Installing the Creality CR-10 All Metal Hot End Upgrade by Micro-Swiss
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- The CR-10 is arguably one of the best deals in 3d printing, and this upgrade enables you to print more materials, letting the hot end get to 300c and above. The upgrade also includes a plated nozzle, so you can print abrassive filaments without worry.
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6:00 As an engineer it's very odd to me that you removed the heater block screws. They add a lot of rigidity and strength to the assembly and without them, the only thing holding the heater block on is that tiny grub screw. Did the micro-swiss instructions specify to do this? Steel doesn't actually transfer heat very well so they shouldn't affect the heat transfer very much.
I'm wondering the same thing.
they dont help hold the heater block on, but they do help keep the heater cylinder tight against the heater block for better transfer of heat, he shouldnt have done that, its really strange and bad advice now the heating cylinder is loose
I love the use of a Swiss army knife to open the micro switch box!
Anyone else see the irony in the host cutting open the microswiss box with a swiss army knife?
Well I noticed that he didn't mention the swiss army knife as tools needed for installation - you need to open the box.......
Will this work on a CR10v2 with Titan Direct Injection?
I just picked up my micro Swiss today from the mail. Super stoked to set it up after this print is done
I just bought this all metal hot end for my CR10s. I started printing PETG on the stock hot end and now it won’t extrude at all. I read PETG needs an all metal. So I am hopeful this is the key. Thanks Joel. High five.
Anyone else having an OCD moment about the bowden tube being inserted when it wasn't cut straight?
Yes
just butt-heads that don't realize on the all metal hot end it doesn't matter ~
@@theothertroll the only downside to all metal hot ends u can get some bad heat creap with pla if u don't print fast or colder like 185 is fine but it's better for abs
@@beauvella32 Nice tip.
Heat Creep is only an issue with all metal hotends if you try and use silent fan options for the hotend. The default fans are noisy, but they have significantly higher Static pressure and CFM more suited for cooling the cold end.
If using Noctua make sure to use the 4020 variant, but even with that you risk heat creep, it's been shown to be near useless with the Hemera unless you are running low amperage in combination with low PLA temps.
Why remove the screws. Don’t they provide added stability ??
I didn't have the two screws holding on the heater block, also the sock does NOT fit over the stock heater block. After you've tightened the nozzle, you might have to cool down and remove the cover to get the sock on correctly.
I'd leave those screws on the bottommof the heat block because that grub screw just isn't enough to hold it and every CR-10 comes with them in and I think Sexy Cyborg said to leave them in.
I absolutely love the way you did this.
Great work
Thank you very much! Big props to my editor, Sean, as well! He makes magic from whatever I'm able to get to him :)
So why remove the two screws at the end of the install before adding the insulation?
I went all metal with my E3d about a year back and i couldn't be happier with it. Over temp'ing the PTFE lined hot ends causes so many issues and they seem to destroy themselves anyway after a fair amount of use. At least with the all metal hot ends you don't need to tweak your settings over time as the PTFE liner degrades :)
Wait so you just put the screws in and then ultimately leave them out at the end?
Why does he remove the two screws on the hotend at the end before installing the sock? I don't understand...
I have a capricon tube and hardened nozzle on my stock hot end so I can do hot temps, but this is nice option for sure. I am surprised that creality havnt developed their own all metal hot end as an option.
I prefer to use a sharp blade to cut PTFE tubing because it doesn't deform it like side cutters.
Hey Joel et al.. I've a Microswiss All metal hotend on my old CTC flashforge clone, i did the upgrade last year, and I'm not joking but one of the best upgrades I added :)
+Makerzord that's rad to hear!
I saw this the other week, been waiting for it to be available locally.
Figured i'd upgrade after the disaster that happened to the original hot end.
Good call!
I just ordered my first printer super excited I got ender3 I wanna print that NylonX stuff looks awesome ...
Me too, NylonX is my next filament, apparently a pain to get it to stick to the bed though.
Those 2 screws attaching the heater block to the cooler should have been removed when the printer was first installed. I'm surprised the manufacturer left them in. Maybe they were rushed off their feet!). Its a bit pointless having a heat break if the screws are left in there short circuiting it.
Hi Joel, I am trying to find information on how to upgrade my CR10s with micro-swiss to reach 310C. I cannot find any information on upgrading with original equipment, do you have any suggestions or recommended sources that I can use? Do I need a K-Type thermocouple, and if so, I am not sure if interface board is required or pinout instructions for integration into original CR10 control board... BTW, have been a big fan for a very long time. Thanks!
Tutorial summary:
1.Screw this 2.Screw that 3.Repeat 1&2 4.Done.
Great video Joel, but I have one concern. At 4:50, it appears the thermistor has PTFE sleeving, which should not be pushed past ~245° C, because it starts to release neurotoxins, such why you would get this upgrade. Can you confirm it is PTFE, or is it something else? You could always swap it out with the glass fiber sleeving you see on e3d hotends if it is though.
#HighFive
Ooh, I'll check it out!
The PTFE fails at 250C the thermistor is actually rated at 270C. The sleeving is silicone, just like the sleeving on the heater cartridge.
Wow, that old hotend is well made.
Bought an A10S for $200, not yet received and already looking for upgrades. This looks like a great upgrade. Why remove the 2 bottom screws? To me it would be better to leave them in place?
Hi gang. Once this hot end is installed, are there any settings that need to be changed in the firmware to allow the hot end to actually reach the 300C? Every vid I've seen only shows the physical installation, but I'm pretty sure the CR-10s is capped at about 260C. Any help appreciated!!!
Why did you remove the screws at the end to install the insulation piece ?
Are the colored bits on the cr-10 factory? I have an Ender 3 and I would love to know if I could print those out and jazz up my printer
If you've swapped out your cooling fan to a noctua, you're going to have issues. While the fan is super quiet and works pretty well on the standard hot end, the all metal one needs more volume than it can provide, so stick with the standard one. Also, make sure your retraction settings are adjusted, I think micro-swiss recommends a maximum of 3. Learn from my pain lol
What if I don't want to reuse the current heater block? I might get one of these but I'm not sure how to install the cables into the new heater block
just install them the same way they are installed in the original one, you basically cant screw this up.
Could you do a similar video for the prusa MK2? But could you should how to remove the wiring with the thermistor and everything, then reinstall all the new wiring
what about to update firmware..to rich 300°C
300c and above are for more engineering grade filaments such as PEEK and Ultem
285 is safe for all metal hotend with a Capricorn tube, anyone know how to change the settings from 260
@@3DPrintingNerd how would I change the maximum temp in printer firmware for PC
@Colin Davis with a capricorn tube you can print nylon on the stock cr10. Straight nylon no additives that push the temp required past 260 of course. You just need to go get some metal insulation tape and use that to insulate your hotbed. Also a makeshift enclosure will help but not required. I have mine in a small bedroom I can keep at 80-100 degrees F easily with a huge cardboard box I set over the printer. No idea how hit it gets under the box but it works and I get excellent durable nylon prints I use on RC crawlers.
a bit late to the party but why does he undo the screws on the bottom of the heat block to put the silicone cover on?
I think I'm gonna buy 2 of these. It seems Micro Swiss is giving E3D a run for their money...
I think they are trying!
Hello, I have a Creality CR-10S Printer that I can't get to print. The z Axis goes up and down when homing but won't When Printing. It just stays on the first layer. Is this a printer problem or am i doing something wrong in Cura ?
What would be the point in removing the two screws on the heat block? Would it be harmful to the device to leave them screwed in?
.
Anybody know why the heater block shipped with the Micro-Swiss was not used. ??
and instead Joel used the ender3 original. Would the other not have advantages. ??
I am upgrading mine Thursday!
Rad, good luck!
what about the fan blowing on the hot end ?
Thank you so much for this quality video.
Can the brass nozzles from the stock hotend still be used if just using pla? and reistall the micro nozzle for other filaments?
would it work well to use a 0.6 mm nozzle?
Why dose that cr-10 look way bigger than mine ??
I have a CR10S Pro V2 I see this is shorter that the standard hot end plus now with the BL touch it is way off. do you have any good idea's on making this all balance correctly ?
installed this yesterday, but i keep getting blockages between the titantum heat break and the cooling block which fails my print. the heat break is in correct and the grub screw is tight and retraction is set low as reccomended.
How come you didn't install the new heater block that it came with?
Great video...But what holds the heater block in if you've taken the screws out?
Prayer.
Heh. No, it’s the threads on the throat.
@@3DPrintingNerd Thanks for the reply...But....why are the screws on there in the first place then?
Hey man ! Is This a good product? What material will this upgrade allow me to print with? or What kind of improvements can I get from this upgrade? and what else would I need to do for this upgrade? Thank you!
By the way, if you are a CNC machinist or know one you can just make a hot end if you get or make schematics.
Ok will try asking the question again. What exactly will this help with as far as hotter temp filaments and abrasives filaments? My son and I have been printing with PLA for our first couple of rolls of our first 3D Printer. When we moved to PETG we have had no luck getting good infill and supports to print. Would this upgrade help with that? What settings do you suggest for petg with a cr10s and what advantages are there to this upgrade not mentioned in the video.
Btw the previous version of the video was great, just had the music missing on your intro?
Thank you
Matt
Hello, Matt! Last video DID have some audio glitches, and a re-render was what was needed. As for this, it helps for hotter filaments and for abrasive filaments because it is all metal from the top of the cooling block to the end of the nozzle. This means the heater block can get much hotter without risking damage to a PTFE lined cooler block (like what the CR-10 comes with). Also, the nozzle is nickel plated, which makes it resistant to abrasive materials, like carbon fiber PLA, and the metal infused filaments. A standard brass nozzle orifice gets widened over a short amount of time when printing with abrasive materials. However, with this plated nozzle, it's wear resistant and will last much longer. I hope that helps!
3D Printing Nerd thank you for your reply. Makes sense now.
wooo!
This won't change anything as far as printing with petg. Assuming you are at the right temperature for petg, try printing slower.
3D Printing Nerd the all metal hot end nozzle is only so good with abrasive filaments. It wears quickly still even with most glow filaments.
It's still a soft brass nozzle. I really wouldn't recommend it for much beyond woodfill and never ever use it for metal fill.
what about the max temp set in the firmware ?
i got it, 86 canadian is a lot but it's going to be worth it. cheaper from swiss store then any canadian sellers even with shipping.
Too easy there should be more expletives, wire cutting and and blood. Lol jk love the video
+Rheller82 that's why I have an editor ;)
I’m pretty sure I heard the start of a “oh sh*t!” In that video lol, better fire the editor 👅👅👅
ApplesUPnorth time stamp?
@@ooliver 6:35
ApplesUPnorth I’m sure that was supposed to be “woooosh”
Hi do they make a version of this that does not have the 2 bottom holes in heater block ? as i have the hictop cr-10 and that does not have those 2 holes :(
or would i need to buy a original crealty heater block
I am screwing the new micro swiss into a Tevo Tornado...The mricro swiss is smaller than my old heat sink...so it is a bit loose... Do they these types of screws at like Home Depot...? I am a newbie...Sorry..
i already ordered the hot end , but now i'm afraid to install it and run into problems, would you recommend it? i was reading we need to also upgrade the fans... and wrap the block...
Why is a company called Micro-Swiss based in Minnesota lol, they even use the Swiss flag on their website. Definitely will look into getting one of these though.
That got me wondering too.
@@AlexKall they just want to copy our great quality, but trust me, no country can give you the same quality like switzerland
Its the same with medecine in europe
I'd not seen the hotend used on the CR10 before...I really wish E3D's hotends were attached in a more sensible way!
what will be the max temperature that I can set in cr-10s after upgrading it to an all metal hotend?
shoomaklovesemmy all metal can go 285 but it depends
I was just wondering if you have ever printed wax filament
Hey Joel! Great video as always. I’d like to change the hot end on both of my CR-10 printers but I need a setup that would allow my Capricorn XS tubing to go all the way diwn to the nozzle. Recommendations?
Hmm... If you want Capricorn all the way to the nozzle, that may be tough. You could get a new nozzle, and swap the bowden tube with a capricorn tube. The stock CR-10 hot end has PTFE liner down through a metal sleeve. Would that be enough?
why take out the screws at the end? Can you leave them in for added support?
Hunter Spartan, I’m wondering why this was done as well. I’ve had my Cr-10 since its release and the hot end unit finally gave out (the original ptfe tube melted in the heating block and clogged the nozzle, nozzle and heating block had burn marks). Instead of buying a replacement I upgraded to this. The official micro Swiss install video doesn’t have you take the two screws out at the end so I’m curious if there’s a benefit in doing so
@@jonathanmatthews9299, so I asked this before noticing the video and the last comment was a year+ old. I don't think we will ever find out...
What other materials other than ply and abs can be able to print with that hot end?
Hi Joel. Do you know if they all include the blue silicone sock? From the links you provided to their product, the sock is not listed in either option, nor is it in the pictures or their installation video. I would like the sock and was wondering.
+Chuck McGee that's a good question. I would reach out to them and send them an email to confirm.
Thanks. I emailed them and they replied..."Yes silicone sock will be included with all CR-10 kits.
We will update the listing and pictures soon."
Why do you need to remove the 2 screws holding the heaterblock at the end?
i was wondering about that to O.o i put the sock on with the screws in and it worked fine.
I don't think you HAVE to, but, it's part of the Micro Swiss instructions, and those were what I wanted to follow.
However, leaving those two screws in means that there are two more pathways for heat to travel to the cooling block from the heater block. I'm not sure how much that impacts performance, but, it might.
I think the screws are there to help prevent breaking the heat break when tightening the nozzle, but should be removed during use to prevent heat from traveling through them from the hot side to he cold side.
how is that hot end working for you? have you tried any others?
Gday Joel bit off topic but I wanna ask you this I’m tossing up to upgrade from my first printer (geeetech i3pro b) between an original prusa mk3 or the cr10 big difference in someways. What would be your honest choice between the 2 be? And hi from Tasmania
I might need someone to explain to me: How is this any more or less "metal" than the standard hot end? This seems to replace some parts that are already metal.
Joel... Actually thats what I’ve already done but the CR-10 hot end parts are a bit non-standard so I thought I would upgrade. Perhaps an E3D V6 would allow me to use the Capricorn tubing? Never done one although I’ve been printing for about a year.
Hmm... reach out to E3D on twitter, they are usually very responsive! Good luck, and let me know what you find out!
no need to change hot end to use capricorn. The cr10 doesnt have a seperate ptfe liner, and instead uses the bowden tube itself and the heatbreak line. So upgrading to capricorn gives you high heat tolerance without any hardware like an all metal hot end. Firmware high temp limit and heater cartridge are then your only limits of reaching up to 300C
+Matt Weber BAM.
will any mk10 fit any printer uses mk10 as in can i use mk10 for say a Creality on a tronxy xy2 pro
I don't know if you can help me with this, but I'm looking to buy a 3d printer for the first time and it's a lot to take in. I (think) I've settled on a CR-10 (wish I could get the S4 variant but will probably go with just the CR-10). Anyways do you know if Lightinthebox.com would be an ok site to purchase it from? Currently the Creality CR-10 is listed there for $300.
Hey 3D Printing Nerd I really need help. I have a cr-10 and it hasn't worked in 6 months. All my prints are coming out really fussy and hairy and i have tried just about everything. I have changed belts and tightened everything down. I have tried different filaments and different files sliced by different slicers. I have slowed down the printer and have changed heat setting along with countless other settings and it all seems to make no difference. I'm thinking maybe if i change my hot end it will help because mine is a little ruff but I honestly don't know and I don't want to put money into a printer that's not worth putting it into. I loved 3d printing but I'm honestly about to quit because this problem has been unsolved for so long and I have tried so many things its ruining it for me.
Does this micro swiss hot end also attach on tevo tornado as well?
Wouldn't you also have to upgrade the firmware to allow you to set higher temperatures?
It's depends on if they've set the temp limit in the firmware or not. I didn't check my CR-10, but I know you can flash new firmware to these machines
the cr-10 have the temp cut off at 270. so if you want to go higher then that you do need to update the firmware.
The CR-10S tempt limit is 260c (I just checked mine and its limited to 260) I dont know how mark is able to hit 270, if you set it higher in any way it drops you immediately to 260.
5:27 thats what she said moment
xD
Hey Joel, don't you need to run PID on it after installing as the cool down rate is now going to be different?. And #highfive by the way
It's probably best practice, but, if you run it and everything looks okay, you really shouldn't need to. It's running a multi day print right now, and it's looking good :)
My cooling block came off that thread in the center.... And it's threadlocked in. So RIP me doing this upgrade (might even be melted filament)
This is working for CR-10s also?
will the CR-10 print cabin fiber ?. i am new to 3d printing
Have you printed anything on it yet? Would like to know if Quality and layers got better with this new hotend even tho It was good to begin with.
+Victor Vazquez I did. Just finished a 50 hour print. Quality is good!
Did you post the picture anywhere? Twitter/Instagram?
+Victor Vazquez not yet. Give me a minute and I'll get it out on Twitter.
Well it print carbon fibre with this upgrade?
Would it not be worth running PID tuning as well?
I bet that wouldn't hurt :)
Do you stay buy a printer bc you wanted it? Or all they all free at this point?
+GeoDroidJohn do you mean "still buy a printer"? I can usually get most machines on loan for a review but there are some I still purchase.
Do you think it is necessary to upgrade the heated bed of the CR 10S to print ABS?
Power: On To print reliably I would upgrade to keenovo heated bed.
You should upgrade the bed and put the printer into an enclosure that you can use to filter the fumes and hold the temps steady.
Thanks for the vid
have you installed a hardened steel nozzle on your TAZ 6?
+getOrvillized not yet though I will at some point.
what about e steps ?
Hey, Great video again. I have a question, I recently purchased a CR-10 and I'm loving it so far. But, I keep getting blobs at each layer. I've tried many different retraction settings and I even went on the CR-10 facebook group but no luck. I don't know what to do. Any help would be greatly appreciated! #HighFive
U ever figure it out?
Can this printer handle carbon fiber?
If you put a wear resistant nozzle on it, carbon fiber PLA is possible.
3D Printing Nerd nice. I want to make parts for my car
Anyone use standard print nozzles with the Microswiss All-Metal Hotend?
The one thing i have against moving to this setup, is a proprietary nozzle that i then have to purchase from Microswiss.
Nozzles are consumables that degrade over time. Regardless of that fancy coating, it will eventually need replacement due to wear, or even sooner if you run into bad filament.
Stock nozzles are very cheap, and its hard to justify this "upgrade" if it forces me into their proprietary replacements.
Reckon this would work with the Tevo Tornado?
Um... perhaps? I haven't had the chance to take the Tornado out of the box yet, but I know the internals are very similar. I would circle back with Micro-Swiss to be sure before ordering.
Cheers, shall do!
Hey I just upgraded with the CR-10 kit on my Tevo Tornado over the weekend. The install is about the same, the cooling block that comes on the Tornado is thicker so the screws are about 5mm to long and will need trimmed. But other than that quick and easy, the nozzle is longer so will have to adjust the bed level to bring it down and away, but sits in the same spot x/y. I'm currently having clogging issues but might be retraction settings getting ready to give it another try.
For an anycubic i3 mega works??
I’m going to upgrade my ender 3 pro with a micro Swiss direct drive hotend
..no need to relevel the heatbed???
+Bitplanebrother I had to do a very minor adjustment. But no full on relevel.
All-metal hot end replaced by all-metal hot end. Where's the upgrade?
The one removed had a PTFE liner in it!
Thanks for the answer!
thanks for sharing :-)
You should have said sir, that the aluminium heater block of Micro Swiss block is wrong manufactured (actually more like mirror projected to the stock heater block) ..... Not ''' this kit allows you to reuse your current heater block'''...ridiculous......we are paying money and we are allowed to use our old stuff..... The truth is.....well...you know it.....please say WHY is better to use the old heater block..
*WHOOSH*
... gets me every time :D
There are going to be so many people complaining of "under extrusion" and filament "jams" with that tiny titanium alloy heat-break, the contact area with the heat sink is minuscule and nonuniform. :(
You've got a very good point there, I'll try to get some feedback.
Titanium has low thermal conductivity, which is why is it used as a heat break, the point is to stop heat creeping up into the heat sink & causing jams. The small diameter of the heat break minimizes the area that the heat can be conducted through, so more of it stays where you want it- in the hotend.
My mistake, I believed titanium to have a higher conductivity than high carbon steel, still - in my experience - the heat break becoming too hot causes the filament to melt or soften around the opening and create a blockage. That was my experience with the Micro Swiss all metal hotend for the Wanhao (before remedying it with thermal paste) and the heatbreak - heatsink interface area is much larger than the CR-10 version. Though the designs are different, so I'm interested to see if Joel experiences any issues over long prints.
Hi, if I want to change the nozzle only, can I use this? s.aliexpress.com/mEjIBbMb?fromSns=
I'm a bit confused as Creality highlighted that the hot end is MK10 but they only sell MK8 Makerbot replacement nozzles.
Thanks.