foggy at least at the hands of Bullseye. There's evidence to support it. I think Karen will either leave after that or be killed also by Muse. Matt talks about retribution in the trailer which means vengeance. He screams in the trailer while fighting, he's angry.
No it’s foggy
There even set photos of him in the ground
In the books Foggys death was a way to mislead people, he ALMOST died but was hidden away.
If it ends up being Foggy, I'm going to be so pissed. He's done nothing wrong since season 1 and it should be Karen that dies. Bullseye killing Karen is already comic accurate, Karen hasn't been a real "love interest" for Matt since season 2, Matt can clearly get around with women quite easily, and Fisk has a reason to want Karen dead since she already confessed to killing James Wesley in season 3. Yes, I know that Bullseye already tried to kill Karen in season 3, but if he completes it here, that still lines up.
In the books Foggys death was a way to mislead people, he ALMOST died but was hidden away.
Okay, this is going to sound really random, but I think the person who dies is Maggie, Matt’s mom. Mostly because I don't want Foggy or Karen to die, but also because I think she is a strong option because she helped raise Matt even before he knew she was his mom. They got close during season 3, so she could also be a good contender
I 100% agree that Foggy is dying. Explains why they aren't working together after opening Nelson and Murdock back up after season 3
My worry is that they will kill off Bullseye. I'll be very disappointed if he dies.
Matt might think he's dead, but remember he's been augmented
I'm starting to feel more and more like they're gonna kill him off at some point, I'd be highly disappointed if the only scene we to see Bullseye (especially in the suit) is the scene where he Dies.
But let's hope for the best.
prepare for disappointment, he wasn't brought back for the long haul. neither were Karen and Foggy. This was not originally going to be a continuation of season 3. They were going to kill Karen and Foggy off screen. Matt is going to kill Bullseye. Muse is the main villain in the show.
@kicknowledgesmith8608 I mean it makes sense, however disappointed I am, the fact we still got another season AND they fixed the story to be a continuation of the original show we all loved, will most likely outweigh my disappointment that I may probably only feel for about a day or two
edit: or not at all
Is it a spoiler for leaks when this whole thing is based on those set photo leaks? Fuck it.
Dex doesn't die during the fight at Josie's in episode one, because the call sheets for episode seven got leaked and he's in them attacking a formal event that Fisk and Matt's new girlfriend Heather is at.
Whatever happened to put Murdock’s Daredevil career on hiatus before the events of Daredevil: Born Again seems tragic, with Murdock telling Fisk “a line was crossed” before the trailer cuts to a scene where his mask slowly falls to a street crawling with police. What line could be crossed with such a heartbreaking effect that it drove Murdock from heroism?
8:42 Maybe Foggy is seated with Matt, as they are both lawyers, and Karen is a reporter
Could it be matt’s mother who dies instead of foggy or Karen, it would make a very shocking and sad moment without pissing the fans off.
I think it's a fakeout meant to stir online controversy and discussion and market the show. There was practically no secrecy to filming the scene at Josie's when there was for several others. To the point that there were even professional photographers on scene that were allowed to share those photos they took on their portfolios and list them on online photo industry marketplaces without ANY sort of the ruthless DMCA takedowns that Disney/Marvel is practically infamous for.
That's not even to mention the fact that in the comics "Foggy faking his death and Vanessa helping him to set up a new life elsewhere" was the plotline that happened only a handful of issues after the "Trial of the White Tiger" arc in Brubaker's run that this season is mainly focused on + we know Vanessa has a big role this season. Add to that, Elden and Deborah (Foggy and Karen) weren't even going to be in the show AT ALL until Fiege fired the old showrunners, ordered the overhaul and canonized the Netflix shows -- but rather than tearing everything from the ground up when more than half the show had already been filmed, they kept what worked and now have to retroactively explain Karen and Foggy's (almost certainly temporary) absence during those mid-season episodes.
I think what you’re saying is logically accurate, hence that’s why Feige mainly focused on the Brubaker’s comic run which they are using for this series. Marvel openly allowing people to film Foggy’s death would be too predictable. Why would they even bring him back if he’d killed in the first few seconds of the intro?
I personally think someone close to him does and Matt kills the murderer in anger . And that’s the line that he crossed which made him quit .
My theory is this…
Karen will die, Foggy will be in ICU.
Karen Paige can be important in the right plots, but she’s not THAT strong of a character all in all. Like you could conceivably write a script for Daredevil without Karen. Lots of you might say Foggy is in the same boat, but I don’t think that at all.
I think both route can be right. Either way, it’ll be a ballsy decision. I just hope they don’t kill off Dex.
Good points. I can see Foggy in the ICU but why was he in NWH and She Hulk without him, if their business is booming?!
@@kicknowledgesmith8608 Well, is Foggy working with Matt at that point? That’s the question.
During Season 3, Matt and Foggy are doing their own thing. Did they get back together? They didn’t at the end of Season 3. It’s a good question, but I don’t see anything contradictory there. The writers can come up with an explanation for that.
@ season 3 ended with them on good terms saying Nelson Murdock and Page alluding to them starting a business together but I'm sure there's an explanation.
It could also be a reason that frank is back too, frank cared a lot for Karen in the punisher series and daredevil season 2 and if she bites the dust from someone else, it’ll send frank on a revenge mission
@ I could see that happening.
I'm hoping that Foggy doesn't die, but gets really badly hurt.
😂 your terrible
Honestly Armin, you took the words right out of my mouth. This is exactly what I think is gonna happen
I’ve got a feeling that they’re gonna kill off both Foggy and Karen, just feel like they’re wanting Daredevil in more MCU projects and I feel like that’s the easiest way to write him leaving Hell’s Kitchen to fight a bigger battle
I've seen the BTS photos and yeah, Foggy definitely dies, he only contributed being Matt's best friend in the series and nothing else, at least Karen had a thing with the Punisher
Karen or Foggy. I really hope not😭 Yet either dying would have a massive effect on Daredevil.
I'm not a fan of this. Killing one of them off feels like a slap in the face to old Daredevil fans. And it feels like they're doing this so they can get rid of them - not because it's right for the story.
karen dies in the comics
Karens been dead for ages in the comics
True but it could be a bait and switch like how people thought she would die and it turns out it was him
If it’s Karen, Foggy or Bullseye, ima be seriously upset. Cuz then Bullseye will have been a nostalgia device and We cant afford to move forward without Karen and Foggy.
yea because Karen is so important to the story, meanwhile Matt has been hooking up with different women since he met her. They had her trying to get with Frank also, they have nothing for her to do, she was brought back out of respect to not just kill her off screen. They show Matt with Heather Glenn in the trailer.
@ Karen has been given so much to do stfu. She found out the truth about Frank’s family. She stood up to all the pricks; The Hand, Fisk, Bullseye, lowlifes and thugs. She made statements to the press. She’s one hell of an investigator. So shut your mouth about her not having anything to do boy
Way too predictable, they wouldn’t bring all 3 of those characters back to just kill em off.. makes zero sense
@@DC-Supreme But knowing Marvel Studios who killed off Karen and Foggy in the original scripts when they had 18 episodes. Someone dies. But no one notices that Karen and Foggy aren’t in the trailer too much. Fight scenes and Matt and Fisk having a conversation
Matt is not quitting as daredevil, there’s a something else
2 theories is either foggy or that white tiger dies and bc he’s directly inspired by the devil of hell’s kitchen, matt quits because someone else died technically because of his actions being a vigilante in general
Either character dying sucks really. I know it's Foggy though as there is footage of him lying on the ground....
I doubt Foggy will die. He’s probably gonna go into a coma, or something
You can see in the courtroom shot with Karen that Bullseye is the closet person to the camera/front of the courthouse. This could be his trial after killing fogg. Hopefully this means bullseye lives
Look, Foggy would not be with Karen at Frank Castle appearances. That would clearly justify her being standing there alone. Foggy never liked Castle. And if Matt’s there, he’s likely council. But that’s a big if. This doesn’t discount Foggy’s untimely demise; but that’s scene doesn’t prove anything about Foggy based on his absence.
Both were initially wrote in deceased, but thats one thing that changed with the new story. I think Bullseye or Muse will kill one of the two.
Bullseye is going to kill Foggy and DD will cross that line and kill Bullseye and I think Muse is going to kill Karen. I think Foggy death will be a flashback scene. Something that happened off screen. Fans wanted dark and violent, death usually happens. Can't have it both ways.
@@kicknowledgesmith8608 Way too predictable, they wouldn’t bring all 3 of those characters back to just kill em off.. makes zero sense
@ Bringing characters back doesn't make them immune to death, If you don't think one or both will die, you are going to be disappointed. He can't be out for retribution if they are still living. I think Karen dies for sure and Foggy gets badly hurt. Many want dark and violent and Marvel listened, dark and violent brings death, why would they be immune to death?! The show is called Daredevil not Karen, not Foggy, not Bullseye. Villains die all the time in Netflix shows and so do others. There are set photos online. Tragedy strikes.
I think that death is a misdirect that the fans will think is Foggy or Karen.
I think Bullseye will, unfortunately, kill Foggy instead of Karen. Matt will kill Bullseye because of that and that’s what he’s referencing when he says “a line was crossed” in the trailer. I mean, if Matt would EVER break his code it would be because of Foggy. After that he guits being Daredevil because he broke his code.
Way too predictable, they wouldn’t bring all 3 of those characters back to just kill em off.. makes zero sense
I hope we'll get shitty bullseye suit in the flashback
And hopefully have comincbook accurate bullseye in a later episode or even in a futur season
Killing foggy is to on the nose I don’t think they will do this.
Bullseye doesnt die we can see him at the front of the court room karens in
I’m ok if bullseye dies for revenge if he kills foggy
I hope it’s Karen. I feel like she’s expandable
I believe it, there's tons of evidence to support it. I think Bullseye kills him and I think Muse will kill Karen. and I think DD will kill Bullseye. I doubt there will be 2 main villains. They just brought them back per fan request, there's really not much left for Karen to do, she should have died in season 3.
Foggy wont die
U don’t bring back an actor, makes him do press, just to kill them after 30 minutes of storytelling
Loki infinty war tom hiddelston did a pres for infinty war iven if he died after 2 min inn the movie.
Nothing the Netflix marvel has done is worse than she hulk and secret invasion lol.
Let me guess Karen and Foggie die and he kills Bullseye.
Way too predictable, they wouldn’t bring all 3 of those characters back to just kill em off.. makes zero sense
Dex is alive and is supposed to be in season 2…
18 episode. not 19
yeah not suiting up is dumb FOR 4 episodes You need him As daredevil Not as matt murddock Yes he is daredevil But As Matt murddock is never fullly daredevil only when he puts on the suit Matt ends and the demon begins
Are they going to mention She-Hulk at all?
If it has to be someone I hope it’s Karen or his new girlfriend .
sounds about right
@Comicbookcast2 I'm not trying to be mean but they were trying to do at least 18 episodes but I get your point😅 👍
No, it’s the new love interest.
That Is Not How It Works
It’s going to be Karen Page.
I wonder if they will really buy into the Karen drug addict/pornstar downfall and she that she sells out Matt
White tiger has to die…. Just saying
The actor passed away, so they can write the character death on the show and his niece takes the mantle of the character
@@stephenheath8465 You mean his daughter
Spoilers😒
Secret invasion was a Good show
🧢🧢
@stephenheath8465 Aliens trying to take over the world... Wat was wrong with that show
@ Emilia Clarke's character is a big WTF for me🙄🙄
@stephenheath8465 so that's why the "SHOW" was bad because of a character you didn't understand?
@@CamCamGeez10 There's nothing wrong with that they're just mad because non of the Avengers or Captain Marvel was in that show just Nick Fury and Skrull Rhodey