I don’t understand Abby haters. Abby wanted revenge and people who hate her for that seem to forget that Ellie did the same thing and killed everyone dearest to Abby.
I agree, but I think that it has to do with people knowing and loving Ellie for longer now, as well as the fact that, yes, they both did the same thing, but Abby did it first. Idk, that's what I've gathered
What put me off was when she said "good" after learning Dina was pregnant and was about to kill her. Yes she did this cause of Mel's death but personally I can't forgive her for that, like that was too far for me. I spent several hours as Abby learning about her and starting to empathize with her thinking she was being redeemed through Lev and Yara. Just for her to throw it all away and completely regress back to the same Abby that killed Joel out of pure hatred. That's just my feelings on it and I just don't like her character and like Ellie much better. So when Im forced to watch Abby destroy Ellie physically, emotionally, and mentally just to end off well better than Ellie. Not scott free like some say but Abby had Lev, while Ellie has nobody. The game also really put me off with Abby saying "I would sacrifice myself" to her dad cause that felt like such a slap in the face and like the game was trying to give Abby the moral high ground (which some see it as).
It's good to see that there are some people who actually understand Abby instead of them saying "LOOK AT HOW SHE KILLED MY BOIII" Looking at you Angryjoeshow
commenting to stay on the pro-abby side of youtube😭 i get not liking her bc she killed joel but the way people purposely disregard the entire plot of the game to blindly hate on her. and thats not even mentioning the people making trans jokes and attacking the voice actor
Abby is one of my favorite video game characters ever. She killed one of, if not the most beloved characters in this medium and yet I feel for her on an emotional level. That is a testament to how great this game is. Laura Bailey’s performance matched with the complexity of her character is some of the most refreshing character writing I’ve ever seen. Good characters are bad people doing good things and good people doing bad things. Joel wasn’t any better than her, he was blinded by his own selfishness. But yet we hate a vengeful daughter of man he killed who spared Ellie not once but twice. Abby showed remorse even after Ellie killed all her friends. The reason she did this was because she had someone to think about, a reason to survive and that was Lev. And that is exactly what Joel did and we don’t hate him for it, down purely to perspective. I find that fascinating and the game, a masterpiece. In fact I think it’s the greatest video game story of all time.
THANK YOU for writing down my feelings about this great Character! TLOU II does not touch me emotionally at all in the first part of the game but the second one does, even after the fifth time of playing it. Cannot describe how brilliant the Storytelling and Character development of Abby ist. No words for it...
I really relate to Abby. I was a female Special Operations soldier. I lost two people in a very violent way, and I went off the deep end for a long time. I wanted to kill the people who killed my team. I was empty for those years, and lost them to that anger, hatred and grief. Abby showed me how to break the cycle.
Totaly agree with all the points made. I wanted to hate her at first, but with this excellent portrayal of there being two sides to every story, i soon found it impossible to hate her. I love Abby's Character and who she is. Granted she is a little two muscular for a world where a persons nutrition goals will rarely be reached for muscular growth. But she does have a pretty face and a heart of gold surrounded by an incredible hulk aesthetic that is a little two intentional haha! Still love her though.
I know you made this comment two years ago lmao but I don't think she was too muscular for what soldiers in the WLF are given to eat. One of the first things we see in the stadium is a fully stocked farm. Also, Abby is clearly one of Isaac's favorites due to her strength and the numbers of Seraphites she was able to kill. I think it wouldn't be that much of a stretch to say that she might get bigger portions than other soldiers because of all of that (even though we have no proof of that, I could just see it happening with the way Isaac is) Anyways, just a thought I had. Maybe other people are also going down the Abby rabbit hole and might see this :)
I'm built close to this and I eat a relatively low calorie vegan diet (as do many athletes in the Olympics apparently like 11%) I was relatively built before I started working out as well so I guess at the end of the day it's just genetics 🤷♀ I also get bloodwork constantly and have near zero testosterone I never get harassed for it either so in Abby's case I do believe it was peer pressure internet influence.
I found Abby to be really cool, her storyline was more interesting and some of her gameplay segments were outstanding (especially the rat king boss). On the otherhand I found Ellie to be a rude, disrepectful and ill mouthed through the whole game. Im glad Dina left her. Ellie finished the game empty handed lol. She deserved it. Also when I seen Abby in Santa Barbara hung up, it was very emotional. She had lost all her muscle and cute round face. Dont know why this game got so much hate, I found it be amazing. The story was strong and easy to follow. I believe it deserved game of the year, even though I'm a big fan of Ghost Of Tsushima.
My mouth dropped when I found Abby like that I was literally not okay for some time 😳😔... and I really hated Ellie for fighting her with the knife after that ... I get that she wanted closure but Abby at that point was just a shell of her usual self. In a way lucky for Ellie otherwise she wouldn’t have stood a chance without her knife
She is such a tragic character. Her father and her community as in the fireflies was ripped from her by Joel. She joined the WLF with the dream of getting her revenge on Joel. Issac weaponized Abby's grief. Using her to kill countless scars, and giving her the gear and training to make her dream a reality.
@@Keolas_multiverse you’re right, I never thought about how Isaac probably used her grief like that. Screwed over by yet another person. She deserves better 🥲
Exactly what i felt! Thank you! In the end i even thought Ellie was the final Boss and you were forced to kill her and quite honestly, i would have LOVED it! Not because i "hate" Ellie but i would have loved the dramatic twist and because i like Abby that damn much. I played this Game free of Spoilers and i honestly thought that killing Ellie was the real reason why this game was hated so intense.
What people don't get is that Abby is pretty much the female Joel. The world took two honest good people and threw their lives in a fucking blender and hit puree. Sure, Joel's decision to execute the doctors and the fireflies was questionable at best [muffled under breath] even though the fireflies are fucking morons who don't know their asses from a hole in the ground. However it was all to save Ellie. Also Abby didn't know about Joel's motivations at the time and spent the next 4-5 years hating him until it became an obsession. Now fast forward a little bit to when Abby meets Lev, and the two of them develop a similar familial relationship, and when Lev is threatened by the WLF (who were like Abby's family at the time), Abby responds in the same fashion as Joel!
She is nothing like joel. Joel showed remorse and was scarred by the things he did. He never willingly tortured people who didn't deserve it. Abby knew what was happening to ellie in the hospital. The whole joel death was stupid because he'd never walk into that
You’re right. Joel didn’t torture people who deserved it. He tortured people who didn’t. Plus, Abby was also scarred by the things SHE did. Owen talked about Joel’s death and Abby got all stuttery and shit- she was guilty. It was pretty obvious if you could pay attention. And Joel did deserve it. He killed 100s.. maybe even 1000s of people innocents included. “But some of them deserved it!!” Well as a wise man, Lee Everett, once said- - “Innocent or not, It’s still killing.” @@robogreek3157
@@robogreek3157 Joel did not show remorse for anybody, have you not played the damn game? Let’s rewind back to TLOU I, when Ellie was captured by David. He willingly tortured two men who were simply doing their job. He tortured them both with beatings and one with a knife. He asked them to mark something on the map, he did. He died anyways. He went up to the other dude who should’ve been let go, but nope! He killed him too. He showed ZERO remorse. They were just following the rules of their leader, not saying it was right, but they knew no better. Joel did deserve death as he quite literally DOOMED the world lil bro
@@nibba134That person was wrong for saying Joel showed remorse cause he didn’t (even though I wouldn’t in his situation either tbh) but they are right that Joel and Abby are not the same. Joel would never kill for petty revenge like Ellie and Abby. He killed for survival
I love Abby and I love Ellie both so much and I feel like in a way they both peel of each others character arc: * They both have tight father figures: Ellie and Joel, and Abby and her Dad * they both have nightmares/PTSD about their respective fathers death. * they both gave up love for revenge. * they both have the opportunity to kill each other but they don’t. * they both have an adopted Asian child. * they are both so strong and driven and brave I feel like they would never be friends even if they didn’t have revenge against each other because they are too similar, but I feel like they would both respect each other tremendously.
Imo I like Abby more then Ellie Joel killed her dad so Abby killed Ellie’s (I’m aware Joel isn’t actually her father) but I can’t help but think it was just revenge nothing more Abby is sweet and has a great story but please don’t attack me my opinion
@@sus-el8li If you are still wondering why the majority of people hate Abby, is because instead of giving her her own game and story, Naughty Dog decided to destroy everything the first game built, and replace Joel and Ellie with Abby and Lev. Keep in mind the ONLY reason the first game worked at all was because of Joel and Ellie. So it was stupid for them to get rid of the one thing people loved about the first game. Also, the game ONLY works for small percentage of people who never liked Joel and Ellie to begin with. Most people dont believe Joel was a villain saving his surrogate daughter by any means necessary. Its the apocalypse after all. All that matters is family. Abby is for the morally complex and superior people who don't believe in killing anybody because they might have a sad backstory.
@@fatherlessapricot5790 this is not true. Most of us loved Ellie and Joel and cherish the first game. However, most of us are mature enough to understand that Joel was no hero. His actions were selfish and were only made to benefit himself. Ellie didn't want to be saved. She wanted to be the cure for everyone. Joel, being selfish, took that choice away from her because he looked at her as a daughter (since he lost his real daughter). He killed unarmed doctors who were the only ones capable of creating a cure. So Joel was the real villain. We pretty much all hated Abby during Ellie's gameplay. But once you play as Abby, you see that her and Ellie are very similar.
@@alexsaltertv She never chose. She was asleep during the entire Firefly ending of the first game. Had they asked for consent, it would have been a different story. All Joel knew was they were going to kill her regardless of what she said to "possibly" get a cure that wouldn't help at all because the world was already too far gone, and the Fireflies would rule everything cherry picking who got the potential vaccine or not. It wasn't worth it at all. I shouldn't have said "never liked" joel. I should have said "thought he was the villain of TLOU". Most people don't think he was. He did a lot of terrible things, but overall most if not all people would do the same things in his shoes. He loved Ellie, and at the end of the first game, Ellie kinda knows Joel was lying but was willing to play along to spare him any guilt he would have. They completely botch that in the second game when she freaks out at him and acts surprised he saved her life. And its the apocalypse. Everything anyone does anymore HAS to be for themselves in some way. Anyone who lived completely selflessly died a long time ago.
I refused to play the game for years and got it on a deep deep sale, after playing it I felt like it was better than part 1 and that Abby was a fantastic character. Thank you for this video
When i first had TLOU II in my hands i thought "Well, it cannot be better than the first game", but when i went through all the emotions this game inflicts, i had to admit, it is absolutely fantastic and yeah, it is even better than part I.
Yesterday this had 8 dislikes, guess someone changed their mind! Btw, thank you, this really made me happy, I put a lot of effort into making this video and I thought it was a complete disaster for a second, this comment made me think otherwise. Thank you for giving it your time! :)
Very well made. She is the product of her environment and experiences. They could have made an entire game building up her character and then had a third game that was part 2. You could have loved her character like you do Ellie and it would have changed everything.
Actually a really good point although the story is about an immune girl and that needs to be either resolved by a cure or ambiguous in part 3 , maybe the franchise could have done your theory and had a part 4 as well
THIS. i loved abby’s story and i understood why she did what she did, but i do feel like a major pacing adjustment would’ve definitely softened the blow a little bit by opening us more up to abby but i guess the point is to leave players distraught and confused just as ellie was
Serial killers are also a product of their experiences and environment. Yet they are rightfully seen as repellent monstrous individuals who prey on those unable to defend themselves. Yet those monstrous people have more of an excuse than Abby does. Most serial killers did not have a loving parent like Abby. Someone who not only loved them but taught them the difference between right and wrong, as well as how to be a compassionate humanbeing. Abby actively sought out an environment and experiences where she would go on to murder and torture, god knows how many, seraphites long before she ran into Joel. And I know that killing in inevitable in this post apocalyptic world but there is a difference between combatants/survivors and war criminals. I dont care how scrawny or nice someone was before they became a war criminal. To willingly and easily inflict unnecessary suffering on helpless individuals is abhorrent behavior that, in my opinion, has no return path to redemption.
Hated her at first but after the full story she is my favorite character,i tried to put myself into her place ,she never meet joel before to her he is just a killer who took most important person in her life so no wonder she hated him and wanted revenge
The reason why everyone hates abby and loves Joel is the fact that we first met joel and then Abby.Now ia am not saying that Joel is bad,i love him the most like everyone else,but people need to understand Abby.She is basically did the same thing that Ellie is trying to do: Getting revenge for her parents death.Thats the only bad thing she did.( Also killing wolves snd seraphites.) But remember that she: Helped 2 helpless kids from dying Killed a giant infecfed that no one else managed to even damage him, Went through hell to save a girls life and left ellie and alive twice. Such an underrated character..
Finally someone said it,i honestly find Abby more interesting than Ellie,I love her,She is so pure and warm hearted,maybe this is why she tries to hide her goodness and tries to be "cold" but I understand her. Plus immature people are the ones who wanted Abby's death,Nobody wants to say that Abby saved 2 people,took care of them,took care of a dog,helped Mel even thought they weren't really close as friends because of Owen,literally abby is better than everyone,She's admirable because NOBODY would be so good in a zombie apocalypse, So people need to admire her.
@@dangerrouswomann i agree,but as i said,i love Joel more than any other game character.I still want Abby to die bc of what she did to my fav game character.She is great person,but a horrible character,unlike Joel
I think at the end of the day, causing damage to each other so badly until near dead, it was never the point of it between Ellie and Abby they both been through extremely shit tough situations, Joel only wanted to save Ellie and screw the world but not her. and because of that he killed Abby's father (i wish the first game would ever gave us the choice to leave them alive, but I see the point of that to create another history and make us understand Abby's actions. At the beginning I hated her so much for what she did to Joel, but then I understand why she did what she did, she was paying tribute and getting revenge for her father, maybe some people would disagree with me and i don't care this is my point of view. Life´s so damn hard and sometimes we take wrong choices because we think that are the right ones even though by doing "the right thing" would be good for you for other people we made a big mistake. Revenge never is a good choice, actually is hurting you more and more. Try to understand and be empathetic with the other side and forgive
People who hate this game are idiot's honestly. Their opinions suck ass. Abby is an amazing character and the last of us 2 is a great story. People who hate it because joel died are silly and probably not the smartest tool in the shed. Ellie would have done the same thing if she was in abbys shoes.
I like to think this game perfectly embodies the audience with Ellie. They’re all so blinded with hatred against Abby for killing Joel, solely for their attachment to him. They ignore that Joel killed her father for his own selfish reasons, and that Ellie does exactly what Abby was willing to do later on: killing anyone who gets in her way on a petty quest for revenge.
What if you found out who your father really was. That he conducted unethical, immoral and anti-scientific experiments on people that cost them their lives. Abby would've been killed and as a parent he did the right thing
Thanks for this video. I am very much team Abby and I can’t wait to send this to a lot of TLOU fans who dislike TLOU2 and couldn’t make it past the Joel scene.
I just don't understand how people can be angry with Abby for killing Joel and not with Joel for killing her dad... I didn't like Joel at the end in the first game and after the second game I didn't like Ellie... Abby was a perfect character😍🤧
I know right? I mean Joel gets away with killing Abby's dad and many fireflies, but Abby doesn't get away with killing Joel just because she did it with a golf club? I understand that there are feelings involved, but it's just a huge double standard imo! Same goes for Ellie and Tommy, people can't stand Abby, but Ellie killed every friend Abby had, including the person she loved the most at the time, and Tommy killed Manny ruthlessly, but somehow that's okay even though Abby suffered a lot and had to go through many losses? I get that many people might not like Abby's character, I don't have a problem with that, I have a problem with the reasons and not trying to see things from different perspectives! Also, thanks for your comment and taking the time to watch the video!
I would have been in royal big time tears if Ellie killed Abby at the end because I didn't want it. I love Abby, she was a true strong warrior. I was literally upset at Ellie for leaving her family (JJ, Dina) it was ridiculous...to get revenge..that made so upset...and it made me root harder for Abby... I'm just glad that Abby survived and more proud that Ellie let her go... there's no way I can ever love Ellie the same though because she's too consumed with hate...hate will do anyone in at the end of the day...Joel is gone...she needs to accept that...and never once is she thankful that Abby spares her life NOT ONCE but TWICE!! Abs is a real one!
I think when Owen tells her she's good with kids Abby looks away because he's implying that she'd be a good mother and she probably wants a family but he's literally starting a family with Mel so she's like, don't even go there cause that's not an option. I think. Love this video. May your survival be long.
Could not agree more with this. Exactly how i felt. A real roller coaster of a ride. Kind of like the pre loge of The Last of us. When they killed Joels daughter. Iactually had to turn the game off as a father i was so mad. But i loved Abby at the end ngl
This is really well explained. It’s so poorly demonstrated in the game but the way you explain it, her character makes perfect sense. Man I wish I could’ve seen her this way while I was playing the game.
no bc i feel this 😭 like her character story ofc is great, ill admit that, but i cant move past her killing joel to admit shes a good person 😭 character plot wise interesting? yes, i just didnt care to learn it and lowk still dont bc of joel 😭 which imo is understandable, he was the main person you play as, you grow attached to characters. and then to have to play as the girl who killed him? 😭😭 mannnnn, gameplay was fun. but also just dragged for me bc i dont care for abby. asides all that tho, she is a well developed and interesting character. i think sm are like me, when playing and even watching, theyre hurt by joels death so they dont pay attention to her play through/dont care to 😭
@@alphavasson5387i think my reply could speak for them, ik you werent asking me but i wanted to give input lol. alot of people have said that maybe if abby was introduced prejoels death, like shown her reasoning prior to it, it would feel less daunting to play as her. i mean maybeeee? but then i feel like it would just immediately wipe away any good feelings players had for her bc at the end of the day, it was joel. but i think at the end of the day abby character was made to make players feel confused, on if shes liked or disliked or whatever. i think they tried to redeem her, which i do understand and got it, but i just dont like her at the end of the day, which i think is ok 😭
I don’t understand how everyone can hate Abby so much, yeah she killed Joel, the main character in p1 and one of the most loved of all, but realistically, he killed her dad. All she did was get revenge to settle her mind. Joel started the whole thing, although it was out of love for ellie. Personally I love Abby as a character and she might be my favourite overall, as 1. She is able to show mercy for Ellie twice (firstly when she kills Joel and lets Ellie go, secondly when she spares her and Dina in the theatre) 2. Killing Joel was just her serving justice. 3. She goes against the WLF to help two seraphite children, as she realises they are only kids, and don’t deserve the same fate as many other seraphites who have actively fought against the WLF
I actually disagree with a lot of these points. I think these plot points you mentioned show just how terrible she is. I actually believe she is a downright horrible person and doesn’t even have a heart of gold. The way she killed Joel and the context that came with it really made me hate her to the point that she was irredeemable in my eyes. Joel had saved her life less than an hour ago. If she had a little bit of hesitation or had at least taken that into consideration before killing him, she would have been a little better though maybe not enough to make her redeemable in my eyes. When it comes to what I learned about her character from that scene. I learned she has no sense of gratitude and possibly no moral compass. Any attempts to humanize her afterwards was simply too little too late. Her lack of a moral compass and lack of a sense of loyalty is mostly illustrated when she turns on the WLF and kills many of her friends and comrades in arms without pity or mercy. Turning on the WLF is fine. A lot of stories have characters betraying their comrades in arms but the fact that she didn’t seem to feel anything implies she never really cared. If they wanted her to save the two seraphite kids then they needed to handle it with more care. As for Dina. Yes she spared her but one second ago she was going to take personal pleasure in the thought of knowingly killing a pregnant lady. It’s one thing to kill a pregnant lady because she is an enemy combatant (which is what happened when Ellie killed Mel). It’s a completely different story when you’re doing it willingly with sadistic pleasure. That scene tells me she has a callous disregard for human life. If I had built up any respect for the character despite my refusal to sympathize with her. It was all gone at that moment and it was never coming back. The way I see it. The story itself had a good idea but the execution was horrible. Abby is a great character only on paper. Although I find it incredibly interesting that we learn two different things when we both saw the same character performing the same action. Some people are willing to excuse her deeds while others are not. If we’re really going to talk about the idea of characters having their own perspectives and biases. I think the audience also has a right to be biased towards certain characters. I was biased toward Ellie so I was willing to look the other way and sometimes even cheer when Ellie killed Abby’s friends. At the same time I was biased against Abby so I wasn’t willing to look the other way when she turned on her own comrades or showed a lack of empathy for others.
@@SleepyGummino i can see why you would think that but i disagree, i think both characters are very well balanced in their actions and i think that neither character is the 'bad guy' in their situation. They both went through very similar things and the way that they both seek justice and still maintain an air of humility about them makes them both the best characters in the game, and equal in moral high ground.
The cruccial differente between the two is when both face the point of no return of violence, one decide to give their violent ego instead of the other (Abby about to kill Dinah at the theater). But all of this just during 99% during the game time, until Elli, just when she is about to finish Abby drowning her, has a vision of the same mistakes that Joel had and is illuminated by a weird and distorted satori and give up at all, losing everything... Congrats man, you got the idea. You definetly have a good heart, a heart worth to make us fight for this world.
Ellie, instead of learning from Joel´s mistakes, incorporated his thirsty for revenge, and end losing literally everything, Him, Dinah, her baby, and the capacity to reconected to Joel´s memories through out the guitar ´cause she lost her fingers... Man, this is a masterpiece that overcomes cinema and presents us a genuine new art form.
I remember being so shocked about Joel’s death that I was angry at naughty dog, I didn’t like that we had to play as Abby but continued on, then I had an understanding of her, even though at that point I was still angry at the game, but what killed all of the anger at the game for me was seeing the late game Joel and Ellie scene, it changed my view of the game and I forgave it all, that’s how you know this game company is really good at what they do, at least for me
Ok, so, months have passed since I made this video. The amount of effort I put into this is insane, it took me 5 entire days to record & edit this + all the time I spent watching the cutscenes and analyzing stuff. Seeing the backlash it received really hurt, at first, but I want to thank every person that took their time to comment, like and share some love. I appreciate you guys, a lot. It got to a point where hate comments don't get to me at all anymore, because the love is way stronger. So, thank you, guys. At one point there were more dislikes than likes, then at one point people started to appreciate the video and look what you did! 70 Likes! This is insane! I've been thinking about creating a whole series about the TLOU characters, I have some ideas in mind for Ellie, Dina and Owen atm, but I'll take my time to work on them. I have also been thinking about doing a separate video for Joel, I will for sure in the future, but it's gonna be hard, it'll take a lot of time, might work on it when the TLOU Remake drops, along with a Gameplay. Again, thank you guys for the support. :) Aaaand, let me know if there's anything you'd want me to work on, maybe you'll hear my strong-ass-italian accent again soon haha!
“Abby was a monster for killing Joel the way she did.” *Ellie tortures Nora with a pipe in the same exact way..* As far as Abby just saying “Good” in finding out Dina was pregnant, imagine what Abby was thinking in that moment. Is it possible she thought Ellie killed Mel KNOWING she was pregnant bc her jacket was left open? I mean, that would be my guess. Abby was just giving back to Ellie what Ellie did to her. But lev stopped her before she could. So the “good” to me, was Abby just trying to make it even. Then Ellie took it one step further by sticking a knife to a child’s neck threatening to kill lev if Abby didn’t fight her. So, In the end, who acted the worst in their revenge?
Also, when Ellie sets out on her revenge mission, she has no idea what Joel did to the people who killed him. For all she knows it could be someone Joel royally fucked over a decade ago and that he might have totally deserved it. She just goes in and kills EVERYONE. she says "they just shoot on sight, they're not like us" but her and Dina were worned "treaspassers will be shot". So two revenge missions, one is concise and spares everyone else involved, and the other is a sloppy murderous rampage. And Abby spares her TWICE! As far as revenge missions go: Abby good ~ Ellie bad And yeah Abby's revenge mission was miraculously efficient because of sheer luck but let's not talk about that lol
Thank you for this video! I agree with you! I think Abby is the best character in TLOU2, it just needs time to understand it. And after 5 times that I finished the game, I prefer now Abby's missions.
Ellie is a monster in this game! And that's ok... people are so attached to her and still root for her even when she goes all murder mode to avenge one death. Abby is (or more like was) the same, and this game showcases the growth of a monster into an empathetic person thanks to her good deed - her saving a kid made her grow as person, showing that good deeds get rewarded just like bad deeds get rewarded with consequences in Ellie's case. Ellie story is so sad yet we see her "earning" the bad things happening to her by setting a chain of events based on bad decisions. People don't understand that now Ellie stands in the same spot as Abby did, and will get to chance to grow as she did. Yes I know she killed your favorite character, but are you and Ellie making the most out of his death an legacy? Or is the ceaseless killing honoring Joel? Joel would gladly sacrifice himself for Ellie yet Ellie is wasting away the gift of life, and in the process loses a relationship with her partner and child...was it worth it? Revenge for the price of never again seeing your child? Not being there when they grow up? Say their first words?... And all that is ignoring the political anti-war message which again makes this game a masterpiece and a lesson in crafting an emotionally meaningful story that actually tackles problems head first instead of dancing around them like many games do. The extreme haters hurt real life people over not liking a game. Every each and one of them is vile, but hopefully redeemable like Abby. Which is why they get to play as Abby...maybe if they see her perspective they too will grow as a person. I know I did.
I don't think it's a logical fallacy and the main purpose of the story is to create a philosophical view. Moral Relativism is an idea belonging to the meta-ethical sub-discipline of the ethics department. Moral Realtivism argues that "any order" contains more than one moral norm, that is, adopted rules, and therefore it is not "objectively" right or wrong. The Last Of Us Part II, on the other hand, is a masterpiece that adapts this mentality, perhaps, in the entertainment industry in the best way. The two sides of the coin represent concepts that are actually opposite to each other. Saying the other side of the coin can indicate both good and bad, because it is impossible to know good and bad, since there is no objective right and wrong according to "moral relativism". Being impartial and telling things as they are, that is, showing both sides of the coin, is an expression suitable for "moral relativism". Abby's father is the only doctor with the skills and knowledge to produce the vaccine that will save "humanity", the only human to fix it. He is also a loved and respected person in the Fireflies group. Social status does not matter, as there is no "civilized social order" destroyed in this post-apocalyptic universe, but there are some issues, with the exception of health, especially this status change in the post-apocalyptic universe. Post-apocalyptic fiction tells how survivors and life are shaped after a destruction. It includes a dark and deep atmosphere, a life clad in dark colors and the colors of nature, and people depicted with different shades of gray. It shows nature, man's essence and man's true instincts. There is no civilized social order, official authority, that is, the state, has disappeared, and therefore there is no body of official rules, namely the constitution. Mayhem and chaos reign in this post-apocalyptic universe. In this universe or in this order, people live for themselves. People live each day to live another day. Since there is no order, human security is under threat, and humans act with the instinct to live, and this instinct is at its peak. As Thomas Hobbes said, “Man is a wolf to man”. Since there is no official authority and no justice in this universe, people maintain their own order with their own ideas and morals. That's why "moral relativism" is evident, and so is the narrative portrayal of man in shades of grey. So objectively there is no right or wrong. In any case, space and time have to serve a narrative or a mentality, otherwise the narrative contradicts itself. With this way of thinking, shades of gray are created. And expression (the expression here is moral relativism.) does not serve time and space; time and space serve the expression, because you cannot design a fictional space and a fictional time without expression or a mindset.
Abby is an interesting character to say the least. At first I fucking hated her and I wanted her dead (still do, kinda) but then I understood why she did what she did and I still don’t like her but I respect her. Joel killed her father (he didn’t know sure but that’s not an excuse) and Ellie took it too far by killing Abby’s friends (if you ask me a bit extreme) Ellie should have stayed back with Dina and JJ.
I love Joel and I miss him. The father-daughter relationship Joel and Ellie had I will miss dearly. But Joel fucked up and he payed the price sad to say that’s just how life works unfortunately.
Goddamn i love hearing peoples different takes. This was a spot on review. When i fisrt saw this game, years after the relewse, i heard many people hated her. But what she did, the wirld she lives in, and the circustamce all made sense. Great video and breakdown
She lose so many people that her love :( His dad, the one who want to safe the world by vacine ellie. But ellie ready and let herself to death for vacine. That why ellie mad to joel because joel safe her Abby lose his friends:( Abby got so many unlucky Abby get tortured Im sorry for hating you when my first game play You are the best character ever For those who hate you, they didnt realized. They just look at joel side, But this is the last of us, everything can be happend
Thank you, it took me a lot of time to put it together, and it received a lot of hate. Reading this kind of comments makes me feel happy, I appreciate it a lot :)
the problem is we want a joel and ellie continues story and digging in more fungus story and having abby in side character for the game is good. but instead they killed joel and make a whole game a revenge story. i personally didn't like the story so much. but the gameplay is good overall.
Agreed Abby was awesome the one thing I hated abt last of us part 2 was Ellie and Dina I completed hated them and honestly wanted Abby to win there love story was boring and Ellie was just going Around killing people I really liked Ellie a lot more in the first game and yes I’m On Abby’s side #Abbysside
The whole point of the game is that there is no good guy. Abby brutally killed joel and many others but Ellie killed everyone dearest to Abby along with most of Seattle.
I love Abby so much she’s my new favorite character now I know she killed Joel but hey he had that coming although I don’t hate Joel honest anyway I prefer Abby because she had better outfits weapons and skills Ellie on the other hand I absolutely hated every outfit she wore in part 2 besides I’m also so happy that Abby spared Ellie Dina and tommy then Ellie returned the favor but then we had a sad ending but hey maybe Ellie and Dina will get back together in part 3 we’ll see what happens
I never played the game, but I did watch Jacksepticeye’s full play through. She had moments that made me hate her and she had moments that made me remember that she’s a grey character, every bit as human as the rest of us (even though she’s a fictional character) and empathize with her. Torturing and killing Joel never brought her peace anymore than it brought Ellie peace to go after her, only when she helped that boy. Lev was the key to her inner peace, filling that void, and would have probably prevented her from finding and killing Joel if all those events happened before she set out to kind him. She’s an interesting character in my opinion, and it’s pointless to hate on a fictional character just because they piss you off.
Why we hate her? Cause she's a horribly written character who kills mindlessly without any confliction, "lets do things without thinking about the consequences"
@@bbbenn8142 not the same thing we care about Ellie cause of her Char development from the Lou1 with Abby you can't say this cause she had no build up as a character she was forced
Abby is an awesome character!! She had every right to kill Joel. Joel is not a good person at all he has done so many messed up shit before he met Ellie!
@@joshh1740Yes. He could have let the world be saved. Ellie wanted it to happen. She didn't care about death. She had lost everyone she cared for and her being immune was her "purpose" and her reason to keep going. And Joel was selfish to take her away from that just because he wanted a daughter figure. And to lie to her after about everything after the fact.
@@justerik6429 forgetting the fact that they had no intentions on giving Ellie a choice, Joel did what any good parent would do. I’m gonna assume you don’t have children and you don’t understand the natural instincts as a parent. If any “parent” would give their kid to a terrorist organization for a CHANCE to find a cure for an outbreak that’s been going on for 20 years, then they shouldn’t be a parent. And again, they have no autonomy to Ellie, so “it’s what she wanted” argument doesn’t work because yes it’s true, but the Fireflies wouldn’t have known.
abby is literally a spiteful character, abby barely had any character arc in the game and no character development. after jackson she went back to the stadium she was feeling horrible and realized that revenge wouldnt fix everything or anything, she felt like she had wasted five years of her life trying to achieve a goal that has no benefit 2 her at all. all of her friends got killed for it, speaking of her friends, Owen supported her for 5 years on an aimless goal, loved her and risked his life for abby and traveled thousands of miles to show her how much he loves her and wanted what she wanted but when owen wanted to chase his own goals she made fun of him and told him to grow up and made him cheat on his pregnant girlfriend whos her friend. back to our main point, after she came back to jackson she still were having nightmares and was so guilt ridden about it she felt that she “need to lighten the load” and found the nearest opportunity to redeem herself, shes realizing that killing joel wasnt all she needed and that joel isnt the root of her problems and revenge isnt everything she wanted hoping that shed realize its not what she needs, and then boom after a whole day from escaping hell fighting the rat king and getting out of haven she drags lev to an extremely dangerous situation to feed into the vicious cycle of revenge when in the past 10 hours (weeks of abby’s life) we’ve been seeing how horrible and guilty she feels about killing joel but oh no abby has learned nothing yet again. she dragged her friends to this and they all fucking died and she gets to live, pathetic regardless abby is not the best character shes poorly written and portrayed if u live in a zombie apocalypse don’t you believe that your loved one would ever last you forever smh
@@bbbenn8142 its not, joel wasnt spiteful as abby, joel didnt torture someone to death infront of a loved one like abby did, joel didnt shit on his partner’s goals when all their partner been doing is supporting theirs’s like abby, joel didnt sleep with someones baby daddy so sir fuck off dont disrespect joel like that ever again
Joel is literally a mass murderer but okay. I bet you’ll love the man that killed your family then also screwed the population out a chance at a cure. He’s also selfish but okay.
There's one fundamental flaw you're overlooking. In the book "Story" by Robert McKee he says "Likeability is not a guarantee for audience engagement, it's merely an aspect of characterization." Showing someone is liked and respected doesn't mean you're forced to like them. And Abby's actions of saving Lev and Yara is too far removed from Joel to generate empathy. Like a politician donating a large sum of money to charity while in the middle of a scandal. Sure the donation is a good gesture, but it doesn't erase previous actions. Robert McKee also discusses building empathy for unlikable/ morally bad characters with the example of Tony Soprano. We are able to generate empathy for Tony because after he does a morally wrong action we're shown his introspection and uncertainty in himself. We empathize because we know even he doesn't think it's right. Abby on the other end never shows remorse or guilt. She never even questions if hunting Joel and torturing him was going too far.
1. Abby's nightmares don't go away after killing Joel. This means that revenge didn't bring her peace as she thought it would. Dreams only changes to the better when she saves the children. 2. Abby tortures Joel before he dies because Joel killed her father. Ellie tortures Nora before her death in order to find Abby, who killed her father. Where is the difference? Why is the second more acceptable? Only because we share Ellie's feelings about Joel's death. But morally it’s the same. Well, yes, we are then shown Ellie in shock after this. Did she stop? No. So she accepted what she is capable of and moved on. 3. Let's put feelings aside and just count actions. 3.1. Abby and her team only killed Joel, and let Tommy and Ellie go. Ellie and the gang from Jackson killed what felt like a half of the wolves and ALL of Abby's friends. 3.2. Abby tortures Joel, Ellie tortures Nora. 3.3. Abby let Dina and Ellie go for the second time. She let them go only because of Lev’s merciful influence. Had the absolute moral right to kill them this time. 3.4 Ellie lets Abby go in Santa Barbara.
Currently replying the game and can’t remember 100% but didn’t Owen shoot his teammate and save that Seraphite only cause he found out that Scar was Max? If you really pay attention in the game Max was one of the boys who grew up at the Aquarium with their father and ran off to join the scars. You find notes throughout the aquarium and even the dead fathers body in the chair as he was just waiting for his kids to come home. And max was the one who drew all the pictures at the Aquarium and made that badass fort.. right next to the spotted seals. (Idk if that was the ocean or what but idk how seals would survive over 20years in a aquariums tank with no one to feed them lol)
No ellie is much better l really like ellie story because we can enjoy the game while he jokes in the first game thats why ellie is actually a better person than abby
I don’t understand Abby haters. Abby wanted revenge and people who hate her for that seem to forget that Ellie did the same thing and killed everyone dearest to Abby.
I agree, but I think that it has to do with people knowing and loving Ellie for longer now, as well as the fact that, yes, they both did the same thing, but Abby did it first. Idk, that's what I've gathered
What put me off was when she said "good" after learning Dina was pregnant and was about to kill her. Yes she did this cause of Mel's death but personally I can't forgive her for that, like that was too far for me. I spent several hours as Abby learning about her and starting to empathize with her thinking she was being redeemed through Lev and Yara. Just for her to throw it all away and completely regress back to the same Abby that killed Joel out of pure hatred. That's just my feelings on it and I just don't like her character and like Ellie much better. So when Im forced to watch Abby destroy Ellie physically, emotionally, and mentally just to end off well better than Ellie. Not scott free like some say but Abby had Lev, while Ellie has nobody. The game also really put me off with Abby saying "I would sacrifice myself" to her dad cause that felt like such a slap in the face and like the game was trying to give Abby the moral high ground (which some see it as).
It's good to see that there are some people who actually understand Abby instead of them saying "LOOK AT HOW SHE KILLED MY BOIII" Looking at you Angryjoeshow
Abby was a great character in my opinion she's more badass than Ellie . like She just wanted revenge
Agreed 100%
commenting to stay on the pro-abby side of youtube😭 i get not liking her bc she killed joel but the way people purposely disregard the entire plot of the game to blindly hate on her. and thats not even mentioning the people making trans jokes and attacking the voice actor
@@msampson2286 THANK YOU
That's so stupid. Then why don't you sympathize David the cannibal in tlou1?
Abby is one of my favorite video game characters ever. She killed one of, if not the most beloved characters in this medium and yet I feel for her on an emotional level. That is a testament to how great this game is. Laura Bailey’s performance matched with the complexity of her character is some of the most refreshing character writing I’ve ever seen. Good characters are bad people doing good things and good people doing bad things. Joel wasn’t any better than her, he was blinded by his own selfishness. But yet we hate a vengeful daughter of man he killed who spared Ellie not once but twice. Abby showed remorse even after Ellie killed all her friends. The reason she did this was because she had someone to think about, a reason to survive and that was Lev. And that is exactly what Joel did and we don’t hate him for it, down purely to perspective. I find that fascinating and the game, a masterpiece. In fact I think it’s the greatest video game story of all time.
THANK YOU for writing down my feelings about this great Character! TLOU II does not touch me emotionally at all in the first part of the game but the second one does, even after the fifth time of playing it. Cannot describe how brilliant the Storytelling and Character development of Abby ist. No words for it...
I really relate to Abby. I was a female Special Operations soldier. I lost two people in a very violent way, and I went off the deep end for a long time. I wanted to kill the people who killed my team.
I was empty for those years, and lost them to that anger, hatred and grief.
Abby showed me how to break the cycle.
Thank god you didn’t follow Ellie’s path instead.
Totaly agree with all the points made. I wanted to hate her at first, but with this excellent portrayal of there being two sides to every story, i soon found it impossible to hate her. I love Abby's Character and who she is.
Granted she is a little two muscular for a world where a persons nutrition goals will rarely be reached for muscular growth. But she does have a pretty face and a heart of gold surrounded by an incredible hulk aesthetic that is a little two intentional haha! Still love her though.
With all the hate this video and Abby's character have received this comment made me so happy!
Thank you.
She was an important person within a big organization. She would have had access to the materials needed to bulk up.
I know you made this comment two years ago lmao but I don't think she was too muscular for what soldiers in the WLF are given to eat. One of the first things we see in the stadium is a fully stocked farm. Also, Abby is clearly one of Isaac's favorites due to her strength and the numbers of Seraphites she was able to kill. I think it wouldn't be that much of a stretch to say that she might get bigger portions than other soldiers because of all of that (even though we have no proof of that, I could just see it happening with the way Isaac is)
Anyways, just a thought I had. Maybe other people are also going down the Abby rabbit hole and might see this :)
I'm built close to this and I eat a relatively low calorie vegan diet (as do many athletes in the Olympics apparently like 11%)
I was relatively built before I started working out as well so I guess at the end of the day it's just genetics 🤷♀
I also get bloodwork constantly and have near zero testosterone
I never get harassed for it either so in Abby's case I do believe it was peer pressure internet influence.
I found Abby to be really cool, her storyline was more interesting and some of her gameplay segments were outstanding (especially the rat king boss). On the otherhand I found Ellie to be a rude, disrepectful and ill mouthed through the whole game. Im glad Dina left her. Ellie finished the game empty handed lol. She deserved it. Also when I seen Abby in Santa Barbara hung up, it was very emotional. She had lost all her muscle and cute round face. Dont know why this game got so much hate, I found it be amazing. The story was strong and easy to follow. I believe it deserved game of the year, even though I'm a big fan of Ghost Of Tsushima.
It did win game of the year
My mouth dropped when I found Abby like that I was literally not okay for some time 😳😔... and I really hated Ellie for fighting her with the knife after that ... I get that she wanted closure but Abby at that point was just a shell of her usual self. In a way lucky for Ellie otherwise she wouldn’t have stood a chance without her knife
@@eefz1 In a way, the story for both of them is how revenge and hatred can turn sour and leave you feeling hollow.
I agree
I will forever defend Abby. I agree with everything you said in this video.
She is such a tragic character. Her father and her community as in the fireflies was ripped from her by Joel. She joined the WLF with the dream of getting her revenge on Joel. Issac weaponized Abby's grief. Using her to kill countless scars, and giving her the gear and training to make her dream a reality.
@@Keolas_multiverse you’re right, I never thought about how Isaac probably used her grief like that. Screwed over by yet another person. She deserves better 🥲
I ended up hating Ellie and loving Abby
I love baby, but Ellie had her redemption when she didn't kill abby at the end.
I though i was the only one lol
Exactly what i felt! Thank you! In the end i even thought Ellie was the final Boss and you were forced to kill her and quite honestly, i would have LOVED it! Not because i "hate" Ellie but i would have loved the dramatic twist and because i like Abby that damn much.
I played this Game free of Spoilers and i honestly thought that killing Ellie was the real reason why this game was hated so intense.
@@marcor6284okay but having abby kill ellie would’ve been such a shit way of going with the story lol
@@tmm4195
Why exactly?
What people don't get is that Abby is pretty much the female Joel. The world took two honest good people and threw their lives in a fucking blender and hit puree. Sure, Joel's decision to execute the doctors and the fireflies was questionable at best [muffled under breath] even though the fireflies are fucking morons who don't know their asses from a hole in the ground. However it was all to save Ellie. Also Abby didn't know about Joel's motivations at the time and spent the next 4-5 years hating him until it became an obsession. Now fast forward a little bit to when Abby meets Lev, and the two of them develop a similar familial relationship, and when Lev is threatened by the WLF (who were like Abby's family at the time), Abby responds in the same fashion as Joel!
She is nothing like joel. Joel showed remorse and was scarred by the things he did. He never willingly tortured people who didn't deserve it. Abby knew what was happening to ellie in the hospital. The whole joel death was stupid because he'd never walk into that
You’re right. Joel didn’t torture people who deserved it. He tortured people who didn’t. Plus, Abby was also scarred by the things SHE did. Owen talked about Joel’s death and Abby got all stuttery and shit- she was guilty. It was pretty obvious if you could pay attention. And Joel did deserve it. He killed 100s.. maybe even 1000s of people innocents included. “But some of them deserved it!!” Well as a wise man, Lee Everett, once said- - “Innocent or not, It’s still killing.” @@robogreek3157
Plus, he killed a hospital full of people who were trying to create a cure- you should’ve expected a consequence of the world!@@robogreek3157
@@robogreek3157 Joel did not show remorse for anybody, have you not played the damn game? Let’s rewind back to TLOU I, when Ellie was captured by David. He willingly tortured two men who were simply doing their job. He tortured them both with beatings and one with a knife. He asked them to mark something on the map, he did. He died anyways. He went up to the other dude who should’ve been let go, but nope! He killed him too. He showed ZERO remorse. They were just following the rules of their leader, not saying it was right, but they knew no better. Joel did deserve death as he quite literally DOOMED the world lil bro
@@nibba134That person was wrong for saying Joel showed remorse cause he didn’t (even though I wouldn’t in his situation either tbh) but they are right that Joel and Abby are not the same. Joel would never kill for petty revenge like Ellie and Abby. He killed for survival
I love this video. Its perfectly fine if you don’t like Abby. However Abby is NOT a bad character whatsoever. In fact she’s fucking great.
Thank you, this means so much to me.
I love Abby and I love Ellie both so much and I feel like in a way they both peel of each others character arc:
* They both have tight father figures: Ellie and Joel, and Abby and her Dad
* they both have nightmares/PTSD about their respective fathers death.
* they both gave up love for revenge.
* they both have the opportunity to kill each other but they don’t.
* they both have an adopted Asian child.
* they are both so strong and driven and brave
I feel like they would never be friends even if they didn’t have revenge against each other because they are too similar, but I feel like they would both respect each other tremendously.
Imo I like Abby more then Ellie Joel killed her dad so Abby killed Ellie’s (I’m aware Joel isn’t actually her father) but I can’t help but think it was just revenge nothing more Abby is sweet and has a great story but please don’t attack me my opinion
Bro exactly. In this game Abby is pictured as the hero while Ellie is pictured as the villain
@@get_flankedaxr2472 yes dude,i am glad thereis a place for abby lovers,people only hate her for killing joel when he is the villain
@@sus-el8li If you are still wondering why the majority of people hate Abby, is because instead of giving her her own game and story, Naughty Dog decided to destroy everything the first game built, and replace Joel and Ellie with Abby and Lev. Keep in mind the ONLY reason the first game worked at all was because of Joel and Ellie. So it was stupid for them to get rid of the one thing people loved about the first game.
Also, the game ONLY works for small percentage of people who never liked Joel and Ellie to begin with. Most people dont believe Joel was a villain saving his surrogate daughter by any means necessary. Its the apocalypse after all. All that matters is family. Abby is for the morally complex and superior people who don't believe in killing anybody because they might have a sad backstory.
@@fatherlessapricot5790 this is not true. Most of us loved Ellie and Joel and cherish the first game. However, most of us are mature enough to understand that Joel was no hero. His actions were selfish and were only made to benefit himself. Ellie didn't want to be saved. She wanted to be the cure for everyone. Joel, being selfish, took that choice away from her because he looked at her as a daughter (since he lost his real daughter). He killed unarmed doctors who were the only ones capable of creating a cure. So Joel was the real villain. We pretty much all hated Abby during Ellie's gameplay. But once you play as Abby, you see that her and Ellie are very similar.
@@alexsaltertv She never chose. She was asleep during the entire Firefly ending of the first game. Had they asked for consent, it would have been a different story. All Joel knew was they were going to kill her regardless of what she said to "possibly" get a cure that wouldn't help at all because the world was already too far gone, and the Fireflies would rule everything cherry picking who got the potential vaccine or not. It wasn't worth it at all.
I shouldn't have said "never liked" joel. I should have said "thought he was the villain of TLOU". Most people don't think he was. He did a lot of terrible things, but overall most if not all people would do the same things in his shoes. He loved Ellie, and at the end of the first game, Ellie kinda knows Joel was lying but was willing to play along to spare him any guilt he would have. They completely botch that in the second game when she freaks out at him and acts surprised he saved her life.
And its the apocalypse. Everything anyone does anymore HAS to be for themselves in some way. Anyone who lived completely selflessly died a long time ago.
I refused to play the game for years and got it on a deep deep sale, after playing it I felt like it was better than part 1 and that Abby was a fantastic character. Thank you for this video
Gross. 😂
When i first had TLOU II in my hands i thought "Well, it cannot be better than the first game", but when i went through all the emotions this game inflicts, i had to admit, it is absolutely fantastic and yeah, it is even better than part I.
Wow equal dislikes and likes. You don't see that often. However this is a good video.
Yesterday this had 8 dislikes, guess someone changed their mind!
Btw, thank you, this really made me happy, I put a lot of effort into making this video and I thought it was a complete disaster for a second, this comment made me think otherwise.
Thank you for giving it your time! :)
@@hi-xig.3516 you're welcome 😊
Very well made. She is the product of her environment and experiences. They could have made an entire game building up her character and then had a third game that was part 2. You could have loved her character like you do Ellie and it would have changed everything.
Actually a really good point although the story is about an immune girl and that needs to be either resolved by a cure or ambiguous in part 3 , maybe the franchise could have done your theory and had a part 4 as well
THIS. i loved abby’s story and i understood why she did what she did, but i do feel like a major pacing adjustment would’ve definitely softened the blow a little bit by opening us more up to abby but i guess the point is to leave players distraught and confused just as ellie was
Serial killers are also a product of their experiences and environment. Yet they are rightfully seen as repellent monstrous individuals who prey on those unable to defend themselves. Yet those monstrous people have more of an excuse than Abby does. Most serial killers did not have a loving parent like Abby. Someone who not only loved them but taught them the difference between right and wrong, as well as how to be a compassionate humanbeing. Abby actively sought out an environment and experiences where she would go on to murder and torture, god knows how many, seraphites long before she ran into Joel.
And I know that killing in inevitable in this post apocalyptic world but there is a difference between combatants/survivors and war criminals. I dont care how scrawny or nice someone was before they became a war criminal. To willingly and easily inflict unnecessary suffering on helpless individuals is abhorrent behavior that, in my opinion, has no return path to redemption.
Hated her at first but after the full story she is my favorite character,i tried to put myself into her place ,she never meet joel before to her he is just a killer who took most important person in her life so no wonder she hated him and wanted revenge
Exact same situation for me
The reason why everyone hates abby and loves Joel is the fact that we first met joel and then Abby.Now ia am not saying that Joel is bad,i love him the most like everyone else,but people need to understand Abby.She is basically did the same thing that Ellie is trying to do: Getting revenge for her parents death.Thats the only bad thing she did.( Also killing wolves snd seraphites.) But remember that she:
Helped 2 helpless kids from dying
Killed a giant infecfed that no one else managed to even damage him,
Went through hell to save a girls life and left ellie and alive twice.
Such an underrated character..
Finally someone said it,i honestly find Abby more interesting than Ellie,I love her,She is so pure and warm hearted,maybe this is why she tries to hide her goodness and tries to be "cold" but I understand her.
Plus immature people are the ones who wanted Abby's death,Nobody wants to say that Abby saved 2 people,took care of them,took care of a dog,helped Mel even thought they weren't really close as friends because of Owen,literally abby is better than everyone,She's admirable because NOBODY would be so good in a zombie apocalypse, So people need to admire her.
@@dangerrouswomann i agree,but as i said,i love Joel more than any other game character.I still want Abby to die bc of what she did to my fav game character.She is great person,but a horrible character,unlike Joel
I think at the end of the day, causing damage to each other so badly until near dead, it was never the point of it between Ellie and Abby they both been through extremely shit tough situations, Joel only wanted to save Ellie and screw the world but not her. and because of that he killed Abby's father (i wish the first game would ever gave us the choice to leave them alive, but I see the point of that to create another history and make us understand Abby's actions.
At the beginning I hated her so much for what she did to Joel, but then I understand why she did what she did, she was paying tribute and getting revenge for her father, maybe some people would disagree with me and i don't care this is my point of view.
Life´s so damn hard and sometimes we take wrong choices because we think that are the right ones even though by doing "the right thing" would be good for you for other people we made a big mistake.
Revenge never is a good choice, actually is hurting you more and more.
Try to understand and be empathetic with the other side and forgive
I agree with you but this video was risky AF because there is so much hate around this game, especially Abby
Yeah, it's been a hard one to make!
People who hate this game are idiot's honestly. Their opinions suck ass. Abby is an amazing character and the last of us 2 is a great story.
People who hate it because joel died are silly and probably not the smartest tool in the shed. Ellie would have done the same thing if she was in abbys shoes.
I like to think this game perfectly embodies the audience with Ellie.
They’re all so blinded with hatred against Abby for killing Joel, solely for their attachment to him.
They ignore that Joel killed her father for his own selfish reasons, and that Ellie does exactly what Abby was willing to do later on: killing anyone who gets in her way on a petty quest for revenge.
I understand why Abby did what she did because if someone shot my dad I'd want revenge too.
What if you found out who your father really was. That he conducted unethical, immoral and anti-scientific experiments on people that cost them their lives. Abby would've been killed and as a parent he did the right thing
she didn’t care about her dad. she cared about her emotions. she wanted closure. Abby is a narcissist, which I respect
Thanks for this video. I am very much team Abby and I can’t wait to send this to a lot of TLOU fans who dislike TLOU2 and couldn’t make it past the Joel scene.
I hated Abby until Day 2 and the Lev/Yara storyline. She started to grow on me and by the end I was amazed at how much I enjoyed her character arc.
Incredible video, I love Abby Anderson and you did an amazing job analyzing her character and her story.
Thank you, this comment made my day.
Abby sucks
I just don't understand how people can be angry with Abby for killing Joel and not with Joel for killing her dad... I didn't like Joel at the end in the first game and after the second game I didn't like Ellie... Abby was a perfect character😍🤧
I know right?
I mean Joel gets away with killing Abby's dad and many fireflies, but Abby doesn't get away with killing Joel just because she did it with a golf club?
I understand that there are feelings involved, but it's just a huge double standard imo!
Same goes for Ellie and Tommy, people can't stand Abby, but Ellie killed every friend Abby had, including the person she loved the most at the time, and Tommy killed Manny ruthlessly, but somehow that's okay even though Abby suffered a lot and had to go through many losses?
I get that many people might not like Abby's character, I don't have a problem with that, I have a problem with the reasons and not trying to see things from different perspectives!
Also, thanks for your comment and taking the time to watch the video!
Cause Joel saved Ellie from her dad genius, Joel pretty much lost everybody in his life except tommy and Ellie
@@gohan2791 her dad wanted to save the world and being alone doesn't justify becoming a mad man who shots first and talks later...🙄
@@marc_8o0 being alone, what are you talking about?
@@marc_8o0 clarify
I would have been in royal big time tears if Ellie killed Abby at the end because I didn't want it. I love Abby, she was a true strong warrior. I was literally upset at Ellie for leaving her family (JJ, Dina) it was ridiculous...to get revenge..that made so upset...and it made me root harder for Abby... I'm just glad that Abby survived and more proud that Ellie let her go... there's no way I can ever love Ellie the same though because she's too consumed with hate...hate will do anyone in at the end of the day...Joel is gone...she needs to accept that...and never once is she thankful that Abby spares her life NOT ONCE but TWICE!! Abs is a real one!
Abby was consumed with hate too, which is a good thing
I think when Owen tells her she's good with kids Abby looks away because he's implying that she'd be a good mother and she probably wants a family but he's literally starting a family with Mel so she's like, don't even go there cause that's not an option. I think. Love this video. May your survival be long.
I like Abby in fact she’s my favorite character she seems she has anger issues a bit but that’s understandable and very relatable to me
I was NEVER on the Abby hate train. I loved that chick. I hope I get to see more of her and Lev.
Same bro, ppl just dick ride joel
Could not agree more with this. Exactly how i felt. A real roller coaster of a ride. Kind of like the pre loge of The Last of us. When they killed Joels daughter. Iactually had to turn the game off as a father i was so mad. But i loved Abby at the end ngl
Its really a special game. The way it makes you feel for both characters is insane
The Abby section of the game is actually my favourite bit of the entire game
When I replay the game I just pick up her parts.
Same, I just got finished replaying her section a few days ago and I already miss her
This is really well explained.
It’s so poorly demonstrated in the game but the way you explain it, her character makes perfect sense.
Man I wish I could’ve seen her this way while I was playing the game.
It was pretty well demonstrated in the game lol
How is it poorly demonstrated in the game? No hate, I'm just curious what you thought was written poorly and how it could've been improved
no bc i feel this 😭 like her character story ofc is great, ill admit that, but i cant move past her killing joel to admit shes a good person 😭 character plot wise interesting? yes, i just didnt care to learn it and lowk still dont bc of joel 😭 which imo is understandable, he was the main person you play as, you grow attached to characters. and then to have to play as the girl who killed him? 😭😭 mannnnn, gameplay was fun. but also just dragged for me bc i dont care for abby. asides all that tho, she is a well developed and interesting character. i think sm are like me, when playing and even watching, theyre hurt by joels death so they dont pay attention to her play through/dont care to 😭
@@alphavasson5387i think my reply could speak for them, ik you werent asking me but i wanted to give input lol. alot of people have said that maybe if abby was introduced prejoels death, like shown her reasoning prior to it, it would feel less daunting to play as her. i mean maybeeee? but then i feel like it would just immediately wipe away any good feelings players had for her bc at the end of the day, it was joel. but i think at the end of the day abby character was made to make players feel confused, on if shes liked or disliked or whatever. i think they tried to redeem her, which i do understand and got it, but i just dont like her at the end of the day, which i think is ok 😭
Abby > Ellie
I don’t understand how everyone can hate Abby so much, yeah she killed Joel, the main character in p1 and one of the most loved of all, but realistically, he killed her dad. All she did was get revenge to settle her mind. Joel started the whole thing, although it was out of love for ellie. Personally I love Abby as a character and she might be my favourite overall, as 1. She is able to show mercy for Ellie twice (firstly when she kills Joel and lets Ellie go, secondly when she spares her and Dina in the theatre) 2. Killing Joel was just her serving justice. 3. She goes against the WLF to help two seraphite children, as she realises they are only kids, and don’t deserve the same fate as many other seraphites who have actively fought against the WLF
I actually disagree with a lot of these points. I think these plot points you mentioned show just how terrible she is. I actually believe she is a downright horrible person and doesn’t even have a heart of gold.
The way she killed Joel and the context that came with it really made me hate her to the point that she was irredeemable in my eyes. Joel had saved her life less than an hour ago. If she had a little bit of hesitation or had at least taken that into consideration before killing him, she would have been a little better though maybe not enough to make her redeemable in my eyes. When it comes to what I learned about her character from that scene. I learned she has no sense of gratitude and possibly no moral compass. Any attempts to humanize her afterwards was simply too little too late.
Her lack of a moral compass and lack of a sense of loyalty is mostly illustrated when she turns on the WLF and kills many of her friends and comrades in arms without pity or mercy. Turning on the WLF is fine. A lot of stories have characters betraying their comrades in arms but the fact that she didn’t seem to feel anything implies she never really cared. If they wanted her to save the two seraphite kids then they needed to handle it with more care.
As for Dina. Yes she spared her but one second ago she was going to take personal pleasure in the thought of knowingly killing a pregnant lady. It’s one thing to kill a pregnant lady because she is an enemy combatant (which is what happened when Ellie killed Mel). It’s a completely different story when you’re doing it willingly with sadistic pleasure. That scene tells me she has a callous disregard for human life. If I had built up any respect for the character despite my refusal to sympathize with her. It was all gone at that moment and it was never coming back.
The way I see it. The story itself had a good idea but the execution was horrible. Abby is a great character only on paper. Although I find it incredibly interesting that we learn two different things when we both saw the same character performing the same action. Some people are willing to excuse her deeds while others are not.
If we’re really going to talk about the idea of characters having their own perspectives and biases. I think the audience also has a right to be biased towards certain characters. I was biased toward Ellie so I was willing to look the other way and sometimes even cheer when Ellie killed Abby’s friends. At the same time I was biased against Abby so I wasn’t willing to look the other way when she turned on her own comrades or showed a lack of empathy for others.
@Shadow Gear Audio I find that hilarious because a lot of those describe Ellie more then Abby.
@@SleepyGummino i can see why you would think that but i disagree, i think both characters are very well balanced in their actions and i think that neither character is the 'bad guy' in their situation. They both went through very similar things and the way that they both seek justice and still maintain an air of humility about them makes them both the best characters in the game, and equal in moral high ground.
The cruccial differente between the two is when both face the point of no return of violence, one decide to give their violent ego instead of the other (Abby about to kill Dinah at the theater). But all of this just during 99% during the game time, until Elli, just when she is about to finish Abby drowning her, has a vision of the same mistakes that Joel had and is illuminated by a weird and distorted satori and give up at all, losing everything...
Congrats man, you got the idea. You definetly have a good heart, a heart worth to make us fight for this world.
Ellie, instead of learning from Joel´s mistakes, incorporated his thirsty for revenge, and end losing literally everything, Him, Dinah, her baby, and the capacity to reconected to Joel´s memories through out the guitar ´cause she lost her fingers... Man, this is a masterpiece that overcomes cinema and presents us a genuine new art form.
I remember being so shocked about Joel’s death that I was angry at naughty dog, I didn’t like that we had to play as Abby but continued on, then I had an understanding of her, even though at that point I was still angry at the game, but what killed all of the anger at the game for me was seeing the late game Joel and Ellie scene, it changed my view of the game and I forgave it all, that’s how you know this game company is really good at what they do, at least for me
Ok, so, months have passed since I made this video.
The amount of effort I put into this is insane, it took me 5 entire days to record & edit this + all the time I spent watching the cutscenes and analyzing stuff.
Seeing the backlash it received really hurt, at first, but I want to thank every person that took their time to comment, like and share some love.
I appreciate you guys, a lot.
It got to a point where hate comments don't get to me at all anymore, because the love is way stronger. So, thank you, guys.
At one point there were more dislikes than likes, then at one point people started to appreciate the video and look what you did! 70 Likes! This is insane!
I've been thinking about creating a whole series about the TLOU characters, I have some ideas in mind for Ellie, Dina and Owen atm, but I'll take my time to work on them.
I have also been thinking about doing a separate video for Joel, I will for sure in the future, but it's gonna be hard, it'll take a lot of time, might work on it when the TLOU Remake drops, along with a Gameplay.
Again, thank you guys for the support. :)
Aaaand, let me know if there's anything you'd want me to work on, maybe you'll hear my strong-ass-italian accent again soon haha!
I personally love Abby. Her trauma is so overlooked😢
Abby is my favorite character
Great video liked and subbed 😁
Thank you :)
@@jacktheripper3524 stfu toxic tlou fan this guy put effort into this u just don’t understand the story
@@Therealnapoleonbonaparte_ what did they say?
@@chiviiwinny9255 saying the video is terrible and how Abby Is a terrible character
And Abby was wayyyy more fun to play … beast
“Abby was a monster for killing Joel the way she did.”
*Ellie tortures Nora with a pipe in the same exact way..*
As far as Abby just saying “Good” in finding out Dina was pregnant, imagine what Abby was thinking in that moment.
Is it possible she thought Ellie killed Mel KNOWING she was pregnant bc her jacket was left open? I mean, that would be my guess. Abby was just giving back to Ellie what Ellie did to her. But lev stopped her before she could.
So the “good” to me, was Abby just trying to make it even.
Then Ellie took it one step further by sticking a knife to a child’s neck threatening to kill lev if Abby didn’t fight her.
So, In the end, who acted the worst in their revenge?
Look I'm sorry, Abby's cool and all, but nothing is gonna make me put her above Ellie.
Sad what the rattlers did to abby at the end
They are the best
I love abby!
I don't give a shit if she killed your crush, Abby is an objectively incredible character and she's my favorite.
Abby is more fleshed out in half of TLOU2 than Joel in all of TOUL1. I don’t know why so many ppl like Joel, he’s just a TWD Shane clone.
Also, when Ellie sets out on her revenge mission, she has no idea what Joel did to the people who killed him. For all she knows it could be someone Joel royally fucked over a decade ago and that he might have totally deserved it. She just goes in and kills EVERYONE. she says "they just shoot on sight, they're not like us" but her and Dina were worned "treaspassers will be shot". So two revenge missions, one is concise and spares everyone else involved, and the other is a sloppy murderous rampage. And Abby spares her TWICE! As far as revenge missions go: Abby good ~ Ellie bad
And yeah Abby's revenge mission was miraculously efficient because of sheer luck but let's not talk about that lol
Great analysis my friend 💜
Thank you! :)💚
Thank you for this video! I agree with you! I think Abby is the best character in TLOU2, it just needs time to understand it. And after 5 times that I finished the game, I prefer now Abby's missions.
Ellie is a monster in this game!
And that's ok... people are so attached to her and still root for her even when she goes all murder mode to avenge one death.
Abby is (or more like was) the same, and this game showcases the growth of a monster into an empathetic person thanks to her good deed - her saving a kid made her grow as person, showing that good deeds get rewarded just like bad deeds get rewarded with consequences in Ellie's case.
Ellie story is so sad yet we see her "earning" the bad things happening to her by setting a chain of events based on bad decisions.
People don't understand that now Ellie stands in the same spot as Abby did, and will get to chance to grow as she did.
Yes I know she killed your favorite character, but are you and Ellie making the most out of his death an legacy?
Or is the ceaseless killing honoring Joel?
Joel would gladly sacrifice himself for Ellie yet Ellie is wasting away the gift of life, and in the process loses a relationship with her partner and child...was it worth it? Revenge for the price of never again seeing your child?
Not being there when they grow up? Say their first words?...
And all that is ignoring the political anti-war message which again makes this game a masterpiece and a lesson in crafting an emotionally meaningful story that actually tackles problems head first instead of dancing around them like many games do.
The extreme haters hurt real life people over not liking a game. Every each and one of them is vile, but hopefully redeemable like Abby.
Which is why they get to play as Abby...maybe if they see her perspective they too will grow as a person.
I know I did.
I agree I love Abby but Dina is my favorite character
She is awesome
She is trash
@@gohan2791 nah, that's your face bro. You are looking at a mirror.
@@PhreakPhantom damn my feelings hurt.
I don't think it's a logical fallacy and the main purpose of the story is to create a philosophical view. Moral Relativism is an idea belonging to the meta-ethical sub-discipline of the ethics department. Moral Realtivism argues that "any order" contains more than one moral norm, that is, adopted rules, and therefore it is not "objectively" right or wrong. The Last Of Us Part II, on the other hand, is a masterpiece that adapts this mentality, perhaps, in the entertainment industry in the best way. The two sides of the coin represent concepts that are actually opposite to each other. Saying the other side of the coin can indicate both good and bad, because it is impossible to know good and bad, since there is no objective right and wrong according to "moral relativism". Being impartial and telling things as they are, that is, showing both sides of the coin, is an expression suitable for "moral relativism".
Abby's father is the only doctor with the skills and knowledge to produce the vaccine that will save "humanity", the only human to fix it. He is also a loved and respected person in the Fireflies group. Social status does not matter, as there is no "civilized social order" destroyed in this post-apocalyptic universe, but there are some issues, with the exception of health, especially this status change in the post-apocalyptic universe.
Post-apocalyptic fiction tells how survivors and life are shaped after a destruction. It includes a dark and deep atmosphere, a life clad in dark colors and the colors of nature, and people depicted with different shades of gray. It shows nature, man's essence and man's true instincts. There is no civilized social order, official authority, that is, the state, has disappeared, and therefore there is no body of official rules, namely the constitution. Mayhem and chaos reign in this post-apocalyptic universe. In this universe or in this order, people live for themselves. People live each day to live another day. Since there is no order, human security is under threat, and humans act with the instinct to live, and this instinct is at its peak.
As Thomas Hobbes said, “Man is a wolf to man”. Since there is no official authority and no justice in this universe, people maintain their own order with their own ideas and morals. That's why "moral relativism" is evident, and so is the narrative portrayal of man in shades of grey. So objectively there is no right or wrong. In any case, space and time have to serve a narrative or a mentality, otherwise the narrative contradicts itself.
With this way of thinking, shades of gray are created. And expression (the expression here is moral relativism.) does not serve time and space; time and space serve the expression, because you cannot design a fictional space and a fictional time without expression or a mindset.
Abby is an interesting character to say the least. At first I fucking hated her and I wanted her dead (still do, kinda) but then I understood why she did what she did and I still don’t like her but I respect her. Joel killed her father (he didn’t know sure but that’s not an excuse) and Ellie took it too far by killing Abby’s friends (if you ask me a bit extreme) Ellie should have stayed back with Dina and JJ.
I love Joel and I miss him. The father-daughter relationship Joel and Ellie had I will miss dearly. But Joel fucked up and he payed the price sad to say that’s just how life works unfortunately.
Goddamn i love hearing peoples different takes. This was a spot on review.
When i fisrt saw this game, years after the relewse, i heard many people hated her.
But what she did, the wirld she lives in, and the circustamce all made sense.
Great video and breakdown
Ellie is better than Abby
Abby is much better than Ellie tbh. I felt more empathy for her than Ellie
Yes,she is a pure character.
She lose so many people that her love :(
His dad, the one who want to safe the world by vacine ellie. But ellie ready and let herself to death for vacine. That why ellie mad to joel because joel safe her
Abby lose his friends:(
Abby got so many unlucky
Abby get tortured
Im sorry for hating you when my first game play
You are the best character ever
For those who hate you, they didnt realized. They just look at joel side,
But this is the last of us, everything can be happend
amazing video!! i agree that abby was the best written character. so interesting and amazing and lovable even after what she did
this is truly a wonderful video. thank you.
Thank you, it took me a lot of time to put it together, and it received a lot of hate. Reading this kind of comments makes me feel happy, I appreciate it a lot :)
@@hi-xig.3516 This video is shit Abby is shit
Ok man but you need a hobby. 😶
@@hi-xig.3516 My hobby is complaining it vents my rage
@@gohan2791 lm31
Great video about a great protagonist!
the problem is we want a joel and ellie continues story and digging in more fungus story and having abby in side character for the game is good. but instead they killed joel and make a whole game a revenge story. i personally didn't like the story so much. but the gameplay is good overall.
Agreed Abby was awesome the one thing I hated abt last of us part 2 was Ellie and Dina I completed hated them and honestly wanted Abby to win there love story was boring and Ellie was just going Around killing people I really liked Ellie a lot more in the first game and yes I’m On Abby’s side #Abbysside
The whole point of the game is that there is no good guy. Abby brutally killed joel and many others but Ellie killed everyone dearest to Abby along with most of Seattle.
Abby is the best. She went through Hell and lost everything.
I love Abby so much she’s my new favorite character now I know she killed Joel but hey he had that coming although I don’t hate Joel honest anyway I prefer Abby because she had better outfits weapons and skills Ellie on the other hand I absolutely hated every outfit she wore in part 2 besides I’m also so happy that Abby spared Ellie Dina and tommy then Ellie returned the favor but then we had a sad ending but hey maybe Ellie and Dina will get back together in part 3 we’ll see what happens
Boy i just love this video,abby is the best character
dude this video is amazing! btw I agree with you! :)
Thank you, this means the world to me :)
@@hi-xig.3516 I’m being real dude, your pacing was immaculate and I was really interested! 👍
Totally agree with the title
Haha per fortuna! :)
I think is the best too ❤ her story and her motivations.
I see you have not been on here in two years but all the same you have a subscriber based on your analysis of this do think about coming back😊
I'm in love with Abby's arms! She can handle me anyday! 😍
She’s a better man than Ellie, for sure
I'm so glad someone made this video
there are soooooooooooooooooooo many people who refuse to recognise Abby's humanity and its soooooooooooo tired playing as Abby made this game
I agree Abby is a great character. A mixture of Laura croft , and Solid snake
I never played the game, but I did watch Jacksepticeye’s full play through.
She had moments that made me hate her and she had moments that made me remember that she’s a grey character, every bit as human as the rest of us (even though she’s a fictional character) and empathize with her. Torturing and killing Joel never brought her peace anymore than it brought Ellie peace to go after her, only when she helped that boy.
Lev was the key to her inner peace, filling that void, and would have probably prevented her from finding and killing Joel if all those events happened before she set out to kind him.
She’s an interesting character in my opinion, and it’s pointless to hate on a fictional character just because they piss you off.
Mignon Abby Anderson ❤️😍
Why we love her? Because she's breaks Joel's skull in two with her bare hands!
Why we hate her? Cause she's a horribly written character who kills mindlessly without any confliction, "lets do things without thinking about the consequences"
@@gohan2791 I mean if you say that I guess that's Ellie as well
@@gohan2791 you just describe Ellie lmao
@@bbbenn8142 not the same thing we care about Ellie cause of her Char development from the Lou1 with Abby you can't say this cause she had no build up as a character she was forced
@@gohan2791 Did you even see the video?
I really liked Abby too. I made a similar video on my channel.
I LOVE HER SMMM
I love Abby and your analysis🙌❤
Thanks 🥰
Abby is an awesome character!! She had every right to kill Joel. Joel is not a good person at all he has done so many messed up shit before he met Ellie!
Joel was supposed to let his daughter figure get killed for a chance to make a vaccine?
@@joshh1740Yes. He could have let the world be saved. Ellie wanted it to happen. She didn't care about death. She had lost everyone she cared for and her being immune was her "purpose" and her reason to keep going. And Joel was selfish to take her away from that just because he wanted a daughter figure. And to lie to her after about everything after the fact.
@@justerik6429 forgetting the fact that they had no intentions on giving Ellie a choice, Joel did what any good parent would do. I’m gonna assume you don’t have children and you don’t understand the natural instincts as a parent. If any “parent” would give their kid to a terrorist organization for a CHANCE to find a cure for an outbreak that’s been going on for 20 years, then they shouldn’t be a parent. And again, they have no autonomy to Ellie, so “it’s what she wanted” argument doesn’t work because yes it’s true, but the Fireflies wouldn’t have known.
Abby is awesome, i love her
abby is literally a spiteful character, abby barely had any character arc in the game and no character development. after jackson she went back to the stadium she was feeling horrible and realized that revenge wouldnt fix everything or anything, she felt like she had wasted five years of her life trying to achieve a goal that has no benefit 2 her at all. all of her friends got killed for it, speaking of her friends, Owen supported her for 5 years on an aimless goal, loved her and risked his life for abby and traveled thousands of miles to show her how much he loves her and wanted what she wanted but when owen wanted to chase his own goals she made fun of him and told him to grow up and made him cheat on his pregnant girlfriend whos her friend. back to our main point, after she came back to jackson she still were having nightmares and was so guilt ridden about it she felt that she “need to lighten the load” and found the nearest opportunity to redeem herself, shes realizing that killing joel wasnt all she needed and that joel isnt the root of her problems and revenge isnt everything she wanted hoping that shed realize its not what she needs, and then boom after a whole day from escaping hell fighting the rat king and getting out of haven she drags lev to an extremely dangerous situation to feed into the vicious cycle of revenge when in the past 10 hours (weeks of abby’s life) we’ve been seeing how horrible and guilty she feels about killing joel but oh no abby has learned nothing yet again. she dragged her friends to this and they all fucking died and she gets to live, pathetic regardless abby is not the best character shes poorly written and portrayed if u live in a zombie apocalypse don’t you believe that your loved one would ever last you forever smh
Literal description of Joel but roles are reversed.. smh
@@bbbenn8142 its not, joel wasnt spiteful as abby, joel didnt torture someone to death infront of a loved one like abby did, joel didnt shit on his partner’s goals when all their partner been doing is supporting theirs’s like abby, joel didnt sleep with someones baby daddy so sir fuck off dont disrespect joel like that ever again
@@rea7805 joel fanboy,if joel kills your parents i bet you would thank him
Joel is literally a mass murderer but okay. I bet you’ll love the man that killed your family then also screwed the population out a chance at a cure. He’s also selfish but okay.
love abby and lev
Hahahahahaha lmao totally understandable those 46 subscribers
I love Abby! Awesome video!
There's one fundamental flaw you're overlooking. In the book "Story" by Robert McKee he says "Likeability is not a guarantee for audience engagement, it's merely an aspect of characterization."
Showing someone is liked and respected doesn't mean you're forced to like them.
And Abby's actions of saving Lev and Yara is too far removed from Joel to generate empathy.
Like a politician donating a large sum of money to charity while in the middle of a scandal. Sure the donation is a good gesture, but it doesn't erase previous actions.
Robert McKee also discusses building empathy for unlikable/ morally bad characters with the example of Tony Soprano. We are able to generate empathy for Tony because after he does a morally wrong action we're shown his introspection and uncertainty in himself. We empathize because we know even he doesn't think it's right.
Abby on the other end never shows remorse or guilt. She never even questions if hunting Joel and torturing him was going too far.
She literally helped Yara and Lev because of her guilt, play the game again, smh.
1. Abby's nightmares don't go away after killing Joel. This means that revenge didn't bring her peace as she thought it would. Dreams only changes to the better when she saves the children.
2. Abby tortures Joel before he dies because Joel killed her father. Ellie tortures Nora before her death in order to find Abby, who killed her father. Where is the difference? Why is the second more acceptable? Only because we share Ellie's feelings about Joel's death. But morally it’s the same. Well, yes, we are then shown Ellie in shock after this. Did she stop? No. So she accepted what she is capable of and moved on.
3. Let's put feelings aside and just count actions.
3.1. Abby and her team only killed Joel, and let Tommy and Ellie go. Ellie and the gang from Jackson killed what felt like a half of the wolves and ALL of Abby's friends.
3.2. Abby tortures Joel, Ellie tortures Nora.
3.3. Abby let Dina and Ellie go for the second time. She let them go only because of Lev’s merciful influence. Had the absolute moral right to kill them this time.
3.4 Ellie lets Abby go in Santa Barbara.
I’m team Abby but know this is the minority
Nah
Currently replying the game and can’t remember 100% but didn’t Owen shoot his teammate and save that Seraphite only cause he found out that Scar was Max? If you really pay attention in the game Max was one of the boys who grew up at the Aquarium with their father and ran off to join the scars. You find notes throughout the aquarium and even the dead fathers body in the chair as he was just waiting for his kids to come home. And max was the one who drew all the pictures at the Aquarium and made that badass fort.. right next to the spotted seals. (Idk if that was the ocean or what but idk how seals would survive over 20years in a aquariums tank with no one to feed them lol)
Good evening, you deserve more likes my friend, a very interesting analyses of the character. Very much enjoyed it. Good luck in the future.
Great video
Agreed
I like her too
No ellie is much better l really like ellie story because we can enjoy the game while he jokes in the first game thats why ellie is actually a better person than abby
Ellie is #1
abby is a goated character but ellie better 🤷♂️
Ellie will get her revenge on Abby in part 3