Exclusive: TKB-022PM / ТКБ-022ПМ animation
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- Опубліковано 30 вер 2024
- Экслюзив: 3D анимация внутреннего устройства экспериментального автомата Коробова ТКБ-022ПМ. Подробнее об автомате: modernfirearms...
Exclusive: 3D animated video of the experimental Soviet TKB-022PM assault rifle by Korobov. More about the gun here: modernfirearms...
FINALLY there's a clear display of how this piece of soviet space magic works!
Cool words!
Just recently declassified?
Some months ago it was a HUGE PAIN in the butt to find out how this beast worked.
I'm sure all of this stuff was declassified long ago, it's just that they don't let any random guy dis-assemble museum pieces, but Max is known enough for him to be allowed to do so I assume.
I remember back when picture of TKB-022PM was first surface on the internet, a lot of people immediately call it fake and "will never work", now we have this video to show them, thanks Max Popenker
But you can understand them, because no-one thought that someone could come up with something so complex and functional lol.
I understand why, this is a very unconventional approach, Korobov was really thinking outside of the box with this design.
Can you imagine this thing in 5.45mm or 5.56mm? I think this design could be adapted into a very competitive modern rifle.
When they first popped up on the internet, I knew they were real because they in a museum, but I still couldn't wrap my head around the mechanism on how it fed without the bolt exiting the rear of the stock..
@@thermionicemission6355 I think one of the main problem is the magazine placement. Even with bullpup rifles you can see there is some distance between the end of the stock and the magazine however with this gun the magazine is right at the end of the stock which means under normal circumstance there would be no space for the bolt to cycle the rounds. Obviously there is a solution for that(as shown in the video) however, we wouldn't know it.
I never doubted it could work. The Steyr ACR has a similar and unconventional layout and it still works.
I really wasn't expecting the lack of a trigger bar, though; instead, it's a sliding hammer hitting a sort of "seesaw" striker. That's genius.
You can take the OTs-14 and turn it into a conventional AK with a folding stock, or you could take a SIG 551 and make that into a bullpup. This design, by comparison, cannot be made in a conventional layout. This thing is built from the ground up to be a bullpup.
Was looking for this for years. Finally I can rest in peace.
My God. It's a bullpup, self-loading Winchester falling block rifle. On crack.
...It's beautiful.
Closer to a Bofors 40mm., especially in function of the rammer, but totally adapted for a small arm, in the Bofors the massive cartridges were short-stroked forward and hit home via inertia, with intermediate cartridges in a firearm which could be fired from any position, it's not a good idea, gravity and other forces would affect it, so he made the rammer go all the way home! Genius design all-around.
If you think about it, it is about as complex as the Madsen, but it's also a bullpup.
well said good sir!
@@olekzajac5948 I was thinking about the old Madsen machinegun when I saw the bolt moving here. Another gun which was extremely ahead of its time.
wow. Beyond the black magic of designing the rifle with the best barrel to overall length ratio ever and that incredible feeding and extraction with forward ejection, all the way back in the 60s... the firing mechanism itself is amazing. Instead of a connector bar that pretty much all bullpups use (and that results into one of the most common complains about bullpups, i.e. mushy trigger) he went with a sort of striker-fired approach... only reversed and actuating on a hammer-lever... Truly unique design.
That could be easily mitigated by either lengthening the barrel slightly, so the case fall on the barrel and to the side, or adding a profiled damp to force them to the side.
@bacorable there is no way the case could interfer with the bullet, absolutly no way
I’m trying to draw the system but it’s so confusing I wish the video was slower and they took more time so I could draw it better but hey, at least I understand how it works
@@thebadlander3608 You can progress frame by frame on desktop by using period and comma keys. And slow down the playback in the menu.
@@thebadlander3608You know you can slow down the video right?
I think German Korobov deserved more acknowledgment for his incredible contributions . And by posting his work I think more people will give him more respect and admiration he deserves..
wouldn't even work
the bullets would just hit the casing flying out
unless the bullets fires before it comes out
@@Kadencabs there are close to a dozens guns with a similar design that work why don't you think this one would work... Keltic RFB , FN 2000 , are two that come to mind immediately. Sure the barrel is very short but I think with an addition of a suppressor this would be a great gun in fact that muzzle looks like it was designed to have a quick detach muzzle device like a suppressor,. By the way Korobov is the one who designed the magazine for the AK-47, he gave kalashnik of his magazines and Kalashnikov modified the AK to accommodate them since the magazines that Kalashnikov was previously using were more prone to failure..
@@Kadencabs also if you look at the design the injection gate has a spring on it and I'm sure that would be enough to deflect the cases to the side enough so they would not be aligned with the projectile. Also Korobov designed several quick detached muscle devices including suppressors that or similar to the osprey suppressors that are offset. Similar to the original Maxim suppressor..
@@Kadencabs also wouldn't even work as a strong statement... I think saying I don't think it would work would be more appropriate.. but I would disagree with both statements regardless,, is it the most practical weapon, no,, it would be prone to more chances of failure, highly likely , is it the an original very interesting engineering design, absolutely. Did Korobov designe innovative weapons that were in many ways very advanced in their forethought and possible use.. absolutely.. like I said I think Korobov was one of the most interesting designers , he designed many other mechanisms that were very original in their design and approach.. I think he would have been a magnificent teacher that would teaches students to think outside the boundaries and not to limit themselves to standardization of design.
@@Kadencabsit worked, well.
I have always been perplexed by this magnificent bakelite enigma. This puts a lot of things into perspective and allows for many different things to possibly come of it
Живу в Туле. Спасибо, дал посмотреть как это работает... Коробовские образцы бесподобны, лучшее, что есть в нашем музее.😂
Thank you, sir Max Popenker! for showing us the detailed animation of mythical TKB-022!
Funny how the F2000 was always seen as "futuristic" when it clearly was inspired by the TKB, except it's much, much more simple. The 22PM may be the most advanced firearm for it's time period, rivalling designs by the likes of John Moses Browning.
Honestly the guys at FN probably hadn't even heard of the TKB, or any other prototype soviet bullpups given the whole Cold War making access to russian records pretty much non existent.
What wouldst thou think about the H&K G11 K2? I think hits design swayed later bullpups...
I would be surprised if anyone at FN, or anyone at all in Belgium, had even heard as much as a description of the TKB. The only chance for a Westerner to have seen this beauty in those times must have been if they were a spy embedded in Russian arms design.
If FN knew about the TKB and how it worked, I think that the F2000 might have actually copied some of its more unconventional elements, maybe even the vertically traveling bolt.
@@volvagianintendo6465 The amazing thing about it is the mechnism, however unlike what we're told it was not designed by anyone over at H&K, the design was either bought or taken from an independent german inventor, because some people found a patent of it dating back to before H&K got their hands on it. Not that relevant but, imo an important note. Even if we are to assume it's dispersion in the hyperburst was low, the overheating of the chamber, the bulkiness and the really high recoil after each shot or burst are problems that I believe would have made it worse than one would think when first looking at it. The main one is overheating though, there's a reason the soviets dropped all research into caseless like a decade before any other military started talking about it and with such a chamber, the issues are multiplied. That's why the LMG version of H&K G-11 is a bit suspicious, but maybe it had some heat-spreading methods? I don't think there's any good pictures or info on it so not sure.
Negatives aside, I think it's real interesting / impressive and superior in most ways to what was used at the time by most of europe but I'm not sure I can agree with the swaying later bullpups statement though, in what way do you mean this? It did influence many other caseless projects though and was perhaps the most "ready" caseless firearm at the time. I think it's mechanism could actually be downscaled today and be absolutely amazing for PDWs and such, ultra-compact, without the delayed recoil though as that increases the size and dispersion is less of a concern for your typical DPW use.
Basically, I see the G-11 as something which was made worse than what it could have been, I think H&K perhaps even ruined the incredible design they got ahold of by not making multiple different power version fo the first, diversifying basically. The real killer (which is influenced by outdated military beliefs) is the above-intermediate cartridge power, had they worked with something with less recoil & less heat production, most of the negatives would be irrelevant. It's a cool piece of history though, and as much as I crapped on H&K, if someone else would have attempted it maybe the funding wouldn't even be there / they wouldn't bother, so other companies perhaps wouldn't have even done anything with the design.
Browning designs aren't exactly advanced. I find them to be sensible straightforward and very stout. But not complex.
Of all the things I woke up to yesterday morning... I was not expecting this. In some ways I am not sure what I expected but now that I have seen it, Korobov's genius cannot be understated.
Fantastic animation.
Возродить бы нынче заново.
Восхитительно!
Спасибо Максим!!
ТАК ДЕРЖАТЬ!!!
Someone get gun Jesus and AK Jesus @forgottenweapons @brandonherrera reaction to this.
Exactly how i imagined it to look!
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jk i had no friggin clue
I found a sketch of it's internals somewhere, but even with that I was still unable to guess it correctly, the sketch made it look like it was open-bolt and the rocket which hits the primer was actuated by the bottom arm hitting against the chamber, but here we see a totally different thing with a linear hammer. So, even with partial sketches available the design was hard to predict!
Наш советский сумрачный гений не уступает немецкому! ;)
Please do a series on all of German Korobov's guns. His designs are the most unique I've seen in guns.
I GENUINELY thought these were relics that simply did not work, this animation is incredible! Look at how that trigger pull works, that's great... eliminates sloppy trigger pulls wouldn't it?
God, I’d pay a considerable sum for blueprints
Это не ролик, это просто песня!)
Any chances there will be a video of you and Ian discussing Korobov's weapons on the Forgotten Weapons channel?
well, I'd say that it's a possibility ;)
Момент экстракации гильзы доставляет. Я так понимаю что там не просто отдельная деталь (извлекатель) А целых две детали хитро соединённые. В анимации заметен подвижный лоток внутри извлекателя. Да интересно а как его вообще разбирать? Хотя узел газового двигателя вполне доступен. Я думал будет хуже. УСМ тоже классно сделан ( без сарказма). По сути просто ударник с обратным движением и рычаг в затворе. Не очень понятно осуществляется постановка на предохранитель и переключение режимов стрельбы? И да это реально самый булпапаный булпап. ВСЕ элементы автоматики и УСМ "размазаны"- распределены по всей длине оружия. Баланс конечно ( с магазином) сильно задний, но какая самая тяжёлая часть у этого автомата ( после магазина), я думаю что толкатель( он же затворная рама) и расположен он сильно впереди, как часть УСМ.
Korobov woke up that day and decided to bulpup a bulpup, we need more like him today and Keltech can only do so much
вроде это один из вариантов, потому что видел схему ТКБ-022ПМ, где гильза выбрасывается вниз
@@СтаниславШукало вариант который долго ходил по интернету, кустарно нарисованный с выбросом гильзы вниз сильно надуманный. У ткб 022пм не возможен выброс гильзы вниз. Слишком плотная компоновка.
@@СтаниславШукало Этот вариант - отсебятина того, кто не зная конструкции просто предположил такую схему.
Impressive weapon, I am always intrigued by its mechanism, one of my favorites and with this video I like it more ....... as I would like to have it in my collection, Amazing.....thanks for the video....
Thank you so much I've been wondering how this was design since I was a kid this is my favorite designer and one if not the most interesting guns ever in my opinion.. Thank you so much for your time ,
Good Lord this is awesome! Thank you for showing us how true Soviet space magic works!
Sick until a case falls into your line of fire
Never thought I'd see the day, thank you!
Music fits the overall complexity of design
I've red about Korobov maybe dozen years ago, and still thinking this was a totally underestimated designer... maybe one of the first "bullpups" ever... THX Max for this awesome video!!!
Actually, he designed a bullpup during WW2, which competed against the AK, but lost due to a few issues, also bullpups weren't seen as a good idea then so even if he made a perfect one the Ak would have won either way, in my opinion.
Ууух, давно я искал подобный ролик, а нашел только сейчас. Спасибо огромное за работу!
Коробов конечно гений дизайна. Выглядит как оружие из 21 века.
RUSSIAN GUN JESUS!!!
I've always thought the Flatline assault rifle from Titanfall/Apex had its magzine placement too far back to have cycling mechanisms. Welp I stand goddamn corrected.
Outstanding animation very much needed in the West
Учитывая длину ствола в соотношении с общей длиной данного автомата идея Коробова, вероятно, была в том, чтобы заключить максимальную убойность и точность оружия в минимальную длину оного. И это, чёрт возьми, получилось гениально! 👍👍👍
This is magnificently animated! I was afraid the west would never learn how this funky thing worked.
Thank you for the work, Maxim and the rest of the team!!
(I'm poliorcetes at Tony's autogun forum)
BTW A lot of us would really appreciate a second animation in order to locate all the weak points... because I couldn't identify so much small pieces.
Besides, this design is really closed against dirt and particles... I would assume that the problem is more related with difficulty to access to the chamber in case of any kind of malfunction
The main "problem" was it was way too ahead of it's time, really the only legitimate issue the army mentioned was that it was rear-heavy, the only other problem they had was worries of it not surviving storage, which now we know is not an issue, since polymer guns are the norm now, not to mention only a short while after these guns were designed USSR adopted mags made of the same material, so..
@@thermionicemission6355 The main problem was that it is too complex and had to many intricate parts to mass produce, and would’ve been a PITA to field strip. Way too much of expensive nightmare to get these into the hands of every Soviet soldier. Complex guns are never good for a nation’s main infantry force. Simple, cost effective, and rugged designs that get the job done (like the venerable AK) will always be superior. No military now or in the future will ever adopt such a complex design. Special forces are the only place it would find it’s niche, like how the AN-94 did to an extent. It’s an amazing feat of engineering, especially for its time. But it’s just too convoluted to be a viable standard rifle.
@@xthee_0nly_1x11it’s actually fairly simple, it’s just that the USSR was fairly conservative militarily and relied heavily on poorly trained conscripts which is why they also refused to adopt an earlier design by Korobov which was a delayed blowback competitor to the AKM which was better but refused on the basis that Soviet troops would need to be retrained on it (keep in mind it was also very similar to the AK ergonomically and economically it wouldn’t have required much if any new tooling aside from stamping which they were already swapping over to for the AKM). The only complex part of this gun is how it extracts spent cartridges, a simpler solution would just to do what the Kel-tec RBD does and just drop them down behind the mag. However this is the simplest bolt design for a gun as it’s a falling block, the gas system isn’t even there to move the bolt but to simply extract the rounds which a falling block is normally unable to do in a semi-auto configuration.
my brain hurts from just trying to comprehend everything that is going on at the same time
Now I finally understand how this thing works. Fascinating.
Масса бОльшая подвижных частей. БОльший ЛИНЕЙНЫЙ момент инерци в РАБОТЕ. Я вижу в правильной кинематике затворную раму лучшего пистолета отодвинутую к прикладу и ствол от плеча до разумной динны максимально использующую мощность патрона. При минимально возможном весе, не учитывая вес магазина. Чем не схема?
Can we get the files for this animation or the diagrams used to make this?
Must have been a nightmare to clear a malfunction on this.
Sure it's kinda advanced for its time. The trigger mechanism also is probably pretty good.
But overall definitely a technological dead end.
It's made to have a very good barrel to overall length ratio. But I don't think you would be gaining much in doing this. Today we have lot of rifles with traditional mechanics and folding stocks. Something like the TKB-022PM is a solution to a very minor problem.
Отличная анимация. Автору респект.
i always wondered how the flatline from apex/titanfall works being how the magazine is so far back. this would explain it
*sees the gun*
*is confused on how the fuck it works*
*watches this video*
*proceeds to wonder what kind of drugs korobov used to do.*
Thank you very much. Now waiting for TKB-011, TKB-059, Smerch bullpup from aks74u trials and TKB-0146 from project abakan.
Tkb 0146 internal was published on kalashnikov magazine and can be found on TFB by hrachya h in english.
@@cgdg7075 Thanks
I don't think there was even a functional prototype of the smerch and little is known about it
I've wondered how does it work for years. I finally see, and it's far beyond my imagination. Damn.
This thing is real neat. From what I can make out (I could be wrong)...
It feeds like a PKM but in reverse (claw push ammo from mag into chamber and not pull out from links).
Cases are extracted and ejected like F2000 and especially the RFB.
And the locking action is a falling block, not different from an artillery piece or a Bofors 40mm gun.
Soviet space magic indeed.
Это у F2000 гильзы выбрасываются как у ТКБ022! Надо быть точнее в высказываниях! Конструктор А2000 был ещё в сперме у своего папочки,когда ТКБ Коробова разрабатывался.
So beautiful. Words alone cannot describe my joy...
This is the bullpup'est bullpup to ever bullpup
Thank you for the video! It's amazing how intuitive the mechanism is for such an unorthodox design
the only trouble part about this gun is you have a high chance shooting a case on auto.
This is based
Огромное спасибо ! Не заслуженно забытое оружие .Thank you so much ! An undeservedly forgotten weapon. 👍👏
So basically the FS2000 but Soviet! And made in the 1960s. Russia firearms were heads of its time.
Yeah. And this design literally asks for a mag on the top of the stock
no, actually they never where ahead of anyone. Korobov was an interesting dude however, unlike other boring russian/soviet copy-pasters.
@@levanpkh6882 lol, balanced-action rifles, semi-auto WW2 rifles with automatic fire mode, shifted recoil rifles...yeah, never and boring)
@@saint_alucardwarthunder759 stick to playing warthunder
@@levanpkh6882 stick to copy-pasting myths about soviet copy-pasters
Want to watch OSV-94 9A-91 animations，thanks
15 years of curiosity. Finally.
это очень правильно, что это великолепие не пустили в серию и не поставили на вооружение:
《НЕЗАКОННО БЫТЬ ТАКОЙ КРАСИВОЙ》(С)
Из-за ненадёжности и трудностей устранения задержек.
I can picture Kel-Tec engineers taking notes while watching this video, ready to remake this monstrosity
Wow! I was always wondering about the mechanism of one of my all time favorite rifles TKB-022PM.(the craziest bullpup design ever)
There has always been so little information about this weapon and I can't believe that I'm seeing this right now!
German Korobov = pure genius
Korobov straight up invented the ejection system used on the RFB and F2000.
This is a great animation, but there's still two things I don't understand. How does that striker rod along the bottom of the rifle operate when the trigger is held down or doesn't latch into it? It seems like the trigger would get jammed if it was held down throughout the operating cycle. At 1:09 you can actually see the sear seemingly move on its own to release the striker repeatedly.
Secondly, that small tube above where the empty cases are held is the piston/gas tube, right? how does the gas from the barrel actually enter that to push against the bolt, since the magazine for the casings is in between it and the barrel? Is there some channel for gas that I'm not seeing, or am I misinterpreting something?
First: it wouldn't. At least I don't think so. If the trigger is held down, it'll simply go back and forth since it has spring and locking mechanism has enough energy to push it back.
Second: Cost me plenty of time, but I figured it out. Remember this axis right under the barrel with a spring(it's above the triggering mechanism)? There's a gas tube inside of it. I wasn't able to believe, but it's really so. Rewatch it carefully.
so thats where the bolt go.....
It definitely inspired the design of the Pulsar smg in Cyberpunk 2077, additionally the forward ejection reminds me of the Keltec RFB line.
I think this is more reliable than fn2000
RIP if you have a double feed.
Indeed. Steyr ACR has many of these elements (rammer, elevator) but a double feed is impossible due to push-through chambering and ejecting. Also the rounds are telescoped and the primers are annular, so there's that.
You see Ivan when foolish western capitalist fire bullet he throw away casing. This is wateful so we fire casing after bullet for full use of cartridge.
Russian casing is made of steel. It is cheap enough.
I am also interested in A91M and ADS, I am interested in all Forward-ejection
Havent seen the fired case guiding pipe but in multiple news articles and blogs says that the ejection mechanism can be compared to the one on the fn f2000 which can be seen on worldofguns.
Soviet FN2000
Huh. A falling block 7.62x39... never thought about that
People don't realized, if your an autist for details, this game is potentially the main lead up for making the halo AR, especially the caliber... I think the Halo AR uses 7.62. If anyone can confirm that.
This was a life saver, i've only had the Steyr ACR as a reference for such vertical bolt designs. Now with two of these it will certainly shine a lot of light.
Kriss vector too, i think
One failure to feed you you have to disassemble the hole rifle I guess ..
È molto bella ed esotica!!!
Ma come si risolve un un inceppamento???
Qual'e' lo smontaggio ????
Che bella e misteriosa ...come una sirena
So fucking good, thank you so much for the video
I feel bad for the person who would have to fix one of these if it got jammed
Ok... I have so many questions about this thing even after watching this video. How does everything attach? Is it all connected to the barrel? How do you field strip it? Are most of the parts a steel stamping? How does the hammer stay oriented correctly on the spring guide rod? How does the gas system work? Short stroke gas piston? Where is the gas port in the barrel for the gas piston if the spent shell tube is on top of the barrel?
I'm glad in the weirdest way possible to be confused because I never knew you could do a firearm this way! :D
Макс когда будет книга про нарезы в стволах и скорости пуль а также типы оболочек и тюльпаны с ободками.
It looks like it'd work in such a mind bogglingly batty way, but... It's quite brilliantly simple, really.
I do wish Ian would hurry up and do this on forgotten weapons
I wish someone would clone this thing. Surely the patent has expired by now, right?
@@theflyingwelshman5338 cohort, I bet you're right.
I might try and do one
wow! I designed something similar but completely upside down with the block going up, traditional striker and switchable ejection to either side. this is a very elegant solution. the ejection can be simplified further with the use of completely controlled case handling and ejection to the right where a traditional rifle like the ar would. I am building this!
TKB-517 please.
This is great, but i wish there was more effort spent on making it easier to understand. Check out vbbsmyt channel, he does tutorial level animations, absolutely glorious.
My god... It's beautiful.
0:44 - Can this thing extract the unfired round? It looks like the moving ramp of the ejection chute passes close to the case mouth through the space where the bullet was. What if there is an unfired bullet in the case?
вот нафига постоянно ракурс менять?
... так-то оно круто, но при стрельбе вверх, предыдущая гильза может выкатиться из "трубки удалительной" и зажмёт ту, которая вытягивается из ствола "ухватом специальным"...
Подвижный патронник??
Thank you for answering some very burning questions a friend and I had
I always wondered how this gun could load rounds from a magazine that far back
01:14 Подпружиненная шторка. Офигеть!
Beautiful 😍
How many shell casings were accidentally shot when firing that thing?
I cant even understand where the gas block is...
right behind the front iron sight (above extraction pipe)
I've never had my jaw drop till I saw this.
Good on ya, Max
this it amazing sir 👍👍👍
И ролики, и книги Максима всегда максимально прекрасны))
Весь бакелит сожрал в союзе
Korobov was definitely ahead of his time, but there has to be a way to simplify his design. A rifle that short would be a game changer for any war.